General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDo we actually know who killed those cops
It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops.
This really looks too neat.
I want more info - yes it's horrible for their families and I grieve for them regardless of who committed this awful act.
I'm skeptical about everything these days.
ProdigalJunkMail
(12,017 posts)Raine1967
(11,596 posts)I honestly believe he was a guy with a very sick twisted mind that wanted to die.
He wanted notoriety as well. He pretty much said so in his postings.
elias49
(4,259 posts)Reports are that he killed himself. He should have done that firs!
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)Which he was very clear to explain on Instragram. He wanted to go out in a blaze of glory.
Raine1967
(11,596 posts)Something was wrong in his head. HE did kill himself. HE shot his girlfriend in Baltimore and made it to Brooklyn to assassinate two cops.
These are the actions of a mind gone wrong. Did he have to?
We will never know. He's dead.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)He was clearly crazy. And has nothing to do with the peaceful protesters. So why is he being used against them? Who is orchestrating this campaign to try to shut down these protests?
The NYPD is so thoroughly corrupt that nothing I might learn about them would surprise me.
And if the police are going to lie about any connection between him and the legitimate protests against the murder of unarmed African Americans, then we are free to speculate about EVERYTHING that comes from them.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)THERE IS NOT ENOUGH TINFOIL IN THE WORLD FOR THIS PRISONPLANET SHIT
Response to NuclearDem (Reply #57)
Post removed
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)though his death was a tragedy and imo, murder.
We know that witnesses lied to the GJ, the prosecutor, McCullough has now admitted that AND that he knew they were lying. Those two are the 'witnesses' used to try to discredit all the other witnesses.
But that is just the tip of the iceberg regarding this problem. Brown was just one more African American teenager gunned down in the street by a police officer. I guess his death was the tipping point for something that has gone on for so long with no justice.
If I am misunderstanding you, I'm sorry.
But the NYPD is not a Civilian PD anymore.
They have been caught lying and deceiving and engaging in corruption and prejudice over an over again.
They have declared themselves to be above the law. That is not acceptable in a Democracy.
Now they are using this tragedy to try to stop the protests against their own law breaking. That is reprehensible.
Now they are using this tragedy to try to stop the protests against their own law breaking. That is reprehensible.
marble falls
(60,394 posts)NYPD after all.
Rex
(65,616 posts)snooper2
(30,151 posts)Don't use it all though I need several square feet to cover the ham and turkey goodness after I get done cooking on Thursday
Rex
(65,616 posts)snooper2
(30,151 posts)and it-s got a mad, not madz-
If you are going to type in tween at least do a little research first!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)unarmed African Americans by the Police. Thanks, I like to know where people stand on the issues.
They are undermining Mayor De Blasio because he spoke up for the victims of Police Brutality.
I guess you agree with them that he was wrong to do that also.
Oh My Good God! On DU of all places.
Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #63)
Post removed
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Sometimes taking a hide is just worth it.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Is that what you're referring to when you say that "sometimes is worth to take a hide"??
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Take your finger-wagging elsewhere.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #115)
Post removed
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Boreal
(725 posts)Posts like that let you know who someone really is and should be left to speak for themselves.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)when they were deleted and no one could see them. Now we get to see them, which is a lot better imo.
Where can you see what was hidden? I didn't know that.
I had a post hidden and it was all because the person who alerted lied to the board and told them I used was used was racist. The word was "Ukie", short for Ukrainian and is not a racial slur, AT ALL. The alerter wanted the facts of my post hidden and used the lie to get it done.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)over the mod system. True, there are people who try to abuse it, but most people are fair I believe.
You can see a hidden post if you click on it. That is what I like about it also. While the community may hide it, it is still accessible. The old system just deleted posts so you never knew why something was hidden.
marble falls
(60,394 posts)censor the rest of us by drowning out by shouting us all down. Disruption may be free speech but it isn't protected speech and specifically it isn't tolerated here. Some of this big group of disruptors made up to 50 posts yesterday. I don't know how many juries were raised but I bet it was a near record.
When I see a "message removed/name removed" I kinda know what the reason was even if I don't get the specifics. And I am sure at least 90% of the time I'd agree 100% with that erasure. When you are actually here for a while you'll understand. Stated in a way that contains no direct insult to a member or clearly racist, sexist, ageist (etc) reference to others, one can at least say pretty much anything.
Its not so much what they said, its the intent and how they said it that got them removed.
If you like that kind of thing, almost total freedom to be insulting, rude, angry etc, you might want to take a look at a site that the creators of this site put up about six or eight months ago called the discussionist. Its a free for all sometimes and people feel free to say almost anything, including some fairly racist stuff.
Personally, I'll take some censorship to keep the OPs on track and semiclose to topic.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)was an outright lie. And if you want to say something to me don't use someone else's words, use your own.
I did not alert on that post, I'm fine with letting people see these vile attacks on DUers here who have spent their lives standing up against police brutality especially against minorities.
I got used to these kinds of attacks on those of us who for years, have spoken out against these cops. But I have to say, I never encountered it on a Democratic Forum until recently.
Mayor De Blasio is learning how dangerous it is to speak the truth about this issue.
He will need the support of every decent citizen in this state right now. I imagine he too will be the target of the same kind of anger just seen here.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Police officers by armed psychos.
Thanks, I like to know where people stand on the issues.
Oh My Good God! On DU of all places.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5987254
G_j
(40,420 posts)for doing your part to drag the coversation into the sewer.
Last edited Sun Dec 21, 2014, 04:28 PM - Edit history (1)
Not a member of the fan club.
I'll favor the direct approach over the backhanded snide any day.
ETA: No, THIS is where it went into the sewer:
"So you support the police shootings of innocent
unarmed African Americans by the Police. Thanks, I like to know where people stand on the issues."
Snide, disingenuous, and thoroughly disgusting.
Get it now?
marble falls
(60,394 posts)GGJohn
(9,951 posts)that post was taken completely out of context by the other poster.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)He seems to have attacked the wrong person.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Last edited Sun Dec 21, 2014, 05:37 PM - Edit history (1)
I'm clapping in agreement with the hidden poster, because the post she was responding to was one of the most dishonest, disgusting posts I've seen around here in some time.
I cannot stand people who pull this snide, dishonest crap.
unarmed African Americans by the Police.
What the fuck??
Hope that clears it up for you.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)Probably another case in which I find the nesting of comments hard to follow.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Skittles
(157,118 posts)ABSOLUTELY
marble falls
(60,394 posts)not being able to post on that OP anymore? He could have made the statement in an acceptable way and that would have reached the audience he wanted to be heard by.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)OP has the right to ask questions, or be skeptical. You on the other hand chose to be condescending and associate the OP with "tinfoil hats". Which is fine, your right ( we are a free country) but don't forget she just asked a legitimate question, and didn't point the finger to x or y.
Which is far from needing "tinfoil" anything.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)someone like the hidden "jewel" above goes ballistic, because there have never been any conspiracies involving cops EVAR.
You have to be mighty ignorant and very immature and naive to imagine there is no such thing as corruption, set-ups blackmail etc.
