Some shocking views of the group known as The Family or the Fellowship.

[madfloridian]

There are reasons why some have concerns about their goals.

Interestingly enough the group was founded as an anti-union movement.

While 700 plus policemen patrolled the 1934 union strikes, The Family founder prayed with the elite.

These are a couple of paragraphs I transcribed from Jeff Sharlet's book The Family.

This part showed a sharp contrast between the wealthy and the workers. They seemed to take the efforts of the unions to gain power very personally...or as Sharlet once said Abram Vereides considered it a challenge to God's sovereignty. From page 104 about the 1934 union strikes:

From page 104 about the 1934 union strikes:

Seven hundred policemen in dark blue patrolled the waterfront on foot and in black cars and on high chestnut horses. Twice that number and more picketed and searched for strikebreakers. The middle class began contemplating last minute vacations. The wives of the wealthy bunkered up at the Union Club, where Abram led prayer meetings for businessmen. As the blue tear gas sent tendrils up the hill, they must have felt frustrated by his optimistic lessons in biblical capitalism. Scripture has much to say about honest dealing and even more about handling the heathen, but not once does it mention organized labor.

From page 108:

The strike went on, but the shippers were defeated by the time the coffins went into the ground. Their old beliefs could not compete. Management-capital-would require a new faith if it was to survive.

The strike of 1934 scared Abram into launching the movement that would become the vanguard of elite fundamentalism, and elite fundamentalism took as its first challenge the destruction of militant labor. Destruction was not the word Christians used however. They called it cooperation.

Abram Vereides was given much power by the end of WW II.

In 1944, Vereide had foreseen what he called 'the new world order.' 'Upon the termination of the war there will be many men available to carry on,' Vereide wrote in a letter to his wife. 'Now the ground-work must be laid and our leadership brought to face God in humility, prayer and obedience.' He began organizing prayer meetings for delegates to the United Nations, at which he would instruct them in God's plan for rebuilding from the wreckage of the war. Donald Stone, a high-ranking administrator of the Marshall Plan, joined the directorship of Vereide's organization. In an undated letter, he wrote Vereide that he would 'soon begin a tour around the world for the (Marshall Plan), combining with this a spiritual mission.'

In 1946, Vereide, too, toured the world, traveling with letters of introduction from a half dozen senators and representatives, and from Paul G. Hoffman, the director of the Marshall Plan. He traveled also with a mandate from General John Hildring, assistant secretary of state, to oversee the creation of a list of good Germans of 'the predictable type' (many of whom, Vereide believed, were being held for having 'the faintest connection' with the Nazi regime), who could be released from prison 'to be used, according to their ability in the tremendous task of reconstruction.' Vereides met with Jewish survivors and listened to their stories, but he nevertheless considered ex-Nazis well suited for the demands of 'strong' government, so long as they were willing to worship Christ as they had Hitler.

More from a Salon article in 2009.

Sex and power inside “the C Street House”

The Family likes to call itself a “Christian Mafia,” but it began 74 years ago as an anti-New Deal coalition of businessmen convinced that organized labor was under the sway of Satan. The Great Depression, they believed, was a punishment from God for what they viewed as FDR’s socialism. The Family’s goal was the “consecration” of America to God, first through the repeal of New Deal reforms, then through the aggressive expansion of American power during the Cold War. They called this a “Worldwide Spiritual Offensive,” but in Washington, it amounted to the nation’s first fundamentalist lobby. Early participants included Southern Sens. Strom Thurmond, Herman Talmadge and Absalom Willis Robertson — Pat Robertson’s father. Membership lists stored in the Family’s archive at the Billy Graham Center at evangelical Wheaton College in Illinois show active participation at any given time over the years by dozens of congressmen.

Today’s roll call is just as impressive: Men under the Family’s religio-political counsel include, in addition to Ensign, Coburn and Pickering, Sens. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, and Jim DeMint and Lindsey Graham, both R-S.C.; James Inhofe, R-Okla., John Thune, R-S.D., and recent senators and high officials such as John Ashcroft, Ed Meese, Pete Domenici and Don Nickles. Over in the House there’s Joe Pitts, R-Penn., Frank Wolf, R-Va., Zach Wamp, R-Tenn., Robert Aderholt, R-Ala., Ander Crenshaw, R-Fla., Todd Tiahrt, R-Kan., Marsha Blackburn, R-Tenn., Jo Ann Emerson, R-Mo., and John R. Carter, R-Texas. Historically, the Family has been strongly Republican, but it includes Democrats, too. There’s Mike McIntyre of North Carolina, for instance, a vocal defender of putting the Ten Commandments in public places, and Sen. Mark Pryor, the pro-war Arkansas Democrat responsible for scuttling Obama’s labor agenda. Sen. Pryor explained to me the meaning of bipartisanship he’d learned through the Family: “Jesus didn’t come to take sides. He came to take over.” And by Jesus, the Family means the Family.

In 2007 the Miami Herald quoted Grace Nelson, wife of Florida's Senator Bill Nelson.

Mother Jones, the progressive politics magazine, delves into Dem prez contender Hillary Clinton's religious and political life - and among the few in her inner circle who would talk for the story was Grace Nelson, wife of Florida Sen. Bill Nelson.

Nelson, the magazine notes, was one of Clinton's "cell mates" in the DC-based Fellowship, described by the magazine as "a network of sex-segregated cells of political, business and military leaders dedicated to 'spiritual war' on behalf of Christ."

The magazine quotes Nelson - whom it describes as "a piety broker in Florida politics" because of her role as organizer of the Governor's Prayer Breakfast - as cautioning that she's not "at liberty" to reveal much.

