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G_j

(40,371 posts)
Fri May 30, 2014, 11:28 AM May 2014

Unbelievable...Gun Activists With Assault Rifles Harass Marine Veteran on Memorial Day

http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2014/05/guns-open-carry-texas-harassment-marine-veteran

"Are you gonna cry? Sounds like you're about to cry." Watch armed men pursue a vet through downtown Fort Worth.
—Mark Follman on Fri. May 30, 2014 6:00 AM PDT



On Memorial Day this week, a former Marine in Texas named James got a couple calls from friends who'd spotted an unusual gathering in downtown Fort Worth: Roughly a dozen people, mostly men, were hanging out in the middle of the city's cultural district, armed with semi-automatic rifles. James quickly knew what his friends were describing, having recently encountered an open-carry demonstration himself in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. An independent TV commercial producer who sometimes films live events, James headed downtown with his camera to get some footage.

What he saw there struck him as especially provocative. Not only had the open-carry activists come to a typically relaxed, family friendly part of town, they were displaying intimidating firearms just three days after a major gun massacre in southern California. What he didn't anticipate was that they would soon be pursuing him for several city blocks with cameras of their own, harassing him and later posting the footage online, where they would also level homophobic slurs and violent threats against him.

Women who speak out have been the primary target for gun activists, as I detailed in a recent investigation. But now, on a day meant to honor fallen service members, a military vet would make the hit list.

James, who asked that his last name not be used, knows his way around guns. He served for four years in the US Marines infantry, where he earned several awards for marksmanship. He is a gun owner, he told me, and a strong supporter of the Second Amendment and concealed-carry rights. But while carrying rifles publicly is legal in Texas, he felt that these guys—supporters of a movement that seeks to legalize the open carrying of handguns—were crossing a line.

The men, members of the groups Open Carry Texas and Open Carry Tarrant County, asked him which news network he was with. When he said he wasn't, things began turning frosty. They pressed him about what he thought of their demonstration, and he replied with an unvarnished opinion that included profanities, language he told me he regrets having used.

"I'm all for responsible gun owners," he says. "What I was taught was not to wear it around like a gold chain. What they're doing is irresponsible. It intimidates the public, and people have just as much right to be comfortable in their public environment as these guys have a right to own their firearms."

Suddenly he was surrounded by about a half dozen armed men. They started badgering him with questions and accusing him of being anti-American. "I said, 'Are you kidding me? I served in the military.' They were trying to intimidate me, and when I didn't cower that upset them," he said. But he was starting to feel nervous and decided to disengage and walk away.

In a video obtained by Mother Jones that was posted online later that day by one of the activists, the group can be seen pursuing and harassing James through downtown Fort Worth. "I'm following this guy around," declares one of them, setting off after him with his weapon slung across his back. He and others stay right behind James for several city blocks, following him through traffic and taunting him along the way. James grows more agitated and tells them off, calling them assholes and bullies.

"We're being polite, you're calling people names," one of the gun activists pursuing him says.

"You're not being polite out here with assault rifles the weekend after people lost their children," James retorts, before again trying to walk away.

The harassment continues down the street. "Are you gonna cry?" one says. "Sounds like you're about to cry." Another says: "What's wrong with that guy, is he a liberal?

"Yeah," the other replies.

"Big time?"