I'm not saying it's the case here but there certainly have been known conspiracies among cops.
How sad that the hidden poster is so convinced that "cops are just the most wonderful people on the planet and they would NEVER lie or do anything sinister,' that they feel they have to get so personal and ugly with someone who isn't convinced.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)The "hidden poster" took issue with an individual. Ascribing an exaggerated stance, " cops are just the most wonderful people on the planet and they would NEVER lie or do anything sinister." to ND is just ridiculous beyond belief.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)NuclearDem insulted the OP, malaise ( a respected DUr) in a very nasty way. He cursed her out, and you said that " sometimes it's worth taking a hide", in respect to his hidden post.
You approved of that nastiness.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)to malaise.
You seem confused.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)His post was deservedly hidden, but you approved of it saying that " sometimes it's worth taking a hide).
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Done here.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts).. if that was the case. )
You alfoved of breaking the TOS and community standards, albeit, which were done by another member.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)ND's post was directed at sabrina 1, not the OP.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Did she not?
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)ND's response was still directed at the aforementioned person.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)And this poster approved of those violations.
Do you see nothing wrong with that??
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)ND probably knew that the post would be hidden, but felt it was worth it.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Sun Dec 21, 2014, 12:39 PM
GGJohn
139. No, I do not.
ND probably knew that the post would be hidden, but felt it was worth it.
You aprove of a poster telling another to go "fuck themselves"??
This is NuclearDem's post you stand behind:
64. ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME
FUCK OFF YOU PSYCHO PIECE OF TROLL SHIT
FUCK OFF WHATEVER DRUGS YOU'RE ON YOU MISERABLE WASTE OF OXYGEN
YOU NEVER GIVE A SHIT ABOUT UNARMED BLACK KIDS UNTIL IT GIVES YOU AN EXCUSE TO PEDDLE YOUR DELUSIONAL PSYCHO CONSPIRACY BULLSHIT
FUCK YOURSELF
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Did I stutter?
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)141. Yes, really.
Did I stutter?
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)It's not a violation of the TOS, so, I won't delete.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)But you do support a post literally cursing another DUer.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Anyway, thanks for keeping it a decent converse.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)but want to be treated with kid gloves yourself.
I smell something....
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)I'm guessing that you can provide a link?
Ha, I spent over 40 years in the Army, I have an extremely thick skin, so, fire away, it won't offend me.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)you thanked the poster for being ever so gentle with you, so I assume that you appreciate that but only if the gentle discourse is directed toward you or someone who agrees with you.
Otherwise you support being abusive toward others.
Got it.
I know a lot of them IRL who have this double standard like you and others on this thread. Except they all watch FOX news and rub their guns against their crotches and hate anyone not pasty as a tortilla.
I'd hate to think DU would ever get infested with people like that, but you never know...
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)I thanked her for a decent conversation, if you can't see that, then it's on you, not me.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)Like I said, double standard from HELL.
You guys don't fool anyone; I hope you realize that. Oldtimers here can smell you through our laptops.
PHEWIE!!!!!
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)maybe.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Does the word hypocrite come to mind?
That's ok though, have a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)or you don't like it when people online are mean to YOU?
Because you stated that you were fine with another troll (we all know it) poster abusing a DUer.
YOU SUPPORTED THE ABUSE.
Now you don't like when someone is mean?
Awwww....Poor baby....those double standards ALWAYS out you guys. ALWAYS.
If you could just try not to be so hypocritical yourselves, maybe we wouldn't catch on to you so soon.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)you seem to forget, I spent 40+ years in the Army, you're nothing compared to to some of my commanding officers.
All I was doing was point out your hypocrisy.
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)People who aren't insulting?
NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)Be very careful around here...
zappaman
(20,607 posts)We'll be sure to take your advice.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)I thought that's what the republicans did, I was under the impression that the Democratic Party was a big tent.
Was I wrong to have that impression?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)rbrnmw
(7,160 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)They all pretend to be here with good intentions, until they don't - and then just laugh it off. You are right, oldtimers ain't fooled by their narrative one bit.
Thanks for pointing it out. The double standard and ignoring facts are so obvious it is sad/painful to watch.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)We never were.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Did back on DU1 still does on DU3. Like on DU1 those that would defend Bush and never criticize a thing he or Cheney did. Same shit, different year.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I didn't alert on that post just so people know, but not surprised someone did. There are rules here, which being in the army I'm sure you learned to respect. The admins of this site do not want it to look like the comment section of Utube and for the most part people are decent enough to respect that.
I've been on forums where there are no rules, and have no problem with them. But this is not that kind of forum and people generally respect that.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Go visit Discussionist, that place is wide open no holds barred.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)in the one you approved there. I disagree with many of the people there, but haven't had any problem doing so.
Discussionist is mild compared to some of the forums I started out on. The post you liked here was mild compared to some of them. Though even on those forums, the dialogue was of a slightly higher caliber, bad as they were.
Discussionist has the same jury system as this one. And it seems to be working fine wrt to posts that are filled with nothing but personal attacks. As does this one.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)a habit of attacking other DUers here. But when someone responds to them, they go ballistic. All they have to do is to treat other people here with respect and they will be treated the same way. That hidden post should surprise no one, and it is that type of attack, which people are becoming pretty familiar with and pretty sick of, that elicited my response.
Malaise has a right to question and so do I. Both she and I were attacked for doing so.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)And "It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops." Is well beyond a question.
Try again.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)It was not a statement, but a followup to explain the question.
Nowhere does the OP state any belief one way or the other. In fact, she closes by saying she is skeptical of everything.
In this day and age, NOT being skeptical is the real fool's game. You have to be sort of thick headed or naive to not question EVERYTHING.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)So the OP was at the scene?
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)I am so sorry that you don't know what an observation is.
Here is a definition for you:
ob·ser·va·tion
ˌäbzərˈvāSH(ə n/
noun
noun: observation; plural noun: observations
1.
the action or process of observing something or someone carefully or in order to gain information.
"she was brought into the hospital for observation"
synonyms: monitoring, watching, scrutiny, examination, inspection, survey, surveillance, consideration, study, review
"the patient has been brought in for observation"
the ability to notice things, especially significant details.
"his powers of observation"
the taking of the altitude of the sun or another celestial body for navigational purposes.
2.
a remark, statement, or comment based on something one has seen, heard, or noticed.
"he made a telling observation about Hugh"
synonyms: remark, comment, statement, utterance, pronouncement, declaration.
Bold mine.
According to the dictionary, you do not need to be present at an event to make an observation about it.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)And I stand by my statement.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)darkangel218
(13,985 posts)J_J_
(1,213 posts)+100000
If they didn't want us to be suspicious, they might have been a little more humble with their reaction.
They are so obvious, and we are not morons.
And the idea that we are expected to believe whatever the media presents us at this point is completely laughable.
rustydog
(9,186 posts)How about because there are bad, EVIL people on this planet and all some need is a perceived threat or grievance to impel them to act first..
name not needed
(11,663 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)I think it's far more loony that we don't.
And, we don't have a press corps who questions anything authorities tell them, either.
