Man beheads co-worker after firing

[DemocratSinceBirth]

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MOORE, Okla. — Police said Friday a man recently fired from a food processing plant in an Oklahoma City suburb beheaded a woman with a knife and was attacking another worker when he was shot and wounded by the owner of the company.
The 30-year-old man, who has not been charged, stabbed Colleen Hufford, 54, severing her head in Thursday’s attack at Vaughan Foods, Moore Police Sgt. Jeremy Lewis said.
Lewis said the man then stabbed Traci Johnson, 43, a number of times before being shot by Mark Vaughan, a reserve sheriff’s deputy and the company’s chief operating officer.
“This was not going to stop if he didn’t stop it. It could have gotten a lot worse,” Lewis said.
Lewis said the suspect had been fired in a building that houses the company’s human resources office, then immediately drove to the entrance of the business. Lewis said he didn’t know why the man was fired.
Johnson and the suspect were hospitalized and in stable condition Friday, Lewis said.


http://nypost.com/2014/09/26/woman-beheaded-by-co-worker-in-oklahoma/

[Sopkoviak]

2. Yep, a real hoot. Laugh thought I'd die.

eom

[CBGLuthier]

3. I imagine she is covering her face in shock horror and grief

but hey, if it made you laugh it was all worth it right.


Can someone tell me when DU became overrun with callous people? Or has it always been that way?

[shenmue]

4. A full moon?

[snooper2]

5. My ROFL was for the video I posted, not for the story or the woman at top per say

But you knew that right!

[philosslayer]

6. Yes, because its always appropriate to post a funny video...

On a thread about someone who was brutally murdered.

[snooper2]

7. probably not always, I have to disagree with you there

[TDale313]

11. How about nearly never?

Even if you couldn't click on the link, the thread title shoulda tipped you off that this was about something pretty horrible that had happened.

[Aerows]

22. Indeed

It was insensitive as hell.

[Ms. Toad]

14. So you think it is funny to take pictures of people who clearly say

they don't want you taking their pictures, pretend to respect it, all the while having a back-up videographer filming the exchange - and then post it on Youtube?

I certainly hope the videographer obtained consent to use the images of those who clearly declined to participate...but I'm suspecting not.

A real laugh a minute.

[snooper2]

19. most people don't care and do it in good fun, the funny ones are the ones who throw a fit

"I didn't give my approval for my picture to be taken"

Um, we are in public

"you need approval, I'm calling the cops!"

There are hundreds of videos of LEA blocking cameras and throwing fits about video recording in public. Some groups do it on purpose. For example, search for-

First Amendment Test - Des Moines Water Works Encounter - "Legal Theories"
on YouTube-


This waterworks manager dude throws a FIT because the guy is video taping the treatment plant. You can't record this! Well, tough shit dude, I'm on public property you can't stop me. COPS! LOL But, terrists! the terrists!

[LanternWaste]

30. Even funnier still is the one person on the thread attempting to rationalize the irrational.

"the funny ones are the ones who throw a fit..."

Even funnier still is the one person on the thread attempting to rationalize the irrational.

[Ms. Toad]

31. Two things:

1. If you are a decent human being, you don't intentionally take pictures of private individuals - especially when they ask you not to. And if they do ask you not to, if you are a decent human being, you do not continue to have a friend video tape them from a different location.

2. Having a right to take photos in public places does not give you the right to use those photos which include recognizable individuals for your own gain without the consent of those whose persona you are using to promote yourself. Virtually all states have right of persona/publicity laws - which require consent of those being photographed or videotaped before recognizable images of the person are intentionally published online.

[snooper2]

32. LOL, cameras are everywhere you have no expectation of privacy in public

LONG ESTABLISHED!

as for #2, you better tell YOUTUBE!


Education of the public and LEA is key and there are people out there doing it-

[Ms. Toad]

34. The presence of cameras everywhere

is completely irrelevant to the two points I made, neither of which had anything to do with an expectation of privacy (which, by the way, is a criminal concept, having to do with the Fourth amendment, not the First Amendment:

1. Decent human beings don't act that way. Neither of the two involved were mindless cameras. They were individuals who were intentionally photographing individuals who asked not to be photographed.

2. Individuals have rights with respect to the use of their images by others. Those are balanced against first amendment rights when you are talking about a matter of public concern - but the first amendment has very little to do with idiots appropriating the images of private individuals who are not engaged in matters of public concern for their own gain and amusement.

