If the following take part in the Democratic Primaries, whom would you vote for today?

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

This should be interesting...

45 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	Bernie Sanders
	31 (69%)
	Hillary Clinton
	3 (7%)
	Joe Biden
	1 (2%)
	Alan Grayson
	1 (2%)
	Howard Dean
	6 (13%)
	George Clooney
	0 (0%)
	Al Franken
	3 (7%)
	0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[VanillaRhapsody]

1. One is NOT a Democrat for sure...

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

4. Bernie is not a Democrat

He will be running as a Democrat, however, which is all I said.

[VanillaRhapsody]

5. nope you cannot say that.....you don't know...

wouldn't it effect how people vote if he doesn't?

And this woman will vote for whichever DEMOCRAT wins the Primary.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

7. Yes I can say that, Bernie has already intimated it.

[VanillaRhapsody]

11. He is considering it....he hasn't "intimated" anything....

you are not being an honest broker....

and ANY of those DEMOCRATS would be fine with me...

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

15. Alright! I'll google it for you!

http://onpolitics.usatoday.com/2014/10/23/bernie-sanders-to-caucus-with-gop-indie-senator-says-no-way/

[VanillaRhapsody]

16. "considering it"

is far removed from what you are saying here....

[Skidmore]

39. Caucusing with Dems is not the same thing

as running as one on a national ticket.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

51. Can we just stick to the Poll question.

This has gotten out of control.

[Skidmore]

60. Why? In most states, party affiliation must be declared to

participate in the primaries. Democrats run for the nomination of the Democratic Party. Unless Sanders wants to declare that he will become a member of the Democratic Party, he will run as an Independent. What is so hard about that? It is a fact.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

71. But the assumption built into the question is that Bernie is running as a Democrat!

[Skidmore]

72. Why should that be assumed.

Until Sanders says he is running for the nomination as a Democrat, then the question is pointless.

[Jim Lane]

79. For the same reason the same assumption is made about everyone else on the list.

The OP asks a hypothetical question. This caviling about Bernie Sanders says that maybe the hypothetical won't be accurate as to him.

Well, maybe Biden won't run. Maybe Franken won't. It's even possible that Clooney won't.

A poll confined to those who have definitely stated that they will seek the Democratic nomination in 2016 would be, shall we say, fairly uninteresting.

To me, it's notable that Sanders is the only one whose inclusion is attracting such disparagement. Perhaps the man has touched in a nerve in supporters of less progressive possibilities?

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

87. That's been occuring to me too. The grief I've taken for a simple fun poll!!!

[Enthusiast]

102. Why are they so worried?

Why are they trying to shut you up?

According to the poll, Bernie's support is at 67%. There is your answer.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

107. Hilarious Hillary Homers are scared shitless of Bernie Sanders.

Which makes me feel kind of happy.

[Skidmore]

88. I don't recall stating that I was supporting anyone

at all at this point. I just know that, for a candidate to get a nod in the caucuses in this state, a party affiliation needs to be established.

[Jim Lane]

100. Yes, in most states a party affiliation needs to be established, but so does a willingness to run.

I vaguely recall that, at one time, there was at least one state that would include on the ballot every candidate who, in the judgment of some state official, had been widely mentioned as a prospect, unless he or she affirmatively told the state "I'm not running, please de-list me."

I don't know if that's still true anywhere, but I know that it's not true in most states. Generally, no candidate will be listed unless he or she has asked to be listed. Currently, none of the people named in the OP's poll has even declared a candidacy. None has asked to be listed on the ballot for a Democratic primary or caucus.

Therefore, while you are correct that Sanders has not done what he would need to do to be on the ballot, my point is that no one else has, either.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

86. That is my RIGHT as the creator of the poll - you needn't respond to it.

Christ, I put up a scenario for a question and everyone want's to change the scenario on me. Well create your own damn poll!

[Enthusiast]

101. Ever feel like you are being double teamed?

For a guy that has not announced that he will be running as a Democrat I would say 67% of the support is pretty fabulous.

DU Democrats love Bernie because he represents us, he doesn't represent those that wish us harm. You know who they are and so does Bernie.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

106. Sometimes this place seems more like F/R...

[MADem]

77. Jumping Jim Jeffords,Republican-turned-Independent out of VT (also), caucused with the Dems as well.

As does Angus King, indy outta Maine.

Caucusing doesn't make a person a Democrat. It just makes them more amenable to our side than the GOP one.

[LWolf]

10. For the purposes of the poll,

Sanders was included in "Democratic primaries." The OP can certainly say that, and did. The key word you seem to have missed : "IF."