We're a country of drones.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Bingo.
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)might be a tiny bit less offensive if we didn't already have ample evidence that we live in a deeply corrupt propaganda state operating with with virtually no limits when it comes to morality and manipulating the public.
This guy may very well be a lone nut. However, we also have ample evidence by now that our corrupt government is capable of just about anything in order to dupe Americans into supporting the most malignant aspects of their corporate, war, and police state agenda.
We know we are the target of campaigns of propaganda and smear by our own government, down to discussion boards on the internet. We know that most of the reported "terror plots" that were supposedly interrupted by our government were largely manufactured by it. And that's not even remotely the worst of what we have learned.
If our country will torture, break bones, rape, sodomize, and even murder human beings for the express purpose of extracting false confessions to manufacture American support for war, then people should think twice about attacking those who suggest that it might also respond to nationwide outrage and protests against our militarized police state with an extreme incident to justify its continuation.
At the very least, we should be open to questioning, and outraged that this incident will undoubtedly be used by the PTB to try to render the protests null and void.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025938295
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025959095
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)malaise
(275,661 posts)Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)CatWoman
(79,536 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)woo
There is nothing more to add, but I did down-thread. YOU have said it best.
Jeebus
. WHEN will people start paying attention?
G_j
(40,420 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
uponit7771
(91,186 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)Thankfully 99% of this site just laughs at their extremest views.
AuntPatsy
(9,904 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)My point is that we shouldn't call people "looney" if they don't automatically believe what authorities tell them.
It's been proven time and time again that the authorities can and do lie. Maybe not always, but we should reserve judgment.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Hey, it's just a hypothesis.
NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)How long must it take for people to get their head out of the sand and pay attention to what passes as a mystery unsolved? This particular story as it unfolds is unfolding a little too neatly for me, personally. I have not finished with what I feel was behind this crime. Meanwhile
. I'm getting tired of the tin foil association that some persons throw out with considering all possibilities. Tin foil? I consider that well worn phrase will wear itself out sooner than later.
There are more reasons within our current law enforcement and policy making where it might be reasoned to control a growing number of Americans, mainly, the ones who are more likely to "rise up", albeit peacefully. This would not be the first example in history where setting up a mentally challenged "loon" is worth the price of a few soldiers, as the lie blurs between police and soldiers. How to control disgruntled populations... What tactics could possibly be used to suppress militarization of police? This would not be the first example for me to conclude. However, NOBODY is going to tell me I shouldn't consider it. To cast aspersions on that possibility of this tactic BEING used is one way to shut people up. I've had shit hurled at me by lesser individuals since 2001 for reasoning the possibilities, based on real history. That is what happens when you pay attention to history.
There is nothing wrong with allowing these kinds of opinions, so I'm with you on this one.
malaise
(275,661 posts)seventy years ago - bet it was tinfoil to defend him then, but seventy years later after the racists killed that child, he has now been exonerated from the grave.
I'll remain skeptical - I questioned all the nuns at school and my parents, so I don't care who gets upset when I question the 'very convenient' establishment meme driven by self interest.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)have learned not to trust anything they are told, question authority! All the MORE reason to question imho.
They HAVE been outraged over the protests. They are getting worried that they are not only NOT ending, as they expected, but are growing.
And no way should the protests stop. I heard one of them today stating that the protests should end.
Seems they intend to use this tragedy, for their own purposes.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
LiberalElite
(14,691 posts)philosslayer
(3,076 posts)I'm leaning towards a false flag operation run jointly by the North Koreans, ISIS, and the NYPD
(Eye roll inserted here)
sharp_stick
(14,400 posts)trying to distract from the Cuban deal.
GreatGazoo
(3,951 posts)OilemFirchen
(7,149 posts)I see what I did there.
branford
(4,462 posts)COLGATE4
(14,791 posts)the Illuminati!!!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)members to train in Israel and other ME countries? Why are our civilian police being trained in WAR ZONES?? Bahrain is a dictatorship, did you know that? So who knows what training they are receiving? Your little 'joke' isn't that funny when you actually know some of what is going on with our supposed civilian PDs, is it?
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Or is it just more "facts" like "50 million Americans get their news from RT"?
sharp_stick
(14,400 posts)you're gonna come across as kind of loony.
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)too late on "gonna"
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Response to Nuclear Unicorn (Reply #72)
Post removed
AnalystInParadise
(1,832 posts)to post this nonsense, you are usually quicker on the draw with your Conspiracy Theories.....Was everyone at Prison Planet busy today?
malaise
(275,661 posts)7962
(11,841 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)re Infowars, is moot at this point.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)You still digging it?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)interesting comments to attend to. What was it you wanted again?
zappaman
(20,607 posts)He "supports the police shootings of innocent unarmed African Americans by the Police."
I'll wait right here for the link thanks.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)The Cave? How are they doing btw? I think I've met a few of them on Discussionist where they are not so 'outspoken'. The jury system, it does work.
Oh no, it was Infowars! How are THEY doing? I'm always impressed with your knowledge of all these sites.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Or just dodge since we both know you made it up.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)thing. Just go read the thread if there's anything you don't understand, and a few others also. And my advice? Try another sport!
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Enjoy the dishonesty.
Sucks that he fell for your bait, but hopefully he learned not to take you seriously.
No one else does.
Hope that doesn't hurt your feelings...
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Lonely? Sad?
Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #332)
Post removed
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I understand that DUers are fascinating people, but most of them don't come here to talk about each other. That's kind of boring.
Eg, how do you feel about the NYPD claiming that Mayer De Blasio and the Protersters 'have blood on their hands'? Do YOU think that particular CT that it was the Mayor and the Protesters who killed those two cops, holds any water whatsoever?
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Why am I not surprised?
Thanks, I like to know where people stand on the issues.
Oh My Good God! On DU of all places.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5987254
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)from your comments which are always all about other DUers. At least all the ones I've seen.
Doesn't that ever get boring?
I'm bored now, so I'll leave you to make stuff up about DUers who stand up for the rights of others.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)I'm sure you'll be back shortly to make up some more stuff about DUers shortly.
ScreamingMeemie
(68,918 posts)I think not. Hide the thread instead of hurling rude commentary. Take a breath and try and enjoy the rest of your weekend.
AnalystInParadise
(1,832 posts)because we should be tolerant and inclusive of whack job posts.......And for the record that was me being EXTREMELY polite. If I was impolite, I would probably get in a lot of trouble.
ScreamingMeemie
(68,918 posts)indicative that you need a DU break.
Go outside, get a walk in. Come back, and participate in threads you find are more to your liking. Being rude (and I highly doubt you being "impolite" in your words would be much different) is being rude. People need resets when they can't control their posts as evidenced here.
No one asked you to be inclusive.
Rex
(65,616 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)ncjustice80
(948 posts)Our government will rape, lie, and torture. Why not kill two minority cops to create "heroes" to distract from police violence.
Response to AnalystInParadise (Reply #11)
Name removed Message auto-removed
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Get over yourself.
Horse with no Name
(34,005 posts)they are piling on malaise.
