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[Name removed]

[LifeLoveLib]

1. I don't know...

...but I think if we start by giving them less attention, they might stop killing, or at least be less motivated to kill.

[leftynyc]

22. Or

they could become even more brutal and more vile in order to garner the attention. How many do they have to kill before we should be able to speak out and not worry about what their motivations are?

[CJCRANE]

2. If everyone else disagrees with them

then it's not going to work.

[JI7]

3. hostages held by them have said they don't talk our know

Much about the religion.

The things they do talk about is what they will do with all the money they steal and get from ransoms..

[TexasProgresive]

43. Sounds like a lot of "Bible beliving Christians" I know. n/t

[yallerdawg]

4. What they want to spread is not Islam.

It is political and ideological terror worshipping destruction and death.

These people are psychotic criminals and are not part of the human race.

They represent no religion.

[bobclark86]

8. NO.

They are most definitely "part of the human race."

They have thumbs. They have sentient speech. They have the same basic genetic makeup as you do. They're humans.

Yes, humans lock people in cages and light them on fire before bulldozing them.

Never forget that.

That said, they're assholes. And they are the perfect modern example of people using religion to gain power over others.

[bobclark86]

5. Well, since the Quran calls for kindness to prisoners...

Then quite a bit.

[Douglas Carpenter]

6. the fact that the overwhelming majority of Muslims are against them puts them in the category

or a very powerful cult - but without the legitimacy of wide support except in certain specific areas where an aggrieved and persecuted Sunni majority is breaking away from Alawite or Shiite domination. The number of Muslims of any school of thought who actually wants to live that way would be miniscule

[LanternWaste]

7. I found that much more often than not, religion is simply a pretext

I found that much more often than not, religion is simply a pretext rather than the fundamental rationalization for many of the human conflicts-- nationalism, self-determination, imperialism and simple greed being the foundation for most of our conflicts.

However, I realize that views such as that may require context, nuance and most importantly, a desire to avoid dogmatic bumper-stickers-- bumper-stickers which are far too convenient for many people to surrender rationally and willingly.

[BainsBane]

18. I agree

Religion is often an ideology used to articulate disputes about land, self determination, empire, power, anticolonialism, etc..
Some seem to think if they could only rid the world of religion, all these conflicts would disappear. They would not. Humans will be what they are, with or without religion. It is but one of many ideologies that people use to justify themselves.

[TexasProgresive]

44. Well said, BainsBane. n/t

[e-cigdub]

9. well

Bigdude,

I was born in iran. I live in the states and im agnostic. My fear of tying all muslims to terrorism is that poeple like me are going to get caught up in the net. It was very hard for me and my family after 9-11. our family isnt perticuarly muslim.. we just look middle eastern. but the assumption is that were terrorists.

DONT GET ME WRONG.. im not pinning the blame solely on americans. I HATE HATE HATE the fact that there is so much islamic extremist groups out there. Truth be told. under sharia law i would be eligible for double execution lol. fact is im gay and agnostic.. if ISIS caught me they would throw me of a building , stone me, then burn me.. but like any american, i just want to run my e-cig shop.. make some money pay my house.. im really not interested in promoting sharia law here in the states.

[jwirr]

26. Islam is most likely very similar to Christianity in that there are many different sects or

denominations. To assume differently and lump everyone into one group is showing a deep degree of ignorance. It is all in how one interprets the message that causes the trouble.

[JoePhilly]

10. And the KKK isn't about Christianity, right?

[Nye Bevan]

12. Setting the most revered symbol of a religion on fire

is not typically a sign of adherence to that religion.