"Yeah."
70 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Unbelievable...Gun Activists With Assault Rifles Harass Marine Veteran on Memorial Day (Original Post) G_j May 2014 OP
This will backfire.... AnneD May 2014 #1
so did telling Malala friggin' Yousafzai to STFU about guns 'coz she only got shot by one and thus MisterP May 2014 #8
so where were the fucking police? dhill926 May 2014 #2
Probably tasing grandmas. nt valerief May 2014 #38
and where were the brave police? Schema Thing May 2014 #3
this was legal, not much they could do, Texas is a fucked up place geek tragedy May 2014 #9
I live in Texas. Schema Thing May 2014 #11
open carry is the problem geek tragedy May 2014 #13
yes and no Schema Thing May 2014 #15
open carry means these guys are above the law effectively geek tragedy May 2014 #16
No it doesn't. As mentioned above Lucinda Jun 2014 #55
While it may be legal to be in public with a gun it is not legal to harass someone Bandit May 2014 #19
How is it legal to follow, harass, and intimidate someone like that? nt tblue37 Jun 2014 #60
because police there won't arrest anyone for it, so long geek tragedy Jun 2014 #62
Hell, these goons probably had police officers Tsiyu Jun 2014 #44
I see that these "guns everywhere" laws are working out well. world wide wally May 2014 #4
An armed society is a polite society! Brickbat May 2014 #5
bullpucky! Sam1 May 2014 #17
No. It's a society paleotn May 2014 #30
I was being ironic. Brickbat May 2014 #31
Oh. Never mind. : -). (Nt) paleotn May 2014 #33
Like the man who threatened to shoot a father because he didn't approve of the tblue37 Jun 2014 #61
These ass holes are the very people guns should be kerpt away from etherealtruth May 2014 #6
This is what we get for lax gun laws and coddling those into accumulating and carrying guns. Hoyt May 2014 #7
How is this not threatening with a deadly weapon BrotherIvan May 2014 #10
Harassing a Marine on Memorial day Aerows May 2014 #12
Gun owners, these people are YOU! MohRokTah May 2014 #14
I don't think so seveneyes May 2014 #18
Oh yes they do. MohRokTah May 2014 #21
You make a good point seveneyes May 2014 #23
Gun owners can accept some reasonable curbs on ownership and use or take a chance that A Simple Game Jun 2014 #48
Tell that to the people of Muslim faith Lazy Daisy May 2014 #25
........ daleanime Jun 2014 #45
law abiding... mikeysnot Jun 2014 #46
These guys are less analogous to suicide bombers and more to door to door evangelicals... LanternWaste Jun 2014 #66
Vegans, this guy is YOU! friendly_iconoclast Jun 2014 #43
Is it difficult going through life not knowing the difference between an apple and an orange? n/t A Simple Game Jun 2014 #49
Which groups *can* we judge by the actions of a few members, and which not? friendly_iconoclast Jun 2014 #52
and a good question it is Duckhunter935 Jun 2014 #53
The thread is talking about multiple groups, your post is talking about one person. A Simple Game Jun 2014 #54
You're right- PETA and Stop Huntington Animal Cruelty would be a better analogy friendly_iconoclast Jun 2014 #58
PETA would be a better analogy to the NRA because they are mostly people interested A Simple Game Jun 2014 #59
If you find well-honed snark sufficient recompense for political inefficacy... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2014 #63
Well thanks for the compliment and I'm glad you finally see things my way, good for you. n/t A Simple Game Jun 2014 #64
I devoutly hope you don't change a bit friendly_iconoclast Jun 2014 #69
Don't you worry one little bit devoutly or not, no plans on changing here. n/t A Simple Game Jun 2014 #70
Distinction being: article to go actively looking for, rather than paraded in front of a restaurant LanternWaste Jun 2014 #67
Open carry is blowing back on the gun militancy movement, big-time. Paladin May 2014 #20
gun responsibility is on the march! KG May 2014 #22
Completely believeable. Iggo May 2014 #24
These kinds are exactly the people who shouldn't be carrying guns. drm604 May 2014 #26
Yup, they get gun muscles and think they JoePhilly May 2014 #27
My hope is that they'll be marginalized and no one will want them around. drm604 May 2014 #28
Your last sentence is very important. JoePhilly Jun 2014 #56
"gun muscles" Spitfire of ATJ May 2014 #35
Guns give cowards courage. n/t A Simple Game Jun 2014 #50
Hmmmmmmm. I am ... 3catwoman3 May 2014 #29
Answer.... paleotn May 2014 #32
Fear is the prime motivator for gun sales mikeysnot Jun 2014 #41
Can you imagine the mayhem if a bunch of fleeing bank robbers stumbled into these clowns? Spitfire of ATJ May 2014 #34
Typical GOP blkmusclmachine May 2014 #36
Big Time Liberal. Octafish May 2014 #37
"Are you gonna cry?" ROFLMAO Were these middle-school activists? Beartracks May 2014 #39
Exactly! narnian60 Jun 2014 #42
Texas, huh heaven05 Jun 2014 #40
It is! There is a lot of sh** in this country and fortunately it is being exposed. n/t RKP5637 Jun 2014 #51
Did any of the "teeny weenies" even serve in the military? DinahMoeHum Jun 2014 #47
Misleading Headline... cactusfractal Jun 2014 #57
Stand your ground kokobell616 Jun 2014 #65
He would be a murderer if he decided to shoot them hack89 Jun 2014 #68

