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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThink again: Brown, Wilson, and Ferguson.
Too many people are jumping to one side of this issue before the facts are in, and I suspect most of you are going to end up on the wrong side.
Namely, what are you going to do if the evidence shows that MB assaulted the cop first? Prints in the car? Pictures of serious facial injuries? Voice/video recordings?
If the pictures and prints support DW's story that Mike Brown assaulted the him while he was still in the car (presumably on the presumption that the convenience store clerk incident had just caught up with him) he cannot and should not be indicted. He would be correct under those circumstances to assume that whatever MB did after that, he constituted a serious threat, justifying deadly force.
It doesn't matter if he was shot in the back (as some "eyewitnesses" have incorrectly alleged), front, or side. Once someone has attempted to kill a peace officer, all bets are off.
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notrightatall
(410 posts)To drag it out at this late date would make it appear concocted.
PorridgeGun
(80 posts)I think the reason the PD and Union are keeping quiet and waiting is because they've got an ace in the hole. Maybe they're full of shit and just trying to forestall a complete collapse in public confidence (I'll gladly admit I'm wrong if they are) but people need to reckon with the possibility that the cop isn't just a dipshit racist loonie and acted within the bounds of reason.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)But I'm not holding my breath either.
notrightatall
(410 posts)notrightatall
(410 posts)
blm
(114,458 posts)You think they kept the 'police report' from Eric Holder?
pintobean
(18,101 posts)the feds have everything they have, and vice versa. There has to be police reports.
BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)You are obviously new to this game
First thing that happens in any questionable shooting of a Black person is to dig into that person's background for something...anything that disparages that person so that any bullshit excuse for shotting said person is accepted by the (White) masses.
It's happened so damn often, I think it's part of procedure. Google Dorismond in NYC and see how many folks wanted Giulani disbarred for digging into to his criminal records.
Nope...if they had the info, we would have saw it....Why do you think we saw the video tape from the store.
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)have not already been raised and discussed at some length here?
bravenak
(34,648 posts)I said it first.
What if none of your fake what ifs make any sense? We saw PHOTOS of the shooter standing near the body. No blood. No facial injuries visible. Did you forget we have google?
PorridgeGun
(80 posts)No joke: if its all a charade to put off the announcement of an injustice until they think the weather is less favourable for civil disobedience then they should be given all the more for their trouble. I just don't think so. I suspect if Wilson were really guilty they'd hang him out to dry and try to stop the bleeding with "isolated example of a bad apple" type talk.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)Then come back and discuss his injuries with me.
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)notrightatall
(410 posts)
BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)Google is your friend....go take a look at ANY highly questionable police shootings and pay attention to the sequence of events....Trotting out the victims background along with any info that might remotely justify the shooting is par for the course
BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)You are new to this aren't you???
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)reports to support what you just said might be the case? Of course you don't. You are ignoring everything known about the case and relying on fantasy what if bull shit!
bravenak
(34,648 posts)If all this fantasy evidence exists,why not release it?
And, wtf is this anyway?
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)So fucking tired of bullshit.
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)First, your "what ifs" are preposterous. We've already seen the alleged pictures of the severely wounded policeman. They were FAKES. The supposed Wilson defense put forth by "Josie" or whoever has been proven to be a FRAUD.
Second, if the cop wasn't in danger after a scuffle ended, he has no right to execute the person.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)then I got here:
And realized that with that patently incorrect statement, you telegraphed any response would be fruitless.
marym625
(17,997 posts)And, by the way, the statement that he was shot while his back was to Wilson is not refuted. The autopsy stated that the shot(s) in the arm could have come from behind.
Unbelievable post! All bets are off when out of harms way my ass! Guess the cops tasering an 8 year old were justified. Smdh.
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)Blue_Tires
(57,596 posts)Lot of low-post accounts saying outrageous bullshit this week...
I'd play if they actually had the brainpower to get some fresh material this time...
Admins need to get their asses in gear
PorridgeGun
(80 posts)Someone who attacks a police officer is demonstrating a level of desperation that requires action. Granted the ferguson PD might be completely full of shit, but if they're not, and MB did assume the cop was coming at him to apprehend him for the convenience shop thing and took the initiative, its hard to see how lethal force is not justified.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,985 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)all the "What ifs", this: ...
My educational and employment background tells me you do not know what you are talking about.
scarystuffyo
(733 posts)I think he means once someone surrenders then all bets are not off
He could have tried to strangle , punch , kill
BUT once the officer (any officer) has distance and a sidearm drawn if the person surrenders then the use of
lethal force stops
Demit
(11,238 posts)I mean everyone knows that's just shrewd police work. And suspects always 'take the initiative' and run towards a cop who is coming to apprehend him, instead of running away. By jingo, I believe you've uncovered what really happened, with your clever forensic reasoning!
Scuba
(53,475 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)Are you not equally guilty of "jumping to one side of this issue before the facts are in"? 
PorridgeGun
(80 posts)What I resent is the suggestion that anyone who wants to see all the evidence before making a judgement is a troll/racist/bigot etc. Wilson deserves to have his side considered too and if he's telling the truth he should have a great deal of evidence to black him up.