Here's what the story says:

"Clinton's prayer cell was tight-knit, according to Nelson, who recalled that one of her conservative prayer partners was at first loath to pray for the first lady, but learned to 'love Hillary as much as any of us love Hillary.' Cells like these, Nelson added, exist in 'parliaments all over the world,' with all welcome so long as they submit to 'the person of Jesus' as the source of their power."

There are two more shocking statements from the Salon article. The statement by the son of the present head of The Family is especially shocking in light of recent news stories.

But David Coe, Doug Coe’s son and heir apparent, calls himself simply a friend to men such as John Ensign, whom he guided through the coverup of his affair. I met the younger Coe when I lived for several weeks as a member of the Family. He’s a surprising source of counsel, spiritual or otherwise. Attempting to explain what it means to be chosen for leadership like King David was — or Mark Sanford, according to his own estimate — he asked a young man who’d put himself, body and soul, under the Family’s authority, “Let’s say I hear you raped three little girls. What would I think of you?” The man guessed that Coe would probably think that he was a monster. “No,” answered Coe, “I wouldn’t.” Why? Because, as a member of the Family, he’s among what Family leaders refer to as the “new chosen.” If you’re chosen, the normal rules don’t apply.

Their support of dictators around the world who commit atrocities is also a shocking stance, and it seems to prove the point about the group being about power....not about religion.

If the Family men who stood over John Ensign as he wrote a baldly insincere breakup letter to his mistress were naive about hearts that want what they want, they don’t claim ignorance about the strongmen with whom they build bonds of prayer and foreign aid. They admire them. Counseling Rep. Tiahrt, Doug Coe offered Pol Pot and Osama bin Laden as men whose commitment to their causes is to be emulated. Preaching on the meaning of Christ’s words, he says, “You know Jesus said ‘You got to put Him before mother-father-brother sister? Hitler, Lenin, Mao, that’s what they taught the kids. Mao even had the kids killing their own mother and father. But it wasn’t murder. It was for building the new nation. The new kingdom.”

[NYC_SKP]

1. The Family or the Fellowship, Anti-Union, this all makes sense.... Was Hillary a friend or member?

I've seen articles on Kos, Slate, and Huffington Post suggesting that she was part of the inner circle.

Of course I, NYC_SKP, have no idea if that's true.

But if there's any truth to it then I think it's important to know.

Recommended for further discussion.

[madfloridian]

2. I don't know that answer.

[Luminous Animal]

4. She participated in their weekly women's prayer and bible reading group. Men and women are

segregated. Women interns serve as cooks and maids. Men interns do yard work.

I've yet to ascertain if membership is restricted to men only and women are mere adjuncts. All members are sworn to secrecy about their affiliation.

Sharlet's book, 'The Family' was published in 2009 but I only caught up with it last year and I was horrified. Particularly with their worst of the worst mass murderers as organizational models to emulate… Mao, Hitler, and Stalin, and their currying favor with modern mass murdering and oppressive despots.

What they seek is access to power and affirm the powerful that their power is biblically justified.

When George Bush rejected "The Fellowship" brand of Christianity, Doug Coe, the head of The Fellowship, called up Bill Clinton to complain. And Bill assured Coe that George would 'get it'… i.e. that George would ultimately understand.

[sabrina 1]

18. Power is their ultimate goal. And they admire Hitler and Mao because they see the way to

gaining such power is to be as brutal as possible.

I just told MF that Rachel Maddow did an excellent series of shows on the Family a few years ago which are probably available online.

These people are certifiable and should not be allowed anywhere NEAR our government, but many members of our government ARE part of Family.

[madfloridian]

27. Yes, power is their goal. It's a power movement.

I watched Rachel's shows on this with much interest. There was also some CNN coverage, can't remember who.

It's real.

[RKP5637]

84. It's a very dangerous group, another group wanting to bring down America in the name of thier god.

[Cheese Sandwich]

26. Imagine if we learned Bernie Sanders was in a sex segregated fundie cult

Probably wouldn't go over too well.

The Family is some scary stuff.

[KoKo]

142. NYC_SKP & MF: Hillary's Prayer: Hillary Clinton's Religion and Politics--Mother Jones/2007

And from a 2007 Mother Jones article:
Hillary's Prayer: Hillary Clinton's Religion and Politics

For 15 years, Hillary Clinton has been part of a secretive religious group that seeks to bring Jesus back to Capitol Hill. Is she triangulating—or living her faith?

—By Kathryn Joyce and Jeff Sharlet --4 Part Article

When Clinton first came to Washington in 1993, one of her first steps was to join a Bible study group. For the next eight years, she regularly met with a Christian "cell" whose members included Susan Baker, wife of Bush consigliere James Baker; Joanne Kemp, wife of conservative icon Jack Kemp; Eileen Bakke, wife of Dennis Bakke, a leader in the anti-union Christian management movement; and Grace Nelson, the wife of Senator Bill Nelson, a conservative Florida Democrat.

Clinton's prayer group was part of the Fellowship (or "the Family&quot , a network of sex-segregated cells of political, business, and military leaders dedicated to "spiritual war" on behalf of Christ, many of them recruited at the Fellowship's only public event, the annual National Prayer Breakfast. (Aside from the breakfast, the group has "made a fetish of being invisible," former Republican Senator William Armstrong has said.) The Fellowship believes that the elite win power by the will of God, who uses them for his purposes. Its mission is to help the powerful understand their role in God's plan.

