He never regretted doing it.

[MH1]

How can Romney NOT remember that bullying incident? Sure it was high school. Sure, it was 30 years ago.

When I was in junior high I participated a couple times in something I then realized was wrong (and no longer participated in). It 'only' involved some juvenile mischief (or so my 12-ish brain thought at the time), but created a hazard that could have caused people to be hurt. That's all I'm going to give for details here, but I remember it like it's burned into my brain. From junior high. At least as long as it's been since Romney's bullying of another student. Because I regretted even being involved, and realized how wrong it was and that people could have been hurt.

I think that it's even worse that Romney DOESN'T remember the incident. If I read the article right, 5 people confirmed what happened. That goes beyond hearsay or inaccurate memories, I think. They remember, why doesn't he?

BECAUSE HE NEVER REGRETTED DOING IT.

The thread about the original article, for those who somehow missed it: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002668805
The thread where Gillespie claims Romney doesn't even remember it: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002668931

Am I the only one who gets a cold chill about Romney, realizing this?

[coalition_unwilling]

1. Those diagnosed with anti-social personality disorder are incapable of feeling remorse or

empathy. By way of contrast, I saw bullying going on while in junior high and high school and failed to try to stop it. I still excoriate myself for this some 30 years later, so I know what you're talking about.

[MH1]

6. Exactly. I think that diagnosis fits Romney.

The more I know about Romney, the more I believe that fits him.

Technical question: is having "anti-social personality disorder" essentially the same as being a "sociopath" (a little bit shorter and easier to use) or are they considered different disorders?

[coalition_unwilling]

8. Oy, I got in trouble for conflating the two awhile back and a DUer

graciously set me straight. Apparently, 'sociopath' is not a formal diagnosis in the DSM-IV, but 'anti-social personality disorder' is.

I am a layperson in these matters and totally defer to any resident psychology\psychiatry experts.

[MH1]

31. Ok thanks for the info. Still waiting for a resident expert to clarify further.

meanwhile, I'll probably still use 'sociopath' until someone yells at me for it, because it's easier, and close enough.

[coalition_unwilling]

32. I believe my error was in saying something along the lines of "According to the

DSM-IV, sociopaths . . . " Turns out the DSM-IV does not mention sociopath but does mention Anti-Social Personality Disorder. In my defense, I had read a monumental tome on early onset bipolar (called "The Bipolar Child&quot and had gotten lost in all the alphabet soup of diagnostic categories and what-not.

[Renew Deal]

2. Politically, not remembering is probably the better option

Because if he remembers, then he has to apologize, defend, take blame, etc.

[MH1]

5. It shouldn't be the better option.

Even if he doesn't remember (because he is basically a remorseless sociopath?) he should be able to weasel out an apology where he admits he did it, and says he now knows it was wrong and regrets it, because (hypothetically in his words, something like) "homosexuality is wrong but there are better ways to address it than physical assault". Yeah, some of his base would be "appalled and disgusted" if he apologized at all, but they have nowhere else to turn, and really really really want Obama gone, so it shouldn't hurt him too much.

Yeah, I question his political smarts. Or maybe he only wants the thug vote, or those who aren't alert enough to smell a sociopath in someone who has zero remorse for being a high school bully.

[sinkingfeeling]

3. We should just start saying Mitt is senile. I certainly wouldn't vote

for anybody who can't remember what they did 30-some years ago!

[ProSense]

4. Exactly, and

he still doesn't. He should be able to remember such an incident even if it happened before HS. Romney is cruel and creepy.

[MH1]

16. Romney is either a scum without a conscience, or a bald-faced lying coward. (or, probably, both)

Combined with the dog incident, I'm going with Door #1. (or both)

Cruel and creepy. Yes.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

26. scum without a conscience, or a bald-faced lying coward

Ohhhh I don't think they're mutually exclusive at all!!

Yecchh. He is repulsive.

[Skink]

7. They must have been reading Lord of the flies

[coalition_unwilling]

12. While most of is who read it saw it as a cautionary tale about

how quickly civilization can revert to atavism, Romney and his crowd probably read it as a Users Manual.

OT, but have you read "The Chocolate War" by Robert Cormier? Highly recommend if you are into young adult fiction.

[Scuba]

9. As I posted elsewhere, Mitt doesn't deny, claims he can't remember these incidents...

Apparently the victim was so insignificant to Mitt that he's not worthy of any space in Mitt's memory banks.

Or perhaps his attacking other boys was so commonplace it gets lost in the blur.

Or perhaps he's a lying asshole.

[MH1]

10. Pretty much sums it up. Bottom line is the same: Romney is scum. nt.

[Bandit]

15. "Or perhaps he's a lying asshole.".................Ya Think??

It is very easy to describe Romney in a single word....LIAR

[SomethingFishy]

29. Actually I believe that he could have forgotten...

I think you are right about the incident being so insignificant to him that he doesn't remember it.

My middle son has Autism. He had a few minor problems in school and one day when we were talking about bullies he told me that bullies do horrible things and just go about their day while the horrible things they did live with the victim forever.

Smart kid.

[hamsterjill]

11. I remember someone in junior high that I was mean to!

I'm 53 now, and I remember this girl in junior high school that we were all mean to. We were little jerks. I'm not sure why we did it, but she was different than us in some ways, and I guess we were insecure idiots. We never did anything to physically hurt her. It was more about excluding her because we all thought we were the cool crowd.

