DU ... Just So You Know, It's NOT Our Imagination ...

[1StrongBlackMan]

Last edited Tue Dec 30, 2014, 02:27 AM - Edit history (1)

Posted FROM the African-American Group:

Message to the blacks on DU (how to be a good ally)

Dear black people,

1) Just because white people don't agree with you, it doesn't mean they haven't listened to you. Do not demand that white people shut up and listen to you when you're not willing to do the same.

2) The world does not revolve around you. You are not special, so don't expect to be treated as if you are. If you're offended or outraged, that's just too bad. There's no law that protects you against hurt feelings.

3) You do not get to tell white people what they need to be doing or saying. Learn some respect and humility.

4) You are not an "oppressed group". You live in a First World country, the wealthiest in the world. We have a generous welfare state that provides for your every need. You have a home, access to clean, running water, central heating, and so much food that many of your people are morbidly obese, while there are people in the world who are starving. You have access to some of the best education in the world, and some of the best healthcare. There are genuinely oppressed people in the Third World who could only dream of having the opportunities and privileges that you have.

5) No black person alive today was ever a slave, and no white person alive today ever owed slaves, so get over it. Nobody owes you anything. Spare us the "300 years of oppression and suffering". There are no 300 year old black Americans, and you have suffered no more than the average white American.

6) Do not accuse whites of being racist. You are far more racist, so check your own racism first and ask yourself, did I do anything to provoke this?


You have created a huge divide in American society. This will be difficult to overcome, but not impossible. All it requires is that black America takes a good, honest look at itself, and stops blaming whites for their own failures.


Regards,

White America

and this:

There are three main things contributing to the death of DU.

The first was the creation of the African American and feminist groups. The more prescient DUers commented at the time that this would only divide people, create a clique-like environment and create safe havens for extremists. Over time, the bullying and alert-stalking of the rest of DU by these two groups created a very hostile atmosphere and it killed open debate.

The second thing was the daily threads pushing the "white male privilege" meme, and more recently the "cultural appropriation" meme. Having people constantly abuse and shit all over you while telling you you're actually a member of the privileged class is too absurd to take seriously. DU obviously doesn't do irony. Telling people their opinion doesn't matter because they're a white male is no better than telling someone their opinion doesn't matter because they're a black female. Both are wrong. Equally wrong were the black people telling white people to shut up because they couldn't possibly understand what it's like to be black, while these same people think they know everything how about white people think and feel. At some point, the sane DUers were going to stand up and fight back.

The third thing was the automatic support given to certain criminals, just because they were black, and the demonization of the people who killed them. It started with Trayvon Martin, continued with Michael Brown and Vonderritt Myers, and it's still continuing with Antonio Martin. Even after it was proven that George Zimmerman and Darren Wilson acted in self-defense, certain DUers continued to lie about what happened, and supported the criminals. We now had the "police brutality" meme. This has divided not just DU, but the whole country. It seems like some kind conflict is unavoidable at this point, unless the blacks back down and apologize.

The only thing that can save DU at this point is making it more open, especially to more conservative views. MIRT is one of the biggest obstacles to free discussion at DU right now, and should really be retired.

One final point. Several of the people responsible for creating the toxic atmosphere at DU are posting right in this thead - BainsBane, bravenak, Cha and JustAnotherGen, among others. Banning these people would improve the morale of DU immensely.

And my personal favorite:

Such dirty ugly people, and they all smell of wet dog and mayonnaise, am I right? Nigger.

When you call white people crackers, they have a right to call you nigger.

And this is from a single thread in the AA Group. Now ... This very well my be hidden as a Meta post; but, the fact that DUers feel comfortable enough to post the above in a Group, is should suggest (should this last long enough to be read ...) remove any doubt as to Member's of Colors observation that it is open season on Black folks on DU ... It is not our imagination.

And while, each of these posts were removed, it appears high time more DUers express that this is unacceptable.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. That's just awful. Where is this stuff coming from,

and why is DU putting up with it? Whoever wrote the "White America" post should be 86'ed the hell out of here if they haven't been yet. Was all of this crap written by the same racist troll, or are there a bunch of them?

[1StrongBlackMan]

7. Self-identified Democrats/Liberals/progressives ...

that post primarily to the GD, but have found they way to the AA-Group.

Was all of this crap written by the same racist troll, or are there a bunch of them?

Nope ... and the "White America" poster has years on the site and a relatively high post count.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

11. That's pretty disheartening.

If you ask me, they don't belong on DU. It's disturbing and depressing to see garbage like that anywhere on DU, and it's especially crappy for them to post it in the AA group.

[cwydro]

49. Obvious trolls.

Lots of that activity here lately.

Trolls are all over the internet. The comments I read on news sites are astounding in their pure nastiness.

Racism, misogyny - it's all out here on the web. I don't think those posts are representative of DU at all.

I think Skinner, EarlG, et al do a good job cleaning up the slime that seeps in here. But it must be a continual struggle. It does seem like an awful lot of troll attacks lately. Zombies or freepers, probably both.

But that is not what DU is, IMO.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

55. I'd like to think those comments were anomalous, but

unfortunately they came from someone who apparently had been a DU member for awhile. There does seem to be an awful lot of trollery lately, if that's what it is. Or are there long-time DUers who are also racist assholes?

[marym625]

62. The latter. n/t

[cwydro]

208. Then EarlG should be informed.

No way are they going to allow that crap on DU.

[niyad]

282. you have clearly missed a lot of the crap on du, then.

[1StrongBlackMan]

304. Sadly, I find the Admin's silence, deafening ...

but I can understand their not weighing in.

Hopefully, it is just my impatience ... and they are crafting a brilliant message.

[niyad]

306. I truly hope you are correct.

[1StrongBlackMan]

95. Clearly,one doesn't have to be much concerned with ...

racial equality/race issues (or gender, or lgbt issues) to be a good progressive, so long as one is right on income inequity, the 1%, the NSA and weed.

[freshwest]

105. +1

[Bobbie Jo]

197. This. nt

[BlueCaliDem]

260. Yep. And it would explain their hatred for President Obama and anyone who supports him

while promoting the likes of Rand Paul and Glenn Greenwald and attacking Democrats with almost RW glee. But then, when called on it, huff up and posts the usual list - supported Obama, signed people up for Obama and Democrats, walked a thousand miles knocking on doors for Obama and Democrats...donating millions to their campaigns. You get the gist.

[DonCoquixote]

325. i'll see that and raise you another truth

the only reason a lot of these folk carry the "liberal" or "Progressive" banner is because the GOP forced them off the lifeboat. Back in the 80's and 90's, when their stock portfolios were filled to the brim, they were warm to Ron Ray Gun, because he promised them wealth without having to deal with the people their fathers taught them how to hate; the people with diferent skin or different genders. Now, the bills came due, especially when their "good job" that defined them went to Mexico or China, and when the banks of Wall Street became casinos that were less regulated than Las Vegas. Now they fly the porgressive flag because they think they have a god-given right to what THEY call "liberty" which is nothing more than the right to their old salary, the right to pontificate on the internet (with a side of porn), and their weed.

Not that there is one thing wrong with decent salaries, free internets, or the occasional weed. Certainly those items are a part of the agenda, but they are NOT the whole. Until the issues of both racism, and it's parent classism, are dealt with once and for all, everything else is just a whitewash of termite eaten fence. Those of us who are brown, different gendered, or who NEVER had a chance to get that good Union salary, are looking at these people crawling onto the lifeboat and saying "wait a minute, aren't you the people that tired to throw us off the boat back when Ray Gun and Bill Clintons were president?" They smiles and say "damned right, and if we want to win, we need to throw you bastards off the boat again!" Then of course, enter 2016, where the conservative democrats, without ONE CLUE, or ONE APOLOGY, immediately try to take the wheel, shove us in the galley to row their oars, and try to steer right back to the good old days (which means THEIR good old days.) Of course, the oligarchy sits back laughing, because they know that Ray Gun and yes, Clinton, were nothing more than the people then the figureheads of the ship of fools.

[seabeyond]

333. a couple of us where talking just this, thru pm. and a little bit more,

that i will not say right here and now. yes. what was promised went away. people are angry.

[1StrongBlackMan]

345. Well put; but,one observation ...

Then of course, enter 2016, where the conservative democrats, without ONE CLUE, or ONE APOLOGY, immediately try to take the wheel, shove us in the galley to row their oars, and try to steer right back to the good old days (which means THEIR good old days.)

I would have it a little reversed, with the conservative Democrats being the ones trying to throw PoC off the life raft in order to get back their glory days of good jobs/salaries and racial deafness/muteness ... and our "liberals/progressives" trying to take the wheel, while trying to convince/shove us in the galley to row their oars, with them trying to steer right back to what they imagine their PARENTS' good old days to have been ... only with the internet and weed.

[DonCoquixote]

363. touche mon ami

well put. Especially sinc eyou oput the liberals in quotes, which is where it belongs for these folk

[countryjake]

374. You make great edits.

Your post and DonCoquixote's made me think of the song "When the Ship Comes In", which, after all these years later, I still have hope for.

[JustAnotherGen]

357. I just - I don't . . .

I don't even know to express my awe at this post. I think you are filled with awesome sauce!

[countryjake]

373. +1000 I'm no gambler...

but I'd say that you've won this hand, a great post.

[JustAnotherGen]

202. No give credit where credit is due

The MIR Team, GD Hosts, and Group Hosts do the heavy lifting at DU.

And to name 'names' in the second one - That's someone 'familiar' with a massive bone to pick.

[cwydro]

413. That's why I said "Et al"

Which means "and others." When using my phone, I look for short cuts.

[sheshe2]

21. The recent White America post in AA

I alerted on it. Already was juried 0-7 hide then PPred.

The second I had not read. So ugly. So very sorry 1SBM.

The discussion needs to start and it needs to start now!

[1StrongBlackMan]

30. This ...

The discussion needs to start and it needs to start now!

Is my point of posting that ... And, I did not want it regulated to the AA Group where it can be ignored. Not reading, and reacting to this conduct is a conscious and considered DUer choice.

[sheshe2]

53. Yes

Not reading, and reacting to this conduct is a conscious and considered DUer choice.

So let's see who is ready for the discussion. Sounds like a great opening for you. I am white and ready to take your back. Do it 1SBM. Some of us have been waiting, like the President your voice is thoughtful, your tone measured. You do not react out of anger. You think. Do it, because I am sick of the bullshit here.

Please do it.

[A Round Tuit]

290. Okay, I'll stick my toe in the water...

Let's take one of the points of the poster...not for any particular reason, but one that invariably provokes a rage, especially amongst whites, is the issue of reparations.

Someone will have to pay for it. Now, realistically, you and I both know it's not going to be the fat-cat Koch Bros types, but is going to be laid on the backs of the working white man.

Why do I say working white man? Well, it wouldn't be a reparation if a working black man had to pay the taxes to allow the payment of reparations to another black man.

Also, the efforts of several Democratic administrations have resulted in welfare programs (I really don't like the word "welfare", but...) that already benefit the black man, as well as the white man. And, I use the terms black man and white man for no other reason than brevity. I intend no gender discrimination.

So, therefore, in the minds of many, payments are being made to the black man. Now, would it make you or anyone else happier if you received a payment that was clearly labeled "Reparation for a Black Man", on it, to distinguish it from "Welfare for a Black Man" on it?

Don't dismiss my words out of hand, until you have given them thought. No matter what you call it, where it comes from or who actually has it put in their hand, there will be a problem.

Also, why should the white man, sitting in some gloomy, forlorn factory making widgets for little more than minimum wage, be told now he has to absorb the blame for what his ancestors may or may not have done 150 years ago?

Someone will chime in here and say: "Well, just have the Bureau of Whoever is Responsible for Printing Money, just print up some money."

Well, you and I both know that won't work, even if they have printed up bushels of money for unjust and uncalled for wars.

I'll not go on, as I'm sure I'll be immediately attacked for this little exercise in advocacy for the devil...but really, I'm not a bigoted person and I do see the problems we are faced with...and at the top of the list of those problems is the one that no wants to recognize that sticking one's fingers in one's ears and going "nah, nah, nah, nah", is not going to solve them. Nor is name calling or screeching about whose ancestors did what and when.

So, please, help me to make a start on it. Seriously, what would you propose for the reparation situation? Perhaps, with your views, your realistic views, may contain something that will provide a solid footing for beginning the discussion.

For the record: I am against reparations, because they cannot be realistically administered and will provoke a backlash that will most certainly result in death and mayhem and the destruction of even more lives. But we can solve it.

What say you?

[1StrongBlackMan]

296. I say, politely, start your own thread and I will gladly reply. n/t

ETA: Because I think your post is worthy of further discussion, I re-posted it here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026021278

I apologize if you found my previous response was terse ... upon reflection, I believe it was.

[notadmblnd]

342. I think he's back already.

[notadmblnd]

344. Is that what you're afraid of? Having 1/10 of a cent of the few dollars (if any) you pay in taxes

going for reparations?

[1StrongBlackMan]

346. And more, that 1/10 of a cent in his/her taxes ...

would be combined with MY 1/10 of a cent in taxes, I pay.

[DonCoquixote]

381. ok, i'll respond

"Someone will have to pay for it. Now, realistically, you and I both know it's not going to be the fat-cat Koch Bros types, but is going to be laid on the backs of the working white man. "

With all due respect, if the majority makes a government which is unable to make the fat cats pay for thing sthey have benefitted from, that is NOT an excuse to deny people their due. Indeed, part of reparations is to hold those COMPANIES that have benefitted from bad behaviour responsible, and there is enough modern day pollution (which happens to be in black areas) that not one ghost of a slave or slave owner need be summoned, that is because the bad behviour of yesterday is being used for bad behavior TODAY.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/02/koch-brothers-lawsuit-chicago-petcoke_n_5255853.html
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/04/30/3432796/koch-getting-sued/
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/03/21/3417531/peters-petcoke-koch/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/12/arkansas-koch-industries-plant-high-rates-of-cancer_n_1007148.html
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/inside-the-koch-brothers-toxic-empire-20140924

If you ask why bad behaviour that happened almost 200 years ago is relevant, it is because that same bad behaviour is being used to justify NEW bad behaviour. This is being done in black areas because the Koch brothers know that to many, Black lives do NOT matter.

"Also, the efforts of several Democratic administrations have resulted in welfare programs (I really don't like the word "welfare", but...) that already benefit the black man, as well as the white man. And, I use the terms black man and white man for no other reason than brevity. I intend no gender discrimination."

So, therefore, in the minds of many, payments are being made to the black man."And it is not our job to prove them wrong? And this welfare is payment for abuse, and not just the fact that if people are poor, they will either die or become criminals to survive?

