General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDid the emergence of Elvis Presley in the 1950s help or hinder progress of African
Americans?
Elvis' music owed more to black gospel and R & B than it did to country, western swing or hillbilly boogie in my opinion. And his flashy style of dress and the swagger with which he carried himself was a reflection of the hip blacks that he admired. (and of course the white rockabillies copied E)
Was Elvis flattering black people with his imitation or was he ripping them off?
IMO, Elvis was very sincere about his music and his style in the 1950s. It's possible that he was flattering black people with his imitation AND ripping them off, though unintentionally. But I believe that Elvis' immense popularity only helped open the door for other rock-n-rollers.
I think that Elvis got his penchant for over-the-top jewelry and big, fancy tricked out Caddys and Rolls from black people too. But black hip hop artists have appropriated that right back!
There is no doubt that Elvis would not have ever happened without black people. So what does this all mean as it relates to cultural appropriation?
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Sheldon Cooper
(3,724 posts)
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)I'll wait for an answer to your question and mine, too.
Jetboy
(792 posts)Is BLING BLING not hip hop these days?
Elvis loved great big Caddilacs and Rolls Royce cars. Are hip hop artists suddenly not interested in those anymore? Escalade is a Caddy, right!?
And Elvis DID cop even those ideas from blacks. Wynonie Harris loved Caddilacs so Elvis loved Caddilacs too. Not sure about the bling but it's no secret that Elvis, MR T and rappers enjoy rocking the BLING BLING.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)Now you say that Elvis and hip hop artists like all that. We are questioning your claim that Elvis got his love for those from blacks.
My gram !oved Caddys, before Elvis was around. Correlation does not mean causation.
Jetboy
(792 posts)early 50s.
If I'm wrong which I may well be, then Elvis developed those tastes all on his own.
MrScorpio
(73,772 posts)It first needed to be presented with a white face?
Jetboy
(792 posts)Black music from the first half of the 20th century need only to be heard to be accepted. I do think that Elvis helped in getting that music heard by the masses.
MrScorpio
(73,772 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)had Elvis stayed a truck driver?
Would rock-n-roll have been a sensation? It's true that Bill Haley and Fats Domino recorded before Elvis. (not to mention all of the jump blues artists) Rock-n-roll would've happened without Elvis. But would the lack of Elvis been good or bad for black artists? Maybe they would've burst through and became much bigger stars without Elvis to hog the spotlight. Maybe rock-n-roll would've been a blip instead of a BANG. I don't know how we could ever know something like that.
MrScorpio
(73,772 posts)As he made all of that fortune and fame off of black music.
I think that you understand my sense on this matter.
Jetboy
(792 posts)deserved to make as much or more than Elvis back in the 1950s. I rate Little Richard above Elvis for one. I don't blame them for feeling ripped off but who was responsible? Elvis?
Not in my opinion. The fact is that very few 1950s rock-n-rollers made much money beyond the well known headliners. And even they got ripped off some. Johnny Maestro of the Crests claimed to have gotten a check for $17 for royalties for one of their recordings. He said that out of his peers, he was one of the few to get ANYTHING.
'A lot of people seem to think I started this business', Elvis told Jet. 'But rock n roll was here a long time before I came along'. 'Nobody can sing that kind of music like colored people'.
'Let's face it: I can't sing like Fats Domino can. I know that'.
Elvis always gave credit to his black influences.
MrScorpio
(73,772 posts)I'm just wondering where the justification in it is.
You know that cultural appropriation is outright theft, right?
Jetboy
(792 posts)And I do appreciate you for addressing the topic at hand. I was curious about cultural appropriation and specifically wondered DUers opinions regarding Elvis.
Elvis borrowed heavily from blacks to come up with his music and style. I have not seen anyone anywhere argue against that premise.
But who's fault is it? Elvis played the music that moved him and dressed the way that suited him. He was a poor white boy from the South who admired black culture. Should he have rejected the music that made his heart race or the style that suited him?
How could Elvis have righted this wrong? Why should it be up to him and not the record industry?
I wish we could go back and fund the great talents that didn't make it big, name Little Richard the King of Rock-n-roll and while we're at it, eliminate segregation of that era too. But we can't do any of that.
