Bernie validated my faith in him with the Robin Hood Tax

[Bonobo]

It is high time that we recognize that the United States has the the worst economic inequality among industrialized Western nations.
Furthermore, in the last 30 years we have been crippling the futures of young people with back-breaking college debt which not only puts them into indentured servitude for, in some cases, decades, but limits their professional choices to ones that can return quick economic payback -it is incalculable how much damage this does to the society as a whole (for example, doctors choosing profitable specialties rather than general practitioners as one example).


"It would impose a Wall Street speculation fee on investment houses, hedge funds, and other speculators of 0.5 percent on stock trades, a 0.1 percent fee on bonds, and a 0.005 percent fee on derivatives."

http://www.robinhoodtax.org

This small tax of %0.5 on Wall Street transactions would generate hundreds of billions of dollars each year in the US alone. The revenue raised would be enough to protect American schools, housing, local governments and hospitals, to pay for lifesaving AIDS medicines, to support people and communities around the world, and to deal with the climate challenges we're facing.

It won't affect ordinary Americans, nor their personal savings, nor everyday consumer activity, such as ATM usage. It's easy to enforce and tough to evade. This is a tax on the same Wall Street interests that created the greatest economic crisis since the Great Depression - and that continue to reap record profits and bonuses while ordinary Americans cleaned up the mess.

[Autumn]

1. Bernie had me at I'm running for President. Well actually before

And anyone that Bernie lost over this Robin Hood tax he never had in the first place so no big loss.

[Hoyt]

2. I'm for it too, but it has been proposed by a number of people.

[pampango]

30. And in a number of countries. It is a great idea.

[FailureToCommunicate]

107. Bill Nighy explains the 'Robin Hood Tax'

It's at least five years old, but still refreshingly appealing:

[NYC_SKP]

3. It's brilliant!

I love it.

[msongs]

4. think of it as a partial refund of the $$ wall street cheated us all out of w/govt help nt

[Bonobo]

5. That is precisely how I think of it.

Corporations exist only because they have been given the right to exist.

And that "right" is derived from the will of the people of this country.

They OWE something to the society and must assume reasonable responsibility in the social contract. A responsibility they have abandoned.

[Unknown Beatle]

7. Corporations and Wall St

don't see it that way. We saved their asses with the bailout, but that isn't enough and the TPP and TTIP will ensure that they enrich themselves even further at our expense.

[sabrina 1]

33. That's exactly how I think of it. Hopefully derivatives will be banned once we get a

government that isn't beholden to Wall St.

[deutsey]

6. K&R

[Spitfire of ATJ]

8. Wall Street was supposed to set aside a fund to bail their own asses out....

No doubt they bet on the fund not doing it's job.

And keep in mind, I'm in Vegas. I have seen people push the button and actually bet real money on which elevator door is going to open.

[erronis]

78. They did. They set aside the funds in off-shore non-traceable banks.

None of the real culprits of the WallStreet raid on the investor's funds will ever go to jail or pay back their thievery. The only ones who get/got sucker-punched are the taxpayers - again, and again.

[Logical]

9. Kick nt

[blue neen]

10. Okay, so does it include retirees' 401k's?

Forgive my ignorance on this, as this is the first time I've heard of the Robin Hood Tax.

[Bonobo]

11. Honest answer is I am not sure.

But 401Ks do not NEED to be invested in the stock market either.

[blue neen]

22. With some companies, you don't have a choice where the money is invested.

You have a choice of how aggressive you want the investment to be, but that's it.

[GummyBearz]

38. Every 401k I have had

has given the employee the option of taking their 401k money into a schwab/ameritrade/whatever account where they can choose to invest in individual companies, buy mutual funds, bonds, or whatever they want. You do have to take the initiative, get the paperwork from HR, and then be a responsible investor with your retirement money.

The bottom line is this: if you are afraid this tax will get passed on to you by the people who manage your 401k, then get out. I got out of it years ago just because of management fee's (which are often way more than a .5% tax).

Invest in solid companies that aren't going anywhere and whose products you buy. Your personal 100 shares of starbucks wont be skimmed by money managers and wont get touched by new wall st. taxes.

[blue neen]

47. The company my husband worked for had it set up as I described,

possibly because they matched contributions up to a certain amount. He is retired now, so we are no longer contributing. In fact, we will be required to take a certain amount of money out soon. We just don't want to have to pay more taxes on it.

