General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIf you were president how would you respond to the threat from ISIS?
Thank you in advance for your responses.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)while reserving the right to be outraged when something bad happens.
Oh ... You asked what I would do as President ... not an anonymous person typing on an anonymous message board.
samsingh
(17,595 posts)Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)to allow them to focus their own resources on ISIS. Build hospitals, schools, roads, utilities.
randome
(34,845 posts)They would probably blow up every hospital that treated people indiscriminately.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)Or you can try arming people, who then simply abandon those arms for ISIS to take and use.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)The people who kill and blow things up are able to cow the local populace into accepting them as the defacto order.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)I'd say humans are humans, no matter what part of the world they're in. They're about as easily cowed in 'that' part of the world as we are in 'this' part of the world. When you proclaim 'them' as 'different' and requiring violent solutions to problems you just make excuses for the war machine.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)predict this, democratic voters I mean, back when there was a chance to stop it?
So, the solution is to do more of what created this in the first place?
I also would warn those Arab Dictatorships that are being touted as 'allies' to stop funding these terrorists groups as they have been doing for eons. But then we would have to NOT WANT excuses for more and forever war.
randome
(34,845 posts)No one 'created' the mess other than the usual haters of women and minorities. Sure, maybe the CIA had a hand in making stupid decisions that led to ISIS. But 'we' did not create them.
Not even hypnotism can make you behead a stranger or rape your wife unless you already want to do so for your own reasons.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]A ton of bricks, a ton of feathers, it's still gonna hurt.[/center][/font][hr]
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)in the ME. Greed, power, money and OIL is why we are there. Before us it was the OLD EMPIRE, now it's the NEW EMPIRE with the old one tagging along. Or who knows, maybe it's the old one using the power of the new empire to continue their centuries long policies.
So the CIA made a few errors? Lol!
Sancho
(9,067 posts)cut the military budget in half - spend the money on developing new energy in the US.
At that point, Isis wouldn't care about us.
KansDem
(28,498 posts)I might go one step further and give them the Fab Four to do with what they please --
Oh, and I'd tell the Sauds to **** themselves. And I'd release the 28 pages!
leftstreet
(36,106 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)and able to buy or develop any kinds of weapons including nuclear who will then attack Europe, Asia and eventually the US.
Yeah, that's not a good plan.
nationalize the fed
(2,169 posts)it's kinda like the old domino theory, only New and Improved®
The domino theory was a theory prominent from the 1950s to the 1980s, that speculated that if one state in a region came under the influence of communism, then the surrounding countries would follow in a domino effect. The domino theory was used by successive United States administrations during the Cold War to justify the need for American intervention around the world. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domino_theory
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results." Rita Mae Brown
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)flamingdem
(39,313 posts)and his legacy is on the line.
He accomplished the big goal of creating a coalition including many Arab nations.
Meanwhile the Republicans can only respond with - he should have done it sooner and other stupidities.
I believe that some Repukes would rather see an attack on US soil than work to prevent it.
While we don't know how this will end up it was necessary to weaken Isis, no doubt about it, and apparently the Korasan Group that is/was a more advanced group as far as US attacks.
So far so good. Obama is the clean up guy for the repulsive legacy of the Bush admin and CIA doings regarding Saudi Arabia etc.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)flamingdem
(39,313 posts)but there's always room for a twist ending.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)flamingdem
(39,313 posts)and let's face it - the resources and intel of the US.
A competent leader was needed to bring any sanity to the situation and on top of that Obama's actions might lead to at least temporary peace - Iran meeting with Britain, Iran meeting with Saudi Arabia. This is under Obama's wing and flows out of his strategies.
Erose999
(5,624 posts)hands folded watching the US go it alone?
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)L0oniX
(31,493 posts)They get attention from their videos and messages ...while we can't even see the US military coffins being offloaded.
TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)Heads are cut off and propped up ALL OVER THE CITY.