"For the record: I am against reparations, because they cannot be realistically administered and will provoke a backlash that will most certainly result in death and mayhem and the destruction of even more lives. But we can solve it. "

First step is to commonly agree on what should be the minimum rights and standard that ALL Americans should expect, and admit that until such time as prejudice is eliminated, that yes, blacks and minorities are playing this game with a handicap. Even Barack Obama (and yes, I can disagree with him a LOT) has had hits that would NOT have been done to a Bush, or even a Clinton. Yes, Black people are still "last hired, first fired" and we need to formally acknowledge that. We need REAL education reform, not just Charter school crookery, to ensure that it does not matter what side of Town a student was born in. That is step one.

[tblue37]

177. Is it permitted to identify him, since he has been PPR'd? nt

[Spitfire of ATJ]

79. "Self-identified Democrats/Liberals/progressives ..."

They would have to be "self identified" because nobody else would call them that.

[Enthusiast]

166. That's a good point.

[Matariki]

136. Seriously? That reads like it's coming from a free republic troll

Ugh. Has the person been banned? And if not, why not.

[1StrongBlackMan]

141. Perhaps discussion Hobbits is a more pressing concern. n/t

ETA: But I understand those posters are no longer with us ... R.I.P.

[Matariki]

148. And good riddance to them

I'm not sure I understand about the hobbits though. I think you mean that discussions about racism in GD turn ignorant pretty fast? It's frustrating. Nor is it called out or shut down as often as one would hope.

[1StrongBlackMan]

151. Nope ...

I mean something very specific ... the house is burning down and the firemen are posting discussions about Hobbits.

[ancianita]

194. Okay, then. So where to begin. I say there should be a generally agreed upon set of definitions

around race talk; for example, keeping the understandings of the terms race, racist, racism, prejudice, bigot, bigotry and stereotype solid and consistent, so as to stop the constant inferring of bad intentions by those who just don't understand the real life meanings of the words they use.

I'm just putting this out there for starters: that DU needs to restart an official DU glossary of discussion terms -- that reflects both DU's Terms of Service and Use (or whatever DU the official guidelines are).

[1StrongBlackMan]

251. Okay, but do you realize the storm that will create? ...

Just take the words "racism" and "bigotry" ... in the not so distant past, I posted definitions of the terms from writings in peer-reviewed social science journals (with links to the underlying articles/research) that specifically indicate that the distinction between the terms is the cultural/institutional power relationship(s) component, i.e., racial bigotry = negative race-based interaction(s); racism = bigotry + cultural/institution power/support. These articles link(ed) to other articles that, like all academic writings, trace the evolution/refinement of the term to reflect the science's current understanding of the phenomena of racism.

The DU response? ... folks arguing, "Well, that is not what my/the dictionary says", or "That is not how I understand the term", and finally, &quot I don't care what the state and body of social science research says) I don't accept that ... We're just going to have to agree to disagree." (I can post links to these exact responses, if you wish)

How does one come to a common understanding of terms, when those that most in need to be engaged, refuse to "accept" the state and body of social science research?

I, once, likened it to discussing climate change with conservatives; but, now, I liken it to discussing climate change with coal/oil/gas industry lobbyists/insiders, in that those arguing against the science have an interest in maintaining the definitional status quo. And no amount of science or reason is going to change that.

[ancianita]

268. Wow. You've made a considerable, fair effort. And I say, let the polling and voting begin on your

peer reviewed definitions. Let's start a DU Glossary II that officially defines those terms for use in discussion, and let the "agree to disagree" posters here fall into Alert Territory.

I would appreciate the links, just so that, in the interests of not retreading old arguments or derailing, the general DU population keeps these past discussions in mind.

If we can't move forward in our racial definitions, we are hardly equipped to be a Democratic Party -- much less an "underground" -- that can define much else. Our problem in DU is not characteristic of 'the party of good governance.'

Seriously, I'd urge the admins and Skinner to review the need for basic terms that are boldly supported by the DU Terms of Service, so that we ALL align with the interests of supporting a progressive wing of the FDR Democrats. While this party needs to be a 'big tent,' that tent must not include wide ranging ignorance that drags down spirits, discussions or decisions, and keeps us all vulnerable to the 'they both do it' arguments of the racist and privileged. DU needs to end the lazy rationalizations and stand for core belief about our fellow black and white Democrats. (Am I excluding other races from this proposal? Of course not.)

You're more than equipped and supported around here about writing a proposal to Skinner and the admin set, and I'm certainly willing to help. And there are others more qualified and better spoken than I who'd help you, I'm sure. So what do you say? We have to start somewhere.

Race relations are the heart of American history because how we live with perceived difference is how we've historically seen America. The least we can do is take a shot at positively shifting that history.

Defining terms and fairly and consistently enforcing those definitions here forms a real, productive identity for Democrats here and, hopefully, in the larger politic. If we won't do that, we, in my view, are not a serious group, but just one among other 'confirmation biased' chat sites where posters spin their wheels over difference. I don't say this lightly.

[janlyn]

274. I remember the discussion on definitions.

My thoughts at that time, were that people arguing about the definition of those terms, didn't want an honest discussion. The deliberate attempt to derail your conversation. A bit like people arguing about what caused the sinking of their ship, while their ship is sinking.
I am not a huge commenter on this site, mainly because I see how some posters attack people for their opinions. But I am on here quite often, and enjoy your thought provoking posts. I want to thank you for being being such a voice of reason.

[dumbcat]

318. And I think you have just clearly described

the reason why we will never have the discussion that many here would like to have. If there is not agreement as to the terms of the discussion, there can be no rational discussion. The debate will revolve around the terms, rather than the substance of the debate.

[ancianita]

323. I think that after the final adoption date, people will have to apply base term understanding, or

stand corrected. They'll get used to it. Or they'll be asked to move on.

[herding cats]

392. I think what you ran up against in that thread was maybe a couple of different things

One of which was people who after reading the actual real definitions of racism and bigotry saw shades of themselves in those definitions. Which by itself is a good thing if you learn and grow as a person when have such a discovery. However, some people prefer to insulate themselves within the same thinking they've always had, and still consider themselves as not having believed, done, or said any racist or bigoted things. Which meant, to them, you had to be wrong so they could continue to happily delude themselves.

Another of which is the posters here who use others lack of understanding on such things as a means to game the system. Alluding to, but not outright saying something racist/bigoted, and/or posting things they know are going to be viewed as racist/bigoted by specific members here they're targeting, then feigning innocence when someone calls them on it because it didn't fit the definition of racism/bigotry the link they'll provide for you states.

Of those two types; only the first one is worth trying to reach, they already know, or at least suspect on some level, that their thinking isn't right. With time they can sometimes admit their mistake. The second one is just here to troll for the 'lulz' of it, they're not worth the effort of anything beyond a well written alert.

I hope this makes some sense. I currently have a virus and am taking some things for the symptoms which do tend to cause my synapses to misfire a bit.

[1StrongBlackMan]

401. This makes perfect sense. n/t

[DesertDiamond]

155. Trolls.

[shireen]

158. have those creeps been tombstoned?

If they haven't, they need to be kicked out NOW.

Edited to add: thanks for bringing it to General Discussion. I don't have much time on DU and generally just check out GD posts. Had no idea this was going on.

[Enthusiast]

165. It sucks. This is an infiltrator. This is someone that is sowing the seeds of discord.

This is someone I think should be tomb stoned.

[tblue37]

173. But he is calling for DU to be more *conservative*! Why on earth is he

here rather than on the site that shall remain nameless?

[elehhhhna]

205. bill cosby wrote that shit

The last point was edited out. It said "alert women are also a major problem in society today".

[nxylas]

303. Many years ago, there was a post from Free Republic copied and pasted here

It was basically a "how to troll DU" guide. It specifically recommended posting innocuous posts about cats and the like for a while in order to boost your post count and make it less obvious than if you come right out with this crap in your first post. So being a long-standing DUer with a high post count doesn't really mean very much by itself.

[drynberg]

198. Agreed, waste of my time to see such crap

[1StrongBlackMan]

255. Yes ... we know it's out there/on here ...

so, it's best to confront it by saying it sucks, then ignore it.

[randys1]

307. bravenak says i missed something last night, what, where?

[1StrongBlackMan]

315. I have no idea. n/t

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

322. No one person or group can talk for "white America".

I'm white and if I was invited to a KKK meeting, they'd probably end up burning me at the stake.

[calimary]

383. YEESH, yeah! Truly awful!

Dang! That's not just awful, that's embarrassing!

[zappaman]

2. WTF?

This is from DU?

[1StrongBlackMan]

10. Yep ...

It was posted into a well received thread in the African-American Group.

[sabrina 1]

50. 'A well received thread'! Do you have a link to that thread?

Were these from new posters, trolls? Hopefully they are no longer here. But how could such garbage be 'well received in a protected group?

[1StrongBlackMan]

57. By well received...

Last edited Wed Dec 31, 2014, 10:42 AM - Edit history (1)

I mean, it sparred a good discussion.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1187&pid=10884

[sabrina 1]

70. Okay, thanks, I misunderstood 'well received'.

Good you brought this to GD. I know you don't want to name the person who is a long time DUer, which is pretty honorable of you, but have they been PPR'd?

[marym625]

59. The first one was it's own post

But the one that you were just linked to had some pretty horrid crap on it

[sabrina 1]

65. Thanks, it looks like the worst of them were removed thankfully. Shameful though that anyone

would post that garbage here or anywhere for that matter.

[marym625]

67. What I think was the worst

Was told to me by someone else. I missed it. But it was disgusting.

I had to have it explained to me.

[sabrina 1]

73. How sad that there are such people in the world.

[marym625]

77. yep.

Sadder still that so many can't admit it.

[rbrnmw]

292. I think it was the same thread that earlier in the thread

JustAnotherGen implored a poster to read the first page in the AA group to get a taste of what was going on I suggest the same here and that is if you want to know what it's like for black folks on DU read the first page of posts in the AA group.

[lovemydog]

3. Ban those racist mofos.

Joe Strummer (and Woody Guthrie before him) had a sticker on his guitar that said 'This Machine Kills Fascists.'

This DU Machine should Ban Racists.

[bravenak]

4. Ummm hmm.

I wanted to be first but I missed it.

Yeah. It was bad. Followed us around all day from thread to thread, forum to group. Ugh.

[lovemydog]

8. Dirt off your shoulder I hope.

But seriously. Ban the racist mofos.

[bravenak]

16. We did.

They were like White Walkers from Game of Thrones. Won't stay dead.

[lovemydog]

23. ROFL. We may need a stake, and garlic.

Last edited Wed Dec 31, 2014, 02:18 AM - Edit history (1)

Edited. Changed You to We. We're in this together.

[DonCoquixote]

382. I am sure that over on that site

the one that rhymes with "disruptionist" there are a bunch of people already helping to stitch a new sock puppet.

[Glassunion]

390. They all look the same.

[DonCoquixote]

411. that was tasteless

but so true that the aftertaste of sarcasm made me approve

[Luminous Animal]

28. Read your blog today. Great first week. I imagine it will be depressing at times to keep it up.

But the beauty of blogs is that you can plow through, take a break, solicit compatriots, or abandon it all together whenever you feel like it.

One of my favorite twitter accounts is "Yes,you're racist." https://twitter.com/YesYoureRacist

[bravenak]

35. Thank you, I'll check it out.

The idea to blog cam to me through a stupid question. I get so many lately. Can't figure out why.

I'll try my best to keep it up. People need to know how many stupid things I hear so they start believing me.

[bravenak]

44. That was funny.

Dude said Osama's Army.WTF? People be trippin!

[Luminous Animal]

52. I love it. Just retweeting racists all day long. This is one of my favorites from today...

RT @kendrannw2: I’m not racist. But a black Annie? Really. It’s a little red headed orphan you can’t have a black red head.

#1) black people can and do have naturally red hair.
#2) She was always sportin' a 'fro.

[bravenak]

56. I love it.

I think it's a good idea to openly mock racists. I will begin adding more mocking into my repertoire. They need it. It helps them immensely to feel stupid.

[brer cat]

206. I think mocking is one of the best ways to deal with racists.

And you can do it so well, bravenak. I read your blog and I love the way you are handling it.

[bravenak]

308. Thank you.

It's better to just laugh at them than to internalize their hate.

[lovemydog]

61. 'I'm not racist but....'

That rarely turns out well.

[JI7]

75. the original composer of the first Annie said he has always wanted a Black Annie

VF Hollywood: The film has taken a while to get to the screen since it was first announced back in 2011. What did you think about it initially, particularly with the idea to have an African American Annie?

Charles Strouse: I loved the idea. I always wanted to have a black Annie, so much so that we later integrated the orphanage several years into our first Broadway run. Back then, it didn’t make sense to cast an African American as Annie because the cartoon character was so iconic, but I was always in favor of someday having a black actress play the role, and Quvenzhane Wallis is amazing.

http://www.vanityfair.com/vf-hollywood/2014/12/charles-strouse-annie-remake

[gwheezie]

190. Beasts of the southern wild

Wonderful film. I was amazed a child could act so well. She really pulled me into the story.

[_Blue_]

32. I'm sorry that happened to you.

That's sickening. I'm glad they're banned.

[bravenak]

38. Thank you.

I'm glad they're gone too. I'll see them tomorrow. I usually do.

[Cha]

5. It's too bad.. I don't what their problem is.. too much White Privelege? Wow.. I just read

my name as part of being a "toxic part of DU".. by whom?! Well, at least I'm in brilliant company.

Mahalo for your OP, 1StrongBlackMan

[1StrongBlackMan]

13. LOL ...

I know I've been busy IRL and haven't been posting as much, or in as much depth; but, to go from "Mak(ing) DU Suck" to a no mention, in less than two months?

I'm hurt!

[KMOD]

31. well you are

sexually vulgar or something, lol.

I'm not a member of the AA forum, but I have been reading/lurking from time to time.

I'm glad you brought this post out in the open for all to see. It was very shocking to see.

[1StrongBlackMan]

37. LOL ...

sexually vulgar!

I really do wish whomever wrote that in an alert would point me to my history of sexual vulgarity.

[lovemydog]

66. Haha! Sounds like projection.

It usually is.

[Cha]

43. It said "others".. I think you're

in there. LOL NOT. the opposite of suck.

[1StrongBlackMan]

51. Like in the movies ...

if your not named in the credits, you don't count ... no matter how good your fainting looked on screen.

[JI7]

20. i think they don't like you because of support for the President

[Cha]

45. Yeah, good ol toxic supporters of President Obama .. whatever will we do without their

approval?

[lovemydog]

76. Be proven correct, by history.

[Cha]

80. Quite right, lovemydog!

[marym625]

84. peanut butter jelly time!

to you, Cha

[Cha]

87. Well that puts a smile on your face! Mahalo marym.. I've never

seen that before. rofl

to you~

[marym625]

91. Glad you enjoyed it

Mahalo!

[1StrongBlackMan]

100. More, whatever will they do when President Obama ...

is no longer President.

[Cha]

112. Exactly.. go back in the woodwork? I was thinking about this and that one racist poster sure did

tie his/her racism to President Obama by calling me out. Saying DU would be a better place without me, BainsBane, bravenak, and JustAnotherGen, among "others&quot too numerous to mention?lol).

