Someone needs to inform Bruce Jenner...

[SHRED]

Last edited Sat Apr 25, 2015, 12:08 PM - Edit history (1)

Since he also claimed he is a Conservative in the interview he should know...

It's not Liberals who are hiding behind religion to attack the LGBT community.

It's not Liberals who are actively working to limit Constitutional rights for the LGBT community.

It's not Liberals who ridicule, beat and murder those in the LGBT community.

[GeorgeGist]

1. He's definitely a Republican

Bruce Jenner blames driver he killed.

http://pagesix.com/2015/02/13/bruce-jenner-blames-fatal-accident-on-driver-who-was-killed/

[alphafemale]

6. You should never be following that closely.

Even if someone did stop suddenly in front of you, there should be a large enough space to stop outright or an open lane beside you.

Has nothing to to with thinking what he is doing now is going to be extremely helpful to many transgender young people.

[pnwmom]

24. I agree. But on some roads, including that one, it's almost impossible to maintain a safe distance

because every time you leave enough of a gap, someone else slips in to fill the space. You can't be the only one maintaining the correct distance on a road where everyone else is determined to close any gaps they see.

Have you ever driven on the highway where he had the accident? I'm surprised they don't have ten car pile ups all the time.

[mopinko]

33. i have

right at malibu, wasnt it? yes, it is an insane place to drive. the whole area is. canyon roads that scare the crap out of those not used to driving them.

but that doesnt make the accident jenner's fault.

[alphafemale]

36. Didn't someone in front of her stop?

She was alert enough to stop.

It is called being fully alert.

[SusanCalvin]

45. >>because every time you leave enough of a gap, someone else slips in to fill the space

So, at a safe rate of deceleration, back off from *them*. I do it multiple times every day. If someone cuts that close in front of me, I re-establish the gap. Don't like them cutting close in front of me, but I'm not going to stay inches from their bumper just because I don't like the way they drive.

[pnwmom]

47. He wasn't inches from her bumper. But he wasn't the several car lengths that would have

been the safe distance. But it's hard to keep that kind of a distance on a road where everyone else is following much more closely.

[SusanCalvin]

63. Gotcha

Sounds like he wouldn't have hit so hard, at the least, if he'd been paying enough attention. But, then again, I wasn't there.

[pnwmom]

68. It's easy to think that we would never make the mistake that others might make.

I've never hit anyone, but there's always a first time. And when I slow down because someone has cut in in front of me, I'm very aware that someone behind me might hit me from behind.

Driving on highways around here is getting harder and harder. It's hard for me to judge someone who was driving under the speed limit and wasn't using a cell phone or under the influence. Especially on a crowded, tricky road.

[SusanCalvin]

71. I learned to be aware of the people behind me

when a drunk (I'm assuming) happened to follow the same route I was following (on business/residential streets, not a highway), directly behind me. I fortunately became aware of him before he nearly ran into me as I slowed for a stationary line of cars. I had been watching him in the rearview, and was able to slew over to the side. And *he* was able to stop (barely) before he hit the car that had been in front of me. That was a wakeup call, and has saved me at least couple of accidents.

Oh, those people on cell phones, especially texting! When I pass what seems like an obvious idiot on the freeway, I can't resist the urge to take a glance. Nine times out of ten they are texting.

[Faux pas]

2. He's

got his, what does he care. It's the rethuglican way!

[SHRED]

3. Well he did say...

...he believes in the Constitution.

[Faux pas]

70. Isn't that part of

the 'vow' they take to be a card carrying member? lol

[Zorra]

4. +1. Ugh. nt

[backscatter712]

5. Chickens for Colonel Sanders! n/t

[LibDemAlways]

7. I'm guessing he pays very little attention

to politics and has no idea who Boner and McConnell are. His wondering aloud if there's something wrong with being a Republican and then expressing a belief in the Constitution suggests he's completely clueless. Too bad Rachel Maddow wasn't conducting the interview. Her follow up would have been a much more interesting and informative exchange.

[pnwmom]

22. I think you're right. He's clueless. If he knew anything about Boehner or McConnell at all

he wouldn't think they'd be supportive.

