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Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:32 PM

Babies Are Getting Brain Bleeds—Are Vaccine Fears to Blame?

Last edited Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:05 PM - Edit history (1)

Some parents are refusing vitamin K injections for their newborns. The consequences can be devastating.
http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2014/07/vitamin-k-injection-infants-safety

"In May, the Tennessean reported on a truly shocking medical problem. Seven infants, aged between seven and 20 weeks old, had arrived at Vanderbilt University's Monroe Carell Jr. Children's Hospital over the past eight months with a condition called "vitamin K deficiency bleeding," or VKDB. This rare disorder occurs because human infants do not have enough vitamin K, a blood coagulant, in their systems. Infants who develop VKDB can bleed in various parts of their bodies, including bleeding into the brain. This can cause brain damage or even death.

There is a simple protection against VKDB that has been in regular medical use since 1961, when it was recommended by the American Academy of Pediatrics: Infants receive an injection of vitamin K into the leg muscle right after birth. Infants do not get enough of this vitamin from their mother's body or her milk, so this injection (which is not a vaccine, but simply a vitamin being delivered via a shot) is essential, explains pediatrician Clay Jones on the latest installment of the Inquiring Minds podcast (stream below). It's also quite safe.

So then why are some parents refusing to get it, leaving their infants vulnerable to a potentially devastating condition? It's difficult to understand the phenomenon outside the context of a growing fear, in general, about vaccines in the US. "There's a lot of overlap with that anti-vaccine mentality," says Jones. Indeed, reporting on the Vanderbilt VKDB cases, the Tennessean explained that "Vanderbilt doctors believe incidences are on the rise because of the anti-vaccine movement."

VKDB comes in two versions, an "early" form (occurring in the first week of life) and the much more dangerous "late" form, which tends to strike infants between two and 12 weeks old who have not received Vitamin K, and who are "exclusively breastfed" by their mothers. The problem, writes Jones, is that "levels of vitamin K in breast milk are low, much lower than in infant formula."

..."



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Reply Babies Are Getting Brain Bleeds—Are Vaccine Fears to Blame? (Original post)
HuckleB Jul 2014 OP
Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2014 #1
La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2014 #2
tallahasseedem Jul 2014 #42
mainer Jul 2014 #3
HuckleB Jul 2014 #7
weissmam Jul 2014 #25
upaloopa Jul 2014 #4
mainer Jul 2014 #5
upaloopa Jul 2014 #6
surrealAmerican Jul 2014 #8
SoCalDem Jul 2014 #9
HuckleB Jul 2014 #10
upaloopa Jul 2014 #16
HuckleB Jul 2014 #17
cui bono Jul 2014 #44
upaloopa Jul 2014 #46
Ilsa Jul 2014 #12
Fred Friendlier Jul 2014 #20
HuckleB Jul 2014 #22
LeftishBrit Jul 2014 #14
jeff47 Jul 2014 #23
barbtries Jul 2014 #11
zappaman Jul 2014 #13
mettamega Jul 2014 #15
Dr Hobbitstein Jul 2014 #18
drm604 Jul 2014 #51
Dr Hobbitstein Jul 2014 #61
drm604 Jul 2014 #63
msanthrope Jul 2014 #19
BrotherIvan Jul 2014 #21
jeff47 Jul 2014 #24
BrotherIvan Jul 2014 #27
jeff47 Jul 2014 #32
BrotherIvan Jul 2014 #33
jeff47 Jul 2014 #43
BrotherIvan Jul 2014 #48
HuckleB Jul 2014 #37
HuckleB Jul 2014 #29
blue neen Jul 2014 #26
HuckleB Jul 2014 #28
blue neen Jul 2014 #30
HuckleB Jul 2014 #34
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #31
HuckleB Jul 2014 #35
cui bono Jul 2014 #45
HuckleB Jul 2014 #47
cui bono Jul 2014 #49
HuckleB Jul 2014 #50
cui bono Jul 2014 #56
HuckleB Jul 2014 #57
cui bono Jul 2014 #59
HuckleB Jul 2014 #60
snooper2 Jul 2014 #36
LibertyLover Jul 2014 #38
HuckleB Jul 2014 #39
LibertyLover Jul 2014 #52
3catwoman3 Jul 2014 #54
LibertyLover Jul 2014 #62
xchrom Jul 2014 #40
HuckleB Jul 2014 #41
AgingAmerican Jul 2014 #53
HuckleB Jul 2014 #58
SidDithers Jul 2014 #55

Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:37 PM

1. More victims of Jenny McCarthyism. nt

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:39 PM

2. i feel like my disdain for anti-vaccers increase daily. nt

 

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Response to La Lioness Priyanka (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:55 AM

42. +1

There's simply no excuse for this!

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:40 PM

3. Some parents are so stupid. It's not even a vaccine. It's a vitamin.

And yes, I know one baby who suffered a bleed because he didn't receive the injection. He was permanently disabled and had to be raised in an institution.

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Response to mainer (Reply #3)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:51 PM

7. Exactly. I just don't get it.

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Response to mainer (Reply #3)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:30 PM

25. you have to wonder how the parents feel

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:43 PM

4. So what did they do before 1961?

What other deficiencies do babies have?

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #4)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:43 PM

5. Some babies bled into their brains.

It's one of the causes of infant mortality in the early days.

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Response to mainer (Reply #5)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:50 PM

6. What else do we do for babies like vitamin injections?

I am not a parent and not aware of what happens to babies to prevent these kinds of deaths.
I would think that parents to be are taught about these problems.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #6)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 04:57 PM

8. Parents-to-be are no better educated than anybody else.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #6)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:00 PM

9. For many years (decades, actually) expextant parents relied upon the knowledge

of DOCTORS...these days, too many people flock to the internet and decide to listen to whomever they choose...often those people are not all that intelligent..

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #6)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:00 PM

10. If parents take a reputable birthing class, read a reputable book, or have a thorough gynecologist..

..... they should know about these things going in to the birth. Of course, that doesn't happen for everyone.

Here's a bit on the post-birth prevention stuff: http://www.fitpregnancy.com/pregnancy/labor-delivery/ask-labor-nurse/vitamin-k-shots-antibiotic-eye-treatment-hepatitis-b

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #10)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:21 PM

16. Thanks for the link

Unfortuneatly there is an ad in my way which I don't know how to get rid of.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #16)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:35 PM

17. Oh, yeah, that was a pain.

Sorry, I forgot. I let it play, and then it finally let me click on the x.

My apologies.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 01:51 PM

44. Install a browser add-on called "AdBlocker".

When I go online on my work computer I remember what ads look like. Don't see any on my own system.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #44)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 02:16 PM

46. Thanks

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #4)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:08 PM

12. Brain hemorrhage can occur in newborns

because of late pregnancy complications, including medications, forceps delivery, C-section, etc. Given the frequency of these events, Vitamin K delivery after birth seems to be the smart thing yo do, even if some people believe Vit K and prothrombin are high enough by day 8.

From what I've read, opting out of Vit K it isn't a vaccine fear, but a desire to minimize distressing the newborn until the baby is older.

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #12)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 06:05 PM

20. I never understood that concern

 

My children were fine after being squeezed through a garden hose, so it never crossed our minds that a pin stick would be distressing. We hired a good OB-GYN for her expert opinion, and we followed her recommendations.