I know.. he wants the place all to himself(call it a he since I don't know)..

"Mine All MINE!"

[appalachiablue]

340. Love this image, ha! Great, made my day esp. after sicko: Regards, Ugly White America Letter?!>!

Who is or was this toxic ex-DUer? Or troll? The wacked 'Letter' is unbelievable-don't tell us what to do, you're the problem, forget AA and wimmen groups, lay off white men, and be more conservative!?? Naming who should leave?

[WhiteTara]

228. Hate the woman that follows him?

What else. Unless it's all old greedy white men running the country (and how can they with such a minority) they are going to hate, hate, hate.

[yuiyoshida]

350. Hugs Cha..

I think we all need them.

[Cha]

360. We do.. sure

bet! yuiyoshida

[JustAnotherGen]

352. All I know was I never knew

I was in such awesome company! Who knew? I'm a brilliant disruptor with so many other ill behave women!

[Cha]

362. The racist writer called us out, Gen. we got under his skin something awful! I have no choice but

to hold it dear as a badge of honor. Especially in such grand company!

[JustAnotherGen]

368. LIKE seriously didn't realize I was so "high profile"!

Coooool!

I didn't realize people actually were that "invested" in the Internet. That's kind of sad.

[Cha]

372. I don't you didn't, Gen.. it's not like you post all the time like

some posters.. ahem. But, what you do post is some quality stuff and pissing off the right people "invested" in the internet!

[Action_Patrol]

6. Please out the username that posted this garbage.

[1StrongBlackMan]

14. That's not my job ...

I only wish to call this to great attention ... and remove any doubt as to what Black Duers have long been saying, but never believed.

[Action_Patrol]

24. I've never doubted what anyone has to put up with...

I just wish someone would name names. I'd like to know who these assholes are. They deserve a goddamn spotlight.

[octoberlib]

9. Who wrote this shite? Jesus Christ.

[aikoaiko]

12. Were those posts not hidden? Were the accounts notPPRed?

[1StrongBlackMan]

18. Yes ... No ...

I only wish to call this to great attention ... and remove any doubt as to what Black Duers have long been saying, but never believed.

[aikoaiko]

146. Those posts and those DU members are not acceptable.

[Wounded Bear]

15. Another missive from the irony challenged...(clarified)

I guess I was unclear. I'm referring to the C&P crap, not aimed at 1SBM. He's one of DU's assets IMHO. I generally find his posts to be well thought out and written.

on edit: clarification added

[1StrongBlackMan]

22. referring to me as having post an irony challenged missive? n/t

[Wounded Bear]

26. Un....no....

Sorry if I was unclear. I find the text you copied to be from an irony challenged person-probably a white supremicist-type person. I've always found your posts to be well thought out and written. You're definitely not a whiner, the guy who wrote that is.

[delrem]

27. How is 1StrongBlackMan "irony challenged"?

[Wounded Bear]

29. Not my intent...

the text he C&P'd was the irony challenged writing. I consider 1SBM to be one of the finer posters here on DU.

[delrem]

36. I'm glad that was cleared up,

because the way you stated it suggested the opposite to me.

Thank you.

[1StrongBlackMan]

125. Not a problem. n/t

[JI7]

17. and you know many on this site agree with it also

[starroute]

19. Completely unacceptable

Not least because it reads like copy-and-paste from some motherlode of racist memes. It's far too polished to be ordinary comment thread posts.

That suggest it's deliberate trolling at best -- and quite possibly outright infiltration and disruption, designed to divide the board and set people against one another. In either case, it can't be allowed to stand.

[1StrongBlackMan]

25. But one of these posters has been on DU for years ...

and has a relatively high post count.

But understand ... This was just 3 posts from one thread ... I could have post 10 more (easily) from 10 different high tenured/high post count DUers.

[starroute]

40. I've been noticing that lately in several areas

For example, the anti-Edward Snowden threads some months back.

You still see the 17-post wonders popping up to weigh in on divisive issues, but being a long-standing member with a high post count doesn't mean what it used to.

I don't know why, and I try not to get paranoid about it, so I just try to take it as a given.

[justiceischeap]

191. Just as an FYI, apparently there are people who troll DU for years

I don't know what they get out of it but they do it. I don't know if this is the case with this one or not but it does happen.

[jeff47]

349. I actually prefer they do

If they're busy trolling DU, they aren't getting anything done in the real world.

[canuckledragger]

203. There are plenty of stealth right-wing posters on DU

A high post count means nothing at all.

As stated by another poster, their purpose is to infiltrate and disrupt any meaningful debate.

You see their type whenever another mass shooting occurs, trying to poo-poo any talk of regulation and such.

You see their type during election season, trying to smear and shoot down any prominent liberal candidates.

You see their type defending police abuses.

Etc...

I see the same types on Al Sharpton's facebook page, pretending to be black people while they call him racist, a thief, etc.


This is nothing new, but an old tactic by racists and their like-minded ilk.

[1StrongBlackMan]

262. Can I point out ...

that there are plenty of folks on the Left that poo-poo any talk about race/racism to turn the discussions to what REALLY interests them, their own wallets ... erm, defeating the oligarchs.

[bettyellen]

285. And every single point in that letter from "white America" has been posted here before many times...

Often by LT DUers. We've been reading this crap for years, it only seems to be condemned now because it's all in one post.

[tblue]

376. They all should be banned.

That crap has no place here or anywhere else, imho.

Who signs a post "White America"? Clearly some kinda troll who needs to be ousted, I don't care if they are charter members of DU.

[daredtowork]

33. Concern Troll Alert

Report this stealth rightwing nutball into the ground and grind his racist trolling BS into teeny tiny pieces.

I hope his visit wasn't long.

[marym625]

34. Bravo for posting these in GD

Pretty disgusting stuff.

It's amazing to me that anyone is surprised. Look at how many "name removed" posts are around. I have only had one, possibly two, posts in months that haven't had a "name removed" reply. Each one a racist remark. And that's nothing compared to what many others get on their posts.

Look at Bravenak's poll. People actually think that black people in America are not treated any differently than white people.

The racism is rampant in the US and DU is not immune to it.

[countryjake]

104. +1000 I can't even believe how anyone can be surprised by it...

such shit has been expressed (granted, just a tad more subtly) ever since the primaries for the 2008 presidential election. Hell, it was even seen here during the aftermath of Katrina.

I think if the host consensus ends up trying to lock this thread for being too "Meta", we should stage our own little protest and demand that it remain open for discussion.

This eye-opener was long-overdue for our community.

[marym625]

109. I am hoping

They leave this be. It needs to be seen. It needs to be discussed. I think that the deniers on DU are just racists. With this up, it's kind of difficult to deny

Thanks.

[kentuck]

41. Two wrongs do not make a right...

It is not right to call a person a name because he called you a name. Those are two wrongs.

I have thought for a long while that the greatest thing about America was its ability to accept all races in a way that no other country in the world could ever do. Racism of any sort is not about equality.

Personally, I thought the election of Barack Obama was a sign that the Americans had finally climbed that mountain top, and racism, except for minor incidents, was a thing of the past.

But it seems, to look at most recent events, with the policemen killings being the most recent event, that the racism was latent in a lot of areas? And the election of Barack Obama, along with the media campaign against him, brought forth a dormant racism which we need to defeat, before it gets out of hand.

And what is the best way to fight racism??

[Cali_Democrat]

47. "And what is the best way to fight racism??"

The first step is to acknowledge it.

It also doesn't help when we have politicians like Alison Grimes trying to appeal to redneck racists.

[Old Codger]

42. that shit

Has no rightful place in our entire country say nothing of here...

[Cirque du So-What]

46. Sunlight is the best disinfectant

so thank you for bringing this to the my attention, along with those who don't usually venture past threads that appear on the Latest Threads page. I absolutely concur; this is unacceptable.

[Starry Messenger]

48. I know people say, alert and ban...

but this website needs to have a discussion of why more and more posters feel comfortable signing up to post crap like that here.

[JI7]

60. plus they seem pretty familiar with names and conversations

and seem to have personal interest in it. the singling out of certain groups is done regularly by many on this site. and that's what the scum quoted in op did.

it wasn't the usual wingnut "you commies , abortionists, god hating" type crap.

[bravenak]

72. Bingo!!!

That's the point it was trying to come to.
They knew each of us personally like they already have accounts and just opened new ones up to troll us all day long.
They even named who they think are the worst. One of the guy's first posts was about how we're ruining DU. After being a member for 2 minutes? I think those are regular posters and we need to have ip addresses compared. All day every day? Nameremoved. Ugh.

[marym625]

88. I think they will show themselves in other ways

For instance, your poll and their absence elsewhere

[bravenak]

90. Yep.

I think so too. I have my suspicions. I'll figure it out soon enough. Whomever hateps me, bains, and JAG the most are my main suspects.

[marym625]

92. I know you will.

No doubt about it. .

[1StrongBlackMan]

93. Or, their failing to weigh in/condemn conduct ...

exposed here.

Silence sometimes is consent, other times it's just enabling.

[marym625]

96. yep!

That's what I meant by their absence elsewhere.

Someone else has suspicion of who and already linked in this thread

Freshwater post 64

[freshwest]

114. No doubt one of the banned DUers at DI. And those forums over there... Wowsers!

[bravenak]

116. They've got some real winners over there...

One of them feel very familiar like I've dealt with them here recently. Today was a busy day with the racists, but I've had worse days here. The things I've read would shock the Pope.

[Starry Messenger]

267. Yes. The hateful posts have a familiar tone.

[lovemydog]

68. I agree, and I guess we're having a discussion here.

To paraphrase Salt-N-Pepa, let's talk about race.

[Gormy Cuss]

209. +1 n/t

[ismnotwasm]

54. Assholes

What really bugs me aside from the overt racism is complete ignorance of such statements. They are, in a word lies. Discretion and disease. Hurtful and harmful to the AA community, and as much as I'd like to think these are the bottom feeders I know they are not even close.

Subtle racism, institutional racism is harder for a white person to identify, and easier to deny whether it's in ourselves, or someone else, and stems unacknowledged racism-- or NOT thinking/talking/doing something about it.

[Gothmog]

58. WOW

Both of those posts are totally unacceptable.

[Bobbie Jo]

63. What?

WHAT??

Apparently this poster just out and out decloaked, but I've seen dozens of variations of the same ignorant points posted right here. The only difference is the presentation.

Unfuckingbelievable.

Glad you posted this, and no, it's not your imagination.

[freshwest]

64. Like this post saved by a DUer. This one was served pizza:

to BumRushDaShow:

10. Before it gets tombstoned here is what it posted in Cha's thread -

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025989785

Slavery was the best thing that ever happened to your people. White America civilized you, they clothed you, they fed you. They gave you a better life than anything you could have had in deepest, darkest Africa. They freed you from slavery. All white Americans have ever done is tried to help your ungrateful people, and how do you repay them?

Disgusting. Your people are the root cause of all racial discord in America because they're hateful racists, and they've been brainwashed to see themselves as victims.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025993122#post10

The post in the OP is one of the most racist insults I've read here. Really personal. Just flat out ugly. And did it not, use the exact same phrases as the newly tombstoned?

This is common with Rush and other radical anti-Democratic, anti-women, anti-minority and anti-emigrant complainers.

And the AA has been getting more posts by 'name removed' than ever. I believe that the word is getting out that there is a change coming. And they are freaking out, dredging out trash that is literally centuries old.

Please inform me of who this highly esteemed personage is, so I will know how I am talking to in the future. The assumption of speaking for a card carrying white person like me, is pretty presumptive and a mistake.

Why does anyone reject such hard won wisdom as black people have gained and still persevered?

We need to listen like liberals and progressives and give way to minorities and their stories, not be offended. Do we or do we not need allies in the our work against those who oppress?

The hyper identification with being white above principles and social justice is foolish. Are we the oppressors of minorities or are we fellow sojourners to a greater cause?

The old saying goes, 'The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.' No reason to stay in that state, time to learn and change or the world will leave you behind. Quit biting your littermates, says kitteh mom.

Let me know if I'm missing the full context of the OP.

[blackspade]

156. It just makes me want to bang my head into my desk....

[countryjake]

69. Point #5 of that first one sounds like it's straight from a white nationalist...

I've seen that exact same sentiment coming from latent stormfront goons when debating whether reparations must be paid to minorities who deal with continuing oppression in our country. And I mean, to the word, that same exact line.

DU must keep them very busy, copying and pasting from their handy white power handbooks.

When bravenak posted a graphic, earlier, of what she imagines "Name Removed" must look like, I had to shake my head. I'd sooner think it must be some muscle-bound pig with swastika tats all over their head and face.

The DU jury system emboldens such scum to come here and engage in the sport of bait and attack, to see how many hides they can deliver to our sincere posters, get people forced into time-outs, and even banned. Like a sick game...

All I can do is continue to not feed the trolls, ignore and alert, and send every failed jury on to a MIRT member or directly to Skinner. As hard (and as useless) as that may seem, I think it's the best any of us can do to prevent DU from totally imploding.


I thank you for posting this shit...it needs to be seen.

[alcibiades_mystery]

71. The Admins seem to consider these outright White Supremecist posts to be mere DU factions

I'm horrified beyond description.

All these out-and-out racist posts are being treated as if they're just different "positions." Oh, whatever. It's just Manny Goldstein v. ProSense, or whatever. No. It is not mere factionalism. It is racism. DU is allowing racism and becoming a racist board. The three main Admins, who are three white males, have been wise on factionalism for the most part, but they are dead fucking wrong on allowing this shit. It's racism. It's destructive. It's horrific. Where are they? Where?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

94. Here's one weighing in...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1270&pid=1388

[bravenak]

97. You made me laugh with that one.nt

[A-Schwarzenegger]

121. Lots of passion about the injustice

of a bad Hobbit flick.

[bravenak]

122. No shit.

I'm all torn up about it too. Most important issue of the year.

[XemaSab]

278. Yup

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12596695

[WillyT]

74. WTF ???

Were these all new trolls ???

[countryjake]

83. I doubt any of them are actually new people...

I'd be willing to bet that they're regular DUers, probably, using proxies to hide who they really are from Elad, EarlG, and Skinner.

There's too much familiarity in such posts to be coming from anyone new. Names are named, often, and the baiting is directed at only certain outspoken DUers.

[DonCoquixote]

103. ill see that and raise you

I bet these people are on discussiont, cosniodering how many exiles brag about attacking us with sock puppets.

[countryjake]

132. That may be, but such a racist rant as that first "letter" has been around...

here at DU since long before Discussionist ever existed. Not all wrapped up in such a filthy little package as the diatribe which 1StrongBlackMan has shown us, tho; way too often such sentiments have whistled right over our heads and that's why I believe that they most likely reside here, comfortable, longtime.

I haven't a doubt that such types have flocked over to that forum; I only read over there for the first few days, then gave it up as a lost cause.

