How much homework for a child is too much? My grand daughter spends at least four hours on

[mfcorey1]

assignments that include just repetitively copying information from a book. Then when assignments are turned in all that is received is a checkmark that it was done and a demerit if it is not. This is just in grade 6.

[Violet_Crumble]

1. That's per night? It seems an awful lot for a 6th grader...

I remember reading something about a study that was done on how effective homework is. I can't find it now, but it was something like 2 hrs per night is enough, and kids in primary school (I think that's called gradeschool in the US) shouldn't be given much at all as they don't gain anything from it...

[mfcorey1]

5. It varies from day to day, but not less than two hours. I should amend to say up to four hours.

[NYC_SKP]

34. As a retired teacher and admin, I find this unacceptable and reprehensible. It should be criminal.

From your description of the assignments, your child's teacher is the problem and I pray you find a solution.

Sadly, they are serving a function embedded in the institution: promoting conformity while discouraging autonomy and curiosity.

They are killing your child's innate love of learning, of school, and creating a host of other problems.

Best of luck in finding a less destructive, more supportive setting for your child.

There are ways to fight this.

If you want some specific solutions, I'd be happy to take it up with you through PMs.

[Generic Other]

60. My sixth grade teacher prepared me for academic success

She denied us recess. She kept us after school. Even kept the ones not passing after the school year let out. We never had less than 2-3 hours of homework. We had to spend every afternoon in the library. No other teachers required what she did. All of us in her class were a year ahead of our peers. I am eternally grateful to that teacher. I am a professor today because of her.

[NYC_SKP]

62. Excellent, but anecdotal. And, in some cases illegal and/or impossible.

It sounds like you had an effective and caring teacher, and it's doubtful that you were expected to copy passages of text just to earn a checkpoint.

It's also likely that the conditions and learning environment you were blessed with having are substantially different from this child's.

After school, time in the library, and summer school are all excellent ideas but are not always options in today's world for every family.

Surely you realize this.

The one element you mention as being in common with the situation described in the OP, long hours of homework, does NOT prepare one for academic success.

Again, surely you realize this.

[Generic Other]

68. I always felt she was a slavedriver

No other teacher did it. Many of my peers had no teacher who pushed like this. They sailed through school doing nothing.

We had the advantage of having a library across the street from our school. Our teacher made sure we used it. We kids complained. I don't remember any parents complaining though. They lobbied to get their kids in her class. The kids who stayed after the school year ended only did so for a few weeks. Better than failing which she did not accept.

As for the long hours of rote copying, I agree that is worthless, but seems as if the teacher is trying to make sure there's NCLB. She is trying to make sure kids can pass the tests since that is all that's taught in school anymore. My teacher made us make notebooks, collect stuff, classify material, write reports, give speeches, etc. All before the age of computers. There was not time in the school day to finish it all.

And I learned more that year than any year before or since.

[roguevalley]

78. taught for 30 years. 20 minutes a night and doesn't count a half hour to an hour just reading

I made everything not done during the day homework. Four hours is madness. They don't function past 20 minutes. Have them take breaks, then talk to the teacher. this is madness and has no value.

[DetlefK]

2. That teacher is lazy.

Just copying what is already written? That's like bulimia-learning: It goes in and it goes out. Homework should force a student to rethink what he was told.

I think, the teacher is too lazy to make up some real assignments. I know two teachers personally and they told me, at the beginning of their careers they spent many hours each evening, planning the lesson for tomorrow and the assignment they would give. Older teachers do it differently: They have a treasure-trove of possible homeworks memorized AND they have figured out how make up homeworks on-the-fly.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

3. destroying a child's love of learning

one copywork page at a time... fuck the current mentality on teaching. it's garbage...

sP

[Hemmingway]

4. Agreed.

There are a lot of wonderful teachers needlessly hamstrung by a bullshit teach-for-the-test system. It needs to GO!