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Response to Fred Friendlier (Reply #20)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:03 PM

22. +1

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #4)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:14 PM

14. Were at far more risk than nowadays.

Infant mortality rates in 1960 were 26.5 per 1000 in the USA, and 22.5 per 1000 in the UK. The corresponding rates in 2013 were 5.2 and 4.5. Obviously, vitamin K is far from the only reason for this improvement, but is just one of the many advances in child health over the last 50 years or so.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #4)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:13 PM

23. They gave the babies formula.

Vitamin K problems are one of the reasons they considered formula "better" than exclusive breast feeding back in the 50's.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:02 PM

11. it's so frustrating.

stupid people.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:11 PM

13. What does the famous asshat RFK JR have to say about this?

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:18 PM

15. Oh My ... this needs wide circulation

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:38 PM

18. These fears brought to you by assholes like

 

Andrew Wakefield, Jenny McCarthy, Joseph Mercola, RFK Jr, and Alex Jones.

Inciting fear against proven science because some quack who wanted to sell his own vaccines decided to conspire against current vaccine makers.

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Response to Dr Hobbitstein (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 07:48 PM

51. Mercola comes up first in a Google search

If you Google vitamin k injections in newborns the very first result is a page at mercola.com with the title The High Risks of Vitamin K Shot for Your Newborn Baby. Thank you Google.

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Response to drm604 (Reply #51)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 07:25 AM

61. Not exactly Google's fault...

 

They don't set the order results come in. It's a ranking system. That mercola page has probably been linked to on a bunch of different message boards.

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Response to Dr Hobbitstein (Reply #61)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 07:44 PM

63. Oh, I understand that very well.

It's still irritating.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:51 PM

19. Always, the children suffer. nt

 

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 06:43 PM

21. But I thought vitamins were woo?

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Response to BrotherIvan (Reply #21)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:15 PM

24. Tablets are. Deficiencies aren't.

You need a minimum level of vitamins. 99% of adults in the developed world get them from food. There's rare situations where a supplement is beneficial, such as this situation with vitamin K and newborns.

There isn't evidence that levels beyond the minimum are beneficial. Thus there's little evidence to actually buy One-A-Day vitamins.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #24)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:37 PM

27. But what happens when the food itself is deficient?

There is plenty of testing to show that our food is much less nutritious than it used to be due to soil depletion and improper farming. I am not saying that multivitamins are the answer, but so many on here discount nutrition as the key to health. In this case, newborns have a severe deficiency that requires a concentrated dose. There is also neurological complications due to a lack of B12 that also requires a series of shots. But we keep putting bandaids on the fact that we do not receive the adequate nutrition to create optimum health.

Traditionally, women and men of child bearing age were given special diets so they could produce healthy offspring. In Peru, mountain tribes would trek hundreds of miles to the sea to get fish eggs and sea vegetables for couples to enhance fertility, make a healthy baby, and ease childbirth. That is also the case in some Pacific island areas where tribes would have a cease fire so land-locked peoples could go to the sea to get important foodstuffs. They had very firm rules about spacing of children as well so the parents could replenish their nutritional stores to create another healthy baby. We have totally lost this practice.

We really too heavily on extreme band aids and do not encourage health on a daily basis. It is a smouldering epidemic in this country. It seems too old fashioned to be appreciated. But we, as all other living things on this planet, have certain requirements for health that our current food landscape does not provide. Subclinical deficiencies over a lifetime could be why we are seeing skyrocketing chronic illness.

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Response to BrotherIvan (Reply #27)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 09:11 PM

32. This isn't solvable by nutrition.

Traditionally, women and men of child bearing age were given special diets so they could produce healthy offspring.

The problem at hand is a foible of our evolution. Our offspring don't get much vitamin K from the placenta or breast milk. Even if mom gets lots of vitamin K.

In Peru, mountain tribes would trek hundreds of miles to the sea to get fish eggs and sea vegetables for couples to enhance fertility, make a healthy baby, and ease childbirth. That is also the case in some Pacific island areas where tribes would have a cease fire so land-locked peoples could go to the sea to get important foodstuffs. They had very firm rules about spacing of children as well so the parents could replenish their nutritional stores to create another healthy baby. We have totally lost this practice.

