Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 07:43 PM Aug 2014

VANDANA SHIVA, BULLSHIT ARTIST: This Week In Pseudoscience

http://www.twipscience.org/news/2014/8/5/q9h838x9mawvrq8fincfenghry209m

"On the 1st of August, an article was published on Common Dreams titled 'The Fine Print of the Food Wars'. This letter was penned by none other than pseudoscience heavy weight and the remarkably effective anti-science troll Vandana Shiva. And before we can truly get into the track record of this woman, let's start taking a look at the article in detail.

The first thing that struck me as odd was how loaded the title was. Chronicling the woo of the world, you get to see some impressively titled pieces of crap, but this one was nefariously loaded. Attributing a 'fine print' to the topic immediately places the reader as an outsider from some type of bureaucratic red tape and insinuating a complexity that doesn't exist. It de-humanizes whatever it is we're to be discussing. Secondly is the topic: 'Food Wars'. That word, war, is utilized by the anti-science chemophobic Luddite crowd quite often. It polarizes the discussion about our agricultural practices into two camps, disallowing for any possibility of a middle path of compromise and discussion.

...

In the very first two paragraphs, Shiva pulls out an old tactic, making the case that genetically engineered seeds are the only ones patented. In fact, almost all seeds for large scale agriculture are patented; GMO, conventional and organic. As well, she lumps in the technology with Monsanto, despite there being many different producers of GE crops, some of which are competitors in the field. This is especially troubling given Vandana Shiva rather quickly mirrored Mike Adams (owner of Natural News) famous article comparing Monsanto to Nazis and calling for the death of scientists and journalists. (although she took it down once it was apparent people were less than thrilled with the notion of opposition extermination).

...

She also makes it a point to mention that she was appointed as an expert to the UN Convention on Biological Diversity and helped to create Article 19.3. She does this because her entire career depends on legitimizing herself despite almost everything she publishes or says in public forums is either hideously distorted from available facts, or just made-up.

..."



I really hate to have to point out the reality that someone is a huckster, but, in this case, it appears to be needed. Shiva is not someone to be trusted. She has made that very clear, over and over again.

28 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
VANDANA SHIVA, BULLSHIT ARTIST: This Week In Pseudoscience (Original Post) HuckleB Aug 2014 OP
I can see why persons such as yourself would desperately want to try and marginalize her- KittyWampus Aug 2014 #1
Repeating some of her claims that have been debunked, does not make them accurate. HuckleB Aug 2014 #3
The OP starting with a rather bizarre critique of the targets own OP headline lost me right away.... Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #7
There was nothing bizarre about the OP critique. HuckleB Aug 2014 #8
Vendana Shiva is no huckster... hedda_foil Aug 2014 #2
The evidence shows otherwise: HuckleB Aug 2014 #4
Well, I was going to read her article but you only vanlassie Aug 2014 #5
I'm confused. HuckleB Aug 2014 #6
I think the point is you aren't presenting the full story tkmorris Aug 2014 #20
Actually, I am presenting the full story. HuckleB Aug 2014 #22
ALL CAPS DELIVERY ALREADY SAYS WHAT THIS IS ABOUT JackRiddler Aug 2014 #9
I Love It! HuckleB Aug 2014 #10
Hey, so... NuclearDem Aug 2014 #11
A Victory.. Cha Aug 2014 #13
So the judge failed to understand the science of the matter... HuckleB Aug 2014 #15
Everyone else other than you are wrong? awards for Vandana shiva wisechoice Aug 2014 #17
Check in here if you ever heard of more than two of those "awards" prior to reply #17 Orrex Aug 2014 #18
These "awards" are not based on science. HuckleB Aug 2014 #19
The All Caps is simply copied and pasted from the article. HuckleB Aug 2014 #14
you and Sid are like defenders of the realm in regards to woo.... dionysus Aug 2014 #12
More power to their arms! (nt) mr blur Aug 2014 #16
Oh geez, you're goring a DU sacred cow... SidDithers Aug 2014 #21
She also played a big role in, and was supportive of, Mike Adams recent Nazi-GMO rant. HuckleB Aug 2014 #25
Scientists call her a huckster while non scientists trust her. Iron Man Aug 2014 #23
Luckily, many non-scientists can see beyond the facade she portrays. HuckleB Aug 2014 #26
Persistent Anti-GMO Myths by Steven Novella HuckleB Aug 2014 #24
Another piece the debunks Shiva's usual deceptive claims. HuckleB Aug 2014 #27
Shiva lies and lies again! HuckleB Sep 2014 #28
 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
1. I can see why persons such as yourself would desperately want to try and marginalize her-
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 07:48 PM
Aug 2014

Quickly reading her bio- she is very well educated in both science AND science philosophy.

She is also from India where farmers have committed suicide after being ruined by falling for Monsato's lies.

