Please grade Barack Obama's performance as president

[DemocratSinceBirth]

119 votes, 4 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	A
	42 (35%)
	B
	22 (18%)
	C
	27 (23%)
	D
	16 (13%)
	E
	3 (3%)
	F
	9 (8%)
	4 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[DemocratSinceBirth]

1. I gave him a B

The nation is in much better shape than where he found it. However , rightly or wrongly, he deserves some of the blame for not getting the credit he deserves for the improvement.

[madokie]

4. I don't think he deserves any blame for anything

He's worked his ass off for me, overall

I'd damn sure vote for him again if I was given a chance.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

6. We are going to get our asses handed to us in the midterms

It's unfathomable to me that this could occur with the stock market up, the GDP up, disposable income up, and unemployment down. The president has to accept some responsibility for allowing a political environment to exist where these achievements are ignored.

[RKP5637]

8. The successes are not capitalized on. n/t

[DemocratSinceBirth]

11. That's why I gave him a B/NT

[RKP5637]

12. Same here. n/t

[madokie]

14. Says you

and the republiCON press. Plus a few others here but I don't believe a word of it.
He's been damned if he does and damned when he doesn't and if you can't see that thats not my or his problem, Maybe some new glasses would help. Not me or him but for you.

I just don't buy into all the doom and gloom, its all the black mans fault for getting elected, not just once by twice and with a pretty good margin both times, sorry
and if you don't think skin color has anything to do with it I'm sorry yet again.
Peace,
don't intend to ruffle any feathers this morning just laying out how I feel about all this

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. What do I and the Republican press say?

That we are going to get our asses handed to us in the midterms?

If this comes to pass, the president as the head of the party bears some responsibility. He bears some responsibility for allowing a political environment to develop where his achievements are ignored and his failures or flaws, real or imaginable, are discussed ad nauseum and ad infinitum.

If I wake up on November 5th and our losses in the House and Senate are minimal and we still control the Senate I will increase his grade from B to A.

[madokie]

23. how can he do what you think he should be able to?

What you all are saying is we're going to get our asses handed to us in November. I thought that was pretty clear. I say that is the word of the pukes and some of the so called half assed Democrats and not much more.

He's been pounding the pavement for 5 plus years but the press isn't reporting on any of that. What hilltop and what type of a speaker is it going to take to get his message out if the press and a bunch of supposed democratic party members don't say anything except how we're going to get our asses handed to us in November. bullshit i say. Thats all I heard before the last election too, Thats what I was hearing to begin with, how he can't possibly win and on and on. Sorry I don't buy into the right wing bullshit of its the President fault. Watch this mornings muppet shows and tell me that a single one is even trying to help get his message out. I won't watch and I'll be surprised if you can come back here after a while and tell me yes Madokie there was one or two or any at all. I'm saying right now there won't be. prove me wrong and I'll start paying some attention, otherwise I'll continue on my path of calling bullshit bullshit

[DemocratSinceBirth]

25. Whether or not we get our asses handed to us in the mid terms isn't a matter of opinion.

We will know on November 5th if this prediction comes to pass or not.

I have said, three or four times , that the country is in much better shape than when he found it. For that I give him an A but I can not in good conscience give him an A overall when there is an impression in the country we are going to Hell in a handbasket. He has to accept some responsibility for not getting out the good news. He has the biggest bullhorn in town.

[madokie]

30. And I keep telling you there is no one turning on that biggest bullhorn, its silent

he's been using it day in and day out but the Press isn't passing it on. What the hell does he have to do? He's trying but getting no and I mean NO help from anyone other than a few people like me calling bullshit bullshit when we hear it. I don't have a press box to get in and if I did you can bet what I'd be using my time for but I don't.

Our Press is in the pockets of big business ie the Puke party so what avenue does the president have? You and I. I've refused to cater to the we're going to get our asses handed to us bullshit and more of the Democratic voters need to be doing the same rather than keep repeating the line.... My fingers are getting tired. They do that when they realize no one is listening to the sound they make, sorry. I'll pass
have a good day, see you in the next thread

[BlancheSplanchnik]

73. I completely agree with you. we are as propagandized as Germany was

During the rise and reign of Hitler. Information the pukes don't want circulated is attacked, hidden, perverted, forgotten.

[madokie]

76. thank you

How Democratic voters can't see this for what it is baffles me. I just don't get ti

[DemocratSinceBirth]

87. The difference was the govt was controlling the message.

We are letting the media control us. POTUS needs to wrest the message.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

92. I wish he could. Cable news was given legal right to lie to the public.

Biggest networks are owned by Nazi profiteers (kochs), a right wing Australian corporate tyrant and a Saudi princ, conservative extremist bankers, mega-church leaders......

Thank dog for the internet, at least there's some way to move information. But it requires citizens have critical thinking abilities.

Without a mega conglomerate progressive mass media hub, I dont know what PBO can do. He's busier getting out and talking to people than anyone i can think of, but US Deceptive Media bashes, twists every word, ignores, cuts off, misquotes.

[tiredtoo]

143. hopefully you are wrong here.

I am looking at holding the senate and knocking out a couple of one term tea party govs.

[Major Hogwash]

174. President Obama has asked for our help a dozen million times.

So, if we lose, it's not his fault . . . it's ours!!!!

And you can take that to the bank!

[3rdwaydem]

2. A Plus! I wish he could run again.

[madokie]

3. He gets an A+ from me

sure he's done some things I wish he'd done differently but in the political climate he's had to play in I say he has been one excellent President.
GObama, you da man

[Caretha]

5. He sure looks swell!

I love his blue tie with the blue suit. His flag pin & "Presidential Watch" really complete the look!

[Autumn]

13. He looks very good.

I love the suit against the back ground of the oval office window. Very presidential.

[safeinOhio]

7. A for the Pres.

F for congress. works out to a C for the country.

[RKP5637]

9. Yep, therein lies the root cause of most of the problems in this country! n/t

[marym625]

21. Just add my name to your posts

[RKP5637]

47. Ditto for your posts too, add my name! There are millions and millions of people

in the US like us. I've talked with some people and they are so frustrated. In some places R=D=I. We need a catalyst, somewhat like FDR was, to galvanize the nation into action. One bizarre thing I see in the US is many people vote those into office that are the least interested in working for them as effective leaders.

What I also often see are far too many politicians just work to prop up the existing system than working to improve it for all. Often, "we the people" have no voice, for example, as in congress.

[marym625]

50. exactly

We are no longer citizens but slaves to a corpocracy.

And thanks!

[rogerashton]

10. B+

Points off for not understanding bargaining. You don't start off the bargaining process by offering to give up the store.

[marym625]

15. k&r for exposure

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. I used to get criticized because people felt my options represented an agenda

Now I just use the grades we used to get in school.

[marym625]

20. Well that's ridiculous

And even if you had an agenda, so what?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

32. I think my system used to consist of

I think my system used to consist of:

Outstanding
Excellent
Very Good
Good
Average
Failing

Some posters said my choices were tilted to the positive.

[marym625]

37. seems reasonable to me

I guess you could have added a "below average" but it was your poll.

Some people have to criticize. Probably would have said you were wrong for not having a "maybe" if you had "yes" and "no."

Hopefully, they won't find anything wrong with the current post.

[marym625]

105. Looks like you caught

some shit anyway.

Sometimes people seem to think we're here actually creating law or writing reference books. As awesome as this site is and as wonderfully talented and intelligent as so many are, it's still social media.

[DerekG]

16. C -- Like Clinton and Carter before him, a mere caretaker

Nothing extraordinarily awful (well, apart from civil liberties), but nothing inspiring either.

However, future historians may be less kind to him. If Climate Change proves to be as disastrous as predicted, Obama will surely be excoriated for failing in a time of severe moral crisis. He'll be a Neville Chamberlain.

[marble falls]

24. Clinton was no "caretaker". He led.

[Art_from_Ark]

40. Carter gave us probably the most visionary energy policy ever

and then Reagan trashed it as soon as he got the chance.

[orpupilofnature57]

53. Carters plan would of had the deficet paid off by 1990, but People

went the funny money route .

[Scootaloo]

153. Abd more or less the same foreign policy as ever

Imagine the sort of messes that could have been averted if Carter hadn't...

- signed on to Operation Cyclone, arming and funding Afghan "rebels" with intent to overthrow the Tariki government in Afghanistan (sound familiar?)

- began the US buddy-buddy relationship with Saddam Hussein, a direct cause of Iraq's invasion of Iran and later Kuwait.

- provided backing of Iran's deposed "emperor" and treated the revolution against that despot as an assault on the US itself.

President Carter is responsible for at least some of the mess in the middle east and west Asia today, and is a very influential figure i nthe history of US interventionism in the region.

But yeah, would be nice if his energy policies had stuck through.

[Art_from_Ark]

168. Carter got bad advice on Afghanistan

from his national security advisor, who wouldn't know Kabul from Kinshasa and was ingrained with the Cold War mindset.

He also got bad advice from Henry Kissinger about admitting the deposed Shah into the US.

And basically he was forced to make overtures to Saddam, because of the oil shocks of the '70s and the threat of the spread of the Iranian Revolution, which was a pretty nasty business.