[Arugula Latte]

60. Yes, he doesn't strike me as the brightest chicken in the coop.

And, holy baby jebus, he spent two decades with Kris Jenner ...

[KittyWampus]

99. He's had the financial LUXURY to pay little attention. Not going to talk about this subject much

but the fact is he and his family have profited hugely from exploiting themselves and their celebrity and putting themselves in the public eye.

[TNNurse]

8. Hard to respect someone

who decides to participate in a "reality" show. I do not know him, but wish him well. I am sure he could have done this in a different manner. Perhaps he thinks attention to him will help others. There is however NO dignity in that TV crap he is apparently going to do.

But I wish him well.

[JaneyVee]

9. Who cares what political affiliation he holds?

[zappaman]

12. +1

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6563723

[yeoman6987]

54. Yes so shocking considering 50 percent of the country is Republican

I guess lying would have been a better option for some around here. I don't even know why that's the focus after a two hour interview.

[KittyWampus]

96. He is trading on the currency of his celebrity. So while I don't care about him and know little

about the whole circus that is his family, I have no issue with everything he says and does getting analyzed and debated and criticized.

DU talks about lots of stuff every day that doesn't involve really "caring" that deeply about this or that.

People offer opinions on stuff.

[niyad]

10. who is bruce jenner, and why should anybody care?

[Blue_Adept]

15. It's all just silly sports stuff.

I mean, why should anyone celebrate someone who was considered one of the greatest olympians our country has had, right?

[niyad]

17. considering how corrupt the olympics are, that isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.

[Blue_Adept]

19. Sorry, I forgot.

Everything, everywhere, sucks.

[niyad]

20. are you quoting someone?

[pnwmom]

26. If you had watched that Olympics you wouldn't be attributing his win to corruption. n/t

[tazkcmo]

41. In 1976

The Olympics were still fun.

[niyad]

42. really? I remember the furor at so many olympics over the way the soviet bloc judges

judged american skaters, for example.

[tazkcmo]

53. Well, yeah!

That was part of the charm! It's where the line, "And the East German judge gives it a 2!" comes from! THOSE were Olympics like we'll never see again until Putin's 7th term as "President".

[pnwmom]

90. His events were in things that could be measured in time and in meters.

No concerns about judges fudging scores.

[eShirl]

93. Exactly; this was no subjective scoring like in ice dancing, for example. n/t

[Logical]

56. LOL, you really don't know who he is? wow. nt

[KittyWampus]

97. It was 40 years ago. I remember cause those were my teen years. NOW?

I had to have a friend explain who the Kardashians were and why Bruce Jenner was getting mentioned again after 40 years.

[BainsBane]

11. I didn't see the interview

and I don't know if he is in transition or what the correct pronoun to use is. I will say this much. Bruce Jenner has been hounded to death and trans-shamed disgustingly. I do not believe any of us here need to join in that phenomenon is any way, shape, or form. If he is trans or gay, that is his right, and I don't care if he is conservative, liberal, D or R. Enough.

[pnwmom]

27. He is still using the male pronoun at this point, and is still trying to get

a grip on the whole thing -- calling himself "Bruce" sometimes, to refer to his male self, and then also saying he was a woman inside.

The interview is well worth-watching. He was sincere and his children, sister, and mother were lovely.

[awoke_in_2003]

64. Hear, hear. nt

[jalan48]

13. I think of Bruce Jenner and then think of the photos of starving children in the the third world-

His problems seem pretty minor in comparison.

[Blue_Adept]

16. True

But what he's going through and expressing it in a national forum that gets a lot of attention will help A LOT of kids or adults that have similar feelings and will gain more realization that they're not alone. And that others who interact with people like them won't shame them as much since there may be a greater understanding that comes from interviews like this.

This and starving children are separate issues. Each has their own importance. Why minimize one through the use of another?

[jalan48]

23. I don't mean to minimize. If Bruce is a positive role model for others that is a good thing.

For me it's a question of priorities. When the news media spends more time on Bruce Jenner than on climate change I think it's a problem for all of us.

[pnwmom]

29. He would agree. But so are the problems of most of us in the first world. nt

[jalan48]

31. Good point-Perhaps the Kardasians would have been a better example.

[951-Riverside]

14. He killed a 60 year old woman 2 months ago and acts like it didnt happen

...of course he's a Republican.