Clinton declined our requests for an interview about her faith, but in Living History, she describes her first encounter with Fellowship leader Doug Coe at a 1993 lunch with her prayer cell at the Cedars, the Fellowship's majestic estate on the Potomac. Coe, she writes, "is a unique presence in Washington: a genuinely loving spiritual mentor and guide to anyone, regardless of party or faith, who wants to deepen his or her relationship with God."

The Fellowship's ideas are essentially a blend of Calvinism and Norman Vincent Peale, the 1960s preacher of positive thinking. It's a cheery faith in the "elect" chosen by a single voter—God—and a devotion to Romans 13:1: "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers....The powers that be are ordained of God." Or, as Coe has put it, "we work with power where we can, build new power where we can't."

When Time put together a list of the nation's 25 most powerful evangelicals in 2005, the heading for Coe's entry was "The Stealth Persuader." "You know what I think of when I think of Doug Coe?" the Reverend Schenck (a Coe admirer) asked us. "I think literally of the guy in the smoky back room that you can't even see his face. He sits in the corner, and you see the cigar, and you see the flame, and you hear his voice—but you never see his face. He's that shadowy figure."

Coe has been an intimate of every president since Ford, but he rarely imposes on chief executives, who see him as a slightly mystical but apolitical figure. Rather, Coe uses his access to the Oval Office as currency with lesser leaders. "If Doug Coe can get you some face time with the President of the United States," one official told the author of a Princeton study of the National Prayer Breakfast last year, "then you will take his call and seek his friendship. That's power."

"If you're going to do religion in public life," concurs Schenck, a Jewish convert to fundamentalist Christianity who's retained his sense of irony, Coe's friendship is a kind of "kosher...seal of approval."

Coe's friends include former Attorney General John Ashcroft, Reaganite Edwin Meese III, and ultraconservative Rep. Joe Pitts (R-Pa.). Under Coe's guidance, Meese has hosted weekly prayer breakfasts for politicians, businesspeople, and diplomats, and Pitts rose from obscurity to head the House Values Action Team, an off-the-record network of religious right groups and members of Congress created by Tom DeLay. The corresponding Senate Values Action Team is guided by another Coe protégé, Brownback, who also claims to have recruited King Abdullah of Jordan into a regular study of Jesus' teachings.

The Fellowship's long-term goal is "a leadership led by God—leaders of all levels of society who direct projects as they are led by the spirit." According to the Fellowship's archives, the spirit has in the past led its members in Congress to increase U.S. support for the Duvalier regime in Haiti and the Park dictatorship in South Korea. The Fellowship's God-led men have also included General Suharto of Indonesia; Honduran general and death squad organizer Gustavo Alvarez Martinez; a Deutsche Bank official disgraced by financial ties to Hitler; and dictator Siad Barre of Somalia, plus a list of other generals and dictators. Clinton, says Schenck, has become a regular visitor to Coe's Arlington, Virginia, headquarters, a former convent where Coe provides members of Congress with sex-segregated housing and spiritual guidance.


MORE OF the 4 PART ARTICLE AT...

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2007/09/hillarys-prayer-hillary-clintons-religion-and-politics

[KoKo]

144. I just edited for the excerpt of the article mentioning Doug Coe & Fellowship...

I cut & pasted the introduction of the article by mistake. Anyway, the whole article is worth the read. But, this excerpt is more relevant for NYC_SKP's question as to how much she may have been involved.

[BeanMusical]

161. Hey, cool coincidence. When I first read the OP I Googled for "The Family + Hillary" and

got the same article. This is really creepy.

[NYC_SKP]

153. Mother Jones? You can't post that RW crap here!

Or so we've been told by jurors. An OP with that very link was hidden by a jury, can you believe it?

[KoKo]

159. It's not an anti-Hillary article at all.

If one reads the whole 4 parts it shows what religious influences she's had growing up and through 2007. It even gets into "third way" and why she seems to support that thinking, along with Bill. It's part of who she was up until the time the article was written but is as relevant today as then if we want to know more about who we are voting for--which is pretty important. Has she changed her views on some issues since 2007?

[NYC_SKP]

164. It's true that a reply was hidden by a jury for having that link and two or three others.

One was from slate, the other NPR, and maybe huffpost and the MJ piece.

I agree, it's relevant, and it's a kookie set of people and I totally believe that pols are expected to kiss their feet and I'm certain that Hillary would not shrink from having to do so if it meant she could get ahead.

[KoKo]

165. Hillary could always say..."I've Grown....and Changed" and "Here's What I've Learned" ...and

what "My Views are Today" that show how I've changed since 2007."

Is this too much to ask? Since we have a record of Hillary since Bill Clinton Ran for President and Hillary ran in 2007....there is a HISTORY she needs to answer and make clear for "swing voters" just WHY they should Vote for Her?

Those of us who voted for Obama over Hillary REALLY want those questions answered. And....we have a right to ask.

That's what I'm saying.

[madfloridian]

166. ...........

One of my motives...nevermind.

[bvar22]

152. The "C Street" group (The Family kept an apartment there)

were On-the-Radar a few years ago. Frightening stuff coming from that group.

*Wealth is bestowed a sign of god's favor.

*It is gods plan that The Wealthy control of everything else.

[Voice for Peace]

157. it's a darn good subject to ask her about.

over and over.

[arcane1]

3. You mention them being anti-union... I just started a book called "One Nation Under God"

The subtitle is "How Corporate America Invented Christian America." I'm just starting it, so I'm reading about stuff from the 40's and 50's, but I wonder if this group will appear in later chapters.