However, he departed from his predecessors in his focus on human rights in his foreign policy, which won him acclaim in Latin America and elsewhere. His successor, on the other hand, never met a brutal right-wing dictator he didn't like.

And Carter's efforts led to a peace treaty being signed between Egypt and Israel, efforts for which Carter won (deservedly) a belated Nobel Peace Prize.

[Scootaloo]

169. Unfortunately...

The Israel-Egypt peace treaty contained parts that essentially cemented authocratic rule by despots in egypt, and ended up with the current situation of the united States funding the oppression of the Palestinian people. I don't suppose carter deserves blame for that - both instances of 'aid" were supposed to be one-time deals when the treaty was finalized, and the reagan administration termed htem into long-ter,m MIC laundering exercises.

But you know, I'm afraid i can't buy the "bad advice" argument. Is Carter a mart guy? I think he is. He was the president, and able to say no; after all these were his people, appointees to the executive branch that he was the boss of. And Carter was as mired in the cold war mentality as any other americna politician at the time. i have no doubt that he actually thought overthrowing a oviet-friendly government in Afghanistan was a great idea. I also imagine he has buyer's remorse on that subject.

None of our leaders are saints. Not even the ones from our party.

[Art_from_Ark]

170. And none of our leaders know everything about everything

As Will Rogers noted, "Everyone is ignorant, only on different subjects." That is why presidents have advisors. Sometimes those advisors give bad advice.

Carter was not a die-hard cold warrior like Reagan or the early Nixon. He realized, for example, the folly of the Vietnam War, which is why he granted amnesty to all draft dodgers, something that really irked the hard-liners. His SALT II negotiations with Leonid Brezhnev also riled the hard-liners, and the treaty was signed but never ratified.

[Scootaloo]

171. "Overthrowing a government via armed religious nutjobs" seems a universally bad idea

If Carter didn't know that then I have to say he really didn't deserve to be in charge of a country. I wouldn't put Sealand into the hands of a man who couldn't figure that one out.

[Major Hogwash]

172. James Earl Carter, Jr served in the nuclear submarine program in the United States Navy!

Right after they were first invented!!!!!!!!!!!!

Though he had long dreamed of attending the U.S. Naval Academy in Annapolis, Carter had to wait for a sponsorship to match the cost. Meanwhile he enrolled at Georgia Southwestern College in nearby Americus. After taking additional mathematics courses at Georgia Tech, he was finally admitted to the Naval Academy in 1943. With his short, slim stature, Carter barely met the minimum physical requirements for entry. He was a good student but was seen as reserved and quiet, in contrast with the academy's aggressive hazing culture. While at the academy he fell for Ruth's friend Rosalynn Smith, whom he would marry shortly after graduation in 1946. Carter graduated 59th out of 820 midshipmen, by his own recollection. From 1946 to 1953, Carter and Rosalynn lived temporarily in Virginia, Hawaii, Connecticut, and California, as he served deployments in the Atlantic and Pacific fleets.[6] Promoted to a full lieutenant, he completed qualification for command of a diesel-electric submarine. He applied for the US Navy's fledgling nuclear submarine program run by then Captain Hyman G. Rickover, which he began in late 1952. Rickover's demands on his men and machines were legendary, and Carter later said that, next to his parents, Rickover had the greatest influence on him.

On December 12, 1952, an accident with the experimental NRX reactor at Atomic Energy of Canada's Chalk River Laboratories caused a partial meltdown. The resulting explosion caused millions of liters of radioactive water to flood the reactor building's basement, and the reactor's core was no longer usable. Carter was ordered to Chalk River, joining other American and Canadian service personnel. He was the officer in charge of the U.S. team assisting in the shutdown of the Chalk River Nuclear Reactor. The painstaking process required each team member, including Carter, to don protective gear, and be lowered individually into the reactor to disassemble it for minutes at a time. During and after his presidency, Carter indicated that his experience at Chalk River shaped his views on nuclear power and nuclear weapons, including his decision not to pursue completion of the neutron bomb.

Link ---
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Carter#Naval_career

Any man that can disassemble a nuclear reactor is okay in my book.
He was the officer in charge!!!

But, maybe I'm wrong.
I mean, Bush couldn't even pronounce the word "nuclear"!!

My, how things change.

[Art_from_Ark]

173. The neutron bomb

Designed to kill people, but leave buildings intact. Carter shelved it, but Reagan took it down, dusted it off and waved it like a red cape in front of Brezhnev.

[Hippo_Tron]

221. All true, but he also gave back the Panama Canal and worked with the Sandinistas

He also didn't respond to the hostage crisis by carpet bombing the country, like most others probably would've done.

Carter's record wasn't perfect, but he was the last President to do some really decent things in the realm of foreign policy.

[ozone_man]

225. I would liken Obama to Clinton, but not Carter.

Carter really was different, too moral to be president really. He was just an engineer, not a politician like Clinton. Can you imagine that he put solar panels on the White House and Reagan took them down?

Carter gets a B+/A- in my book. Clinton and Obama C.

[lamp_shade]

17. A

[flamingdem]

127. +1

woot!

we're going to miss him

[B Calm]

22. I would have gave him an A, but his globalist free trade crap is a loser!

[madokie]

26. i keep reading about this globalist free trade crap

but I've yet to hear him say anything about it. Mind you I don't pay any attention to the so called main stream news so I might be missing something but I do pay attention to this place and a few others devoted to the democratic cause and all I keep seeing is how this and that and its all coming from others and not from him. Fill me in on this global free trade crap coming from the presidents mouth or desk. I'd like to see what evil he has in store for us too. If you get my drift

[cali]

41. why here.

He's pushed it and praised it repeatedly. And the following is just about the TPP.

I want to welcome, once again, all the leaders gathered around this table and their trade ministers to Hawaii. Here in Hawaii, the United States wants to send a clear message: We are a Pacific nation and we are deeply committee to shaping the future security and prosperity of the Trans-Pacific region, the fastest-growing region in the world.

I’m very pleased to be here with my partners with whom we’re pursing a very ambitious new trade agreement, the Trans-Pacific Partnership. I want to thank my fellow leaders from Australia, New Zealand, Malaysia, Brunei, Singapore, Vietnam, Chile and Peru.

We just had an excellent meeting, and I’m very pleased to announce that our nine nations have reached the broad outlines of an agreement. There are still plenty of details to work out, but we are confident that we can do so. So we've directed our teams to finalize this agreement in the coming year. It is an ambitious goal, but we are optimistic that we can get it done.

The TPP will boost our economies, lowering barriers to trade and investment, increasing exports, and creating more jobs for our people, which is my number-one priority. Along with our trade agreements with South Korea, Panama and Colombia, the TPP will also help achieve my goal of doubling U.S. exports, which support millions of American jobs.

<snip>

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/11/12/remarks-president-meeting-trans-pacific-partnership

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/20/us-usa-trade-tpp-idUSKBN0EV2KE20140620

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140429/14333827067/obama-complains-that-tpp-critics-are-conspiracy-theorists-who-lack-knowledge-about-negotiations.shtml


http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/obama-trade-promotion-authority-97073.html

[philosslayer]

27. I think that in 100 years

Historians will rank President Obama within the top 3 Presidents of all time. On par with FDR and Lincoln (who are in my opinion the top two).

[JoePhilly]

36. I'm not sure about top 3, but ...

... I agree he'll be up there near the top.

[cali]

28. Anyone giving him an A is so partisan as not to be able to actually

look at his record with any degree of objectivity- and the same goes for anyone giving him a flunking mark.

I'd give him a C+, and that's actually quite a good grade. I'm taking into consideration the context of his inheriting a clusterfuck in Iraq and Afghanistan and another clusterfuck when it comes to economy, not to mention the craziest republican house in history since 2010.

[ibegurpard]

29. I gave him a C

A "B" or "D" is debatable. An A or F is just ridiculous.

[Quackers]

31. I love your post!

[JoePhilly]

33. Disrespecting other DU members, nice.

[morningfog]

57. You would never NEVER do such a thing. LOLOLOLOL

[DemocratSinceBirth]

35. I gave him a B and a poster took umbrage

B seems to be the mode

[Peacetrain]

38. I am giving him an A and I will be glad to tell you why

With the mess that was handed him.. what he had to do to keep us from completely falling apart was immense. You have to work with the hand your dealt, not the one we all wish could have been a starting point..

[woo me with science]

51. Continuing and aggressively expanding Bush policies that directly assault the Constitution

and the very foundations of democracy deserves an F.

That said, I think it's absurd to rate any presidency on an A to F scale.

[YoungDemCA]

114. The Constitution is not some infallible static document with divinely-inspired authority

And the "very foundations of democracy" as we understand them today have a lot of sources from outside the Constitution.

[woo me with science]

116. Yes!!!11!1!

Because that's EXACTLY what I said!!!!1!1!

Goddamn outdated piece of paper!

[hughee99]

147. The constitution is a living document that can change meaning depending on the party in power.

That's how I think a lot of people look at it anyway.

[bigwillq]

59. I don't think it's an A but, if others do, that's fine by me.

It's a poll and a post on a message board. Nothing to take that seriously.

[Number23]

94. For real. Funny how somefolks are simply never happy just having an opinion without declaring it THE

definitive opinion that eeeeeverybody else needs to have as well.