Dr. Vandana Shiva has fought for changes in the practice and paradigms of agriculture and food. Intellectual property rights, biodiversity, biotechnology, bioethics, genetic engineering are among the fields where Shiva has contributed intellectually and through activist campaigns. She has assisted grassroots organizations of the Green movement in Africa, Asia, Latin America, Ireland, Switzerland, and Austria with campaigns against genetic engineering.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
3. Repeating some of her claims that have been debunked, does not make them accurate.
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 07:55 PM
Aug 2014

If you look into the matter with an objective eye, you will see that she is a self-serving, wealthy individual who does not care a lick about accuracy or honesty in anything. This is about reality. Why is that so hard to grasp?

She is not someone anyone should look up to: http://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2014/02/12/vandana-shiva-scandal-deepens-as-beloit-college-botches-response-to-criticism/

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
7. The OP starting with a rather bizarre critique of the targets own OP headline lost me right away....
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 10:24 PM
Aug 2014

Not to mention the rather unbecoming headline used....rather rude and disruptive, no?

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
8. There was nothing bizarre about the OP critique.
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 10:34 PM
Aug 2014

Can you challenge your preconceived notions?

That is the question.

vanlassie

(5,681 posts)
5. Well, I was going to read her article but you only
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 08:02 PM
Aug 2014

want to direct me to the criticism. And no, I'm not going to Google it myself.

tkmorris

(11,138 posts)
20. I think the point is you aren't presenting the full story
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:54 AM
Aug 2014

I don't have an opinion on this woman. I haven't read enough about her to have one. Your presentation however does absolutely nothing to convince me she is a charlatan. You do not present any sort of reasoned argument, just an assortment of hyperbolic, shouted conclusions. You sound like someone with a huge axe to grind, and the failure to calmly address the points raised by those who respond to you is not making you appear to be objective.

 

JackRiddler

(24,979 posts)
9. ALL CAPS DELIVERY ALREADY SAYS WHAT THIS IS ABOUT
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 10:35 PM
Aug 2014

ASSASSINATE CHARACTER! PILE ON AD HOMS, STRAWMEN AND JUST LIES. AVOID THE ISSUES. AVERT POLITICS. SAY "PSEUDO-SCIENCE" AND "ANTI-SCIENCE" 30 TIMES! KEEP PILING ON! MAKE HER OUT TO BE A NAZI! ASSOCIATE HER WITH SOME UNRELATED BOZO! SAY "LUDDITE"!

Here's Vandana in her own words, and a current thread about the real issues behind the GMO debate:

Vandana Shiva on the problem with GMO seeds
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025321673

All I'll bother with here is to note that anyone who defames the Luddites is automatically disqualified. It ought to be the new Godwin's law. They had nothing against technology or science. That was the defamation devised by the then defenders of the status quo, from whose playbook the current fake "skeptics" movement borrows. The Luddites sabotaged the machines that were slowly killing people, in protest against a regime of 14-hour-plus days for subsistence wages.

See ya!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025321673

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
10. I Love It!
Sat Aug 9, 2014, 10:38 PM
Aug 2014

ALL CAPS is the only thing you can jump on, because you know that Shiva is a scam artist, and you have no way of supporting her claims with actual evidence.

AWESOME!!!!!

Cha

(297,497 posts)
13. A Victory..
Sun Aug 10, 2014, 04:31 AM
Aug 2014
Sweet victory for Mexico beekeepers as Monsanto loses GM permit

A small group of beekeepers in Mexico has inflicted a blow on biotech giant Monsanto, which has halted the company’s ambitions to plant thousands of hectares of soybeans genetically modified to resist the company’s pesticide Roundup.

A district judge in the state of Yucatán last month overturned a permit issued to Monsanto by Mexico’s agriculture ministry, Sagarpa, and environmental protection agency, Semarnat, in June 2012 that allowed commercial planting of Roundup-ready soybeans.

The permit authorised Monsanto to plant its seeds in seven states, over more than 253,000 hectares (625,000 acres), despite protests from thousands of Mayan farmers and beekeepers, Greenpeace, the Mexican National Commission for the Knowledge and Use of Biodiversity, the National Commission of Natural Protected Areas and the National Institute of Ecology.

In withdrawing the permit, the judge was convinced by the scientific evidence presented about the threats posed by GM soy crops to honey production in the Yucatán peninsula, which includes Campeche, Quintana Roo and Yucatán states. Co-existence between honey production and GM soybeans is not possible, the judge ruled.

Mexico is the world’s six biggest producer and third largest exporter of honey. About 25,000 families on the Yucatán peninsula depend on honey production. This tropical region produces about 40% of the country’s honey, almost all of which is exported to the EU. This is not small change: in 2011, the EU imported $54m (£32m) worth of Mexican honey.