It's a fascinating book and I'm still in chapter one!

[madfloridian]

5. That really looks interesting.

I just looked it up on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/One-Nation-Under-God-Corporate/dp/0465049494

This paragraph in the review stood out:

As Kruse argues, the belief that America is fundamentally and formally a Christian nation originated in the 1930s when businessmen enlisted religious activists in their fight against FDR’s New Deal. Corporations from General Motors to Hilton Hotels bankrolled conservative clergymen, encouraging them to attack the New Deal as a program of “pagan statism” that perverted the central principle of Christianity: the sanctity and salvation of the individual. Their campaign for “freedom under God” culminated in the election of their close ally Dwight Eisenhower in 1952.

[appalachiablue]

11. Very interesting for sure from this passage. Thanks for the OP, hard to fathom but exists.

[peacebird]

75. Wow. Thanks for this, I will see if our library has a copy & read it.

[MindPilot]

132. I'm working on that one too...about a third of the way into it.

Completely explains the libertarian screw-you-I-got-mine Christianity that exists today. It is a slow read because there are so many WTF? moments that I have to keep re-reading to make sure I saw that right.

The rewrite of history that sold America's "Christian origins" to its own population and indeed the world is one of the most successful and all encompassing propaganda campaigns in modern history.

I haven't seen any mention of The Family yet; I'm still in the 50s with "under God" being added to the pledge, and how the US Mint had to run three shifts for six months to get the new "In God We Trust" currency into circulation.

It also explains how "socialist" and "liberal" came to refer to not just points on the political spectrum, but sins in the eyes of God. Striking is a sin too, because God apparently gets pissed when workin' folk get uppity.

If anything this book will galvanize any idea you might have that voting is an exercise in futility. I'm probably going to write in Adam West for president.

[arcane1]

140. Thanks for the preview! I've already dog-eared every other page so far...

I can see this being one of those eye-opening books that part of me will be sorry for ever reading, like "The Shock Doctrine"

[madfloridian]

146. Okay, that review makes me determined to read it.

Thanks.

[Agschmid]

6. So conspiracy theories are okay in GD now?

I mean did anyone actually read the post? How is this not divisive, what does this accomplish for us, Democrats, or anyone for that matter?

The day that Bernie Sanders or Martin O'Malley use this as a campaign tool, hell will have frozen over and we as a party are screwed.

[madfloridian]

7. We much disagree about the conspiracy part.

Many here have posted about this group for years.

Feel free to alert or whatever you need to do.

[Agschmid]

8. No alert from me. Don't stress it.

[madfloridian]

9. Not stressing at all. I don't alert on anything.

So much appreciated.

[rhett o rick]

10. First of all, we as a party are screwed. When the party bows down to billionaires

the party is screwed. Ironic that Citizens United was created to derail H. Clinton and now it looks like it will sweep her into the WH.

Studies have shown that we no longer live in a constitutionally controlled democratic republic but a Plutocratic Oligarchy. The Oligarchs want H. Clinton. That should be a warning sign.

[Agschmid]

12. .

Studies have shown that we no longer live in a constitutionally controlled democratic republic but a Plutocratic Oligarchy. The Oligarchs want H. Clinton. That should be a warning sign.

What's changed in the past 20 years that makes that true now, if it wasn't true in the past. In my lifetime it seems to just be the same old shit.

[rhett o rick]

15. I volunteer at a local foodbank. I have seen changes. The poverty level is increasing.

Millions of children are going to bed hungry and Pres Obama is killing innocent people somewhere in the world, illegally, with drones. Our bridges are falling down and trains going off the tracks. Our aquifers are being polluted by fracking. If you haven't seen it get worse in the last 20, you must have your eyes closed. I have friends and family that are losing their homes as Goldman-Sachs and the Wall Street Gang are ripping off our people. I have friends and family that are looking for jobs. The Presidential elections in 2000 and 2004 were stolen and no one gives a shit. We kill a million people in Iraq and no one gives a shit. Those responsible are walking free and one is running for president, but no one gives a shit. The NSA/CIA is spying on all of us and we don't know who they are sharing the data with. But what does our democratic president do, he is harder on whistle-blowers and journalists that all previous presidents. I could go on, but I assume you are oblivious to the mess around us. My best friend lost his retirement as did another friends wife because no one gives a shit.

We can't do another eight years of Wall Street preying on the 99%.

[Agschmid]

17. I'm not oblivious to all the changes.

Trust me, the bridge in Mass. are deteriorating. There are infrastructure issues just ask anyone who tried to take the T this winter.

That being said, unfortunately this seems to be the status quo, our world isn't perfect, and I have a hard time believing that a somewhat fake-ish story about Hillary Clinton is going to fix all our problems. Pick a decade and I'm sure we can identify what went wrong, it's a lot easier to play Monday morning quarter back.

If our problems are as bad as you say they are Rhett what the heck are you and I doing on here, we won't accomplish all that much on DU where most of us are all on the same wavelength.

[awoke_in_2003]

67. Oh, we will accomplish much

We will put a woman in the WH, just like we put an AA in the WH in 08. Then, people will sit back and say "hey- we did this, we must be progressing". But when it comes down to it, we keep putting the same people with the same goals for in the WH- their skin color and gender just change. The illusion of choice.

[treestar]

74. Studies have shown no such thing

This kind of shit is ridiculous. You can't convince the voters, so you resort to this crap.

[rhett o rick]

128. The first step is to get past the denial stage. Just because a few people get to vote

doesn't make a democracy. Millions are locked out of the process altogether. Millions have given up altogether because most of the time their choices are between corporate chosen candidates.