[Marr]

181. Yeah, I know-- like this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5596752

Are you for real?

[Number23]

182. Thanks for giving me yet another example to send to the admins about your idiotic stalking

As well as proving that you are on this site for no reason than to harass people. It doesn't surprise me in the LEAST that you would conflate someone proclaiming that everybody who votes one way is a troll or an ass kisser and someone else using the RESULTS of a poll to analyze what a group of people think.

All you do every time you chase me around this web site is IRREFUTABLY prove why I have demanded that you stop responding to me (what is it now? A dozen fucking times I've asked you to leave me alone? Is it MORE than a dozen now that I have asked you to dig down reeeeal deep and find some semblance of self control and do something so simple, so easy) and leave me alone.

[Marr]

184. Oh, god-- this line again?

I'm going to tell you this one final time-- do try to process it.

You are posting on a public message board. People will respond to your posts. That is not "stalking". And you can manage your own ignore list, thank you. I don't ignore other posters.

But please-- cite the last reply I made to one of your posts here. I expect it's been months since I responded to one your posts. Frankly, I rarely see you contribute anything more than a bit of rock throwing while hiding behind another poster-- as you did above. That's not exactly something I often feel compelled to respond to. But please, prove that I'm stalking you, and that you aren't simply trying to pull this incredibly lame "I'll get you banned" threat on yet another poster.

[Number23]

185. Only people with desperate social issues REPEATEDLY harass and respond to people who have REPEATEDLY

demanded that they stop. You may use the "it's a public board" bullshit as your cover but you are transparent and creepy as all fucking hell. You are so much like the leering letch at the end of the bar that won't leave the female patrons alone because "it's a public place" completely oblivious to the fact that because it IS a public place, they have the right to ask you to stop bothering them and only someone with terrible issues would REPEATEDLY ignore that request.

It doesn't matter if it's been YEARS since you last responded to me because I have made it crystal clear that your abusive, nonsensical, pointless idiocy -- which is EXACTLY what you have exhibited in this thread -- is not something I am even the slightest bit interested and I NEVER WILL BE. I have asked you at least TEN TIMES to stop responding to me and LEAVE ME ALONE and the admins have seen them all. And all of this has been just since 2013 so your "it's been soooo long since I last responded to you" bullshit is every bit as stupid and irrelevant as it sounds.

Is there a statute of limitations on doing the right fucking thing, Marr? I AM NOT INTERESTED IN YOUR OPINION. I find you toxic, mortifying ignorant, beyond boring, and mildly frightening in your stubborn insistence that you will KEEP harassing me no matter how many times I ask you not to. I am requesting YET AGAIN that you STOP RESPONDING TO ME.

Stop it. NOW

[Marr]

186. So you admit your accusation was BS.

An adult would now apologize.

Also, you can manage your own ignore list. I'm not doing it for you-- and I will respond to any post I like.

[Number23]

187. You are beyond ill. There is no other word for it

There is nothing in ANYTHING that I've typed that a sane and healthy person would conclude is me saying that my accusation was bullshit. Which is exactly why that appears to be why you reached the conclusion that you did.

You need help. But more immediately, you need to LEAVE ME ALONE. If I never have anything of "importance" to say then WHY DO I HAVE TO KEEP BEGGING YOU to Leave ME ALONE? So quick to jump into some shit with me YET AGAIN you didn't even notice the post you were responding to was damn near TWO WEEKS OLD.

[Marr]

188. Again, I will respond to any post I like.

Your attempts at bullying are not going to make me give you a free pass to post bullshit by putting you on ignore. Put me on ignore if I bother you that much.

[Number23]

189. You are the one who refuses to leave ME alone. How the hell is that ME bullying YOU??!

A DOZEN times you've been asked for well over a year and yet -- I am still asking. And somehow, that gets twisted in your already beyond twisted mind as ME bullying YOU. I could not be more happy that there is hopefully a .000005% chance that our paths will ever cross in real life. You are about as scary as they come.

You are coming through loud and clear and highlighting BEAUTIFULLY exactly why I have absolutely no interest in your opinion and even LESS interest in you as a person. Take the hint, take a hike and LEAVE ME ALONE. Maybe if you posted something other than personal attacks and stupid assed insults as if anyone gives the first damn about your opinion, someone here would actually be interested in engaging with you.

[Marr]

190. Oh, I think it's obvious to anyone reading this.

I've seen you do the same thing to a couple of other posters. You make all sorts of claims that the person is "stalking" you, and suggest that you're going to get them banned, as you did here in your opening salvo about my giving you 'more info to send to the admins' about me. All while making constant personal insults, directly and indirectly implying that they're creepy, crazy, etc.-- as above.

[Number23]

191. In my 6.5 years on this site, there have been four of you that I've asked to put me on ignore

One stopped IMMEDIATELY at the first request. The other eventually stopped, one pops up every now and again. And then there's you.

If you think for one second that ANY of this makes you look good, happy or sane you are even more deluded than everyone reading this thread could ever think.

[Marr]

192. Well, congratulations-- I guess your bullying worked once or twice.

As for myself, again-- I will respond to any post I like, and kindly invite you to manage your own ignore list.

[Number23]

193. Leaving someone alone when they've identified you as toxic, abusive person that they want nothing

to do with is not relenting to bullying. It is merely doing the sane, decent and RIGHT thing. Not that I am in any way surprised that this simple truth escapes you, but he fact that you cannot see the difference is EXACTLY why I am demanding YET AGAIN that you find some way to find some self control and LEAVE ME ALONE.

If the admins do ban you, like other bullies and unwell people, you'll blame everyone under the damned sun for what happened except for the ONE person who actually had any control over the situation and could have done something about it -- YOURSELF.

[Marr]

194. Why don't you just put me on ignore?

Seriously-- why is it so important for you to make others put you on ignore?

And no, I feel no obligation to just passively sit by while you're insulting other posters, just because you've "identified me as toxic", and called me a few dozen names.

You do realize that you are the bully here, right?

[Number23]

195. Because you are the one incapable of NOT responding to me. Time and again you see my name,

you MUST respond. YOUR lack of self-control, of decency and honesty are the issues here. Your attempts to twist my requests for you to stop harassing me as "bullying" on my part is one of a long line of bizarre and incoherent posts that are indicative of a seriously maladjusted person that I have made it ABUNDANTLY clear that I want nothing to do with.

This subthread is a classic example. From my first post to you until now, the answer has been the same. LEAVE ME ALONE. And yet, you just can't fucking help yourself. Can you? You just HAVE to keep at it, no matter how deranged you are making yourself look. How utterly without self control. Guys like you always get sooo pissed when everyone calls them "creepy" because they know that it's the damned truth.

Keep at it. Keep going. Everyone in this forum knows that you just CANNOT help yourself. And the old "why don't you put me on ignore even though I'm the one who is always responding to YOU even though you have told me a dozen times to fuck off" is just the extra touch of crazy that you needed to really get it all out there.

[Marr]

202. Um, we're both responding to *each other* here.

So again, why do you refuse to just put me on ignore?

It's incredible to me that you are actually trying to play the victim, when your posts are filled with nothing but personal attacks and projection. Seriously, look at the post you just made. Read that over and tell me which of us seems unbalanced.

You know... now that I think of it, you've responded to several of my posts in recent months. But you always do it indirectly, by cheering someone with whom I'm having an exchange, giving them an 'attaboy' and some variety of, 'isn't that poster an asshole'. That's your prerogative, of course-- but it does sort of undermine your demands to be put on ignore. I might be able to find those posts if you like.

[Number23]

209. My only response to you is the same every time -- LEAVE ME ALONE

That's it. Nothing more.

Love the new tactic of "you actually do respond to my posts just INDIRECTLY." Jesus Christ. LEAVE ME ALONE. You get more absurd with every new post. This is your stupidest yet. I learned about a year ago you added nothing to this web site and haven't paid you any attention since. That's the truth of the matter.

I mentioned downthread that judging by the PMs I've gotten that the only good thing that's come out of this thread is that sooooo many other people see you for the loon that you are. But I just checked the poll results and that's not entirely true. Since you accosted me YET AGAIN about an extra 20 people have responded to the poll putting the president's level at support at now 87%. Putting you even more squarely in the unhinged minority which I have NO DOUBT is a major contributing factor to why you keep chasing me and other supporters around DU with your bullshit.

You're just sad. As all hell. And I'm realizing you're not scary, just exceedingly pathetic.

[Marr]

212. It isn't a "tactic", it's the truth.

Here are a couple I found in about 2 minutes, but there are others:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4593959

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4771877

You want to be free from all criticism, apparently, while calling names, making personal attacks, and standing behind other posters and throwing rocks. Doesn't work like that, sorry. I'll respond to any post I please. Put me on ignore or grow up or just pull your hair out, I don't care which.

[Number23]

216. Comment was in response to being attacked by another poster

Exceedingly pathetic. Yep. And you are WAY too fucking interested in me.

And what's funny is that even in that thread, you are ONCE AGAIN RESPONDING TO ME!!! Oh my GOD!!! And I ignored you as I have done soooooo many other times, even when you're high fiving a post of mine as if I give two shits about your opinion.

Find someone else to do your "I will NOT be ignored, Dan!" impression on. You are way too interested in me. The feelings are NOT RECIPROCATED.