CatWoman
(79,536 posts)just because someone asked a question?
pintobean
(18,101 posts)just asking a question.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)in Iraq, even though I thought Bush was capable of pretty much anything. That just seemed to me something that would NO ONE would support him on.
That was a long time ago. I was so naive back then. I really thought we were the good guys and Bush was just a temporary aberration.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)If you say so.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)I don't know any good fiction sites since it's not my thing, but you should find one.
Cuz I've yet to read anything from you that was even remotely true.
Judi Lynn
(162,032 posts)The fury leads one to recognize something else is at play there!
Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #29)
Post removed
Rex
(65,616 posts)crying over people DARE question their motives! They are cops! How dare we! The same small group of posters sounds just like the union leaders. How DARE we question authority! The very idea is a CT! Their narrative is getting really old and tired - but when that is all you have...what else ya gonna do?
Start telling the truth? Pay attention? Use common sense?
840high
(17,196 posts)Igel
(35,895 posts)When you ask a question, you have presuppositions. You don't ask questions that you think are insane.
"So, how many tons of chocolate coated shrimp do you think the first lady ate for breakfast today?" To ask it is to be a nutjob.
It's a commonplace to intuit that questions have no "truth value"--they don't have a claim on the truth. They don't assert a claim. "It's just a question."
"So, Mr. President, do you still beat your wife?"
The idea that questions are just harmless questions without some kind of embedded claim is straitjacketed early 20th century logic in which humans were automatons. It shows a fake (or stunning ignorant) understanding of how human brains work. We assume that many kinds of questions suppose relevance, some underlying claim taken to be true. Depending on the question, this claim can be easily denied with a yes/no response or it might need a long-winded one. The two goofball questions I wrote above require longer responses. They're inflammatory because they seem to suppose relevance and there's some claim that listeners assume the asker thinks is true. It takes a sentence or two to peel back to the underlying presupposition, the underlying claim. The very fact that they provoke a certain level of outrage is sufficient to show that it's not "just someone asking a question."
The problem is that in understanding a question with an embedded presupposition the listener must assume the presupposition is true. In studies it's been shown that later the rejection of the presupposition might be remembered. It's also possible for the assumption that the presupposition is true to be remembered. The more you challenge the question, think through to the underlying presupposition and consciously deny it, the less likely that is. Most people don't do that. So in asking the question, you wind up getting a certain percentage of people, a month later, to think that you actually made a claim that, for whatever reason, they believed was true.
It's a great rhetorical technique. It's really good for propaganda and advertising, esp. if you don't let the listener have a chance to think through and deny the presupposition. Politicians love asking that kind of question and then quickly moving on to answer it themselves or changing the subject, denying listeners "think time". It's psychological manipulation at its rawest. It's demagoguery at its vilest.
Neutrally phrased questions with no special intonation like "Is Barack Obama President of the United States?" are closer to being truth-neutral. It's hard to not put non-neutral emphasis on obvious questions.
Welcome to a rudimentary psycholinguistic, research-based, data-driven view of questions.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)It's not that deep. People do not trust the police. They kill nearly 500 Americans every year. France's PD kills 0 of its citizens.
So people are suspicious of American police. They have a reputation for brutality, against unarmed people.
They have been take aback at the growing protests against the killing of unarmed citizens, including children.
They are used to getting away with their crimes. So these protests have scared them, caused great anger among their ranks, we've seen that anger displayed, stupidly, on their web sites.
So when a tragedy like this happens, and THEY immediately claim they are 'going to WAR' and totally blame the NYC Mayor for everything, AND the peaceful protesters, it all seems, ODD to say the least.
A terrible tragedy occurred. Period. But not to them, it is being USED by the Police to try to stop the protests.
Something is fishy about that. So people ARE asking questions. We know they lie, they've been caught lying and cheating so often, it's a given.
So, the OP merely put into words what a whole lot of people are wondering.
Of course no one can say one way or the other.
But fair is fair. THEY are blaming perfectly innocent protesters for the tragic deaths of two police officers.
Now people are 'wondering' out loud if maybe THEY might have something to do with it.
See how that works? When you have bad policing, you create a suspicious, untrusting population.
It's bad all around. Which means, the protests must no stop, the distrust that causes the questions PROVES that we have a very big problem with our PDs.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
cwydro
(51,308 posts)This was a silly post.
Come on now.
Horse with no Name
(34,005 posts)It was a legit question...no way we have the entire story in a nice neat package hours after the crime.
Regardless, she didn't deserve the pile on. It was just a question.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Look back.
Maybe three were actual "pile-on" posts.
The rest were disagreements.
I reckon she can handle it.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)No one is saying anything about Sandy Hook, they're just asking questions. 'Cuz, you know, like we haven't ever used patsies.
Questions, indeed; just not the one's you're hoping for.
Judi Lynn
(162,032 posts)Democrats are not racists, as Democrats know.
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)What does racism have to do with it?
pintobean
(18,101 posts)malaise
(275,661 posts)never question anything.
But it is convenient and I will ask questions. Watch everyone who's crawling out of various holes. Nothing they say changes the video with the murder of Eric Garner -that was not Al Sharpton, the Mayor or the protesters.
They intend to silence the protesters with this.
I'm tough - it's water on a duck's back
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)By willfully murdered two police officers. And who is this mysterious "they"? Maybe the NYPD themselves? Got any theories?
malaise
(275,661 posts)I'll take Mediaite over most of you any day of the week.
I'll wait for evidence. I have never been part of the sheeple.
NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)be it will be used to tell YOU that the problem is NOT cops shooting black people.
count on it
malaise
(275,661 posts)It's Obama's fault, the Mayor's fault and the 'fault.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Not all of them of course, but way more than enough.
They have tried to silence protesters, not just those who are protesting the murders by police, but other peaceful protesters also.
People don't trust them. That's THEIR problem.
This is a tragedy, and should be treated as such. For the sake of the families.
However, the NYPD wants to USE it to try to end the protests against THEIR criminal actions.
Why would they want to do that? If they cared about the officers who were killed?
nilesobek
(1,423 posts)I would suggest borrowing it but I might just steal it. I have a favorite, "I'm that pebble in your shoe."
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Oh, I having lots of questions.
Probably not the ones you're counting on.
onecaliberal
(35,151 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)I assume you were there at the scene?
Cuz otherwise, this statement if yours is full of shit.
"they appear to have been shot by a marksman"
SomethingFishy
(4,876 posts)But it's good to see you back (Pssst.. I used to be Walldude)
And yeah Devolution seems to be par for the course here over the past couple years, I drop by every few days to see what some of the old hands are up to, but I don't stay long as it just pisses me off... This thread turned into a mess real quick...
Skittles
(157,118 posts)nothing special in America
Horse with no Name
(34,005 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)malaise
(275,661 posts)KMOD
(7,906 posts)He probably took her phone after shooting her.
Perhaps he posted on her facebook account, too?
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Just stop it.
Who do you think killed them? Great conspiracy person that you are? Tell us.
I still remember you and nadin saying that the government had ships of dead folks offshore during a hurricane that did not produce the number of casualties that you would have liked.
Remember that? I do. More utter conspiracy nonsense.