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
8. so did telling Malala friggin' Yousafzai to STFU about guns 'coz she only got shot by one and thus
Fri May 30, 2014, 01:52 PM
May 2014

clearly doesn't know shit about 'em

everyone gets physically sick when their "mainstream" shows up at shootings and opens their gaping mummy maws, followed by their "fringe" stalking the parents of victims

what we have to do is make that backlash count: the NRA's against 90% of the country and knows it--but as long as it's backed by 51% of Congress and/or the WH backs down it won't ever matter; this means working with Pubs unfortunately (but not all of them are White Power anarcho-capitalists so gun control has an "in&quot

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
9. this was legal, not much they could do, Texas is a fucked up place
Fri May 30, 2014, 02:02 PM
May 2014

with fucked up laws.

Same place that allows men to shoot prostitutes who take the money and then refuse to have sex.

Schema Thing

(10,283 posts)
11. I live in Texas.
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:33 PM
May 2014

I've seen enough to know that when the police want to stop someone from harassing someone else, especially in-the-moment, they can find a way to do it.


What they didn't want to do, is confront a bunch of guys with guns. I don't blame them, but they need to do it anyway.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
13. open carry is the problem
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:36 PM
May 2014

these guys have an effective license from the Texas state government to terrorize the population

Schema Thing

(10,283 posts)
15. yes and no
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:39 PM
May 2014

It's a horrible fucked up law, but the police can certainly ascertain when people are being threatening and disturbing the peace. Open Carry does not trump that.
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
16. open carry means these guys are above the law effectively
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:43 PM
May 2014

small scale version of what happened with the Bundy thugs

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
55. No it doesn't. As mentioned above
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 07:36 AM
Jun 2014

if open carry is done in such a way as to threaten the safety of individuals they can be charged.
One of the open carry groups recently posted a message telling members how to conduct themselves in order to stay out of trouble. If I find the link, I'll add it.

Bandit

(21,475 posts)
19. While it may be legal to be in public with a gun it is not legal to harass someone
Sat May 31, 2014, 09:12 AM
May 2014

Especially while carrying an assault weapon. That is assault. Just by following him and verbally abusing him while armed like they were is threatening. You can not threaten people just because....

Tsiyu

(18,186 posts)
44. Hell, these goons probably had police officers
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 02:20 PM
Jun 2014

in their ranks

Pretty sad when cops can spend hours and lots of $$$$$ find a pot seed but turn the other way when violent thugs try to intimidate people by brandishing weapons.

Bet those lowlife cowards would have not been such billy badasses without their firearms on their hips and shoulders.

paleotn

(17,963 posts)
30. No. It's a society
Sat May 31, 2014, 02:54 PM
May 2014

....where people get shot just for doing something that irritates others. You may want to live in a psyco world like that, but I think the rest of us have better sense.

tblue37

(65,488 posts)
61. Like the man who threatened to shoot a father because he didn't approve of the
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 05:26 PM
Jun 2014

way the father was teaching his 7-year-old daughter to ride a bicycle. (There's a DU thread about that incident.)

etherealtruth

(22,165 posts)
6. These ass holes are the very people guns should be kerpt away from
Fri May 30, 2014, 12:00 PM
May 2014

(actually, my personal belief is that I would love to see "no" guns).

