General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsShouldn't it be "Arab-led air strikes, assisted by America". Since five Sunni Arab nations with far
more on the line than trembling America half a world away, I think I am right.
They are doing more missions, and they have fighter groups with female commanders, that is more than just a bit of human interest news.
And the Arab nations are not afraid of ISIS, they are not shitting their pants over a beheading.
Meanwhile in trembling, terrorized America the major media turns up the terror machine knob to Full Fear Factor and folks are being told to hide under their beds.
The major media have become allies of the terrorists, both are spreading fear as far and wide as they can.
It is obvious, it is disgusting and irrational....the major media are doing it on purpose, the major media campaign for one more hit of the old war crack pipe that the entire nation is addicted to, shaking like a junkie missing its fix.
You can almost feel the rush of relief when the first bombs were dropped and those glorious clips of
America's glorious and gloriously expensive air war machines were like balm to a festering wound.
America, modern plutocratic, divided AMERICA, is the greatest threat to America in history, not a bunch of pickup riding religious zealots with a modern video editing studio 10,000 miles and an ocean away.
Land of the brave?
Prove it.
.....................
Edit: Seems the very notion of America not doing the majority of the killing in a war campaign, in combination with the notion of being led by, gasp, Arabs and Muslims, is beyond the capacity of some folks to handle.
Why am I not totally surprised? OK, maybe America can be the Sheriff and the Arab fighter pilots from five nations near the conflict can be America's Local Deputies, all better now?
cali
(114,904 posts)if you think the U.S. would let American forces be under the command and control of those countries, think again. And politically? There would be an uproar. And yes, if we were "assisting" them, then by definition we'd be under their command and control.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)tritsofme
(17,376 posts)Don't get this OP. Arabs are major contributors, but this is an American led effort.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)Fortress America.
They built the fort to keep you in, not others out.
tritsofme
(17,376 posts)This response is nonsense.
Throd
(7,208 posts)I'm trying to see if those words make sense in a different order, because they don't as you originally typed them.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)that it should be Americans assisting in this military effort, it's absurd. assisting means that they would not be leading. If they're not leading, presumably some other nation or group of nations is leading.
You seem to want to wriggle out of this fact. No dice, fred.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)Tough talk is cheap.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)... that would mean you'll "bravely" fight with your keyboard.
No surprise.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)Clearly, a high ranking member of the 101st Chairborne.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)The RW crowd would be so happy with your ability to ignore the issues.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)Fuck the "RW crowd."
The "issue" is tough talking keyboard warriors wanting to send others to do the heavy lifting and dying while they sit safe and secure many thousands of miles away and do it on other people's dime.
Ad hominem attack that.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)isn't it?
Can you explain how all these wars, lives and money spent, have benefited Americans?? What is the American people's STAKE in any of this??
99Forever
(14,524 posts)I'd be very interested in someone, anyone, explaining those answers. I see absolutely no benefit to anyone besides the war profiteers and the oil goons.
EX500rider
(10,839 posts)How does the Peace Corp benefit Americans?
How does foreign aid benefit Americans?
How does feeding starving children in Africa benefit Americans? etc..
Some things are done because they are the right thing to do.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Here's what we DO know.
According ti the House and Senate Intel Committee Americans are now LESS safe than they were before 9/11.
How could that BE if continuing to KILL people all over the ME and even in Africa, see Libya, was done to 'keep America safe'??
Feeding starving children V bombing innocent people!!
Creating good will around the world DOES benefit Americans.
But you didn't answer how killiing people benefits Americans since it has made them LESS safe??
EX500rider
(10,839 posts)I said some things you do for other reasons.
And having a genocidal terrorist based group carve out their own country in the Middle East is a bad thing for everybody.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)world?
We went to war 13 YEARS AGO to 'wipe out' terror. NOW we are told, terror is WORSE THAN EVER.
So, here you are saying let's go do what failed SPECTACULARLY for 13 years to an even MORE dangerous group which exists ONLY BECAUSE we went to the ME already.
Can someone explain to me how repeating a total failure isn't going to have the same result again?
Speaking of Genocidal Maniacs. Did you how many of them are ALLIES of the US? We seem to be very selective when it comes to brutal terrorists.
We even PAY some of the world's worst Dictators. Can you explain that? IF genocidal maniacs is what we are supposed to care about.
EX500rider
(10,839 posts)None?
Our allies are UK, France, Italy (and various other NATO countries) and Australia/New Zealand, South Korea and Japan. End of list.
So, here you are saying let's go do what failed SPECTACULARLY for 13 years
Except it didn't fail spectacularly..Al Qaeda had their very own country to base in and plan atrocities like 9/11...but they don't no more.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Your list is only a short list. And a couple of them have a history themselves that they apparently would like to repeat so are tagging along with the LATEST Empire obviously feeling a bit nostolagic for the old brutal Colonial days, which are not that far back. See Apartheid, Northern Ireland, Algeria and much of Africa and the ME and then ask the people there who suffered under these old Colonialists for CENTURIES, how they feel about their jumping on board AGAIN to try to recolonize the world.
