Just had to give this a thread of its own. The owner of Cali Chrome sounded like a whining

[kelliekat44]

teabagger to me.

I hated to hear him because I really wanted to see a triple crown winner today but after hearing the owner whine like Cliven Bundy I think the horse-racing gods were in control. The game of horse racing is older than I and trainers have been holding out their horses for the right spot since the game began. That's what makes them trainers and winners. The horse either has it or it doesn't. Class, distance, time, weight, breeding are still important factors. The owner just should have been more graceful in his defeat. I never heard an owner or trainer whine like this after a loss.

I have great respect for the owner of the winner who gave a classy comment when asked about the comment made by Chrome's owner. "I don't have any comment about that."

[boston bean]

1. I think he had a point, but then was probably not the right time.

Although it will cause lots of discussion which might be a good thing.

His wife wanted him to stay mum. Did you see that, where she tried to calm him and he told her he didn't care!

I guess after a loss one is to be gracious, but if someone is pointing out unfairness, I think it's ok.

[Logical]

2. What was his main complaint? nt

[boston bean]

4. That owners hold horses as ringers for the Belmont

and the horses are fresh and not tired. He states they do this to target a horse that has a chance at the triple crown.

He thinks that if one qualifies for the Kentucky Derby with the points and doesn't run it, they should be disqualified to run the Belmont, where the triple crown is on the line.

[Logical]

8. Do horses not recover 100% between races? I don't know much about it. n-t

[boston bean]

9. According to him, it takes a toll on the horses to run the three races.

[kelliekat44]

12. That's true but other horses have accomplished the feat. Didn't complain about the fresh horses

before the race. Sour grapes to me.

[FSogol]

37. Also, at 1-1/2 miles, this one is the longest race. n/t

[magical thyme]

49. it does take a toll. also the Belmont is the longest of the 3 races

and he is correct that there will be horses entered in the Belmont specifically to try to knock the triple crown contender out of the race. His gripe is legitimate, but not for yesterday's race.

With his post position, the jockey had to get Chrome past the horse in the #1 spot to get on the rail and then had to stay even with the front runners. He didn't have to be ahead of them, but he couldn't fall behind to allow one to cut in front of him. He failed to do that, and as a result got boxed in.

That forced him to go very wide late in the race, which meant running further and faster when it was too late to make up the lost ground. The bottom line is that he simply didn't have it. At first I thought his jockey was holding him back a bit to keep him from burning up too soon, until he fell behind. At that point it was clear he simply didn't have the energy and for him the race was already over.

After watching the derby and preakness, I doubted he was going to make it. He faded at the end of both those shorter races...he doesn't have the stamina for distance when he's fresh, never mind in the final leg.

Otoh, I also watched some of the lead up to the race, when they showed past horses that lost the Belmont. The one where the gripe was truly legitimate (and I forget which horse it was now) the horse "stumbled" shortly after coming out of the gate. However, it looked to me like he may have been jostled by the horse next to him. I would want to watch that video in slo-mo very carefully, to see if it was deliberate. In the days before video, that was not uncommon. Coming out of the gate is quite dangerous while they're fighting for a good position, and there would be ringers entered specifically to knock the favorites out. Back in the Man O'War days, once an owner actually entered 2 horses with the sprinter instructed to tire him out at the beginning and the "closer" to finish him off at the end. He wrecked those plans when he left both horses in the dust right out of the gate.

[Aerows]

14. No

Owners do not hold back "ringers" they hold back horses that are better for endurance (1.5 mile Belmont vs. .75 mile Preakness and Kentucky Derby).

I'm as sad as everyone that CC lost, but the second I saw the heavy wide chest of Tonalist, it was clear he wasn't just going to outlast everybody, he was going to beat them in the last bits of the run.

Derby - Speed. Preakness - Agility. Belmont - Endurance. The horse that has all three is a miracle. I wish CC would have won, but he just got out endured by another horse. You can't be first if you are only first among those you compete with in a handful of races - you have to first before ALL. He wasn't. He's still a great horse.