[GummyBearz]

52. I'm much younger

But it still seems since you are retired you could roll it over into a schwab account. I have no idea if doing that at your point would cause some kind of taxes to be applied... I'd definitely look into it if it were my money

[sabrina 1]

32. 401Ks should NOT be invested in the stock market. I have been told here that

you have control over where your pension funds etc are invested. By those who support investing OUR money in the Stock Market. But then when it suits them, they apparently forget that excuse for a practice that should be ended and tell us the opposite.

[erronis]

79. Blashpemy! The stock market (and traders) are your friend! Also don't forget to put your SS in stock

Just let our little GOP friends manage your investments, manage your retirement funds, manage your Social Security.

What could possibly go wrong?

[sabrina 1]

80. Lol, I just saw a documentary on one of the Wall St Ponzi schemes perpetrated by

Dreier, I believe. He dipped into one of those Pension Funds when he ran into trouble keeping up with his scam.

Sure, let's put the SS Fund into the hands of Wall St 'investors' and then say goodbye to it.

[leftofcool]

34. But, 99% of them are invested in stocks, as are many retirement pensions

It is something that many have no control over.

[L0oniX]

44. Index funds are the least risky and the best long term investment. Bernie isn't talking about those.

You can blame Bernie all you want for your poor choice in investments but it is your choice. Want to make money quick and take more risk? That's your problem. You know what he is talking about ...asshole millionaires who do nothing for anyone but make money from their investments and pay a tax rate far below the rest of us common people.

[Fla_Democrat]

108. This may be informative

So what should 401K's be invested in? As an aside, my company* doesn't offer a 401K, but say if they did... what should then be in, if they don't "NEED to be invested in the stock market"? Gold? Bank CD's? Real estate? Pork bellies?

Can't be gold, Glen Beck hawks that.
Can't be Bank(STER'S) CD's... hell, give more money to the banks..
Can't be Real Estate... bubbles and all of that.
Can't be Pork bellies... meat is bad for the environment.

So, how does one avoid the stock market with 401K's (403B's, IRA's, etc), and still save for retirement?





* no 401K, but I have a ROTH set up. It has mutual funds, which..... ...... are made up of stocks.

[uponit7771]

12. yes

[blue neen]

23. If that's the case,

I'm not too sure I can get behind this.

[Jack Rabbit]

13. Bernie vs. the Banksters

[center]

[/center]

[MaggieD]

16. More like Bernie versus your 401k

[leftofcool]

35. And that scares the shit out of me.

[L0oniX]

41. Right. Bernie will take all your 401k. Hyperbole much?

I'd be more concerned about those management fees you're paying.

[kenfrequed]

77. It is hyperbole

The tax would be on transactions that most 401K's are only supposed to go through at most quarterly and usually only yearly. The tax is less than half of what most brookerage houses charge in fees for such transactions. The point of the whole thing is to reduce speculative gambling and punish investment houses that transfer around this stuff to saddle the 401 K people with the losses to assist wealthier clients.

The talking points saying this is going to hurt 401K's badly are probably coming from the very brokerage houses that make lots of money by shuffling things around. Speculative investment in general is bad for the economy.

[OKNancy]

99. Don't worry it has a snowball's chance in hell of passing

Even Bernie said that on CNN ( he said it won't pass when asked by Blitzer)

[L0oniX]

40. Where's your proof that Bernie is talking exactly about your 401k?

[MaggieD]

42. Read his plan

Not the BS stuff being linked from wiki that is NOT his plan.

[L0oniX]

45. Got nothing like I figured. Read the OP for a real change.

[MaggieD]

88. The OP does not contain his plan

It's from wiki. Read HIS plan.

[sabrina 1]

100. I read it, and today, thousands of young people all over the internet have read it also

and I would say, they are thrilled to have a candidate who is not just talking, but working in their best interests. The comments are wonderful, the questions intelligent, their appreciation that there might finally be some hope that one day the debt they are saddled with won't be forever.

It's a fantastic plan. Tax the Wall St gamblers, just a teeny bit, to help pay for higher education. What an investment in the future that is.

Btw, what do YOU object to in his plan? And don't waste our time with the talking points, they've been debunked already.

[MaggieD]

101. I object to having my 401K taxed

His pay for on this bill is ridiculous. Don't pay for it off the backs of the middle class trying like hell to save for retirement.

But I am not going to get too worked up about it since a) it will never pass, and b) he will not get elected.

[sabrina 1]

102. That's the talking point I mentioned. Now, try to stick to the facts. What about taxing the rich

Wall St Gamblers to invest in Higher Education do you object to?

[MaggieD]

103. I object to having my 401K taxed

Stick to the facts (even though you just learned them this morning when I told them to you).