[TDale313]

39. Seriously, why?!?

Why are you *still* hijacking a thread about a particularly brutal murder? Ya wanna start your own thread about how privacy is dead, yay upskirt pics and peeping toms and stalkers, be my guest, but it has NO PLACE here, and it takes a particularly nasty human being to mock a complete stranger's grief/pain.

[Logical]

38. This poster is famous for making fun of accidents and injures. nt

[Aerows]

21. I think everyone on DU

that saw that post knows how ridiculously insensitive it was, and your follow-ups aren't much better.

[TDale313]

9. Stay klassy.

[Demit]

15. You really have to learn when laughing is inappropriate.

This is a horrible story. Laugh about your side shit some other way.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

18. Really? That's what you got out of the story?

Not going to alert, but maybe you ought to think about self-deleting in good taste.

[Ms. Toad]

8. Wonder how the witnesses know

"Nolen shouted Islamic phrases during his attack."

Did anyone present really speak classic Arabic to recognize the language being spoken? If someone did, have they confirmed that what was being shouted had anything to do with the Islamic faith?

The cynic in me says this just an attempt (conscious or not) to link a very ill individual to current acts of terrorism in the wider world.

[leftstreet]

10. +1 What exactly were the phrases? n/t

[maced666]

12. I wish you were joking.

But I know you are not.
Pathetic.

[jwirr]

17. I assume that they are thinking about the ISIS call for followers to find someone, anyone and

behead them. Thus they think he was speaking Arabic. Who knows - someone with a mental illness and angry at people at work could easily latch into the idea.

[Lee-Lee]

20. "Allahu Akbar" is pretty recognizable

And if reports that he was yelling such phrases are accurate, big if, it was probably included.

With a work force that size odds are good there were enough recent vets who have learned some Arabic along the way.

I wouldn't be so dismissive of the chances of it.

[Ms. Toad]

28. I think it far more likely that witnesses heard him yelling things they didn't understand,

and made assumptions about what he was saying.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

23. Since he was a convert to Islam

They are probably pretty sure that their assumptions are correct.

[Ms. Toad]

27. Arabic is a fairly complex language to learn.

It would surprise me if a recent convert was particularly fluent in it (since conversion appears to require recitation of a single sentence).

[OnlinePoker]

33. Why do you assume the Islamic phrases were in Arabic?

He was a North American convert to Islam. My copy of the Koran at home is in English.

[Ms. Toad]

35. I don't think the witnesses would have made the comment

if he was quoting phrases from the Quran translated into English. Had he been doing that, I doubt it would even have occurred to may of them that the source was the Quran.

[Gore1FL]

37. It's weird that he shouted "Islamic phrases" as he was apparently a Christian.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/09/26/oklahoma-beheading/

The problem with the claim is oMr. Nolen’s arrest report. According to the Oklahoma Department of Corrections, Mr. Nolen sports numerous tattoos, all of a Christian theme. From a greeting in Arabic given by Christians in the middle east to a portrait of Jesus and the clasped hands of Christian prayer, none of it fits with a member of the faith of Mohammad. In fact, having tattoos is strictly forbidden in Islam, as said in the Koran (al-Bukhaari, 5032):

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) cursed the one who does tattoos, the one who has a tattoo done…

Before he could convert to Islam, he would need to have had the tattoos removed. Of course, the right-wing sees that one of them is in Arabic, and they begin proclaiming that it is Muslim, and that he therefore must be a Muslim, ignoring that the greeting is not specific to any religion and is used by Christians as a greeting in several countries.

[liberal_at_heart]

13. This is a horrible murder just as any other murder is. With the terrible lack of mental health care

in this country I have often thought to myself that I would not want to be in a position where I had to fire someone.

[daredtowork]

16. People are so worried about "gun rampages", that they miss the other possibilities for mass violence

For instance, mass stabbings seem to be a trend: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mass_stabbing

And then there is always bombing, mass poisoning or contamination with diseases ("white powder scares&quot ...

We can't just neatly categorize this as "domestic terrorism". There are so many triggers: mental illness, political agendas, retaliation for bullying or some personal injustice.

My take on this so far is that people commit acts of terror - dragging in innocent bystanders - when they feel terrorized not just by specific people, but by vague forces they have trouble identifying, and therefore they can't negotiate with or fight back against. They don't know where the attack is coming from, so they don't know where to fight back. And the bystanders aren't neutral: they are people who aren't helping - who need to be "leveled" to feel the pain, to get their attention, to be motivated to do something in the future. The bystanders have made a death treat because the terrorized individual feels suicidal: the choice is kill self or kill the society that made you feel suicidal. That's a huge generalization, but that's my best guess as to the psychology behind an act of mass terror that doesn't have a specific political motivation.

