Let's not do anything about ISIS

[Cyrano]

No other country in the world seems to want to do anything about them. Why should we? Yeah, I know. They're insane nuts who murder, torture, kidnap, rape, and do every other horrible thing that can be done. (And they're not Christians.) But, we don't seem to be going after every other group of crazies in the world who do exactly the same things.

We're told this is going to take a long time. Hell, WWII lasted only six years (for Europe, Africa and Asia -- less than four years for us). So we're going to spend the next 20 or more years chasing them through every dark, back alley in the world?

The Republicans are foaming at the mouth for us to attack and kill, kill, kill them. That should tell us something regarding what they want to focus on in an election year.

Can anyone give me a good reason why the U.S. should take on this endless, no-win quest to end one single group of insane people?

[Marr]

1. The oil industry would like us to.

Those fields are very profitable for them and they'd like to control them. Yes, it will cost us a lot of money and lives, but sometimes you just have to put your petty personal interests aside and think of Exxon.

Sorry, that's about the best I've got. I can see no other reason to focus on ISIS instead of some other group of malicious thugs.

[louis-t]

5. I've been thinking about this lately

and wondering if one of the reasons oil futures are tanking is because of the oil ISIL is selling (probably below market) on the black market, causing the price to fall.

[Marr]

15. It's an interesting thought-- what I read was that they control five oil fields, and that

delivers... a want to say $1million/day? I have no idea what that would do to the global market, if anything, but it's not like the information we'd get on this topic could be trusted anyway. It could be that Iraq's fields are widely controlled by groups that are not western now, and that would certainly light a fire under our government's ass.

[arcane1]

51. Dropping the price of oil will certainly get some invading going on!

"We" don't take too kindly to that.

[99th_Monkey]

16. Not to mention the Munitions Industry. ~nt~

[TreasonousBastard]

2. I think we should have the same urgency as we had..

dealing with the Janjaweed and other sub-Saharan African killers. Central American death squads, too.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

13. Hang on, are you suggesting selling weapons to Iran in order to fund ISIS? N.T.

[TreasonousBastard]

27. Well, we might consider setting up small dictatorships to...

protect whatever business we have while keeping Communists oops, Islamists out.

[Nye Bevan]

3. Was Bush right to do nothing about the Bin Laden threat?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bin_Ladin_Determined_To_Strike_in_US

[Cyrano]

4. If/when intelligence finds that they're

planning to attack us, that's the time to do something. In the meantime, I'm more scared of homegrown militia/"patriot" groups who are armed to the teeth and spoiling for a revolution.

[phantom power]

6. +1000

what if we left the middle east the hell alone, and spent 1% of the money we save actually identifying and preventing possible terrorist attacks here, in our country?

[logosoco]

25. Or what if we spent that money on renewable energy resources.

I am pretty sure that would change the power balance in the middle east.

[Nye Bevan]

8. Like this?

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/17/islamic-state-video-threatens-white-house-us-troops

[CJCRANE]

19. There's a difference between a verbal threat and an actionable plot.

But FWIW how do you suggest we respond to the threat?

[Nye Bevan]

23. I trust Obama to respond appropriately to this threat.

He has access to a lot more intelligence than you or I, and I think he has earned the right to be trusted here. Unlike, obviously, a certain other recent president.

It's good to have the grownups in charge.

[Cyrano]

43. Obama will do everything possible to

help the Dems hold onto the Senate and win as many seats in the House as possible. Yes, he has has access to intelligence. And then there's politics.

ISIS, and so much more, just fell on him. And being the President, he's stuck with it. At the very least, we should be thankful we have a thoughtful, intelligent, decent human being in the White House rather than the sick shits who lied us into this Middle East quagmire.

[FlatStanley]

44. Republicans said the same thing about Bush.

[uponit7771]

38. +1

[Enrique]

9. that comment suggests there is a similar threat from ISIS

in fact that is not true.

[Marr]

20. This is more comparable to going after Hussein.

ISIS isn't a threat to the US. They're a threat to the profits of a few very plugged-in US industries, that's all.

[Nye Bevan]

26. You would probably have said the same thing about Bin Laden in August 2001 (nt)

[Marr]

31. Your argument could've been used to justify invading Iraq. And it was, oddly enough.

Right down to the above "if you aren't for my war, you're a do-nothing peacenik".