[boston bean]

17. i'm just relaying the owners word and feelings as seen on national tv.

So, you are no'ing the wrong person.

[Aerows]

34. Please don't believe I am admonishing you my friend

I am just admonishing the concept.

[Enthusiast]

31. That's interesting to know.

I had no idea.

[truebluegreen]

40. No. The Belmont is the longest, at 1 1/2 miles

but the Derby is 1 1/4 and the Preakness is 1 3/16.

[exboyfil]

41. The first two races are not 0.75 mile

Kentucky Derby - 1 1/4 mile
Preakness Derby - 1 3/16 mile
Belmont Derby - 1 1/2 mile

That being said horses have accomplished the feat in the past. If you want to be classified among the truly great you have to beat all comers. I could seeing adding a week or 2 weeks to the schedule given that modern horse racing is different than the past (but really has not changed that much since the 1970s when we had the last run of Triple Crown Champions.

A long term tactic was holding horses out of the Preakness. Our champions in the 1970s were able to win even with other owners doing this.

[kelliekat44]

5. His complaint was that the winner didn't run in the Derby or the Preakness and it wasn't fair for

the horse to compete in the Belmont. Hmmmm how many other horses in the race had not competed in those races?

[Logical]

7. Hmmmm...that is weird. Does he think his horse was wore out or something? n-t

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

10. Well, it's harder for a horse to run three races in that short time

Any fresh horse of that caliber has a natural advantage.

I think all the horses in the field should have at least run one of the other two legs.

[Logical]

24. Makes sense. n-t

[Rhinodawg]

28. The Preakness was like 2 or 3 weeks ago, no?

just wondering.

[Orrex]

50. Seems to me...

If three weeks isn't enough for the athlete to recover before the third event, then they're being worked too hard in the first and/or second event.

[Mosby]

29. three

[Brickbat]

3. "The horse either has it or it doesn't."

That's it right there.

[Aerows]

16. He's either capable of all levels

or he isn't. He is still a marvel. He's just not a miracle.

[boston bean]

35. just curious

How is it a measurement of the horses capability, if the horse that beats them is well rested. It's not an accurate measurement unless all other factors are the same. In other word cc may have been able to beat him if he was as well rested as the other.

[laundry_queen]

44. That's pretty much how I see it. nt

[Tuesday Afternoon]

51. I wonder this, too.

It does not compute.

[Leme]

6. meh, people in the entertainment business whine all the time

[alcibiades_mystery]

11. Will get 1/1,000 of the press of Richard Sherman

[mythology]

26. Because horse racing isn't nearly as big as football

And while the comment is whining, I doubt he was jumping up and down looking like an ass, or has a history of running his mouth off. And presumably the horse's owner doesn't have a failed performance enhancing drug test in his past (and a team full of other players who were also busted for performance enhancing drugs who weren't able to loophole the test). And given the number of other athletes who have managed to win an appeal on a failed drug test who went on to be caught again, I think it's pretty likely that Richard Sherman will get busted again.

[Benton D Struckcheon]

13. Eh, Steve Cauthen always had it right.

When asked why he won a horse race, he said: "He put his horse down, I put mine. My horse won."

[lovemydog]

15. I agree

The Horse Racing Association cannot and should not force horses to race in any races.

[boston bean]

25. as far as i understand it is preventing a horse from racing thats was the crux of the argument.

Not forcing one to run.

[malaise]

18. Yep he sounded like a sore loser

no matter the comment - and I have no idea if it was even a valid argument.

Were there fresh horses in the Belmont when the other winners of the triple crown won?

Once the answer to that is yes, he's just another whiner...and at a very inappropriate moment.