[ProdigalJunkMail]

10. nailed it...

i come from a family of teachers and i was admonished NOT to enter the teaching profession due to all the crap that was coming. but i still teach... just in a corporate environment.

sP

[Heidi]

13. That's exactly what I'd call it.

Being compelled to copy text was a punishment when I was in school.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

16. exactly...when i'd act up i would be assigned a page in the dictionary

for copy work... didn't take too long for me to do the math : 30 seconds of acting up = 2 hours of hand-aching writing...

i learned PDQ that was NOT a formula for fun...

sP

[RiffRandell]

6. My son in in 8th grade and has about an hour a night.

He's in 2 accelerated classes (science and algebra) and has never gotten anything below a B on his report card.

I need to check his grades today to make sure he's not slacking...apparently math is a lot harder this year.

That's insane; I would complain.

[cyberswede]

21. as an aside...I have an 8th grade boy, too

[RiffRandell]

23. Awww...cool!

Without getting too personal, do you have anymore children?

We have an 8 year old daughter who is in 3rd grade. I'm done!

How's your teen? Mine can be grumpy but nice, respectful boy though...and paid me a compliment yesterday.

I was floored!

[cyberswede]

24. Yes, I have a 6th grade daughter, too.

She just started middle school and loves it.

My son is grumpy when he wakes up in the morning, and grumbles when asked to do chores, of course. But, the other day I dropped him off at the movies, and the theater owner was unloading a bunch of stuff for the snack bar, and my kid stopped and offered to help him carry stuff inside. I guess he doesn't mind chores for OTHER people. LOL Made me proud, though.

With my daughter, it's all about the DRAMA.

[RiffRandell]

29. That's good that she loves it.

MS can be really hard for kids. My son hasn't has any problems, fortunately.

All the boys in my daughter's class think she's so cool because she and her brother are close and she learns a lot of cool stuff from him like gaming, movies, Godzilla.

She says the sweetest things and I always tell her I want to freeze her age...as well as mine!

[avebury]

7. It has to be hard to levy the same amount of

homework to all children since different children have different abilities. A friend of mine was telling me about the list of words that her son was given for a school year. He is pretty smart and could have completed the entire list within a couple of weeks. Children need to be kept challenged but not beaten down.

[RKP5637]

8. My take on this is lots of homework indicates a poor curriculum and inept teachers. n/t

[MattBaggins]

35. Thank the NCLB and privatizers

This is part of the design to tear apart local schools so the vultures can descend.

[RKP5637]

47. Sad, isn't it anymore. The worst floats to the top. Greed rules, shenanigans rule and

"we the people," not so much.

[TBF]

9. Every night or is this a week's worth

that she does all at once?

My child is the same age with advanced curriculum. Even when the math is hard it doesn't take that long. I would say she averages 1-2 hours a night at most when the semester is in full swing.

[mfcorey1]

12. Every night

[TBF]

26. Too much is my thought -

I can see an hour or two at most in middle school. Maybe 3-4 hours in high school at most - I think I spent about that much time to do all the reading, math, and prepping for the exams.

[Sancho]

11. I suppose anything is possible, but it's unlikely to have copying large sections of a book.

If nothing else, there has been a solid avoidance of plagiarism over the last couple decades. I would think the school administration would not approve of whole passage copying unless there was a specific educational reason.

Most districts or supervisors expect teachers to keep track of homework, assignments, or some kind of accountability because of "new" assessment systems that are data driven. Because of this, checks or something similar are given for every assignment. If a typical 6th grade teacher has 5 classes of 25 students and everyone gets an assignment every day, there's no possible way to read everything and react in detail. Most teachers have some assignments that they score individually, but more and more districts are using a variety of standardized and computer-based assessments to prepare for for high-stakes testing. Things like homework are "just do it" and so they get a check (or plus, check, minus) for turning in the work.

