Ferguson and surrounding cities profit from poverty

[peasant one]

Devastating article from the Washington post. Some of the charges were for what lawyers call "poverty violations"

"On March 20 in the St. Louis County town of Florissant, someone made an illegal U-turn in front of Nicole Bolden. The 32-year-old black single mother hit her brakes but couldn’t avoid a collision. Bolden wasn’t at fault for the accident and wanted to continue on her way. The other motorist insisted on calling the police, as per the law. When the officer showed up, Bolden filled with dread.

“He was really nice and polite at first,” Bolden says. “But once he ran my name, he got real mean with me. He told me I was going to jail. I had my 3-year-old and my one-and-a-half-year-old with me. I asked him about my kids. He said I had better find someone to come and get them, because he was taking me in.” The Florissant officer arrested and cuffed Bolden in front of her children. Her kids remained with another officer until Bolden’s mother and sister could come pick them up."

[link:http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/09/03/how-st-louis-county-missouri-profits-from-poverty/|

[AuntPatsy]

1. So many if these to tell, I fear for many it is already to late ;(

[peasant one]

4. Yes there are too many of these

The attorneys drafted a white paper on what they observed:

"Overall, we found that by disproportionately stopping, charging and fining the poor and minorities, by closing the Courts to the public,
and by incarcerating people for the failure to pay fines, these policies unintentionally push the poor further into poverty, prevent the
homeless from accessing the housing, treatment, and jobs they so desperately need to regain stability in their lives, and violate the
Constitution. These ongoing violations of the most fundamental guarantees of the Constitution are the product of a disordered,
fragmented, and inefficient approach to criminal justice in St. Louis County."

[silverweb]

2. So wrong.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]This is so very wrong.

From the "family values" people, right?

Hypocritical, bigoted, hateful bastards!

[peasant one]

3. it is so wrong

one of the attorneys stated "what’s happening here is that this system is breaking good people. These are people just trying to get by, just trying to take care of their families.”

[Quantess]

5. I'm going to get some backlash for asking

The failure to appear in court: what is behind that? It seems like a no-brainer that you need to appear in court if you want to avoid a lot of unnecessary trouble. Am I missing something?

[peasant one]

6. You are missing something

First, if you can't pay the fine you may be afraid to appear in court; second, some of the courts until recently did not allow others into the courtroom (defendant and attorney only). So, if you have kids and brought them with you, you would appear for court and they wouldn't allow the kids in--you would have to find someone to take them or you would just leave and the court would issue a warrant for your arrest. Some people couldn't miss work for whatever reason (they were out of leave and didn't have vacation). I think that to people who aren't stressed out of their gills this is a no-brainer, but people in stressful situations--and poverty is very stressful--know that you may not make optimal decisions under these circumstances.

[joeglow3]

16. How do we punish the individual in the story who broke the law?

[angstlessk]

7. did you READ the article?

explained...fear of not having the fine and going to jail

[Quantess]

8. Yes, I read the article.

I have also been broke and poor, but It seems so obvious that not showing up in court would only make things 100 times worse. I was raised middle class, so maybe that's a middle class mindset?

Edit to add: from my experience, the judge gives you a fine (which is often reduced if you show up and say something) and then you stand in line and make a payment. If you can't pay that day, you have like a month to pay it.

[peasant one]

9. I think the system isn't working for the poor and minorities.

Last edited Wed Sep 10, 2014, 05:51 AM - Edit history (1)

The individuals who are hassled by these cops don't show up for court for a host of reasons but ultimately the system is set up to take advantage of them.

Think of this --the White Paper written by the attorneys -that observed these courts- stated that,

"Despite their poverty,defendants are frequently ordered to pay fines that are frequently triple
their monthly income."

I don't know about you but most people couldn't pay triple their monthly income even if they were given a month to pay it. What is happening here appears to be that these municipalities are taking advantage of people who can least afford it through a complex system that is built up around finding ways to trip up someone who is poor. And through these machinations the poor pay for the expenses of the city --so the city doesn't have to tax the real citizens. And these real citizens, you know the ones the city cares about, can hire attorneys to navigate this system and get these fines reduced and can reduce points to their licenses (if you get too many points in Missouri your license is suspended).

[Quantess]

10. Thank you for explaining in a way that is not insulting.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who wonders about people who fail to show up in court.

[Android3.14]

11. The are always two sides to a coin

Yes, the systemic prejudice in the region is a serious problem, but the ones the system abuses have to take responsibility as well. Showing up for court is part of that responsibility.

This doesn't make it right that the system abuses, just as there is no excuse to hit your partner in domestic abuse situations, ever. Still, in any sort of relationship, the participants often play the scripts that lead to further abuse.

[captainsardonicus]

12. two sides?

I don't think you realize how scary showing up for court can be to someone who is poor, and already sees a system that is stacked against them. You can't afford an attorney to begin with, and you know you can't afford whatever fees or fines will be levied against you. Then what? Will you be put in jail? What will happen to your kids? Your job? Will your already meager wages be garnished?

In light of these potentially disastrous consequences, I'd say it seems pretty callous to state that poor people should "take responsibility" and face the music.

[Quantess]

13. There must be something beyond being poor

that makes people afraid to show up in court from the start. I have been flat broke and living in poverty for a good chunk of my adult life, and I have always placed showing up in court as a high priority, because if you don't appear, you know things will only get worse.

But then, I have a clean slate, a totally clean legal record, I'm white and was raised middle class.

I have also had really annoying experiences with traffic court, but choosing to not appear seems foolish and irrational. It's poor decision making.

[captainsardonicus]

14. I actually feel the same.

Like you, I'm white and was raised middle class, and have been scrupulous regarding any kind of court appearance. But I've only had one, lol, and it was for a minor traffic mishap. I'm just trying to understand the world-view of someone like Ms. Bolden in the article. Her fear of even showing up for a court date is severe, compared to mine--and rightly so. I''m practically from a different universe.

And not to put too fine a point on it, it's also highly unlikely I'd ever be shot for jaywalking.

Just my two cents.

[Quantess]

15. Possibly, she has such an overwhelming mistrust

and fear of not only police, but of the legal system in general.

I've always been baffled by people who fail to appear in court for traffic violations. I always wondered if they were passed out and forgot to wake up, or so totally absent from reality that they don't know what day it is. But then, I could never imagine being so afraid of the legal system that I would choose to not show up in front of a judge.