[DonCoquixote]

139. i'll re raise

If skinner wnats to make a dollar making a post where the bad chuildren can pay him to feed them candy, that is one thing, but when these people activly brag about riggign juries, or getting seabeyond hidden (again), then I have to wonder, why should I pay money to DU when they will give that money to discussionist? That would be like me feeding Freeperville.

[1StrongBlackMan]

157. Allow me to edit ...

Not all wrapped up in such a filthy little package as the diatribe which 1StrongBlackMan has shown us, tho; way too often such sentiments have whistled right over our heads {despite what PoC have been alerting us to} and that's why I believe that they most likely reside here, comfortable, longtime.

[countryjake]

184. Thank you!

A friend of mine who came here with me from another message board, back when old DU first began, was run off by that subtle shit, quite awhile ago. We used to call it whistling past the tombstone when some post that was blatant enough to us would be allowed to stand by the mods. With things set up the way they are now, it's hard to even have outright flaming offenses handled properly.

[hfojvt]

161. there are people from other sites

by which I mean conservative sites, who read a whole lot of DU, and have for years.

Possible that some of them have registered and stayed here as "deep cover trolls" or repeat socks. I mean, Dookus, for example was here for years under a couple of names. So was TangerineLabamba.

[countryjake]

188. Oh yeah, I know, that list is probably a mile long by now...

if you just think about all the corrosives that've been tombstoned and PPRed thru all these years.

[marble falls]

78. All I can say is that there is no open season on anyone here except racists, trolls and disruptors..

most of these posts are down within minutes. We do it together, the black and white overwhelming majority of the DU community.

[Feral Child]

81. I had a visceral reaction to your OP, 1SBM.

I felt an actual revulsion, a sick knot in my stomach.

I just don't know what to say, 1SBM. I am so deeply sorry you had to read those statements. Those and others i just read, reviewing some longish threads in this Group, trying to get a perspective on what you've posted.

I've restarted this post over and over, but I'm too angry, too ashamed, too damn raw to express myself. I try to imagine how you must feel and it just overwhelms me.

Love your screen-name, 1StrongBlackMan. I guess you have to be.

[herding cats]

82. Both of these posters were low post count trolls who have been banned?

I'm only asking because I'd missed their posts and when I search for the wording in them now all I get are to "Name Removed" links.

Was it this one and this one?

The racist assholes are out in force. I wouldn't be surprised if we've managed to attract morons from some of the worst forums of that type. It's happened before with other hate sights when high profile topics hit the news about guns, race, gay rights and womens rights. Totally disgusting knuckle dragging idiots with nothing better to do with their time!

[marym625]

99. These are obviously people who have been here a while

Too specific and too pointed.

And I am sure getting their jollies reading this post. Sick m-Fers

[herding cats]

107. Oh, I hear you!

There are a lot of assholes who have been trolling this site for years and years. Sick demented little minds who get off on tossing out some hate bomb and then sitting at the keyboards with their Cheetos stained fingers and reeking of BO, while they giggle to themselves over the imagined grief they've caused people. What they get out of doing shit like this is a mystery to me. I guess it could be their lives suck so badly they feel they have to tear everyone else down to their same level just so they have a fighting chance at making the curve. Personally, I think it's a form of mental illness.

[marym625]

113. No doubt

It's a sociopath. They've done studies on these sad little people.

Although, I think the poster of the second one is so jealous they can't see straight. A racist misogynist that hates seeing black women get more attention than they do.

[herding cats]

142. I agree with you about the poster in the second one 100%.

I'm thinking that's one of our many times over banned assholes considering the strong personalities they selected to hate and the things they mentioned. You can always pick them off by the little tells they give away. I don't know a lot of members here very well, but they picked on some people there I have major respect and admiration for. My thinking is any person who would single out the AA group, the feminist groups, MIRT and those power posters is a person who spends way too much time reading here and hating us. I don't waste my free time trolling places I don't like, but for people like that one it's what they do for shits and giggles. Like I said, sick, demented, etc.

Don't let someone like that asshole get you down or skew your view of this site, or anything else for that matter! That's what they want and I don't want them to get their way. They don't count for anything here, or anyplace else for that matter and I don't care what they call us, they're a slimy internet troll and they're the ones who have to live with their nasty personalities, not us. I know I'd never put up with a jerk like that in my life, and I have a feeling you wouldn't either. Screw them!

[Blanks]

297. It's odd isn't it.

I don't waste my free time trolling places I don't like

I hadn't really given it much thought, but who does that? Unless they're compensated somehow, who spends all their time antagonizing a group that keeps banning them?

It doesn't sound like any way to spend your free time. It can't bring much joy to the person doing it.

[jeff47]

359. And that's the price they pay

It can't bring much joy to the person doing it.

Nope. And that's the price they pay for doing it.

[herding cats]

384. They enjoy harming other people.

It satisfies a sadistic personality to hurt other people. My guess is since some of these people seem to have taken on trolling this site over and over again, they're enjoying the pain they cause the members here. So, to put it simply they're sadist. They're just using the internet to get their fix by hurting people on a discussion board. They're cyber sadists.

[Quantess]

106. He said one of the DUers was not new.

I am dying to know who the long-timer was!

[herding cats]

110. Maybe a sleeper troll account?

If they had too many posts the software wouldn't have removed their posts. I don't know what the threshold is on that, but I'm sure I read it was in the low 100's of posts.

[Jamaal510]

85. IDK where to start dissecting this.

Point #2 in the first comment: Nobody in the Black community said that the world "revolves around us". All we have wanted for years is fairness and for other people (like that commenter) to quit behaving like insensitive assholes.
#3: It goes both ways--learn how to treat people right and not be so self-centered when it comes to other people's needs and feelings. You want Blacks to stop complaining about racism and unfairness? Stop acting that way!
#4: This sounds like something straight off of FOX. For starters, this "generous welfare state" typically doesn't even provide enough for a family to live on per month or pay rent with. This person sounds like the typical wingnut who thinks that a person has to be dirt-poor and with literally nothing in order to qualify for help. Also, obviously not all families have access to clean water, heating, etc., and our healthcare is still expensive compared to other 1st world nations. Our so-called welfare state is nowhere near as generous as that of Scandinavia, for example.

As far as the second comment goes, these groups shouldn't even be needed on a supposedly progressive/Democratic website, but they are. The reason why is because not everyone on this site has been receptive to the concerns of feminists and minorities. Rarely does a related thread get posted in GD anymore without a handful of posters derailing it and calling people who they disagree with "extremist" just for speaking out. The same thing also applies to the need for a BOG on a site that supposedly supports Democrats. Whenever a person in GD posts something Pres. O accomplished that progressives would generally support, there are frequently one or more posters making "well, that's not enough/too late/we forced him to do it..." types of comments, and DUers get called "third-way", "cheerleaders", and other BS.
And this:

The only thing that can save DU at this point is making it more open, especially to more conservative views. MIRT is one of the biggest obstacles to free discussion at DU right now, and should really be retired.

would be sort of the antithesis to what DU is about. It would be like me going on KKK or Stormfront's sites, demanding a discussion on Black issues.
This 2nd comment sounded like it not only came from a wingnut dumbass troll, but someone who is clearly obsessed with Black people for whatever reason--to troll the AA group that hard.

[AgingAmerican]

86. Too much race baiting going on around here

...period.

[1StrongBlackMan]

89. Yes, pointing out instances of race-baiting/racism is ...

just as bad as saying the racist crap. Gotcha.

[AgingAmerican]

111. You missed my point entirely

Sigh...

Have a good evening.

[DonCoquixote]

118. sigh

which is DU speak for "I was caught by my own BS, but will act superior in order to avoiud beignb called out or actually learning something."

[AgingAmerican]

119. ...

[DonCoquixote]

123. go ahead and facepalm

The fact is that people got all over the OP because people posted some vile, nasty stuff that no Democratic, Liberal site would tolerate, and then you came and tried to shame the OP against speaking about it, as if what he did was "race baiting."


We here at DU have every right, no the duty, to look at threads that are vile and say "how did THESE get on here?" like the vile "white America" thread. That's not hurting feelings, that is seeing if this site wants to stay a liberal site. If we think we are here to champion or own side of things (be it race, unions, insert faction of Democrats here) and ignore everyone else, , then we will lose.

Then again, not like Bill Clinton made any apologies for his "we got mugged" comments either, or Hillary her "he is not a Muslim as far as I know (wink wink nudge nudge.) Priviledge means you never have to apologize.

[AgingAmerican]

126. Wrong again

[1StrongBlackMan]

160. Bingo ...

We here at DU have every right, no the duty, to look at threads that are vile and say "how did THESE get on here?" like the vile "white America" thread. That's not hurting feelings, that is seeing if this site wants to stay a liberal site. If we think we are here to champion or own side of things (be it race, unions, insert faction of Democrats here) and ignore everyone else, , then we will lose.

One cannot be a liberal and (consistently) tell me, a Black man, that income inequity is more important than racial equality (or tell women, or the LGBT, that income inequity is more than misogyny or gay rights).

Well, you can ... but don't expect me to take you seriously as an ally.

[DonCoquixote]

364. now this is not to lower

the value of income equality one penny, especially as because, let's be honest, whatever gains minorties have made to power is NOT because Uncle Sam has had Ebenezr Scrooge like change of heart, but because they wanted our money. Even when Jackie Robinson was hired, the owner of the St. Louis Cardinals said "we sell beer to everyone" meaning he realized his dollars were made of our pennies. We cannot yield any front, because a table with one busted leg is a table with one busted leg. However, when some champion income equality over civil rights, what they are foten syaing is that "if we could get back the good old days, we would leave you in the dust." I can read Joe Beagant and enjoy his insight, but what the SOB never understood is that the goals was never to get back to the "goold old days" where minorities were used as the pavement for their roads, and that no, we do not owe any gratitude to them, because whatever they gave us, they also took from us, even if it was the smug knowledge that the worst of the White voices would blast over the best of the others.

[Number23]

127. NAILED. IT.

[1StrongBlackMan]

120. No,I think I understand perfectly ...

"Both sides do it. And both side need to stop!"

Am I right?

[AgingAmerican]

124. You are wrong

You have a nice evening. And wipe that chip off your shoulder...

[bravenak]

129. No. They're right.

I remember you.

[AgingAmerican]

133. See post #130

And have a nice evening!!

[bravenak]

145. You too!

Good evening!

[DonCoquixote]

131. he might if people stop swinging at his head

and since you state we are wrong, why do you not explain what you actually do mean, or are you going for the zen koan approach? Seriously, if you claim no one understands you, than go ahead and explain "what I was saying was (insert answer)" If you do not explain what you meant, how do you expect people to get what you mean? Or is it that you think it is beneath you to do so? or that you cannot, if either is true, than do realize you will NOT get desired results, unless it is for people to ignore you while you spout off "wrong" like some malfucntioning fortune teller machine.

[1StrongBlackMan]

134. Then explain it ...

And I have no chip on my shoulder ... I will not, however, ignore racist stuff {ETA: ... I don't have that luxury}.

Aging Americans, or Americans of a certain age, wish to claim some credit for stuff they did (claim to have done) 50+ years ago;but, are slow to recognize how they have(are) stymied(ing) progress today.

With all due respect (chip-shouldered and all) ... I am speaking directly to you.

Now, you have a choice ... you can pause to consider what I am saying; or, you can defensively and reflexively deny/ignore what I have said ... and go back to your life.

[AgingAmerican]

135. See post #130

Sometimes you have to take off the blinders to see that someone agrees with you.

I have to work tomorrow, have a pleasant evening.

[1StrongBlackMan]

138. I saw it before I posted. n/t

[AgingAmerican]

140. Very well put

Kudos

G'nite

[KMOD]

128. Your point was apparently

what you believe is to much race-baiting.

That point does not fit with the context of this thread.

Clarification of your point, would be nice. Otherwise it appears that you have missed the point.

Just sayin'.

[AgingAmerican]

130. Baiting a racial group

Baiting people, using racially-inflammatory issues or stereotypes.

Note: Some people consider making accusations of racism where there are likely none to be race-baiting. This is tricky because it hinges on the viewpoint of the person who is judging whether or not racism is involved. It is possible to underestimate the possibility of racism. Thus some people say people are using the race card when they are legitimately concerned that racism is a factor. Using the race-card in and of itself is not race-baiting. Using the race-card in order to bait people is race-baiting.

Is action against racism race-baiting if it's done in order to increase political action? I don't think so.

[DonCoquixote]

137. ok, at least you tired to explain..

Now...let's roll back to the OP. The author founds egregious exampels of stuff tyhat should NOT be on DU, any more than a thread saying "union guys are thugs" should be allowed on DU. Just as the author has tried to explain time and time again that there are stupi posts about race, I am sure that you could find posts about Unions just as bad. Indeed, if you do, let me know, because I do want to read it,. and I have nop doubt you could because there are both paid trolls and , AND, AND people who are simply assholes in sheep's clothing, or rather elehpants in donkey's clothing.

But here is where you and I part:

"Using the race-card in order to bait people is race-baiting. "

So, considerign the op did not wirte any of these posts, HOW is what he did race baiting. If he went ahead and found posts about Unions (and oh yes, you and I both know DU can print some stinkers, especially where education unions are demonized, hell, madflordian can probably fill both our desks with such posts.) then we, as DU can and should be ouytaged at the wolves in sheep's clothing. But you had to accuse him of race baiting.

[AgingAmerican]

258. Doh!

Your crystal ball is irreparably broken

[DonCoquixote]

321. another short pithy comment

without explianing or responding.

I'll tell you what, if this is how you plan for us to win the elections in 2016, we might as well be prepared to weather another four years of some fool named Bush in power. Appealing to authority one does not have and attacking without offering facts to back it up just creates the ideal opponent the GOP wants, a useful punching bag that cannot even get sympathy, or even respect, from those on the left.

Keep facepalming, at least you can ACT like you are saying something, meanwhile, those of us who know that the issues of race and class need to be dealt with will be solving problems.

[KMOD]

143. Oh for crying out loud,

Put down you damn psyk books, re-read the op, and respond with normal human emotion and thought, or don't respond at all. Geez!!!

[Major Nikon]

291. Results...

On Tue Dec 30, 2014, 11:01 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

Baiting a racial group
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6019948

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

There were plenty of examples of actual racism in the OP. To claim the OP is race-baiting is highly insensitive, inappropriate and is the worst of community standards. And that is exactly what this poster is doing.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Dec 30, 2014, 11:21 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: It appears as if someone is trying to catch someone else in an alert trap. I'm not going to encourage them.
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: the whole subthread from post #86 should go away.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Why was this alerted?

[AgingAmerican]

409. Doh!

[TexasTowelie]

98. I wanted to add my support and give the thread a K&R.

I respect your posts and find the excerpts that you and others provided to be disgusting. Beware of the trolls from other Websites that lurk at DU.

[antiquie]

245. Apologies to the Group,

Last edited Tue Dec 30, 2014, 05:02 PM - Edit history (1)

inappropriate post here.