If I'm asked to prove it, and it's allowed I will. I have the pics.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)L0oniX
(31,493 posts)TwilightGardener
(46,416 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)or attacking us here. Disengagement in Iraq and Syria.
If the regional nations are concerned, have them deal with it. We could provide humanitarian relief to refugees and cut off funding to the extent possible. Sanction nations who by oil form IS, work with the regional nations to block access to funds and resources. Facilitate discussions of the regional nations to address and solve what is their problem.
US bombs are not the answer.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)money.
Next, after all those people are on jail, I would seize all of their assets and anyone doing business with ISIL.
Next, make SA, Iran, Syria, and Israel get together to deal with it.
Oh yeah, prosecute those who got us into Iraq in the first place.
Sorry for shouting but it's so loud with all those bombs
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)for this war during the UN meeting period.
We can't afford it alone and some of those countries owe big time.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Easy peasy right?
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)From thier conquests.....who you gonna prosecute?
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)30,000 barrels of oil per day?
Who is sending oil well repair equipment? Who does the payroll for the oil workers? Maintenance on their military equipment? Who sells them bullets?
A million dollars doesn't do you any good without someone who is willing to launder the cash.
Also, have we bombed the oil resources where they are making their money? Why not?
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)I knew you had...
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Last edited Tue Sep 23, 2014, 03:52 PM - Edit history (2)
That's what we should be doing.
But hey, hope you guys are right.
Although history has proven this tact to fail time and time again.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)So ISIS aren't perpetrators of murder and torture in your book?
Should we have intervened with Hitler in YOUR book? And by the way Arab Nations are ALSO bombing ISIS....along with other nations supporting this....I hear it is 50 of them....but YOU....disagree!
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Oh gosh yes!
As far as tracking black market money, that would involve arresting banksters. In my view, it's cheaper and easier than another 3 trillion dollar war.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/avinash-tharoor/banks-cartel-money-laundering_b_4619464.html
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)we are talking oil.....Black gold....Texas tea.....
What you don't think there is lots and lots and lots of money changing hands for nefarious shit?
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Obama and dislike everydamn thing he does?
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)cheapdate
(3,811 posts)Thousands of Syrians gathered in 2011 in nationwide demonstrations for political reforms, an end to secret police kidnappings and massive corruption, and an end to the 40 year rule of the Assad family. Assad responded to the protests with lethal violence.
So, whose attempt to overthrow Assad are we talking about? The Syrian people's, or the modest support the US provided to them?
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)chaos. We just had 400,000 march in NYC..... should Assad now arm the craziest of those people and goad them into military action?
How bout Ferguson?
What would be the result?
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Your opinion..so what is your opinion on that Black guy in the White House . ...since you are offering your opinions and all .
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)a real coalition.....and he might be preventing a huge massacre of Kurds....
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)It was all over tv. They flew in the second and largest wave....and so did the French
cheapdate
(3,811 posts)Our getting involved happened in 2003. Our getting uninvolved happened in 2011.
"...should Assad now arm the craziest of those people and goad them into military action? "
No, Assad should not arm the craziest.
"How bout Ferguson" Racist cop shot and killed an unarmed teenager.
"What would be the result"
???
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)LordGlenconner
(1,348 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)LordGlenconner
(1,348 posts)I guess you must have deduced that because I object to the bile you post about the president here on a daily basis.
It's cute that you believe you are somehow above the fray.
Erose999
(5,624 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Erose999
(5,624 posts)their commentary.
LordGlenconner
(1,348 posts)Of folks who start dozens of threads on DU with negative posts about Democrats, and especially the president, week in and week out.
FSogol
(45,480 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)yet on and on and on they go....coming here to do NOTHING else but complain about any and all things Democratic both person and policy....and YET proclaim that "they" are Democrats....there has GOT to be some other reason...
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)which is one big reason why I never ever want to be a president. There doesn't seem to be any easy options in this situation.