I like to try and come up with a solution to a problem. I don't know if there is one in this case.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley
To do black music so selfishly
And used it to get myself wealthy
There's a concept that works
Twenty million other white rappers emerge
But no matter how many fish in the sea
It'll be so empty, without me
Read more: Eminem - Without Me Lyrics | MetroLyrics
erpowers
(9,445 posts)It is not just rappers who wear expensive jewelry and drive Cadillacs and Rolls Royces. There are many white people who drive Cadillac Escalades and Rolls Royces. Most likely rappers like Cadillacs because they have always been seen as a sign of success.
Jetboy
(792 posts)We're talking the uber rich though.
I think that Cadillacs have been a sign of success to a lot of different musicians, dating back to when they were first produced.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)
CatWoman
(80,290 posts)John Gotti was black?
Sheldon Cooper
(3,724 posts)The things you learn on this website...
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)think it means? I'd be interested to see if you have an opinion about this, yourself.
Jetboy
(792 posts)elements of music and style that he liked into his act. He presented this style to the public and they went crazy.
He was a poor white boy from the South who had an affinity for black music and style. Black artists sold a whole lot more records after Elvis broke than before. It could only have had a positive impact on race relations when white teenagers started buying records by black artists and vice versa.
Admittedly, I am a big Elvis fan (but a bigger Little Richard fan) but I am truly curious about others' opinions.
malaise
(296,101 posts)religious and royal folks and get back to me about gawdy jewelry - maybe you might check out the British royals as well.
FFS!
http://www.vice.com/read/your-corpse-will-never-look-this-good
Jetboy
(792 posts)hip hop artists today, Mr T a while back and Elvis before he died.
You really have to 'dig' to find that lol!
malaise
(296,101 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)no?
Guess I won't quit my job to become a comedian.
CatWoman
(80,290 posts)
Jetboy
(792 posts)Wait a minute, it's me we're laughing at!
CatWoman
(80,290 posts)you thought Fly Guy was real, didn't you?
malaise
(296,101 posts) 
Earth_First
(14,910 posts)
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)Where you alive in the 50's.
Maybe you should read a biography of Elvis before you make stuff up 60 yrs after the fact.
Go watch the movie "Cadilac Records"
You might learn something,
Jetboy
(792 posts)I've actually done a lot of research on Elvis specifically in regards to race.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)Did Elvis pay royalty or did he "appropriate" that song?
Jetboy
(792 posts)I would imagine that it falls under the category of 'traditional'. My guess is that no one owns the rights as will other 'traditionals'.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)Caddy's and Rolls" from?
Jetboy
(792 posts)nm
Downwinder
(12,869 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)Liberace was an incredible piano player.
Downwinder
(12,869 posts)acquiring the sobriquet "Mr. Showmanship".
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)Or are you extrapolating behavior of 1 man to the category of "blacks"? Thank you. I am interested.
Jetboy
(792 posts)cars. I do know that one of Elvis' idols, Wynonie Harris was known to drive them. Indeed I am extrapolating on this one.
I'm fine with the idea that Elvis just loved big fancy cars on his own. Pretty sure that another artist Elvis admired, Hank Williams, was a caddy fan as well. Come to think of it HW and the like loved fancy rhinestone suits. Flash can come from just about anywhere, who knows?
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)"from black people" as you seem to be attempting to perpetuate a rather racist stereotying of "black people".
Jetboy
(792 posts)Though I don't know for a fact, it is very possible that Elvis copied these things from black people. It's proven that he admired the style of hip black people. While I don't know the automobile purchase history of every jump blues artist, I do know that Wynonie Harris loved Caddies and Elvis loved Wynonie. I am probably in error about the gaudy jewelry. But Elvis' fashion sense was very much shaped by the hip black people that he admired.
OK OK you win- it's rappers that coped Elvis' style!
Elvis liked big fancy cars and bling bling jewelry. Rappers do too. Are we supposed to pretend that these things aren't true?
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)rolls and gaudy jewelry " is as racist as claiming "black people like watermelon". I will call it when I see it and your refusal to notice the racism implicit in what you write is telling.
Jetboy
(792 posts)'black hip hop artists like gaudy jewelry and big fancy cars'. It is true that white hip hop artists also favor them.
The stereotype is that rappers like bling and cadillacs. I don't see the harm in acknowledging it.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)Your stereotype is, your exact words, is "from black people". Own it.
Jetboy
(792 posts)The key word is 'think' and I layed out several reasons why a person could think that. There is also a stereotype that Elvis stole the music and style of black people. Style can refer to car and jewelry preference too. No one argues that Elvis came up with his style and music all on his own. Hence your 'GOTCHA' is unnecessary.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)No "gotcha", just pointing out the racist stereotype.