You can't pick a few activities from a few cultures and declare them as better. First, there's thousands of successful cultures that were different. Additionally, a lot of times these cultures did such things to make up for a massive nutritional deficiency caused by not being able to get food from anywhere. We can get food from anywhere.

Second, there's this thing called "science". We can, and have, studied what happens if kids are born close together. Or what diet elements are beneficial. Also, if your theories were correct, life expectancy would not have gone up. Including expectancy from adulthood.

There's a massive tendency to declare the old ways superior by only looking at a small window of the society that practiced the old ways.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #32)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 09:42 PM

33. My first statement was I understood a severe deficiency

required a large dosage in the first paragraph of my post. I also acknowledged that there are other deficiencies that require an injection. We know about other deficiencies such as goiter, scurvy and rickets. I am talking about long-term subclinical deficiencies of which even our wealthy nation is rife.

What has science said about babies born too close together? As far as I know, there is no recommendation from doctors to space out pregnancies. Only not to have sex for six weeks after labour and that is being cut down to four. I know many women who are having over three children in a row to "get it over with". Working with children, I have often seen the later children to have problems such as severe eyesight deformities, learning disabilities, and sometimes behavior problems. Over and over. I have heard doctors complain that the fad to "lose the baby weight" like a celebrity is causing breastfeeding mothers to produce deficient, dangerously low-fat milk that is causing failure to thrive in some instances. We still do not recommend women have children after a certain age, but other than that, there are very few guidelines.

The trouble is, if we rely wholly on "science" for our health, forgetting that we are organisms that have basic requirements, we are missing the big picture. New discoveries are being made all the time, meaning we are far from knowing everything. And then there is the profit motivation, where less-expensive proscriptions and the ability of the individual to be proactive in their health are discouraged and called "woo".

And no, the idea that life expectancy has gone up is a myth and has been disproven often. Yes, infant mortality has gone down and infectious diseases have been controlled, but that does not mean that people are actually living longer than ever before. If that were true, we would have people living over the age of 120 on average. Funnily enough, the people who do are often do not live in modernized societies. And there are new studies that say that this generation, the average life expectancy in number of years has gone down for the first time ever in the US.

Science has made some remarkable discoveries, but saying extreme modern interventions is the only thing keeping people alive is, well, woo.

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Response to BrotherIvan (Reply #33)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:56 AM

43. Science has said...

What has science said about babies born too close together? As far as I know, there is no recommendation from doctors to space out pregnancies.

That it doesn't matter physically, unless the mother is older. If the mom is older, the kids should be 2 years apart or longer.

Mentally is an entirely different issue, and will vary from kid to kid. An "easy" first kid isn't going to be driving the parents crazy, and thus having a second kid close in age works just fine. And that mental situation can have an effect on the kid's behavior, since we are teaching children how to behave.

Working with children, I have often seen the later children to have problems such as severe eyesight deformities, learning disabilities, and sometimes behavior problems. Over and over.

Statistics don't back up what your opinion. We tend to find patterns in our lives, even when the patterns aren't really there. That's why science uses statistics instead of "It seems like there are problems".

I have heard doctors complain that the fad to "lose the baby weight" like a celebrity is causing breastfeeding mothers to produce deficient, dangerously low-fat milk that is causing failure to thrive in some instances.

And that isn't science. "lose the baby weight" is woo. If you look at the stats, we should actually be trying to be about 10-20 lbs "overweight" - people in that group live longest.

We still do not recommend women have children after a certain age, but other than that, there are very few guidelines.

That's because we evolved in a far more harsh environment. So we evolved for women to be able to handle a lot during their pregnancies. Not perfect - dying in childbirth was somewhat common until the modern era. But pregnancy just works the vast majority of the time. If it was a fragile process, we wouldn't be here. Our species would have died out.

The trouble is, if we rely wholly on "science" for our health, forgetting that we are organisms that have basic requirements, we are missing the big picture.



