Stiglitz and Sanders under the bus.

[WilliamPitt]

Seriously, where am I?

They were heroes here a year ago.

Remember?

I do.

[smokey nj]

1. We're through the looking glass, Will.

[seabeyond]

2. omg... you that have spent how long doing it to clinton? nt

[hrmjustin]

3. How so?

[marmar]

4. In Alice-In-Party-Over-Principleland

[m-lekktor]

9. yeah I am self censoring big time. I let it out on facebook though. nt

[cali]

6. HDF. Hillary Defence Force

They're upset over the positive attention Bernie is getting.

[cantbeserious]

12. ^^^ THIS ^^^

eom

[Depaysement]

26. Hilarious

[hifiguy]

33. You just might be right, cali.

[L0oniX]

41. HDF ...gotta luv that.

[DanTex]

7. Yeah! Only Hillary and Obama are supposed to be under the bus! What's wrong with people!

[MineralMan]

8. And how many posts have you made to throw President Obama

under the bus? Almost nobody's throwing Sanders under any bus. Some doubt that he can win, and that's a valid issue in a Presidential race. Many people will vote on that basis in the primaries, and political planners and major contributors take that very seriously in their considerations.

You're complaining about something that isn't really happening on DU. You can find a few isolated threads where someone is dissing Senator Sanders, but they're not getting much traction. There are dozens of threads trashing Hillary Clinton and President Obama. Just trash the threads that you hate and you won't see them any longer. That's my suggestion. DU will have all sorts of threads about the primary race. Not all will be 100% supportive of Sanders. That I can guarantee.

[Andy823]

13. I am with you

I see some posts where a poster doubts Bernie can win, but nothing that could be called "throwing him under the bus"! It seems more like some here are playing the victim in order to paint others in a bad light, and it's pretty much the same posters who have been throwing Obama under the us for years, and now are doing the same with Clinton.

I think instead of throwing accusations around, people who support certain candidates should concentrate on the issues, instead of playing games.

[MineralMan]

19. Many posters do discuss issues and make good cases for

their favorite candidates. I appreciate their posts. Others, however, focus on writing posts that simply are in opposition to a Democratic candidate, without any real comparison between the candidates we will be voting on in 2016. Still others focus on other DUers in their posts, without much information at all about the choices we all will be making.

Still other posters discuss primarily political history and how people vote in elections. There are some really politically savvy people writing about these topics, and we need to pay attention. DU represents only a small fraction of Democratic voters. DUers aren't here in numbers enough to really affect any elections, especially a presidential election.

Studying how voters behave, polling trends, and how we can most effectively work to bring voters to the polls who will vote for Democratic candidates are another set of important topics, although they rarely create long, active threads with lots of recommendations. DU is just a political discussion forum. It has a limited set of viewers who read posts, so its influence is rather small, when weighed against other things.

[yuiyoshida]

37. I hope mine isn't one of them..

I made the poll to have fun, with all the discussion about his bad hair, it was meant to have people lighten up about it.. as we should.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026610719

[Major Hogwash]

56. Naw, don't worry about it.

Of course that poll of yours wasn't one of them!
I thought it was funny and entertaining.
Besides all that, since the choices of the poll were so absurd, I think it broke the tension in GD for the whole weekend.

[yuiyoshida]

58. Someone disagreed with you

And alerted on it. Some people have no sense of humor.

[Major Hogwash]

59. Well, that person not only doesn't have a sense of humor, he must be a . . .

. . . poopyhead, too!

Because I was cracking up just reading it.

[yuiyoshida]

60. Their take on it was...

What if this was posted about Hillary Clinton, DU would have a Nuclear melt down!!!

[Major Hogwash]

62. That's way too much hyperbole for me.

For one thing, there was a thread about Hillary's hair started in GD last week.
And, yet, the Earth continued to spin on its axis the very next day without apocalyptic ramifications taking place here at DU.

For another thing, if hair was such a critical factor to anyone at DU in determining who is a great Democratic candidate, someone should do a thorough investigation to find out who turned DU into a beauty shop!

This is why the "hair's on fire" crowd at DU is so hard to take seriously.
Someone is always pulling their hair out around this forum, it seems.

[yuiyoshida]

63. agree...

Didn't know about the Hillary posting.. I am surprised the person who alerted on me, failed to alert on that. I suspect though, they needed an excuse to put an Asian American in her "place".

[Major Hogwash]

64. Well, that could have been the underlying reason for the alert.

No doubt about it.
The misogyny is rampant here, along with way too many racist comments being made about Asian Americans, blacks and other minorities.

Your hair looks fabulous, by the way.

But, it's late and I've got to hit the rack.

[yuiyoshida]

65. nite nite

Oyasumi nasai !

[Jack Rabbit]

54. Not all will be 100% supportive of Sanders

And I predict that the team that scores the most runs will win today.

IIRC, Hillary had it wrapped up eight years ago. What happened?