[Marr]

217. Projection. /nt

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

196. I can't even believe the nerve....

Well...yes, I can!

------

On Thu Oct 9, 2014, 11:18 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

You are beyond ill. There is no other word for it
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5646346

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Lots of personal insults here and accusations of stalking that are not being backed up.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Fri Oct 10, 2014, 12:06 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: calm down, deep breath......

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[Number23]

197. Oh, I can believe it. And from what I've seen of the jury results that have been sent to me

every time this person comes after me (which he has repeatedly done and SHOCKINGLY, a series of alerts on my posts always seem to soon follow) just about everyone here not only sees what he is but are shocked that someone would not only keep coming after someone who has asked them repeatedly to leave them alone, but then has the unmitigated gall to alert on the posts where they are reminded of that fact.

[Marr]

203. Excuse me?

What are you accusing me of now?

And for the last time, if you want to be left alone, either stay in your bog, or don't insult people. I don't care for your childish insults, whether they're directed at me or others, and I may choose to respond to them. Get used to it or go away, but stop crying about it.

[Number23]

207. I'm accusing you of being exactly what you are. The only good thing that's come of this is that

everyone sees it judging by the jury results and PMs I've gotten.

And here's a hint, when you are able to post anything here except harassing bullshit, personal attacks and insults as if anyone gives the first damn what you think about them or anything else, then you can worry your manic little head about what I'm doing and posting. Until that miraculous day happens, you will continue to be seen for exactly what you are which is an entitled and oh so special individual who thinks that someone appointed you Hall Monitor, has the gall to try to tell other people WHERE they should be posting and WHAT they should be posting as if anyone GIVES THE FIRST SHIT ABOUT YOUR OPINION and sees nothing wrong with your truly psychotic behavior. Self awareness -- BUY SOME.

Until then, for the umpteenth time, leave me alone, put me on ignore or just stop responding to me. Since this is the only response you have gotten from me over the last year and are ever GOING to get from me, your insistence on responding to me even when I'm responding TO OTHER PEOPLE truly shows the depths of... whatever the hell is going on with you.

[Marr]

208. Count the insults this little subthread.

Review the tone. Who is making personal attacks, again? All I've done is repeat my position that I will respond to any post I please, and that I will not be bullied into giving you a pass on your insults. If you cannot handle that, again, I invite you to either put me on ignore, stop insulting other posters, or withdraw to your bog.

[Number23]

210. And as I said, when you contribute something here other than personal attacks and stalking

then you can tell me and others WHERE, WHEN and WHAT we get to post.

Since we both know that's not going to happen anytime soon and that insults and stalking are the best you have EVER been able to come up with here -- LEAVE ME ALONE.

[Marr]

214. Again, I'll respond to any post I please.

You just cannot refrain from responding to me, can you?

[Number23]

218. "You just cannot refrain from responding to me, can you?"

HOLY SHIT.

And with that, this stupid, deranged and completely PURPOSELESS subthread has come full circle. The poster who repeatedly and openly REFUSES to leave me alone despite being told a dozen times to take a hike is accusing ME of bullying and now has reached the absolutely psychotic "conclusion" that I am the one who cannot refrain from responding to HIM.

Oh this shit is being bookmarked for the next time you just simply HAVE to fucking respond to me and the next time someone talks about how the devolution of discourse here and the harassment faced by certain posters has turned this place into a shit hole. I could have called you a maniac a hundred times and nothing, and I mean NOTHING, could have illustrated that truth better than your own damned posts in this subthread.

Thanks for doing my work for me and for ending this conversation on such an illustrative note. Because whether you choose to acknowledge it or not (and history has proven that you almost certainly WON'T) this conversation is over and you could not have lost it in more ways or more spectacularly.

Edit: Oh, and I love the edit you made. Folks should make sure to click that edit button to see your lame "Testing" reply that was your first response. Like I said, this person lost it in every conceivable way and is clearly not bright enough to realize that. Utterly pathetic.

[Marr]

219. You just keep telling yourself you look good here, Number23.

I think any impartial judge would see a reasonable enough (though perhaps a little repetitive) person asserting their right to simply post on a message board being badgered by someone who refuses to use ignore and cannot post more than a sentence or two without making a personal attack.

[Rex]

74. If he had a functioning Congress and SCOTUS, I would give him a B.

But an A for keeping us all out of WWIII with the Russians and running the country solo.

[adirondacker]

93. I think many are grading on a Bush curve.

C+ for Civil Liberties and not so much the constitution.

[Doctor_J]

104. Same here

C or C+. The party has been decimated during his terms, and so has the working class. He has not even attempted to implement the agenda he campaigned on in 2008. But his situation was really difficult.

[Capt. Obvious]

108. They only gave him an A because

A+++++ wasn't an option.

[flamingdem]

130. Partisan? Excuse me, the other Parti is full of traitors!

Or do you excuse them to build your narrative of partisan subjectivity?

[tiredtoo]

145. Thank you for clarifing this grading

i will now give him a c, c+ is not an option

[Puzzledtraveller]

158. This is a majority of the constituency anymore Cali.

[treestar]

176. Insulting DUers

for not agreeing with you and lacking substance.

[Marr]

180. +1

[dmosh42]

34. I knocked him down a peg for his 'no-accountibility' handling of financial crisis, but pluses for...

his having to deal with a mostly racist opposition in the House. -'B'

[woo me with science]

39. What is being done to this country, under this administration and the last,

Last edited Sun Sep 28, 2014, 11:34 AM - Edit history (1)

is not just another flavor of capitalism within an essentially functioning democratic government.

It's not.

As a former president of the United States put it, we don't have a functioning democracy anymore.

Secret laws, secret courts, "Kill Lists"/indefinite detention without due process, and mass surveillance in the United States of America are extreme violations of our Constitution and should not be considered "moderate" positions in any sense of the word. They are extreme, even fascistic policies, yet the politicians who espouse them are permitted by us to describe themselves as "moderates."

I think we need to start using the words, "corporatist," "extreme," and even "fascist" to describe what is happening in this country under the corporatist/neoconservative/neoliberal/Third Way agenda. We are witnessing a malignant merger of state and corporations and the active dismantling of important Constitutional protections. The corporate state is pouring our tax dollars into propaganda and marketing for their agenda, and IMO the vast majority of Americans, while aware of their own economic pain, have little understanding of the peril facing our democratic institutions and basic Constitutional protections.

We use words that suggest the current neoliberal and neocon policies are business as usual in America...just another flavor of policies that Americans can trust still fall safely within the boundaries of a democratic, constitutional, representative political system. They are "centrist" or "moderate." But they really aren't...and I think we need to adjust our labels to drive home the seriousness of the crisis we face.

We are witnessing an ongoing process of merger of state and corporation (one definition of fascism) that is truly frightening. The very foundations of our democratic system are being actively dismantled by the corporate politicians you defend.

We have lost much of the Bill of Rights. There is a secret, unaccountable government operating alongside the one we are taught about at school, and it has the power of mass surveillance and dossiers on citizens, secret laws and secret courts, the power to smear and lie and disinform, to suppress protest and political dissent, and to indefinitely imprison and even murder American citizens without transparency and without due process.

Our intelligence and security agencies have been co-opted and are being used to surveil peaceful domestic protest and to engage in corporate espionage. Our purchased government actors are using every means possible - the courts, "trade" agreements, legislation, executive actions - to restructure and rig the system to pass power to corporations that used to belong to the people of this nation.

Journalism has been hobbled through intimidation/abuse of espionage laws and by active consolidation and purchase by corporate entities that parrot the party lines....and our precious internet is being handed over to those same corporations as we speak. Whistleblowers and potential government whistleblowers are under unprecedented surveillance and assault. Our police departments have been militarized, and peaceful protests federally surveilled *in cooperation* with Wall Street and brutally suppressed.

Legislation coming out of our corrupt, purchased government bears no resemblance whatsoever to the popular will and hasn't for a long time. And the wealth of ordinary Americans is being looted, and our commons are being looted, to fill the pockets of the billionaires, bankers, and corporations who are building this new corporatocracy hurtling into fascism.

We hear a lot of lies and propaganda and Newspeak, most likely funded through our own tax dollars. We are told that our system is functioning, that we need only vote harder next time. We are told that the politicians perpetrating these assaults on our nation are "centrists" or "moderates," with the safe, warm connotations of those words. How could anything "moderate" or in the "center" be dangerous? But these are extreme, even fascistic policies, and it is time we called them out for what they are.

They are assaults on democracy itself in the service of corporations. This is the result of the corporate money that floods Washington. They are assaults on our Constitution. They are assaults on every one of us.

And it needs to stop now.

The record shows aggressive, proactive pursuit of a corporate agenda.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3202395

CUT THE CRAP! Your Month in Review from the most "progressive" administration ever.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025006297

Just a Republican thing, huh? Assaulting the Constitution itself
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5554112

Study: Obama's "Trade" Deal (TPP) Would Mean a Pay Cut for 90% of U.S. Workers
http://citizen.typepad.com/eyesontrade/2013/09/the-verdict-is-in-the-trans-pacific-partnership-tpp-a-sweeping-free-trade-deal-under-negotiation-with-11-pacific-rim-coun.html

Obama’s Latest Betrayal of America and Americans in Favor of the Big Banks: TISA
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/06/26/1309671/--Obama-s-Latest-Betrayal-of-America-and-Americans-in-Favor-of-the-Big-Banks-TISA-by-Bill-Black

Bombing Syria: The next step in the PNAC playbook, remember?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025520459

The "Justice" Department
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025587151
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025586874

You want facts?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1842895

When the DLC connections to the Koch Bros. became well known, they just rebranded the infiltration
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4165556

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5535960

[OilemFirchen]

55. Ha!

Moved your vote from "F" to "Pass". Embarrassed? Is that possible?