Your principles seem to ebb and flow with the tides.

[Nye Bevan]

34. Really? What in the world did bin Laden have to do with Iraq? (nt)

[Marr]

37. Bush claimed that Iraq was a threat to the United States.

It was not.

[Nye Bevan]

39. On that, I agree with you.

My attitude to this whole issue would be very, very different if someone like Bush was president instead of Obama.

[dixiegrrrrl]

47. The problem is, Nye

that the decisions Obama makes are going to be precedent for decisions the next President makes.
And if there is a Repub Pres. down the road, that may not be good.

[Chathamization]

24. Obviously, if Bush had just bombed Afghanistan a month before 9/11 the attacks would have

been stopped.

[arcane1]

53. No invasion would've prevented 9/11, especially after the August 6th briefing

The terrorists were right here, doing all their training right here. We could've nuked Afghanistan on August 7th and it would have prevented nothing.

This is, of course, assuming that IS has the same abilities and desires to attack us here.

I'm not afraid.

[lark]

57. That's not the same, in most aspects.

Osama required intelligence and targeted strikes, but he was useful to BFEE so of course nothing was done. This is war, causing deaths to our service people and to civilians in the country, using tons of resources for war that should be better spent on improving the infrastructure, the environment and health care system. It also creates a whole new crop of anti-American fervor from people that we kill . The one way it's the same - we funded both Osama and ISIS. After the disaster from the Osama experiment, you'd think we'd know better than to repeat the same mistake. The MIC don't care, they just want more war and more weapons and they and their paid lackeys, the Repugs and pro-war Dems want to personally profit from all war all the time. There is no real reason to go there and Obama should hang his head in shame as I'm sure he knows he's just doing this for political expediency.

[wyldwolf]

7. "No other country in the world seems to want to do anything about them."

Coalition of 30 countries to help Iraq fight the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant "by any means necessary".

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/09/france-urges-global-fight-against-201491584827778481.html

[Cyrano]

14. Wake me when their troops get there

[wyldwolf]

22. Cyrano jumps down thread, moves goalpost

[pampango]

35. For some, if you are going to 'do anything' that means troops and boots on the ground. Anything else

does not count as 'doing anything'. That seems to be the McCain principle: "If you really care, you'll invade."

[A Simple Game]

59. 30 countries? Then we must certainly be able to sit this one out. n/t

[Nye Bevan]

10. I stand with Elizabeth Warren on this.

http://thehill.com/policy/international/216559-warren-destroying-isis-should-be-our-no-1-priority

[Enrique]

11. why?

why Elizabeth Warren of all people?

[totodeinhere]

29. Myself, while I usually support Senator Warren I try to be an independent thinker and just

because she supports it that doesn't necessarily mean that I will. And I must say that there is no politician whom I agree with 100% of the time.

[Nye Bevan]

30. Me too. (nt)

[Aerows]

40. Agreed!

Heck, I'd be afraid if I agree with any politician 100% of the time, even those I generally respect.

[dmosh42]

12. We did our 'humanitarian' rescue, so time to let them go at it! This was well predicted when we.....

removed Saddam. The rest of this is the continuing religious war between Islamic factions. No winners here!

[99th_Monkey]

18. Yes. Thank you for a voice of reason.

A rarity these daze.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. But..but...we have a golden opportunity to lose another war and prove our stupidity!!

[R.Quinn]

21. With you 100% on this

I can't think of one reason that makes any sense whatsoever.

Keep our American lives at home. Keep our country's wealth at home. Attention and warfare is exactly what they WANT. If we ignore ISIS, we win. If we further bankrupt ourselves by attacking them, THEY are the winners.

[Aerows]

28. KurtNYC linked to this in another thread

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/09/16/1330029/-Saudis-Lobbied-John-McCain-Lindsey-Graham-to-sell-War

It is extremely comprehensive and explains why ISIL suddenly appeared and became the "next big bad".

I absolutely agree we should do NOTHING about ISIL.

[dixiegrrrrl]

48. Cheers to you, Aerows.

Good find.