[VanillaRhapsody]

14. why?

He isn't one....so this poll is severely FLAWWED.

I would find it much more enlightening to find out who on DU will vote for him if he DOESN'T

[LWolf]

19. Anyone can speculate about anything at any time.

That's not a flaw.

Anyone can start any kind of a poll on DU as well. That's not a flaw.

The '14 midterms are over. It's a natural time for speculation about the '16 primaries to begin. And Sanders has certainly expressed a specific interest in challenging HRC for the nomination. That can only occur through the Democratic primary process.

[VanillaRhapsody]

20. so WILL YOU vote for him if he doesn't?

[LWolf]

27. How would I?

If he's not on my ballot, I can't vote for him.

Being a Democrat, my primary ballot will only include those running as a Democrat.

Obviously.

And this poll IS about primaries. Did you read that far?

[VanillaRhapsody]

30. Okay...you just proved WHY he doesn't belong on the poll...

thanks for proving my point!

[cascadiance]

54. No, if you only have facts established TODAY, this poll would be empty with no options...

... as no one TODAY is running! THIS IS SPECULATION!!!!

[VanillaRhapsody]

55. and he is NOT a Democrat...that is NOT SPECULATION!!!!

why not put Rand Paul on the list too....since you are "only Speculating"...(on a Democratic Forum)

How about Superman? Abe Lincoln? Peter Pan? Popeye???

[cascadiance]

57. People like you say that Hillary is "inevitable" because it is LIKELY she will run...

... and say we shouldn't have Warren on there because you think it is unlikely she will run.

I think with what Bernie is saying it is LIKELY he will run and JUST AS LIKELY that he will run as a Democrat! There IS NO RULE that you can only speculate on candidates if they are Democrats NOW! That notion is in my book undemocratic and against the principles of free speech that we regard as a core Democratic Party principle! Why are you against Democratic Party principles of free speech?

[VanillaRhapsody]

58. NO I have NEVER used that word...EVER....

the ONLY ones that EVER say that are you and yours....

sorry.

I just say SHE has the best record right now of kicking their sorry Republican ASSES! AND I for one .....want to WIN!!!

Let me know when one of the others polls higher than EVERY Republican speculation!

[cascadiance]

61. This is a useless conversation...

... You continue just trying to disrupt anything that isn't worshiping Hillary Clinton running for president. Join my ignore list.

[VanillaRhapsody]

67. no anything that iSnt Democratic...

[LWolf]

66. .

I'm sorry that your reading and understanding is so limited that you can't see beyond your self-inflicted mirror box.

[cascadiance]

29. That WASN'T the question posed by this poll!

And it is not really a very probable possibility, as it is probably more unlikely that he'd run as an independent in this election than Elizabeth Warren running in this projected primary, which she's not put in either.

For that matter, with none of these candidates actually declaring they are running, this is ALL speculation at this point.

[VanillaRhapsody]

32. but it is NOT speculation that he is TODAY NOT a Democrat....and we are talking TODAY!

right???/

[cascadiance]

34. Saying he he could be a Democrat is just as real as saying that Hillary Clinton IS NOW running too!

[VanillaRhapsody]

36. No...because she IS a Democrat....

He has the additional hurdle of NOT being one.....so that makes this poll completely bogus from the start.

[cascadiance]

43. But like everyone on this list SHE IS NOT RUNNING T-O-D-A-Y!!!!!

This is a speculative poll. And like you say that Hillary Clinton running is highly likely and shouldn't be questioned, one could also say that with what is being said that it is also highly likely that Sanders would run with what he is saying, and that if he does it is also HIGHLY LIKELY that he would run in the Democratic primary, and VERY UNLIKELY that he'd run as an independent!

What is your point where you continue to try to be a voice of OBSTRUCTION in these threads? We should be able to speculate on possible events in the future shouldn't we? You are really in to suppressing any progressive opposition in the primaries to Hillary aren't you! You just don't like democracy (small d, in case you are trying to confuse that term with the "Democrat" label you seem to love claiming and saying we don't deserve) that has us all wanting to speak and vote for who we want to see be represented in our system, and our party. I still say that Bernie has far more policy stances that I feel represent Democratic values than many like Hillary do.

[VanillaRhapsody]

45. but these are Democrats...and WE are Democrats...

and HE is NOT!

therefore I do not recognize him as their equals....