My solution would be to reduce the chances of people feeling terrorized. Reduce the stakes of being fired. Offer more outlets to handle disputes and problems - besides lawyers which people can't afford. Make sure people can get their basic needs in life met in an emergency: food, shelter, housing. Just give people a local place to complain if they have some random complaint. Provide a valve for the steam. Reduce the terror imposed on the individual, and it will reduce the terror projected on a massive scale.

Just my 2 cents.

In the mean time, I'm betting we will see more "domestic beheadings".

[BrotherIvan]

24. I agree with many of your suggestions

But just to note, if the guy had had a gun, most likely many more people would have been injured & killed. In a crowded place such as a factory, he could have killed many more people.

[daredtowork]

25. You would think that

But if you look at the mass stabbings in China and compare the death tolls from "gun rampages", it's actually pretty much the same. Mass stabbing seems even scarier to me.

[IdaBriggs]

26. Well, obviously it was her fault - she was probably wearing slutty clothing.

Or not being careful enough about what she was eating or drinking, because hello! You have to watch out for that stuff, especially when you are a woman in a public place.

Oh - wait-a-minute!!! This isn't a RAPE CRIME? How embarrassing!

My bad!

In that case, we should all PRAY FOR THE FAMILY. That should take care of the problem.

Because not all victims are created equal, not all crimes are taken seriously, and sometimes you just have to point it out.

And non-sarcastically, sympathy to those involved in this horrible situation.

[Cayenne]

29. And so it starts.....

[Raine1967]

36. What starts?

I don't understand what you mean.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

40. Cryptic comments can be interpreted in so many ways.

I guess that's the person's making them intentions.

Odd and deeply sad story...

[Raine1967]

41. Yes, and it's why I asked.

I wanted to know what was being communicated.

This is a very sad story. To be very honest -- I find anything from a Murdoch publication suspect. I still want to know what this DU'r meant with said comment.

Here is a local report. http://kfor.com/2014/09/25/reports-police-respond-to-possible-shooting-near-moore-grocery-store/

The FBI is now looking into Nolen’s background after his former co-workers said he tried to convert them to Islam after converting to the religion himself.

Lewis says the FBI is working in conjunction with the Moore Police Department, especially when it comes to the religious aspect of the case.

At this time, it is not known if the suspect’s beliefs played a role in the attack.

Adam Soltani, the executive director of the Council on American Islamic Relations in Oklahoma, says Nolen’s actions are condemned by the Muslim community and his faith should not be connected to this horrific crime.

CAn you see how quickly the NYP tried to allude to religion? It's slanderous -- This may very well have been a sick person.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

43. I will try to make as few inferences as possible.

CNN is following the outline of that story as well.

[Raine1967]

44. I appreciate that.

At this point I don't expect an answer from the person I originally asked.

I wasn't questioning you, I was questioning another DU'r.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

46. But this interests me.

The cynics are suggesting this is just an attempt to stir up anti-ISIS hysteria. They may be right...They may also be wrong...


It's okay to have an open mind.

[Raine1967]

48. I think you may understand why I asked that of the DU'r.

(I did get an answer, after all. one that I appreciate.)

[Cayenne]

42. Copycats will follow his lead

This was already predicted. IS will recruit among the dissaffected and there will be more of this bloody violence.

[Raine1967]

45. Thank you for the answer.

I am not sure I am willing to believe this was an ISIS/ISIL recruit. I do appreciate the answer.

At this point, I think this was a disturbed individual. Deeply and deadly disturbed.

[alphafemale]

47. Because if he had just shot her as happens numerous times a year in workplace deaths

She would be much less dead.

[TDale313]

49. It's not rational, I'll grant you...

Last edited Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:41 PM - Edit history (1)

But there is something people react to on a gut level with beheadings. I suspect it's a "desecrating the body" thing. And it's also relatively rare in Western society, whereas (as you point out) at least in the US, gunshot deaths are all too common. It's understandable people find this and the journalists' beheadings particularly horrifying.

Editing to add, because your post did get me thinking: looking back particularly in British and French history, there was a time not to long ago (in the grand scheme of things) where beheading was considered one of the more humane forms of execution.

In any event, this was a horrible crime, and obviously touched a nerve with many people.