Can an employer lock an employee in the building & force them to stay & work overtime?

[CrispyQ]

Last edited Mon May 18, 2015, 10:41 AM - Edit history (2)

My husband recently got a job in a grocery store. He is full time & works the closing shift. One of the managers locks the door at 10pm & then refuses to let my husband out at 10:30, the end of my husband's shift. Sometimes the manager just makes my husband wait (off the clock) while he finishes his paperwork, 15-20 minutes. other times he will make my husband work in other departments, sometimes as long as 2 hours past his shift. The manager taunts my husband, being rude & confrontational, knowing the my husband can't respond unless he wants to risk losing his job.

I know an employer can require you to work OT, & can fire you if you refuse, but can they lock you in & refuse to let you leave?

This is a chain store that is popular throughout the west.

My husband is taking this to store management on Monday, but I thought DUers might have some valuable suggestions/input.

on edit: Wow, lot's of great input, suggestions & ideas.

Other managers stand by the locked door, sometimes as long as 15-20 minutes, to let closing employees out. This manager either makes employees wait until he is done with his work, or makes them work until he's satisfied that everything is done. It is just so wrong.

Edit 2: Lo and behold, other employees have come forward & said that this manager has done this to them too! There is a big meeting today with all of store management. Crosses fingers that this works out & hubby doesn't have to look for another job.

[IDemo]

1. This was common practice at Target at least a few years ago

The "Flow Team", those who unload the trucks and stock the shelves during very early morning hours, were locked in supposedly for security concerns.

[FSogol]

5. I managed a large restaurant back in the 80s and we had a cleaning crew that we locked in at night.

They'd arrive around 1 am and were locked in until 8:00 am. If they left, it would set off alarms.

[SheilaT]

8. How did they get out in case of fire?

It's happened more than once that employees have died in a workplace fire behind closed doors.

Locking employees should be illegal.

[FSogol]

11. The door was locked from the outside, but if you were inside you could get out by setting off the

fire alarm on the door. The fire alarm of course summoned the police and fire dept. If they called a manager before leaving, we could disable the response to the alarm. They usually quickly finished their cleaning and then took some zzzzs on the booths.

[SheilaT]

13. I'm still bothered by the notion of locking them in.

I gather you felt you couldn't trust the employees to actually get the job done? What if they wanted to go outside for a smoke break? Why not just pay them for the time worked?

[mythology]

18. It's generally more about keeping people out than keeping them in

[harrose]

55. It sounds like they weren't locked in...

... as they could leave at any time (although it would set off alarms). Not quite the same thing as actually locking someone in (as in the OP's case) where they couldn't leave if they wanted to.

[FSogol]

19. I would have personally trusted them, but it was the company policy. Back then, they could smoke in

inside. 100% of them were immigrants (Northern VA had a huge influx of Bolivian and Salvadorian immigrants in the late 1980s.) Most were working 1-2 jobs already and liked the setup for extra money. We did pay better than a lot of places. I managed there while attending college and whenever I was closing would save some food for them.

[Cooley Hurd]

2. Pretty sure they cannot...

My 1st "over-the-table" job was 3rd shift at the local P&C. They never locked us in...

[LiberalFighter]

3. You must be paid when you aren't allowed to leave.

There is also likelihood a safety violation. If there is a fire or other emergency.

Other actions might be depending on your state.

[avebury]

4. Can your husband find another job?

Does your husband have a cell phone that he could use to capture an audio of any conversation he has with the manager requesting to be allowed to leave? If so, he should start documenting what is going on.

What the manager is doing has got to be illegal if he is holding your husband essentially prisoner against his will. Once your husband has plenty of documentation, your husband should consider one night making a phone call to the police department and state that he is being held against his will and would the police please come and make the manager let your husband out. He should insist upon filing criminal charges against this manager. Lining up an attorney that specializes in employment law ahead of time and releasing a statement to the media could help bring to the public's attention what is going on. I can't imagine that the employer would like that kind of bad publicity.

[Lint Head]

7. Exactly. Hold this person accountable and contact

local news media. Don't threaten just follow the legal route so this practice will end for everyone and possibly change policy for this business.

[KingCharlemagne]

6. IANAL, but this smells a lot like 'unlawful detention' and\or

'kidnapping'. Your husband should probably consult an attorney who specializes in labor law, as the company may have taken on some vicarious legal liability with this douche-nozzle manager.

