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babylonsister
(172,759 posts)
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)and unhappycamper says hi...
babylonsister
(172,759 posts)
Meiko
(1,076 posts)enough is enough...get out already.
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)
cbayer
(146,218 posts)
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)I've been absent DU too long...
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Hope all is well. Feel free to PM me with an update on what's going on with you if you don't want to post it here.
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)in the streets of Los Angeles protesting in November 2001 and thereafter, not that my protests accomplished much of substance.
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)the better angels of our nature and we can succeed in ending war once and for all. Sadly, history shows me that my hope is small indeed, but it is there, along with my voice against war and violence as the means to an end.
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)Vietnam and Afghanistan are both signal in that neither was a 'war' that had to be fought. Each is more properly thought of as a 'civil war' in which the U.S. took sides (the South Vietnamese puppets in the case of Vietnam and the Northern Alliance thugs and bunco artists in the case of Afghanistan).
Maybe the moral of this story is that the U.S. should only go to war if and when it has been attacked (and then only go to war against its attackers) and not take sides in other nations' civil wars. I do not claim to have all the answers to these questions but they need to be asked repeatedly.
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)then we have troops all over the world getting involved where they shouldn't be, the Congo is perfect example.
WWII was an extension on WWI. After the depletion of the fighting population, and particularly because of the Flu epidemic which killed more than the war, there simply were not the men to push it any further. After a generation grew into a new fighting strength, the War resumed. Politics had a huge impact, w/Germany being crushed under debt to France, unable to climb out of debt and with little hope to the future, the nazi's won in a plurality, then gained steam through brutal tactics suppressing dissent and when Hitlers war machine produced obs, war became inevitable.
We stayed pretty much out of the fray until 7 Dec 41, there was actually a large contingent of Peace minded people until that Sunday morning...after Pearl Harbor, all bets were off. Our history is replete w/all kinds of wars and excursions, (to include genocide). Smedley Butler's famous remark, "War is a racket" was dead on target. He led Marines into excursions directly against forces that were against American companies, none of them were threats the US proper, it was all about corporate profit. Following WWII, the Marshall Plan was a stroke of genius. Marshall understood that if left on their own, Germany and Japan would suffer intolerably after the war, most likely setting up a WWIII scenario. Once we began aiding former enemies, they became our staunchest allies, proving that a helping hand as opposed to a beating can work wonders beyond what one can dream of.
Today, w/Iraq and Afghanistan and potentially Iran, it is all about corporate profit. I had no problem going after bin-Laden, although I believe he should have been captured and tried by international court if possible as opposed to being assassinated. To me, trundling him up and putting him on the chopper would have been a simple task since they got out of there anyway, even after spending time gaining access to intelligence to include hard drives, etc. A trial of bin-Laden would have been a coup hard to trump, but bullets are cheaper than trials, rope is cheaper than appeals.
I lost a lot of faith in PO, I still have "Hope", but the "Change" is little more than failed policy where force is used to impose one's will upon others...to the point where we are close to being under martial control at this point. The increase in federal power over citizens is at an alarming level, we are becoming what we've always despised, a despotic power bent on empire building as opposed to the force for good we could easily become. War should always be the last option, as Sun-Tzu said so long ago, "the best battle, is the one that is never fought". There are other options before unleashing the hell of war.
unhappycamper
(60,364 posts)and Afghanistan
and Yemen
and Uganda
and many more to come.
Obama's taking his Nobel Peace Prize out for a spin or two or three or ......
pasto76
(1,589 posts)rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)
countryjake
(8,554 posts)
cynatnite
(31,011 posts)I don't care for the imagery. I understand your point, however.
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)I find the entire situation appalling, but the story needs to be told.
cynatnite
(31,011 posts)I do, however, appreciate warnings on those with graphic photos. I like having the choice of whether or not I want to see a dead body. I've seen enough death that I do my best to avoid it whenever possible.
Bandit
(21,475 posts)At least in vietnam we were engaged against the third largest army on the face of the earth and they all mostly wore uniforms..A few were Viet Cong in the early days and they also were civilians but eventually almost all were uniformed soldiers with modern weaponry..
cynatnite
(31,011 posts)They could have taken weapons he may have had. I do wonder about the legality of this photo. The defense department frowns on this kind of posing my military soldiers over the dead bodies of people...civilian or not.
rgbecker
(4,890 posts)In the picture, that is.
rasputin1952
(83,497 posts)in fact, going all the way back to the beginning of these fiascoes, horrifying images have come from this hell.
metalbot
(1,058 posts)..and the chest rig that he's wearing. I'll grant that it is definitely possible that this was simply a civilian off in the hills walking around with his AK-47, but I think your statement of "The dead guy appears to be an unarmed civilian" is a bit of a stretch. There are higher resolution versions of this photo if you care to dig around.