Too much homework won't help students learn, but you might take note that school days in the US are shorter than other countries, and our school year of 180 days is less than international competition with 210 or 230 day years. Combined with crowded classrooms, our students have less "time on task" or individual attention. Sometimes teachers try to make up the difference with excessive homework (especially in accelerated classes). They know their students are competing on tests against kids who have more time to learn.

You should talk to the teacher and find out if there's a reason for the homework or if it's a rogue teacher with an unreasonable expectation.

[LWolf]

14. That's too much.

I have a couple of questions, and some suggestions.

Does your daughter have an IEP? The solution is quick and easy if she does. If not:

How focused is she? Is she using her time efficiently, or does she spend a lot of time day dreaming, getting drinks, dropping the pencil, sharpening the pencil, going to the bathroom, etc.? Are the tv and any other distractions off? Some extra time may be due to some of the above. At least, it is for my 6th graders.

As far as the homework itself? I honestly can't think of any good reason to copy things from a book. Are any of the homework assignments actually purposeful practice? Those are what I'd concentrate on. As for the book copying, get in touch with the teacher, and in a warm, cordial manner, ask what standard the copying is addressing.

Check or demerit...I don't know what state you're in, but the current obsession with "proficiency" has, in some places, determined that homework shouldn't be graded. Or practice of any kind. That could be the issue, and if so, it comes from the district and state, not the teacher. In your conversation about homework, you could ask the teacher to explain the grading system, and why some things get grades and others don't.

Those answers can determine where to go from there.

[YvonneCa]

65. I second this...

...approach.

Former 6th Grade Teacher...

[abelenkpe]

15. My son is in fourth grade and every night he also has about two to three hours

Of homework. He has dyslexia so reading and writing takes him longer than other kids. Because he gets excellent grades the school won't test him or give him extra reading help like they did last year. Last year he worked with a teacher twice a week for half an hour to help improve his reading and writing skills but the district doesn't see the need for the added expense this year since he got such good grades last year. Last year he loved school. This year he is miserable.

[RiffRandell]

17. Poor kid!

That's terrible!

[SheilaT]

18. If he's diagnosed with dyslexia,

isn't he entitled to an IEP or whatever they may call it where you are?

[madfloridian]

46. Not anymore. Arne wants ALL kids to be able to take IB classes.

That's literally his new plan. His own words.

[SheilaT]

59. I did not see that all schools have

cancelled all IEP plans.

And yes, I know what Arne said and he's an idiot, because not all kids are up to IB or AP classes.

[madfloridian]

61. When funds start to be denied for non-compliance with Dept of Ed...

that's when you see things start to happen. I think by calling attention to Arne's goals...teachers unions, parents groups, might just protect children with special needs.

[kcr]

41. Get an IEP if you don't already have one

Then bring an advocate in with you to the IEP meeting. You don't have to take that.

[abelenkpe]

50. Working on it!

The teacher who helped him last year helped us draft a request to the assistant principle for one. She warned us there would be push back because of his good grades and exactly as she mentioned the assistant principal and his new teacher said they didn't understand why we were making a fuss. So we're going to get together with them both and make our case. School only wants to provide help for those who are already failing.

Thank you for the advice!

[kcr]

54. Good luck!

I've been through it so I know it isn't always easy. Some schools are worse than others, too.

[Ilsa]

74. Stay firm and keep making noise

Until he gets the help he needs. Make certain your communications are documented, too. You need a paper trail. Good luck!

[Are_grits_groceries]

19. I taught.

When I assigned homework, I tried to remember they had other classes and lives to live.
I stressed that they at least to try to do it because I was down to the core issues and not loading them with crap. If they tried, they got credit.

[JaydenD]

20. Can you talk with other parents and group up?

I think that is too much a burden on a child.

[cyberswede]

22. I have a 6th grader, too.

I think she usually has about an hour of homework (not 100% sure, since she completes it at home before I get home from work).

She also has to read 30 minutes a night for her Spanish Lit class (and write up a summary in a log), and a few times a week, she has chapters in a novel to read for English Lit, too.

