When have conservatives EVER been on the "right side of history?"

From the revolution to slavery to prohibition, women's suffrage, the labor movement, social security, civil rights, Vietnam, Medicare, ERA, Iran-Contra, gulf war I, Afghanistan, Iraq, patriot act and marriage equality they have ALWAYS been on the wrong side.

I'm sure there are many more.

"A Conservative is a fellow who is standing athwart history yelling 'Stop!'"

William F.Buckley, Jr.

"so WHY do so many people insist on modes of thought that they can look at, historically, and recognize that they're wrong?"

Because people are just that f'ing stupid. That's why. And they're that full of hatred for the people they're tricked into believing are their enemies by a few people who are their true enemies. But that goes right back to people being that f'ing stupid, doesn't it?

the first.

uh-hum. same as it ever was -not.

They ALWAYS misread society in times of great change.

fear of change.

(from Prof. Allen Foley's book of that name on Vermont humor)

What's the matter, Joe?

I don't like all them changes they're makin' up to Montpelier!

Joe, you've been around a long time. You must have seen a lot of changes.

That's right! And I been again' every god-dammed one of 'em!

Hitler anschlussed the Sudetenland?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmund_Burke

I have no doubt he would be horrified at what we see today in GOPers like the Pigman.

he was a really interesting intellectual.

of course, his views were actually pretty centrist back in the 1700s....

no doubt he would conflate the teabaggers with the mob that he detested in France during the revolution. He would think they're too stupid to govern. I think I would agree with him.

control the 'conservative' party.

it doesn't matter what the label for the party may have been. Slavery was the status quo.

And part of the point is that the party label doesn't matter. If you're a Democrat and you support conservative positions - you're a conservative, not a liberal. You may call yourself a Democrat and share views on issues with both Republicans and Democrats - but if you, for instance, don't support equal rights for all adults - you're a social conservative. Even if you're a Democrat. Or you're a politician who is trying to appeal to social conservatives in your party.

Northern conservatives led the battle against slavery.

They were mostly progressives if anything.

The abolitionist movement was not simply made up of religious groups, btw. Fredrick Douglass would beg to differ. Along with other former slaves.

However, what was a religious conservative in that time? In comparison to what?

You can certainly say that religious groups in the north were part of the abolitionist movement - but I don't know how you can label them as conservative in relation to other beliefs at the time.

so, how do you go about doing that? what made them conservative in that time?

In the 1700s the Quakers were anti-slavery and were aligned with the atheist, Thomas Paine. So, were they conservative then?

I don't think you can apply the term "conservative" to all religious groups and you need to look at their social beliefs in the context of the time. It seems to me that, by default, any religion that was staunchly anti-slavery even before the American revolution was not a conservative religious group.

On the other hand, the religious groups in the south that used the Bible to try to justify slavery could, following the logic of conservatism as the attempt to conserve the status quo, be considered social conservatives. And religious conservatives, due to the Great Awakening - but the Great Awakening influenced the entire nation - some to positive action and some to negative action.

So, again, I guess you need to provide an explanation of religious conservative in relation to that era for me to say... okay, maybe this is one instance.

I'm often a "reply first, read other replies later" type of person

courageous Quakers who weren't afraid of rocking the boat, for instance

taking the liberal position on one issue.

The conservative position on an issue is always against progress.

almost diametrically opposed to what one associates with the labels today.

To wit, conservatives generally favored a larger governmental role in the economy while liberals favored removing some or all governmental role in the economy.

On a semi-humorous note, in the mid-1970s, the only leftwing organization protesting against South African apartheid in America that I'm aware of was the Communist Party USA (and other CP iterations). I've begun to think that communists are about 20-50 years ahead of the Democratic and Republican parties on questions of social justice.

They ALWAYS misread society in times of great change.It's a beauty!