Goodness gracious. Stop it. Or tell us who killed the cops, since you do not believe the official story.
Trashing this thread now.
How sad to be someone who can ignore such a horrid act - instead, using it to make into a story of your own.
For real?
I'd love to read that if you have a link.
linuxman
(2,337 posts)GGJohn
(9,951 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)Go Vols
(5,902 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)KingCharlemagne
(7,908 posts)And none of what you hear
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hajBdDM2qdg
DesertDiamond
(1,616 posts)the bad ones. That made me wonder, because I know now that those who want to divide and conquer us will stop at nothing. What better way to fan the flames than to make it look like the good cops are getting killed?
Quantess
(27,630 posts)That or the CIA!
99Forever
(14,524 posts)The entire situation seems almost designed to discredit any questioning of bad policing.
First appearances can be deceiving.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)But no shit it looks "designed"!
And it's disgusting that so many are attacking malaise for simply asking a question.
spanone
(137,286 posts)Throd
(7,208 posts)Dr. Strange
(25,986 posts)Although, ironically, promoting that kind of nonsense gets hidden automatically.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)ccording to witnesses, Brinsley walked out of a home with a gun in his hand at 2.47pm, crept up behind the officers' patrol car, and systematically shot both men in the head through the passenger window.
He then walked to the Myrtle/Willoughby G train subway station where he shot himself in the head.
It came two hours after he posted a picture of a gun on Instagram with the chilling message: 'I'm Putting Wings On Pigs Today. They Take 1 Of Ours... Let's Take 2 of Theirs #ShootThePolice #RIPErivGardner (sic) #RIPMikeBrown. This May Be My Final Post. I'm Putting Pigs In A Blanket.'
Tragically, Baltimore police had tried to apprehend Brinsley by alerting the NYPD after his morning shooting - but by the time a wanted flyer was issued, his attack was already under way.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2882105/Two-New-York-police-officers-shot-Brooklyn.html#ixzz3MVKMklyz
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
liberalmuse
(18,838 posts)Fucking people think that killing innocents is going to absolve an injustice, not realizing it only makes them so much worse than the perpetrators of the original injustice. Such is terrorism - killing innocent people while stupidly believing that this will somehow right a wrong. Fuck people like this.
840high
(17,196 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)liberalmuse
(18,838 posts)Yet another mentally ill person who was able to access a firearm much more easily (and inexpensively) than obtaining help for his mental issues. THANK YOU, REAGAN! 'Cause, let's face it, when you trace a lot of the preventable and senseless fuckery of the past 40 years, it seems to lead right back to him and the GOP, who don't really give a shit about most people, but they sure like to holler about how it's the liberal's fault when shit they're responsible for eventually hits the fan.
Drunken Irishman
(34,857 posts)nichomachus
(12,754 posts)The PTB have an endless supply of them.
JFK
Malcom X
RFK
MLK
Reagan
And on and on.
maced666
(771 posts)Maybe....
NewDeal_Dem
(1,049 posts)The killing seemed to drive the wedge between Mr. de Blasio and rank-and-file officers even deeper. Video posted online showed dozens of officers turning their backs to the mayor as he walked into anews conference on Saturday night.
Theres blood on many hands tonight those that incited violence on the street under the guise of protests, that tried to tear down what New York City police officers did every day," the head of the Patrolmens Benevolent Association, Patrick Lynch, said outside Woodhull Hospital. He added, That blood on the hands starts on the steps of City Hall, in the office of the mayor.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/21/nyregion/two-police-officers-shot-in-their-patrol-car-in-brooklyn.html
I agree, it looks very neat.
ileus
(15,396 posts)JustAnotherGen
(33,058 posts)Last known address Georgia.
He shot/wounded an ex girlfriend in Baltimore first.
He used a Taurus firearm (pistol).
He had a long record - and STILL - he had a gun.
RandiFan1290
(6,338 posts)for pissing off all the right people!
So entertaining to watch them throw their temper tantrum. The kicking and screaming! The crying and gnashing!
Gold, Malaise! Gold!
NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)FarPoint
(13,357 posts)The thoughts arise in many of us, to be suspicious, to question the origin. And no, we definitely do not trust law enforcement. I think healthy discussion is reasonable.
shaayecanaan
(6,068 posts)Is the NYPD false flag killing its own officers in order to deflect some of the bad press they've been receiving lately?
Next week on "Reasonable Questions": the Reichstag fire. Could the NYPD have been responsible?
FarPoint
(13,357 posts)Analysis is essential in effort to move forward.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)and gotten away with it?
Let's see, why yes, they have. Who would think that in a civilized society the civilian police could rack up all those dead citizens?
Next week on 'Reasonable Questions': The invasion of a sovereign nation, the killing of one million of citizens, torture, ransacking of its natural resources. Could the US be responsible?
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)UglyGreed
(7,661 posts)when we live in such corrupt times. When those who are murdered are considered by some as useless and not worthy of life or their mourners are ridiculed and not allowed to grieve in peace.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Lee-Lee
(6,324 posts)Rhetoric like "all cops are racist pigs" "cops are all guilty because they don't speak up enough" "they are all thugs with badges", etc.
When you foment hate with that extreme rhetoric, you inspire some who are unbalanced to take it too far.
Its the EXACT same thing as the teabaggers after some indictment of terrorism saying "all Muslims are terrorists" "all Muslims are guilty because they don't speak up enough" "all Muslims are evil".
And we speak out against that kind of blanket hate because it is wrong and, just like in this case, it pushes some unhinged people over the edge to violence.
If you are using against cops the exact same kind of rhetoric you denounce as irresponsible against other groups, you are part of the problem that created this. The same way all those who call all Muslims terrorists bear some blame when some nutjob attacks an innocent Muslim.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)I have heard them demand justice, demand that cops stop murdering people and demand that they stop using miltary tanks and other weapons to combat protesters.
It's NOT the same. And the fact is cops are getting aay with their crimes and with what they do to people. Look at that little toddler who had a flash grenade thrown at him or the 7-year-old child shot in her own bed during a raid.
When people see justice, when they see that the cops who harmed these kids don't get away with it, they have faith in cops.
When cops get away with killing a 12-year-old with a toy gun or choking a man to death over cigarettes and there is no accounting, people very rightly get very angry.
Even of nobody protested; even if nobody said anything publicly, do you think all the people in the US who have been abused, had family members killed, had their money stolen all by cops, do you think those people only feel pain or get angry when protesters point it out?
Do you think maybe a lot of people have been suffering in silence for YEARS out of fear? Do you think if we just sweep all of the cop corruption under the rug, that nobody will be angry with cops? You live in a dream world if you think that.
This man was a nut most likely, who just went out of his head. He wasn't motivated by anything protesters did or said. He was motivated by his own anger and prejudice and inability to cope with either.
kelly1mm
(5,007 posts)we want them? Now!"?
Here is a link:
Brickbat
(19,339 posts)sibelian
(7,804 posts)mrdmk
(2,943 posts)Why this person killed these police officers will be exploited by persons with extreme views and objectives.
muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)and mean that, when we say "look at the loony RW conspiracy theorists" for something else, people will say "yeah, well, you post on a board that had 33 recs for a wing-nut conspiracy theory saying the cops were shot by a marksman, and it looked too neat".