[TexasTowelie]

326. The moment that someone mentioned that it was insensitive I immediately deleted it.

I also posted an apology afterwards. Was there anything else that I could have done after I realized that my failed attempt at humor was offensive to others? The post was intended to be about climate change deniers not about racial issues.

[DonCoquixote]

101. this quote

"
The only thing that can save DU at this point is making it more open, especially to more conservative views. MIRT is one of the biggest obstacles to free discussion at DU right now, and should really be retired. "

If that does not stink of discussionist trolley, nothing does. IF YOU WANT TO BE ON A CONSERVATIVE SITE, FIND ONE!

[1StrongBlackMan]

108. I suspect this thread is/will be the talk of that other site tomorrow ...

I understand, over there, I have already been named as the biggest racist on DU. And I had a DU post about my family history that got a bit of play.

[JustAnotherGen]

211. That person has discussionist

Why can't they be there?

And nope - nothing should be done to make 'those' people happy -

Until we bring back some moderators to this site.

[ismnotwasm]

221. Apparently they want to stir it up

What's horrific, is when someone signs up and deliberately trolls a thread with racist comments, and regular DUers get on that same thread and sound little different than the trolls, in some cases actually agreeing with them-- not seeing the racism--or not caring. The fact that I am shocked at this is an example of my own white privilege.

[JustAnotherGen]

223. No the fact that you are shocked at this

Is because they do the same thing to a lot of groups around here - and you have a tremendous EMPATHY chip for people not precisely like you.

One of 'those' also got a 1Strong post hidden this weekend accusing him of being a misogynist. Uh - no. Anyone who defines themself as a feminist around her knows that's the last damn man at DU - that acts like that.


This is a group effort - these aren't 'individuals'.

[seabeyond]

328. i agree with all of this post, also. nt

[ismnotwasm]

394. ...

[DeSwiss]

102. K&R

''In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happened, you can bet it was planned that way.''
~President Franklin Delano Roosevelt

[marym625]

115. +1000

[applegrove]

117. These are conservative sockpuppets

pretending they belong here. It was the same when women‘s rights was baited. Femminism is a pretty settled issue on the left. Women should be treated as equals. Now the powers that be are under scrutiny for how they police black youth and here come the GOP race baitors to stir up anxiety, fear and hatred when the people of the DU pretty much agree that policing needs to change and a discussion needs to take place. I hope you get that yhe GOP are scared because the police are part of their coalition and a good discussion between african americans and the police and powers that be might threaten the GOP ‘Southern Strategy‘. This is about power in so many ways. And today African Americans are winning (and then the police and we all win). That is what results from dialogue. I don‘t doubt that more dynamic policing will be the result. So, as to these posters?, they have lost and you are winning. The DU must be doing something right to have garnered such attention. I‘m sorry their panic has taken the shape of such vile and discusting thoughts. These trolls know exactly how dispicable they are acting. But they‘ve sold themselves for money and don‘t care who it hurts. It is the panic of morons who have no idea how to build a great country.

[eridani]

144. Wondering if Twitter and Facebook have something to do with this

Buttons to tweet and like are new features of this edition of DU. I tweet a lot, especially posts that have information that is not widely available. Wondering if some of the newbies that might be thus attracted are less than desirable netizens. I'm reluctant to stop the practice because it probably attracts a lot of worthwhile new people as well.

I've always thought of Discussionist as a troll nature preserve where you are allowed to tease the wildlife--maybe that has also backfired.

[SidDithers]

147. Fuck 'em...

Sid

[1StrongBlackMan]

153. +1 ...

LOL ...

[Stellar]

377. +1

I agree also!

[NBachers]

149. Absolutely unacceptable

I spend a lot of time on DU, but there's a lot here that I don't see. Usually I don't know about it 'till after it's happened and I read about it in another thread.

That said; many other "topical news and discussion" sites are filled with the most vile kind of hate and trolling. I start to scroll down through the comments sections, and I feel unclean and sick to my stomach.

Sometimes I lose hope; sometimes I feel like this is what everyone else in America thinks in their own unfiltered mind.

I come here for my daily dose of sanity, sensibility, and intelligent education. It's a way for me to stabilize my own, sometimes tossed-and-tumbled, psyche.

I read a lot of posts that don't mirror my opinion or experience, but that's OK. We're not all the same.

But I can't abide the hate, racism, and vitriol I sometimes see here. As I said, it's absolutely unacceptable.

Thanks for putting this in front of me, 1StrongBlackMan. I'm always glad to see your contributions here.

[sheshe2]

150. Kicking to 150 ~

[blackspade]

152. Holy Shit!

Un-Fucking-Believable

Three of the worst dumb shit posts I have ever read at DU. And that is saying something.

[DesertDiamond]

154. WHAT are those people doing on DU??? Trolls should be cleaned out of this place.

[Unknown Beatle]

159. WTF?

[div class= "excerpt"]The only thing that can save DU at this point is making it more open, especially to more conservative views. MIRT is one of the biggest obstacles to free discussion at DU right now, and should really be retired.

This is a progressive site and making it more open to conservative views will save it? Sounds like a true conservative posted this shit and is wishfully thinking for the demise of DU and the biggest obstacle is not MIRT but racist assholes like this poster that slimed his way into a liberal site.

Whoever posted that crap, FUCK YOU! Piece of shit! I don't care if this post gets hidden because I'm tired of playing nice to racist dumb assholes that don't know the meaning of civil discourse.

This gets me pissed off and sick to my stomach.

Stay strong, 1StrongBlackMan.

[Mbrow]

162. I was #6 on this one and voted to hide it,

I believe there are trolls who come and disrupt honest discussion, some are more subtle then others. this first clown wan't one of them.

Thanks for the post.

[gwheezie]

163. That's not the only racist comments posted

These examples are the more blatant. It cannot be tolerated and I don't care how many posts someone has, there is no room for this among normal decent people.
I have sought out several as group members to read and I haven't read anything in that group that could be interpreted as racism towards white people. AA is one of my preferred groups because of the posters in that group. I'm white. I am not offended by any discussion about the continued effects of racism in our society. we live in a racist society. There's no "but" after that statement.

[steve2470]

164. Thanks for posting this, 1StrongBlackMan

I'm glad they were both PPR'ed, especially the long-timer. That BS has no place on DU or anywhere for that matter. The AA group is really getting targeted right now, and hopefully that will cease soon.

[Quackers]

167. ...

no words.....

[ChosenUnWisely]

168. Damn looks like a freerepublic or stormfront posts

[etherealtruth]

169. Unfortunately it has been very clear that its NOT your imagination

The first was the creation of the African American and feminist groups. The more prescient DUers commented at the time that this would only divide people, create a clique-like environment and create safe havens for extremists. Over time, the bullying and alert-stalking of the rest of DU by these two groups created a very hostile atmosphere and it killed open debate.

I wonder what kind of place they would like DU to be? (I actually do not wonder)

[bravenak]

170. I noticed that too.

Like, damn, they want the blacks and women and Obama lovers gone.

[malaise]

171. Freaking wow - those were posted on DU

No wonder I spend my time in GD - damn!

[BainsBane]

172. He called me a coalburner

I had to look it up. The entry in the urban dictionary was horrific.

The disconcerting thing is that he speaks as though he has long-term familiarity with DU.

[albino65]

365. I had never heard of this term before

I also looked it up, and I was appalled. I apologize for him, not as a man, but as a member of the human race.

[BainsBane]

367. Thank you

He's a real piece of work, as you can tell from the text posted in the OP.

[OKNancy]

174. This is NOT a DU member. This is a recurring troll

who comes back again and again. As a MIRT member, I can tell you that he usually only gets in one post and we zap him.
In some ways you have done his job. He desperately wanted to get these posts read and now he has won since you posted them.

I realize it's hurtful to read, but this guy is one sick mofo. No real DU member thinks this way or they would be nuked too.

[BainsBane]

179. He has long-term familiarity with DU

and talks about how the place has been ruined by people of color, feminists, and people sympathetic to "criminals." Yes, MIRT keeps banning him, but I'd like to know who he is. Does he or did he have a regular account here? He sure talks like he does/did.

[OKNancy]

182. I suspect he is a zombie as well

He was probably banned. I seriously doubt he still has an ongoing account.

[Skidmore]

229. He was banned. I checked this morning first thing.

I was on the jury that voted unanimously to hide that awful post.

[OKNancy]

235. I meant the original DU member

I'm on MIRT so I see all the banned accounts. This jerk has been banned...maybe 100 times.
He makes about 10 accounts a day.

[Skidmore]

240. Is it no possible to block his

ISP number? I just assumed that was what happened when someone got MIRTed.

[OKNancy]

241. He is using an IP hide program or some sort of program to get around an IP block.

What bothers me most about this thread is that some here really think this is indicative of normal DU thinking.
This is a nut-job troll who is getting his kicks trolling DU. It's working too.

[Skidmore]

242. I know that I have strongly believed

there are quite a few trolls representing more than one ideological group with agendas on this site for many years. Until they out themselves so blatantly, it is hard to shine a light on them without getting banned yourself. I don't hide users generally. I've used that feature sparingly. It is very distressing at times to see the level of abusiveness that is acceptable to some of the most egregious violators. I so get tired of that old saw about politics not being bean bag. Viciousness is never a starting point for civil discussion.

[seabeyond]

248. +1. nt

[AwakeAtLast]

273. Good grief!

Why would anyone go to that trouble? Someone needs to get a life!

[PeaceNikki]

252. Have there been IP checks to see if it's a sock of a current member?

[OKNancy]

254. I'm sure Earl or Elad has done that.

[1StrongBlackMan]

279. I understand that ...

In some ways you have done his job. He desperately wanted to get these posts read and now he has won since you posted them.

I realize it's hurtful to read, but this guy is one sick mofo. No real DU member thinks this way or they would be nuked too.

But my intent was to display this to the "real DU members" that consistently question whether there is racism on DU ... and more, it's to those that ignore it.

[Jappleseed]

175. Really is shameful.

Though I believe this turn has occurred hand in hand with the gun nutters release into the general forum. When that happened the whole forum became a bloody and vile place as folks pushed the boundaries.

[MrScorpio]

176. KicKAGE!

[riqster]

178. Posts such as those you cite remind me of something an uncle once said:

"Kid; study biology. In all of God's creation, you'll find that shit always, always, always comes out of assholes."

Thank you for reminding us that sphincterish behavior exists everywhere, even on boards like this one. We all need to listen to others; indeed, we need to also listen carefully to ourselves from time to time.

Many's the time I have been called out for proving my late uncle's maxim. It was unpleasant to hear, but neccesary for my growth.

[bettyellen]

180. Anyone who is shocked by this, ain't been paying attention.....

It's interesting to see who's ignoring this thread- quite a few very prolific posters here actually agree with some of the sentiments expressed by those racist shit heads.

[ellenrr]

183. I'm not shocked by it, and I'm not shocked by it being on DU- DU is an open site

that anyone can join. there is no barrier, that says you must be a person of some intelligence before you join.
DU reflects America.
The anonymity of the internet allows many racists to come out of their holes, who in real life may or may not express themselves openly.

[JustAnotherGen]

213. Thanks betty - I agree

It was an interesting weekend.

Just wondering where all of those 'oh fiddle dee' types are now? Bored maybe?

[1StrongBlackMan]

281. I don't know that they agree ...

and, actually, suspect they do not ... It's just they don't CARE!

Like rand on the CRA, he states he PERSONAL finds discrimination abhorrent; but, it is less an important issue than individual freedom. In these DU(er)'s case, racism is PERSONALLY abhorrent; but, is not as important as fighting income inequality/the 1%.

[myrna minx]

181. This made me sick to my stomach. Such ugly and disturbing racism has no place here.

[Marrah_G]

185. Never thought it was your imagination

Unfortunately racism and bigotry infiltrate just about every group...including progressives. I am left shaking my head because you just know the people who wrote those don't for a second consider themselves prejudiced.

[Glassunion]

186. But... But... But... I've been told there is no racism on DU.

Just a few weeks ago and that I am the one with the problem.

[1StrongBlackMan]

283. Well, to be fair ...

"there's no REAL racism on DU or in the Democratic Party." (actual DU quote)

[Glassunion]

287. My personal favorite when I referenced the "I hate Ni**ers. That is all." post...

So someone titles an OP in GD "I hate niggers. That is all.", and I'm the asshole for pointing it out...

People like yourself, who attack people completely out of context, either out of a lack of critical thinking, or out of some truly assholish desire to fuck with people, really do, through these kinds of actions, make this place suck for the rest of us sometimes, whether it involves accusations of racism or something else.

I make DU suck because I don't like it when white people use the n-word...

[ms liberty]

187. OMG...

This is disgusting. Any DU'er who believes and would write this filth should just resign and join freeper central, because their minds are already there. I am a middle aged, southern white woman, and I've been on DU since before 03...and I am so sorry that my AA brothers and sisters are being forced to deal with this racist garbage! This is unacceptable behavior and we all must call it out when we see it. "Our lives begin to end when we become silent about the things that matter." (MLK)

[mmonk]

189. Really sad. Had no idea.

[LeftishBrit]

192. As a present and former member of MIRT, some background

There is at least one, and possibly more than one, racist troll who signs up again and again and again to post vile racism. Sometimes they also branch out into misogyny, homophobia and anti-Semitism. But racism is a constant.

The quotes you give are clearly from this troll, or group of trolls.

They are generally banned after two or three posts at the most, but then seem to sign up under a new name very quickly.

It is absolutely sickening and disgusting and reflects a horrible sickness in society at large. But it's not the attitude of 'DU-ers' but of people who wish to disrupt DU.

[annabanana]

204. can we not block the IP identity or something?

A more permanent solution?

[jeff47]

361. Wouldn't work.

For almost all of us, IPs change all the time. Your ISP is going to regularly hand out a different IP. Blocking at a higher level is going to be way too broad - for example, they could block anyone on Time Warner Cable.

Theoretically, and email verification could slow them down, but there's a lot of places that will hand out free email addresses.

There isn't a particularly good technological solution

[1StrongBlackMan]

284. I really appreciate the fine efforts of MIRT. n/t

[BrotherIvan]

387. Sometimes I see things in threads that make my jaw drop like that in the OP

I can't imagine what MIRT has to read. It's like someone's insane brain screaming. It's been rather eye opening to realize that yes, they really do hate us that much.

[deafskeptic]

410. well, it has been my experience that if someone has an issue with one minority group, they

will have problem with other minority groups as well.


Just so you know where I'm coming from: I'm a white woman who has been deaf all her life.

I've had to deal with people who think they are more intelligent than me because they can hear better than I can all my life. Or they complain too many deaf are on disability even those very same people would not hire the deaf because of telephone issues. Such people suddenly become unable to text the deaf and using voice is required for the job. This is for jobs with low communication requirements. We're not talking about being a phone operater or a secretary.

Many of those people also have problems with ethical. GLBTs, etc.. And then there's the deaf version of "uncle toms" to contend with as well.

