Two reasons I could never support Hillary.

[Dawgs]

Our economy is our number priority and I have zero faith that she won't select similar characters in the same mold.

I know the type of person that Bernie would select.

[marym625]

1. K&R!

Larry Summers is evil incarnate.

[Fast Walker 52]

2. Never is a strong word

Let's see how the campaign goes. Unless you don't think she can change at all.

[corkhead]

14. I'm sure she'll tell me exactly what I want to hear... until 11/8/16

If she publicly PROMISES to put Elizabeth Warren in charge of the Fed and Tammy Duckworth Secretary of Defense maybe that will make me less skeptical of what she does should she actually manage to get elected next year.

[Fast Walker 52]

61. I can't argue with that-- that being said,

she's said all the right things so far.

[arcane1]

77. Why take chances on someone "changing" when we have someone who has been consistent?

If she can have such a fundamental change during the campaign, then she can just as easily change back after getting elected

[Scuba]

118. +1,000

[840high]

98. Never is a good for when

it comes to voting for Hillary.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

3. Do you feel better now? /NT

[Dawgs]

15. Huh?

[sabrina 1]

46. Who do you think should be in a Democratic President's cabinet.

We didn't ask this question last time and we got Corporate CEOs and Republicans.

[Agschmid]

64. Eric Holder... The Republican corporatist that he is.

[dawg]

4. Hillary isn't my first choice, but I could still support her.

I could even be okay with those guys as advisors, so long as there were other voices to balance them out and they weren't allowed to steer policy entirely in their own direction.

[morningfog]

6. dawg, I was confused by you response to Dawgs.

[dawg]

13. Understandable.

I'm lucky, I guess, that I agree with about 99% of everything I have ever seen Dawgs post.

[sendero]

18. Who...

.. let the Dawgs out?

[MisterP]

93. a Cabinet of rivals, eh?

[leftofcool]

5. Will you be leaving DU during the primary?

[morningfog]

7. They don't have to.

For one thing, until we have a nominee, nothing is required.

And when we have a nominee (which may not be Hillary!) the poster need not leave DU, but only mindful of critiques of te nominee.

[el_bryanto]

9. Why would you need to leave during the primary? I'm confused.

After the primary I can sort of see.

Bryant

[Dawgs]

16. No. There's no rule that says I MUST support the nominee. n/t

[MaggieD]

24. You just have to stop bashing her

[Dawgs]

27. You're right. I will stop (if I ever start) bashing Hillary if she ever wins the nom. n/t

[yeoman6987]

32. I think you will run very fast to the voting booth,

If Ted Cruz is 50-50 with Hillary. Granted she may not have your best interest 100 percent but I predict Ted Cruz has about zero percent iof your interests.

[Dawgs]

40. I'm supporting Bernie until a Democratic nominee is selected.

It will be a sad day, but if Hillary wins I will vote for her against any republican. I can guarantee I won't run.

[yeoman6987]

74. Lol. I won't run either and I hope Bernie wins

He isn't perfect but he is the only candidate on both sides that care about people in a genuine way.

[Agschmid]

66. If Ted Cruz is 50-50 with Hillary we are fucked.

[George II]

67. "if I ever start"? Look to the top of the page!

[Dawgs]

73. "Not supporting" is bashing? OK. n/t

[hrmjustin]

60. True but you can't advocate third party when she is the nominee.

[sabrina 1]

47. Is that question relevant to anything?

[rock]

8. It's nice having a solid non-sequitur to support your choices

Thanks for sharing

[DemocratSinceBirth]

11. The first photo is of Tim Geithner, of course...

Team Obama did a pretty good job of getting us out of the worst economic crisis since The Great Depression.

[sabrina 1]

50. I guess if you were bailed out you could say that. But for the people I know who lost their jobs

and their homes, (because of the corruption no one was held accountable for) they have a different view of the economy.

Geithner is a tax evader also, and all you have to do is what Warren questioning him about why the money that was set aside to help MAIN ST, never got to MAIN ST to know why he was chosen to guard the henhouse.

Glad you were okay, wish I could say that the people I know and so many across the country.