[qazplm]

10. well

i would think he would have to request to leave and be denied for it to be either of those. If he held off because he didn't want to be fired, then that's not enough.

[KingCharlemagne]

15. That's a good point and one reason why I do not practice law! :) - nt

[avebury]

30. That is exactly why the guy should use a cell phone

to gather evidence, i.e. asking for the door to be unlocked so that he can leave and the manager's response. After he gathers enough evidence that is when he can call the police after the manager does it to him again.

[Panich52]

9. Locking employees in violates safety standards, at least.

Walmart got into trouble a couple years ago for locking in employees.

Forcing OT may be allowed, but does he get paid OT wages f/ time? If not, then that's illegal. To me locking employees in, esp after shift, is illegal detainment. But I'm not sure where law actually stands. Employees aren't quite regular citizens in a plutocracy, you know.

Your husband should contact NLRB. I'm guessing he doesn't have a union, but NLRB governs all workers, not just unionized ones. It soubds like a class action suit in the making to me.

[enlightenment]

12. Your husband might want to

contact your local Legal Aid office. Generally, they will answer a brief question without charge.
Lock-ins are legal in some cases (with OT pay if the employee is past the 40h week/8h day - usually), but this sounds more retaliatory on the part of the manager.

[Renew Deal]

14. He should be paid for the time he's obligated to be there.

And if he has to stay late for security reasons, he still needs to be paid.

[Ruby the Liberal]

16. Is the manager carrying cash and making nightly bank drops?

There may be a rule for safety that the store has to be closed by 2 people. One walking to their car alone could run a robbery risk.

[CreekDog]

28. You said nothing about him needing to be paid

Surely you arent justifying his being keptin the building without pay.

Remember the "Liberal" in your screen name.

[Ruby the Liberal]

31. Pay is assumed

If he has to be there, he is on the clock. I am asking if this requirement is because they aren't allowed to leave alone if they are closing shift.

[greiner3]

38. You missed the point of the OP saying sometimes he is off the clock.

[Ruby the Liberal]

47. You are right.

I did. My bad.

[awoke_in_2003]

45. I think the OP said it was a chain...

of grocers. Most have armored car pickups during the day.

[BainsBane]

17. No, that is legally considered slavery

and factories have been raided for locking workers inside. This is a serious issue. Depending on your state, you might contact the department responsible for labor violations. If you're in a state that isn't labor friendly however, he might be better off contacting a labor lawyer.

[Lurks Often]

20. It would depend on the definition of locked in

If all of the doors, including fire doors, are locked so that no one can leave at all, then there is almost certainly a violation of the fire code, probably OSHA regulations and probably state law. In this case, I'd skip company management and go directly to the state labor board, other state agency or even possibly your state senator or state rep.

If they can leave through fire doors in case of an emergency, with the corresponding alarm, then there is unlikely to be a violation of fire codes or other laws. This is a grayer area and calling the state labor board and asking them the legality of what is going on, without giving his name or the name of the employer.

Before recording any conversations without the night manager's knowledge, make sure to check YOUR state law regarding the legality of doing so.

Locking the doors to the outside (excluding the fire doors) is partly for the security of the people inside and partly because there is always going to be stupid people who will try to come in and shop if they see people inside if the doors open for them.

[TransitJohn]

21. Nope.

That sounds lika false imprisonment. Is he paid for the time? Then if he agrees to it I'm sure it's okay.

[yallerdawg]

22. That manager is about to get "schooled."

One of the characteristics sought after by employers in management-types is "asshole."

Every time I have seen this occur, the manager is instructed to release the employees as soon as they are off the clock - period. I have had co-workers call the police on managers! That put an end to it!

Now, if the manager requires all employees to stay on-the-clock, work and assist other departments until all work is done, they can get away with that, unless that becomes an employee issue. Your ride is waiting in the parking lot, prior obligation, etc. You can clock out anytime, and be released immediately from the facility. Your employer could justify termination, if other employees submit to these conditions.

In most states, you don't receive overtime pay until you surpass 40 hours in a pay week. A few states/communities do require OT pay if work over 8 hrs in a day. Most companies have NO OVERTIME PAY policy, so if you pick up an extra hour here and 2 hours there, you might have a 3 or 4 hour shift on the last day before you have to clock out before you hit 40 hours. Management schedules should be a standard for coverage, but we'll go along with a lot as an employee.

Sounds like your manager needs to be brought back down to earth. And definitely be less of an asshole.