[JoePhilly]

13. Doesn't matter ... if the OP's logic holds, that is.

[YoungDemCA]

19. Then how about this:

The Second Klan saw threats from every direction. A religious tone was present in its activities; "two-thirds of the national Klan lecturers were Protestant ministers," says historian Brian R. Farmer.[84] Much of the Klan's energy went to guarding "the home;" the historian Kathleen Blee said its members wanted to protect "the interests of white womanhood."[85] The pamphlet ABC of the Invisible Empire, published in Atlanta by Simmons in 1917, identified the Klan's goals as "to shield the sanctity of the home and the chastity of womanhood; to maintain white supremacy; to teach and faithfully inculcate a high spiritual philosophy through an exalted ritualism; and by a practical devotedness to conserve, protect and maintain the distinctive institutions, rights, privileges, principles and ideals of a pure Americanism."[86]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan#Social_factors

For the record, the KKK had over five million members in the 1920s, including elected officials in both major political parties and chapters in every state.

Also, terrorists massacring fellow Muslims at mosques via bombings and shootings doesn't seem to strike me as being a particular tenet of Islam. Perhaps we shouldn't subscribe to the terrorists' definition of Islam?

[ChosenUnWisely]

24. The KKK is just the Fraternal Organization of the GOP

Only WASPS Allowed

Christianity and the KKK are joined at the hip, they even used to have bible rallies to help with recruiting.

[maxrandb]

11. What a stupid and simplistic approach to things

Hell, Faux News has a "stated" mission to be "Fair and Balanced"...and they even call themselves a "News" organization...doesn't mean shit. I certainly don't recognize Faux as spreading "truth, fairness and balance" worldwide.

Hitler and the Nazi's mission was to spread Christianity and German "Values" worldwide...did we fucking call them "Christo-fascist", or "Christian Terrorist"?

You may call yourself "intelligent" and have as your stated mission to "educate" the rest of us about Islam, but I'd never call you an expert on Islam....or intelligence.

[BainsBane]

14. Yes, their version of Islam

but that is not the sum total of the faith or its believers.

[randome]

16. All religion aims to divide, IMO. But just because these monsters say something, don't believe it.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game. -Existenz[/center][/font][hr]

[randome]

21. Control and clannishness taken to extremes.

"I'm part of this group and you can't be part of it because you don't believe the same things I do."

It's all nonsense. But ISIS is a special breed of nonsense, calling religion into the mix when what they practice is the furthest thing from religion known to the world.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game. -Existenz[/center][/font][hr]

[JaneyVee]

20. If they really wanted to spread Islam they would stop killing Muslims.

[Matrosov]

23. Some progressives hate Christianity so much..

..they feel the need to excuse Islam. Perhaps the most shocking examples are when feminists complain about the Christian war on women in one breath and then claim that keeping women covered by a hijab shows respect to those women in another breath.

In reality, all these institutions of fairy tales are dangerous to a modern, progressive society, and the actions of one do not excuse the actions of another.

[maxrandb]

27. Please provide one example

of a feminist or a progressive claiming that "keeping women covered by a hijab shows respect to those women"

and Faux News, Hannity, Limbaugh and Drudge don't count as sources.

[Matrosov]

39. Here are several

Seeing as how feminists also object to women being treated as sex objects, instead of judging Muslim women for wearing hijabs maybe we ought to wear them ourselves, as a show of solidarity.

http://www.femagination.com/1009/womens-rights-the-headscarf-hijab/

Islam offers a strong and robust defense of women’s rights, and this reinforces the reason Muslim women choose to wear the headscarf. Because wearing the headscarf is, for many Muslim women, a way to practice feminism.

http://www.dailytexanonline.com/2014/06/26/hijab-gives-muslim-women-the-chance-to-practice-feminism-in-their-own-way

Some hijabis find their personal liberation by wearing the head cover, each with their own different reasons. In a society where expectations of beauty is constantly present in our everyday lives, some hijabis opt for the hijab to avoid being another target of consumerism and eliminate another thing that glorifies imposed beauty standards. Donning the hijab means reclaiming their body as a private entity and not a public space for abuse. The French schools’ ban on the hijab is the opposite of this. By coercing people out of certain headwear, they not only steal away their freedom to practice but also force them out of a comfort zone and turn a piece of cloth into a subject of political attention in the public arena.

http://feminspire.com/my-hijab-is-just-as-feminist-as-your-burnt-bra/

As a nonhijabi, people often forget that I’m Muslim until they realize that I’m fasting or find me defending an ignorant Islamaphobic comment.

