General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDid You Guys Just See Bernie Sanders On Rachel Maddow (Now With Video) ???
Last edited Thu Apr 16, 2015, 01:32 PM - Edit history (1)
He looked damned serious about jumping into the race if he gets us to support him.
(Will post video when it becomes available.)
Here's the Video...
So let's support him... through donations, publicity, social media, and activism.
People say there is no way he can get elected...
The name recognition thing...
They said that about Elizabeth Warren.
Take a gander her of how the numbers can move: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026512518
There are many months left.
gotj90
(45 posts)Spoiler: He's going to run
InAbLuEsTaTe
(25,518 posts)QuestionAlways
(259 posts)I support Hillary, but Burnie running is the best thing that could happen to her. It is a tune-up for the general election, and he will act as a foil showing the difference between Hillary and a real Socialist, which the RW will accuse her of being. I love Bernie but he has no chance of winning because when low information voters hear socialist, they think of Russia.
tazkcmo
(7,419 posts)As in spoiler alert, not as in "Bernie is a spoiler."
Just my guess.
MBS
(9,688 posts)if he runs a third-party campaign, it would ensure a Republican victory
tazkcmo
(7,419 posts)He will not be a spoiler or in any way aid the GOP in winning this election.
trumad
(41,692 posts)No way.
onecaliberal
(36,594 posts)Can't never could do one damn thing!
WillyT
(72,631 posts)trumad
(41,692 posts)And he's still not going to get elected.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)trumad
(41,692 posts)Pharaoh
(8,209 posts)should nobody run against Hillary in the primary? And maybe debate the issues? Or should we all just rollover and praise Hillary as the anointed one?
WillyT
(72,631 posts)DrKZ
(53 posts)If it were not for those silly messy things called primaries which interfere with one of the few democratic (well not completely given the super delegates) processes us peons have available to us. She would have been crowned 8 years ago if it hadn't been for those messy little primary things
Thespian2
(2,741 posts)How many votes do you have? One?
Perhaps the billions of dollars HRC will suck up from the billionaires will buy her an election...then where will you be? Presidency purchased by the billionaires. Good luck with that.
Caretha
(2,737 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Win? No, probably not.
But I'd sure like to hear him chime in at the debates, wouldn't you?
cyberswede
(26,117 posts)bvf
(6,604 posts)G_j
(40,569 posts)We absoluely need him in the conversation.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)lastlib
(28,264 posts)(As I said over there, we need to be reciting this daily to the GOPosaurs! And all those who hold office under the Democratic banner should pledge fealty to it, or face getting primaried.)
appalachiablue
(44,022 posts)A Democrat is a Real Democrat, as in an Apple is a real Apple. Although something might be a GM Apple, or a Potato, an Apple is an Apple! nothing else. Otherwise it's 'Apples and Potatoes'.
a la izquierda
(12,336 posts)To squirm and look miserable when they have to rebut Senator Sanders.
And I want him to mop the floor with them.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)Hillary and the not-Hillarys. The not-Hillarys will vie for the top not-Hillary spot.
They will be positioned to hopefully surprise and overtake Hillary in one of the first three contests to prevent the "inevitable" narrative.
The not-Hillarys will also be there in case she implodes or leaves the race. Anything is possible.
ismnotwasm
(42,674 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)If Bernie runs he SHALL win!
Once the word gets out that he is a man of WE THE PEOPLE, and not them, the corporations, EVERYONE shall vote for him!
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)wouldn't that be a hoot?
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Because enough people will be faced with the alternative, and that ain't looking too progressive in a world for large humanoid populations that needs to be around a little longer.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)our policies, policies that have made them very rich.
But it would still be great to have him in the race. He speaks so clearly on the issues that matter to the American people.
That would definitely raise the level of discourse. I'd love to see how Republicans react to his bold, no nonsense style.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)If Bernie is sooo uncompetitive why keep telling us how he can't win?
You seem awfully dedicated to tamping down any enthusiasm for a candidate that cannot be selected.
elleng
(141,926 posts)to run a decent campaign, #### of $45.00 contributions.
a kennedy
(35,978 posts)he'll never become president, as much as it pains me to say it, he won't.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Debate, argue, sharpen skills, set forth your vision, have your vision challenged, etc.
a kennedy
(35,978 posts)dhill926
(16,953 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(25,518 posts)Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)That needs to happen as a precursor to any Progressive uprising. People have to be able to entertain thoughts of the possible before they can start moving toward it. Bernie may not win, but it's vital to get his sort of ideas launched into public discourse.
merrily
(45,251 posts)a waste. Neither is volunteering for him.