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Xyzse
(8,217 posts)1 - The attacks we received are attacks of opportunity, meaning that they can only do things as they see it. They can't really attack using long planned methods. So, the best thing to do, is to fix things so that there are less opportunities to exploit.
2 - Improve roads, public spaces, medical centers (particularly by expanding health care). Couch it as improving security, and planning for disasters. If we as a society plan for natural disasters, which are capable of creating damage that far exceeds any terrorist threat.
So, triage centers, access to hospitals, fire departments and police improvements are key to this.
Basically, improve construction here, and utilize existing talent within the US to improve health, security and infrastructure to reduce threat, while benefiting society as a whole.
This is far better than piddling our funds to a place that is for all intents and purposes is just a money drain hole.
Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)knowing the whole region has become unstable by using the bombing tactics.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)I would rather use that "fear" to do something, as a means of improving infrastructure within the US.
Not there.
Change the idea of "attack out of fear" to "build and defend".
Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)how to respond to the threat, agreed that our infrastructure needs improving everyone knows that, but you take action by taking the war to them. You don't ignore it because doing so allows for escalation of threats.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)Use the public's fear instead to something more productive in regards to fixing things here instead.
So, change the conversation from "attacking a group outside of the US" taking a side on an area we don't know much about in regards to variables, as most of them hate us for our interventionist approach any how. Attacking now merely creates more enemies. I don't really like that idea, and if they escalate further, which I sincerely doubt they can... Then, we have already started preparing ourselves within the country first.
What have they done to us other than small things that happens monthly from the last Administration in greater numbers?
I feel like we're only attacking because of a public outcry of people who don't know enough about the situation to begin with.
Until they themselves reach a state of equilibrium, we can't help them any how other than killing a group or multiple groups giving one ascendancy for probably a year or two before it devolves again.
Besides, fixing things here is a direct response to a threat. A response does not always mean attacking.
I did mention infrastructure, and included fire department and policing. I think that is more important than a military response.
Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)will affect the US economy either directly or indirectly if the Obama administration sits back and do nothing. In taking the war to them you ( should also mention that I'm not in favor of bombing as it solves nothing) succeed by isolating the troublemakers in the region, find the culprits responsible for such inane actions which we've seen from them and help with the stability of the region, all this should be done with the help of our allies in the region.
On the issue of
The answer to this question will be based on ones perspective, the issue of terror is not for one to wait till it falls on our doorstep before taking action, you address terror by taking actions on the small things that you mentioned they have done to prevent them from becoming major threat in the future.
Until they themselves reach a state of equilibrium, we can't help them any how other than killing a group or multiple groups giving one ascendancy for probably a year or two before it devolves again.
Yes it is a possibility that the administration is taking action based on public out cry, obviously the reason behind this out cry came from the beheading of two Americans in Syria. What this shows however, is that this terrorist group is operating from the same rules applied by Al-Qaeda which tells me that the players in the dark alley are the same guys who orchestrated and supported Al-Qaeda. On the issue of help, no one wants another 911 to occur therefore you take actions to prevent another disaster.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)I mean, mentioning the unsexy things like improved roads, and flow of traffic to be able to get out of disaster areas.
Fixing bridges so that they don't collapse when disaster strikes.
Hospitals and triage beds, when disaster actually happens.
Fire Fighters and Policing improvements particularly in regards to intelligence gathering would be a better means of preventing disaster.
Striking people through bombing and doing that type of strikes to me merely increases the threat to the US. Generally due to the ones involved in the collateral damage and what is seen as American over-handed and heartless intervention.
If I had to do it, I would, but this tends to hit a larger group rather than actually getting the problem.
Like I said, taking actions to prevent another disaster does not mean a military option or an attack.
Still, I take your point in helping allies in the area and finding stability.
Problem is, I am not convinced that those we are helping are indeed the allies that we should be fostering.
In certain ways, like I mentioned earlier, till the area finds a state of equilibrium and a solid group that can stabilize the area (does not matter their policies), I would foster a relationship with them first, before influencing their policies. Those can come later.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Xyzse
(8,217 posts)However, the question was, what I would do if I were President.
