For Those Attempting To Smear Bernie Sanders Over The Gun Issue... Please Read This:

[WillyT]

DULink: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026602795

[leftofcool]

1. He may be a great man and one I would support if he wins the primary but

that does not negate his gun issue.

[Number23]

5. Exactly. Why are those who love to scream the loudest how they are all about "issues" so concerned

that people want to discuss Bernie's votes and time in office? I don't get the impression at all that he is a delicate hot house flower that needs to be protected.

And on top of that, I have no idea what that other thread is supposed to do in terms of mitigating the "smears" about his gun votes.

[KittyWampus]

23. It's refreshing to see you are finally embracing your inner pragmatist.

[Number23]

30. As usual, you are arguing about absolutely nothing and no one knows what you're babbling about

[99Forever]

31. I think perhaps this was in the wrong place.

As it doesn't make sense to me either. I'll delete it. And thanks so much for the personal snark. Very classy, "as usual."

[Number23]

32. You get what you give, hon.

[99Forever]

33. Right back atcha, hon.

Bless your heart.

[Number23]

34. Please see post #30. It is appropriate for just about everything you post on this board.

And certainly for your "contribution" to this conversation which you admitted was in error and yet, are still here stirring up a big pot of nothing for absolutely no reason. As usual.

[99Forever]

36. Bye bye.

[Number23]

37. Finally.

[bigwillq]

2. Politicians are meant to be smeared

and criticized. Bernie should not get a pass.

[MineralMan]

3. Did he vote against the Brady Act or not?

Did he vote in favor of gun manufacturers or not? Facts are simply facts. People will consider them as they will. He's not running in Vermont. He's running for President of the entire country. Facts will be considered by voters. Facts are not smears. They are Simply facts.

[Autumn]

4. It's like Hillary's IWR vote. People will hold it against them or they won't,

you are right. They are simply facts.

[MineralMan]

6. Exactly. Candidates' records are matters of public record.

They will be discussed and considered by voters. What is important to one may not be important to others. The facts will emerge. Calling facts smears isn't valid, IMO.

[totodeinhere]

9. You are not ever going to find a perfect candidate who voted 100% the way you wanted them to.

You just aren't. That's why you have to look at their overall record rather than cherry picking.

[treestar]

12. My goodness, that's hilarious

to see on DU. When it's Bernie, all the usual rules don't apply. And he's not even a Democrat.

[boston bean]

15. That is what I keep thinking...

one standard does not fit all, obviously.

[totodeinhere]

26. Not at all. I at least apply the same standard to all. I evaluate their overall positions on all of

the issues important to me and then I decide whom to support. I think it's also OK to take into consideration who the candidate is. For instance I think it is valid to make the case that it's high time that this country finally elect a woman to its highest office just as we finally elected an African American. But in this case I don't think that Hillary Clinton is that woman. I would enthusiastically support Elizabeth Warren but apparently she isn't running.

[totodeinhere]

25. What rule are you referring to? Is there a rule that we can only support a candidate that we

agree with 100% of the time? Because if there is I never heard of it. I agree with Bernie probably more than any other potential candidate with the possible exception of Warren. And I certainly agree with him more than Clinton. And I don't see any problem with that. On the other hand you are free to support Clinton. But are you going to tell me that there is absolutely no position that Clinton has ever taken that you disagree with?

As far as the Democrat part goes, he is running as a Democrat so he is a Democrat. And based on his stands on the issues, he is a better Democrat than most in my mind..

[HereSince1628]

20. Many folks like simplicity...unfortunately, simple things usually aren't

Typically getting to simplicity requires a good degree of pruning away overlying nuances that hide it. And that act of pruning is often guided thru biases and interpretation to arrive at something of an evidentiary topiary.

When a 'simple fact' is actually a reference to a voting outcome on a complex issue, all the complexity, all the nuance, all the labored prioritization needed to resolve competing interests into such a simple vote (aye, nay, abstain, absent) which went into the vote are entirely lost.

'Simple facts' liberated from their origins become potted plants suitable for ad lib use in political landscaping.

[onehandle]

7. Bumping and reposting your own thread again? nt

[WillyT]

8. Thanks For The Kick... Check The Date... No Reposting Here...

^G^O ^B^E^R^N^I^E

[BrotherIvan]

10. I will say it again

I very much disagree with Sanders on his gun votes, but I very much agree with him on his IWR vote. I think maybe we can push Bernie to the left on guns, don't you?

[KittyWampus]

24. probably not. He lives in a rural state & discusses his votes on guns = state issue.

So considering his consistency, I'd imagine he stick with his current position it's a state issue.

[BrotherIvan]

28. Perhaps, but I doubt he loves open carry and gun craziness that is going on in the rest of the

country. I'm not sure of all the reasons behind his gun votes. I think gun control in this country is an extremely important issue. But I do not expect a president to use all of their political capital tilting at that windmill.

[treestar]

11. Why is it a "smear" to note what he voted on?

[JoePhilly]

19. It's kind of hilarious isn't it.

Folks who endlessly smear Obama and now Clinton are very upset that anyone wants to talk about some of Bernie's votes.

The nature of the OP's complaint is very instructive.

[ileus]

13. We should be proud he supports the most hated of our rights.

[Renew Deal]

14. How are the facts about his voting record a smear?

I doubt he would even think that. The guy is not perfect. Is that really a surprise?

[Vinca]

17. Bernie has been representing his constituents and many of them are people

who have been hunters for generations. Vermont is not Texas. They're mostly sane people (I'm proud to have been born in Bellows Falls). I personally don't agree with him on this issue, but I've never encountered a candidate I agreed with 100%. As much as I love Obama, I sure don't agree with him on the issue of trade (for one example). I'm not totally opposed to Hillary, but Bernie happens to be closer to my socialist views so I'll support him in the primary.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

18. It's not a smear to truthfully expose a candidates views/votes

I haven't yet decided whom I'll support, but it's looking more and more like it will be Senator Sanders. I support his stand on not holding gun manufacturers responsible for the illegal use of a legal product, so this isn't a negative to me.

But even if it were, it's not a smear to put it out there. That's what campaigns are all about, learning where the candidates stand. I've yet to find one with whom I agree 100%, and I doubt I ever will. I know what my top priorities are, and I look for the candidate who most closely aligns with those priorities.

[KittyWampus]

22. Exactly, I probably vote Sanders in primary. But then I balance my idealism w/pragmatic.

He lives in a rural state where people hunt. So his constituency favors loose gun legislation.

See?

That's supporting an ideal candidate while being pragmatic.

[KittyWampus]

21. His actual record is not smearing him. FFS, is it so difficult to embrace pragmatism?

You know, this issue of his voting record on guns COULD have been a teachable moment for many of his DU supporters.

Like maybe using inflammatory and misleading rhetoric against other Democrats isn't always a great idea.

Spending hours on end declaring Democrats to be ……………… (insert juvenile insult here) because they aren't ideologically pure.

Instead, it seems many are doubling down on the "LALALA I CAN"T HEAR YOU" tactic.

[yallerdawg]

27. OK, representing his constituency excuses a non-liberal vote!

But that will never apply to Hillary, the New York senator who represented a shell-shocked and frightened New York City, the actual targets of terrorist attacks.

We hold Hillary to a higher standard.

[JVS]

35. How do fear and shell shock justify invading a country that had no connection to 9/11 whatsoever?

[yallerdawg]

38. Perfect!

No reason or excuse or apology on her part is satisfactory.

So you won't mind me holding Bernie responsible for every gun death attributable to his vote?

Same standards.

[Telcontar]

29. His gun record makes me like him more