(and if you think regular Democrats WILL automatically consider him the same as the others if he does....you are sadly in need of another think)

[cascadiance]

50. And if you think that most disaffected and oppressed progressive Democrats won't accept him...

... then YOU need another "think"! The nation spoke heavily against corporate Democrats like Hillary in this last election! They want NEWER ideology than what the corporate Democrats have given them and LOST with this election and in 2010 when it cost us so much gerrymandered districts since then.

Republicans would never have had Reagan go anywhere if they dismissed him for being a Democrat earlier. There are many corporate Democrats that were Republicans or worked for Republicans earlier (including Hillary for that matter) that you now feel define the Democratic Party instead of those who hold traditional values of not letting money influence define our ideology.

Someone could put a Republican on this list as "speculation" too, but it would be useless, as there probably isn't anyone here that would pick them representing their views.

If Sanders indicated he'd run as an independent for president, I don't think he would be included here. He has indicated that he would run as a Democrat if he were to run, so I and most everyone else here really don't care what you think. He should be a part of this poll.

[Scuba]

52. +1,000

[VanillaRhapsody]

85. If you think you are like most Democrats..

you are sadly mistaken...

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

89. You are the mistaken one. Thanks for completely hijacking my thread.

You are a POOR example of a Democrat. And an even worse example of a progressive.

[QC]

118. +1

[Enthusiast]

104. +1 an entire shit load.

[BeanMusical]

84. I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

[LanternWaste]

98. We're talking of hypothetical and fun polls to see where the wind is blowing on DU.

We're merely talking of hypotheticals and fun polls to see where the wind is blowing on DU. And yes, your wind is certainly blowing both strong and irrelevantly on this one.



If Christmas was held in July would you enjoy tha...?
It's NOT though!
I'm, simply asking if it was, would you...
Stop saying it's in July! It's in December and we have to focus on that and that alone!!!

Backing away from the irrational and irrelevant passion now. Thanks so much. Sheesh.

[Chemisse]

40. Why the extreme reaction?

Is it because IF he was in the Democratic primary, he would win in a poll on DU?

Who the heck cares? It's just a poll - a conversation starter. It doesn't mean your candidate is going to lose when the real thing comes along.

[VanillaRhapsody]

41. Since when is reality an extreme position?

[cascadiance]

47. Since when is your opinion "reality"?!

[Enthusiast]

105. Pffft!

[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[BlindTiresias]

46. Shhh

Vanilla is a very sophisticated chatbot, it can't help itself.

[Enthusiast]

103. If you don't like the poll don't participate in it. Ignore it.

Maybe you could start your own poll.

[ieoeja]

108. Why do you people do this? Do you think DUers are actually stupid enough to believe you?

Sanders has spent a lot of the last year in Iowa and New Hampshire preparing a campaign. While those two states are important to Republican and Democratic primaries, they are way down the list of importance in the general election.

So you either think we are so gods fucking stupid that you can convince us he is planning to run in the Republican Party, or that we're so gods awful stupid that we can not see his obvious intent to run in the Democratic primary.

[freshwest]

63. Bernie said he may run as a Democrat on MTP this year. I would support him in the primary, because

I want to see the debate that would take place and want his ideas given a thorough hearing. I want the Democratic Party to define itself in more concrete terms the way Sanders does. We need to thrash out many things in public to educate voters. I don't want to hear slogans and euphemisms.

I do not expect him to win the primary, and he would not win the general.
Like you, I will vote for whoever wins our party's nomination in the general.
But I will not support him if he goes on the attack against other Democrats, which he has not done. If he sticks to the ideals and I think he will, fine.

Sad to say, none of the choices in the OP are the same caliber as Obama and I don't think any of them have a good chance to win the general bar something that will make people think. The MSM ensures most of them don't think at all.

JMHO.

[BlindTiresias]

37. Hey vanilla

Deal with it

[VanillaRhapsody]

38. deal with what?

I am the one in REALITY!

Reality tells me he AIN'T one....deal with THAT yourself.

[BlindTiresias]

44. Lol

[Union Scribe]

109. Lol. Awesome.

[hifiguy]

2. 1. Bernie

2. Al Franken
3. Howard Dean

[Kalidurga]

3. My pick does not want to run...

But, if he could name an alternative to Hillary that would be great.

[Laf.La.Dem.]

6. Clinton has my vote!!

[hrmjustin]

8. Hillary has me in her corner.

[longship]

9. Too damned early for 2016 straw polls.

They only cement opinion and divide the party.

I will vote for any Democrat who is nominated, in 2016. And since nobody has declared their candidacy -- thank god -- it is stoooooopid and utterly meaningless to put up a straw poll now.