It assumes that I am not Obama, but myself.
Obama is doing what he is doing, as he is himself. I seem to be to the left of him, and I would make the attempt to change the conversation rather than go along with this.
---
Change the question to, "If You were Obama" what would you do? Then, I'd probably do the same thing, as he may have painted himself to a corner.
---
My answer was, what I would like to see, not what is being done. So it is colored by what I think is most important.
On Edit, I'd probably do what Obama is doing, but still try to change the conversation to include doing things here.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)or sabotaging U.S. installations.
Provided funding and assistance for refugee management.
Attack ISIL's sources of funding, which right now is black market oil sales primarily through Turkey.
Non-military funding for regional efforts to oppose ISIL.
The bottom line is that U.S. military intervention in the Middle East has never solved the problem. There is no reason to think that it will work this time.
Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)I will first tell the WAR HAWKS to fuck off and die, then will visit NSA and get them to monitor every electronic devices in the region. Focuses on the use of satellite and drones images in the area while monitoring movement between Russia and Syria at the same time utilizing our special forces to carry out rescues of Americans or British that might have been captured.
Using bombs has just put all captives in greater risk from being saved.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)What our objective in a region is is kind of the most important question that we never address.
Erose999
(5,624 posts)aid, where needed.
Send a "singing telegram" to PNAC telling them to fuck off.
951-Riverside
(7,234 posts)all records on any agents or employees who are directly or indirectly funding, training, arming and supporting ISIS rebels in any way, declassify those materials and turn the papers over to the department of justice for prosecution, I would also send a second copy of said materials to the Hague.
Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)but don't bet on it. Everything is so convoluted that you get lost in translation in trying to fin d answers.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)The_Casual_Observer
(27,742 posts)populace. Like the good old days.
TeeYiYi
(8,028 posts)...why ISIS deserves more attention than the murderous drug cartels of Mexico.
Close to 100,000 people have been murdered by gangs in Mexico since 2007. Most of those murders involved beheading.
Mexico has a common border with the United States, whereas ISIS would have to charter a plane or a boat to get here.
Tens of thousands of beheadings in Mexico...
TYY
Bigmack
(8,020 posts)ISIS is just another fringe group, and the other fringe groups fear them. Why not encourage all that fear and distrust between the nutball groups?
A few weapons, a little money, a lot of propaganda, a LOT of opposition research and black intel.... "Hey...do you know what they said about your mom?" "Are you gonna let them talk about the Sunni/Shia/Wahabi/ that way?" "Let's you and him fight!"
Add a few well-placed and anonymously delivered bombs to sow more confusion....
I think ISIS is a small powerless group with a great PR campaign of "fear us" going. And most Americans have fallen for it.
JI7
(89,247 posts)ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)world hunger, mosquito nets for malaria infested countries, increasing world literacy rates, and things like that. I would try to be force for what I consider to be good, which would save significantly more lives than dealing with ISIS.
I feel like people are more concerned with punishing people than saving people.
Dems to Win
(2,161 posts)Remind the king of all those American weapons that equip the Saudi military. Tell the king in no uncertain terms that America will do absolutely nothing if the Saudi-created Frankenstein creature attacks Saudi Arabia. So they had better take ISIS out before they get to the Saudi border.
Hold a press conference outlining all the military equipment sold by the US to Saudi Arabia, point out how they have the capacity to solve the problem they created, and we expect them to do so. Announce that this is a great opportunity for the real Muslims of Saudi Arabia to show the world their compassion and concern for all humans by taking out ISIS before they kill anyone else, Muslim or non-Muslim.
In short, I'd like to see Obama use the bully pulpit of the presidency to shame the Saudis into doing the right thing for once.
(this question was asked and answered extensively in this thread; I cut and pasted my previous response here. http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025520067#post80 )
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)LuvLoogie
(6,995 posts)muntrv
(14,505 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)highmindedhavi
(355 posts)nt
tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)The regional players have plenty of incentive and resources to do something about them. I'd wish them luck and offer what ever support they may need short of military aid beyond what we have already provided.