A new study from Princeton and Northwestern Universities has found that the United States’ government more closely resembles an Oligarchy or a Corporatocracy than a Republic or Democracy. Researchers examined nearly 2,000 policy changes in the United States between 1981 and 2002 and compared the changes to the preferences of average Americans, wealthy citizens, and interest and lobbying groups.

http://truthinmedia.com/princeton-study-declares-u-s-government-an-oligarchy/

From the report:

Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence. The results provide substantial support for theories of Economic-Elite Domination and for theories of Biased Pluralism, but not for theories of Majoritarian Electoral Democracy or Majoritarian Pluralism.

The bottom line is we need change from the status quo that has 22% of American children living in poverty and getting worse every year. I think some view that as collateral damage for Goldman-Sachs profits.

[rhett o rick]

131. Are you a supporter of Citizens United? Do you think the billionaires should be able to

literally buy the presidency? Maybe the answer depends on whether it applies to your candidate or not.

The wealth inequality of the US is greater than all other modern nations and growing. This wealth inequality can not sustain a democracy. We must change this and H. Clinton hasn't shown any inclination for fixing this growing problem. At least Sen Sanders is openly speaking out about this.

[aspirant]

13. The quest for truth

[Agschmid]

14. So what is the truth here...

It seems there are two sides? What's your call?

[aspirant]

20. So far, thumbs down

but the quest isn't complete.

[Agschmid]

21. You've potentially impressed me...

[madfloridian]

24. Okay, thumbs down to what? To the existence of the group? To Sharlet's book?

Or to my post.

For years we have posted in GD about this group. Why not now?

[Agschmid]

31. I interpreted it as a "thumbs down" to the connection...

But honestly I never quite understand that poster.

[madfloridian]

34. I only posted Grace Nelson's words...that's supposition.

I don't really know how deeply involved anyone is, but the very thought of the group scares me.

[aspirant]

38. Thumbs down to this cult

and the quest continues to find the depth of all political involvement.

[madfloridian]

39. Okay, thanks. I agree.

[Agschmid]

45. Just for clarity I am also thumbs down to cults...

Just in case people thought otherwise, I just don't see a strong connection to any current Democratic candidates. And I think that you may have an agenda with your OP, that is all.

[madfloridian]

46. My agenda is pointing out scary cultish movements that affect our government.

That's not a bad agenda.

[Agschmid]

48. Nope, not at all.

Curious as to why Hillary is highlighted in your OP I guess...

But I guess some of my frustrations come from the first response as well (sorry SKP, you know in general we get along).

[madfloridian]

54. I did not "highlight" her. Not at all.

If I wanted to do that I would have included this post. Kathryn Joyce is a highly respected researcher and writer.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2007/09/hillarys-prayer-hillary-clintons-religion-and-politics

[Agschmid]

57. Well there we have it.

Goodnight.

[RKP5637]

85. K&R! n/t

[sabrina 1]

72. The word is 'informative'. If Sanders or O'Malley are involved in anything like this

I want to know about it! I would think ANYONE would who cares about this country.

This is a particularly vile, Right Wing organization that the entire country has a right to know about. Especially since they have so many of our Representatives under their control.

I can't for the life of me understand what problem you are having with this. The Family has been discussed here since we first learned about it.

Clearly you agree it is an unsavory association especially for a Democrat. But why are you blaming the messengers? You want to hide information you cannot hide because this has been known for a long time.

[sabrina 1]

16. A few years ago Rachel Maddow did a series of shows on The Family. Those people are SCARY.

They are apparently mostly from the Right but basically non-partisan airc so long as the members adhere to their weird, almost medieval 'philosophy'.

I'm sure Rachel's coverage is available on Utube.

Just finished reading your post. Wow, those last two paragraphs are like something from a horror story.

And to think these monsters have so much influence over our government!

This from Coe (that guy is certifiable imo, isn't he one of the founders of the DLC btw?)

Attempting to explain what it means to be chosen for leadership like King David was — or Mark Sanford, according to his own estimate — he asked a young man who’d put himself, body and soul, under the Family’s authority, “Let’s say I hear you raped three little girls. What would I think of you?” The man guessed that Coe would probably think that he was a monster. “No,” answered Coe, “I wouldn’t.” Why? Because, as a member of the Family, he’s among what Family leaders refer to as the “new chosen.” If you’re chosen, the normal rules don’t apply.

That's a cult! And an evil one imo. Rape is okay if you're chosen??? Insane.

[Agschmid]

19. Do you actually think someone currently running for President thinks this...

Rape is okay if you're chosen??? Insane.

What is the point of this OP? What does it get us?

[madfloridian]

22. Well, do you dispute David Coe said that? Do you want to challenge that statement?

Just the intersection of anti-labor movement meeting Christianity is upsetting. But worse is their seeming superiority.

[Agschmid]

25. Is David Coe running for president?

It seems the OP is talking about Hillary and her connection to the group, it then appears Sabrina may think that Hillary stands on those same view points.

To me that seems like malarkey.

[madfloridian]

33. She is mentioned only once, by Grace Nelson.

Bill and Grace Nelson are really not two of my favorite people, but I don't think Grace would lie. Did you notice what else she said? That there are prayer cells like through all over the world.

" Cells like these, Nelson added, exist in 'parliaments all over the world,' with all welcome so long as they submit to 'the person of Jesus' as the source of their power."

That's important stuff there.

[Agschmid]

35. Can you link me directly to this so I don't have to weed through it?

Lots of information in the OP/links.