[YarnAddict]

19. Just wondering

if the rules have always been the same. Did Affirmed, Secretariat, Seattle Slew, and all the others compete under the same conditions? If so, then that makes his argument invalid (IMHO.) If not, well, then, maybe he does have a point. Just know, it would be nice to see a Triple Crown winner again. Knowing it was a possibility piqued my interest, and probably a lot of others' as well.

[boston bean]

21. meant to respond to you, see below..

[LuvLoogie]

39. Um...Secretariat won the Belmont by 31 lengths...

and on that day would have beaten any other horse that ever lived.

[boston bean]

20. I would like to know too.

I just watched Secretariats Triple Crown win and there were only five horses racing. But I'm not sure if all five ran all three races.

[YarnAddict]

27. I just watched it again.

Amazing horse.

[meadowlark5]

30. That's what I read about several of the triple crown races

The field was much smaller in years past with less stiff competition. Now you have a pack of 10 or more horses clumped together jockeying for position.

I think what the owner said is valid in that a fresh horse that hasn't raced 2 races in the past 5 weeks like CC did, has an advantage. As far as I understand, none of the 3 races is more prestigious to win than the other. So holding a horse for the last race, I don't quite understand. Is there more money to be won if you wait to race the Belmont as opposed to the other two? So I can see why the owner would be upset. Maybe he should have been more gracious but he and his partners had a lot of hopes for this race. Just like the viewing public did. Hopefully they will have some changes so horses racing all 3 can rest and recover properly.

[truebluegreen]

42. A lot of times when there is a clear favorite,

other owners and trainers do not enter their horses. The entry fees are very steep, I believe. When Secretariat won the Derby there was a big field, but smaller in the Preakness and smaller still in the Belmont.

But I did run across a little factoid today: that no Triple Crown winner ever had to contend with a big field in the Belmont. Question is, which is the cause and which the effect? In Secretariat's case, I'd guess it was an effect. Today? I'm not so sure.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

22. There is talk of stretching out the season to give the horses time to recover from each race =

The Kentucky Derby would still be held the first weekend in May.

Hold The Preakness the first wkend in June and hold The Belmont the first wkend in July.

Personally, I think this idea has some merit.

[MFM008]

23. its not fair

and Im no bagger. They run fresh horses, ones that hadnt competed. While not every horse can be Secretariat shouldnt SOME other horse have won in 43 years? Big Brown, Smarty Jones, War Emblem? All great horses... the rules suck and I agree with him.

[Little Star]

32. I agree.....

something is wrong with the rules. The man had a good point, it was just a bad time to make it. But then again, when else would his voice have been heard if not then.

[Stardust]

36. Secretariat was one-of-a-kind. Please read...

http://www.horsesonly.com/crossroads/xfactor/heart-1.htm

Today, the normal weight of a horse’s heart is 8.5 pounds. Even though Secretariat’s heart was not weighed at autopsy, Dr. Thomas Swerczek, head pathologist at the University of Kentucky, estimated it at 22 pounds after finding the second-largest heart in Sham (Secretariat’s Triple Crown rival) and weighing it at 18 pounds.

"I have done thousands of autopsies, and I had noticed differences in heart size in horses before we did Secretariat," Swerczek said. "I had picked up the difference in the male and female hearts and noticed that some were bigger than others.

"But I didn’t pay much attention until Secretariat came along. He was completely out of everybody else’s league. Looking back at what he had done, it was easy to put a connection to it. The heart was what made him able to do what he did. It explained how he was able to do what he did in the Belmont Stakes – a mile and a half race (Secretariat won by 31 lengths in track-record time). You would have to have a large heart to do what he did. It would be impossible for a horse with a small heart to do that."

[malaise]

38. Secretariat was one-of-a-kind

- a magnificent horse

[a kennedy]

45. I still get teary eyed watching Secretariat's run at the Belmont....

and get goosebumps at what a race that was, he was a magnificent horse..... wow.

[Ilsa]

48. I heard that Secretariat's speed was increasing after each

Quarter mile in the Belmont. He just kept getting faster and faster. He loved to run.