[woo me with science]

58. No-I don't consider sustained assaults on the Constitution and the foundations of democratic govt.

I don't consider sustained assaults on the Constitution and the foundations of democratic government to be a "failure." "Failure" implies that another outcome was desired. We are seeing the *deliberate* results of corporate purchase of our government. This is why corporate money floods Washington, our elections, and our media.

It's actually a very successful continuation of a corporate, antidemocratic agenda that is moving this country into oligarchy and even fascism.

The scale here is absurd.

[OilemFirchen]

60. That's an "A" then, right?

But wait... the country is still standing. You're still posting on the Internet, despite the Stasi watching your every move. You're likely not a political prisoner, stowed away in a stainless-steel boxcar. Maybe a B?

What to do, what to do? So many choices...

[woo me with science]

62. "You're still posting on the internet."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025423091#post14
Someone tried that sad line of argument on another thread...The results were quite embarrassing for the attempt. I recommend that everyone read all replies to Response #1 to share in the appreciation of how absurd and offensive this line of argument really is.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025378446
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025378446#post1

Time to post again the 14 defining characteristics of fascism.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025423091#post14

[OilemFirchen]

69. Your argument is facile, at best.

I'm reminded that all my friends from childhood are convinced that the FBI has a file on them, thanks to participation in anti-war rallies. They don't. And even if they did, it is and was irrelevant - none of them went to jail, none of them were denied employment, all of them lived their lives unfettered by the burden of the all-seeing, all-knowing surveillance apparatus. Even the most vociferous, the most obvious. The SDS members. The Panthers. Even during the Nixon, Ford, Reagan and Bush administrations - those most likely to have used such info for nefarious purposes.

BTW, this is a theoretical "police state". It includes, for your enjoyment, an actual dead person:



Ask your dad.

[woo me with science]

86. Well, there's a facile argument around here somewhere...

Last edited Sun Sep 28, 2014, 09:08 PM - Edit history (13)

I trust people to figure out which one it is.

(And to the alerters: No, this post is not about Obama himself, but about the entire diseased, bipartisan, corporate money-corrupted system of which he is a part, and that the poster above denies is orchestrating suppression of dissent).

All these indignant denials that we're in trouble take the same form:

We're not being burned alive in ovens, or we're still typing on the internet, or we aren't being lined up in the streets and shot (well, that one's starting to get debatable, isn't it...).

As though the corporate owners of the United States of America, who rely on its reputation as the beacon of freedom and democracy in the world, can't find more effective and less politically damaging means to make sure dissent never materializes into anything seriously threatening to the PTB.

Psst. Our president has a "Kill List." And indefinite detention. And a surveillance state. And an entire secret government, secret laws and secret courts, operating alongside the one we are taught about in school. And all it takes to become part of that is for someone to invoke the word, "terrorism" and relate it to you.

"But that's a high bar!" all the sensible woodchucks will protest. "I TRUST my president! And it's only for TERRORISTS!"

Really? And do you trust the next one?

Actually, we're all being spied on. And "terrorism" is being invoked as a weapon against political dissent.

Report Details How Counter Terrorism Apparatus Was Used to Monitor Occupy Movement Nationwide
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12527647

Whoop, There It Is... 'Evidence Homeland Security Coordinated Occupy Crackdown' -
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002462465

ACLU discovers FBI is labeling peace activists as 'potential terrorists'
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4500788

And the most sinister aspect of all of this is the fact that the language of terrorism and espionage is being actively expanded to include whatever citizens or groups the corporatists consider to be irritants: political enemies, protesters, even journalists.

Protestors against Energy Company charged with terrorism
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024175848

Mission Creep: When Everything is Terrorism
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023279560

US Uses Espionage Act To Convict Manning Using Words Added In 1990: "with a computer"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023375845

Fed Court: Just changed interpretation of Espionage Act to cover leaks that are NOT Harmful To USA
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023365713

NY Times: White House Uses Espionage Act to Silence Employees, Press
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101616764

Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023080388

If you are a One Percenter trying to effectively use the government you have purchased to manage unpleasant press about what you are doing, what do you do? Well, one tactic might be to try to get the government into the business of deciding who is a journalist. That way you can claim to establish "protections" for whistleblowers, when what you are actually doing is creating categories through which you can exclude from protection those you don't want to protect.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023708417
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976955
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976082
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976955

Yeah, journalism isn't doing too well in this country. One might say it is being murdered. There's a reason it's supposed to be protected by the First Amendment. That reason is not compatible with increasingly totalitarian corporate control.

Petition Calls On Obama Stop Intimidation Of Journalists And Whistleblowers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025509395

Why Is President Obama Keeping a Journalist in Prison in Yemen
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023300531

James Clapper Calls Journalists "Criminal Accomplices" -
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017174990

Reporters without Borders: 'Security interests threaten press freedom'
http://www.democraticunderground.com/11333723

US Plummets In Press Freedom Rankings
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024487392

Obama's escalating war on Freedom of the Press
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023314296

Risen Case: War on Journalism coming to a head
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101699216

Government Surveillance Is Crippling Press Freedoms, Report Shows
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023902153

So....you shut up the journalists.

And you shut up the protesters.

Who else do you need to shut up?

Ah....all the people who work for the government, many of whom can be assumed to still have consciences and thus be potentially dangerous to the corporate coup of democracy. How do you handle them?

Well, you can fire them. See, it's *useful* for the government of an ostensibly free nation to have highly visible groups like the ones you mention...Black Panthers, etc....and not to deny them employment or do anything serious to them. It gives the illusion of freedom. But look what we learned of just this week, about how firings happen at the Fed:

The Secret Goldman Sachs Tapes
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025587384

But you can also wage legal war against their power to function as whistleblowers. And you assault the unions that protect them.

The Obama administration/DOJ war on whistleblowers, federal unions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5586389

You can institute draconian snitch rules to intimidate those who might be thinking about whistleblowing:

President's 'rat out your co-worker' plan unlikely to work, experts say
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023214675

And you claim the right to spy on them even at home.

You let the dissent flourish, as long as it's safe dissent. But you take care of the stuff that has the potential to be truly threatening. Most importantly, you make a vicious example of those who carry through with revealing corruption:

Daniel Ellsburg: Snowden would not get a fair trial today, was right to flee US
http://www.democraticunderground.com/11784497
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023198130

Bradley Manning: top US legal scholars voice outrage at torture
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x871563

That includes those who whistleblow on financial institutions, not just the government. Since you're not prosecuting the banking criminals, you have plenty of time to send up a guy who tried to identify them:

Bradley Birkenfeld, UBS Whistleblower, Finds Himself in Federal Prison
http://www.cnbc.com//id/41257962

It's a delicate line to walk, all this intimidation while still claiming to be the beacon of freedom for the world. But the intimidation is necessary, because people are starting to catch on.

No, nobody has sent the jackboots to line up the protesters in front of everyone and methodically kill them. But we're seeing the next best thing.

Militarizing the hell out of the police departments. That way it's blamed on some "programs"....but it sends a clear psychological message to the upstarts.

Stopping police militarization: Once again, the solution requires confronting corporate politicians.
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/10025416709

Federal grants drive the militarization of police departments in America.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025383806

And then you get this:


And this:


Three of the five Occupy violence pics I used to use regularly now I cannot find anywhere on the internet; if I could, I'd put them here, too. The elderly woman tear-gassed, the mobs of jackbooted storm troopers surrounding a few people on a blanket...

And, meanwhile, out in the community, the militarized police are starting to terrorize ordinary citizens, mostly the impoverished and voiceless ones. But the corporate-controlled federal government keeps sending the hardware and the storm trooper uniforms, even encouraging it with grants, and they refuse to keep records on how many citizens have been murdered. How many were there this week?

"What I've Learned from Two Years Collecting Data on Police Killings...
...I'm convinced to my core: The lack of such a database is intentional."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025429276

Twenty-Three People Killed by American Police in the Span of One Week
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025593137

We're all suspects, potential terrorists now. and the mechanisms are in place to ensure that any dissent that begins to bubble up can be handled and eliminated before it materializes in any serious way.

The truth is that you don't know what dissent may have already been cut off at the root, because of the elaborate, secret, unaccountable system that has been put into place. We know that the president has sought the power to lie in response to Freedom of Information requests. We know that data collected from NSA spying has been used to imprison Americans using false evidence trails. We know that the CIA can spy on the Senate Intelligence Committee with impunity and nothing is done about it, and that Clapper can lie to Congress and the Department of Justice can lie to the Supreme Court about spying and nothing is done. These are just the things we know.