I was one of those who had low expectations of a Clinton presidency being anything more than warmed over DLC Republican lite garbage, and I decided to lend my voice to Senator Obama. I will say that what I got was somewhat better than I expected of a Clinton presidency, but somewhat less than I had hoped for from President Obama. If I had had my way, TPP and TTIP would be DOA, we'd be long out of Afghanistan, we would have been out of Iraq sooner and the NSA spy-on-everyone program would be a bad memory of dark years of the Frat Boy and the Big Dick, who would have been tried and convicted by now in federal court of torture and other war crimes along with Rummy, Dr. Rice, Gonzo and a swath of other crooked and sadistic bastards who served under them. Speaking of crooked bastards, Legs Dimon and Pretty Boy Lloyd would now be appealing their convictions on a gazillion counts of banking fraud and I would singing the praises of Eric Holder and Lanny Breuer instead of throwing them under the bus as they richly deserve. Much of what I got was really what I was expected of a Clinton presidency, or even a McCain presidency.

I am delighted that we got some health care reform, though not as much as hoped for or needed, and, although as a humanist I am a little embarrassed to admit it but I am really delighted that Osama bin Laden is dead, dead, dead. I can't say I shed any tears over him.

Much of what I had hoped for wasn't forthcoming because the Republicans in Congress, a pack of racist, misogynist, Koch addled sociopaths who want nothing more than to kill the black man's mule and dump manure in his well and punish Americans for voting for him twice. They made damned sure there was no recovery.

So, in 2015, I'm feeling right where I did in 2007, dreading a presidencial race between Hillary Clinton and an actual Republican. The announcement of Bernie Sanders' candidacy reminds of a glimmer of optimism I felt just after turning 16, in November 1967, when Seantor Gene McCarthy announced that he would challenge President Johnson in the Democratic primaries starting with New Hampshire. The 1968 presidential race was shaping up at that time as being between LBJ, who blundered us into Vietnam, and Richard Nixon, who wasn't perceived as being in any hurry to get us out. Vietnam wasn't just a foreign policy blunder to me, but a threat to my life as my 18th birthday approached with no end of the war in sight. Tonight, I am a sixty-three year old man facing my 65th birthday listening to bastards like Paul Ryan suggesting that I've been laying in a hammock and America doesn't owe me the Social Security I paid into.

I served in the US Army after the Vietnam war was over in order duck the recession in the mid-seventies. As we used to say in the Army, Congressman Ryan, FOAD. I am so glad that now Senator Sanders is running against the folly of neoliberalism (or Reaganomics, trickle-down economics, the Third Way or whatever you call that folly) as I was forty-eight years ago when Senator McCarthy ran against the folly of the war in Vietnam.

[kentuck]

66. Good post Jack Rabbit!

[IDemo]

10. The 'fools' of only one camp are safe from hides here n/t

[m-lekktor]

16. yeah, I noticed which "fools" thread was hidden and which one wasn't. nt

[sufrommich]

11. You're on Democratic Underground during primary season.nt

[magical thyme]

14. link please? nt

[Dragonfli]

17. I saw this one about Stiglitz

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026611268

[Maedhros]

52. Some posters specialize in messenger-killing. [n/t]

[Enthusiast]

67. That is fucking horrible.

[sabrina 1]

15. Lots of former Liberal heroes are under buses for a few here. But for most, that is not the case.

Sometimes people just ignore them, because anyone who would throw good Democrats away because they speak the truth, isn't worth worrying about, imo.

If we were to make a list, to those few it would include almost every, single respected journalist, Democrat, most of the base, and whenever I have asked for recommendations as to who CAN we trust, I get no answer.

Bernie is doing far better than anyone anticipated, even those who asked him to enter the race.

Those who don't support him thought it would easy to dismiss him.

That isn't happening so they are feeling threatened.

I take that as a good sign for Bernie. No one is going to after someone who is insignificant.

[L0oniX]

46. Nut shell ...got it.

[Zorra]

18. There exists in America a strange hybrid, an unstable political animal, which is a cross between

an elephant and a donkey.

This animal is commonly known as a sychophant.

Sychophants become enamored of, and fixated on, specific individuals, and can become unstable and dangerous when the object of their fixation is threatened. Under these conditions, they often become fearful and enraged, causing them to abandon all reason and logic.

Sycophants have been known to throw large segments of populations, even entire countries, under buses when sensing danger to the object of their fixation.

[hifiguy]

31. Some people have high-school crushes on individual politicians

and remain astonishingly resistant to actual facts. They are to be avoided.

For serious people, it's all about the policies, not the person.

[JDPriestly]

57. More important is the fact that a lot of voters vote against a candidate because of the

candidate's personality or person.

That's why it is important to choose a likeable candidate.

[Enthusiast]

68. +1 You nailed it.

[L0oniX]

45. That would make a great PBS Nature special presentation.

[MisterP]

22. "progressive" just means "supports candidate N unconditionally, no matter the policies"

[Andy823]

23. Total BS!

Why do you stay on such a board if you feel this way?