TBF
(32,050 posts)To start with. I'd probably also be assassinated pretty quickly for not playing ball with the MIC.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)underpants
(182,776 posts)Man from Pickens
(1,713 posts)and ignore it until and unless it actually becomes our problem instead of that of some dubiously-designated "ally"
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)Since I believe the ISIS threat is being hyped and manufactured to provide an opportunity for unstated policy objectives, I would not respond like the president.
Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)All that did was telegraph our intentions to bomb ISIL out of existence.
Instead, I would have started the bombing campaign at night, when most Americans are asleep.
I would have made my announcement that the US had started bombing ISIL in Syria from a golf course, even though the news media outlets had already been talking about it for the last 8 hours on tv.
Hopefully, I could get an early tee time from one of those exclusive golf clubs in New York City to use as my backdrop for this awesome announcement so as to shock and awe everyone that they actually let me on their freakin' golf course.
At the golf course I would be wearing a plaid pair of pants just like Payne Stewart used to wear, to show my support for Scotland recently holding an election to become independent, and to also poke a stick in Queen Elizabeth's eye that kingdoms like hers are outdated now that I am the President of the United States.
At this announcement I would also have my vice president, Joe Biden, in my foursome, and he would be seen standing behind me, sort of doing some low growling while I talked slow and deliberate into the microphones, while practicing my swing like Johnny Carson used to do on his tv show.
Joe wouldn't be real loud, mind you, just loud enough as to be audible to the careful listener.
I would make sure that Joe would also have a Shasta Strawberry pop with him that morning.
So he could let some red foam dribble from out of his mouth every once in awhile, you know, to make it look like he has rabies and is stark raving mad, sort of how Cheney used to do it.
Then, after I made 3 or 4 short contradictory statements about how short the bombing campaign of ISIL will be, I would say something deep and historic like, "Now, watch this drive" and let the media pundits do their thing for the rest of the morning.
Then early that same afternoon, I would put on my tan suit and announce that I am going on the road to help more Democrats get elected to Congress.
And I would be sure to call ALL Republicans, not just those that had disagreed with my ISIL bombing campaign, weak and unpatriotic and make hints that their parents may have not been legally married at the time of their conception.
I would also make obtuse, outlandish, audacious comments that the entire Republican party is not able to keep America safe, even at the state level.
I would constantly refer to my new ISIL bombing campaign as proof of my ability to keep America safe, at the same time.
Then, after approximately 5 grueling days on the road, crisscrossing about a quarter of the country for the 2014 mid-term elections, I would take a much well-deserved vacation until Thanksgiving.
And then, on the day before Thanksgiving, I would return to the White House, still wearing the same tan suit, but instead of participating in the annual pardoning of a turkey, I would chop the turkey's head off -- live on tv -- and then look straight in to the camera and say "See, I can chop off heads, too!!"
Then, 2 days after Thanksgiving, I would make an unannounced trip to Hawaii to announce that I am increasing the ISIL bombing campaign, just in time for Christmas, by 400%, so that the Republicans will know just who is really large and in charge here!!
And to announce that I am going on vacation until January 15th because it is too damned cold to stay in Washington in December.
LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)Action has no inherent strategic advantage over inaction. Let the various groups who oppose ISIS fight them.
If we had done what I wanted, ISIS would not exist in the first place.
Skeowes28
(62 posts)Some people are so naive we don't want to bomb them not because we want to it's because we have to aid education and bombs to prevent genocide
GeorgeGist
(25,319 posts)customerserviceguy
(25,183 posts)those nukes you've been working on, well, you might just need them."
zappaman
(20,606 posts)You better believe it!
?d=1296372882
kwassa
(23,340 posts)SummerSnow
(12,608 posts)Arrested the Bush administration and handed them over to them in return for the hostages.