33 recs.
Threads like this make DU suck.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)By doing it, you are suggesting that it could be reality. That the witnesses who saw it are all in on the conspiracy, and that some 'marksman' somewhere did it instead. That the witnesses who saw the guy run into the subway and shoot himself are also all liars in the pay of the unknown people for whom you think that this is 'neat'.
There is such a thing as a dumb question, and the OP is an example.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)But the truth is that freedom of thought and expression ( within the TOS of course ) is not what "makes DU suck".
It is posts which try to shut people up and belittle them, and tell them they need "tinfoil hats", like a poster above, or curse the OP , like another did upthread.
We are different people, with different backgrounds and different life experiences. We should be able to ask questions and pose doubt, within the terms of service and community standards.
I do not know what happened. But the police have lied and forged reports so many times, not just here in the US, but all over the world. Why should they be allowed to forge reality and get away with it, yet, by some here, the OP shouldn't ask any questions 're what happened?
She didn't violate the TOS, or community standards. Yet other DUrs think it's ok to belittle her and even curse her out ( see the hidden post). That is what "makes DU suck"; not expressing doubts about the official story of an event no one here participated in.
muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)They were there interviewing people. How big a conspiracy do you think it's worth saying "I'm only asking a question" about? Are the people who ask "was it holograms and not airplanes that 'crashed' into the WTC?" "only asking a question"?
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Allow me to respectfully ask you WHY are you tying me ( or the OP) with the WTC conspiracies?? Have either of us posted anything about that? I at least, I have not.
You're trying to establish a pattern, where there is none.
The OP is not what "makes DU suck", this kind of accusations are though, if anything.
muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)in favour of some huge conspiracy theory that some group of people want people killed to 'look neat'.
Yes, there is a pattern of paranoid conspiracy theory in the USA. DU is sadly part of that. The OP is an example.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)They do not.
Which gives room for questions and doubt.
Again, it is not true that "DU sucks" because someone asks a question.
muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)and not a 'marksman'? That they saw the guy run into the subway? That an armed man with the same description shot himself in the subway?
What's to question? Bullshit about a 'marksman' is on the level of 'hologram'.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)I am asking you again, what did I or the OP out had to do with WTC ???
Response to darkangel218 (Reply #150)
Post removed
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Certainly not me or the OP.
Quote marks are for quoting, not emphasizing something you want to emphasize.
Please use them accordingly.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Their hidden posts in this thread speak volumes for how much they hate free speech imo. DU1 and DU2 were great for open expression of ideas...DU3 not even close.
malaise
(275,661 posts)I always ask questions - I don't care who is upset by them.
NoJusticeNoPeace
(5,018 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)I'm not laughing about what the OP sets forth at all. What I think some may take more pleasure in THEIR reaction here when reading is how certain internet boards cannibalize each other's discussion.
Your aim is to end discussion because it rates right up there as a laughing stock. But, you have no basis for that. It's your homemade petard in an otherwise discussion. Well, that's okay for you, but
geez...
That didn't work very well, as evidenced by the reasons within this very thread set forth.
You might be into the "recs" = external validation of reality. Well, good luck with that.
muriel_volestrangler
(102,141 posts)There has been no 'reason' set forth in this thread that gives any decent excuse for putting forth bollocks like "a marksman did it". It's complete rubbish. Everyone, apart from, apparently, 34 (when I last looked) DUers knows who did it. That some marksman killed the officers is as foolish a theory as Bush using HAARP to cause the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami.
"I'm only asking" is a slimy attempt to weasel out of something that is normally derided on DU. If a newbie came up with this crap, they'd run the risk of MIRT banning them as an obvious parody.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)What is the point of being moved in this discussion over what the Garner family is wondering, or what an Al Sharpton says?
I look at the probability that a non-marksman -v- a marksman did it, and will find one news source that sides with marksman already here.
To then discuss the "why" in this crime is not a foolish consideration, or do you think it must be? To use logical fallacy to support the foolishness is an even less thoughtful response. "something that is normally derided on DU" by a newbie? I don't recall being derided when I was.
You are clearly moved by how comment invites scorn. Do you actually fear MIRT for linking civil unrest and exacerbation of the tension associated with a police state in this country as a result of these crimes? The day that this is the DU rule is the day I say, "buh-bye".
Your comment, "they'd run the risk of MIRT banning them" seems to motivate your opinion in an otherwise discussion. If MIRT thought my discussion on this board was yelling, "fire!", I think they'll not waste time in saying so.
Meanwhile, I'd recommend a cool grip on logic with fear, as they are meant to be mutually exclusive.
Warpy
(112,838 posts)It could, of course, be true, stranger things than this have been proven to be true.
However, the package is tied up just a little too neatly for me.
We live in a time when cynicism is vital.
melman
(7,681 posts)Warpy
(112,838 posts)because the shooter took his own life right in the middle of the carnage he caused.
malaise
(275,661 posts)Just ask the war criminal of a Dick
Marr
(20,317 posts)repeated media description of the shooting as an "execution style" killing. As I understand it, an execution style murder is one where the victim(s) are already under the physical control of the assailant.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,988 posts)darkangel218
(13,985 posts)notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)then yes, it was way to convenient.
chrisa
(4,524 posts)It's not out of the ordinary for someone to shoot two people in the head when they have both the element of surprise and targets at a short distance.
Plus, the hole in this being a conspiracy of some sort is that the guy killed his girlfriend before he killed the cops. He was obviously crazy and just wanted to go out in style.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)Just your interpretation of presented "facts".
OP is allowed to ask questions.
chrisa
(4,524 posts)See this article from the NY Post: http://nypost.com/2014/12/20/2-nypd-cops-shot-execution-style-in-brooklyn/
He didn't need to be a good shot at all. Plus, his girlfriend was also killed by him.
It's not that the OP isn't allowed to ask questions. It's that this case is pretty straightforward from the evidence and probably not a conspiracy.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)she's in critical, but stable condition, other than that, you're spot on.
chrisa
(4,524 posts)Skittles
(157,118 posts)someone "talked him into it"
gawd
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Would be nice if the OP would explain how it appears they were shot by "marksmen".
Skittles
(157,118 posts)point-blank = expert marksmen
yes INDEED
zappaman
(20,607 posts)who know a murder by "expert marksmen" when they see...er...read about it on the internet.
wingzeroday
(189 posts)That Ismaaiyl Brinsley shot and wounded his ex girlfriend and then shot and killed these two officers.
Who did you think did it? If it wasn't him there is a dangerous killer on the loose that needs to be brought to justice.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)The OP was just asking questions and speculating out loud.
Lots of things aren't as they first appear.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)It was not a statement, but a followup to explain the question.
Nowhere does the OP state any belief one way or the other. In fact, she closes by saying she is skeptical of everything.
In this day and age, NOT being skeptical is the real fool's game. You have to be sort of thick headed or naive to not question EVERYTHING.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Keep trying.