DEA Manuals Show Feds Use NSA Spy Data, Train Cops to Construct False Chains of Evidence
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4507611

Obama Admin Seeks Permission TO LIE In Response To Freedom of Information Requests - Even To The COURTS
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2185303

DOJ lied to Supreme Court about domestic surveillance
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140514/06214727229/doj-still-trying-to-hide-fact-it-flat-out-lied-to-supreme-court-about-domestic-surveillance.shtml

The sensible woodchucks keep telling us that someone has to be actively involved in VERY SERIOUS TERRORISM against the United States of America in order for our government to start throwing *that* word around, or showing an interest in us. But we are all surveilled, and the methods for it keep expanding. If you think about it, it's GOOD for corporate control to have people posting dissent on the internet. It helps you know whom to watch. Voiced dissent is USEFUL as long as it doesn't lead to anything...you know, serious. Our corporate government is keeping an eye on us.

OKC protestors slapped with terrorism charges
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024175848

A Nation of "Suspects"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x5011487
http://www.truth-out.org/nation-suspects/1314810046

American Protesters Declared Enemy for Weapons Testing Purposes; Rules of Engagement
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2132808#2139011

DoD Training Manual: Protests are "Low-Level Terrorism"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/100227662

Ridiculous FBI list: You might be a domestic terrorist if...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1790765

Doctors asked to identify potential terrorists under government plans
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1261120&mesg_id=1261120

Do You Like Online Privacy? You May Be a Terrorist
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002257966

Top US counterterrorism official: drone critics are Al Qaeda enablers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002279862

"Arrogant complaining about airport security is one indicator Transportation Security Administration officers consider when looking for possible criminals and terrorists"
http://www.cnn.com/2011/TRAVEL/04/15/tsa.screeners.complain/

N.S.A. Examines Social Networks of U.S. Citizens (Decision Made In Secret, in 2010)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014605329

Now, you tell me.

Why would the corporatists who have purchased into our government and rely on its reputation as the beacon of freedom and democracy for the world, use such heavy-handed and politically damaging tactics as shutting down the internet or ostentatiously lining up protesters to shoot them in the streets, when they have already put into place and legalized this elegant system to control dissent?

Yeah, I'm typing on the internet. That PROVES we're free.

[marym625]

100. Bravo!

I would like to add that back in the day, though activists were certainly watched, some more than others, it was only the leaders of the time that were targets.

Not to get into conspiracy theories but look at who were killed, jailed, tried and tied.

[questionseverything]

141. excellent post

should be an op

[navarth]

154. well done. nt

[marym625]

97. I just read through your part of this thread

The post I am replying to and everything below. I have just one question.

Will you marry me? I don't care what sex you are, what your age is or what you look like.

[PeteSelman]

101. Dead on.

I'm afraid it's way too late to do anything about it and it's only going to get worse. This country is done.

[Puzzledtraveller]

157. You do us a service Woo, thanks again.

I have real concerns about the future of this country, my children's future. And to say that a republican president would have been worse therefore we should be happy is absurd, he was our best hope, at least he had me and my family believing this and nothing has changed. Hell, he even flipped on his stance on marriage equality only when it became politically expedient to do so. Many things are credited to him that took him NO effort to do and so much that has not been done, been swept under the rug or even mad worse is not attributed to him. Why? Because people's ego are so powerful that they resist ever having to think they were wrong? Much less admit it? Or is it, I have to love him because the R's hate him?

[Rex]

42. I give him an A for being forced to go it alone.

Running the entire country by yourself, has to be hard.

[BeyondGeography]

43. A for effort, B for results equals B+

Obama had the best intentions and has put his heart and soul into making the right possible things happen. He overcompensated on bipartisanship in the first two years of his term, not fully understanding imo just how nihilistic his opponents are. I think he has played close to error-free ball since on that front and delivered a better America in the process.

If you think that's a crock, go out there, beat the Republicans nationally twice and raise Mitt Romney's taxes (plus everyone else making 400K plus a year), because that's what he did, not to mention saving our auto industry, enacting fair pay, LGBT rights, defending voting rights against a non-stop assault and an underrated environmental (when you're getting twice the gas mileage in ten years, thank Obama) record. He is a brave and good man. He is also practical.

[LittleBlue]

44. D+

D for disappointment. F has to be reserved for the Chimperor himself. I'll steal Le Taz Hot's excellent post for my reasoning:

It's "the pony left," it's because he's Black, it's the right wing, it's everything except the fact that he represents the 1%. His policies reek of it. The Banksters were let off scott free, he's pushing a SECRET TPP deal, he loves fracking, he's PROSECUTED whistleblowers instead of protecting them, he's prosecuted more people for pot than Bush ever thought of, he's marched us into a war with Syria for no other reason than for oil, he's good with ANWAR, he loves the XL pipeline, . . . every time, EVERY TIME he's had a chance to stand up for the poor and middle class he runs to the right. And the "geniuses" on this board have all determined that it's because the Left wants a pony. Either the stupid is strong with them or they're gravely delusional. Personally, I don't care which it is but it ends up hurting the entire nation. And now we're going to do it all over again with Hillary.

I'm a leftist and I'll vote for lefties when and where I can and calls for party unity will go unheard -- as the left has gone unheard by the current incarnation of the "Democratic" Party.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5591121

[woo me with science]

54. That was a stellar post.

[Autumn]

61. I think that was the best post I have seen in years

Le Taz nailed it down with that post.

[sunnystarr]

72. So just 1 degree of separation from Bush!?!?!

You and those who agree with you make me realize that perhaps this place just isn't for me anymore. Totally. Unreal.

[LittleBlue]

75. Only if you assume Bush barely flunked

A D grade can be 65%. A C can be 70%. An F can be 0%

[Number23]

99. The only thing funnier than that post is the Amen Choir that followed. And apparently continues to

The fact that so many black, brown, poor and middle class people support this president would lead that poster to the conclusion that maybe, juuuuuust maybe, s/he is 100% wrong about a lot of stuff. But no, it just means that all of us are stupid.

[WillyT]

139. + 1,000,000,000 What You Said !!!

[tech3149]

45. I would like to think my mediocre rating is not a condemnation

just a pragmatic view of the realities of the world we live in.
I never saw him as being the great progressive hope of the nation.
My first questioning of his ideals and interest was when he ran against Nancy Skinner. He was the penultimate politician, never addressing the cause of the issues at hand but presenting some non-offensive mediation of the effects, so long as it didn't harm the financial industry.
During the primaries an article published reviewing his books showed a strong bias toward the free market capitalist system without regard to the harm it can cause.
When he was elected it was clear by his appointments that the working man was screwed. He might talk a good game and to some degree might even believe it but actions speak louder than words so long as you are willing to listen.

[yeoman6987]

46. I have him a C mainly because he squandered the huge

Opportunity he had with 7 months of super majority Senate and could have gotten a minimum wage increase and equal pay passed easily. Total waste of a super majority getting one item passed.

[jeff47]

118. No, he really couldn't.

While it was nominally a super-majority, it included senators like Lieberman and Ben Nelson. Who would would have been thrilled to join the Republican filibuster on those issues - they would have been invited on the Sunday shows to talk about how independent they were.

Obama didn't have 60 Ted Kennedys.

[yeoman6987]

119. That just pisses me off

Everyday we hear how Ronald Reagan ruined this country while having a Democratic House the entire time and a Democratic Senate most of the time. Something is wrong when a Republican President can get more done with opposition party then a same party president having a same super majority. What absolute crap!!

[jeff47]

122. Well, Democrats actually believe in government

As a result, they think it's important to actually accomplish things.

Republicans believe in the Randian fantasy that "Government is always the problem". So it really doesn't matter to them that nothing gets done.

When one side insists on accomplishing things, and the other are insane nihilists, you're going to get an unequal outcome.

[yeoman6987]

132. Your post makes no sense

Democratic Party believes in accomplishing things? When the have a Republican President? That is basically what you are saying.

[jeff47]

136. Democrats believe government can do good things

even with a Republican president.

Republicans believe government can never do good things.

So Democrats will take a "deal" in order to accomplish some of their goals.

Republican's goals are to accomplish nothing. So no deal required.

[yeoman6987]

137. After a good nights sleep,

I read the latest reply and that makes complete sense and accurate. Clearly I was tired reading previous replies you made to me! Have a great day and thank you for being patient with me last night.

[Art_from_Ark]

135. Reagan had a Democratic Senate for only 2 years,

but he did have an (ostensibly) Democratic House that contained such "boll weevils" as Tommy Robinson of Arkansas who tipped the scales in favor of the Republicans.

[davidpdx]

164. So true

I frankly am sick of the Bluedogs on both sides of Congress. The CD I am in has a Bluedog who I have voted for consistently in both the primary and general since I registered there (I was in a different CD before that). In the primary I decided to not vote for him (which made no difference since he was the incumbent with no serious opposition). I'm fighting over myself whether to do the same for the general. The chance of getting a progressive elected to that seat is slim to none. If I was in another CD it would be an easier choice.

[karynnj]

138. He did not have 7 months. He had 4 months

Franken was sworn in on July 7th, the Senate recess started on August 7 - and Kenendy died on August 25th. The Senate returned on September 7th.

However, they needed to change the process in MA to let the governor name an interim Senator because the law was that it would be filled by special election. It took time to pass that change and it was September 24th before Kirk was named and he became Senator the next day.