I'm just getting warmed up too . However, I think you'll get the message.

[TNNurse]

193. I have always lived in the south.

I grew up with the guilt of what white southerners had said and done. I went to college and learned that horrific bigotry was not isolated to the south. I traveled some in the country and saw and heard it happen.

Now I see horrific racism in public officials, police departments, churches, teachers, doctors and pretty much every aspect of life. I did not expect to see it here in DU. I could not finish reading that post. I do not need to learn what racists think. I have known about it for all of my life. As a white person I have spoken my mind and pointed out behaviors and probably isolated myself from some people.

I no longer feel guilty for the words and acts of other citizens. I feel rage, sadness and horror, but I am not that kind of person and I will not share responsibility because we read and post in the same place.

Please continue efforts to block and remove hate filled words from people who need our pity for their small minded thoughts. They do not have my pity, they only have my disgust.

[gregcrawford]

195. Bigots are a lower life form

Sadly, my stepson married one, and he's gone completely over to the Dark Side. You cannot reason with bigots because they haven't the intellectual capacity to comprehend what your saying, or to grasp complex issues. Most literally do not have the vocabulary to express themselves intelligibly. And they'd carve out their own eyeballs with a rusty spoon before they'd EVER admit they were wrong about anything. Unbelievably, nearly all consider themselves "Good Christians!" As far as I'm concerned, they can take their sick and twisted idea of "Christian" and shove it sideways where the Sun don't shine.

I suspect that the "Self-identified Liberals" are, in fact, Right-wing trolls who take malicious delight in smearing their feces on the walls of DU and other progressive sites.

Scum from the shallow end of the gene pool will pollute reasoned discourse for generations to come; not much we can do about that. But we don't have to be silent and let them get away with it.

[B Calm]

196. I was a juror on that post! He's gone now!

[ProfessorGAC]

199. I'll Express It

What kind of tool writes that kind of stuff? Despicable.

[rbrnmw]

200. kick

thanks 1SBM

[annabanana]

201. great jumping jesus

That is disgusting. I had no idea that there was that degree of trolling. I'm glad the mods deleted them, but are the posters tombstoned?

[DLevine]

207. I hear you, ISBM. No, it's not your imagination.

We all need to speak up against racism, forcefully and often, including admins.

[JustAnotherGen]

210. Silence is Deafening

I'm deaf at who has remained silent.

Maybe I'll get my hearing back later today - or tomorrow?

I'm just wondering where all the "Who me?" folks are on this -







Perhaps -more concerned with their great *redacted* hope rap star?
Corn rows?
Fried Chicken?

I'd think they would want to be all over this to explain to us why it's NOT wrong and well - fiddle dee -

No worries - don't you worry your little picking heads over this.



This is why I went ballistic this weekend on a thread.

I do not doubt that other people have had hard times in other places. I don't doubt it.

But comparing what happened 100 / 200 years ago in some far away place to what is going on for black people in America today is fucking insulting. So I take back any apologies I gave this weekend. I hope my dismissal of people who have been dead for a hundred fucking years HURTS. That was then, this is now. They can suck it. So can the people who want me to feel bad for them.

And your silence and lack of even a rec -

Let's put it this way . . . that second post? I think I Know PRECISELY who you are.

Only ONE person is that detached, cold , and totally lacking in sympathy/empathy for other human beings that I've seen in my 7 years at DU.

But if I say it in writing - I get a hide.


The thing is - the people that wrote those posts have no honor - no integrity. That's who and what they are. So until someone steps forward and owns up to the one where I'm named -

I have a short list of three people with a top suspect whose writing style DIRECTLY matches that one -

And I'm gonna have to give them the stink eye.

No worries - I'll be polite. I'll even stand on the line of TOS - but that's all I'm gonna do.

[Gormy Cuss]

212. That's some egregious shit.

I don't care that two of the three comments were from repeat racists trolls. I care about the one that wasn't. I care about the more subtle or polite racism that will pass jury muster --- and there's an increasing amount of it on DU these days.

[JustAnotherGen]

214. I did an OP about it in 'America' this weekend

http://www.democraticunderground.com/118710763

^I had to be careful with my wording - but I figured being compared to Rick Santorum is probably pretty insulting.^

[brer cat]

215. These posts are so vile.

Take away: "it appears high time more DUers express that this is unacceptable."

I am guilty of walking away in disgust without posting some times...I posted early in Tobin's thread in AA then left. We all need to speak up whether it is abuse of AA members, women or LGBT.

This is a really important thread, 1SBM, and I appreciate that you posted it.

[Bluenorthwest]

216. LGBT DUers can relate, admins purged many gay posters for calling out the bigots. Other DUers

did not accept that the bigotry existed. They still don't. Here's an example of what we put up with all the time on DU, this poster is still on DU. At least the racists you cite got banned. The homophobes are always allowed to stay. They are always given comfort by a wide range of DU posters.
This is from an OP the morning after the election, Nov 5 2014:
"The openness and brazenness of the LBGT agenda and the media flaunting of gay marriages all across the country cost Dems dearly and threatens to do so in the future."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025764803#post45

That poster 'self deleted' after several hours of being told how shitty it was. No jury hid it and that poster is still present.
When I see that poster in a thread, I simply exit the thread after noting who is cozy with the bigotry merchant.
And I never, ever have qualms about pointing out bigotry by name. I could offer, if you'd like, many such comments by current DUers. 'you people have plenty of rights already'. 'Gay marriage is to me unthinkable, because the Bible speaks negatively of homosexuals'.
The list goes on.

[Iris]

222. Unacceptable.

I'm sorry this is happening. I don't come around much anymore but will be vigilant.

[Bluenorthwest]

415. That's nice of you to say, but sadly it is accepted on DU, my posts get hidden for calling that

hate speech out, while that poster strolls around DU freely. Even the DUers who pose as 'anti bigotry' refuse to stand up to the hate mongers if those hate mongers stick to hating gay people. I've asked several to step up, but they won't. Hypocrites.

[Iris]

416. What's happened to this place?

Or had it always been this way but I just wasn't paying attention?

[Puglover]

263. Thanks for posting this Blue.

Yes, we can relate. And the posters you mention are long term members not one note serial trolls.

[Behind the Aegis]

408. Oh..how's about...

Lindsay Graham:

"The biggest sissy in the GOP and he wants to be pwezident"

"Yeah, you got alerted on... Apparently Sissy is now "politically incorrect". LMAO... "

"You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Dec 29, 2014, 02:06 PM, and the Jury voted 3-4 to LEAVE IT. "

"3 wanted to hide it?"

See, the person in question doesn't even have to be gay, but implying it and then making fun of it...that's OK.

[heaven05]

217. was just reading my daily dose of DU

and this one caused an OD. No surprise though. I'm glad the racist clowns on here finally are saying what all the zimpig, wilsonthepig, guiliani supporters, NYPD union supporters, Crawford killer cop supporters, the ones who said the pregnant black woman slapped down by the white cop deserved it because she was not compliant enough.

Sooner or later, they are all uncovered or feel bold enough to write what's written in the OP above. This is why I hold NO ILLUSIONS of what waits for us after next months installation of the new representatives of the Plutocrats and their racist lackeys. THANK GOD we DO HAVE an AA POTUS who has not much to lose and a veto pen...fingers crossed here. With the bluedogs in Congress always having been in league with the RW racist-fascists, as evidenced in the OP, I don't think AA people have real hope of much more progress in the upcoming year. You uppity women better get back in the kitchen... you LBGT....better hide again, at least the non racist ones.....progressives...we are so far, it seems, outnumbered, but still in the fight. When they finally cremate this old body, it will be left up to the next generation and there lay the sadness for me, another generation of minorities and women have to keep fighting for equality against the privileged white males and their supporters from all sexes and the complete political spectrum...... I have had enough for awhile with the hypocrites on this site, but I couldn't pass this one up, just couldn't. POST RACIAL????! MY ASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JustAnotherGen]

218. I'm not messing with you

Go outside, take a walk, have a shot of gin, play a game - but by all that is good on this green earth don't you dare sit up here and read any of this racist drivel!

[Chemisse]

219. Each of these posts was removed?

I hope each of these posters were removed as well.

[Iris]

220. This is disgusting. And anyone who suggests it's just some alternate viewpoint is disingenuous.

Acting like this is some reasonably expressed counter-view is the equivalent of saying that FOX news does not twist the truth and is just a "conservative alternative" to actual news and real facts. Most of the "points" in this "letter" have been debunked over and over. What kind of liberal community allows bullshit lies, misconceptions, and outdated assumptions to run rampant?

I feel like the creators of DU are just tired of what they built and are trying to slowly drown it. How else can you explain creating an alternate group where members are encouraged to come over here and tear a community apart with horrific attacks like this?

I came here after the horrible Gore-Bush fiasco because I wanted to be with like-minded people and that's not something I'm privileged to experience in my day-to-day life. Much of my questioning and changing and adjusting of my own assumptions, bias, and prejudice happened because of this place. It would not happen if I stumbled onto this site in its current state, and that just makes me sad.

[seabeyond]

224. i read the OP and perused the replies. so so so many of the replies, a big yes to what is

being said.

i am sorry. i have watched women walk. too many of our valued lbgt no longer post. and of course, blacks are taking the hit now.

it is like the tshirts, i can breathe.

feeling the right to be able to express those words, with no repercussions.

disgust. simple disgust at the hate, and stupid.

i am so sorry.

thank you all, for participating in this thread, expressing what you have to say.

thank you. cause these threads, and all the people speaking out, really mean something to me.

[Tsiyu]

225. Racist morons can't even see the irony in their hatred

A poster has the unmitigated GALL to tell an entire race of people what they should be doing and saying, and then in the next breath writes:

You do not get to tell white people what they need to be doing or saying. Learn some respect and humility.


WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

The mouthbreathing dumbfuck CALLED HIMSELF disrespectful and lacking humility, by his OWN STANDARD.

"Because I have WHITE skin I get to tell people whato to do or say, but everyone else has to shut the fuck up. My Caucasianness makes me a SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE."

The lowlife scum don't even see what a fucking JOKE they are. They contradict themselves left and right.

I've been here over 10 years. There have always been evil trolls whether the topic is rape, racism or income disparity.

I personally like to humiliate them when I do have a chance to be on DU.

There's one cop apologist here who minimized Mike Brown's death but went apoplexic when a cop death was similarly minimized just to show the poster what that felt like. I was happy to make that poster squirm and get outraged.

Mess with their heads, attack them and alert alert alert.

And to those who have been hurt by the evil scum of this earth I am so sorry. I'd hunt all the trolls down if I could and give them waht for. But there are so many stupid racists in this world, it would take a lifetime.

Sad that this is 2015 soon and people are still ignorant fucks.

[MindPilot]

226. Well, the OP does have a point...

a point which should be covered with a white sheet.

I had no idea this was going on at DU. Thank you 1SBM for dragging this bag of garbage out into the light.

[spanone]

227. k&r...

[MannyGoldstein]

230. AP poll: U.S. majority have prejudice against blacks

Of course, you're not imagining it:

AP poll: U.S. majority have prejudice against blacks

WASHINGTON (AP) — Racial attitudes have not improved in the four years since the United States elected its first black president, an Associated Press poll finds, as a slight majority of Americans now express prejudice toward blacks whether they recognize those feelings or not.

Those views could cost President Obama votes as he tries for re-election, the survey found, though the effects are mitigated by some Americans' more favorable views of blacks.

Racial prejudice has increased slightly since 2008 whether those feelings were measured using questions that explicitly asked respondents about racist attitudes, or through an experimental test that measured implicit views toward race without asking questions about that topic directly.

In all, 51% of Americans now express explicit anti-black attitudes, compared with 48% in a similar 2008 survey. When measured by an implicit racial attitudes test, the number of Americans with anti-black sentiments jumped to 56%, up from 49% during the last presidential election. In both tests, the share of Americans expressing pro-black attitudes fell.

Unfortunately, I suspect that it will get worse before it gets better. Ignorance and anger are entrenched and celebrated in so many places these days, this evil will not be dislodged without a great struggle.

I pray that those of good heart can pull together to turn the thing around.

[bravenak]

332. Hi Manny.

I agree.

[JustAnotherGen]

358. Than you manny

[Cryptoad]

231. Still amazes me that,,,

there still people in the world who think they can determine the race of a poster on the Internet, much less their true intentions of their post.

[riderinthestorm]

232. DISGUSTING!! All caps on purpose!

Hope everyone who posted that shit is already banned!!

[JaneyVee]

233. THOSE ARE DISCUSSIONIST TROLLS

The cons over there say the exact same thing to a tee.

[seabeyond]

234. as well as some long time duers.... agreeing whole heartedly with them. nt

[onecaliberal]

236. Anyone who writes that vile kind of crap

Or supports it should not be allowed here. What the hell?

[intheflow]

237. This is unacceptable.

Please count me in as a white ally. I will never know what it's like to be black in America. You talk all you want. I can hear you and think I understand you and I - a white middle-aged woman in her 50s - will still never know what black Americans experience on a daily basis.

As a woman, I have experienced some oppression, but it's my skin that gives me a (probably literally, at some times) a Get Out Of Jail Free card.

I am poor financially but rich in privilege.

I live in hope that some day people of color will be given the same benefits of the doubt as my white brethren get and don't even now they're getting. I try to educate my white-skinned (and white-passing) family, cohorts and acquaintances, but most can't even hear that they're not hearing me, much less not hearing you. I keep trying, but what authority do I have since I cannot speak directly from experience, only from history?

My voice is a poor substitute to your experience. Please keep talking. Please keep educating. Thank you for your voice and persistence in the struggle. I will never know what it's like to be black in America, but I will always be your white ally.

[salin]

238. that made me wretch

This is absolutely unacceptable. Especially disturbing is the supremist action (not just tone) that posts this threateningly in the African-American Forum in a tone that is reprehensible.

Thank you for pulling the sheets off of those posts for exposure. I am appalled, and embarrassed.

You are right - more of us need to stand up and forcefully demonstrate that the dismissive, racist appologia dancing around and shifting from indignant righteousness (for example the quotes about Zimmerman's having been "cleared&quot to playing victimized (ala the same poster who claims these groups abuse him/her) has no business being at DU.

[jwirr]

239. I read the post because it is under your user name as I often do. By the time I reached #4 I either

assumed that you had lost your mind or there was something I was missing. After reading it all and then seeing why you were telling us this I agree - this kind of posts are both unacceptable and not true at all.

I hope that there is a great outcry against this and it will stop now. These attitudes are not acceptable in society let alone on DU.

[mcar]

243. I'm speechless

[Aristus]

244. Jesus Christ!...

[mountain grammy]

246. This is the first time I've see these posts, and they are unacceptable..

I was on a jury for a similar post and voted to hide.

No, it's not your imagination, if only that were true. This is reality in America and it's not pretty. I wish DU could be an escape but it's an open forum. It's imperative we call out racism every time we see it.