If my kid had homework like that (the amount of time, but especially the "copying information from a book" business), I would contact the school for a discussion.

[AngryAmish]

25. Way too much.

In high school if you are one of those gunners that need 5 ap courses a semester, a tasteful team sport, orchestra, founding some dummy charity that looks good in entrance essays etc. Then four hours might be appropriate.

Also, next year when they get a job when are they gonna sleep?

[hedgehog]

27. How about a new system entirely?

1. Extend the school day to 5:30 - providing time for parents to get home from work.

2. Schedule each kid for an hour of physical activity daily.

3. Provide a 1/2 hour snack break/free time at the end of the formal teaching day.

4. Provide a 2 hour study/homework time with tutors standing by to assist. This time would be used for math assignments, writig up science lab results and reading. Teachers would have to work together to divvy up the time. I think students do need to practice math to absorb it. Most lesson plans require some outside reading.

One huge advantage of this system is that homework would no longer be interfering with family life.

[merrily]

28. Regardless of hours, that is the wrong kind of homework.

[LeftyMom]

30. The guideline is generally 30 mins per grade, max.

So a sixth grader should have no more than three hours of homework. I think that's still excessive considering how long kids are in class, but that's the widely accepted upper limit.

Personally in sixth grade we generally had a math assignment every day that we had to do at home unless we finished it in class. I certainly never did, I was and am terrible at math. Sometimes we'd also have a paper or some special project (science project, history presentation, holiday play script, etc) we were working on in the longer term, but that was generally it. This was in an advanced program, fwiw. I think an excess of busy work is a sign that a teacher doesn't know what the hell they're doing and mistakes quantity for quality in challenging students.

[NYC_SKP]

31. Where on Earth did you find that figure? Six hours in 12th grade, really?

Former teacher and administrator here, I've never seen this figure used.

Maybe it's a personal experience or local, but nobody in the industry would ever suggest that as a nightly guideline.

Reasonable homework requirements vary, as they should, with tons of other factors such as family demographics, balancing with other social activities, available support systems at school, extracurricular activities, etc.

I don't find a three-hour requirement for a 6th grader to be reasonable, especially if parts of it involve just copying text.

I've seen this kind of thing before and worked to eliminate it.

[LeftyMom]

33. EGUSD has used that guideline since forever.

Six times thirty minutes is three hours, not six.

[NYC_SKP]