[sabrina 1]

86. Keep trying, so far I don't see you having much success with that. Btw, what is Hillary's

plan to reduce the cost of higher education? Wouldn't it serve your candidate better to show us what she is going to do?

[MaggieD]

87. You'd know if you were paying attention

She's been touting it since 2007.

[sabrina 1]

90. So, what did she accomplish, wasn't she a Senator also? Did she introduce any legislation, try to

get support for her ideas, as Bernie has?

And have her views changed since then? Or not?

Bernie has talked about this too for years. But now he is a candidate and is talking about it in his campaign, not telling people to back and read what he said seven years ago.

Why not post positive information about your own candidate of choice, rather than go back to the early 2000 internet negative campaigning when people thought it was 'so cool' to do, not on DU where the conversation was generally a lot more adult.

You are not going to win any converts by repeatedly attacking Bernie. And it sure doesn't make your candidate look good to go on the attack rather than present her ideas.

My advice to Hillary would be to speak to her supporters about this, as Bernie has.

I doubt this is the kind of campaign she wants to run.

[MaggieD]

91. So you're telling me you have no idea what she proposed or passed

... and you are just bashing her on general principle?

http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clinton-on-college-affordability/

Here is the thing. I happen to be fully aware of the records and proposals and policy positions of the various candidates. That's how I can comment on them intelligently. I, personally, think that is the duty of people who (at least SAY) they want to be involved in political policy discussions. I guess that is a quaint idea these days.

What I find MOST astounding is that many Bernie supporters have no clue what his "College for Free" plan entails. Look at the OP -- for goodness sakes. It's a link to a Wiki article about the "robin hood" tax, which has nothing to do with Bernie's plan. It's not like these folks couldn't actually read Bernie's plan. They just don't.

Here is my advice. If people have time to post on a web forum regarding these issues, people ALSO have time to know what they are talking about. Again, perhaps a quaint idea on my part.

[kenfrequed]

14. It actually would have other benefits

It could also encourage more stable investments too by penalizing quick, rapid fire, speculation.

But my real reason is that we have to pay for investments in our people in education and in our infrastructure and this seems to be the best way to do it.

[metalbot]

19. Doesn't it do the opposite?

It puts the lowest tax on derivatives trading, which would encourage investors to bet on stock price rather than actually invest in stock.

[kenfrequed]

20. It adds up

Derivatives are very complex formulae based on numerous transactions. Believe me, even that miniscule tax will quickly add up to drastically control their usage and bring them back into better scrutiny.

[sabrina 1]

27. I think it's brilliant. A two fold policy, take money from the profits on what should have been

outlawed after the economic collapse and give it to students.

[MaggieD]

15. No to taxing 401k plans

But it will never pass congress, so whatever. It's just political pandering in my view. I guess he's desperate for the youth vote. But he's lying to them. He knows it can't pass congress.

The idea that he wants to tax retirement plans is an issue though.

[L0oniX]

17. Well ...he is pissing off all the right people.

[deutsey]

21. LOL

Emphasis on "right"

[sabrina 1]

25. Lol, that's for sure!

[leftofcool]

37. Why would you want him to piss off the middle class?

Many of us have paltry retirement plans that are invested in stocks and we have no control over this. If it comes down to a choice of whether I can eat or pay taxes so someone can go to college free, which one of those do you think will win out with us middle class retirees?

[L0oniX]

39. Because the only middle class left is the banksters and Wall Street thieves.

[ProfessorGAC]

54. I'm Middle Class and I Don't Fit Your Other Description

I don't work for a bank. I don't work on Wall Street. And i've been saving for retirement (and yes, i still have a vested pension on top of that) for nearly 40 years.

So, it's ok for my lifetime savings to get taxed because the tax only applies to banksters and Wall Street thieves?

That makes no sense.

[L0oniX]

60. Good for you. Must be nice looking down on everyone else. Most of the normal people won't be able to

retire like you. Wall Street and banksters crashed the economy ...put people out on the streets ...took their homes ...but hey as long as it doesn't affect you it's all good.

[ProfessorGAC]

61. What?

Who's looking down on whom? You're screaming with hyperbole and i just said i'm not a bankster, i'm not judging anyone, and I'M THE ONE LOOKING DOWN ON OTHERS?
Get a grip on yourself, will you?

[MaggieD]

56. Is he?

I will bet you my employees would not be happy to find out that a vote for him is a vote to tax their 401k.

[L0oniX]

62. Feel free to lie to your employees then. Maybe threaten to fire them if they vote for Bernie.

[MaggieD]

64. Show me where his plan

.... Exempts 401k and 529 plans from this tax.