This shock is justified with “But you’re so feminist,” and the juxtaposition of this statement has always puzzled me because I find that Islam and feminism do, indeed, complement each other well.

As I became more comfortable identifying as a feminist, I became closer to my faith and became more public about being a Muslim and heavily involved in social justice.

http://everydayfeminism.com/2014/07/solidarity-with-muslim-women/

[JI7]

49. that talks about the women who choose to wear it

Not about laws forcing them to

[A-Schwarzenegger]

28. Just like we're spreading democracy.

[Fred Sanders]

29. ISIS is to Islam as the KKK is to Christianity. Or is it CHRISTIANITY?!!

[Warren Stupidity]

35. The membership of the KKK were typically also members in good standing

of their local (southern) baptist church. Generally the rest of the membership had no problem with their klan members and generally considered them to be "true" christians.

The klan circa 1910-20 was in fact a powerful radical militant christian organization with nationwide support even while it engaged in extreme brutality.

I think perhaps this is not the analogy you wish to make.

[Fred Sanders]

37. You ancient analogy is far worse.

[LanternWaste]

40. I think the analogy is as accurate as analogies usually are...

Many ISIS members are in good standing with their local congregations and are considered to be "true" Muslims. I think the analogy is as accurate as analogies usually are...

[stevenleser]

30. The claims of the most whackjob of any philosophy or religion should be taken with a grain of salt

Who cares what they claim to be. They are murderous scum.

[FLPanhandle]

31. What's surprising about people using religion to gain power?

Of course it's about religion. In this case Islam.

[KingCharlemagne]

34. Proofreading is your friend: "Their," not "they're". "Caliphate," not "califate" (which would be

the fate of all us suckers who moved to California seeking fame and fortune in show biz).

[pinboy3niner]

36. Unrec. nt

[KamaAina]

41. Only Shi'ites believe in the caliphate.

[KingCharlemagne]

45. Are you sure about that? IIRC, one of Osama bin Laden's strategic aims

was the re-establishment of the Medieval Caliphate from Indonesia to Morocco. Bin Laden was Sunni. I think ISIS (Sunni) has likewise expressed an interest in the same strategic goal.

In the 20th century the reestablishment of the caliphate, although occasionally invoked by Islamists as a symbol of global Islamic unity, was of no practical interest for mainstream Islamist groups such as the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. It did, however, figure prominently in the rhetoric of violent extremist groups such as al-Qaeda. In June 2014 an insurgent group known as the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (ISIL; also known as the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria [ISIS] and the Islamic State [IS]), which had taken control of areas of eastern Syria and western Iraq, declared the establishment of a caliphate with the group’s leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi as caliph. Outside of extremist circles, the group’s claim was widely rejected.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/89739/Caliphate

[KamaAina]

46. Perhaps not

but Sunni Muslims believe a caliph should be elected. bin Laden and ISIS clearly do/did not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliphate

The Sunni branch of Islam stipulates that, as a head of state, a Caliph should be elected by Muslims or their representatives. Followers of Shia Islam, however, believe a Caliph should be an Imam chosen by God from the Ahl al-Bayt (the "Family of the House", Muhammad's direct descendants).

[Warren Stupidity]

47. One problem with making categorical statements about Islam,

or even about one of the major sects within Islam, is that there is generally no central authority (no pope) for the major sects but instead a plethora of imams each an authority in their own, and at the same time aligned with various schools, traditions, etc. each of which again claim their own status as authoritative.

It is like stating that, categorically, all protestants believe "x", which will generally fall apart from counter examples that disprove the assertion, there being no central authority for "all protestants".

[KingCharlemagne]

50. Very interesting (and important) wrinkle - thanks for the annotation! I learned something

new today!

[H2O Man]

48. gosh