RIP Kim Howe

[pnwmom]

21. "Acts like it didn't happen"? Where are you getting that?

[cherokeeprogressive]

75. Diana Sawyer said the interview took place before the accident.

[pnwmom]

18. I'm sure he knows that. And being a conservative is probably why it took him so long

to be able to come out.

He's his own worst enemy.

[LittleBlue]

25. He identified as a Republican, not sure how conservative he is

Tbh he didn't sound politically sophisticated. He thought Boehner and McConnell would be receptive. That tells me one of his friends got him to identify as Republican with slogans (support the Constitution). Now that he's out, hopefully the community will sway him away from those who hate him

(Btw Bruce hasn't asked to be referred to by a different pronoun)

[cilla4progress]

28. He struck me as something of a

dim bulb.

That aside, I really hope his coming out normalizes being transgender.

I think it, along with homosexuality, pro-choice, equal pay for women - so many of these things are accepted in the mainstream community.

Why do we let the right-wing extremists drive the debate? Because, Roger Ailes?

[pnwmom]

32. I think his coming out as a conservative AND transgender could have a greater impact

than if the conservatives could slot him as an "other."

Instead, he's said he's one of them. And he's surrounded by a loving family who supports him -- the conservative dream (even with multiple wives.)

So now the ball is in the conservative court. How do they respond to him?

[cilla4progress]

37. Fascinating observations!

Will be interesting to watch!

[Hepburn]

30. Bruce Jenner and has a problem...

...he is a fucking REPUKE!!! Gag me...

[gregcrawford]

34. Could it be...

... that Jenner is just a shameless opportunist milking the "reality show" cash cow for all it's worth? I mean, (insert gender pronoun of your choice) has already established that beyond doubt, so it's just a matter of degree.

I suspect that the audience that is entertained by such voyeuristic drivel as "Keeping Up With The Kardashians," "Here Comes Honey Boo-Boo," et cetera, are nearly all of the uber-conservative persuasion, though spelling such polysyllabic words undoubtedly presents an insurmountable challenge. With that in mind, it's not unreasonable to assume that Jenner is appealing to (insert gender pronoun of your choice) base with that LOOK AT ME! I'M A CONSERVATIVE! remark.

[pnwmom]

40. Did you watch the interview? I don't think you'd have written this post if you had.

Whatever his reasons for being on the reality show -- and I'm guessing it might have mostly been just to please some of his children -- his public profile as a result of that show made it impossible for him to transition quietly. He was boxed in. So his best choice now was to publicly out himself and get it over with.

[pnwmom]

50. Did you watch the interview? Kris was not a part of it. The other adult children, the ones we never

see, were there and they were very supportive.

I think this was all about Bruce and his struggles, not about Kris. Yes, she could find a way to milk it, but this special was not about her.

[gregcrawford]

79. Please do not misunderstand me...

... I am completely sympathetic to Jenner's choice, indeed, existential need, to transition, and I'm sure it is sincere. I'm straight, but I have dear friends who went through it long before it was as tolerated as it is now, which ain't sayin' much, BUT... big but, that tribe is hopelessly addicted to attention, and even a sincere choice can be exploited for a buck. As you observed, Jenner's been in the spotlight so long that anonymity is not an option. But that doesn't mean that he or she, and others might not take crass advantage of it, and by so doing, demean the experience of those less able to insulate themselves with comforting layers of money.

[pnwmom]

82. I don't think if you had watched it you'd be suggesting there was any possibility he was trying

to take "crass advantage of it." It was obviously very painful for him to go through. He also happens to directly address this very question when Diane Sawyer asks him.

[hifiguy]

35. Wealth trumps all. nt

[LeftInTX]

38. Please Bruce Jenner, have a photo-op with Ted Cruz

[Hepburn]

39. Maybe we should contact Teddy and ask him do do this? N/T

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

43. Bruce just wants his tax cut

Tax cuts always trump rights and shit for folks like him.

[SoapBox]

44. Politically speaking...idiot.

Will he be joining the Log Cabin Republicans?