His groom, Eddie, said he was smart, too. They have several stories about how intelligent he was.

I think CC's owner was disappointed and showed his lack of grace at a poor moment. He should have waited. But the fact is, his horse didn't have the right stuff for the Triple.

[Stardust]

52. Lacking "the right stuff" may be ubiquitous and makes

me doubt any horse will ever again win the Triple. I hope I'm wrong, though.

[underpants]

33. Sheriff Brimley. Also, Gov. Cuomo is dating Sandra Lee (Food Network)?

[taught_me_patience]

43. He'd have a better argument if CC came in second

but CC came in fourth - well off the pace - so it just sounds like sour grapes.

[Leme]

46. This is a manufactured event, just manufactured event

Someone decided to call winning these 3 races the Triple Crown. And it now has become a tradition.
-
In golf they call some courses majors, others are not called a major. If you win all 4 it is called a Grand Slam. The same in tennis. Someone just decides to name these things.
-
In baseball(from wiki):

In Major League Baseball, a player earns the Triple Crown when he leads a league in three specific statistical categories. When used without a modifier, the Triple Crown generally refers to a batter who leads either the National or American leagues in batting average, home runs, and runs batted in (RBI) over a full regular season.[1] The Triple Crown epitomizes three separate attributes of a good hitter: hitting for average, hitting for power, and producing runs. It has been accomplished 17 times, most recently in 2012 with Miguel Cabrera producing the first such achievement in 45 years, after Carl Yastrzemski in 1967.
-
If the Belmont or Preakness or Kentucky Derby for some reason ceased to be held, they would just add a different race track.
-
Sports change and things that affect the sport change. Ease of travel for golf and tennis make it quite different. And for horses'
-
there often is special, extra money for winning a grand slam or triple crown.
-
And it is a GREAT MARKETTING tool for the industry.

[bklyncowgirl]

47. What Steve Coburn didn't know at the time was that his horse was injured at the start of the race.

California Chrome grabbed a quarter coming out of the starting gate. That means he ran the 1 1/2 mile race with part of his heel torn off.

http://www.drf.com/news/california-chrome-grabbed-quarter-during-Belmont

It clearly hurt him. http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/videos/13300/california-chrome-returns-to-barn

Espinosa felt there was something wrong but thought it was because he was between and behind horses and the horse didn't like getting dirt kicked in his face. He swung wide coming into the turn to get his horse out of there. That move probably cost him the race.

I was standing by the rail about halfway down the stretch and California Chrome was still running hard and gaining on the outside. If Espinosa hadn't swung wide he might have made it home bleeding foot and all.

As for the owner's comments, they were completely inappropriate. I think he just lost it. He's an ordinary guy--an ex rodeo cowboy turned factory worker who happened to catch the fabled lighting in a jar not a hedge fund manager or blue blood skilled in public relations. He's also an emotional person who dearly loves his horse and sees California Chrome as a gift from God. I was sitting next to a guy who happened to be on line with Coburn and his wife coming into the track and was struck by what a nice, normal people they appeared to be. They talked for a while and Coburn and his wife posed for pictures. I later thought I recognized him walking alone through the crowd back by the paddock but I couldn't catch a look at his credentials as he went by to be sure.

We'll never know if an uninjured California Chrome would have beaten Tonalist and the other fresh horses. Spectacular Bid was on anyone's list of great horses but he lost the triple crown to a safety pin and a lousy jockey ride. Is Steve Coburn's little Junior a great horse who had bad luck on the biggest day of his life like Spectacular Bid, a very good horse who got lucky for two thirds of the Triple Crown like Funny Cide or a possibly great but fragile horse like Big Brown or Smarty Jones.

I hope he'll get a chance to prove it later this year and hopefully next year. I also hope that Steve Coburn learns a lesson from this. Never, never talk to the media when you're upset. You can't take it back.