[Vinca]

23. If he has no way to get out of the building and the manager refuses to let him out,

he's essentially being held hostage. The store management should beg your husband not to sue them. If they give him a hard time, I'd call an attorney.

[TheCowsCameHome]

24. Mention this to store management --

http://www.aflcio.org/About/Our-History/Key-Events-in-Labor-History/Triangle-Shirtwaist-Fire

Watch the color drain out of their faces.

[treestar]

26. laws resulted from that

so there probably are more yet and the original ones still on the books. A labor lawyer would know.

[TheCowsCameHome]

27. I'd love to know what business locks their people in.

Talk about crazy...............

[Ruby the Liberal]

32. Bank branches

They lock the doors when the branch closes, and then the employees leave together when their followup paperwork is done and the money secured in the vault.

[Jamastiene]

51. And this:

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/12/31/us/north-carolina-plant-is-fined-808150-in-fatal-fire.html

[TheCowsCameHome]

52. Yes. Good article.

I had forgotten about this tragedy.

[treestar]

25. I'd check state and federal law

There might be a prohibition.

While employment is at will, so is quitting, too. Though if you want to keep the job that's another thing. But someone who'd lock you in? That's the kind of thing a union would deal with.

I don't know they can require you to work OT - is that in any law? They have to pay a higher rate for it, but can they require it? Just seems like it should be the employee's option, not something forced.

Locking them in is "false imprisonment" and may be a crime. If they want to fire you for refusing OT, they probably can as at will employment. But locking someone in? I'd say there is a big lawsuit there.

[Hoyt]

29. I'd find another job, no matter what. The manager is an ass. But even if one were to sue them, it

will take years, assuming you even prevail in the end.

Don't most grocery stores have unions, they did when I worked in them 40 years ago. This is where a union really helps, your husband can go to the union and let them confront the manager.

If there is no union, good luck.

[avebury]

33. I would totally agree with finding another job.

Once a new job has been found I would give 2 weeks notice (because giving notice is the adult thing to do). Then if the manager pulls that locked door crap and I am not letting you out BS, I would calmly walk away out of sight of the guy and pull out my cell phone and call 911. Once the cops showed up I would insist on filing charges against the manager. I can understand having the doors locked at night for the safety of the employees and the store. But there is no excuse in making an employee stay off the clock and without additional pay after his/her shift is over.

Also to be considered, if the manager is doing this to you husband, there is a good chance he is doing it to others. An employment attorney could tell you if there is the possibility of a class action suit against the company.

You could also check out your local news stations. We have one here that has a guy that does In Your Corner stories. If a local station has a similar reporter, he or she might be interested in your husband's story.

[elleng]

34. Sounds like 'false imprisonment' to me.

'CAN' he? Physically, obviously, he CAN. MAY he do so lawfully? Doubt it.

[Orrex]

35. Yes, but only if they're literally chained to their looms.

[Wellstone ruled]

36. Depends on which State this is happening in.

In the Southwest Lowe's managers tried this crap and once Corporate received notice from State Labor Commission,that ceased and when your off the clock out the door. Someone usually a Dept Mgr or other Management would stand by the door and let people out. Yes,one person had to remain and exit with the closing Manager and he or she remained clocked in until such time.

Talk about a moral builder,the beatings will continue until moral improves.

[CarrieLynne]

37. off the clock is illegal

he must be paid ALL the time he is required to be there, no exceptions - he also must be allowed a 30 minute unpaid break every 5 hours - during that 30 min break he must be allowed to leave or whatever - if he is not allowed to leave, or not allowed a 30 min meal break at all he must be paid for that time as well - yes they can require OT - I assume they lock the doors because the store is closed? if you husband walked out the door he may be giving up his job but im sure they would not stand in his way....hes not being held hostage

the other question - is this same requirement for everyone or just him? if just him is he part of a protected class? as long as requirements are the same for all employees in the same position its most likely fine but if he is being singled out thats another story....

also - if he filed some kind of complaint or spurred some kind of investigation, and this treatment started right after that he may be a victim of retaliation.....

check your state laws as well - but for the federal laws http://www.dol.gov/whd/flsa/

[Sherman A1]

46. Yup!

I would complain to both the Dept of Labor and to the State Wage & Hour Department or Agency. This Manager has a huge load of trouble that he has created for himself. Do not wait, do it immediately.

[CarrieLynne]

49. I will add...

that the key to suing or launching any kind of claim is - you need to file a formal complaint with the HR Dept first - the company will likely not be held liable if no one let them know whats going on.....