And we know those basic requirements due to..........? Hey, we know those thanks to science!

New discoveries are being made all the time, meaning we are far from knowing everything. And then there is the profit motivation, where less-expensive proscriptions and the ability of the individual to be proactive in their health are discouraged and called "woo".

Those new discoveries are woo when there's no independent studies to back them up.

And no, those evil corporations are not preventing study of the amazing new discovery. You don't need a corporation's permission to study your amazing new discovery. A company refusing to sell you their drug doesn't mean you can't compare your own study to a placebo. But it's a fantastic line to push when you want to sell woo.

And no, the idea that life expectancy has gone up is a myth and has been disproven often.

The myth is that cave people only lived to their 20s. That was caused by the high infant mortality. Life expectancy from adulthood does not show nearly as dramatic an increase, but it still shows an increase.

Here's life expectancy information from the 1850s to today for the United States.

An example of the myth is newborn's life expectancy in 1850 was 38, while today it's 76. That massive 38 year difference is mostly do to childhood mortality. Which is why a better measurement is life expectancy from adulthood.

In 1850, a 20-year-old white male lived to about 60. Today, a 20-year-old white male lives to about 77. 17 years is not a myth.

Science has made some remarkable discoveries, but saying extreme modern interventions is the only thing keeping people alive is, well, woo.

Yes, cancer treatments, open heart surgery and transplants are woo.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #43)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 03:44 PM

48. I will respect your opinions, but many of them are not wholly true

What do these three things have in common?

The Theory of Evolution
The Theory of Relativity
Quantum Mechanics

While I await your answer, I will provide some links to interesting reading about some of your points

Child Spacing
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/jan/9/close-birth-spacing-linked-to-autism/?page=all

From Contra Costa Health Services
If there isn't adequate space between pregnancies the mom and baby will be at risk for poor nutrition, which could lead to some of the problems mentioned earlier (low birth weight babies, or small for gestational age).


http://cchealth.org/birth-spacing/problems-cause.php

Outcomes of IQ and testing achievement on closely spaced births
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9881138

There are lots more, yet I don't have time to provide them all. So in effect, the opinion that, "That it doesn't matter physically, unless the mother is older" is not true at all, as disproven by science.

I don't know everything, but I do not agree with internet scientific "orthodoxy" and neither would most actual scientists. Science does and must constantly evolve. It is in fact a debate tactic used as a call to authority in most cases. It evolves quite rapidly in medicine because the human organism is always surprising (why so many computer models or animal testing confound researchers when taking a drug to human trials). The cholesterol hypothesis and statin overuse is one such paradigm that is being dismantled as we speak. Cancer treatments, as you tout, might finally move away from the 150 year old slash/burn/poison that only survives not because it is so effective (except for fast growing cancers) but because it is so damn profitable. There are treatments that actually work by using the immune system, the most powerful weapon in the human body, to defeat cancer rather than knocking it out. So yes, medicine has made amazing advances, but what it has never claimed is to know exactly how the body works.

But some tried and true methods have been thrown out due to the next shiny thing or lack of profit. I have personal experience with thyroid conditions where the method of treatment that worked for over a century was overturned by new testing that was considered "the gold standard" by modern medicine. Trouble is, the test doesn't even test the correct thing and has led two generations of doctors to underprescribe or fully ignore the condition. We have a synthetic drug that Pharma is fighting to push out the more successful treatments because it is in the top five most prescribed drugs. Trouble, is this drug only works with about 10% of the population, the other 90% it makes worse. The traditional drug is not patentable because it has natural origins, so the pharmaceutical company is trying to eradicate it. This is leading to all kinds of trouble and could be the reason for high cholesterol, increased heart attack, diabetic complications, fibromyalgia, CFS, high blood pressure due to kidney blockage and on and on. Science, and most specifically medicine, is no longer able to proceed without the backing of wealthy corporations. University research has been wholly corrupted by corporate sponsorship.