[L0oniX]

65. 401k's are part of "speculation"? Sounds risky but I'm sure you know what you're talking about.

[MaggieD]

66. READ the plan

[L0oniX]

67. Read the OP.

[MaggieD]

68. The link in the OP is not his plan

It's from wiki. SMH.

[reddread]

48. 401k's are a ripoff from start to finish

If you cant do better investing your money your way, that is just sad.

[MaggieD]

49. So companies should just stop....

.... Offering them as a benefit? I'll tell all my employees that's what Bernie thinks then.

[reddread]

51. do whatever you like, most employers do

OR maybe a pension plan?
show a different set of stripes.

[MaggieD]

53. Oh brother....

Talk about living in la la land. SMH.

[reddread]

57. 401k's are a ripoff from start to finish

[MaggieD]

58. Uh huh

Good to know. I will immediately close mine down and pocket the extra $100k that would have gone to my employees. Thanks for the info.

[reddread]

59. Im sure you will do whats best for you

for me, I did as well.

[MaggieD]

63. Actually I do what's best for my employees

So imagine my surprise to discover that giving them $100k out of my pocket is actually bad for them. LOL!

[reddread]

69. by all means give till it hurts

just dont force them to invest through crooked intermediaries or into funds that profit from war crimes or other despicable measures.
If you can help them turn it into a MUCH larger number with NO STRINGS ATTACHED go ahead.
otherwise, its better for them to do what they will.
but then, 401k's are a ripoff from start to finish.

[MaggieD]

70. This is why the fringe left is ignored

Really? Don't give my employees a 100% vested match on their 401K? That's evil or something?

You folks have jumped the shark. You really have.

[reddread]

72. like a 100k is a significant amount?

dont injure yourself patting your back.
100k goes pretty much nowhere these days.
I hope it is no more than 3 employees.

[MaggieD]

73. You clearly do not even know what a 401k with employer match is

I should have figured that out previously. Apparently you have never had a decent job that offers one. My condolences.

[reddread]

74. right of course how sharp your perceptions

I work fast food, never had a 401 k, never worked for large companies owned by multimillionaire big game hunters or family enterprises that own phone companies or anyone but street people, have no idea what an employee contribution or employer match is, and have never seen a 401k balance jump up and down like Jack Lalane.
Neither do I consider 100k a significant amount, no matter what you think.
Feel free to continue with your assertions, just dont fool yourself, it reflects only upon you.

[MaggieD]

75. So what makes you an expert on them then?

SMH.

Just to clue you in, us LIBERALS own companies too. And we live our values. Like taking good care of our employees. I am sorry you are bitter that you cannot find that situation.

[reddread]

76. Ive seen good employers

and there was much more to be had than a 401k.
How many employees benefitting from your largesse?
seriously, you started that discussion, I could care less.
And how well Ive done with my investments is none of your business.
I can tell you no 401k would hold a candle.
thats actually irrelevant.
401k's are a cover for the death and rape of pension funds,
and none of that helps the masses of poor in this country.
Which Im sure bothers you considerably.

[Lurker Deluxe]

83. Sure ...

I've been here ten years. My match is 7%. I have averaged 75K a year in that time.

75KX10=750KX7%=52,500.

That is no growth match number.

Add my contribution and my 401K is quarter mil, give or take.

Let me know how well your investments have done since "no 401k would hold a candle ".

[reddread]

89. hard of reading?

none of your business.

[Lurker Deluxe]

93. Well ...

You should create a fund, if your results are so great you will be rich in a matter of a couple of years.

[MaggieD]

94. Don't you know your employer is evil for doing that?

Or something. SMH.

[MaggieD]

95. You'll pardon me....

For not taking investment advice from someone who never owned a business and never even had a job that provides a 401K, won't you? LOL!

[Oilwellian]

96. You have employees?

What kind of business do you own that allows you the time to hang out on DU 24/7?

[MaggieD]

97. A very successful one!

In fact, I am hanging out in my lovely office right now.

[cali]

82. I'm so glad you've given up your "I love Bernie" schtick. Absolutely no one

was fooled by it. You'd attack him over and over and over on the most bullshit premises, from he's a Ralph Nader to he's lied to your cutesy story about your son- and more, but your dislike of Bernie shone bright and clear. You kept pretending that you weren't supporting HRC- who knows why.

At least now you're edging toward some semblance of honesty as to where you stand, though as I've noted, it was always clear to just about everyone. I don't get your game playing at all. Oh, and you aren't fooling anyone at all with your claim that Bernie's supporters turned you against him. you were against him from day one.