How are these jack asses responsible gun owners? They haven't shot anyone (yet) ... yet are we to believe that using guns to intimidate people is an acceptable and responsible use? does the NRA support their 'rights" (of course without any associated responsibilities).

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
7. This is what we get for lax gun laws and coddling those into accumulating and carrying guns.
Fri May 30, 2014, 12:19 PM
May 2014

BrotherIvan

(9,126 posts)
10. How is this not threatening with a deadly weapon
Fri May 30, 2014, 02:39 PM
May 2014

Because they did not aim it at him? If a guy started yelling at me and harrassing me like that it would be one thing, but armed to the teeth, that's as intimidating as hell.

I'm sure all the gunners will be along shortly to tell us all how safe this is and guns don't kill people and blah blah blah.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
12. Harassing a Marine on Memorial day
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:36 PM
May 2014

Doesn't get much lower than that. I get that they disagree with him - what I don't get is that they continually harassed him and he is one of the reasons that they have the Bill of Rights in the first place.

Ideological idiots.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
14. Gun owners, these people are YOU!
Fri May 30, 2014, 03:39 PM
May 2014

IF you don't get this shit stopped soon, everybody in this country is going to believe EVERY gun owner is just like these assholes.

Police your fucking own!

 

seveneyes

(4,631 posts)
18. I don't think so
Sat May 31, 2014, 08:57 AM
May 2014

These nutcases don't represent law abiding gun owners any more than suicide bombers represent the religion they belong to.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
21. Oh yes they do.
Sat May 31, 2014, 09:27 AM
May 2014

Because so called "responsible gun owners" are not being part of the narrative, these people are now the public face of gun ownership. If you don't like that fact, you had damned well better get active and get very loud about accepting some new reasonable gun control, or else these people could convince a majority that your worst nightmares about gun control will end up as law.

But right now, these people are driving the narrative about gun ownership just like the fun dies drove the narrative for the traditional marriage movement, and all it took to turn the country around on that issue was less than a decade.

 

seveneyes

(4,631 posts)
23. You make a good point
Sat May 31, 2014, 09:33 AM
May 2014

Yes, those flaunting gun owners do give normal citizens a black eye. While I don't think their ignorance will cause any disruption to the 2nd Amendment, it may help get rid of open carry or at least curb their idiotic behavior.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
48. Gun owners can accept some reasonable curbs on ownership and use or take a chance that
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 07:52 PM
Jun 2014

we reach the tipping point on guns. Personally I think we are close to the tipping point, all it would take is 2 or 3 Representatives and or Senators to lose their jobs by not supporting gun control and the many will change sides in a hurry, or for a massacre in a state capital building. Gabby wasn't enough but if 5 or 10 get shot at once, then all bets are off. The next school shooting may be enough, it's hard to say.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
66. These guys are less analogous to suicide bombers and more to door to door evangelicals...
Tue Jun 3, 2014, 09:18 AM
Jun 2014

These guys are less analogous to suicide bombers and more to the garden variety door to door evangelicals.

However, I do understand the desire to paint them as extreme as possible, and pretend they are not indicative or predictive of the herd as a whole.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
43. Vegans, this guy is YOU!
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 02:12 PM
Jun 2014
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/07/morrissey-meat-eating-pedophilia_n_4554667.html

Morrissey Compares Eating Meat To Pedophilia

...He took to True To You, an online fan site dedicated to the artist, and answered questions submitted by his devout listeners.

"I see no difference between eating animals and paedophilia. They are both rape, violence, murder," he said.