But to get to a few of the more recent Brutal Dictators we are in bed with.
Let's start with the 'five Arab Allies' in this latest foray into yet another war.
Know anything about the Bahrain Dictatorship?
How about the Saudis?
Qator? Whose 'boots' are now our proxy armies, in Libya, another spectacular disaster for the unfortunate people who live there.
Italy you mentioned? Know anything about Italy and Libya eg?
So we have a new 'Coalition of Dictators' helping us now in Syria and Iraq.
But that's just the beginning of the list of Brutal Dictatorships we are in bed with.
Here's a great example. Uzbekistan. We pay the genocidal maniac, Karamov, who runs that tragic place, MILLIONS to let us keep a base there, making it possible for him to continue his reign of terror against his own people. Genocide, of protesters. Torture, burning people in oil.
THAT is who we support, while claiming we are opposed to 'dictators'. Just one or our decades long support of dictators.
Iraq was a spectacular failure. Al Queda IS ISIS. And do you know who created AQ in the first place?
If only they taught history in schools here, Americans would not be so susceptible to propaganda, they would know their own government's decades long associations with some of the recent world's worst thugs and torturers and dictators.
But maybe that is why they don't teach that history.
See South America, eg, another one of our allies, Pinochet, who was protected from prosecution when he was finally about to be brought to justice in his own country. Yes, the UK protected that particular criminal.
But I know, we are the 'good guys' and we only want to 'help create democracies all over the place'.
EX500rider
(10,839 posts)And just because we rent a air base near Afghanistan does not make Uzbekistan our ally. Plus no longer use the Uzbek base, we use Kyrgyzstan now. We have a base in Cuba, are they our ally too?
cali
(114,904 posts)KurtNYC
(14,549 posts)Who created ISIL ?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/qatar/11124714/Senior-Isil-commander-raised-1.25-million-from-Qatari-nationals-says-US-Treasury.html
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/09/16/1330029/-Saudis-Lobbied-John-McCain-Lindsey-Graham-to-sell-War
Sometimes the arsonist and the fireman know each other, other times they are one in the same.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)But a whole lot of people get to make a whole lot of money, and all the old Colonialists get to keep on being Colonialists, controlling the resources of the old colonies, and feeling POWERFUL. But the people only get the bill.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)influence on whether or not we go to war than the American people.
And our other ally, Bahrain, now there is a bastion of Freedom! If only we had a news media that covered these Dictatorships and how they abuse their own people, it would be much more difficult to fool the people into thinking we have these great Arab Allies, who must be nice people!
The whole thing is disgusting.
We need investigate who helped these people become the big wig terrorists they are today and NO, the answer is not Assad
Bragi
(7,650 posts)Is the idea here that the MSM ought not report events? If not, what do we expect of them?
How do they report "non-sensationally" on a terrorist group with a significant military capacity, and a billion dollar budget, that is taking over large swaths of the ME, creating hundreds of thousands refugees, and engaging in mass killings, while they openly threaten attacks in western countries?
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)yes, the MSM is deflective and reporting only what it wants to report to avoid blame on America, to gin up war fever to substitute for the pointed finger of history.
I would have them report, not cheerlead and sow fear to make the cheerleading plausible.
War fever covers up all kinds of blemishes.
Bragi
(7,650 posts)There has been reporting of violent attacks in Iraq by Sunnis and Shia, but it isn't high on the US news agenda when Americans aren't directly involved. That's hardly new.
Nor is it new that MSM are prone to banging the war drums whenever the Pentagon and the MIC give the signal.
I'm just reacting to some of the comments I've read here about the MSM somehow "sensationalizing" the recent stories about ISIS and possible domestic threats.
I don't see that. For example, the beheading in Oklahoma is being underplayed by most MSM media, far as I can tell. The MSM seems to be going out of its way not to hype the story, and are playing down the (apparent) religious motivation for the attack, and being quite careful in their overall reporting.
Anyway, sometimes I find people on this board find fault with the MSM when I just don't see it. I'm less concerned about media sensationalism than I am about media self-censorship so as to not rile people up.
TwilightGardener
(46,416 posts)that ISIS was calling for, whether or not this guy was responding to it. It was religiously motivated, he was radicalized, and living among us (same as Maj. Hasan at Ft. Hood), and why this isn't a bigger deal in the media is probably because no one wants retaliation against Muslims.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)has played the terror angle is interesting.
Sopkoviak
(357 posts)I LOL'd.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Sometimes our Dictator friends get ideas of their own, see Saddam and Noriega eg. So while we pay them lots of money to keep their own people under control, brutally if necessary, we have to keep them under control in case they decide that their resources are not ours, see Saddam again.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Some good points, Fred Sanders. I am not sure we should even be assisting. Then again, I don't know what bombing ever solves.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)lol
former9thward
(31,981 posts)The U.S. is doing the vast majority of the air strikes and is doing the majority of the killing in the war. Arabs are not leading. A very few of them are following in the coalition of the unwilling.