Ever visit one of our now familiar 'Tent Cities' and talk to some of the residents? It's heart breaking.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

62. I lost everything in the Great Recession...

I lost everything in The Great Recession; my home, my business, my savings, my investments, and my car. I still don't own a car. The only thing I didn't lose, praise be to God, is my girlfriend... She lost her job as well... Yes, we were homeless...Luckily for us my neighbor let us live with him...Out of the blue I got a check for approximately $2,800.00 in the mail. It was escrow money for the insurance on my foreclosed home. We used that money to buy a one way ticket to move from Orlando, a city I lived in since I was a kid, and the only home I really knew to Los Angeles, her hometown. That left it us with $2,000.00 between us and the abyss... We are in our forties and we lived in a hostel in Koreatown while she looked for a job...

Thanks to God, the Obama recovery and the dint of her perseverance, toughness, and plain hard work she found a job...But even then it wasn't all sunshine and roses... We moved from rooms in Alhambra, Los Feliz, Northridge, Koreatown, and Van Nuys until we could save enough to get enough money to pay the deposit on a studio apartment and furnish it.

There is always the supposition here that I and some other BHO/HRC supporters on this board are part of the 1%. Nothing could be further from the truth but when all a person has is a hammer the whole world looks like a nail...

...

I once had a lot of money, not !% money, of course, but enough to live well...I don't miss it as much I thought I would...

[eloydude]

68. So, by supporting Clinton, you are in fact supporting another economic crash..

and you'd have to start all over again, and by then it'll be too late for you.

Bernie has a extensive plan for every issue, especially making sure that the economy is robust.

It is improving, but Clinton's allegiance with the 1% will always be a major problem for the 99%.

I wish you the very best of luck with your choices, and believe me, when the debates starts, you will change your mind.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

87. Wow, thank you./NT

[Sheepshank]

109. Are you really trying to state that Clinton will orchstrate a Bush-esque crash?

wtf is that made up piece of shit supposition

[eloydude]

110. Her economic policies are in question

She waffles just about every issue involving the economy.

How is she going to improve on it without pissing off her major donors? She's in a Catch-22 mode.

[yardwork]

10. So you would prefer the choices made by a Republican?

By all means campaign for your preferred candidate during the primaries. But if Hillary ends up being the Democratic nominee and you fail to vote for her, then you become part of the problem. Sorry to sound harsh but that's the way it is.

This is the system we have. We often have to choose between options we don't really like. A Republican president would be far worse than anything Hillary does.

[NYC_SKP]

12. That's not a problem, as Hillary will not be the nominee.

And if she by some horrific act of nature becomes the nominee, she will lose to the Republican.

Ergo, support for her now is support for a win by the GOP later.

peace out.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

58. Heh. If she loses in the general

they plan to blame it on people who wanted better 'discouraging the vote' or 'staying home' or whatever else, instead of admitting they chose a poor candidate.

[Dawgs]

17. No. I'm supporting Bernie Sanders.

Is the primary already over, or is it really a coronation?

[hifiguy]

101. In all seriousness, could anyone be worse than those two pusbags? nt

[yardwork]

108. Yes. Watch what happens is a Republican gets elected.

[Mnpaul]

119. Geithner was a pick by both Obama and McCain

During the 2008 Presidential election, Geithner was one of three people tipped to be nominated for Treasury Secretary regardless of whether John McCain or Barack Obama won
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Geithner

[yardwork]

120. And on that basis you assume there are no other differences.

Sigh.

[Mnpaul]

122. You were the one who claimed a Republican pick would be different

I said nothing about no difference - strawman.

[brooklynite]

19. Do you know the kind Jeb Bush or Scott Walker will select?

[Dawgs]

20. Yes, that's why I'm supporting Bernie to win the primary and then beat one of them for President.

[brooklynite]

22. Present a convincing argument as to how Bernie wins a national campaign...

...because I don't see one.

[Dawgs]

30. Sure. All of us supporters of candidates beside Hillary should just give up.

I mean, since you don't think it's possible, right?

[brooklynite]

75. Funny - I thought we were on a political blog...

...where we discuss political issues.

I'm challenging your belief that Bernie Sanders can win and giving you an opportunity to sell your candidate's electability.