No vote.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

90. This isn't a straw poll

I was just interested in the CURRENT opinions of people here. Sure, they are bound to change, but dammit, I have a right to put up a poll. Anyone that doesn't like it should just move on.

[Agnosticsherbet]

12. When Bernie sanders joins the party, I wll consider changing my primary vote.

[VanillaRhapsody]

21. IF!

[Agnosticsherbet]

33. I don't vote for If.

Several months back he actually suggested he was considering changing parties so he could run in the primary. Until he does so, he will not be in a Democratic Primary.

I voted for the best Democratic candidate for the General election. I will vote for who I deem as the best of the candidates in the General election.

[VanillaRhapsody]

35. "considering".....that is the very definition of "IF"!

but like everything else...they refuse to look at reality....just like they did for Elizabeth Warren and Barack Obama before her....they think they are waiting for Superman!

[Agnosticsherbet]

48. I think the Democratic Party, especially most of us on the left, put too much stock in ideal

candidates.

We are never going to get an ideal candidate. What we look for is the best of those who want to run.

A poll based on realism would have Jeff Boss, Vermin Supreme, and Robby Wells. Those unknown candidates are, currently, the only actual declared candidates for 2016. I suspect that will change.

Of those, I support Vermin Supreme. (1) We need a Performance Artist in the White House. (2) Jeff Boss is a self-labeled conspiracy theorist. We do not need one of those. (3) I have grave doubts about Robby Wells "Eaglenomics," though I like his stand on veterans and getting people to work.

[VanillaRhapsody]

49. Exactly...and THAT is the problem!

they need to start defending DEMOCRATS!

More carrot... less stick please maybe we can win next time....

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

91. Berinie Sanders may not be a Democrat (today)

But he represents Democratic ideals better that anyone. Do labels interest you more than political positions? You are not politically sophisticated. You treat politics as a sport.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

13. Nobody for Clooney? He'd play a very presidential POTUS.

[Ykcutnek]

18. I'd be down with that, but the moment he meddled in South Sudan for any reason...

Our firebreathers would accuse him of being a neocon.

[Ykcutnek]

17. I don't have my mind made up.

I'll wait and see what unravels and what comes together the next couple of years.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

22. Sorry the poll says "today". You have to decide if you had to vote today.

[VanillaRhapsody]

25. I don't care...any of them....I want to WIN!

I go with who looks like they can beat the shit out of the Republicans.....after the whipping we just took from them.....I hold NO QUARTER....(they can let their precious "superior morals" keep them warm at night)

[Ykcutnek]

26. I agree. I like them all.

If they are formidable, they'll have my support.

[freshwest]

64. I think we will win if we can express ourselves well in the primary. I think Sanders will give HRC

a chance to show how she will move America to where it needs to be.

My problem with her is only that she just does not come off well in debates and that is necessary to win the general. I'm not talking about 'gotcha' moments from anyone, either.

I'm spoiled by Obama's ability to express himself and show higher ideals than his competition. That is what I find inspiring and a good indicator of what a candidate will do when elected.

HRC has been defined the most negative ways possible from all sides for an entire generation of voters. She may do better in less public settings, but I don't see her do well in television interviews, although they are never fair to her, anyway.

I've watched her at rallies in 2008 after she came out in support in Obama. And she was not at all lukewarm, either, which I appreciated because if one was to define her by some of her supporters, she wouldn't look good. I think a lot of what she has said has been taken out of context.

But I did not like how she came off in the debates in 2008. She has significant negatives with many Democrats and with all Republicans. She is not a clear shot for Democrats to keep the White House.


But she will get my vote, as I know exactly what kind of swine she'll be up against in 2016 if she wins the nomination.

[Jim Lane]

80. Interesting. Let me ask you a follow-up question.

You write, "I go with who looks like they can beat the shit out of the Republicans...."

Does that mean that if, by the time of your state's primary, some Democratic candidate other than Hillary Clinton is polling the best against the leading Republican contenders, you would vote for that other Democratic candidate rather than for Clinton?

I ask because you have been among the most fervent Clinton supporters here -- quite possibly the most fervent. Your post, however, seems to open up at least the possibility of your not voting for her, which is why I'm curious.

BTW, by "Democratic candidate" I mean a card-carrying member of the Democratic Party, registered to vote as a Democrat (if registered in a state that allows voters to declare a party).

[VanillaRhapsody]

83. Good luck with that....

but Yeah I vote for ANYONE who can beat the Republicans ass.