Jetboy
(792 posts)nm
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)And it's in that sentence and it's what you need to do.
Downwinder
(12,869 posts)Americans?
Jetboy
(792 posts)Since few knew who she was, she likely had little to no affect.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)or did she appropriate his music.
When Black people used hair straightener in the 50's were they appropriating white culture?
Did Chuck Barry appropriate white country music?
boston bean
(36,931 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)Thanks
madokie
(51,076 posts)my reasoning is that it took a bunch of haters attention from black people and tuned it towards Elvis and what he was ushering in.
hadist and racist are one person. If you're one you're the other pretty much
Jetboy
(792 posts)Conservative white America hated Elvis specifically because much of his music came from black people. Elvis and rock-n-roll in general were the bane of racists.
Teenagers both white and black suddenly had something in common that they all liked. Rock-n-roll's listening audience was almost all teenagers until the dance crazes of the early 60s brought adults into the fun.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,996 posts)Wow. Racist stereotype much?
Jetboy
(792 posts)Hip Hop artists aren't a race of people. And hip hop artists like big fancy cars and lots of bling jewelry, just like Elvis.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)racist. Are you the arbitrator of what is?
There are a whole lot of arbitrators on this board now seeing racism where none exist. Those folks are what's wrong here!
Jesus Malverde
(10,274 posts)Did they cross an invisible line when they created Beefaroni?
We need answers!
yuiyoshida
(45,415 posts)Chun King was an American line of canned Chinese food products founded in the 1940s by Jeno Paulucci, who also developed Jeno's Pizza...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chun_King
This stuff used to make me gag.... When I was 2 years old.
AsahinaKimi
(20,776 posts)Real Chinese food, that was crap!!!
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)a kid. As an teenager, I discovered that it had nothing to do with Chinese cuisine. That was a revelation.
yuiyoshida
(45,415 posts)and Italian tries to cook Chinese, and fails very badly! Than again, I have been to Japanese restaurants, that were run by Chinese chefs, and they failed as well... Culture is a delicate thing..and for chefs to make authentic food, needs to follow the directions without adding any kind of romantic flair to the food, they think it should have.
Note regarding Chun King... I HATED those water chestnuts and bamboo shoots. I think some wharehouse some where had an over supply of them and they ended up in those cans. Bleh!!
MineralMan
(151,269 posts)had nowhere to go to find real cuisine of any culture other than Mexican cuisine. When I was in high school, though, a small Chinese restaurant opened in the next town. While most of what they served was Americanized, the menu also included a complete set of Hunan and Szechuan dishes. I graduated from the Americanized items to more authentic dishes quickly, learned to use chopsticks, and had a new world of food opened up to me. The restaurant was a favorite with the high school kids, due to what seemed to be exotic food and reasonable prices.
We'd go there in sizable groups, order a wide variety of dishes and just have a ball eating. I quickly worked my way through the entire menu. It was the beginning of exploring international cuisines, and I'm still exploring. A new Equadorian restaurant opened near me. We'll be heading over to it soon. They have guinea pig on the menu! Wow!
yuiyoshida
(45,415 posts)That's fantastic, thanks for sharing!
RebelOne
(30,947 posts)It was my mother's go-to meal when she didn't know what else to cook for dinner. Believe it not, I loved it.
randys1
(16,286 posts)upaloopa
(11,417 posts)Can you elaborate?
randys1
(16,286 posts)think?
DIdnt Obama's election bring out a whole lotta folks who have a problem with the Black folk?
Seems to me anyway, not sure who here is having a problem with Black folk, but seems to be some
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)of those pointing out other people's problems.
randys1
(16,286 posts)like that?
I am not sure what you mean
rbrnmw
(7,160 posts)like an OP that has indefensible racism in it
Jetboy
(792 posts)This seems to be the sentence people THINK is racist:
'I THINK that Elvis got his penchant for over-the-top jewelry and big, fancy tricked out Caddys and Rolls from black people too. But black hip hop artists have appropriated that right back!'
In other words, I THINK meaning that I don't know for sure, that Elvis stole his taste in jewelry and cars from black people. Conventional wisdom says that Elvis stole black music and style. Nobody argues against that. So why is there a problem with the idea that he might've coped his taste in jewelry and cars from blacks? I even gave reasons why I THOUGHT that. Elvis admired Wynonie Harris, Harris favored cadillacs. Those facts may or may not have had anything to do with Elvis' love of caddys but my THOUGHT had reason behind it and wasn't pulled from thin air.