[Dawgs]

79. That's not what you were doing, and you know it. n/t

[questionseverything]

92. he has better ideas

he has a better voting record

he speaks truth to power

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026703985

[George II]

95. I've asked this question several times on this site, never got an answer....

.....do supporters of Sanders reallly think he'll get 60+ million votes next year?

[bvar22]

99. A year before the 2008 election,

....nobody thought a Black Man could WIN.

[workinclasszero]

29. People more to Bernie fans liking

apparently.

[think]

34. Nothing but the best of course. Another someone from Goldman Sachs....

[Exilednight]

90. Yep. Just look at the current lineup. Who appointed

Bernanke? Who nominated him a second time? Who did Bill keep in charge of the Fed after Bush I?

A D or R next to the president's name still seems to yield us the same results as to who is put in charge of the Fed or Treasury.

The people Walker and Bush will surround themselves with are the same peor that Bush II surrounded himself with and Obama kept around.

There's nothing Hillary has said it done to make me believe she would appoint a Krugman type economist.

There are only two ponds to fish from for your economic advisors. The Greenspan pond, or the Keynes pond. No president had wandered over to the Keynes pond to find a new head of any US economic policy, but the Greenspan pond gets fished regularly and stocked as needed.

[Wilms]

115. That needed to be said.

Thank you. It's been the economic gang of thugs.

[Fuddnik]

21. You forgot to include 2 more reasons.

Orszag and Rubin are her other economic advisors.

I'll be goddamned if I'll vote for anyone again, who'll bring those 4 shitstains back into the White House.

[SoapBox]

23. I understand exactly what the OP means.

HRC will line her cabinet with the same old, same old...and that is not what we need.

We need a Progressive/Liberal/True Democrat in the White House and we need to return to the left of center (especially since the center is now so far to the right), to bring back an America that works for the 99%.

[Chan790]

25. You missed Hillary's economic BFF.

Robert Rubin is someone like Geithner or Summers...and probably exactly who she will choose.

[workinclasszero]

26. Ok when Hillary wins the democratic nomination

Will you post the same thing here again?

If by some crazy miracle Bernie wins the nomination, I would support and vote for him in the general election.

I find it very interesting how the vast majority of Bernie fans say they will never vote for Hillary even if she is the democratic party's nominee.

Very interesting.

[Android3.14]

35. Will post later

During the day, the sockpuppets have too much influence on the alert system.

[workinclasszero]

37. The minute Hillary is declared the official nominee

of the democratic party I will be wearing out the alert button on "democrats" who post that they will not vote for her or support her election on the Democratic Underground website.

I promise that!

[Dawgs]

42. Are you putting words in my mouth? Because it feels like it. n/t

[Zambero]

28. At least a dozen reasons why I WOULD support Hillary

All crammed into the GOP's 2016 clown car at the moment.

[RufusTFirefly]

31. Hillary will not be the nominee. Here is my prediction:

Hillary, often her own worst enemy, will self-destruct. The Democratic Party, having long taken for granted that she would be the nominee, will be thrown into disarray. Meanwhile, the swelling Sanders contingent will prove impossible to ignore. Searching frantically for an alternative to Hillary who isn't Bernie but who doesn't utterly alienate Berne's supporters, the party leaders will settle on Martin O'Malley, who is able to attract key backers from both Sanders' and Clinton's camps.

This is my prediction, not my preference.

[Android3.14]

36. Darn plausible

[upaloopa]

43. This why you are wrong. Bernie does not have

the ability to raise enough money to last until the general election.
You base everything on fantacy and ignore reality just as most every other Bernie supporter on this board.
My guess is you also see the universe acting against you and Bernie will ride in on a white horse and put an end to that.
We need to defeat the right and only pragmatic realistic people have a shot at that, not socialist leaning people hoping for Bernie to give them free stuff paid for by the 1%.

[brooklynite]

71. ...and that prediction is based on...?

[RufusTFirefly]

78. More than 40 years as a Democratic activist and political junkie?

It's a hunch. An intuition. If you expect me to provide you with data, you're on the wrong track.

But then, I already knew that.

[brooklynite]

96. well, I have 45 years as a Democratic activist...

...and one of the lessons I learned from supporting many candidates who ended up losing was not to confuse my personal hopes and dreams with political reality.