[Aerows]

49. kpete made an OP about it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025545166

I missed it but KurtNYC was able to provide it along with other stuff.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025549655#post75

[Aerows]

49. kpete made an OP about it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025545166

I missed it but KurtNYC was able to provide it along with other stuff.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025549655#post75

[Algernon Moncrieff]

32. The Middle East: Not our circus, Not our monkeys

Israel, Egypt, Syria, Saudi Arabia -- I say we wash our hands

[Politicalboi]

33. It's our fault this is happening

I feel real bad for Iraqi's who now have these terrorist in their country. WE fucked up Iraq. Saddam would have handled this. I think Bush/Cheney should have to pay to help the Iraqi people. And maybe we could trade Bush/Cheney to ISIS for some of their hostages.

[Skidmore]

36. What is your plan?

Are you planning to forfeit complaining about those "insane nuts who murder, torture, kidnap, rape, and do every other horrible thing that can be done" when they continue to engage in those horrific acts agains other people? Why is important that they are "not Christians."

I know that I would like to see this group broken up and the states that support them to suffer withdrawal of financial aid by our nation.

[Aerows]

41. My plan would include

Not doing Saudi Arabia's dirty work for them. Does it not seem fishy that all of the freaking sudden this armed group sprang up with elaborate funding when we didn't invade Syria earlier?

We are being taunted into a war. That's exactly never a reason to enter into one. When someone attempts to goad you into a fight against their enemy while they stay out of it and cheer for you, you are being played a fool.

[Cyrano]

45. Regarding the "not Christians" comment in the op

This morning, I caught a piece of an MSNBC interview, (don't know which show) in which a Republican Congressman (I think he was from California) was being interviewed. The reason it caught my attention is because he said, "... and they (ISIS) are killing Christians there."

What kind of humongous, incredible ass did he have to be to drop that comment into an interview? Is he whipping up his base, looking to get more fundamentalist Christians behind him, adding another dose of hatred for Islam, or all of the above?

[Scuba]

42. But we have to!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

46. actually many other countries have expressed concern over isis

and are willing to join coalitions against isis.

[Rozlee]

52. There was a coalition in the Gulf Wars too.

One consisting of greed and bribery. The countries involved either had stakes in the country's resources or were promised weapons or oil profits by the US for their participation. The geo-political stakes are high in the Middle East and it's not about freedom, democracy or human rights. The old saw during the first Gulf War still stands. We wouldn't have lifted a finger when Saddam invaded Kuwait if their chief import was broccoli.

[locks]

54. Kerry: The cancer in Iraq

Republicans and warmongers: If we send 3,000 American troops into West Africa to build clinics and protect health care workers we may be able to contain the ebola virus but we may not have enough troops to "kill the cancer in Iraq." Sweet irony.

[maddiemom]

55. Yes! For once let them battle it out among themselves.

Only one problem: Fox warns us that ISIS fighters are crossing the Mexican border with the illegal immigrants. We know this because they are dropping their copies of the Koran along the way. Also some "Islamic" clothing. Just check out the Elizabeth Hasselbeck interview with this genius Texas sheriff. Not to worry, though. They'll be no match for Texas law enforcement.

[TexasProgresive]

56. Well "It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is."-Big Dawg

Every time I hear or see in print ISIS I think of Bill Clinton's famous response about the word is. And that Isis is the Goddess of fertility and Isis is Lord Grantham's dog ( Downton Abbey).

[toby jo]

58. One day somebody sat our pal Barack down and showed him some $ that made his eyes pop.

And he thought about what that could do for his future, for his wife and daughters, for his people, and he bit.

He's not the first. It's a well- bitten apple.

[Cyrano]

60. Sorry, I can't buy that.

I really don't believe that Obama could be bought.

Perhaps you're a cynic and I'm a naive idiot. However, I really believe that Obama is a man who wants to leave the world a better place than he found it.

Any president can make a fortune in speeches after leaving office. He doesn't need Wall Street's lucre.

This is a guy who cares, and is president during a period of history that really sucks a lot. He is stuck with a Cheney/Bush world and there's no one on the planet that can fix that.

He is stuck with a neocon philosophy of macroeconomics and there's no one in the world that can change that.

He is stuck with being a black man in a country that can't shake the era of slavery and is still going to take many years to shake the perception of black people as "the other."

He is a man who loves his wife and children. He is a man who's trying to do the best possible in a really lousy era. He is a wonderful man who everyone should respect. He is a man that, just perhaps, Americans will come to revere. Perhaps.

But I will never believe that this is a man who views the office of the presidency as a way of enriching himself.