And I pointed out that black HIP HOP artists took this back and made it their own. Did I stereotype Elvis and Hip hop artists as favoring gaudy jewelry and big fancy cars? Yes I did and there is no more wrong with that as there is in saying that country artists favor pick-up trucks and cowboy hats.
People are solid with the idea that Elvis borrowed heavily from blacks. Since Elvis was well known to adapt black tastes in music and style why would his taste in jewelry and cars be any different?
To the people who would suggest that my OP was racist, please read my words and tell me where I'm wrong. I've tried to answer every single question posed with much consideration. If something I said really was racist, point it out and reason with me. Perhaps we all can learn something.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)that difficult a concept to understand? Saying "black people" liked gaudy jewelry and tricked out expensive cars is the problem because there are many many who do not. It is like saying I got my taste for fried chicken from black people. Also seriously offensive.
It really is not that difficult of a concept. Broad brush stereotyping has been explained elsewhere in this thread. Listen and learn. Please.
Jetboy
(792 posts)That's a lot different than saying black people favor those things.
I am guilty of stereotyping artists in a specific genre of music, Hip Hop. I stand by it. Elvis and rappers favor gaudy jewelry and big fancy tricked out cars. I'll gladly wear whatever ist that makes me.
And country music performers favor pick up trucks and cowboy hats. That which is harmless, is harmless.
It really isn't that difficult to understand for those with reading skills: HIP HOP
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)You said that. Then you said hip hop artists "appropriated that right back". But first you said Elvis got his penchant for those from black people which is a stereotype.
Jetboy
(792 posts)So how is the idea that he MAY have acquired his taste in jewelry and cars from the same source any different?
It isn't.
uppityperson
(116,020 posts)"he acquired his penchant for bling and tricked out expensive cars from blacks".
malaise
(296,101 posts)at wrong and strong - seriously I can't believe some of this madness.
CatWoman
(80,290 posts)is awfully, um, stupid.
Jetboy
(792 posts)nm
CatWoman
(80,290 posts)anytime.
malaise
(296,101 posts) 
BumRushDaShow
(169,753 posts) Jetboy
(792 posts)Last edited Sun Dec 28, 2014, 06:03 AM - Edit history (1)
you're a fan of Public Enemy.
That makes me very interested in your opinion regarding Elvis and appropriating black culture.
Elvis in the 1950s: Good or bad for African Americans in your opinion?
edit: typo
BumRushDaShow
(169,753 posts)as a degenerate by adopting "nigger jungle music".
Perhaps a better argument for what many of us here have been trying to argue in order to differentiate appropriate versus incorporate, is to look at the other African American music genres that were in-progress at that time and how the artist handled that, e.g, jazz.
A man (Buddy DeFranco) recently passed away. He has been dubbed as one of the top jazz clarinetists of his era. He was enthralled by the black jazz performers of the '40s and not only went on to incorporate the style (in the midst of the big band and swing genres that dominated the white performances), but actually routinely played alongside them and became a part of ensembles, not afraid of being associated with "coloreds".
Contrast with Elvis, who although he occasionally performed in "negro" venues, was essentially separated himself from his black contemporaries in order to be whisked into superstardom, effectively leaving them behind.
Jetboy
(792 posts)The contrast between Buddy DeFranco and Elvis is a valid critique.
Bobbie Jo
(14,344 posts)
cyberswede
(26,117 posts) bravenak
(34,648 posts)
Always the same.
your Average racist
bravenak
(34,648 posts)CatWoman
(80,290 posts)
bravenak
(34,648 posts)The part where the Mom keeps throwing those guys down the stairs? Could not stop laughing.
treestar
(82,383 posts)if you believe Elvis' act is taken from African Americans, then he got the success one of them would have got, but for racism.
Jetboy
(792 posts)No doubt that the music and style that moved Elvis was taken from black people.
This was the million dollar style that made him a star among stars. So what could he have done differently back then to right this wrong? Had Elvis never recorded would history have changed and Little Richard or Chuck Berry been the King and gotten all the money and glory that Elvis got?
Again I don't think it's that simple.
It was wrong that Elvis was so greatly rewarded while his black influences were not. But what could've been done back then? What can be done now?
Unfair things happened all over America back in the 1950s and unfair things are happening right now. I prefer to concentrate on things we can do something about.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)it's more likely he was than not. If he was does that change anything? If it does why does it?
