U.S. should be "stepping up our efforts to track where people go when they leave the United States."

[FrodosPet]

Warren: Destroying ISIS should be 'No. 1 priority'

http://thehill.com/policy/international/216559-warren-destroying-isis-should-be-our-no-1-priority

Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) on Wednesday said that the Obama administration should make defeating the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) its top priority.

"ISIS is growing in strength. It has money, it has organization, it has the capacity to inflict real damage. So when we think about a response we have to think about how to destroy that," Warren told Yahoo's Katie Couric.

~ snip ~

Asked about the dozens of Americans who have reportedly joined ISIS, Warren noted that the U.S. should be "stepping up our efforts to track where people go when they leave the United States."

"The terrorists have moved, and we have to move in response," she said, adding part of that "means we're going to have to change in fundamental ways how we monitor our citizens when they go abroad."

~ snip ~

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Not really sure where this goes. Senator Warren is right in that ISIS is a dangerous group. But is it dangerous enough to further erode our rights to fight them?

[NYC_SKP]

1. Yes, it's about time. The open border movement is a Libertarian Concept.

Tight economies required tight borders.

Seems to me to be a no-brainer.

[TreasonousBastard]

2. This is horrible...

doesn't she remember the Red Scare days, McCarthyism and all that other Cold War bullshit that cost us a fortune?

The Soviets were a nuclear power with an enormous delivery system, so maintaining a deterrent made some sense, but wtf is the threat from stateless Arabs running around in the desert that we should abandon some of our basic rights?

[Warpy]

4. Yeah, there's always a bogeyman out there

and a cabal of rich men who think citizens of this country have too much freedom.

The combination will be a lethal one for this country. They've already destroyed the fourth amendment because of the drug and al Qaeda bogeymen.

Pretty soon there won't be much of an America to fight for.

[Agnosticsherbet]

3. Oh yes, lets expand our intelgence gathering to spy a bit more on millions of Americans

who travel abroad. Perhaps it would be easier to put every American on the no fly list.

[moondust]

5. Or how about

going after ISPs that allow the posting of beheadings and other violent propaganda? Saw a report about a group arrested in Australia that was plotting to kidnap random people off the street and make propaganda videos of beheading them or whatever.

[JustAnotherGen]

6. Bad idea

I will have to take a deeper dive into her statements beyond what is at the link - but she's wrong on this one. I hope her strongest supporters (not talking about DU - the US is bigger than just DU) challenge her on this.

OFAC and BIS lists are a good group of people to track - and we currently do. They are both wed to NSA activities for banking and telecom. I'm very well traveled. I have all three of these functions at a major wireless carrier. We have all we need to cross check those who have the potential to engage in these activities abroad.

A "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks" is not efficient. Do we miss people? Yep. But on this I would rather hold the line. You need money and communication methods to track a terrorist as well as past behavior being a strong indicator of future behavior.

We have what we need - we don't need to worry about what John and Jane Doe are eating at a cafe in Belgium.

[GeorgeGist]

7. Her Red roots are showing.

[hobbit709]

8. and then we will start tracking them here.

Just like in the USSR when you needed a permit to travel from one city to another.

[Feral Child]

9. Why not take it a step further?

I think that travelers need to explain where and WHY they are going. If their income is under seven figures, or if they actually pay taxes, they should be refused permission.

[WinkyDink]

17. Always had to declare where and why. My reason was always "Personal," but "Business" was an option.

[Feral Child]

22. I should have been more specific

in my language.

I meant, sardonically, that we should have to ask permission from our government , with justifications, before planning a trip so the government can refuse to allow trips without "proper" reasons.

[WinkyDink]

23. Oh, the old Pre-Emptive Permission trick! ;-)

[Feral Child]

24. Yep.

[Romulox]

10. Warren speaks like someone who was a Republican into her 40s. nt

[malaise]

12. Ouch!

[treestar]

11. What "our rights"

She's talking about ISIS and people who might join it and they are outside of the United States. That does not violate our "rights."

[MineralMan]

13. Way back in the late 1960s, if I wanted to travel outside of the US,

I had to submit a detailed itinerary 60 days in advance, and there were countries I couldn't visit. If that sounds weird, it did to me at the time, as well. The reason was what I was doing for the previous three years. It involved a Top Secret security clearance with additional endorsements. Those travel restrictions were imposed when I was discharged from the USAF. Those restrictions were in place for 10 years after my discharge.