HR SHOULD start an investigation....gathering and analyzing evidence by interviewing all parties and recommend corrective actions to be taken.....

that SHOULD tell you whether something was illegal or against Co Policy.....if HR determines it was and management does not follow their recommendations to correct it - then you have something....

[Sherman A1]

50. Agreed

It is also very important to remember that HR is there to represent and protect the company, not the employee. HR is not any employee's Union Representative by any means. Based upon the OP, this worker is due unpaid wages and I believe should move will all due haste to collect those wages and in doing so stop the abusive actions by their store level management (this of course may produce other abusive behavior) but, wages are due.

[MaggieD]

56. Actually there are exceptions...

Workers that sued Amazon for not paying as they stood in security lines when leaving work at the warehouse. Apparently it can take 20 or 30 minutes to go through the line before the worker can leave. The USSC recently ruled it's fine not to pay the workers for thus time.

[cascadiance]

39. Maybe they'll have a new corporate "religion" that allows them to do this...

... through the Hobby Lobby decision that lets employers keep slaves.

Then just use some program like H-1B or H-2b to lock in workers here to be tied to that company so that they can't leave it either or else be sent out of the country.

The Triangle Shirtwaist fire back in 1911 that had many locked in employees burned to death in a fire had many labor laws be put in place protecting workers against this sort of abuse. If employees are being locked in without a means to leave if a fire were to break out, I believe they are breaking the law, and should be taken to court on this!

http://www.csun.edu/~ghy7463/mw2.html

[Yupster]

40. To me the question would be what s reasonable

A manager would have to let you out in a reasonable amount of time.

For instance, if you wanted out and the manager was in the bathroom, it would be reasonable for you to have to wait until he got out.

If he was on the phone to a customer or boss, it would be reasonable.

It seems like it would be up to a local jury to decide what is reasonable and what is not.

The boss will not say he lets people wait for no reason. He will say he lets people out as soon as he has a minute free.

[Gman]

41. Yes they can fire you for refusing OT

No they cannot lock you in against your will. And for every instance of waiting 15-20 for the boss to finish, he is entitled to OT for time worked over 40 hours and that 40 INCLUDES these 15-20 minute waits. He should file a complaint with your state wage and hour office. And a complaint with the Department of Labor.

[Fla Dem]

42. If this is a large store chain, I would assume they have an employees's manual.

If they do, I would check to see what it says about OT pay and leaving at the end of your shift before your husband checks in with the store manager so he has something to support his complaints.

[Hoppy]

43. If the doors are locked,both inside AND out,

Call the local fire department and OSHA

[lonestarnot]

44. Walfarters did this. It didn't work out too well for them.

[Exilednight]

48. Legally speaking

Yes, they can lock you in the store, but all emergency exits must still be operational. So, even though you are locked in the store, you still must have an emergency exit that is not locked from the inside.

As far as being kept in the store after clocking out, the answer is no, they may not. My suggestion is to call corporate HR, and if nothing results from that, then call the state labor office.

[Monkshine]

57. Corporate HR

Contacting corporate HR is a good idea--check the policy first and the way it is written-- many companies..that have overnight workers will lock the exit doors to the exit..where employees come in..for the safety of the people working inside--when you are leaving the building--the policy may state that the doors be locked at time of closing..--here is the problem--there are still shoppers..shopping..and someone has to let them out--if someone is guarding the door and making sure shoppers leave--that is correct..the problem comes when a manager locks the door to make people wait...simply because she wants to know who is leaving--and making them wait..this practice is not right--and needs clarified..people are not on the clock and should be free to leave--problem is they want to control you..by making you stay longer..thus--controlling you..--this type of practice needs to be corrected..simply because fire exits are not normal exits..they are only for fire escape..they will use this as an excuse. to tell you that there is access to leave..but then if you go thru a fire exit..door..the alarm goes off..and the fire dept shows up...making you the bad person-- use tact when doing this..it is usually one manager that does this-- approach it tactfully..and do it right..of course..be ready to look for another job..they don't like people complaining..they want to control you..--and that is wrong.. a good HR dept..will take control..and stop this practice..but who knows..you can't trust anyone..unless you seek legal help..

[Blue_Tires]

53. holy damn

PM me the name of that chain so I can boycott it

[Fla Dem]

54. Please let us know how your husband makes out today after his talk with the store mgr.