General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe LEFT needs to realize that TORTURE is OVER
Last edited Sat Dec 13, 2014, 01:13 AM - Edit history (1)
Look people, we get it: you don't want people, even foreign people, to participate in certain activities that may make it difficult to drive, operate heavy machinery, breathe, or support a normal cardiac rhythm. Truth be told, while I get that our brave and patriotic Activity Directors have very stressful jobs, even I think they sometimes do go a smidge too far. But unlike you moonbats, I don't get all sanctimonious about it.
In any case, our President has ended some of these "enhanced interrogation" techniques so most of us can relax. Deep breath now, folks! It's all good!
But some on the Left are harshing our buzz: they keep raising the whole "extraordinary rendition" thingy, claiming that it's outsourced torture, the Trans-Torture Partnership if you will. Nothing could be further from the truth. Let me say this in a one-sentence paragraph so it looks like I'm being direct and honest:
The people we kidnap for extraordinary rendition are not tortured. Period.
Yes, back in the old days, when extraordinary rendition was invented by Bill Clinton and Al Gore, there may have been a little rough play. But that's a thing of the past: when our President ended torture by ending some enhanced interrogation techniques, he also made a profound change in the "rules" around extraordinary rendition which ensures that all prisoners are treated humanely and with dignity, from the moment they're snatched off the street and drugged into submission, until the last of their body parts are released by the partner country that agrees to serve as their host.
Now, this is all a little technical for the Lumpenproletariat that frequent DU, so rather than bore your with legalese, I'll demonstrate this critical change in the rules as a pretend conversation between the US and the host country. It could be any participating host country, such as Egypt, Jordan, Afghanistan and Morocco or the others that are proud to work alongside us on the War on Terra!
US: "Hey host country! We grabbed this guy off the street because we suspect he has a lot of Terra! in him. We think he wants to overthrow your government, too. Could you give him food and shelter for a few years?"
Host country: "No problem!"
US: "And while you're at it, can you torture the @#$% out of him?"
Host country: "Hell yeah!"
That was then; this is now:
US: "Hey host country! We grabbed this guy off the street because we suspect he has a lot of Terra! in him. We think he wants to overthrow your government, too. Could you give him food and shelter for a few years?"
Host country: "No problem!"
US: "And could you not torture the @#$% out of him? We won't actually check to see if you're not, because we trust you!"
Host country: "LOL. Sure.
"
And there you have it! Unlike the torture-filled extraordinary rendition of yesterday, today's detainee-guest cannot be tortured, thanks to unverifiable assurances from our partners.
"But Manny!", some on the Left protest, "shouldn't we have some way of verifying that the people we snatch off the street aren't being subjected to unspeakable abuse?" LOL! That's why you people don't get paid the big bucks! Insisting on verification would send a signal to these countries that we don't trust them, which could make them angry, and you definitely don't want to get on the bad side of these countries - let's just say that the word vivisection was not in my vocabulary until I started researching these places.
So, in conclusion: it's all the Left's fault.
Regards,
Third-Way Manny
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)Too cool. No, really.
Time to bring in the Reccing crew...
ETA: Don't bother, they're here...
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Sorry.
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)So, I can't say.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)By way of recompense, I'll write a serious OP on the topic of your choice. Any topic at all, except what I think about every night while staring at the album cover of Parallel Lines.
Deal?
Bobbie Jo
(14,344 posts)Beside all that, what do you think about ME??
Autumn
(48,962 posts)on that.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Don't take this lying down!
Andy823
(11,555 posts)You are really good at what you do. Just keep on stirring! Of course I have noticed your rec counts aren't up there like they used to be, guess you need to stir a bit harder.
Andy823
(11,555 posts)He is really good at it. He really loves all those recs.
SixString
(1,057 posts)It seems you're usually the first to arrive when Manny throws a party.
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)SixString
(1,057 posts)... with the number of recs Manny gets.
Some of them even rec their own threads.
Can you believe that?
I've never seen Manny self rec.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)Many of us 1%er, Third Way, DLC, Neo-con, corporatists do.....
I just think his judgement on Elizabeth Warren as a candidate gets a littler skewed.
hueymahl
(2,904 posts)Sorry you had to pull the Friday night shift.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)We don't worry about silly stuff like that, we leave that up to others, I think we all know who.