The Senate then was in session until Christmas Eve, when they passed ACA -- and was then out of session until mid January - when Brown won the election.

So, in total - 1 month (July) plus 3 months (September - December) --- which equals 4 months.

During that time, not just the ACA bill was passed. There were a few bills that addressed jobs and stimulated the economy.

It is not clear that all 60 Senators would have voted for a federal minimum wage increase (not to mention had they done so - you would say it should have been higher.) or equal pay.

[yeoman6987]

140. Your probably right about the 60

I guess I am just going to hope we can do well in November and start seeing results in 2015.

[MohRokTah]

48. Best president of my entire life

I was born in the Spring of 1963.

[davidpdx]

165. It would have been an interesting time to be alive

I am a bit younger (8 years). I have to wonder what life would have been like if Kennedy had not been shot and had won a second term to retire as POTUS.

[JEB]

49. Corporate. eom

[woo me with science]

52. Which more and more equals ANTI-democratic.

Last edited Sun Sep 28, 2014, 11:50 AM - Edit history (1)

E.g., assaults on multiple amendments of the Constitution, support of "trade" agreements that cede powers that should belong to the people, to corporations.

[JEB]

56. I used to say that Republican is interchangeable with money grubbing, corporate sellout,

but more and more the same can be said for Democratic agenda.

[woo me with science]

66. The business party.

[orpupilofnature57]

67. It's become a political society with no aisle, they all refer to us as them .

[BillZBubb]

63. Obama rates a solid C

There are external factors that have limited his successes, but there are also his own missteps.

One additional point: their isn't one republican president since Eisenhower who would get this high of a grade.

[orpupilofnature57]

68. Agreed, Shrub would get expelled .

[MannyGoldstein]

64. The President we all hoped for, dreamed of

Do you have any idea of how much money we've made?

A sold "A" from us!

The TPP will just be the icing on a huge and delicious cake.

Regards,

0.01% Manny

[orpupilofnature57]

65. C,,, I mean on your comedic comment .

[MannyGoldstein]

70. No question that it sucked as comedy

As tragedy, however...

[orpupilofnature57]

71. You got it!!!!! Warren/2016

[William769]

77. I was going to give him a B but then I changed it to a A just to piss off the haters to see another

One in the A column.

[freshwest]

79. Poll does not include my favorite category, President for Life or Until Kingdom Come!

Last edited Sun Sep 28, 2014, 06:21 PM - Edit history (1)

A bitter disappointment, and I feel betrayed. So I gave him an 'A.'

[William769]

83. ...

[sheshe2]

102. Oh what the hell, They hate us anyway freshwest~

Soooooooooooooooo~

*****BOG POST!!!!!***** I gave him an A as well!

[demwing]

223. funny, I did the opposite

I was going to give him a B, then changed it to a C. I can do that because it's just a DU poll (and means NADA), but also because it's a slow night and I'm trollin'.

[Prophet 451]

78. I give him a B

He could have done a little more (such as really pushing for Medicare-for-all) but what he has achieved, especially given the Congress of hell-no, is pretty impressive.

[XemaSab]

80. C: too much time spent shining the shoes of his kkkorporate masters

For example, one thing that he should have done that would have made a HUGE difference in the lives of black people, white people, Latino people--ERRYBODY--is full legalization of weed.

The tide's going in that direction, and the War on Drugs has destroyed enough families already.

Does Obama want to be the last president to see people thrown in prison for 20 years for weed?

Doesn't seem to bother him too much.

[ucrdem]

81. A+ and a DU rec.

Gotta love the easy ones.

[Nye Bevan]

85. What if he had closed Guantanamo, got single payer health care, and ended all the wars?

A++++++?

[ucrdem]

88. In that alternative universe

I'd give Congress a passing grade too I guess. They're the ones who make the laws. Obama has issued his share of signing statements, and gotten the usual overblown criticism from all sides, but there's only so much he can do within the limits of the law. Bush and Cheney didn't worry about laws so they got lots of horrific stuff accomplished but the Obama administration has this tedious habit of following them.

[flamingdem]

126. This poll is a nice surprise

Time to GOTV once again

[polichick]

82. For corporations/Wall Street/1% or for "the people?"

[BlueStater]

84. I'd probably give him a B+.

The fact that he's not only letting Bush and the rest of the assholes in his administration get away with their horrendous crimes but also continuing some of his policies prevents him from deserving an "A" in my eyes.

[flvegan]

89. I've been very critical of Obama. I still give him a B.

Has he been great? No. He's done a number of good things that would never have happened under McCain/Romney. He's also failed and disappointed on many levels.

That said, I can't possibly penalize him with a lower grade, consider the do-nothing shit-for-brains congress he has seated alongside him. A bigger set of clownshoes would be impressive if assembled.

[LiberalElite]

90. Is the "E" for Effort? nt

[tritsofme]

91. Given the cards he was dealt, he has performed miracles.

I give an A.

Perhaps Hillary could have had some more success at the margins, but perhaps not.

History will be kind to this man.

[Number23]

95. 210 votes in. 63% of respondents give the president marks well beyond passing (B and up)

Combined with the 22% that gave him a C, 85% of DU thinks the president is doing well. Which is actually higher than his approval ratings among Democrats as a whole.

And yet, this forum is filled day after day after day with the shrillest screams from the same loud handful about what a crypto-fascist sell out Republican he is. Something just truly AIN'T adding up around here.

[Trajan]

115. Shrill screams?

Last edited Tue Sep 30, 2014, 09:16 AM - Edit history (1)

Those are from A 's and the F's ....

[Number23]

117. The A's are saying he's a crypto fascist Republican?

I will never understand why people respond to posts without bothering to read them first.

[flamingdem]

124. I'm glad to know the silent majority of DU gives Obama an A

You'd never know it indeed!

[Number23]

125. Exactly. May explain why a certain contingent seems so "energized" today

[G_j]

96. the negative outcomes of our latest war actions in the ME

will overshadow most everythying else over time. Get ready for an even a deeper and darker quagmire.

[revmclaren]

98. A solid B....

Room for improvement but with the cards he has been dealt, he has done a great job.

[Brigid]

103. I think I will pass on assigning a grade.

I don't really want to do that when Obama is doing a job I would't do for any amount of love or money.

[hedgehog]

106. I don't think grading him A-F captures the situation -

he needs something more like a record of home runs with an asterisk explaining that he was dealing with opposition teams that stretched the rules (Republicans and DINOS in Congress) plus a biased ump (Supreme Court).

[lamp_shade]

107. Definitely an A+ for performance.

[TBF]

109. B-

Really hate Arne Duncan and Eric Holder.

As far as performance how am I supposed to grade thst? He is the administrator for the 1% and MIC and has been quite good in that role. Sigh.

Extra points for being decent to women and other minorities. That is what distinguishes him from other capitalists who I'd give far lower grades to.

[Erose999]

110. D. He's done nothing at all to address income inequality. He's done nothing to protect our privacy

from NSA data mining, no-knock warrants, etc etc. He's made it his business to punish whistleblowers. Nad now we're in a 3rd Middle East war when the other two haven't even stopped. He wasted the first two years of a Democratic supermajority doing fuck-all and the past 6 years trying to negotiate with the Tea Bag Taliban in Congress.

Granted, we'd be even more fucked with Shitt RMoney or Poot Greengooch or Frothy Rick. So there's that, I guess.

[dilby]

111. I am voting a C, did not do anything special but did not completely F it up either.

Hopefully I can maybe up him to a B at the end of his last term but with the war in Syria I have a feeling it's going to be leaning towards a D.

[hrmjustin]

112. i think a B is fair.

[YoungDemCA]

113. Solid B, maybe B+

Obviously far, far from perfect or ideal...but then again, who is?

In the context of the craziness that is 21st century America-and the wider world-I honestly don't see very many would have been any better than him, or even as solid a President as Obama has been. Not many at all.

[brooklynite]

120. Interesting - the "neocon sellout" brigade seems to be out of town...

[Number23]

131. No, they're here. But on the sidelines where they belong

[freshwest]

146. They're diversifying their portfolio here. But I'll go with the future, instead:

I'm glad to see how the poll numbers worked out.

[ozone_man]

121. A solid C.

Continuing the PNAC warmongering plan of his predecessors. Weak leadership on the environment. Has not taken on the corruption of Wall Street and the FED. What we needed was an FDR. Maybe times have to get worse before they get better, as they did during the Great Depression.

[flamingdem]

123. Obamacare saved my finances

I'll always be grateful, GRATEFUL to Obama for putting so much on the line for that, and for so many other things.

It's criminal that we were never allowed to see what he could have done without the Jihadi Republicans constantly stabbing at him. In spite of that he's accomplished a lot. I'll miss him.

[Barack_America]

128. B-

[Romulox]

129. Bank bailouts, mandatory insurance, dragnet spying, forever wars... you tell me. nt

[La Lioness Priyanka]

133. A minus or B plus.

[liberal_at_heart]

134. Our country is going bankrupt thanks to the 1% and Obama is doing nothing to stop it and

DU gives him a A? Wow. That says a lot about how little people care that the 1% own everything. How many people have to live in poverty for him to get a B?