"They appear to have been shot by a marksman"
Says who?
Oh right, the OP, who I assume must have been at the scene to make that particular statement.
Response to zappaman (Reply #181)
Post removed
zappaman
(20,607 posts)I just find ludicrous speculations like the OP or those that think Sandy Hook was a false flag deserve scorn and ridicule.
You can support them all you want.
Poor dear.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)nowhere did the OP claim the officers didn't die.
The Sandy Hook denier goons claim no kids were killed at all.
There is a significant difference. if you can't see that, that is your problem.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)They're just "asking questions" and making "observations".
Maybe you can clarify the difference, sweetie.
malaise
(275,661 posts)Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)My god, the trauma you have unleashed today!
I hope Santa brings you EVERYTHING you want.
malaise
(275,661 posts)ask questions .
Hope all your dreams come true
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops."
Perhaps you can tell us how you know "they appear to have been shot by a marksman"?
But, don't worry about me since I won't be holding my breath for an answer.
AuntPatsy
(9,904 posts)Asking questions is always a good thing.
Which is why I did so.
VScott
(774 posts)Does Kim Jung-Un have an alibi?
I mean why not?
Makes as about much sense and just as plausible as the OP's suggestion.
Matrosov
(1,098 posts)Not everything is as it appears to be at first sight. This may have been just a case of someone erroneously thinking that their killing innocent officers is justified by officers killing innocents like Michael Brown and Eric Garner. This may have been more. Just because right-wingers like to think every shooting is a false flag operation meant to persuade the people to get rid of their precious guns does not mean there are never any crimes staged for propaganda purposes. It's important to always keep an open mind.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)However, linking it to the need for gun control is not.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Still waiting to find out how you came to this conclusion.
Response to malaise (Original post)
Post removed
Boreal
(725 posts)should always be PROVE IT and to question everything.
There is no evidence the accused dead guy did this. There is also no evidence that he shot himself in the head. There is no proof that someone else didn't create those Instigram and Facebook pages.
Who benefits from these cops being shot? The police state. It creates a demand for law and order and bolsters the fiction that cops are innocent heroes sacrificing their lives for our "safety". How do we know that some unknown entities didn't order a hit on some random cops in order to achieve exactly what's happening? We don't.
Did people on DU automatically believe that Mike Brown reached inside that cop car in Ferguson? Why do they automatically believe this story?
Good post, malaise.
Throd
(7,208 posts)To suggest that the NYPD is killing its own for political gain is just fucking dumb.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Says the OP who won't tell us how they arrived at this conclusion.
Boreal
(725 posts)so don't put words in my mouth, m'kay?
You aren't going to shut down honest and valid questions by saying they are "crackpot", either. Nice try, though.
Now, PROVE this guy from Georgia shot those cops and then killed himself.
Throd
(7,208 posts)Let's wait a few days and see where this goes. If these two cops turn out to have been shot by an expert marksman, well, I owe you a Coke
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Otherwise?
Who shot those cops? Where is the evidence that the accused did it? Where is the evidence he's the one who shot himself? Accusations and assertions are not evidence, btw.
Pretty fundamental and reasonable questions to want answered when three people are dead.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Hint: pick up a fucking paper and read the first hand accounts.
branford
(4,462 posts)These unfounded conspiracy posts do not help Democrats.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)access to actual evidence, it would be appreciated, thank you.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Skittles
(157,118 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)police brutality. That is reprehensible. It was a terrible tragedy, as was the killing of Michael Brown and all the other African Americans, including even children, killed by cops.
One has nothing to do with the other, so why are they using a tragedy to try to silence legitimate protests against the killing of unarmed citizens?
IF they cared about those two police officers they would definitely not be trying to connect the tragedy to people exercising their constitutional rights.
The very fact that people are questioning the evidence demonstrates how bad the relationship is between the cops and the people. How little the people trust them. That is THEIR fault.
I am asking questions. Which is different to speculating. Speculating would mean providing an alternative to what we have been told.
And maybe if they did not declare WAR on the NYC Mayor and whoever else they are declaring war against, people would not be wondering why they are so cynically using the deaths of two human beings for their own purposes.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)but to suggest they killed their own for this advantage is vile too
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)cause is vile enough. And if they can be that vile, is it any wonder that people are going to question the reasons why?
If they can be vile enough to kill unarmed citizens, to target minorities for harassment, to lie to get convictions of minorities. They allowed Frank Serpico to be shot because he didn't want to participate in their corruption. He was one of their own.
As things appear right now, those cops were murdered by a lunatic.
And unless they stop trying to use that tragedy to silence those who are protesting the murders of other, just as valuable, just as loved, unarmed, citizens, they can expect that people WILL question their motives.
I will not blame anyone who is suspicious of them. They earned that suspicion.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)CORRECT
you accuse others of fanning flames, then do it yourself
NOTHING GETS SOLVED
police brutality is wrong, and peacful protests are right, but blaming this nutcase on the protests is WRONG and blaming the Brooklyn deaths on the police is WRONG
JUST STOP
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)And what do you mean by this? 'JUST STOP"! Stop what? You can find cop sites all over the internet. Go sign up and tell THEM to JUST STOP!
I am stating and will continue to do so, that, when the NYPD points at Mayor de Blasio AND the protesters and states that 'there is blood on many hands' THAT IS VILE!
Any reaction they get to that is DESERVED.
And do not issue orders to me. You may do as you please, without any orders from me, and regardless of your orders, so will I.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)yes indeed
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)diminished and the lying NYPD try to connect to them to two tragic deaths.
We KNOW they are decent people. Not sure why you needed to reiterate what is known. And that is all the more reason why what is being done to them is so contemptible.
It's no hard to rise above the gutter and I am glad to see so many people coming out and supporting them and refusing to fall for the devious, deceptive par for the course actions of the NYPD.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)this is fucking pointless
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)any lectures about these issues.
Many have had their own experiences with these cops. And you expect people to do what? 'Just Stop'!! Stop what? Stop reacting to the latest outrage by the NYPD? Their attack on a good Mayor, their disrespect for the office, their egregious attempt to BLAME the people who are victims of their abuse?
I haven't heard any of the 'good cops' speak to their leaders and as them to stop. They are out of line to say the least, and we are supposed to act like sheep? No, they need to hear from people who are not blind to what they are doing.
And what they are doing is despicable, contemptible and vile.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)What an insufferable PHONY.
You don't give a rat's ass about these people, not one WHIT. The only thing you seem to care about is playing some kind of bizarre gotcha game up and down this thread. It's almost like some kind of manic behavior. Who the hell do you think you are to tell ANYBODY on this board:
unarmed African Americans by the Police. Thanks, I like to know where people stand on the issues.
This is just fucking stupid. And I've seen you do this very thing too many times to count, as if it's some kind of brilliant Perry fucking Mason moment. It's not.
I've seen enough of your self-righteous, condescending, phony, game-playing, rambling nonsense. You have the self-awareness of a doorknob, and your sorry ass is finally going straight to ignore the minute I hit POST.
Like I said upthread, I cannot stand your brand of snide dishonesty, and sometimes taking a hide is just worth it. This is one of those times.