No one but MSNBC gave him a platform worth a tinker's dam until he announced for President. Then MTP put him to get him out of the way before anyone focused on a Presidential primary. Still, at least some people heard him. And when people like him, they love what they hear and get energized.
G_j
(40,569 posts)He's my personal choice.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)okay, forget it.
Sometimes it's better to just let the ball sail over the plate.
DCBob
(24,689 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(25,518 posts)dreamnightwind
(4,775 posts)I'll have his back, for what that is worth. I'd also dig up some time and money for him.
I'd be very surprised if he won, but there's always that X factor, which is, what will happen when someone gets up in front of the American people and speaks truth to power, with the knowledge and experience to back it up? You never know. And if his campaign doesn't catch fire, he will at least sow the seeds for others who will, and for a more favorable view of democratic socialism.
Got to start somewhere, and Bernie is probably the best we have.
onecaliberal
(36,594 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)^B^E^R^N^I^E
^S^A^N^D^E^R^S
WillyT
(72,631 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)That with that damn font, most of his arrows point to the LEFT?
MoonchildCA
(1,349 posts)daredtowork
(3,732 posts)F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)Though I'd flip it around. I like Lee, but I've rarely if ever disagreed with Bernie.
2020 Kshama Sawant
daredtowork
(3,732 posts)Bernie has more experience as well. But the thing holdng me back from commitment to Bernie was the hope to finally have the first woman President. I also couldn't stand to see Hillary mopping up all that gravy: especially if Warren won't run.
Barbara Lee is female AND she actually rocks the progressive candidate issues! I'm hoping Bernie would actually choose that team willingly and want Barbara to be the Presidential candidate. I think TOGETHER they could cover a lot of ground Hillary is blowing off - and with strong popular backing they could win.
F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)I just worry that Bernie would be slightly wasted in a VP position. But then again, you could easily say the same for Lee.
I think you make good strategic sense, though. Plus I would also love to see our first woman president
it's long past time!
And I'm of the opinion they could clean the clocks with Clinton if they really went for it. People would move heaven and earth if they had someone who would really fight for them, something the centrists seem to forget--and what I think Clinton's forgetting. Or, as you said, ignoring.
QuestionAlways
(259 posts)daredtowork
(3,732 posts)It's sad she's apparently so low key because she's made of awesome when it comes to championing progressive causes. She has a degree in social work and has been active in housing and poverty issues in an area of the country known for urban decay, crime, and, well, a lot of poverty. You can take my word for it - government social services here is completely made of fail.
While looking up her recent voting record I saw something about her signaling interest in being Ambassador to Cuba: I think that means she does lack recognition on an International stage, and that's why it hasn't occurred to anyone to bring her up as a candidate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbara_Lee
Here's her page on Ballotopedia - she is to the left of Warren, but not quite as far left as Bernie Sanders.
http://ballotpedia.org/Barbara_Lee
![]()
Legally require hiring women & minorities Strongly Favors
Abortion is a woman's unrestricted right Strongly Favors
Expand ObamaCare Strongly Favors
Comfortable with same-sex marriage Strongly Favors
Vouchers for school choice Strongly Opposes
Keep God in the public sphere Opposes
Absolute right to gun ownership Strongly Opposes
Human needs over animal rights Strongly Opposes
Higher taxes on the wealthy Strongly Favors
Stricter punishment reduces crime Strongly Opposes
Support & expand free trade Opposes
Pathway to citizenship for illegal aliens Strongly Favors
Stricter limits on political campaign funds Strongly Favors
Maintain US sovereignty from UN Strongly Opposes
Prioritize green energy Strongly Favors
Expand the military Strongly Opposes
Stimulus better than market-led recovery
Strongly Favors Stay out of Iran Strongly Favors
Privatize Social Security Strongly Opposes
Never legalize marijuana Strongly Opposes
Barbara Lee is best known for being the sole person to vote against the part of the Authorization of Use of Military Force Against Terrorists Act - which basically gave Bush unlimited powers in the name of "national security".
Barbara Lee votes her conscience...and I like what her conscience tells her to do.
Also she would bring great "West" balance to any ticket that also had an "East" candidate on it.
QuestionAlways
(259 posts)brooklynite
(96,882 posts)...all you can do is support his SENATE campaign through donations. He doesn't have a presidential campaign to commit to.
This is why READY FOR HILLARY asked for pledges rather than actual cash.
edgineered
(2,101 posts)brooklynite
(96,882 posts)"DRAFT Bernie" is the equivalent of "Ready for Hillary".It can give a max of $5,000 to Bernie Ssnders under FEC rules.