I am actually not writing this for you, as we obviously disagree. But I hope others that read it can see that there are a range of answers in science itself. It's not all woo. But only the most ardent believers tout that our current science has the answers for everything and is completely without bias.


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Response to jeff47 (Reply #32)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 07:48 AM

37. Good post! (eom)

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #24)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 08:14 PM

29. Good, concise post.

Exactly.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 07:34 PM

26. A couple of questions.

What if a baby is born with a genetic blood clotting disorder (Factor V Leiden, for instance)? Would it be dangerous for that baby to get the Vitamin K injection?

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Response to blue neen (Reply #26)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 08:13 PM

28. There doesn't appear to be concerns of that type on the literature that I can find.

Even the anti-vitamin K shot folks seem to be aiming at other matters. Here's a piece that covers some of that:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/separating-fact-from-fiction-in-the-not-so-normal-newborn-nursery-vitamin-k-shots/

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #28)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 08:33 PM

30. Pregnant women with Factor V do have to inject the Lovenox shots.

I would imagine, then, that the pediatricians would be aware of what to do when the baby is born. I have Factor V, but my childbearing days were long before the availability of Lovenox!

Vaccines have saved us from so many devastating illnesses. Sometimes people just need to get a grip and do what's best for their children.

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Response to blue neen (Reply #30)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 11:11 PM

34. Indeed.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 08:36 PM

31. And this, fellow DUers, is why we call people like RFK Jr asshats.

 

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #31)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 11:31 PM

35. No argument here.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 01:53 PM

45. The problem with that is you negate everything else he has done when you do that.

Not everything is black/white, either/or. Or do you cast everyone you meet aside when they do one thing you disagree with? Humans are complex and imperfect.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #45)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 02:48 PM

47. Actually, RFK, Jr. is the one negating other work he did that might be valuable.

His behavior with journalists last year was plain old despicable.

http://www.cjr.org/the_observatory/robert_kennedy_jr_vaccines_aut.php?page=all

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #47)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 03:54 PM

49. That's a shame, but it does not negate his other work. To dismiss it because of this is to abandon

the ability to see that not everything is black or white. Human beings are complex and imperfect.

Or do you really think all his environmental work is now worth nothing simply because of his views on vaccines and behavior when criticized for it?

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Response to cui bono (Reply #49)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 07:09 PM

50. However, it one does not question his other stances, it would be unwise.

If he can't get the science right on this, when it is astoundingly clear, can he be trusted on his other stances, or has he made serious mistakes there, too?

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #50)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:33 PM

56. But that's not what you are doing. You said "no argument here" to calling him an "asshat".

So without evidence of other issues you and the poster you responded to threw him under the bus based on this alone, according to what's been posted here.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #56)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:37 PM

57. He made his bed, and you don't appear to want to recognize that.

The guy's anti-vaccine stances only hurt people, and could lead to death and disability.

I'm not doing anything that you claim I'm doing, by the way.

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #57)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:41 PM

59. Like I said, it's a shame, but that does not discount what he has done for the environment.

And like I said, based on the posts in here that is what you've done. In fact, you keep justifying it rather than make any sort of statement saying that his other work could still be valid.

But if you are not doing that then you have a funny way of agreeing with someone.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #59)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:08 PM

60. I'm not the one justifying anything.

I'm the one who is questioning. That's always important.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 11:33 PM

36. If your parent is too stupid to do the right thing, and you die

 

does the baby get a darwin award since they would probably be idiots throughout you life and bad things would happen anyway? Or do the parents get honorary awards?


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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:19 AM

38. I honestly don't know if my daughter

ever had a post natal vitamin K shot. She was adopted from China and the story the orphanage told us was that she was found abandoned in a doorway of a municipal building where women from the country side would leave unwanted baby girls. The orphanage checked there at least once if not more a day for children. They said when they found her she was less than a day old. I'm guessing that OB care was not one of the things a family would spring for, let alone any post natal care for a girl. Now I'll worry about it the rest of my life.

