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xchrom

(108,903 posts)
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 07:48 AM Nov 2014

After Fearmongering Kills the NSA Reform Bill, What’s Next?

http://www.alternet.org/after-fearmongering-kills-nsa-reform-bill-whats-next

For a few hours on Tuesday, the Islamic State looked like the best thing that ever happened to the National Security Agency. The USA Freedom Act, a modest bill seen as the best chance for reforming one of the NSA’s dragnet surveillance programs, failed to clear a procedural hurdle in the Senate by two votes after Republicans insisted that it would precipitate a terrorist attack.

“This is the worst possible time to be tying our hands behind our back,” Mitch McConnell said. “We live in a dangerous world, and the threat by ISIL only makes it more so.” Marco Rubio chimed in with his own warning: “God forbid that tomorrow we wake up to the news that a member of ISIL is in the United States,” he said. Former CIA director Michael Hayden penned a Wall Street Journal op-ed under the headline, “NSA Reform That Only ISIS Could Love.”

Really, the USA Freedom Act was NSA reform that no one really loved, except maybe the Obama administration. The bill had “strong support” from the White House and the intelligence agencies, from most of the reform-minded lawmakers and from the tech companies and many civil-liberties groups. And it did contain several provisions lauded by privacy advocates, such as placing special advocates on the secret court that authorizes surveillance requests to argue against the government, and forbidding the government itself from holding phone records.

But groups like the American Civil Liberties Union and the Electronic Frontier Foundation, which deemed the legislation an “ important step forward,” were also clear that it addressed only a very small part of the government’s dragnet surveillance activities. Others thought the bill was so imprecise that it might have sanctioned, rather than ended, certain surveillance practices. Libertarian NSA critic Rand Paul objected because it didn’t go far enough—though before giving him too much credit for his principled stand note that he could have voted to move the bill forward and then offered amendments to address his concerns before a final vote. Ultimately, as Glenn Greenwald wrote at The Intercept, “There is a real question about whether the defeat of this bill is good, bad, or irrelevant.”
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After Fearmongering Kills the NSA Reform Bill, What’s Next? (Original Post) xchrom Nov 2014 OP
shocking, Glenn Greenwald giving political cover to Rand Paul. geek tragedy Nov 2014 #1
Keep on keeping those priorities straight! All that matters here is Greenwald. merrily Nov 2014 #2
raise your hand if you honestly think the next Congress is going to pass better legislation. geek tragedy Nov 2014 #3
How does that relate to your Reply #1 or to my Reply #2, to which you are supposedly replying? merrily Nov 2014 #4
this bill dying was an unambiguous victory for the NSA-humpers geek tragedy Nov 2014 #5
Your Reply 1 was about Greenwald. merrily Nov 2014 #6
NSA-humpers? What are NSA-humpers ? Autumn Nov 2014 #8
They ignore the fact Obama could have killed it and chose not to. Autumn Nov 2014 #7
That's way too sophisticated. merrily Nov 2014 #9
Can you please tell me what a NSA humper is? Autumn Nov 2014 #10
Actually, I don't think I can. merrily Nov 2014 #11
A lot of strange terms lately. I find them to be very interesting Autumn Nov 2014 #12
I have to say most national politicians would. The proof is in the pudding. merrily Nov 2014 #13
So Greenwald is above any criticism whatsoever Blue_Tires Nov 2014 #15
The fake rewording of a post bit is so tiresome and lame. Not worth more of a reply than that. merrily Nov 2014 #16
So you challenge me without a proper response? Blue_Tires Nov 2014 #17
Challenge? No. I simply described your tired posting tactic. merrily Nov 2014 #18
I love how the author tries to pin the diloution of the bill on Obama Blue_Tires Nov 2014 #14
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
1. shocking, Glenn Greenwald giving political cover to Rand Paul.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 07:52 AM
Nov 2014

Never would have expected that.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
2. Keep on keeping those priorities straight! All that matters here is Greenwald.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:00 AM
Nov 2014

Most people thought "kill the messenger" went out with Aeschylus.