[Rex]

46. He is a republican no doubt about it. nt

nt

[pnwmom]

51. Please watch it before you call it a publicity stunt.

And "we" are using the male pronouns because that is what Bruce Jenner is comfortable with at this point in his transitioning. He hasn't yet taken a new name either. Why should we judge him for following his own timeframe on this?

I think it is very unfair to disparage him this way without even seeing the interview. And there is no "normal" or "standard" about how, when, or where any transgender person is on his or her path.

[FreeState]

62. You didn't watch the show or you wouldn't have posted this n/t

[awoke_in_2003]

65. He is still using male pronouns...

and will be until it is complete.

[cwydro]

76. I just can't see a person

"choosing" to transition simply for publicity.

That's just not how it works.

[pnwmom]

91. "(I'm not saying) he isn't being dishonest." Logically, this is equivalent to: "I AM saying He IS being dishonest."

I'd have thought this was a mistake except for the fact that you've already implied he's doing this for the publicity.

[Aerows]

77. I'm disappointed by this post

I know Jenner is caught up in the media maelstrom, attention mongering of those in his family, but that doesn't make his desire to transition any less valid.

It could be that his attention-mongering, media-hungry family made it 20x worse for him to make what is a very personal decision.

I give folks the benefit of the doubt, and I give it to you, too.

[tammywammy]

85. Sawyer brought up Obama not Jenner.

He said he didn't want to get political, she asked follow up questions and he answered them.

[Aerows]

86. I detest the whole family

and didn't know who they were (don't watch normal TV)

I can appreciate the disgust with it, I am disgusted by the entire brood involved.

I still wish that a transgender person can be treated like a human being.

[JanetLovesObama]

102. I agree 100%

Jenner is the Sarah Palin of the LGBT. A liar, a con artist, a money-grubbing Hollywood Republican whore looking for another fake reality show. He is out of wives and needs a job. He is also a terrible parent. Let his two daughters drop out of high school to slut and whore around.

I have been a long time supporter of the LGBT but until they hold this ass-clown up as the con artist and liar he is I will no longer financially support the LGBT. I do believe transgenders are real and deserve transitioning.. Which also by the way, Jenner had a boob job but says he has no intention of having his penis removed. He says he "is not gay and has no desire to have sex with a man"! Well then what the hell IS he? Does he think a Lesbian wants to have sex with him with that thing hanging between his legs? He is a damn liar, fake, and a fraud.

And yes, that Kardashian bunch is exacly like the Palin trash. White trash with Republican money.

[SunSeeker]

52. Why does he insist he is not gay?

He says he's a woman and is only attracted to women. Doesn’t that make him a lesbian? It seems being gay is even harder for him to come to grips with than being a woman.

[TDale313]

101. I think he's still just working through all this and how to talk about it.

When he said he wasn't gay, it was in the context of saying he wasn't attracted to men, and was attracted to women. Diane Sawyer asked him if that meant he was/would be a lesbian and I think it was kind of a "humm" reaction, and he said let's just go with asexual- for now. But he was pretty clear about being attracted to women, even if he's still figuring out the language for it and what labels, if any, fit.

[Heddi]

55. This thread is great for highlighting how otherwise "liberals" are still bigoted against trans* folk

they're confused
he doesn't know what he wants
he's really gay he just doesn't know it
how can he be a woman when he's fathered 6 kids
this is for publicity

I thought that Liberals were supposed to be the more enlightened ones. I thought liberals were supposed to be accepting of people, especially those going through such tough times in their lives.

I feel like many posters here should get their nasty asses back to FR or Discussionist or wherever it is they get their hateful, bigoted, juvenile mindsets about transgenderism, gender identity, and human sexuality.

[lancer78]

57. Most of us are enlightened

its just what bothers some is that we are to believe being LGBT is not a choice, yet Bruce Jenner made the choice after 50-60 years to finally become a woman? I think this damages those fighting for LGBT rights because the anti-LGBT crowd can point to this person and say "See, being LGBT is a choice".

[Heddi]

58. Give me a fucking break. He didn't choose to be transgender

I didn't choose to be bisexual. Yes, I choose my sexual partners (as does everyone), but there was no CHOICE in being attracted to women as well as men.