I'm pretty sure that what Warren is talking about here has to do with people being recruited in the US to join ISIS. A goodly number of Somali immigrants here in the the Minneapolis St. Paul area have been recruited and have joined ISIS. That's the reason for Warren's concern, I'm quite certain. I doubt she's worried about anyone's trip to the Mediterranean on a cruise. Really.

[JustAnotherGen]

15. And we can use

OFAC
BIS
And Phone/Bank records to find these people.

I'm really hoping that she just misspoke and doesn't want to take intelligence agencies eyes off of the algorithm in place. What we have now is not perfect - but it's better than 'check everyone'.

[MineralMan]

16. Not really.

Those systems are not really designed to deal with individuals who might be traveling to join terrorist organizations. The phone/bank records is probably the only one of the three that applies, and those are pretty much overwhelmed right now, given the vast amount of data that is collected.

Learning that Abdi from St. Paul is traveling to Syria isn't all that simple really. From my understanding, most of this travel is done in segments, with only the one originating in the US able to be monitored in real time, and then pretty much only if the person's name is on some registry of people being tracked.

I'm not sure what Warren was talking about in any sort of detail. The US is able, right now, to know who is leaving the country on an airline, but if a ticket only includes the first destination, purchase of additional tickets after that person arrives at the stated destination isn't really trackable in advance for US citizens with passports.

The problem is not a large one, and not that many are doing this, so it may be a problem that doesn't need to be managed so carefully. I don't know, frankly. But Warren has identified a gap in our knowing who is heading out of the US to join some terrorist organization. How that intelligence gap might be filled is hard to imagine, though, I think.

If Abdi is going to fly from MSP to some airport in Greece or Turkey, we might know that. Where he goes from there isn't so easy.

[JustAnotherGen]

18. I disagree with this point . . .

Those systems are not really designed to deal with individuals who might be traveling to join terrorist organizations. The phone/bank records is probably the only one of the three that applies, and those are pretty much overwhelmed right now, given the vast amount of data that is collected.

We review customers lists every single week - and do backwards searches monthly.

They always start from BIS and OFAC. Always.

I do this as part of my job MM - it's not willy nilly - the NSA stuff. It's measured and focused.


All three work together. And I consider Telecom/Banking as one - because we have the same charge from Fed Gov. And the same interruptions to commerce as banking . . .

http://www.fbi.gov/minneapolis/press-releases/2014/mustafa-family-crime-ring-indicted-for-using-thousands-of-stolen-identities-to-steal-cellular-telephones-and-tablet-devices-worth-millions-of-dollar

^It always starts with a Fraud or a Theft - then it goes Import/Export - then the cross check^

Might take a year/two years - but read that link closely.

[MineralMan]

19. I understand. But review doesn't stop Abdi from

getting to Syria. Looking at what has already happened doesn't prevent it from happening, and that's the need right now in this specific situation.

Reaction isn't prevention.

[JustAnotherGen]

20. Ahh see

I don't believe what they are telling us - i.e. - that we didn't know. That we don't know.

They ask too much of banks and telecoms to have me believe that they are just sitting around whistling zippity do dah waiting for the next 'attack'. No way. The requests are relentless.

[L0oniX]

14. Because the NSA is too busy passing home made porn around.

[FiveGoodMen]

21. And then there was one...

[Cali_Democrat]

25. What do you mean?

[CBGLuthier]

26. I am going to Switzerland in December for a week and then I am going to Mauritius

for the rest of my life because I do not want to live in a batshit crazy ass war mongering shit hole of a country where even the most liberal members of congress have to kiss the ass of our disgusting excuse for foreign policy.

Adios motherfuckers.

[FrodosPet]

28. Sounds awesome. Pretty darned close to paradise on Earth

Just be careful if/when you go swimming (of course, that ALWAYS applies). Sounds like they may have a bad undertow problem?

--------------------------------------------

http://news.sky.com/story/1340013/teen-is-13th-to-drown-off-mauritius-this-year

A teenager died while swimming with dolphins after being best man at his father's wedding on an island paradise.

Callum Howkins, 17, from Hinckley in Leicestershire, failed to surface during a dive at Tamarin Bay, Mauritius.

His body was found an hour later by the coastguard.

~ snip ~

"A skipper of the boat that conveyed him has been arrested. A preliminary charge of involuntary homicide by imprudence was lodged against him before a court of law. He did appear in court and was released on bail.

~ snip ~

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

27. Are we on Red Alert yet? Time to "Smoke 'em out"?