Solomon
(12,640 posts)If he has a defense let him present it at trial. What don't people get about that? Arresting Brown is not a judgment of guilt. He needs to justify what he did. That can only happen at a trial. Not by pretending what if.
merrily
(45,251 posts)While saying nothing at all, it implies that some evidence is out there that justifies shooting a kid. Maybe that posting style is why you've been called names-if you have.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)pintobean
(18,101 posts)
tkmorris
(11,138 posts)mr_liberal
(1,017 posts)I think it will probably be ruled a justified shooting because of the fight at the car AND because MB moved/charged at the cop when he was told to freeze.
I don't think its a justified shooting just because of the fight at the car, so if the officer had shot him while he was running away or after MB gave up with his hands up then I think it would be at least manslaughter and probably murder.
What I think happened is after the fight at the car (where MB shoved the cop back into the car, went for his guy, and punched him in the face), that MB ran and cop chased him and told him to freeze. I think MB stopped and turned around, and that should have ended it. But I think after that, for some crazy reason, he didnt remain still he moved at the cop and thats why the cop shot him.
I believe the report about there not being enough evidence for the grand jury charge the cop. I think thats because they have witnesses, fingerprints, wounds that are consistent with what I said above.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,985 posts)Give me a break. There is no world in which that kid deserved to be put down like an animal.
mr_liberal
(1,017 posts)the attacker went for your gun and then charges at you after told to freeze that its understandable what the cop did. Its what cops are taught to do.
It does seem like overkill when you think of MB just having stole some cigars, and that maybe a more restrained experienced cop would have handled it differently, but that wont be the question before the jury. The question is, is what the cop did legal? And I don't know what all the evidence is, but from what I know so far I can see a jury saying it was.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,985 posts)or other left-identifying things in their screen names are almost always trolls.
Hm.
pintobean
(18,101 posts)It was really funny when this guy did it in meta.
merrily
(45,251 posts)who use liberal as all or part of the screen name don't usually post anything like I would expect liberal to post. There's always an exception or two, so you have to go by the content of the post.
merrily
(45,251 posts)BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)that the whole stealing cigars thing has been open to a whole of of interpretation. Funny how you wnat us to give credence to the what-ifs of Officer Wilson but Mike Brown was stealing Cigars and he charged the officer.
Out of all the raw video and witness statements I have heard so far, no one says he charged the officer....quite a few said he had his hands up in the air and was shot for nothing
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)is there some new info about to be released and you came here to get the meme out ahead of it?
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)If I grab you and you pull away, even slapping my hand as you pull away ... would you classify that as a fight?
That IS the statement of the one eye witness that saw the initial interaction.
Now that contradicts the statements of ALL of the eye witnesses to the ENTIRE incident.
I disagree ... I think the GJ not having enough evidence to indict is because the Prosecutor ... the guy that refused to issue a charge ... tanked the presentation.
BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)Taitertots
(7,745 posts)There is never a situation where "all bets are off".
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)at least not when the incident occurs in broad day-light and witnessed by no less than 5 eye witnesses!
Taitertots
(7,745 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)But I agree.
As an aside, many years ago, I read a report comparing the psychological profiles of cops and crimes (controlling for IQ and mental illness diagnosis, I believe) ... I was amazed at how similar the profiles were.
dilby
(2,273 posts)the robbery. After all need to keep everything hush, hush to build a case. And if the peace officer is too much of a pussy to handle an unarmed man without shooting him with his hands in the air maybe he should find a new job.
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)assaulting a police officer doesn't justify execution. Especially if he was surrendering when so viciously murdered.
Egnever
(21,506 posts)The idea that deadly force is justified in anything other than extreme cases where the officer is under direct threat of losing his life or serious injury is just wrong headed. A suspect running away or even holding a weapon that is not pointed at the officer or in the case of a knife not within striking distance should never be shot ever.
A cop getting punched in the face does not excuse deadly force ever IMHO.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Ignore is a great feature when bullshit like this gets thrown out there.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"what are you going to do if the evidence shows that MB assaulted the cop first?"
Not being a jurist, a judge or an editorialist on a major paper, my idle speculation (like yours) is both irrelevant and benign. Hence, should it come to pass that the police officer acted in the manner you hope, I will do nothing... as will you.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Personally, I think Wilson could have handled Brown without shooting him a bunch of times, even if Brown was "charging" him (which I doubt).
If the reports of how many shots were fired and hit Brown are anywhere near accurate, Wilson fired wildly endangering people in the neighborhood. Shows how he felt about the folks that live there.
Does your user name indicate partiality toward gunz and the callousness that usually goes with them, or is it in reference to this Urban Dictionary entry (warning for those prudish) -- http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pump%20action%20porridge%20gun
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I suspect the latter.
panader0
(25,816 posts)
aikoaiko
(34,213 posts)the fatal shots.
An assault on the officer in the car may be mitigating, but thats not the same as justification.
AverageJoe90
(10,745 posts)
Dr. Strange
(26,058 posts)then I will criticize the cop mildly and will cease to view Brown as a victim.
Along the same lines, if I win $12,554,782,832 in the lottery tomorrow, I shall live extravagantly and ride pink unicorns to work.
I suspect neither of these will happen.
merrily
(45,251 posts)
spanone
(141,211 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)that would be my guess.
BronxBoy
(2,287 posts)spraying here and there, hither and fro or some other shit/
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)He was acquitted, wasn't he?
PorridgeGun
(80 posts)Reserving judgement pending the production of physical evidence is never a bad thing.
malokvale77
(4,879 posts)Is why you and the one person who recced this OP are still here.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Not hard to tell which side you are rooting for!
valerief
(53,235 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)as I doubt he/she will be around long.