So let me say again, these posts are unacceptable.

[proReality]

247. That's extremely unconscionable.

I can't even find the words to say how disgusting posts like that are. Hate is so incredibly ugly.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

249. wOw

O_O

that first one almost reads like satire but, damn. they are straight out sincere with that shit. boggles the brain.

where are the cheerleaders, now?

hmmm ....

[seabeyond]

256. where are the cheerleaders, now?

yes. where are the cheerleaders now.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

259. ever notice how roaches scurry when the light shines? yeah, like that.

they will come out soon enough when the light dims

[seabeyond]

261. exactly. and yes. i have noticed. they will start their OP, oh, so innocent, while all on this

thread will know exactly what they are saying.

passive aggressive, i think

[Tuesday Afternoon]

265. and yanno, it is the p/a that is the hardest to deal with given the jury system we now

have in place. and adding the seventh juror did not really help matters. but, sea - haven't you and I been saying this from the inception of DU3 ... you and I, both, from the start have pointed out the flaw in the system and the changes have not helped but, instead have actually strengthened their ability to use the system to their benefit.

Only through time and education have I actually started to see some Jury Results reflect that the jury pool is starting to get wise to what is going on around here and their verdicts are beginning to confirm this.

[seabeyond]

270. i have not seen awareness... a couple weeks ago, it was a womans issue that was thrown under bus by

jury.

and yes.

it was obvious from the beginning that the groups, AA, LBGT, Feminism was going to take the brunt from the whole. the point of the social agenda with the democratic party is that the whole need to protect the minority. with the jury system, you get a more republican.... the whole gets to voice at the expense of the minority.

it is basic. clear. and every "improvement" has just strengthened that position.

the only way for you and i, and others not to get hides, is to not post. as has been the result over the last months or so.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

272. I agree there are some few and far between results reflecting and Not near enough

to cause me to celebrate the system, and Yes Majority Rules at the expense of the Minority. It is the inherent flaw in this jury system.

The system would work fine at a Republican Message Board. And, with some minor rewording of the ToS might still work here.

but, until the ToS is a hard straight line we will never know.

[PeaceNikki]

250. Holy shit, I am so sorry. I'd bet that was a sock of a regular here.

I am so sorry.

[Jefferson23]

253. Horrific expressions of ignorance and hatred, but I am not shocked to see it on DU.

I have read more than a few disturbing rants, you can call them out and alert but some have the ability
to remain members here, regardless.

That you decided to post this for exposure is an excellent response.

[historylovr]

257. Oh. My. God.

Reading this made me sick to my stomach. I can't imagine how it would feel doing the same as a POC.

[Baitball Blogger]

264. The good news is that it's out in the open.

No one can say that we're making it up. At some point our realities will cross and they will see it too.

[Tommymac]

269. Misogyny is rampant too.

I alerted to a poster who called someone a p***y and my alert was rejected; one comment was that it was ok to use that word, and d*** and d***head were also appropriate to use here.

Thinking of canceling my annual donation.

Don't mind hard hitting political discourse, but if the majority of this site is ok with using racist and misogynistic slurs then it may not be the place for me.


==================================
On Mon Dec 29, 2014, 05:03 AM you sent an alert on the following post:

And Where Is The Democrat
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=975515

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

YOUR COMMENTS

The P word is not acceptable.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Mon Dec 29, 2014, 05:21 AM, and voted 1-6 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Strong language, even insulting language. Take him to task for that, but don't hide the question, which is worth asking.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Pussy is just as acceptable as dick or dickhead here.

Thank you.

[el_bryanto]

266. Those are some ugly posts. I'm embarrassed they appeared here. nt

[wryter2000]

271. Are those real?

Holy crap!

All I can say is that this white person is appalled by that!

[Tommy_Carcetti]

275. Holy fucking shit.

Please tell me the poster had under 100 posts and was dealt with appropriately.

[JEB]

276. That is some ugly shit.

Not what I expect on DU.

[AwakeAtLast]

277. Every now and then DU needs some purging

This is a good start. I have been here long enough to see a lot of shot go down.

This takes the cake.

Thank you for shedding some much needed light on this!

[niyad]

280. dear goddess, that is beyond disgusting.

[Matrosov]

286. DU is under attack by RW trolls

The way I learned about Democratic Underground was actually by monitoring RW sites. They love to cite DU and talk about what we 'libtards' are discussing. It almost seems like DU is better known among conservatives than among progressives.

Consequently, I also know it popular among conservatives on those RW sites to visit DU and try to troll. Some think it's funny how fast MIRT shuts them down. Others are a little more intelligent about it and have been posting here for years while pretending to be 'centrists.' I guess even they sometimes slip up and let their true conservatism show, and with time it becomes easy to separate the progressives from the RW trolls.

It's not surprising they'd invade the African-American and feminism groups. The RKBA group also has its shares of RW trolls who try to pose as centrist Democrats but who make their true intentions obvious.

The above examples cited in the thread starting post are clearly from such RW trolls. Opening up the site to conservative views? Getting rid of MIRT? Talking down to African Americans and women? Something smells funny, and it appears to be the stench of right wingers.

[randys1]

312. Rightwingers post here all day, they wont post in these type of threads because they

cant possibly express their true feelings.

They consider the silencing of a liberal a reward they can go back to rightwingland and brag about...

They find many democrats who think they are liberal or progressive to agree with them especially if the post is attacking white people

[bravenak]

353. That is my main problem.

The people who start agreeing with the before they are banned or express similar sentiments couched in polite language.

[randys1]

355. I am going to talk about it, every god damn day too...Problem is unless someone is overt

and in your face, the veiled racism, the polite racism, is allowed here.

Lots of it, too.

[bravenak]

356. Yep.

I've read entire thread full of garbage.

[stage left]

288. OMFG!

This is some ugly shit. The ones who posted it need to join one of their more subtle compatriots, to be honest.

[Iggo]

289. I know it's not your imagination.

[FiveGoodMen]

293. That first one is gone now

A Jury voted 7-0 to hide this post on Mon Dec 29, 2014, 04:19 PM. Reason: This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. When the original post in a discussion thread is hidden by Jury decision, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

So at least the site (and its randomly-selected jurors) isn't okay with that.

No idea how long "Name Removed" was here, so maybe they were just a troll and not a member-in-good-standing.

Horrifying anyway.

[Rex]

294. Wow, look at all the name removed and YEAH I see someone in there

that seems to be saying exactly what is in your copy & paste. How interesting. Telling black people on DU to shut up.

I've noticed a lot of these same people just LOVE the gun forums.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

295. Standing with you, 1SBM

It's not in Women's imaginations either.

I haven't even checked the comments here yet, to see if it's gotten the same kind of trolling that feminist posts get.

Commenters like whoever that was should get banned.

[LWolf]

298. I don't spend enough time

here to check out every group and forum; I've never gone to the AA group, so I guess I've been blissfully ignorant; of this, at least.

No more.

That said, I will also add that DU HAS ALWAYS BEEN more about partisanship than about issues, and that I've seen all kinds of supposedly "Democratic" values and issues fall before the demands of partisanship. I don't think the Democratic Party has EVER been free of racism, so this shouldn't surprise me. Yet it does.

[ellenrr]

338. Remember the Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party

The Democratic Party shat upon the true representatives of Mississippi.
That wasn't the first time nor the last, that the Democratic Party revealed its racist side.
It has a long history of being racist,
of kowtowing to the Southern states, of needing Black votes to win, and then giving Black people the boot.
Look it up.
Put in yr search engine- "Democratic Party Racial Politics" or just race.
The history is there, altho attempts to hide it.

If anyone thinks that Barack Obama got the nod to be the candidate bec. the Dem. Party is not racist... I got some land in Fla to sell ya.

[LWolf]

380. I remember.

I remember my grandparents talking about it when I was very young.

[chowder66]

299. Those posts are despicable and horribly myopic.

I can't imagine that persons life. To be that self-righteous and hateful must be a very sad life indeed.

[grahamhgreen]

300. Kick

[Moral Compass]

301. And I thought it was my imagination...

I'm a fringe character here, but I've been seeing things on DU that I thought would fit right in on some of the right wing sites. That has reduced my desire to become a part what is obviously a very active, well established community.

When I first discovered this site because of a link on another site there were some opinions that could get you banned immediately. That was back in the days of "Top Ten Conservative Idiots"--one of my personal favorites. And the Hate Mailbag (I think it was called that)--which was composed of rambling, misspelled screeds from those who were banned.

Not sure when it changed, but during the Trayvon Martin/Zimmerman time there seemed to be a lot of people who seemed utterly blind to salient facts of the case. In fact, the postings I encountered seemed as fact blind as the people of color that thought OJ Simpson was clearly innocent. There was a definite racial bias that seemed to be emerging.

The same people that thought Zimmerman clearly innocent came down squarely on the side of what I consider our out-of-control intelligence apparatus when Edward Snowden outed the NSA.

Right wing authoritarians on DU? Felt like someone was pissing in my punch.

Then came the Brown murder by Darren Wilson. Then there were many, many postings pointing out that the killing was justified by the irrelevant fact that Brown had just non-violently stolen some cigars from a convenience store and had THC in his system and we all just didn't understand that Wilson just had to empty his gun into Brown.

None of this sounded right to me.

At the least, this has diluted the pleasure I've always taken in lurking about DU.

I don't know what's going on. I'm not truly involved. But I'm about as white as you can get and some of these posters sound racist and right wing (funny how that goes together) to me. So, 1StrongBlackMan, I don't think it is your imagination. The sad truth is we are not and never have been in a post-racial society.

Racism is an ugly, ugly thing. I'm not sure what the answer is. I guess we just have to try to keep the conversation going and hope that understanding will blossom. But you're not imagining things any more than people of color are imagining that there is a white advantage. It's there.

I've had a lot of encounters with the police over the years and not once did I have one even reach for his gun--including the time I exited my car and had a nose-to-nose screaming match with a cop that mistakenly pulled me over for speeding. I didn't get a ticket. Funny how that works.

Keep pointing out the truth and let us strive to be brothers even though it's not that easy.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

302. Anybody who thinks that we're in a "post-racial society"

just hasn't been paying attention and doesn't know any black people.

[Rex]

313. I thought race relations were improving until 2008.

Now I know I was completely wrong.

[seabeyond]

317. i saw it deteriorating right before our eyes, in 2000, with bushco.

they started giving the rw white.... the right to be a racist, and also sexist. but, it was the right to be a racist that really got me.

people i know, verbally were saying out loud. they got to be racist, and they got to say it out loud.

that is what bushco/internet/limbaughs gave us.

[Rex]

337. I've have to deal with hate radio fanatics on a daily basis.

Almost. Just part of the world if you want to work and live in south Texas. However, I never until Obama was a serious contender for office noticed even close friends and relatives starting to lose it rationally - cultivating into some telling me the would 'not vote for a n*!".

It really brought my reality into question, people I never thought of as hardcore racists - coming out of the woodworks to tell me that! Holy shit...was I ever wrong, these are people that voted for Clinton! Family and friends.

I felt really stupid for not noticing before or was it really the fact that a black man could actually win the Presidency? That shook them to their core...a real eye opener for me at 43. People that traditionally vote Dem, nope wouldn't do it. Would they vote for a women? Hmm, not sure anymore. I thought so back then.

Rocked my world in 2008. I didn't post here during all that time cause I didn't want to be pissed off all day at what I would see in GD. I had to deal with it personally at home and work.

You are so right, hate radio is a horribly damaging weapon for bigots to use on the nation. If only more people would realize they are being used like robots to parrot whatever Rush has to say that day.

The BFEE made it X10 times worse.

[YoungDemCA]

371. I think it's been going on before that...

..when the Fairness Doctrine was repealed in the 1980s and with the proliferation of right-wing talk/hate radio since then.

Then the telecom industry was deregulated in the 1990s-part of the same trend.

It goes back even further to the 60s and 70s-the white backlash/paranoia fear about "urban crime" and "riots" and "states rights" and "welfare queens." It's all part of the same rabidly racist bullshit.

The Internet has made it worse, IMO.

[notadmblnd]

305. I think you need to express your feelings to skinner

yes, those were disgusting posts and the person (who had less than 100 posts) that posted it- has been banned. It in no way reflects what the majority of DUers think or feel comfortable posting. I don't know if you also noticed how quickly real DUers jumped on that troll and had him/her banned, but I think it is unfair to portray those posts as what the majority of DUers condone.


BTW, The only white person that speaks for me, is me.

[1StrongBlackMan]

314. Thank you for responding ...

however, it was not my intent to cast these (few) comments as something a majority of DUers think, condone or feel comfortable posting. Rather, it answers those that question whether it has been/is occurring on DU; but more, a clarion call to that majority of DUers that see such comments and choose to ignore them.

Silence on injustice is, sometimes, consent; but, it is always, enabling.

[notadmblnd]

316. It certainly has been occurring and I'm sorry that there are still people that think like that.

I am of the thinking that you have to call people on their bullshit. If you don't- then you are condoning their bullshit.

[seabeyond]

319. the problem is, many of us? know the names of people that make comments going right along

with what is in the OP, one way or another. we have heard this all before. long time posters.

they just are not in the thread. cause if they were, fingers would be pointed. so whenever we have a thread like this, on any of the social "isms", where it is vast support of duers, they do not come in. i could give you a list now.

this is just a few. but the words are said often on du.

[notadmblnd]

324. I understand that. It's why I said what I said.

I would jump on my own mother, in fact I have- over some of the bigoted remarks I've heard come out of her mouth in my life time and I still will if I hear it.

[seabeyond]

329. ya. i am with you. with mine. nt

[City Lights]

309. Holy fuck!

I am completely disgusted and shocked.

[byronius]

310. Good Lord That Is Disgusting.

Holy cow. I had no idea. Thanks for this post.

[Spazito]

311. Reading this thread as well as the other ones posted as links in some responses has...

been both horrifying and enlightening. I had seen all too many racist posts on DU, some more 'subtle' than others, but had no idea of the unrelenting attacks being launched on those in the AA group. It is beyond nauseating, to say the least.

Thank you for posting this in GD, it needed to be seen by those who have been blind, willfully or otherwise, to the vileness being posted.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

320. I was questioning your sanity for a bit

reading the first message. I'm saying to myself, but I don't agree with any of this! What's wrong with 1SBM? Is he really a lily-white cracker from Mississippi?

Then I saw the Regards, White America.... and knew I'd been had.

The second one is just silly. The third, yes, if you call me a cracker to my face, I have the right to turn the other cheek. If you don't like that, then quit bragging about your religion. I'm an atheist and I have better morals than these toothless freaks.

People need to talk to each other on a level playing field and find out what the REAL problems are.

[1StrongBlackMan]

335. The problem with the 3rd comment ...

the poster said it to someone that did not call him/her a "cracker" ... that Duer, does not use that language.