Bernie Sanders' political experience comes in a small state where he can meet voters personally, and in one of the most liberal States in the country. The national political landscape is far larger (including the need to campaign in multiple States at once) requiring a substantial campaign warchest for advertising and permanent staff -- yes, that's distressing and we'd all like to change the system, but it won't change before 2016. And for all of her weaknesses vs Obama in 2008, Hillary Clinton did far better than he did in Battleground States like Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan and Florida.

Add to that, polling OVER TIME has shown that Hillary Clinton is popular with all of the Democratic Party's constituent group. In fact, her LOW point in the past year is higher that her HIGH point in 2007/2008.

Bottom line, Bernie Sanders has to effectively be as popular and successful as Barack Obama was. I don't see that happening.

[Bonobo]

117. I think there is a good chance of that happening and it IS my preference. nt

[Nitram]

33. So, if Hillary wins the Democratic nomination, you'd support the addition of 1 or 2 more...

...conservative supreme court justices. That would be catastrophic. I don't think you're thinking straight.

[Dawgs]

44. No. I'd probably vote (not support) for her.

Not supporting one person does not mean I'd support someone else.

Seems like a lot of Hillary supporters are failing with logic in this thread.

[Wilms]

116. In this thread?

As opposed to

[lark]

38. These are Obama appointees.

Why are you dogging Clinton for Obama's actions? Why is it OK for him, but not for her?

I'm leary of Clinton's corporatist leanings, but she's no different than Obama in that aspect. Why is she getting killed for the same things that Obama's given a pass on here on this board?

[yardwork]

121. I'm going to point this out more often.

At this point it's getting ridiculous.

[classof56]

39. At least it's not because she's female.

And white. Or because of what her husband did.

Sigh...sometimes this old white female is at a loss for words that might make it through the glass ceiling.

[Dawgs]

49. Why are you rolling your eyes?

Please elaborate, because it feels like you want people to support her just for being a female. Am I wrong?

[classof56]

56. You're wrong, and I'm rolling my eyes because I want to.

Hey, I'm pushing 80. Indulge me!

Cheers.

[sheshe2]

112. Great response, class.

Love ya~

[classof56]

123. Thanks, friend. Needed that!

I was worried it could get me alerted--and if I'd said what I really thought, it probably would have. Appreciate the affirmation!

Love ya, too and hugs back.

[upaloopa]

41. Bernie isn't going to select anyone.

Hillary cares even if you will never get that.

[Dawgs]

45. Great. Another, 'the nomination is over already' response.

Do you realize how you guys/gals sound?

[upaloopa]

52. Yes I do. Consider it tough love.

The problem is you don't know how unrealistic Bernie supporters sound.

[brooklynite]

70. Indeed -- cold, dispassionate analysis is better than insubstantial faith

Sort of like religion

[Dawgs]

76. How are Bernie supporters unrealistic?

I think almost all of us believe his chances of beating Hillary are really slim.

[arcane1]

89. It's unrealistic that Sanders would be nominated, but somehow realistic that Cruz would.

Makes no sense to me

[father founding]

48. You say and I say

They are all from the same mold.

[Corey_Baker08]

51. I Can't Wait Until Elizabeth Warren Endorses Hillary

And she will, its coming...

[djean111]

54. Disappointing, but it would not get me to support Hillary.

Or are you just gleefully anticipating unhappiness?

[Corey_Baker08]

65. No I Am Anticipating A United Democratic Party

[Dawgs]

80. She might, but it wouldn't make any sense. n/t

[aintitfunny]

53. Bernie first, but I will support the nominee

So as not to create a larger problem.

In Maryland we are stuck with a governor who shouldn't be cutting back education funding approved by a bipartisan legislature. He wants to invest in a youth prison in Baltimore. We are stuck with this guy because the Democrats either turned to the dark side or didn't bother to vote because they were less than enthusiastic for Anthony Brown. I was less than enthusiastic and I voted for the man who would be, at least, supporting that which I support.

Bernie Sanders will vote for Hillary if she wins the nomination.

[Beacool]

55. I will support the Democratic nominee.

Whether it's Hillary, Bernie or Mickey Mouse. There's no Democrat in the running who wouldn't be far better than whoever ends up being the Republican nominee.