You are who you are, why pretend to be anything or anyone else?

[delrem]

104. dissemblers dissemble - it's their nature.

This dissemblance mirrors an identical "I gave to Bernie, but this is the last straw, he's trying to take away my retirement savings!" posted by another OP yesterday.

False flaggers. Bottom feeders.

[99Forever]

18. The positives keep piling on Bernie.

But don't worry, Hillary has a plan to make a plan.

[L0oniX]

46. "don't worry, Hillary has a plan to make a plan" Nailed it.

[sabrina 1]

24. It's a tax on Derivatives which should have been BANNED due to their role in the collapse of

the world's economy.

So it has a two fold benefit, it takes back some of the profits made by those using it, AND it will help students who want to go to college.

That man really does think about the policies he believes are needed to begin fixing this country's major problems.

[Bonobo]

29. B-but it's like offering ice cream...

Says the least astute observer of politics I have ever seen.

[sabrina 1]

36. I like Ice Cream! Lol! Better than the bitter pills we've been offered for over a decade now.

[MaggieD]

43. I see you haven't read it

[sabrina 1]

85. I see you're not a very effective online mind reader! Lol!

[RiverLover]

26. R&K! Wall street money manipulators shouldn't be the only ones profiting from their games! /nt

[peacebird]

28. He rocks! Going on Reddit AMA (ask me anything) & actually answering questions? Wow.

[Bonobo]

31. B, but "he sounds like every other Dem"

Why doesn't he do some REAL work like Hillary!

[MaggieD]

50. Because it's more fun....

.... For him to base his campaign on pandering with pie in the sky BS? Just guessing.

[peacebird]

71. That's Hillary's gig, pretending to be a populist. With Bernie, what you see is what you get.

[cali]

84. sez the supporter of a candidate who is a champion panderer- from

pandering to Wall Street to pandering to Main Street, HRC has it covered. Her history of pandering is so extensive, it'd take volumes to document. Literally. And there's not even any guess work required.

Bernie is running on what he's been running on for nearly 40 years. He combines nitty gritty goals with long term idealistic objectives.

Hillary? She opposed marriage equality until after the majority of the public supported it. She supported returning immigrant children to their countries of origin until the majority supported immigration reform.

Hillary is the want to be Panderer-in-Chief.

[Agnosticsherbet]

55. The Republican controlled House and Senate will never let it out of committee.

Nice idea, though.

[Omaha Steve]

81. K&R!

[Sancho]

92. I'm against a tax on retirement funds and employee retirement pools...

Sorry, but this Robin Hood tax is a bad idea.

Maybe Bernie would be better to have raised capital gain taxes, removed tax exemptions from big corporations, or cut the military by half to pay for education.

[BainsBane]

98. The name seems strange

because it isn't giving to the poor. It is pooling resources. People here seem to think it extends to retirement funds. If so, it's taxing the middle class to pay for the middle class' education, which is great, but it's not really helping the poor, many of whom lack access to k-12 education adequate to prepare them for college.

[hunter]

105. A lot less radical than my tax proposals...

... since I figure taxes should be pretty close to 90% for income above a certain multiple (much less then 20X) of an untaxed minimum living wage, with similar taxes on wealth too.

I also think stock, bond, hedge funds, and futures market trades should be taxed at a rate just high enough to discourage high frequency trading.

Anything that's traded more than twice a day ought to face tough regulatory scrutiny.

That's right, a Bill Gates lives in a big house in the same neighborhood his immigrant janitor lives in a two or three bedroom apartment. Their kids attend the same public schools. Bill doesn't have to worry about "security." Sure, he has all the high end name brand stuff, an expensive car, designer clothes, Italian stone countertops in his kitchen, but the single mom working at the fast food place down the street has reliable transportation, nice clothes, and a kitchen she can cook most anything she likes in.

More importantly, nobody can buy the political process. The voice of the janitor or the retired widow or the disabled unemployed person is just as loud as the voice of an oil tycoon.

That's right. I would tax the uber-wealthy out of existence.

[Lagom]

106. Call it the Wall Street Sales Tax, not Robin Hood

This type of Tobin Tax is a HUGE plank in my core belief system, but I hate the name "Robin Hood Tax"

Wall Street Sales Tax implies a types of tax that all people, rich or poor have to pay upfront on most personal purchases, thus opening up the opportunity of showing that the banksters and mega corporations are dodging it to a huge extent. This gathers in many many additional people from a more diverse coalition.

Robin Hood, as a name, feeds into the "Class Warfare" meme that moronic corporatists bash any anti-bank, income equality-engendering measure with.