Take your putrid faux concern and shove it.
NOW we're done here.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)It must be obvious by now, that the people whose opinions matter to me are in the majority here on DU, thankfully.
The rest get all the respect they deserve.
We were 'done' a long time ago.
Read your own post again and consider it addressed to yourself.
branford
(4,462 posts)He was probably hiding behind a grassy knoll . . .
Prove there wasn't . . .
Rex
(65,616 posts)seems to have caused a few potty mouths to end up flagged for review (tsk tsk).
K&R for indirectly causing some of the worst to now be in time out land!
Can you believe people here claim to be liberal, but hate it that you have the right to free speech?
Ya me either.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Perhaps you could help her out?
Rex
(65,616 posts)Why did he run into a subway if he was going to kill himself anyway? Why not do it right there after killing the cops? Why make it look like you are attempting to flee? Why even flee?
Yeah...simple questions I know, that horrible free speech stuff.
Throd
(7,208 posts)I didn't know there was protocol to be adhered to when killing cops and then offing yourself.
Rex
(65,616 posts)On DU, we are allowed to discuss issues ranging from speculation to debating facts from different sources.
Free speech seems to cause a lot of ruffled feathers, strange but true.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)And Malaise danced around the edges of suggesting this was a conspiracy. She apparently didn't have the guts to outright suggest what she was thinking.
And in your above post you suggest there is something odd about the guy who executed those cops running into a subway and then offing himself. Otherwise, why question the facts.
This is the leftwing equivalent of the Sandy Hook denier conspiracy kooks.
That's why it has created a reaction amongst us SANE liberals.
Rex
(65,616 posts)And DU has always had people speculating in GD since it began, seriously nice try. Take it up with the OP, you all crying in fake outrage really are sad/amusing.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)asking what many people have been asking. And it's no CT to understand how reviled our Civilian PDs have become which the reason for people questioning anything that emanates from them. Especially when they jump on it and attempt to use for their own benefit.
If they had simply treated this tragedy for what it was, a terrible tragedy, like the killing of Michael Brown was a terrible tragedy no one would be wondering why they jumped on it so quickly and so inappropriately to place the blame for those horrific killings directly on Mayor De Blasio and the Protesters.
Now THAT is a CT. I am sure you will have to agree.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)As to what a psycho decided to do.
BTW, "they appear to have been shot by a marksmen" is not a question.
Rex
(65,616 posts)They appear to have been killed by a psycho is as far as I will go. Maybe the OP will respond to you, but you asked me so I just gave you a few easy questions to speculate on.
Why would you ever believe you will know every single answer? We will never know why JFK was assassinated. We will probably never know why 9/11 wasn't prevented. Just the big questions being answered, would be nice for a change.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Skinner could say that the word 'christian' or 'muslim' or 'blue' or 'liberal'- is forbidden, and you'd have no recourse but to live with it, regardless of 'freedom of expression' or 'freedom of speech'.
Now if this were a government owned & ran forum, then you might have a point.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Which does mean speculation like in the OP, sorry but thems the breaks.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)I swear, too many folks have forgotten their 10th grade civics/govt classes.
Rex
(65,616 posts)And I still stand by my claim that some here loath the idea of others expressing diverse ideas.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)getting called out for BS is.....well, FREE SPEECH
Rex
(65,616 posts)Just like all the idiots that cried about LIHOP and MIHOP, they just couldn't handle some other observation.
I have no more idea what happened to those three people than you do. I could really care less if the OP speculates it was green men from Mars. It really won't change jack shit either way.
AND it is about the LAST thing on DU that makes it suck. There is so much more ahead of speculation imo.
Skittles
(157,118 posts)just because you can doesn't you won't be called out for it
Rex
(65,616 posts)That free speech stuff.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"Free speech" is according to the guy or guys that started it.
Might be time to put that canard to rest.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Yeah DU free speech...what you gonna do? Fuming about something never helps.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Unlike others in this thread, you aren't making shit up.
Just don't think "free speech" applies to this site.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I have no idea what happened, but getting out of sorts over this won't make any difference. I call it speculation, you call it something else down thread. The OP won't answer you, I see that.
Just no need to get upset, I see skittles getting pissed. I understand, I have no idea what marksmen means here. I would say more like madman with a firearm. However, you know I can speculate on just about anything. So when you ask me, I'll give you all kinds of questions of what if.
As far as facts go, I read he was involved with a prison gang that threatened to kill cops. I didn't notice if that was even brought up to the OP.
We do have some free speech here, thankfully. Otherwise this thread would be all mod deletes like on DU2.
Like I said up thread, I will call it DU free speech.
flvegan
(64,526 posts)I don't know about that, but until video surfaces with undeniable proof, no we don't actually know who killed them. However, all signs seem to point towards the alleged crim. Currently, the news is suggesting that he bragged to a couple folks right before doing it.
Throd
(7,208 posts)Show me the proof it wasn't an accident.
flvegan
(64,526 posts)Throd
(7,208 posts)The one that shot Dale was extra skilled, him zooming at 200mph and all.
seveneyes
(4,631 posts)That is a very good question, and much less a statement of "fact".
I, myself, believe that we mostly all are free to follow that which we believe to be true. Truth is a tangible yet elusive fact of life. Emotion tends to lead most humans to their acts and beliefs. The ability to accept facts as we understand them can lead to individual bias.
Someone famous once said "the truth will set you free". Truth is a nested routine in honesty.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Skittles
(157,118 posts)the suspect has been positively identified - do you think someone orchestrated this? PLEASE STOP WITH THIS NONSENSE.
AuntPatsy
(9,904 posts)zappaman
(20,607 posts)Perhaps you can say why "It's very neat and convenient - they appear to have been shot by a marksman - two minority cops shot in the head at the same time reforms are demanded and the killer came all the way from Baltimore and just happened to write a farewell note that includes a threat to cops" makes sense.
Why do you think they appeared "To be shot by marksmen".
AuntPatsy
(9,904 posts)will be the end result..., considering recent headlining news echoes of ongoing police brutality gaining an obvious slow rise of outrage from the people at such tactics, how convent it would be to become the aggressor instead of the hunted which makes it harder to stay out in the open..
Nothing new here really by law enforcement with regard to over zealous and deadly forces being the norm for far too many but what is obviously different is the attention such tactics are finally garnering....
zappaman
(20,607 posts)hexola
(4,835 posts)That made me wonder a bit...
malaise
(275,661 posts)and there's nothing wrong with wondering.
zappaman
(20,607 posts)"they appear to have been shot by a marksman"
Says who?
And can you tell us how you examined the crime scene to make that determination?
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Still waiting to find out how you came to this conclusion.
My guess is you're just talking out your ass since you have not examined the scene and even if you did, you have no expertise in crime scenes.
But hey , keep making shit up! AmIright?
Skittles
(157,118 posts)I kid you not
zappaman
(20,607 posts)Just "asking questions" don't cha know...
Or just making shit up.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025986650#post63
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,988 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)But it is not a sin to question.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)I really only care about some unarmed civilian getting wasted by cops.