Like RFH, its money can only go to activities that encourage Bernie Sanders to run...nothing more.
And I hope you didn't waste too much time with this group: Their FEC filing for 12/31/14 showed a grand total of $6,819 in contributions, and they haven't bothered to file for 3/31/15.
merrily
(45,251 posts)You might want to look at why persisting in discouraging people is so important to you.
It may be treatable.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)I WILL discourage people from IMAGINING that they're doing something useful when they're not, and contributing money to a group with no track record of activity and no money to engage in that activity qualifies in my mind.
But, I suppose, as religious people sometimes say: "why can't you just let me have my faith?"
merrily
(45,251 posts)There's all of $6000 in that account. He's not even trying to raise money." yadda yadda.
You know we can see what you've actually been posting for months, right?
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)...I've never discouraged anyone from supporting Bernie Sanders if they want to. I DO give my opinion on whether I think he can win and whether he's doing what needs to be done to compete in the political system we're stuck with. Last time I checked, we were on a political blog. That's what people do.
Conversely, I've never OBJECTED to someone posting an anti-Hillary message (which happens frequently). I just respond to the comment as necessary.
My immediate comment was only on "DraftBernie", which appears to be nothing more than a website masquerading as a rallying point. It lists no organizers and no staff (at least the Warren groups are sending organizers to Iowa). Its organizing no letter-writing or campaign activities. All its Twitter feed and Facebook page lists are re-posts of the same news articles I can find here for free. But you apparently didn't investigate before you opened your (now lighter) wallet. It said "DRAFT BERNIE" (who, last time I checked, didn't seem to NEED a Draft movement to decide to run), and that was good enough. Well done!
merrily
(45,251 posts)and/or isn't even doing anything to win.
You call those kinds of comments merely giving your opinion on whether he can win (even though the person who posted to cheer Bernie didn't ask for your discouraging opinion) ; I call it attempts to discourage support for Bernie. Clearly, it's both. There is no way all that negativity--and it's persistent--is either neutral or encouraging anyone to work for Bernie. You also can't wait to remind people who cheer Warren that she isn't running. Do you really think any of them are unaware that she's said that a number of times?
And it isn't only you.
It wouldn't be as annoying if there wasn't all the hypocrisy on the board about how we're not supposed to make negative comments about Hillary or here chances. And, if we are unhappy, our honorable route would be to (LMAO) find and support out own candidate for POTUS. As if that were remotely feasible.
Y'all are such a funny lot.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)...and that the conviction of Sanders' supporters was so weak that my "discouraging" posts could sway them.
As I've said before, I've had a private dinner with Bernie and his wife (that whole politics in the real world thing...). He's a nice guy and an asset in the Senate. But I want to WIN in November, and my 35 years of political experience doesn't show me a path that he follows to victory. Feel free to show me where I'm wrong. Or, just complain that I'm saying else discouraging. Your choice.
merrily
(45,251 posts)More straw man, more condescension, more bragging.
Caretha
(2,737 posts)Your words have Zero power. And mean Zero.
Nice you know that....no really, nice.
edgineered
(2,101 posts)i put it in the same category as why do i even ask the dog if he wants a piece of pepperoni?
merrily
(45,251 posts)What I am labeling here is the hypocrisy of telling to us to stop criticizing Hillary and support our people, then throwing a wet blanket over every attempt on our part to support our own people. The only ways out of that Catch 22 are (1) don't say anything about anyone; or (2) praise Hillary.
They may or may not realize it.
If they don't: news flash. This is what you've been doing.
If they do realize it: news flash. We see you.
edgineered
(2,101 posts)It just doesn't stop, not that we don't know beforehand which of the two inevitable replies will be made, thus my comment about the dog. Asking Jackson if he wants a piece of pepperoni is merely entertaining myself, it wouldn't matter to him if I was reading Upton Sinclair outloud or talking to the cat. He smells food, so in his mind its time for me to shut up and toe the line!
merrily
(45,251 posts)"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" Upton Sinclair.
Maybe not always salary. Maybe it's another kind of economic interest. But we all get the drift.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)The assessment of whether a candidate can win, and/or whether he or she is doing the things needed to win seem perfectly appropriate to discuss here. Plenty of people have posted their opinion that Clinton can't win. Nobody should stop them either.
Bear in mind, my original post was NOT about Sanders or whether he should run (he should if he wants to); it was about a purported PAC that seems to be doing absolutely nothing in support of it's stated goal of encouraging Sanders to run, while giving the illusion to it's contributors that they're doing something productive. If you want to draft him, contact him directly. Send money to his Federal campaign committee or his Leadership PAC. Or find a group that has a track record of actually DOING something. Just don't waste your money on a virtually non-existent organization because you like their name.