[madfloridian]

37. I posted the 2 sentences for you. Yes, the post is long.

Sorry about that.

I would be equally critical of any candidate that would be involved in this. It's not healthy for our country.

[sabrina 1]

23. Excuse me? Who is running for president who might believe that? Rachel Maddow

covered this story a few years ago and it was all over Dem forums at the time, because so many Republicans it appears, belong to the Family.

The point of this post to ME is that no one who is closely associated with this fundy, religious cult should be anywhere near our government.

I believe that was the point of Rachel's series airc and most people here agreed airc.

As to your question, it wouldn't surprise me if all the Republicans in this race were part of this cult.

Do YOU think anyone associated even peripherally, I know I wouldn't choose to be, should be in positions of power in this country?

[Agschmid]

29. So...

The point of this post to ME is that no one who is closely associated with this fundy, religious cult should be anywhere near our government.

Do you think someone running for the Democratic nomination could be categorized as closely associated?

But then you close with this...

Do YOU think anyone associated even peripherally, I know I wouldn't choose to be, should be in positions of power in this country?

How do you define associated peripherally? Do you deem Hillary associated peripherally? What about O'Malley? What about Sanders?

[sabrina 1]

40. Did you read the OP? You didn't answer the questions, why are you reposting them to ME

I have already answered them. I asked what you think.

The OP includes some of what Rachel Maddow covered re the Republicans who were 'counseled' by the Family after they were caught in various 'situations'.

I'm not following the thrust of your questions, you seem disturbed by this OP for some reason. No one was disturbed by Maddow revealing what goes on in DC when she covered it. She did a huge service by reporting on this very disturbing organization that appears to have so much influence over our politics.

Coe eg, do you know who he is?

I don't get why anyone would be upset over this since it is now well known how much power this religious cult has on politics, that is a fact.

With a cult like THAT, I would not want any family member of mine, or friend, to be associated with them in any way, peripherally or otherwise. I hope that's clear enough for you.

[Agschmid]

41. Clear as day.

As is your agenda.

[aspirant]

50. The agenda

for Truth, Justice and the American Way.

[Agschmid]

51. Unfortunately the American way sometimes is cults...

Here is a little known story about a guy:

George Washington, a young Virginia planter, becomes a Master Mason, the highest basic rank in the secret fraternity of Freemasonry. The ceremony was held at the Masonic Lodge No. 4 in Fredericksburg, Virginia. Washington was 21 years old and would soon command his first military operation as a major in the Virginia colonial militia.

Freemasonry evolved from the practices and rituals of the stonemasons’ guilds in the Middle Ages. With the decline of European cathedral building, “lodges” decided to admit non-stonemasons to maintain membership, and the secret fraternal order grew in popularity in Europe. In 1717, the first Grand Lodge, an association of lodges, was founded in England, and Freemasonry was soon disseminated throughout the British Empire. The first American Mason lodge was established in Philadelphia in 1730, and future revolutionary leader Benjamin Franklin was a founding member.

There is no central Masonic authority, and Freemasons are governed locally by the order’s many customs and rites. Members trace the origins of Masonry back to the erecting of King Solomon’s Temple in biblical times and are expected to believe in the “Supreme Being,” follow specific religious rites, and maintain a vow of secrecy concerning the order’s ceremonies. The Masons of the 18th century adhered to liberal democratic principles that included religious toleration, loyalty to local government, and the importance of charity. From its inception, Freemasonry encountered considerable opposition from organized religion, especially from the Roman Catholic Church.

For George Washington, joining the Masons was a rite of passage and an expression of his civic responsibility. After becoming a Master Mason, Washington had the option of passing through a series of additional rites that would take him to higher “degrees.” In 1788, shortly before becoming the first president of the United States, Washington was elected the first Worshipful Master of Alexandria Lodge No. 22.

Learn more about the first Oligarchs here...

Woohooo I got to use the word, I never get to do that.

[aspirant]

60. Masons = cult

"The Family" cult approves of rape, therefore Masons are pro-rape

Cults take "vows of secrecy", the TPP is secret, therefore the US Trade Dept is a cult

See how this can work?

[TM99]

73. Did you seriously just try to conflate the Masons

with the Family?

That is fucked up.

I will let you try to figure out why.

[Agschmid]

92. No please tell me.

[LuvNewcastle]

126. My grandfather was a Master Mason.

It's not a high rank in masonry like the article implies. If he was a 33rd degree Mason, that would be different. A lot of men join the Masons to make contacts for business and the fellowship of it all. It's not a fucking cult. Talk about conspiracies.....

[Agschmid]

127. My point exactly.

[sabrina 1]

71. Thank you aspirant!

[sabrina 1]

52. I certainly always try to be CLEAR AS DAY. I like people who are CLEAR AS DAY.

Is there something WRONG with being HONEST now? I'm wondering what YOUR agenda is.

Are you a Hillary supporter?

I am not, not because of this business, I stopped supporting ALL those who voted for Bush policies, the Iraq War eg, long ago.

However, if I find out that Sanders, who I do support, is connected to this dangerous cult, that would be the end of my support.

I don't get personally attached to politicians as you appear to be, they work for us, that is all. So it's not hard for me to drop my support for someone if I find out that they do not deserve that support.

[Agschmid]

55. Nope not a Hillary supporter.

But what I don't support is some of the attacks being thrown at her, on a pretty regular basis.

It's ridiculous.

I use to enjoy my time here now I just end up fighting losing battles with people who I essentially agree with.