[nationalize the fed]

24. + a few billion

The Obama presidency has destroyed the party. It used to favor unions, healthcare, pensions, teachers, public education, environmentalism, and living wage. Now a look around shows favor of corporations, corporate health insurance, 401k's, busting teacher unions, profitized education, fracking, offshore drilling, and Bangladesh-level wages - the Turd Way. They're happy to get trounced at the polls as long as no one insults Obama (now Clinton).

A perfect summation of the last 6 1/2 years.

Clinton took a baseball bat to the progressives knees and now this Obama character has shoved a knife into the back. It's been disgusting to watch.

[L0oniX]

43. Add a few more billion.

[Enthusiast]

69. Me too.

[Major Hogwash]

29. "The Obama presidency has destroyed the party."

[L0oniX]

44. ++++++

[Number23]

48. I feel sorry for them too.

[JI7]

51. isn't this the one that wants to get rid of the african american forum on a democratic website

i guess we know why they wish to go back to the "good ole days" when certain people were kept in their place.

[Number23]

55. I wouldn't doubt it. Not that he's the only one pining for the Good Old Days around here

I mean anyone that can look at the president's 80+% approval rating from Democrats -- and with some members of the Democratic base, the number is actually closer to 90% -- and conclude that this wildly popular and beloved person has "destroyed" the Democratic party is just too isolated from reality and too far away from the truth to be taken even the tiniest bit seriously.

Add on the "pining" for the Good Old Days (for white men) and the open disrespect for minorities and that just takes things to a whole 'nother level.

[MisterP]

21. look, the moment the clock strikes at Jan. 20, 2017, we all know how the BOGers are

gonna start treating Obama himself

[Major Hogwash]

27. Please proceed, MisterP.

Tell me how I am going to start treating President Obama!

[Cha]

38. Sounds like you know nothing. But, yeah, do "please proceed".

[ananda]

25. I have always admired and appreciated both..

.. Sanders and Stiglitz.

And of course Noam Chomsky, Amy Goodman, and Bill Moyers.

[fredamae]

28. I guess it's a matter of

Who tossed who under the bus first, who's Doing the tossing and the reasons why.
Entrenched mainstream pols have done Way more "tossing of us under the proverbial buses" than we have done unto them, imo.

[hifiguy]

30. There seems to be a semi-organized effort

to slander Sanders as, of all things, a crypto-racist and too oriented towards economic issues at the expense of social issues. And even his commitment to "social issues" has been impliedly questioned. Really? REALLY?

To see those kinds of lies on DU is vomit-inducing.

[liberal_at_heart]

50. It's like DU has become the new FOX news where lies are considered truth and actual facts are

ignored. We're in bizarro world.

[Enthusiast]

70. It's very disturbing.

But not entirely unpredictable.

[emulatorloo]

32. Says who? 2 or 3 dumbass weekend OPs?

That doesn't make a trend.

[L0oniX]

42. LMAO

[SMC22307]

49. LOL And over half of the posts in the Stiglitz-is-a-liar thread...

were from one person posting under their two screen names. Which is rather pitiful, if you think about it.

[DefenseLawyer]

34. It was the same or worse in 2008

The outlook of the most ardent Clinton supporters has always been slash and burn to win. Not that its necessarily a bad mindset in politics, but no one should be surprised in 2016

[aikoaiko]

35. Who?

[JaneyVee]

36. Any positive Obama thread gets: HERO WORSHIP IS DISGUSTING!

Any thread with slight disagreement to any other preferred candidate gets: WAAH! WHY ARE THEY UNDER THE BUS.

Lets get some consistency here.

[Cheese Sandwich]

39. Stiglitz was guilty of not sufficiently bowing to authority

He could criticize the powerful on economic issues because it makes most people yawn.

But as soon as he questioned their motives they unleashed the hounds against him.

[ibegurpard]

40. Remember Wesley Clark?

The manufactured faux-grassroots candidate promoted to take the wind out of Dean's sails? That's when these kinds of efforts started on DU. I've gotten to the point where I just find it amusing to watch the usual suspects take sides.

[Rex]

47. The DINOs...er yellowdogs...er whatever they claim to be are desperate for us to lose imo.

That way they can complain for another 4 years about liberals on a progressive forum. IF ONLY I believed half of them were really progressives or even going to vote Dem...but I don't.

[sadoldgirl]

53. There is a question that will not be easy

to answer. If HRC will try to "left out Bernie",that means
she has to disagree with some of Obama's policies.
If so, what will the Obama admirers do?

Go for Clinton, because that would be the future?
Stick to Obama's policies, because they want to
support him to the end?

I happen to think there will be a lot of waffling,
but prove me wrong!

[LiberalAndProud]

61. I like them both.

Still, I fail to see the value in scolding those who hope to see Hillary elected. Naturally they will leap to her defense, and rightfully so. That they disagree with those who challenge her candidacy isn't unexpected and doesn't deserve your scold.

There was a time I would have looked forward to an eloquent treatise on the virtues of both Stiglitz and Sanders. I would have preferred that over this.

[NCTraveler]

71. Hillary and Obama are under the bus waiting.

If you would stop running those two over it might be a little more comfortable for Sanders under there.