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Response to LibertyLover (Reply #38)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:54 AM

39. If your daughter is healthy now, she probably came through it all right.

Take care.

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #39)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:33 PM

52. You are probably right

And yeah, she's a typical 12 year old, right down to eye roll and the whine of "mooooooooom". LOL! You take care as well.

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Response to LibertyLover (Reply #52)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:05 PM

54. Of the many things you might have to worry about...

...when you have a 12 yr old, not having had the neonatal Vit K shot is no longer one of them. Vit K is synthesized by the normal gut bacteria. Newborns don't have any, but these "good guy" germs have long since developed in your daughter.

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Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #54)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 08:30 AM

62. True that -

not only is she producing K, but also whatever it is that causes 12 year olds to decide that eating anything green, with the exception of mint chocolate chip ice cream, is going to maim or kill them.

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:13 AM

40. du rec.

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Response to xchrom (Reply #40)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:48 AM

41. Thanks! (eom)

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:41 PM

53. They fear, "Government Injections"

 



Republicans are flat out stupid

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #53)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:38 PM

58. +1

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Response to HuckleB (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:31 PM

55. DU rec...

Slate has had some pretty good science reporting and opinions lately:

The Anti-Vaccination Movement Has Become an Anti-Vitamin Movement, and Babies Are Suffering

t’s hard to believe it was possible, but anti-vaccination fanaticism has taken a darker turn, as Chris Mooney reports for Mother Jones: Now, it's not just vaccines that parents are foolishly rejecting for their children, but also a simple injection of vitamin K that has been a standard part of newborn care since the 1960s. Some parents now find themselves rushing to the emergency room with babies sick with vitamin K deficiency bleeding. “This rare disorder occurs because human infants do not have enough vitamin K, a blood coagulant, in their systems,” Mooney writes. “Infants who develop VKDB can bleed in various parts of their bodies, including bleeding into the brain.” Bleeding in the brain can cause brain damage and, in some cases, death.

The problem started to attract attention this spring, when Tom Wilemon, writing for The Tennessean, reported that seven babies had been admitted to the Monroe Carell Jr. Children's Hospital at Vanderbilt in a mere eight months with vitamin K deficiency bleeding, which doctors believe may be on the rise because of parents refusing the vitamin K shot at birth. That certainly seems to be the case with Mark and Melissa Knotowicz, who refused the vitamin K shot when Melissa gave birth to twins because they heard that the shot causes leukemia. As Wilemon writes: “An old study did draw a correlation between the preservative and leukemia, but followup studies disproved that theory, according to Vanderbilt doctors.”

When one of the twins got sick, doctors first assumed it was some kind of blood poisoning, but quickly learned about the vitamin K shot refusal. Both babies were diagnosed with vitamin K deficiency and given the shot, but for the baby who had bleeding, damage had already been done:



And from Phil Plait, who is one of my favourites:

The Littlest Victims of Anti-Science Rhetoric

After all these years advocating for science, and hammering away at those who deny it, I’m surprised I can still be surprised at how bad anti-science can get.

Yet here we are. Babies across the U.S. are suffering from horrific injuries—including hemorrhages, brain damage, and even strokes (yes, strokes, in babies)—because of parents refusing a vitamin K shot. This vitamin is needed to coagulate blood, and without it internal bleeding can result.

Vitamin K deficiency is rare in adults, but it doesn’t cross the placental barrier except in limited amounts, so newborn babies are generally low in it. That’s why it’s been a routine injection for infants for more than 50 years—while vitamin K deficiency is not as big a risk as other problems, the shot is essentially 100 percent effective, and is quite safe.

Mind you, this is not a vaccine, which contains minuscule doses of killed or severely weakened microbes to prime the immune system. It’s a shot of a critical vitamin.


Thanks for posting.

Sid

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