More:
http://www.theguardian.com/global-development/poverty-matters/2014/aug/08/sweet-victory-beekeepers-monsanto-gm-soybeans

Judi Lynn http://www.democraticunderground.com/110832710

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
15. So the judge failed to understand the science of the matter...
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:05 AM
Aug 2014

... and that's a "victory" for, well, no one.

wisechoice

(180 posts)
17. Everyone else other than you are wrong? awards for Vandana shiva
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:21 AM
Aug 2014

1993: Order of the Golden Ark, by his Royal Highness Prince Bernhard of the Netherlands for outstanding services to conservation and ecology
1993: "Global 500 Roll of Honour", by UNEP for outstanding environmental work[45]
1993: "Earth Day International Award" by Earth Day International for her dedicated commitment to the preservation of he planet as demonstrated by her actions, leadership and the setting of examples for the rest of the world
1993: "Right Livelihood Award" for pioneering insights into the social and environmental costs of the dominant development process, and her ability to work with and for local people and communities in the articulation and implementation of alternatives
1993: The VIDA SANA International Award, Spain, for her contribution to Ecology and Food Security
1995: The Pride of the Doon Award from Doon Citizen Council, Dehra Dun, India, in recognition of distinguished contributions to the region
1997: The Golden Plant Award (International Award of Ecology), Denmark, for the remarkable contribution for Ecology and Environment
1997: Alfonso Comin Award, Barcelona, Spain, for important contribution both scientifically and personally to the ecologist and feminist movement in India
1998: Commemorative Medal by Her Royal Highness Princess Maha Chakri Sirindhorn of Thailand on the occasion of the Celebration of the 18th World Food Day, organised by FAO Regional Office for Asia and the Pacific, Bangkok
1998: Medal of the Presidency of the Italian Republic from the International Scientific Committee of the Pio Manzu Centre at Rimini, Italy during the XXIV Pio Manzu International Conference on "The Horizons of Hermes"
2000: Pellegrino Artusi Award, Italy for original contribution to reflections on relations between humans and food
2001: HORIZON 3000 Award of Austria in recognition to rendering useful service for defending Human Rights and Preservation of Peace and for the vision of a world wide fair development in the third millennium
2007 The Blue Planet Award from the German Ethecon Foundation,[46][47] one of the comparatively very few 'grass-root' foundations[48] for her work "with a vision and perspective far beyond the next generation."[49]
2008: The LennonOno Grant for Peace
2009: The Save The World Award
2010: The Sydney Peace Prize[50]
2011: The Calgary Peace Prize from the Consortium for Peace Studies at the University of Calgary[51]
2011: The Doshi Family Bridgebuilder Award, for cultivating mutual understanding between cultures[52][53]
2011: The Thomas Merton Award
2012: The EarthE Award[54]
2013: Honoris causa Laurea (Master of Science degree) in Nutrition Science from the University of Calabria, Italy[55]

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
19. These "awards" are not based on science.
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:48 AM
Aug 2014

If you read some of the background, you'll see that she was given some of these based on her erroneous self-congratulatory resume, which is simply not accurate.

Her statements have been shown to be false over and over again, and no award will ever change that.

https://skepteco.wordpress.com/2013/01/11/rape-of-the-earth/

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
14. The All Caps is simply copied and pasted from the article.
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:02 AM
Aug 2014

This and other pieces that show the reality about Shiva, debunk her claims. Please stop pushing her lies on people. It is not helpful to anyone. Thank you.

SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
21. Oh geez, you're goring a DU sacred cow...
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 10:54 AM
Aug 2014

I've been somewhat leery of her because of her association with Gary Null.

Anyone who doesn't immediately run away from Gary Null quickly gets tainted by his woo stench.

Sid

 

Iron Man

(183 posts)
23. Scientists call her a huckster while non scientists trust her.
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 12:02 PM
Aug 2014

I believe the scientists.

Thank you for the article.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
24. Persistent Anti-GMO Myths by Steven Novella
Mon Aug 11, 2014, 12:22 PM
Aug 2014
http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/persistent-anti-gmo-myths/

"One persistent theme in my writing about scientific topics is that, to optimally serve our own interests, public discourse and decision-making on issues that are highly scientific should be informed by the best evidence and scientific analysis available, not on lies, myths, misconceptions, or raw ideology. I am therefore attracted to topics where I think the myth to fact ratio is particularly high.

Genetically modified organisms (GMO) is one such issue. The propaganda machine seems to be way out in front of the more sober voices trying to correct the record and focus the discussion on reality. I also see GMO as the ideological flip side to global warming denial. In the latter case we seen industry and free-market ideologues sowing confusion and misinformation. They also do the ideology shuffle – a dance in which, whenever they are nailed by the facts on one point, they state that their objection is really based on some other point. They never really acknowledge the point, just side-step it.

Anti-GMO activists, in my experience, operate the same way. They have marshaled every possible point they can against GMO, whether or not they are true or valid. When one such point is exposed as a myth, they simply slide over to some other point as their “real” motivation for opposition, but never give any ground.

...

Like any new powerful technology, GMO needs to be studied, monitored, and regulated, which it is. I do not agree with arguments that it is inherently risky, even transgenic GMO, and so far the technology has proven extremely safe. Cries of Frankenfood and impending environmental disaster are little more than ideologically driven fearmongering.

..."



Novella does a good job covering many of the usual anti-GMO attacks, as well. It's a good read.
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»VANDANA SHIVA, BULLSHIT A...