[sabrina 1]

61. How is this an attack on her? If she believed it was okay for her to

be a part of this group, that was her decision. Why would you not want people to speak about the decisions those running for office MADE THEMSELVES? It is not OUR fault when politicians make bad decisions, but it is in our interest to know about them.

I don't understand your concern at all. You're blaming other people for a decision Hillary made.

But the fact that you don't want people to talk about it, and claim it is an 'attack' to simply report a fact about a politician, says to me that YOU think it was a bad decision.

Why not talk about it from that aspect?

When I first learned about it, I gave her some slack due to the fact that she was under tremendous stress as a result of the Republicans vicious attacks on her husband AND her.

I still think she was very vulnerable at that time. I remember fighting Republicans fiercely on her behalf.

But to be angry at people for stating facts, makes no sense.

If she were my candidate, I would not attack other people for talking about something that is a FACT.

I would try to explain it.

YOU eg, questioned MY AGENDA! Let me be very clear AGAIN. My agenda is and always has been VERY CLEAR.

I care about this country and will support ONLY those who I think will be the best possible leaders and RARELY bother with trying to smear other candidates.

This topic has ALWAYS been of interest to DUers.

Look at the list of Members of Congress who belong to The Family and tell me it is not a subject that should be constantly discussed and spread far and wide so that the American people know what their Reps ACTUALLY believe.

[MissDeeds]

91. +1000

Very well said, sabrina 1.

[Agschmid]

113. Sabrina, read my post before you respond please...

- I'm not blaming others, I'm suggesting that the actions which are now being suggested Senator Clinton participated in likely aren't accurate.

- I dont care if she is affiliated with a religious group, to me most religions have some cult aspects and are not something I would ever participate in (sorry to the religious folks I know you are out there) just my opinion.

- I'm not angry at people posting facts, I just don't think everything that made it into this thread is a fact. I'm not really questioning the OP as much as I question some of the replies.

- I am certainly not attacking other people, if I was my posts would be hidden. I am being very civil.

- Yes, you have an agenda. Everyone who supports a specific candidate has one, it's not a dirty word.

- I'm a Massachusets resident so my reps don't believe this stuff, sorry if yours do. It's probably quite frustrating but luckily here we can get people elected who won't participate in this type of behavior.

That's it... I hate making a list but otherwise it's sometimes hard to be clear on here.

[aspirant]

28. What does she actually think?

If Mrs. Nelson's memory is wrong, then Hillary should speak up.

"It gets us" to the truth

[Agschmid]

30. Speak up about what?!?!

If rape is okay?

Really?

Good lord.

[aspirant]

43. Was Hillary

Mrs. Nelson's "cell mate"?

[Agschmid]

44. When you find out, let me know.

[aspirant]

62. Are you saying Mrs. Nelson is untruthful

or quoted incorrectly?

[Agschmid]

103. So far, thumbs down

but the quest isn't complete.

She probably isn't lying, but the stuff being associated with this cult, and then further associated with Senator Clinton just doesn't pass muster.

Why in this thread I read that in these "cells" women were supposed to clean, do the laundry, etc... Not run for President which seems to Elbe what's actually happening.

[aspirant]

137. "probably isn't lying"

Is that a little lying or 100% truthful?

Do you think after many years of association, she got promoted?

[Agschmid]

138. I basically am agreeing with you but even that isn't enough...

Telling.

[aspirant]

139. "basically"

does that mean you are agreeing 100% and what are you trying to TELL me?

[peacebird]

77. It gives us insight into of one of our candidates, who was clearly associated with this group

Is she still? The more I read about The Fellowship, the more concerned I get. This thread has mentioned a book that I had heard of but dismissed without knowing what it was about. 'One Nation under God'. Based on the descriptions given, I am now planning to read it.
Opening a challenging topic privides us all with room to deepen our understanding, and decide for ourselves whether it matters or not.
To me, it DOES matter that Hillary associated with The Family.

[haikugal]

69. Well, just ask the Duggars how that works.

The 'elite' always have viewed themselves as above and apart from the 'unwashed'...these are people that don't believe in democracy, or equality, or the rules being applied equally...they are special, they belong to the club!

[beam me up scottie]

169. Very true.

This is why we need to find out just how beholden a candidate is to any religious group.

[KMOD]

32. This is getting ridiculous.

Please, just stop already.

[madfloridian]

36. We have posted about this group for years here at DU.

Why should we stop now? There are other Democrats who are/were involved with C Street and the Family...so really it's upsetting.

[KoKo]

163. Yes, there are many article in the DU Archives and

I was here then and don't remember any locks over Jeff Sharlit's article in Harpers or the Mother Jones article from 2007 on Hillary's Religious influences growing up and her support for "The Family" and their support for her.

Daily Kos also has many articles about it and concern in 2007 when Hillary ran for President and Obama was being criticized for going to Reverend Wright's church.

[Luminous Animal]

47. Stop what? Hillary's self admitted admiration to a self admitted fascist? This is all public record.

Hillary. Admirer of crime against humanity Kissinger. Hillary. Good friends with dictator Mubarak.

[KMOD]

49. I'm going to bed.

carry on with the nonsense if you wish.

[Luminous Animal]

56. Sleep is a wonderful cleanser for denial.

[Agschmid]

53. So the whole cult thing didn't stick so now you'll throw in Kissinger and Mubarak?

Can't wait for the Kissinger picture to show up.

Skinner should just shut DU down.

[Luminous Animal]

59. Really. Her admiration for fascists and dictators is public record on her own

admission. Kissinger, Mubarak, and Coe.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

79. He should shut the site down because a Democratic candidate for President has ties to a cult?

Or because people are being told about it? Is it just your belief that people shouldn't know what their potential candidates have done that are unsavory? That we should all be left in the dark and therefore be 'happily ignorant'?