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)The people who knew Elvis knew that he treated everyone with respect and that he was a genuinely kind, humble and generous man.
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)on Jan. 8. A lot of people don't realize how profound and beautiful the original story was.
Jetboy
(792 posts)My opinion of Elvis has been greatly elevated over the past 20 years or so. Today, I consider myself a huge Elvis fan.
People will believe whatever they want to believe but all evidence points to Elvis being a genuinely good and decent human being.
As evidenced by this thread, some people still think Elvis was a racist because of what Chuck D rapped about him. I hope that they take the time to understand Chuck D's evolved opinion of Elvis.
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)Anyone who has an opinion about Elvis really needs to understand how much he loved music, how knowledgeable and serious he was about it and how good he was at communicating its joy and power to people. That was the agenda; it was pure and he was a once-in-a-lifetime performer. Also, it wasn't the singing that made him unique, it was the live performances, his movements. And yes, the fact that he was white made a huge difference in terms of impact. But there wasn't a single contrivance involved; the leg shaking started out as stage fright and he took it from there once he saw the effect it had on people.
Jetboy
(792 posts)too bad that my poor wording in the OP got the discussion sidetracked.
I was truly interested in how DUers felt about Elvis and cultural appropriation. Was Elvis' emergence in the 1950s good or bad for black people?
My opinion was that it was good but I really wanted to hear arguments to the contrary. Mr Scorpio did provide some reasoning in that regard.
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)When Marion Keisker of Sun asked him who he sounded like before he recorded that first song for his mother, he said, "I don't sound like anybody." He was right (and nobody was ever this exciting in a chair either):
craigmatic
(4,510 posts)that song "Fight the power".
Jetboy
(792 posts)He's in the video about Elvis posted above. Look elsewhere for his complete repudiation of his stance on Elvis. A complete 180!
Chuck D was ignorant of the facts and when he became aware of them, he changed his views accordingly. No reason others can't do the same.
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)http://www.elvis.com.au/presley/elvis-not-racist.shtml#sthash.LFzvr6ee.dpuf
Elwood P Dowd
(11,453 posts)and so many testimonials from prominent black artists from back in the day.
craigmatic
(4,510 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)should provide something to back it up. I dug and dug for any valid evidence that Elvis was a racist and didn't find any.
craigmatic
(4,510 posts)went on to make millions. He played both sides of the color line. He may not have hated blacks but he definitely didn't seem to care that he profited from that evil system and never really spoke out on it up until the moment he died. I do believe that alot of the blacks at that time were too forgiving of that. There were probably two dozen or more black artists at the time who had better acts that him but didn't get the same break. No is that his fault? No but at same time I'm not a fan and I think the idea that you have to have a white artist to bring black music to white people for them to enjoy it is really fucked up because good music has no race.
BeyondGeography
(41,101 posts)
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Big Mama Thornton:
Better people than I would have discovered her without Elvis whitesplaining her to us; but they are better people than I. Which is a pretty low bar, if you ask me.
Retrograde
(11,419 posts)was written by two white men from New York City, Leiber and Stoller. Cultural cross-pollinization raises its head once more. (Of course they were influenced by both the blues and Tin Pan Alley, which in turn was influenced by - well, it's an all-American genre in many senses of the word).
Jetboy
(792 posts)Freddy Bell and the Bell Boys version of Hound Dog, not Big Mama's.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)way of knowing other outcomes for sure.
Elvis' name was the first that came to mind when I read about cultural appropriation and I was curious as to others' opinions. What you say is the truth- we can't ever really know for sure.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Some people have way to much time on their hands.
Jetboy
(792 posts)It's not weird but rather quite expected that Elvis' name would come up in relation to this topic. No?
I am guilty of having some free time this weekend for the first time in a long time however.
Elwood P Dowd
(11,453 posts)I grew up poor in the South in the 1950s & 1960s. The first record I ever purchased was an Elvis 45 with "Hound Dog" on one side. The only black music I ever heard was in the cotton fields across the road from us. By the late 1950s and early 1960s it was all over the radio waves.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)nt
FirstClassTicket
(18 posts)She hated Elvis with a passion because she thought his success was ripped off from black artists, and she thought his style was "insulting."
I think that's bullshit. Elvis was one of a kind. He was successful because of what HE had to offer. Even if he was influenced by artists who came before him, that is no different from any other entertainer -- ALL are influenced by groundbreakers before them, and Elvis was a groundbreaker himself.
ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)Elvis was a hero to most
But he never meant shit to me you see
Straight up racist that sucker was
Simple and plain
Mother fuck him and John Wayne
Cause I'm Black and I'm proud
I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped
Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps
Sample a look back you look and find
Nothing but rednecks for 400 years if you check
Don't worry be happy
Was a number one jam
Damn if I say it you can slap me right here
(Get it) lets get this party started right
Right on, c'mon
What we got to say
Power to the people no delay
To make everybody see
In order to fight the powers that be
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)I don't think Ali was an "Uncle Tom".
Elwood P Dowd
(11,453 posts)much of what he had heard about Elvis was nothing but outright lies. Why don't you read the entire thread where this was all explained?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Although I think that different people will understand it to illustrate very diffeent things.
HERVEPA
(6,107 posts)Older Jewish guys in the 50's drove caddies, as well as many non-blacks.
Rest of it is fine and I think you're being sincere, and getting dumped on unnecessarily.
Culture is being stolen, modified, expanded all the time. Folks trying to argue against that are fighting a losing battle.
Note: This does not apply to Washington Football fans wearing headdresses, or the name "Redskins", or the idiots in Atlanta doing the Tomahawk Chop, all of which are reprehensible.
Retrograde
(11,419 posts)Static cultures - static arts - are dying cultures. Every artist, and every listener, brings a unique personal background to music, based on their own experiences. At about the time Elvis was bringing his music to the mainstream, Nat King Cole was popular: was he stealing from white crooners like Crosby and Como, or bringing elements he liked into his own musical heritage?
HERVEPA
(6,107 posts)Jetboy
(792 posts)No doubt that I stepped in it with the bling remark. Hank Williams, Liberacie, and plenty of other folks could've been the spark that lit Elvis' taste in jewelry and cars just as easily as the black musicians he admired. Clearly the man was attracted to flash.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)would not otherwise have played. I think they were both two guys who loved music and loved performing, and actually loved "black" music and said, "Fuck it - I like to play this music, and white kids love to listen to it, so this is what I'm going to do". It's was symbiotic.
JonLP24
(29,929 posts)White entertainers or white anything really always had more acceptance. They also felt whites were better at everything until it got to a point where it just shifted to "only good at sports". You still see it with the adjectives or "knows his limitations" "scrappy" "smart" "hard worker" while many white Americans claim the NBA is full of thugs.
There was NBA white player who was drafted this year (2014) -- can't find the article but I swear it exists. Criticized the coverage of when he was drafted they played Adam Morrison highlights and were comparing him to him when he felt like Paul Pierce was a closer match to his player type.
Here is some polling regarding it
NBA draft prospects were compared to black Americans
Player comparisons from white America to white NBA draft prospects
This is an interesting one
The areas where you do see disproportion is height. One of the things people have unfair "you can't teach height" natural advantages when it comes to basketball is height, white people w/ NBA come out on the more taller end disproportionally but how often do you hear that mention? No the white basketball NBA players are portrayed as working so incredibly hard to only come out above average against a league full of natural physical freaks(I loved the part in Carbon Copy where the rich white biological father of Denzel Washington's character assumed he was good at basketball but was terrible at it).
Quasimodem
(441 posts)Jetboy: "I think that Elvis got his penchant for over-the-top jewelry and big, fancy tricked out Caddys and Rolls from black people too."
I don't think that is so much a black/white thing or even a rich/poor thing. I think it is a suddenly-wealthy new-money thing. Poor boys grow up wishing they could afford a new car. They make it big, and suddenly they CAN afford a new car -- not only afford a new car, but the most expensive new car on the market -- several of them! -- Bling-Bling, expensive clothes, and McMansions. Also, they can go to the most expensive restaurants, trendy clubs, and to exclusive vacation locals, which they do.
It’s called conspicuous consumption, and no one is more prone to the disease than the formerly dirt poor who have become suddenly wealthy, be they rockers, hip hoppers, sports celebrities, or ordinary people who’ve won a big lottery.
brindis_desala
(907 posts)the reason performers like Elvis are at issue is because historically black artists were rarely invited to perform on television or at major venues, even as the music they were creating was being "adopted" and "adapted" for white performers for all-white audiences. Clearly those "bad old days" are gone, but there was a time when the originators could only hope to make a fraction of what their imitators could command thanks to market share. The irony is-- the hyped commercialism of authentic American music has diminished its quality.