It's selfish and immature to refuse to vote for the party's nominee just because one's favorite candidate didn't get the nomination. If for nothing more, SCOTUS is of great concern.

[Dawgs]

81. Just to be clear, did I say I would refuse to vote for Hillary in the general? n/t

[Beacool]

94. Well, what does this sound to you?

"Two reasons I could never support Hillary."

[Dawgs]

113. Voting for someone to avoid a republican president is different than supporting.

I don't know why that's so hard to understand.

[AgingAmerican]

57. If she is the nominee I will support her

But until then, I'm behind Bernie Sanders.

Climate will soon trump the economy as number 1 priority.

[samsingh]

59. how do you know?

[Dawgs]

84. I don't know. I do know her history though, and I don't want to risk it. n/t

[George II]

63. Interesting that you use two people she had nothing to do with to justify not supporting Clinton.

[Dawgs]

83. Interesting that you don't know her history. n/t

[George II]

85. Oh, but I do, and she didn't choose either of them to be Treasury Secretary

[Dawgs]

86. Well, if you know her history then you should know that exactly the type of person she would pick.

Seems like pretty simple logic to me.

[George II]

88. Her "history" is that she's never chosen a Treasury Secretary.

[Dawgs]

91. That's part of her history.

My concern is that, based on the rest of her history, she will pick another one from wall street to be her economic adviser. I'm not willing to take that chance.

See. Logic.

[colsohlibgal]

69. One More Big Problem

Her yes vote on war with Iraq. I've heard talkers who support her say she's handled it brilliantly by saying "I was wrong". Really?

It didn't take a brain surgeon to see that Iraq had zero to do with 9/11. But Hillary went with the herd to approve something unthinkable in the US, a first strike war, all to make Halliburton and others wealthier. It cost her the 2008 nomination but she gets a pass now? I see people who pushed back against that war as true heroes, as they did it in an insane time where unbelievably your patriotism was questioned if you even had any reservations about it. Phil Donahue was one who paid.

I see doing what is right as an important personal trait, way ahead of just going with the flow. That goes long with her being beholden to Wall Street.

[Dawgs]

82. Yep. This too. n/t

[deutsey]

72. These guys were why I couldn't get too enthusiastic about Obama

I still voted for him (twice), but I was never on the bandwagon.

Same will probably be the case with Clinton (as was the case with her husband).

[Mike Nelson]

97. There are a million reasons not to support the Republican candidate...

...many of them will be poorer. Many will be dead.

[hifiguy]

100. That is a mighty powerful argument.

Those two fuckers are evil on such a large scale that it is not even quantifiable in exponential terms.

[seabeyond]

102. never as, even if she wins the primary and is our democratic nominee? nt

[Spitfire of ATJ]

103. It's like Jeb's neocons.

[hrmjustin]

104. Are you talking about the primary and general or just thd primary?

[Maven]

106. Dawgs IIRC you were a diehard Obama supporter during the '08 primaries.

Last edited Thu May 21, 2015, 06:29 PM - Edit history (1)

At the time, many of us were sounding the alarm about Obama, and pointing out that his populist rhetoric was at odds w/ his actual positions, and the corporatists running his campaign, and the big banks who'd filled his campaign coffers. We were called firebaggers and PUMAs and generally rolled over by starry-eyed O loyalists.

Now you pick two Obama appointees to indict Hillary? Who was also an Obama appointee?

[Dawgs]

114. I was a supporter because he appeared to be anti-war.

I knew Hillary voted for war, so I knew I couldn't trust her.

I was fooled by Obama. My vote for him in 2012 was to avoid Romney getting elected.

I still have the same problems now with Hillary as I did in 2008. Just because Obama turned out be be a dud doesn't mean that Hillary would be the opposite.

[Dem2]

107. I often can't support Republicans for obvious reasons

Usually because they want to shit all over my rights, piss on the poor, make it difficult for Democrats to vote, want to hand money to the rich while simultaneously raising taxes on the poor or force my wife to do things she doesn't want to (to name a few.)

But I've never heard of someone so angry at their own possible candidate that they would claim to not support the candidate because they might possibly appoint one of 2 people they consider unacceptable - this assuming they somehow were lucky enough to be elected President.