Thankfully, I learned from the experience, and although it was many years before I had the opportunity to apologize to her, I did finally have that opportunity, and it felt really good for me to be able to tell her that the problem had been ME...not her. She accepted my apology and we remain on good terms today.

So, I don't believe for a minute that Mitt Romney doesn't remember something as physically horrible as holding someone down and cutting his hair off. He's simply hoping that if he doesn't comment on it, that the story will go away and not be a problem for him.

Mitt should re-examine his own "belief system" and think about asking this guy's forgiveness! Yeah, right...

[coalition_unwilling]

13. Bravo! I sincerely hope you will consider crafting this response into

its own OP.

I was both a victim of bullying and a passive witness to it when it happened to others (to my everlasting shame and mortification). That was some 30 years ago and I still have not put it to rest.

[MH1]

14. Maybe he really DOES remember and is just lying. But the implications if we take him at his word?

He should be HELD TO ACCOUNT for what that says about him.

That he is a remorseless piece of shit who had so little problem about physically assaulting and bullying another student, that he doesn't even remember!

Really, even people who are uncomfortable with homosexuality, hopefully would draw the line at physical bullying. (Ok, we know about 5% won't but hopefully it's not much more than that.) For someone to NOT REMEMBER being a bully? Wow.

I think we need to point this out every chance we get. He's lost the opportunity to apologize and show the remorse a normal person would. This proves he's a sociopath - or has "anti-social personality disorder" if that is the correct technical term. Whatever, who wants a person for president, who has NO CONSCIENCE?

[madmom]

17. I am 58 years old. I remember something I did in 5th grade that I

wish I could take back. It also was a "bullying" moment and I have thought about it often with regret.

[valerief]

18. When you do something often, you tend to forget particular instances.

Once a bully, always a bully.

[MH1]

19. That too. nt.

[ramuramaswami]

20. selective memory

He is phony. Does not Mitt tell a story and date was even before he was born, now he can not remember what happened
in his senior year at school. Do we really need this guy as President of our country that was created by great Presidents.

I feel sorry for the people who vote for him.

[Worried senior]

21. May be that kind of behavior is the

norm for Romney so therefore it doesn't even enter his mind that he was wrong.

For the rest of us with a conscience knew what we were doing was wrong and it does stick with us forever.

I've worked with and known quite a few people that put on a sweet face but little things they do show what they really are like.

[fishwax]

22. that or he's lying -- but, yeah, like you I remember

a few things I did that were reckless and/or that may have caused people pain, even just by my inaction when other people were being jerks. I never did anything like what they're saying Romney did. If I had, I'm quite sure that guilt and a desire to not demonstrate such weakness of character again would ensure I remembered it.

[abolugi]

23. Of course he remembers it!!

How can you possibly do something so mean and demeaning to a person and not remember it??
The man is a short tempered bully and his campaign AND the debates will prove that.
He is already having a hard time controlling his anger over simple questions like medical marijuana.

He looks tired already. He will be dragging his ass by the time the election rolls around.

[indie_voter]

24. I think he remembers too

I just don't understand how it's better to *not* remember doing such a horrible vicious thing to another person than admitting it and the throwing himself on the mercy of the court if you will. He could lie and say he's been haunted by this for years and he's so so very sorry and kids should learn from his example and not bully other people.

Instead he shows yet again he is not just mean but he's a coward to boot.

[MH1]

28. I almost completely agree. Except, I do think it's actually possible that he doesn't remember -

for all the reasons that fact would connote:

* he's a remorseless sociopath; it was no big deal to him at the time and not something that he would even consider was wrong;

and/or

* there were many other similar incidents, so many that he just can't remember any specific one.

Either way, pretty awful.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

25. I got a cold chill about him over poor Seamus.

Not a bit surprised to see more confirmation surfacing.

This incident and his lack of remorse (again) is disgusting proof of a repulsive character.

[MH1]

27. Yeah, me too. I guess I thought there was some chance that he really thought the dog was ok with it.

It's ridiculous, and I sensed there was a deeper issue. So I'm not surprised by this confirmation either, but it is confirmation of what was suspicion before.

Romney is a remorseless sociopath.

[malaise]

30. I remember stopping a bully beating up a fellow student

in high school. Others assisted and stopped the bully. That was about 48 years ago.
You do not forget that shit. And he was the instigator - the man with the scissors.
Willard Rmoney is a LIAR

[Skinner]

33. I agree. For a time when I was in junior high school, I picked on a kid who stuttered.

I knew it was hurtful and wrong when I did it. And yet I did it. I felt ashamed of it then, and I continue to feel ashamed of it to this day. More than anything else I have ever done. I will always remember it.

Unless Romney is completely incapable of shame or empathy, he remembers what he did too.

[MH1]

34. Kick because this is important.

IMHO, anyway.

[treestar]

35. Exactly, the only way he would not remember it is if he did so many such

heinous things they have flowed together in his brain - maybe Ted Bundy had a murder or two he was fuzzy on.

[TBF]

36. There was a new kid that moved into our elementary school

when I was young. I guess he was sort of a "geek" - smart and quiet. It was an insular community and few kids spoke to him. When we were bussed to the bigger high school he made friends. Looking back I blame not only us kids for not welcoming him and playing with him, but also the teachers for not addressing the situation. If I can remember that 35 years later, and still feel embarrassed about it, surely Romney remembers his high school years. He's an asshole and a liar.