When a person does, or in Manny's case case writes something really great, accolades naturally follow. Accolades in this case being Skinners rec thingy that gets a few of Manny's non fan crew in a tizzy. Writing is a mad skill and Manny haz it. On the plus side Manny's 3rd way writing is funny as all get out. Of course there are those who say that satire is not cool, others say that those who can't find humor have no humor.
hedda_foil
(16,985 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,835 posts)... you posted an OP about torture.
It's been a non-issue here on DU for the past 48 hours. Thank God someone had the courage to raise the topic.
Okay, all right - so there have been a couple of OPs on the subject. But you can't rack up the recs if you merely post a reply in the already existing threads, can you?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)You're missing a hyphen.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,835 posts)... being sick of anything.
It has to do with the need to start a new OP, instead of simply discussing the same topic in the existing threads - which are many.
But as I said, you don't get 'recs' that way. And 'recs' are extremely important to some people.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)On Skinners message board. Where people post things. Where MANY people post things that are current issues and events, Even non-issues.
I gotta tell you though as a former fan of your writing I find your posts in Manny's threads to be the best of any of your writing . They just capture and spotlight the real essence of you.
marym625
(17,997 posts)It's either jealousy or disdain. Either way, why even comment and bring attention to something/someone you don't like? Hmm. Attention to self perhaps?
Autumn
Autumn
(48,962 posts)marym625
(17,997 posts)But it just didn't get enough recs for my liking
Seriously, thank you. I appreciate it.
Me too. Don't get following someone you don't like around. Only time I even see some people are on a Manny thread.
Oy!
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)They realize they should find torture abhorrent but the President is soft selling the war crimes of Cheney and the gang. Children were tortured and Pres Obama shrugs it off. You can see the bind they are in. The only option is to lash out at poor, defenseless Manny who hates it sooo much. LOL. They say he does it for the rec's. LOL, he does it for the hate. He seems to love the hate. Manny is one strange bird, but don't tell him I said so.
LondonReign2
(5,213 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,835 posts)But you knew that.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)for getting so many recs. Really? Are you a DU member to discuss issues?
countryjake
(8,554 posts)Signed,
Proud sanctimonious piece of shit leech of humanity.
(Excellent post, Manny. Thank You!)
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Comrade!
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)No big deal.
Yup.
Oilwellian
(12,647 posts)in Obama's own words, he only ended some of the enhanced interrogation techniques.
merrily
(45,251 posts)the rectal hummus smoothie or whatever methods you tell yourself are okay don't count at all. Just like you don't need to count calories if you eat out.
tclambert
(11,193 posts)Maybe if you stare into a mirror for an hour and then break the mirror, it will cure you.
But don't do it. I love reading the satire, so I would miss Third-Way Manny. Yet I hate the need for his existence. Hang on, I need to go stare into a mirror for awhile.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)A Simple Game
(9,214 posts)Another good job Manny, keep up the good work.
Hubert Flottz
(37,726 posts)there is a lying republican left on my TV!
I'd sooner be water boarded than to see Jebro Bush in the White House or on my TV 24/7.
Bush's and friends are all cowardly draft dodging "wimps," who have to strap on the American Armed forces, to feel like the real Boss Man of the world!
merrily
(45,251 posts)zeemike
(18,998 posts)There have been entirely to many sanctimonious liberals getting their panties in a bunch over a little water in the face....or food up the butt...
Besides it is not really kidnapping, it is free transportation to a hotel where the food and board are free...and they should be happy to take it up the butt.
If the left will just STFU about it they might get their pony.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Getting all sanctimonious about the torturers after Prez Obama told them not to!
Hassin Bin Sober
(27,461 posts)I know a republican senator who pays top dollar for a weekend like that.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Don't forget they ALL hate Obama and every time liberals say something it is only because they hate him. Yup yup.
merrily
(45,251 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)The margin between everyday reality and WTF?! has shrunk from a sliver to a highly-negative number.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Just imagine, though, what it must have taken to write this OP and continue with that crapfest of a thread. http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025935916
Makes your job look like a walk in the paahk.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)That's quite a thread.
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)woo me with science
(32,139 posts)RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)Still. There. Is. Gitmo.