No by Democrat...I mean eligible to run in the Democratic Primary.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

92. Should we qall have to cow-tow to you opinion?

You sure to give it a lot.

[VanillaRhapsody]

97. do you want to win?

or grandstand?

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

99. So HRC is the only person in the world.

You seem to be the grandstander in this thread. I haven't alerted on you yet, but you're really starting to push me.

[AverageJoe90]

23. I'd still support Hillary if she won, but, TBH.....

I'd actually vote for Bernie Sanders.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

94. In the general, I vote for the Democrat

In the primary I vote my conscience. I wonder if Vanilla has a conscience?

[amandabeech]

24. But you didn't include Warren.

I know she's said that she isn't interested in running, but 2 years is a long time in politics. Meanwhile, I opted for Dean, although I would be very happy with Sanders.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

31. I was seriously considering her. But she seems so against it. So I didn't.

[jmowreader]

28. I'm going with Al.

Bernie would be a great president, but you have to get elected president first, and running a self-identifying socialist is the easiest way I know to ensure a Republican victory. Besides, we need great senators as badly as we need a great president.

Al is very sharp and he can work with anyone. He is probably the only one who can solve our worst problem - the need to stop cutting raxes.

Clooney needs to keep doing what he's doing - he can be more effective where he is.

[bigwillq]

42. Dean (nt)

[arely staircase]

53. Sanders 1% Clinton 64%

In the real world where the election will actually happen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationwide_opinion_polling_for_the_Democratic_Party_2016_presidential_primaries

[Aerows]

111. In the real world

Your beloved 3rd partiers got their asses kicked, so tell us all about the real world, won't you?

[arely staircase]

112. wtf are my "beloved third partiers"? nt

[Aerows]

113. What do you think I mean?

I'm not wasting my time on this sort of "Please explicitly explain for the 300th time so I can waste your time" explaining it.

You've been on DU for long enough, and if you don't know, bug someone else.

[arely staircase]

116. I haven't the slightest idea who my "beloved third partiers" to whom you refer

In fact it is probably one of the strangest things anyone has ever addressed to me on DU. This post of yours is now the second weirdest.

[Aerows]

117. Glad I stand out. n/t

[frazzled]

56. Robert Downey Jr.

Because we need a president bold enough to wear purple-tinted sunglasses:

[cascadiance]

59. Iron Man for president!

[RiverLover]

75. Hell yeah!! :-)

[Louisiana1976]

62. I voted for Sanders, but I wonder why Elizabeth Warren wasn't included in the poll.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

65. Same here.

Unlike Sanders Warren is a Democrat.

[ozone_man]

68. Well, that would split the left.

The way it is now, it's a clean break, left vs. right.

[Autumn]

69. Bernie! Bernie! Because Liz isn't going to run, unless she changes her mind

her and Bernie together would be unstoppable.

[PeteSelman]

70. Bernie Sanders by a mile.

Of course.

Then Grayson.

Another mile.

Franken

Dean

Clooney

Another Mile.

Biden

Two miles.

Clinton.

[Generic Brad]

73. No fair

Too many good ones to choose from.

[JEB]

74. I'd change parties to vote for Bernie.

He comes the closest to representing my values. I think his ideas are best for America.

[RiverLover]

76. Write ins: Elizabeth Warren, Sherrod Brown ~nt

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

95. I didn't include them because they've strongly said they won't run.

[Jamastiene]

78. Bernie Sanders if he runs as a Democrat.

Hell yeah.

[libman100]

81. Where is Warren?

That is who I prefer and would vote for.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

96. She said she won't run - otherwise she'd be there absolutely.

[Jim Lane]

82. Just curious -- why did you omit Martin O'Malley?

I'd say he's more likely to run than anyone on your list except Clinton and Sanders.

The defeat of his lieutenant governor's attempt to succeed him will presumably hurt his chances, but my guess is that he'll run anyway.

I realize you could go nuts with possibilities -- Schweitzer? Warren? Sherrod Brown? -- and you have to draw the line somewhere, but I'd tag O'Malley as your most questionable omission.

[Aerows]

114. Martin O'Malley

is another EXCELLENT choice.

[Old Nick]

93. That was easy!

[silvershadow]

110. Bump for Bernie. nt

[LostInAnomie]

115. Dean, always Dean

I don't care what he is running for, he has my vote.

[ozone_man]

119. Write in for Warren as VP.

Bernie of course as president. Dean as head of secretary of health and human services, or wherever he wants to be. Or, maybe he should be VP, and Warren can head up a commission to clean up Wall Street sleaze. Attorney General?