Caretha
(2,737 posts)but your own words show that you live in proximity of the "beltway", which in other words means you really ain't got such a good handle on things..
I've never known such an out of touch group of people as the "beltway people"
Your arrogance & disdain for your "inferiors" is always on display. You need to get another sctick..yours is obnoxious and not based in "so called reality".
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)...I supported them because, in the real world of politics where I live, I determined they could win. When I determine someone CAN'T win, I don't support them. When someone else supports someone I think can't win, I'll say so. What you deflect as "arrogance and disdain" is simply cold hard truth. Choose to listen or not.
Caretha
(2,737 posts)Nice to meet you....
I have never known a determiner.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)and see if they can refer you somewhere.
Supposedly, Warren does not want to run, so it may make some sense to donate to a draft movement, though I am not a huge fan of that. Bernie WANTS to run if only he can raise enough money. Make sure your donation gets into his hands. Spending a penny to draft him is unnecessary.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)CK_John
(10,005 posts)He will not switch to DEM after being an IND since 1980, he's a talker not a doer.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)I'm sure it won't wash off after that comment.
bunnies
(15,859 posts)nice.
think
(11,641 posts)^R^U^N ^B^E^R^N^I^E ^R^U^N
Geronimoe
(1,539 posts)
greyl
(23,024 posts)Thespian2
(2,741 posts)he won't run if he believes he can't win. Bernie can win. The only way to fight money in politics is to elect people who have the same vision as Senator Sanders. I will help him every way I can. May not be much, but I will do what I can.
K & R
2naSalit
(102,791 posts)I don't have a TeeVee and I usually watch online BUT MSNBC has not posted Ed, All In nor Rachel Maddow this evening. They have drastically altered their format and those of us online can only see three segments of any of those NEWS programs on any given night.
He must have been on all four show today since they won't post the shows online. The comments are pretty pissed off. After watching that clip of him of Morning Schmoe, I guess the corporate overlords canned the posting of the other appearances from the eyes of those who pay for Internet but not cableTeeVee.
SO there we have it, folks. If you get your news from the interwebs, they have a way of shutting that whole thing down... how dare we choose to be informed citizens!
merrily
(45,251 posts)2naSalit
(102,791 posts)I am getting the feeling that the divide and conquer pogrom is going into full swing way ahead of the elections in an attempt to get those who are barely engaged in the first place to just give up when thwarted by blocked info.
I really wanted to see the interview of Sen. Sanders this evening, since there's so much chatter about it. Guess that won't be in the cards since he isn't a corporate darling.
It's not like we rural folk have a lot of choice unless we pay a lot for simple internet, we have to buy our news anymore... it used to be a public service. As a public servant, by trade, I am deeply offended by this new trend. Guess I can just stop buying internet access since I can't see or hear actual news - we don't have anything of substance in my area, which is why I was paying for the internet.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Hell, Adam turned on Eve when there were only two people, a devil serpent and God involved.
And she was his very own rib, ffs.
Result: they lost Eden.
Yep, Sanders is not now, nor ever likely to be, a corporate darling. But, his voice is priceless, anyway.
What do you think of a campaign urging the 99% to write in a candidate in the primary if one is not excited about any of the names on the ballot?
2naSalit
(102,791 posts)campaign yet, haven't seen who's in yet. We have a long time before that will be known. I haven't voted for a non-Democrat in forever (if ever) and I sure don't see any reason to vote otherwise when the time comes.
For the record, I like Ms. Clinton and don't buy into all the negativity thrown at her on a non-stop loop. She's truly more qualified to be president than probably anyone in history... and that includes her concern for the not-wealthy. She always has been regardless of the bad press she always gets. The Ken Starr crowd made sure that they brainwashed enough of the public to carry on the hatefest long after the false accusations have been exposed. Such is life in 'muricka for a successful Scorpio woman.
I think people like to judge with minimal info on people like HRC and they seem to get off on it. I find that the failure of the GP to actually take the time to find out the truth about someone is sad and indicative of the kind of problem we, as a society - if you can even call it that anymore - face in solving our collective problems. Jumping on a meme, whether factual or not, and making a hash judgement based on minimal info is really the wrong way to go when the stakes are so high for all life n the planet.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Last edited Thu Apr 16, 2015, 08:32 AM - Edit history (3)
I think people like to judge with minimal info on people like HRC and they seem to get off on it.
WTF?