[Donald Ian Rankin]

142. DDH.

That's the acronym Cambridge University uses for "Deemed to have deserved honours"; awarded when - to pick an entirely non-random example - a student has peritonitis caused by a botched laparoscopy for an ovarian cyst poking a hole in her bladder when she should be sitting her final exams, and hence can't be given a graded degree, but they have strong evidence that she'd have done quite well if she had been able to sit it.

I think that Obama's achievements have been, frankly, mediocre at best, but given the congress he's had to work with even mediocre achievements are good going.

[NCTraveler]

144. C

And if I was leaning toward either side of C, I would be leaning more toward a B.

[Number23]

148. 322 votes now. 63% still give him exceptional marks. Looks like DU has spoken. CLEARLY

And to be honest, given the nasty, demeaning hateful crap that's thrown at him here, I am very surprised by the results and beyond glad to realize that the folks doing all of the tossing represent the tiniest minority.

Probably why they are so vocal, persistent and annoying.

[BillZBubb]

149. You think getting only 63% high marks on a Democratic site is something to crow about?

I would say its very unremarkable and certainly underwhelming.

[Number23]

150. 85% give him a passing grade. 63% of that 85% (the vast majority) give him VERY high marks

So yeah, definitely something to crow about despite your adorable attempt to prove otherwise.

[BillZBubb]

159. Whatever.

On a solidly Democratic site, I would expect to see nothing less than a B for a successful Democratic president. That 37% feel President Obama falls short of that is noteworthy. I would bet Bill Clinton's marks at this point in his presidency would have been almost all A's.

[amandabeech]

162. NAFTA, failured to do anything constructive about derivatives,

but hadn't done MFN for China (I think) and hadn't signed the repeal of Glass Stegall. Had Bob Rubin at Treasury with Summers and Geithner.

Some of us were thoroughly disgusted with the Reps for the impeachment nonsense, but were nonetheless pretty unhappy with Bill Clinton for giving them the ammo that they would surely use against him and which would lessen the chances of another Dem replacing him.

Some of us would NOT have given him an "A".

IMHO, the last president who deserved an "A" was Franklin Roosevelt. In my book, Kennedy gets an incomplete, very unfortunately.

[Number23]

163. This is Democratic Underground and this forum is General Discussion. Are you familiar with them?

Because if you were, there is no way in God's green earth you would be saying Clinton's presidency would garner him "all A's here" considering the endless vitriol tossed at Bill Clinton or his wife DAILY.

85, sorry make that 86% of DU considers the president to be doing fine which is higher than his poll numbers in the real world. Sorry that this appears to upset you so terribly.

[Number23]

179. Back to 85 now

[davidpdx]

166. Maybe so, but in retrospect there are a lot of things Clinton did that

came back to bite us in the ass. The repeal of Glass-Stegal, the freedom of religion law that the SCOTUS used to overturn birth control, DOMA, etc. I tend to think people would have been as hard on Clinton as they are on Obama.

[Scootaloo]

151. The job's too big and varied to condense into an overall grade.

[taught_me_patience]

152. C-

Economy - B
War - D
Social - B
Environment - C

[BillZBubb]

160. Hey, that GPA is a solid C!

The two B's overwhelm the D assuming equal weighting.

I do agree with your breakdown, however.

[Puzzledtraveller]

155. My family is struggling more it seems with each passing year.

I know he's not God, but he is the POTUS, and I thought we would see better days with him in office.

[KamaAina]

156. No pluses or minuses?

And what school on Earth gives an 'E'?!

That being said, B+. He just didn't do the extra-credit work (jailing a few banksters, for instance) to earn the A.

[Systematic Chaos]

206. They gave E's at some school in New Jersey in the late 50s or 60s.

My mother kept my older brothers' report cards, and they were born in 1951 and 1953. One school they attended for a couple of years included E.

I saw that years ago and thought it was strange, too.

[Stellar]

222. I remember those.

E = excellent
G = good
F = fair
U = unsatisfactory

Lawd, that takes me back.

[Jamaal510]

161. I give Obama an A, while the Republican Congresscritters get an F.

He has actually tried his damndest IMO to get things accomplished for ordinary people, but has had no help from the other side of the aisle. Despite this, he did get some things accomplished:
http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/
He doesn't deserve to be burdened with this do-nothing Congress, and we don't deserve to have our lives be jeopardized by them and a handful of rich tycoons.

[Sparhawk60]

167. I Give Him An A

I give him an A. He has done things Bush could only dream of. Expanded the use of torture, expanded the “Patriot Act”, increased NSA spying on normal Americans. Thanks to his leadership we are now blowing up more people, in more countries, than ever!!!

[Number23]

175. Friendly kick

Since the "he's a neo-Con, fascist" folks seem to be hitting the forum hard today.

Not that we don't understand why they scream so loud. It's hard to be heard when you're such a tiny, insignificant number.

[AleksS]

177. It's hard to grade him when he's just staring at me like that.

It's hard to grade him when he's just staring at me like that.

Just
.
.
.
Staring.

[tularetom]

178. On social issues I'd give him an "A"

On foreign policy a "C" and on economic policy a "D". It adds up to a B- or a C+. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and upgraded him to a B because I like him.

[Stardust]

183. This thread is a breath of fresh air (although I didn't read every response--didn't want to press my

luck!)

[Warren DeMontague]

198. B

Not an excellent performance, but a better than satisfactory one.

[AsahinaKimi]

199. I think he tried his best...

Republicans tried to block him every way they could. I would have liked to see him do more for the veterans but we have congress to thank for them blocking stuff. I gave him a B, and I am sure not all was his fault, but somethings he has done I didn't care fore, especially launching us back into a what seems like an endless war.. Other than that.. I think he has done some great things.

[a kennedy]

200. Solid B

and congratulations on that with the horrible, horrible congress he had to work "with".

[riqster]

201. I think a diving score would be more accurate.

Factors in degree of difficulty, y'know.

[Frank Cannon]

204. A, probably A+ given the enormous amount of crap he's had to deal with.

I don't appreciate his stands on the surveillance of citizens, the use of drones to take out "undesirables", or his endorsement of continuous and endless war, but I accept that those are MIC-mandated things that are here to stay regardless of who is in the White House. That is until the American people, like a bottomed-out alcoholic, finally gets tired of all of it and DEMANDS better.

[Xyzse]

205. Soooo... Do I grade him from the beginning of his presidency or the whole thing thus far?

I'd be giving him different grades if that were the case.

[Skittles]

215. that's what makes him a C for me

he is capable of being so much better

[star14]

211. I gave him a D

I was very happy with him and the changes, in the beginning. But I am not happy with the ISIS response, nor the Ebola response. It's just not working.

[roamer65]

213. C+

There is no grade on here I can give to Rethugs. They go beyond failing.

[Systematic Chaos]

220. This thread has managed to prove one thing:

Even DU, which is ostensibly a bastion of information for the left political wing of the US, and which is supposed to stand against right-wing corporate fascist policy and legislation, is chock-a-block full of low-information voters and people who just want to belong to a Cult of Personality.

Why, there must be at least 23 of them....

Thank ye gods for fellow members like woo me with science and Le Taz Hot among others, who can see through all the bullshit and refuse to drink the schizophrenic Kool-Aid this country is now awash in! Because otherwise, my disappointment with this place could not be greater.

[demwing]

224. Wow!

[Melynn]

226. A +

Considering the mess he inherited from Bush, he is doing wonderfully.

[agentS]

227. Big ball- C, C-. Small ball- A, A-

He got some big gains done like healthcare and the stimulus, but got slowed by obstructionists and hard to deal with politics.
On small ball, he's great. People don't realize it but the small victories help out. I thinking of SCHIP and the clean air changes. My sister's kids get healthcare and I don't die of asthma (when in the states).
Well I get my 'pony' with this president. Let's see who else can get their 'pony'.

[kimbutgar]

228. B because he didn't go after wall street and didn't realize soon enough the repugs were evil racists

President Obama has been an excellent leader and role model. I am proud and happy he isoyr President. He tries to see good in everyone and believes there is goodness in everybody. That is before the right wing became unhinged immediately after he was elected. No legislation had been passed and they started to blame him for the deficit he inherited. The bogus santelli bull shit media driven narrative was just the bait the MSM needed to tear him down. It was sick. We were supposed to respect the office of president in 2000 even though W's win was dubious. The hyposcisry is sickening. Sadly President Obama didn't realize it soon enough and was stream rolled by the media.

[DemocraticWing]

229. He gets a B.

On a scale of 1 to 100, I'd give him an 86. Just missed a B+, although he gets two years to prove me wrong one way or the other.

Positives: best gay rights President ever, Medicaid expansion, stimulus package, drawing down foreign deployments, Consumer Finance Protection Bureau
Negatives: domestic surveillance program, Guantanamo Bay prison, education policy

None of the positives were all good, and none of the negatives are as bad as his opponents make them out to be. Overall I don't think he was a particularly revolutionary President policy-wise, but that he made small steps towards larger goals that will be fruitful if followed up on in the future.

[ZombieHorde]

230. I don't know.

On some things he has been very exceptional, in my opinion, but the extreme violence is unacceptable for me. This isn't math; those things are not to be averaged, in my opinion.

Discussing individual policies is easier for my wee little brain.

[Number23]

231. kick

[steve2470]

232. kick nt