36. Elk Grove? I've got a bunch of teacher friends there. They have some strong programs.

~~~

I don't even think three hours is reasonable in high school, but it really depends upon the length of the school day, the type and quality of the homework assigned, and other factors.

I wouldn't toss out the guideline of one district too freely, there are just too many other factors involved.

Some of the highest quality programs I know have no nightly homework whatsoever.

Instead, they provide space and time and support on campus with after school programs.

The OP has a shitty teacher, IMHO.

[NYC_SKP]

37. PS: Grade 12 x 30 minutes = 6 hours/night.

Regarding your reply:

33. EGUSD has used that guideline since forever.

Six times thirty minutes is three hours, not six.

So, grade 10 is five hours, no?

[LeftyMom]

38. I'm not sure what you're arguing about. I said in my post that

a. that's meant to be the worst case scenario upper limit (ie when several papers are coming due and there's a test on Friday or something, not every school night)
b. I personally find it to be excessive
c. I think the emphasis needs to be on quality assignments and this sounds like busywork
d. it doesn't sound like the teacher knows what he or she is doing if she's piling students up with high quantity low quality assignments

I'm not sure why you're being argumentative, because you're making the same points.

[NYC_SKP]

39. EGUSD: Sixth grade: 1 hour 15 minutes, Four Nights per Week. (link)

MINIMUM DAILY AMOUNT OF MINUTES PER GRADE LEVEL

Four days a week.

Kinder.......20 minutes which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
First..........30 minutes which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Second.....30 minutes which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Third........45 minutes which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Fourth......1 hour which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Fifth.........1 hour which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Sixth........1 hour, 15 minutes which includes reading with or to parents, or by themselves
Gr 7-8......Average of 1.5 hours to 2.0 hours, depending on student’s course enrollment and individual efforts
Gr 9-12....Average of 2.0 to 3.0 hours, depending on student’s course enrollment and individual efforts

Projects may be used as a replacement for homework assigned on a weekly basis (i.e., a project assigned in social studies may reduce the amount of daily

http://egusd.net/students_parents/homework.cfm

[LeftyMom]

43. That's minimum. I'm talking about the maximum guideline.

Please stop being needlessly argumentative.

[pnwmom]

42. Three hours for 6th grade. But the same formula for 12th would mean 6 hours --

which can't be right.

[LeftyMom]

44. I said I thought it was excessive, did I not?

[pnwmom]

45. Yes. But you still appeared to claim that that was the guideline.

That's what people are disagreeing with.

[TalkingDog]

63. It's not your fault that some people have no ability to comprehend the written word.

Perhaps they should've been given more homework.

[femmocrat]

56. That was also the guideline in our district (PA).

It was printed in the teachers' manual. I do not know where it came from originally, though.

[treestar]

71. 12 times thirty minutes is six hours

for the 12th graders.

And extracurricular activities and sports too? Not feasible.

[tblue37]

76. But 12 times 30 minutes IS 6 hours, so that formula

would have high school seniors doing 6 hours a night, juniors doing 5.5 hours per hight, and sophomores doing 5 hours per night.

[underpants]

32. We're about to find out

Our daughter started her first day of 4th grade (gifted program) today. She's never had a problem finishing her homework to this point (mostly done at daycare) but we will see.

[Arugula Latte]

40. The top school system in the world, Finland's, gives NO homework:

http://9gag.com/gag/6698591/there-s-no-homework-in-finland

[J_J_]

48. they get her all day, if she isn't learning what she needs in that time, they suck at their jobs

This is to make sure all intelligent children who want to excel are turned off to learning forever and never have a chance to choose a novel of their cholce and actually enjoy reading.

When exactly does the kid get time to go outside and run around, do hobbies, find who they are, spend time with family?

Thank you for being such an awesome Grandma and caring!

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

49. I didn't do that much homework on a typical night in university

At that age all I recall having for homework was reading assignments, like a chapter out of a novel for english.

[gollygee]

51. That's too much

My daughter had about an hour a night at that grade and that felt like plenty.

[elleng]

52. Awful,

and not necessarily the amount of time, but the mindless assignments. Teacher should be 'consulted,' and school administration should be informed. This is KILLING the natural curiosity of a child/young person.

A picture from my daughters' school. When they went it was only grades pre-K - 3, but everyone wanted MORE!

https://www.facebook.com/lowellschooldc/photos/a.155674504446759.34492.146157132065163/919978554683013/?type=1&theater

[Cleita]

53. That's as much as I got sixty years ago but at least I got a

grade telling me if I did well or not. It was parochial school though. Also, if we didn't do our homework, we had to stay after school for detention, do the work which we got an "F" for and still had to do the homework for that night. We learned to do the work the first time because we knew we would end up doing it in the end anyway with a bad grade.

[Mike Nelson]

55. Unless there is some specific reason for her...