In fact, though I have seen that term on this board, I have not heard any PoC use that term in more than 20 years ... this goes back to the "SHUT UP AND LISTEN" thing, as it is another example of white people hearing what Black people have never said. We cannot talk, on a level playing field, when you (in the generic sense) refuse to listen to what I am saying; but rather, choose to substitute in what you think I said ... or rather, what you may have wanted me to say.

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

347. That's fine - I've only seen it used on TV shows and music.

Never been offended by it. It's kind of a lame word to use compared to the N word, Apparently the only word that gets them fired up is the R word. It really offends them to be called a racists. Who me? I work with a black guy and we get along great! You can't accuse me of being racists! (I just did)...

[IVoteDFL]

327. I didn't realize DUers had to express that is unacceptable it should be so fucking obvious

DU is the one place I don't expect to see this kind of BS posting, let alone in the AA group.

[AtomicKitten]

330. Thanks for posting this.

The content is truly vile. I'm shocked that it appeared on this website and that some people here played along. Please know the vast majority of posters here do not subscribe to the vacuous responses on those threads.

[TeamPooka]

331. one more reason why I spend so much less time here nowadays. nt

[Jackpine Radical]

334. "{I}t appears high time more DUers express that this is unacceptable."

OK. I'm on board.

This crap is unacceptable. It is, in fact, outrageous. Proud cluelessness and o'erweening ignorance. I have to confess a great deal of surprise that you gleaned these gems from DU, and that they were apparently allowed to stand.

[Sunlei]

336. I think the words white and black are over used especially in todays media, but thats just me

The 3rd comment is so hurtful and unacceptable, but it does make me grateful for the internet.

The kind of people who would post something so full of hate need to be exposed and discussed. Discussed as long as it takes.

[DMay]

339. amazing

STFU!

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

341. I wouldn't be surprised if those posts

weren't created in a fake account by someone else who is a long-standing member but didn't want to get their long term account banned.

(I'm assuming they were posted by accounts with tiny numbers of posts, which might be wrong, since I didn't see the original posts.)

At any rate, they certainly don't speak for all of 'white America', just racist white America. Might as well have been wearing white hoods while typing.

Kudos to bravenak, JustAnotherGen and the rest for earning the spite of such ignorant people.

[JustAnotherGen]

354. Thank you!

And the writing style of one is very very similar to a certain poster. Very cold. Very flat. And this thread is being very much ignored by this person!

[barbtries]

343. these were actual posts on DU?

goodgawd.

i'm sorry. racism SUCKS and has no rational basis. fear and hatred somehow keep it stoked.

I assume whoever wrote the above is banned from DU? if not, i don't know if i can stay here. how can people spend their time engaging in this? i find that top one especially horrifying because it purports to speak for me and nothing could be further from the truth. as the president said, there is no white america, no black america, there is the united states of america. united we stand, divided we fall...i hate to witness a fall that in my heart i know does not have to be.

fucking bastards.

[yuiyoshida]

348. After reading that I

seriously want to vomit. Some say its hard to believe its on DU, but there is a subtle undertone I have felt with replies to some of my posts. Some guy the other day attacked me and MIRT got him, thankfully. We just have to be diligent and aware of posts like these and make sure those who post them are not only chastised but banned as well.


That first letter, omg.. Glad they were banned. seriously! vomit worthy.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

351. The first two examples are your typical dog whistles. The third example is a fucking air horn.

All three are equally disgusting.

[rbrnmw]

366. I would like for some of you to consider something

It may not necessarily all be coming from Right-wing trolls. I think their may be a few posters that would never vote republican or visit free-republic, that are racists. I think we need to acknowledge that. There are people on the left who can be every bit as racist as someone from the Tea Party. They may vote straight democratic tickets but still have stereotypical views of black folks.

[countryjake]

388. Agreed.

It's something that every single one of us should consider, here and in our daily-lives, too.

DUers who were around here during the primaries for the 2008 election need to remember that some pretty shocking shit was being slung around.

We saw it when we participated in our local district's caucus that year, in a gym full of card-carrying Democrats, some a lot more conservative than most members here at DU, but also way too many hip, young, "progressive" sorts, spouting things off that my mother would have beat me bloody for saying.

I think that what you've said is very true and that is why I am not at all surprised by the content of 1StrongBlackMan's OP.

[Utopian Leftist]

369. Apparently, cognitive dissonance isn't just for . . .

CONS, whose world is crumbling around them as we speak.

It's for Democrats, too, who fail to recognize privilege or racism, even as they themselves benefit from it. Dr. King said that the problem is not with the few who commit the atrocities, but with the many who stand by and do nothing. Too many white people are willing to stand by and do nothing. And as long as we, white people, are the clear majority in this country, then it is our responsibility to make sure that at the very least we listen to the voices of ALL, equally.

It is the duty of anyone born to privilege, to work diligently to see the end of that privilege so that everyone can be judged on merit, instead of on superficial differences such as skin color.

[1StrongBlackMan]

378. Very well put ...

Too many white people are willing to stand by and do nothing. And as long as we, white people, are the clear majority in this country, then it is our responsibility to make sure that at the very least we listen to the voices of ALL, equally.

Though, I wouldn't say "listen to all voices, equally" (because Krugman knows more about economics than a Fox "journalist", as do most PoC know more about racism than (most) white people), but I would say express your disapproval of the stuff that you consider racially offensive, and give a second or third listen, when a PoC indicates they find something offensive.

Silence on injustice, sometimes, is consent; but, it is always enabling.

[YoungDemCA]

370. Big, big K&R to you, 1SBM

Thank you for this thread.

[Docross]

375. Trolls

They'll always be ...trolls...and back-up trolls. We had so many on Howard Dean's blog. Sneaky little devils.
Some of them were way pro Dean and the Democrats and then subtly came on with their negatives. Their speciality
was "I thought this was a GOOD Democratic site...but after reading some of the posts!... oh my goodness !".
Posts that they had posted.

Surprising, there aren't many troll-ish Democrats on right wing blogs. We're too NICE. We are the good guys.

It's alright, because all they do is fire us up! FIRED UP !
Not only that, but often, some of our goodness rubs off on them. Let us be... a candle..in their darkness.

[Moosepoop]

379. "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil...

... is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke

OK, I'm a woman, but that quote holds true for me and for all of us.

I've been here for almost 10 years. I read every day but it's rare that I log in and even rarer that I actually post.

But I'm going to start logging in to respond to any racist postings that I come across.

I've never encountered anything as egregious as what is in the OP before, but yes, there is racism on DU, in various strengths and varieties, constantly. I'm rather ashamed of myself for not speaking up and speaking out on it earlier. So much garbage gets flung around DU that it would be a 24/7 exercise to address it all, so I just haven't addressed much of anything.

No more.

1StrongBlackMan, I regret not entering the fray before now. I'm a 50+ white woman living in a mainly white, redneck rural area, and I've never shied from calling out racism in my day to day life when it occurs (which rarely happens any more as most people have learned by now not to display it around me).

I've known for a long time that racism on DU is NOT in anyone's imagination. The people named in the OP (and you!!!) are some of my favorite posters here. I'm in awe of how so many of you keep your head and deal with the insanity that comes your way.

Thank you for this post. It woke me up, and I needed that.

K&R

[ucrdem]

385. 7-0 leave. Jury results:

Automated Message
AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service
Mail Message
On Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:18 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

DU ... Just So You Know, It's NOT Our Imagination ...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026019528

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

This is definitely a troll post. With a few unfortunately ugly trolls aside(and yes, they have existed) There is no "open season" on black folks on DU, 1SBM; you are either lying or totally self-deluded.

It's especially unfortunate that you're abusing this for your own selfish agenda, because there are a few people out there who actually *have* been hurt by actual trolls. But shitting on DU as a whole serves no other purpose than to fan flame wars, and frankly, enough is fuckin' enough.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:27 PM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Alerter: are you fucking kidding me? You CANNOT be serious. You are what is wrong with this website, and if there is any justice you will be banished from here by the admins. You are sad and pathetic and really need to go straight to hell.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: There seems to be some validation that these offensive posts actually appeared in the AA group, and if that is the case, there's reason to bring it to general attention. 1SBM is a passionate poster with whom I sometimes disagree, but I see nothing hide worthy in this post. Believe it or don't, but it doesn't need to be hidden.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: It's got 287 recs including mine and 383 replies. It's not a troll post. If alerter doesn't want to hear it s/he can hide the thread using the hide-thread feature (small x in OP).

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[Glassunion]

389. I really hope the alerter was alerted on.

My guess is a "new" DUer.

[cyberswede]

402. My guess is an "average" one.

[BainsBane]

403. My thoughts exactly

[countryjake]

391. Ucrdem, please hit the alert abuse button on your jury results email...

and forward that alert on, for Skinner to see.

I don't know how anybody with a conscience could have deemed this thread worthy of an alert.

Since we all are aware by now of what 1StrongBlackMan's thread represents in our community and surely we must also know that something needs to be done about such racism, in order to preserve the integrity of this community, I think that vicious alert needs to be examined by someone who can clearly identify who it was that made it. That person is David Allen, aka. Skinner, the administrator of Democratic Underground.

[ucrdem]

395. Hi Jake, I know 7-0's get special admin scrutiny

and every alert comes to their attention because Skinner has discussed this in ATA. I'd be happy to alert on this alert but I'd like to run it by 1StrongBlackMan first since it's his OP and I'd be indirectly alerting on it and I'm not sure that's what he had in mind. 1SBM if you see this just let me know if you'd like me to alert and I will, and if others would like to weigh in please do, thanks!

[1StrongBlackMan]

398. Is it permissible for me to respond to the alter? ...

I have some words!

[ucrdem]

399. Ha. I think the alerter would benefit greatly.

[1StrongBlackMan]

400. Not more than me. n/t

[DonCoquixote]

412. wow, even the DU jury system worked for once...

Of course, let's not be too happy, as you know the folks over at Stormfront Lite, aka the site tha rhymes with "I'm dumb and pissed" will be howling and saying this is why the DU system iz so unfairrrrr!

note the language here:

This is definitely a troll post. With a few unfortunately ugly trolls aside(and yes, they have existed) There is no "open season" on black folks on DU, 1SBM; you are either lying or totally self-deluded.

So, someone who has posted here for years gets slapped with the troll label. but in the same breath, the poster says that only a "FEW unfortunately ugly trolls aside" as if to minimize the idea of racist trolls, while making damned sure 1strong is labeled as one.

It's especially unfortunate that you're abusing this for your own selfish agenda, because there are a few people out there who actually *have* been hurt by actual trolls. But shitting on DU as a whole serves no other purpose than to fan flame wars, and frankly, enough is fuckin' enough.

Wow, so 1 strong telling people that posts that have NO BUISNESS ON DU manage to get on there serves NO purpose, and ! strogn has an agenda. gee, not like the asshole that said DU needs to start bowing to conservative views has a damned agenda, right? Not like people speaking for "white america" serves an agenda, right. But of course, you have been hurt by trolls, so hurt that you get to determine who has been hurt, and who is not. Here is a hint, if crap like this gets posted in the AA group, it was meant to HURT, because the trolls were not content to yell at black people in general, but went to the forum set aside for AA issues and made a point to shit right on the dining room table!

Let's be honest here, if someone goes to the Hillary Clinton group and makes an anti-hillary post, that person is told to knock it off, or else. Hell, no one puts meat recipe in the vegan group, and heaven help you if you make an anti-gun post over in the place called "the gungeon." But apparently, all these posts could be posted to the AA group, and it is a "selfish agenda."

Hey alerter, you do not like the term priviledge, than let's use a more honest term. In this country, Blacks are expected to take abuse that no one else is expected to take, and to accept blame for it. Yes, it still happens, and yes, while it happens to everyone else (like my fellow hispanics) Blacks are always expected to accept being the default setting for "wrong" be they teenagers getting shot by cops or civil servants that get crucified while the Good old Boys skate and smile. If you are a Democrat, part of your JOB is to put a stop to that, not merely because it is worng, but because it takes away energy and unity we will need if we do not want other parts of the world to bark orders to us. If you do nto feel it is your job, then please, go join some other party, because even if you vote Democrat, your Republican thinking rots us from within.

[Sheldon Cooper]

386. Bahahahaha! I just sat on a jury for this thread!

On Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:18 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

DU ... Just So You Know, It's NOT Our Imagination ...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026019528

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

This is definitely a troll post. With a few unfortunately ugly trolls aside(and yes, they have existed) There is no "open season" on black folks on DU, 1SBM; you are either lying or totally self-deluded.

It's especially unfortunate that you're abusing this for your own selfish agenda, because there are a few people out there who actually *have* been hurt by actual trolls. But shitting on DU as a whole serves no other purpose than to fan flame wars, and frankly, enough is fuckin' enough.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:27 PM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Alerter: are you fucking kidding me? You CANNOT be serious. You are what is wrong with this website, and if there is any justice you will be banished from here by the admins. You are sad and pathetic and really need to go straight to hell.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: There seems to be some validation that these offensive posts actually appeared in the AA group, and if that is the case, there's reason to bring it to general attention. 1SBM is a passionate poster with whom I sometimes disagree, but I see nothing hide worthy in this post. Believe it or don't, but it doesn't need to be hidden.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: It's got 287 recs including mine and 383 replies. It's not a troll post. If alerter doesn't want to hear it s/he can hide the thread using the hide-thread feature (small x in OP).

Some poor fool actually alerted on this, almost 24 hours after it was originally posted, and was shot down as decisively as possible. Bahahhaha! I am absolutely delighted to vote to keep this excellent thread. Kudos to you, StrongBlackMan!

[BainsBane]

393. Juror 1 has it right

That kind of effort to censure this kind of discussion is in fact racist, and that kind of thinking is not only what is wrong with DU but America. How shameful.

Please alert on that alert, I beg you.

[1StrongBlackMan]

397. While I appreciate the support ...

I don't consider alerting on this thread to be racist. Shutting down, or attempting to shut down, a race oriented thread, is not in itself racist ... though it may have may have been done by a racist, or a person with racist intent.

I suspect that the alerter is typical to white liberals that would have any discussion of liberal racism be far worse than liberals doing racist stuff.

[BainsBane]

404. Okay, I defer to you on that

My sense was that it was an effort to keep discussion limited to issues comfortable to people like the alerter, and what he/she finds comfortable is racially-based. Racist was probably the wrong term to use.

[1StrongBlackMan]

405. I agree ...

it was a act (of desperation) to end an uncomfortable discussion. But that doesn't mean it was/is racist ... just pitiful.

[Blue_In_AK]

406. I was on that one, too.

I'm #4.

[Barack_America]

396. Utterly appalling. A visitor from Discussionist, no doubt.

"I'm not a racist", but "learn some humility".

My God.

To our recently departed OP of these horrendous posts, re-read those posts and consider some serious soul searching.

[Hekate]

407. Holy Shit. Thank you for bringing this out into the open. I am just stunned.

Wait. Wut? My friend Cha is "toxic"?

If those posters get to stay, this place is truly done for.

[rbrnmw]

414. kick