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kelliekat44

(7,759 posts)
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:19 AM Jul 2014

The blockade of Gaza should take place simultaneously with the ceasing of rockets into Israel.

If this is not part of the agreement, I fear Hama will not accept any cease fire agreement that puts discussion of removing the blockade to a later time.

30 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The blockade of Gaza should take place simultaneously with the ceasing of rockets into Israel. (Original Post) kelliekat44 Jul 2014 OP
Lifting the blockade as part of the cease fire is Hamas position. And morningfog Jul 2014 #1
Only with strict inspection by a neutral third party of all goods entering Gaza hack89 Jul 2014 #2
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #4
So you want the next war to be the last war hack89 Jul 2014 #6
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #8
Israel is fighting with one hand behind their back hack89 Jul 2014 #11
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #15
If Hamas acquires the weapons you want them to have hack89 Jul 2014 #21
This is actually even worse than apartheid malaise Jul 2014 #17
Exactly ann--- Jul 2014 #27
Hamas has made it clear they won't hold to ANY cease fire Fozzledick Jul 2014 #3
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #5
A fair fight would leave Gaza razed to the ground hack89 Jul 2014 #7
Unintentionally funny statement - "A fair right would leave Gaza razed to the ground" anti partisan Jul 2014 #9
If Hamas gets the ability to kill large numbers of Israeli civilians hack89 Jul 2014 #13
No, if it were truly "fair", Israel would suffer an equal amount as Gaza anti partisan Jul 2014 #16
And we know that Isreal will never let it get to that point hack89 Jul 2014 #20
What's the tangible benefit to fighting fair? Tetris_Iguana Jul 2014 #26
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #10
Exactly!! Don't forget nukes too. anti partisan Jul 2014 #12
Had they put all that effort into importing food instead of rockets Lee-Lee Jul 2014 #18
A small MINORITY import rockets/materials to make them anti partisan Jul 2014 #19
Interesting = a lot of dead Palestinians hack89 Jul 2014 #14
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #22
Once Hamas accepts the right of Israel to exist hack89 Jul 2014 #23
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2014 #24
Not if the elimination of Israel truly is their goal hack89 Jul 2014 #25
Only after Israel accepts the right of Palestinians to have a viable land and Larkspur Jul 2014 #29
Israel does accept that hack89 Jul 2014 #30
Yeah, let's just trust Hamas not to bring in more rockets. NaturalHigh Jul 2014 #28
 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
1. Lifting the blockade as part of the cease fire is Hamas position. And
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:22 AM
Jul 2014

Abbas has now taken that position as well.

hack89

(39,181 posts)
2. Only with strict inspection by a neutral third party of all goods entering Gaza
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:25 AM
Jul 2014

lets not forget why Israel implemented the blockade in the first place.

Response to hack89 (Reply #2)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
6. So you want the next war to be the last war
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:37 AM
Jul 2014

as Hamas acquires enough offensive weapons to actually threaten Israel. What do you think Gaza will look like after such a war?

Making Hamas stronger makes the reoccupation of Gaza and the destruction of Hamas a near certainty.

Response to hack89 (Reply #6)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
11. Israel is fighting with one hand behind their back
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:45 AM
Jul 2014

they have the firepower to flatten Gaza without a soldier entering Gaza. 2000 lb JDAM bombs are devastating - right now they are using small missiles to minimize damage.

Hezbollah had a huge military advantage of lots of land giving them room to maneuver. They also had room to retreat if necessary. Hamas has no such advantage - the IDF will fix them in place and level the buildings they are fighting from.

Response to hack89 (Reply #11)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
21. If Hamas acquires the weapons you want them to have
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:02 AM
Jul 2014

and uses those weapons to kill thousands of Israeli citizens (which is the obvious result of your desires) then international law says Israel can respond in a like manner to eliminate the threat.

The obvious solution is to make sure Hamas never gets that capability.

 

ann---

(1,933 posts)
27. Exactly
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:33 AM
Jul 2014

why should Israel be allowed to "defend" itself, yet the Palestinians are not? Apartheid is wrong. America knows that but ignores what Bibi Yahoo is doing.