...to be copying - like developing poor fine motor skills, for a limited period of time - this amount of time is not acceptable. Please contact the teacher and consult. Be positive, concerned and helpful with the educators at the school- you're working for the same goal.

[femmocrat]

57. Do you have custody of your granddaughter?

If not, this is her parents' responsibility, not yours. They need to make an appointment to discuss it with the child's teacher.

With all due respect, this is your impression of the situation. There could be other factors. For example, copying from a book could be a consequence of some other action, such as being unprepared for class. I don't agree with it, but I say go to the source (the classroom teacher) instead of making assumptions about a classroom you have probably not visited.

[mfcorey1]

66. No, I do not have custody but am concerned and involved in the academic growth of my

grandchildren who sometimes skype with me for additional help. There are no assumptions but actual hands on involvement. The copying spelling words three times is not for punishment but is a part of the homework assigned regularly.

[KittyWampus]

75. Copying spelling words is different than copying passages. Repetition is one way all humans

learn.

[femmocrat]

77. There is a lot of teacher-bashing going on in this thread.

It is very dismaying that people are so ready to jump to the conclusion that the teacher is "lazy," inept, etc. I am disappointed to read so many accusatory posts. It is just too easy to "blame teachers" for every bad thing that happens in school!

I know the OP is very well-intentioned in concern for her grandchild, but I do not think the entire picture is being portrayed here. Possibly the child is just complaining to grandma about all the homework. Copying spelling words is standard practice, and three times is hardly excessive!

Like I said above, the parents need to contact the teacher for a conference if it is truly a problem. Complaining in an online discussion group does not accomplish much.

If they still have problems after a parent-teacher conference, they can go to the principal or request their child be moved to another class.

[mfcorey1]

81. There is no teacher bashing. I posed a simple question and sought input. Do not assume

that a parent teacher conference has not taken place or is scheduled. Sometimes there are policies that teachers are required to follow. Maybe the school or the district requires a certain amount of homework. We, in this post, are simply seeking information. I have found the responses interesting and some very informative. By the way, my grandchildren's parents are very involved in what happens to them in their school.

[a la izquierda]

58. I doubt my students get that much

I teach university history. Well, first off I don't give "homework." They have reading assignments that they can do at their own pace (readings simply have to be completed by a certain date). They have papers due on certain days.
As for their other classes, I'm sure they have some homework (bio or languages). But four hours nightly? I doubt it.

[MissB]

64. Our K-8 school had a philosophy of 10 minutes per grade, so a 6th grader would have 60 minutes

at the most. Teachers would stress that if it took longer than that, then they wanted to know.

Only exception was projects, but kids were always prompted to break their efforts into smaller, more manageable pieces.

In high school, my kids do maybe one to three hours a night, with some work on the weekends.

Both schools are in the same district (and are the only two schools) and are rated as high as possible. The high school has a nearly 100% graduation rate and sends 90-95% of its students on to 4 year universities (including harvard, stanford, etc). Homework is supposed to extend what is learned in class, not repeat it.

[demmiblue]

70. Ten minutes per grade seems pretty common.

It is also what the National PTA recommends.

[kentuck]

67. As a child, I would have refused such treatment...

It tends to make kids dislike learning, in my opinion. Learning should be fun, not a chore.

[treestar]

69. Very odd.

Bad teacher? Just copying information is not good homework. It should be a practice of skills.

Plus for 6th graders an hour should be enough. This is just from my experience.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

72. I was in a gifted and talented fifth grade class that assigned tons of homework

I was also kind of ADD--although they didn't call it that, so I was "fidgety"--so it was really stressful. In some ways I enjoyed the class and my fellow students, but that homework was a killer.

At the end of the year, my parents pulled me out of the program and put me in a regular sixth grade class. This teacher was much less of slavedriver but let us accelerate ourselves if we wanted to. For example, he noticed that there was a huge gap in arithmetic skills, a reverse bell curve with lots of students at each end of the scale, so he let those of us who were good at it work ahead in the book, as long as we stayed ahead of the rest of the class. Those of us who were ahead of the rest of the class in English were put to work producing a school newspaper.

I wonder if that kind of flexibility is possible anymore with NCLB.

[dilby]

73. My kids usually do about 4 hours a night.

My son is in 4th grade and my daughter in 6th, on average they get an hour or two from school and then my ex has them do 2 to 3 hours out of work books she uses because she thinks the education system in the US is very lacking.

[lonestarnot]

79. Starting early on the slave laborer conditioning. Good luck.

[Marrah_G]

80. That is too much

Leaves the child no time to play, which is important for healthy emotional and mental growth.