He never CHOSE to feel out of place in his gender of birth.

The fact that he is "righting a wrong" isn't a choice. The fact he didn't do it sooner wasn't a choice--it was survival.

What about men and women who "Played straight" and married, and had children,and later in life came out as the people they truly were the whole time...is that a choice? No. We live in a bigoted society that thinks eeww! two boys kissing yuckypoo. Better today than 30 years ago, but the violence, the sexual assault, the abandonment by friends and family, being kicked out of your house....people have to survive.

The choice isn't "gay vs straight" or "man vs woman," it's "live vs die" "survive vs not survive"

but I thought we kind of collectively knew that in 2014. I guess not.

[Ex Lurker]

59. Absent the backstory, I would wish Jenner well

But anyone associated with the Kardashians has no credibility with me. Sorry.

[cherokeeprogressive]

61. I'm not believing my eyes, I swear. n/t

[beam me up scottie]

66. Wow.

Just fucking wow.

I thought there might be one or two uninformed comments but it's truly amazing what you find on a so-called liberal website.

Sickening.

[NuclearDem]

87. I would have a ton more respect for some people

if they just came out and said they have problems with trans* people rather than hiding behind bullshit.

They fucking did this with Chelsea Manning too, and it's time for another round of tombstones.

[SusanCalvin]

72. Coming out is a choice, not *being*.

And, yes, I think it could take that many years. Or it could never happen (sadly). I don't know from personal experience; I just like to think I have a certain amount of empathy.

Somewhat related, I've always had a stock response to the "it's a choice" deal - I just say (since pretty much everyone who says that is strait, or says they are), "Really? Why don't *you* choose to be transgender (or gay, or whatever is under discussion) right now, just to prove it can be done?" Or words to that general effect.

[PeaceNikki]

103. WHAT THE FUCK!?!?! "...we are to believe being LGBT is not a choice"???

[TDale313]

105. Just FYI. This? Not enlightened.

Gender identity and sexual orientation are not things we choose. We can make choices in how or if we talk about these things (often under incredible pressure to conform) We can choose who our partners are or how we present ourselves to the world. The choice Bruce made was to live openly as the person he's always known he was inside, and I think that took a lot of courage- especially for someone who spent 6 decades not feeling able to do so.

[LostOne4Ever]

67. This post wins all of gd and the internets!

I don't give a damn if someone says I can't award the Internet, this post deserves it!!!

[morningfog]

69. I fully agree.

Even the posts mocking him as "coming out" as a republican and this OP reek. How he discusses and explains his gender identity and how we discuss the same has nothing to do with the political party he chooses.

I don't care about his politics. I care greatly about how he has publicly shared an experience that will almost certainly save lives at some point. And I don't think that is an overstatement.

[KittyWampus]

98. you are claiming DU'ers in this thread are saying things they didn't say.

As for the "this is for publicity"…. he's doing a reality show and his entire family profits from using their celebrity.

I want nothing to do with anyone saying he's ONLY doing it as a publicity stunt.

But there is not doubt that he's personally willing to profit by perpetuating that publicity circus.

Oh, I see "lancer" made a pretty foul comment. Why portray others as making unfounded comments?

[AgingAmerican]

73. He doesn't care about the LGBT community

He is a narcissist. He wants attention.

[Bluenorthwest]

94. Jenner has yet to become part of the community, one foot still in the old world....

Elizabeth Warren was a Republican until she was in her late 40's, not a jock but a Professor who should have known that Supply Side was piracy, but apparently was distracted by her own growing wealth. Something, no one knows what, pulled her to the left. So one would have to assume that something like a change of gender might also change a person's point of view politically, if it is in fact possible to be a Bush Republican one day then the World's Most Progressive Millionaire the next, then I'd have to say anything is possible.

[JCMach1]

74. To promote his new reality show for Discovery...

any 'good' he does is collateral...

[cherokeeprogressive]

84. The show's on E!, not Discovery.

Fuck.