The reality is.... the US, as a country, so far, is not like us. Not even all of DU is.
At this point, the only recourse is a constitutional amendment making it illegal for our government to condone torture anywhere or any place.
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)joshcryer
(62,536 posts)"Extraordinary rendition" is torture. The "renditions" under Obama were not torture.
This is just more of the black President not getting credit where it is due and under the veil of a rather repulsive TWM post. More attempts to give the Bush administration a pass for the illegal activity it did.
zappaman
(20,627 posts)Great post!
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)spanone
(141,616 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)But the worst of what happened under Bush physical and mental torture could easily happen again, according to a report released last week by the Constitution Project, a nonpartisan public-interest organization dedicated to the rule of law, on the U.S. governments approach to terrorism suspects. The reports task force included Asa Hutchinson, a former U.S. attorney and Bush administration official; James Jones, a former Democratic Congressman from Oklahoma; Talbot DAlemberte, a former president of the American Bar Association; and William Sessions, former head of the FBI.
The report aims to offer a definitive account of what happened in Iraq, Afghanistan and Guantanamo, as well as the numerous covert detention facilities, known as black sites, where detainees were held. It noted that since the Obama administration decided not to commission an official study or establish a Truth Commission, the report is likely to be the only record of what happened. You can read it in full here (pdf).
The report said it was indisputable that the U.S. engaged in torture approved by President George W. Bush but also that the Obama administration, by its own actions, has made it possible for such abuses to happen again. Heres why:
Autumn
(48,962 posts)"But having said all that, we did some things that were wrong. And that's what that report reflects. And that's the reason why, after I took office, one of the first things I did was to ban some of the extraordinary interrogation techniques that are the subject of that report." See that word "some"?
(4) With respect to the larger point of the RDI report itself, even before I came into office I was very clear that in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 we did some things that were wrong. We did a whole lot of things that were right, but we tortured some folks. We did some things that were contrary to our values.
(5) I understand why it happened. I think its important when we look back to recall how afraid people were after the Twin Towers fell and the Pentagon had been hit and the plane in Pennsylvania had fallen, and people did not know whether more attacks were imminent, and there was enormous pressure on our law enforcement and our national security teams to try to deal with this. And its important for us not to feel too sanctimonious in retrospect about the tough job that those folks had. And a lot of those folks were working hard under enormous pressure and are real patriots.
(6) But having said all that, we did some things that were wrong. And that's what that report reflects. And that's the reason why, after I took office, one of the first things I did was to ban some of the extraordinary interrogation techniques that are the subject of that report.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/08/01/press-conference-president
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)He didn't ban interrogation.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)I suppose he wasn't talking about the interrogation techniques that are the subject of that report on how they tortured people?
I suppose he was talking about different interrogation techniques in a much different report.
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)Obama did not commit torture, he banned it.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)6) But having said all that, we did some things that were wrong. And that's what that report reflects. And that's the reason why, after I took office, one of the first things I did was to ban some of the extraordinary interrogation techniques that are the subject of that report.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/08/01/press-conference-president
And from your link these words josh
" in any armed conflict,"
that's a little bit of a loop hole there. What you gonna believe? What Obama said or what Obama said
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)Repeating yourself isn't proving anything here. Obama banned torture. Parsing his words and trying to flip it back on him, over something he did after two days in office, is precious, but it doesn't work with me.
You can read the methods that Obama mandated here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FM_2-22.3_Human_Intelligence_Collector_Operations
At most he was covering himself because the report talks about coercion and such. Which the field manual allows. That's not fucking torture.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Agony
(2,605 posts)it's all OK as long as we just let others take care of the messiness for us, just like we have done for years.
thanks for the National Security Interest nostalgia!
cheers,
Agony
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)True Blue Door
(2,969 posts)It's that we have no plan to achieve accountability for it.
We complain, and whine, and call people names, but actually do politics to achieve justice?
That sounds like work! (hiss!)
Babel_17
(5,400 posts)Babel_17
(5,400 posts)DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)
- It's strange how weird things just seem to go right with each other. Mutt & Jeff, Laurel & Hardy, Rectal-rehydration & Hummus. And so it is with this frame of mine that I therefore dedicate this song to your thread, Manny. Because it's life's deeper questions that really matter in the end.
Lord knows you've answered one here.....