No one I know is getting off on it. To the contrary, they are heartbroken about what has been going on. And I don't think you can possibly say that of posters here like sabrina 1 or Autumn are either operating without info or are getting off on it. On the flip side, though, many women who are excited about a woman in office never heard of the DLC or Third Way and never looked up a single Senate vote Hillary took.
Some Hillary supporters seem positively obsessed with bashing and silencing their fellow DUers. Since we are supposed to be here to discuss politics and politicians and not to diss other groups of DUers, I'll just move on at this point. But not because Hillary supporters as a group are not "criticizeable." IMO, some of you are her worst enemies.
I did not mean to imply that all HRC supporters are short on info, however, many who do and many who bash her appear to be given their reasons for their concerns. I think some of the bashers (and could well be trolls) do get off on the bashing. I know people who get off on being offensive and outright negative about anything.
And I didn't say who I will vote for since the primaries are so far off in the future, so the "you" part is inaccurate.
That's all I was saying and nothing more. I find your take on that interesting though I do think you read more into it than what I was saying. But, whatever.
merrily
(45,251 posts)it was much worse before I edited.
Sometimes, you take just so much before you say, oh, no, I am not putting up with this again. Let me buy you a beeer.
2naSalit
(102,791 posts)okay. This won't be an easy time for any of us as we see our nation's life flash before our eyes for the next year and a half. I'm kind of looking forward to this summer when I go to work and won't have much, if any time to be on DU as I expect it to heat up faster than the climate.
But, let's go with wine or spirits since I'm allergic to hops!
merrily
(45,251 posts)mmonk
(52,589 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)mmonk
(52,589 posts)Scuba
(53,475 posts)I didn't think so.
Vinca
(53,994 posts)In the general, I'll vote for whoever is the Democratic candidate. Bernie has said he would run as a Democrat so he wouldn't split the vote.
merrily
(45,251 posts)too and also said he would never get elected with that name.
Be very selective which memes to adopt as truth. People get paid very, very well to come up with them and make sure you hear them.
Again and again and again. until they seem as though they are not only true, but inescapable truths that you've always known.
Carter lost to Reagan because of a primary challenge. Really?
The only reason Gore lost was Nader. Double really? Did Gore even lose the vote? Yeah, but Nader made it close enough to steal. Really? Why did Kerry lose?
Hillary's inevitable, 2007 version. Really?
Hillary's inevitable, 2015 version. Really?
Super Delegates can't swing a primary election. Really?
No one decided Hillary was going to be the nominee. Really?
If you don't support Hillary (since before she even announces for a primary) shake hands with President Cruz. Really?
Hillary is the only Democrat in a population of 350 million who can bet a Republican, Really?
Hillary will win the general. Really?
As soon as you challenge one successfully, another one pops up, like a Kleenex.
Caretha
(2,737 posts)I think I'll just start asking if they need a Puffs next time the new Hillary is the "ONLY ONE" who can win meme talking point is lobbed.
still_one
(98,883 posts)split the party, but more importantly allow him to be in the debates
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)would have this unless you don't have cable which well many don't which is why I'm upset they shut off the podcast video
I'd run it to my tv on plex now I can't
WillyT
(72,631 posts)chapdrum
(930 posts)perhaps we'd have more of what was formerly known as democracy.
For example: As a condition of operation, the FCC might consider telling media corporations that they MUST
give x percent of airtime and print space to all candidates, or LOSE their charter.
But in the "pragmatic" world, that has yet to happen.
Nonetheless, it is ineluctable: If a candidate did not have to raise millions to run (and then millions
for re-election), much or all of this topic would be moot.
I hate liars
(165 posts)I'd love to see him enter the race.
Response to WillyT (Original post)
Geronimoe This message was self-deleted by its author.
NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)for over a year now, but may need to up my usual amount if he actually announces. He'll have my support for sure.
DrKZ
(53 posts)I was so overjoyed listening to him speak last night so were other members of my family. We all immediately ran to our computers and donated money and offered to assist him in any way we could. It is glorious to hear someone stand up for progressive values
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)We need Bernie!
Babel_17
(5,400 posts)I'd also donate if there was a promise to run after a reasonable sum was raised. I've sent him money before, but I'm on a budget at the moment.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)Please run.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)Bonobo
(29,257 posts)I would offer him my enthusiastic support as I would anyone with his sense of ethics. Sadly, our side seems to be prematurely ceding the field.
HR_Pufnstuf
(837 posts)Webb is our only chance in the General Election because Hill and Bernie can get about 5 Republicans to vote for them.
Keep your eye on the prize.