[Puzzledtraveller]

89. One of the most disgusting comment I have seen on DU.

[Orrex]

104. AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

On Mon Apr 27, 2015, 10:46 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

He said it as he looked around at his house and belongings, not down at his crotch. Ergo, he
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6572366

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

This post is highly insensitive. This person is reducing Bruce Jenner's gender identity to his "crotch." I know that some people think any sort of rude comment is okay when you are talking about Republicans, but please keep in mind that we have many transgender people here (and allies) who do not appreciate seeing gender identity reduced to a person's "crotch." There is already another thread pointing out how inappropriate this post is. Please send a message that Democratic Underground is tolerant and accepting of transgender people by voting to hide this post. Thank you for your time.

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Apr 27, 2015, 10:54 AM, and the Jury voted 4-3 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: This is yet another in a long line of posts mocking Jenner for being transgendered, and the alerter is exactly correct that WinkyDink is equating genitalia with identity. Although clearly intended as a joke, this sort of thinking is retrograte and insensitive, as well as being a direct and juvenile insult to the trans community.

HIDE IT
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I do not agree with the poster that made the comment, but I don't see how it is outside our community standards. If there is already a thread started about this post, post your concerns and disagreement in that thread, or as a reply to this post. Some members need education, not hidden post. Let's educate them. Again, I personally, do not believe anyone would come out as transgender for publicity or fame. There is too much raw emotion there for that.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Jenner needs to look beyond the glitz and material things.
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: I agree with the alerter.
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: We can do better than making snide comments about celebrity's anatomy. Try saying what you mean without crotch references.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

Since I got the jury results almost immediately after submitting my vote, I have to think that I was the 4th "hide."

[Cha]

83. I know.. "the constitution.." But, FYI.. The Obama Admin's Transgender Right Campaign..

Obama Transgender Rights

"Obama's Transgender Rights Campaign Gets Little Attention"

snip//

With little of the fanfare or criticism that marked his evolution into the leader Newsweek nicknamed "the first gay president," Obama became the first chief executive to say "transgender" in a speech, to name transgender political appointees and to prohibit job bias against transgender government workers. Also in his first term, he signed hate crime legislation that became the first federal civil rights protections for transgender people in U.S. history.


Since then, the administration has quietly applied the power of the executive branch to make it easier for transgender people to update their passports, obtain health insurance under the Affordable Care Act, get treatment at Veteran's Administration facilities and seek access to public school restrooms and sports programs — just a few of the transgender-specific policy shifts of Obama's presidency.

MOre..
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/obama-transgender-rights/

[Jesus Malverde]

88. It's worth noting that the LGBT community

Is not some monolith, like any community they have diverse viewpoints. Even within the community there are natural tensions and disagreements.

Link

[Ken Burch]

92. To slightly rewrite and repurpose Walt Whitman

"Within his contradictions, she will contain multitudes".

[Bluenorthwest]

95. He said he was a Republican. Just a couple of years ago, most leading Democrats were also spewing

their dogmatic bigotry toward LGBT people. This pretense among straight Democrats that they have always been with us is very much unearned. I spent the 08 Primary season watching Obama tour with Ex Gays. 'God is in the mix, I'm a Christian and it is my job to speak for God'. John Edwards railed about his Deacon Daddy, traditional Jesus Marriage, 'it's just a part of me, I can't help it, one man, one woman'. Liar, adulterer, hypocrite and hate speaker. Democrat.
Half of DU regularly falls into ecstatic devotions to the Pope, who is just a bigoted anti gay hate preacher. He's different from Pat Robertson if you are in his faith, but otherwise, two sides of the same bad coin.
29 States allow discrimination in employment against LGBT people, but DU allows 'populists' who shit on us saying our rights are just about 'social issues' not about jobs. How vile is that? They discriminate against us in employment then insist that's not about money? That's awful shit. Awful.

Further, I am told daily here that the ONLY progressive in the Party is Senator Warren, herself a Republican until she was nearly 50, and not some celebrity jock, she was a Professor, claiming to be politically insightful. She voted for Reagan and for Bush.
So if I'm supposed to buy into the idea that Webb, Warren and Chaffee all get to spend decades as upper class Republicans then poof, one day they are Democrats how do I rationalize this contempt for Jenner?
It's because Jenner is trans, not some ultra rich straight woman.

[steve2470]

100. I'm hopeful he and other conservatives will have a teachable moment and moments....

We can all hope.