Messenger: A volcano just destroyed most an island, leaving only a ring!

Greek Chorus: Kill that attention whore of a messenger. That will end all our problems

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
3. raise your hand if you honestly think the next Congress is going to pass better legislation.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:08 AM
Nov 2014

Bueller? Bueller? Bueller?

Those who killed it did so because they wanted to protect the NSA.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
4. How does that relate to your Reply #1 or to my Reply #2, to which you are supposedly replying?
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:14 AM
Nov 2014

When in doubt, change the subject entirely?
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
5. this bill dying was an unambiguous victory for the NSA-humpers
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:21 AM
Nov 2014

And Rand Paul voted with them.

Not only did he vote with them, his vote was crucial to killing it.

But it becomes an 'open question' of whether it was a good or bad vote somehow, even though those who opposed it now have complete control of the Senate. (only one member of the Democratic caucus voted with Paul and the other Republicans)

This will not be the last time in which a certain segment gives Rand Paul a pass. Just like they've given him a pass for saying it's okay to use drones on liquor store robbers, and calling for a new invasion of Iraq, etc.

Autumn

(48,965 posts)
7. They ignore the fact Obama could have killed it and chose not to.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:50 AM
Nov 2014

It's the reason for the hate fest for Glen and Snowden, it always goes back to them. Because saying.

"shocking, Barack Obama giving political cover to the NSA . Never would have expected that." That kind of looks bad.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014947842

merrily

(45,251 posts)
9. That's way too sophisticated.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 08:54 AM
Nov 2014

Anyone and anything that causes even a potential annoyance to Obama must be dissed into dust at every turn, no matter what.

And they call the left purists.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
11. Actually, I don't think I can.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 09:06 AM
Nov 2014

Perhaps you can help me out.

In the urban dictionary, might I find that term as an antonym of "Greenwald humper?"

Autumn

(48,965 posts)
12. A lot of strange terms lately. I find them to be very interesting
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 09:38 AM
Nov 2014

I would think that the term " NSA humpers" must be people who like the NSA and of course I think a "Greenwald humper" would be people who like what Greenwald has to say.

If that's the case I find it very interesting the politicians who would fit in the category of NSA humpers. But a pass is a pass. It all depends on who gets a pass.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
13. I have to say most national politicians would. The proof is in the pudding.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 09:41 AM
Nov 2014

The budget comes from the White House and gets passed by both Houses. I am not sure about this bit, but I think it passes most often without resort to reconciliation.

 

Blue_Tires

(57,596 posts)
15. So Greenwald is above any criticism whatsoever
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 12:28 PM
Nov 2014

thank you for reminding me...

Greenwald and his allies tried to play hardline, rolled the dice on an all-or-nothing approach, and crapped out...So now they're trying to retroactively justify that this is the outcome they really wanted...

merrily

(45,251 posts)
16. The fake rewording of a post bit is so tiresome and lame. Not worth more of a reply than that.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 01:11 PM
Nov 2014
 

Blue_Tires

(57,596 posts)
17. So you challenge me without a proper response?
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 01:16 PM
Nov 2014

From now on you can respond to the ignore list, big boy

merrily

(45,251 posts)
18. Challenge? No. I simply described your tired posting tactic.
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 01:19 PM
Nov 2014

Oh, please, please don't put me on ignore.



 

Blue_Tires

(57,596 posts)
14. I love how the author tries to pin the diloution of the bill on Obama
Fri Nov 21, 2014, 12:23 PM
Nov 2014

nice try, my dear...Go back and check the sponsors and the roll call...

And nice to see ol' Glenn pretending to straddle the fence as always -- On twitter he was blaming some mythical "Pro-NSA Liberals"...I'm not joking...Good luck getting your "perfect bill" passed next year...

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