Fozzledick

(3,921 posts)
3. Hamas has made it clear they won't hold to ANY cease fire
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:27 AM
Jul 2014

and lifting the blockade would only make it easier for them to rearm and continue the violence.

Response to Fozzledick (Reply #3)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
7. A fair fight would leave Gaza razed to the ground
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:39 AM
Jul 2014

you really don't want Israel to start using their firepower.

anti partisan

(429 posts)
9. Unintentionally funny statement - "A fair right would leave Gaza razed to the ground"
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:43 AM
Jul 2014

That doesn't sound like a "fair fight" now, does it?

hack89

(39,181 posts)
13. If Hamas gets the ability to kill large numbers of Israeli civilians
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:48 AM
Jul 2014

it would be. The point is the present fighting is low on the lethality scale. As Hamas gets more effective weapons, the wars will become increasingly more and more lethal - and Gaza will suffer proportionately more.

anti partisan

(429 posts)
16. No, if it were truly "fair", Israel would suffer an equal amount as Gaza
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:51 AM
Jul 2014

Or maybe there would be enough deterrent for them to stop their belligerent policies and there would be something resembling peace.

hack89

(39,181 posts)
20. And we know that Isreal will never let it get to that point
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:59 AM
Jul 2014

so what is to be done. Let Hamas arm themselves and light the fuse on greater suffering. Or find away to ensure Hamas has no offensive capabilities. Why not let Hamas have short range defensive weapons and forgo long range rockets?

Tetris_Iguana

(501 posts)
26. What's the tangible benefit to fighting fair?
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:32 AM
Jul 2014

Much more merciful to settle the matter quickly and decisively instead of letting fester, IMO.

Response to hack89 (Reply #7)

anti partisan

(429 posts)
12. Exactly!! Don't forget nukes too.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:48 AM
Jul 2014

As more of a demilitarization type, I don't support this, but I've had it with all these inane arguments against the idea of letting the inhabitants of Gaza not starve and suffer in poverty.

You know, maybe they wouldn't be likely to fire homemade rockets if their lives weren't so bad?

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
18. Had they put all that effort into importing food instead of rockets
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:52 AM
Jul 2014

Maybe their lives wouldn't be so bad?

Seems priorities are a bit off...

anti partisan

(429 posts)
19. A small MINORITY import rockets/materials to make them
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:57 AM
Jul 2014

And the majority suffer as a result.

Don't say "they" as if the majority of the Palestinians support rockets over food.

I don't support rocket shooting either, it's counterproductive to peace. Heck, so dumb that the conspiracy theorists seem to think that Israel is helping supply them with rockets so that they have a pretext to launch an offensive.

hack89

(39,181 posts)
14. Interesting = a lot of dead Palestinians
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 08:50 AM
Jul 2014

which is why stopping Hamas from rearming is in the best interest of all involved.

Response to hack89 (Reply #14)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
23. Once Hamas accepts the right of Israel to exist
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:17 AM
Jul 2014

as a Jewish homeland. Lets not forget that Hamas was founded with the goal of "liberating" all of Palestine from the Jews.

They will have to be reasonable on certain things, especially right of return.

Response to hack89 (Reply #23)

hack89

(39,181 posts)
25. Not if the elimination of Israel truly is their goal
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:28 AM
Jul 2014

because you know what that will mean - more rockets, more suicide bombers. Why is it so hard for them to say they will accept a Jewish state to reassure Israel?

 

Larkspur

(12,804 posts)
29. Only after Israel accepts the right of Palestinians to have a viable land and
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 10:18 AM
Jul 2014

accepts the right of Palestinians to return to their homes or be paid reparations for the theft of their land by Israel.

hack89

(39,181 posts)
30. Israel does accept that
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 10:27 AM
Jul 2014

they have made offers to the Palestinians several times before. They even withdrew from Gaza as a ill conceived good will gesture.

Reparations are reasonable as long as they are part of a package that pays reparations to the hundreds of thousands of Jews expelled from Arab lands post Israeli independence.

NaturalHigh

(12,778 posts)
28. Yeah, let's just trust Hamas not to bring in more rockets.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 09:51 AM
Jul 2014

That will work out well. They've always been such peaceful and trustworthy sorts.

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