Continuing his comparison of the meat industry to other horrible human-related situations, he also likened the slaughter of animals to genocide, saying, "If you believe in the abattoir then you would support Auschwitz."


IF you don't get this shit stopped soon, everybody in this country is going to believe
EVERY vegan is just like this asshole.

Police your fucking own!

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
52. Which groups *can* we judge by the actions of a few members, and which not?
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 09:38 PM
Jun 2014

And why are vegans exempt from your calculus, and not gun owners?

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
54. The thread is talking about multiple groups, your post is talking about one person.
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 07:22 AM
Jun 2014

That would be analogous to apples and oranges. Multiple and many = more than one, one = well, just one.

Being vegan or eating meat; neither will kill you, at least not in a single event. On the other hand, guns and bullets can be fatal in a single event. Again Apples and oranges.

The produce manager at the local supermarket can probably help you with your identity problem.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
58. You're right- PETA and Stop Huntington Animal Cruelty would be a better analogy
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 04:44 PM
Jun 2014

Do we get to judge all vegans by their actions, or does your guilt by association
schtick only apply to gun owners?

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
59. PETA would be a better analogy to the NRA because they are mostly people interested
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 05:21 PM
Jun 2014

in the fair treatment of animals. Their rhetoric and actions are out of the ordinary just like the NRA. Extreme as they are they still do have their extremist, just like the NRA has the Open Carry people that they have denounced. PETA would be happy if we were all vegetarian, no need for vegan. Vegetarians don't mind animal products being consumed as long as the animal is not harmed in the process. Although far from vegetarian, I sympathize with the movement and think it a noble goal.

I honestly don't know much about Stop Huntington Animal Cruelty except they are against testing on animals and are mostly European with their main focus on one facility in Europe, thus their name. Not sure about any extremism on their part. I will admit to agreeing with them that much animal testing can be cruel. PETA also focuses on animal testing. You probably feel differently, especially when they test for gun shot wounds on monkeys and dogs. Ever had a dog or cat stolen and sold to an animal testing facility? I haven't but know a person that has.

Does my "guilt by association schtick only apply to gun owners?" No, I have other pet peeves, but if you will notice that is what the OP and the thread are about. To talk about anything else too much would be a diversion from the main topic which is extremist gun owners, you wouldn't want that would you? You can always do your own OP about anything other than extremist gun owners.

Congratulations though, I will upgrade you to comparing apples and pears, well done!

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
63. If you find well-honed snark sufficient recompense for political inefficacy...
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 05:36 PM
Jun 2014

...far be from me to harsh your mellow.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
69. I devoutly hope you don't change a bit
Wed Jun 4, 2014, 03:15 PM
Jun 2014

It's approaches like yours that have made gun control what it is today...

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
67. Distinction being: article to go actively looking for, rather than paraded in front of a restaurant
Tue Jun 3, 2014, 09:22 AM
Jun 2014

Distinction being: article to go actively looking for, rather than paraded in front of a restaurant and shoved down the throat.

However, I certainly understand the desire to make false equivalences to better rationalize one's demographic of choice.

Paladin

(28,273 posts)
20. Open carry is blowing back on the gun militancy movement, big-time.
Sat May 31, 2014, 09:23 AM
May 2014

This is something that Democrats should be exploiting to the max. I think the vast number of sensible gun owners (including myself) see these gun flashers for the morons they truly are.

drm604

(16,230 posts)
26. These kinds are exactly the people who shouldn't be carrying guns.
Sat May 31, 2014, 12:58 PM
May 2014

Immature assclowns who go around intimidating people in order to make a political statement.

These are the kinds of people who'll open carry. Very few, if any, mature sensible people will want to do so.

drm604

(16,230 posts)
28. My hope is that they'll be marginalized and no one will want them around.
Sat May 31, 2014, 02:45 PM
May 2014

Of course, maybe that would be a mixed blessing because then they'd live in a bubble always surrounded and reenforced by people like themselves.

In any case, the people who most want to be able to do something like this are the very people who shouldn't be doing something like this.

JoePhilly

(27,787 posts)
56. Your last sentence is very important.
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 09:35 AM
Jun 2014

The folks who scream loudest against stronger gun regulations know that if the rules were even just a little more stringent, they would be excluded from gun ownership.

They have anger management issues. Domestic abuse issues. Substance abuse issues.

They are the neighborhood bullies.

These are the guys who think getting into a fight after a night of drinking is the perfect ending to a Friday night.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
35. "gun muscles"
Sat May 31, 2014, 03:49 PM
May 2014

Good one.

I'm old enough to remember, "Quit hiding behind that gun and fight like a man!"

paleotn

(17,963 posts)
32. Answer....
Sat May 31, 2014, 03:05 PM
May 2014

Zero. Like the vast majority of gun nuts, including those in this online community, they'd wet their pants if faced by someone who could shoot back. They're all paper target fortitude. Nothing more.

mikeysnot

(4,757 posts)
41. Fear is the prime motivator for gun sales
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 09:54 AM
Jun 2014

to cowards. Yes theya re heavily armed and harassing a guy armed with a camera.

What they really were doing was preventing him from filming their lame asses posing with their weapons. Showing for the tools they are.

I can't wait to see the guys video of them since this was the camera view of them "law abiding" citizemns we always hear about.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
37. Big Time Liberal.
Sat May 31, 2014, 05:20 PM
May 2014

Since Michael Dukakis ran in 1988 and Poppy called him a "Card carrying member of the ACLU," Democrats should have stood up the moment that their patriotism and honor are challenged when called a "Liberal."

Yet, time and time again, they have refused.

And today, our vets get harrassed by gun nut "conservatives."

Beartracks

(12,821 posts)
39. "Are you gonna cry?" ROFLMAO Were these middle-school activists?
Sat May 31, 2014, 09:56 PM
May 2014

The gay slurs, the taunting, following they guy around... I remember class bullies in 8th grade doing that kind of stuff to classmates.

Eighth fucking grade.

Congratulations, conservatives.

=======================

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
40. Texas, huh
Sun Jun 1, 2014, 08:54 AM
Jun 2014

disgusting type of Texan letting their their little dingalings show to try to intimidate. These aren't adults. A bunch of Bush type cowards is all they are. Wear the uniform and do everything they can to keep out of harms way. Sad, sick and disgusting what has been shown to be the true nature of a lot of amerikkkans and this culture for the last six years. Truly disgusting, but not surprising or unexpected by me. I am so glad the world has been allowed to see the true nature of what was under the rocks and living in the sewers of this country. Truly glad.

cactusfractal

(497 posts)
57. Misleading Headline...
Mon Jun 2, 2014, 09:45 AM
Jun 2014

...though that doesn't detract from the asshattery of these OCT folks. I'm a liberal Marine Corps veteran and I certainly don't expect wingnuts to back off when they find that out. I do ask plenty of those advocating for war when *they* volunteered to serve, though. Chickenhawks are the worst.

kokobell616

(35 posts)
65. Stand your ground
Tue Jun 3, 2014, 07:22 AM
Jun 2014

So what would have been the case if this fellow felt threatened by the sight of those guns and the antagonistic comments of those carrying those guns?

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/txstatutes/PE/2/9/C/9.31

22 other states that have stand your ground laws,

http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-law-basics/states-that-have-stand-your-ground-laws.html

Then again, these were faux patriots who made a conscious choice to wag their penial extentions about in public.

What would we be commenting about had that former Marine chose to stand his ground?

hack89

(39,171 posts)
68. He would be a murderer if he decided to shoot them
Tue Jun 3, 2014, 09:29 AM
Jun 2014

now if they pointed their guns at him then he could make a case for self defense.

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