Besides, shutting DU down won't stop the word from being spread. 'Family diaries' (and Mrs Clinton's connection thereto) have been posted on Daily Kos since the mid-2000s.

[Scootaloo]

87. Insane religious fundamentalism is okay if Clinton sometimes has breakfast with them

Just like Henry Kissinger is absolved of his war crimes if Clinton endorses his book.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

42. Don't worry. Her advisers may get Hillary to think about evolving....again. K&R

[byronius]

63. You're making me want to vote for Hillary.

Is that your intent? Because that's what it's doing.

I was leaning Bernie. This ball of shite post is changing my mind.

[madfloridian]

64. Okay.

Please vote that way if it seems right. I have made it clear I am for Bernie in the primary and the Democrat in the general.

What I don't get is that this topic has been discussed here for many years. Why is it so bad to post it now. There's lots more out there about it.

It is what it is.

[AtomicKitten]

65. Really? This post did it for you?

Good grief, who bases their point of view on what anonymous people post on message boards?!!

Vet the candidates and then decide. The OP is factual information that is relevant in that process of vetting a candidate. Take it or leave it, but spare yourself the drama.

[djean111]

68. Oh, that is just hyperbole, and, in addition, there is an attempt to hijack the thread

in the usual way, asking the same questions and demanding links. "RW attack" should show up soon.

[AtomicKitten]

70. Well we all know the truth has a decidedly

... anti-Hillary bias. Oy. It's going to be a longass primary season.

[orpupilofnature57]

83. Your right, Truth doesn't have bias, and Hillary has to

wear the shoe that fits her, ambiguous ingratiation is a way of life since Bill first ran for office .

[carolinayellowdog]

121. thread jackers' persistence is a wonder to behold

but so is the cluelessness of troll feeders; if a single individual confronts and challenges the author of an OP twenty or more times they go right to my ignore list as harassers

[Luminous Animal]

66. Indeed. I used to be anti-war until protesters blocked my commute.

[peacebird]

78. LOL!

Well played!

[raouldukelives]

80. .

[m-lekktor]

81. lol

that's about it.

[Scootaloo]

88. +1

[madfloridian]

154. .....

[FlatBaroque]

133. hahahahahahahah

[TBF]

150. That's hilarious-

Forgive me if I lol. Yes a post on the Internet suddenly "made you decide" that the status quo candidate is far superior to someone who actually gives a damn about the people of this country.

You must be joking.

[orpupilofnature57]

76. Jesus was talking about Heaven on earth and solitude, they talk Hate

Control and oppression, not the first Group to twist the message .

[peacebird]

82. That's why instead of Jesus' Sermon on the Mount, they reach back into the Old Testament so much

I thought Christians were supposed to follow the word of Christ? In other words the New Testament.

[orpupilofnature57]

86. Fundies are experts at using the old to justify the new, Jesus jacked up with an

Assault weapon .

[trumad]

89. There ain't Jack Shit proof that Hillary is part of this cult.

I love you MF---you're a fellow Floridian who keeps me well informed on my crazy state.

But when you post something like this --- anti-Hillary Zombies smell fresh meat and come a runnin---hence batshit cra cra shit turns into---well--- a pile of shit.

I believe that this cult exists---and I believe the dumbass Republicans and Blue Dog Democrats you listed are most likely part of it. Why? cause there's an F'ing list with their name on it. One name I don't see?

Hillary in a segregated Cell!

[Fumesucker]

90. Bernie?

[madfloridian]

97. Hey Trumad. Grace Nelson said it, not me.

[HooptieWagon]

102. Except her own words in her book. Nt

[TM99]

110. Yes, actually there is.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106115324

In the September 2007 Mother Jones, Sharlet and Kathryn Joyce reported that Hillary Clinton (pictured at the 2009 National Prayer Breakfast) has been active in Bible-study and prayer circles affilated with the Family. Writing in The Nation, Barbara Ehrenreich reported that Clinton described Family leader Doug Coe as "a unique presence in Washington: a genuinely loving spiritual mentor and guide to anyone, regardless of party or faith, who wants to deepen his or her relationship with God."

Now it is true, she may just be pandering to the fundies in order to gather more power. She is know to do that. But to say there is no connection between Clinton and the Family is a lie. Sorry.

Hell, the Family is one of the main reasons I will not be voting for Rep. Ann Kirkpatrick in AZ. She was a chairperson in 2011 of their keynote speaker series.

No thank you to Douglas Coe and the Family.

[VanillaRhapsody]

114. so do you want to also condemn Jimmy Carter as well?

as collateral damage in the Hillary Clinton Swiftboating campaign?

[HooptieWagon]

122. Is he currently running for President?

Hillary is, which is why her associations are important.

[VanillaRhapsody]

123. do you care about his reputation?

I do...

Like I said....Swiftboaters for Bernie.....there is no depths to which they will not plumb for their hero!

[HooptieWagon]

125. Do you care about George Washingtons reputation?

He was a Mason and slave owner. JFK was an adulterer and addicted to pain pills. Our past heros are seldom perfect, but the imperfections are only important when they were contemporary, not when they're decades in the past. Hillary is running for President NOW, which is why her associations are important.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

93. I am glad madfloridian brought this up.

This is an explosive issue that will be of unprecedented interest to rank and file Democratic primary voters. Mr.'s Sanders and O'Malley should make this issue the centerpiece of their campaign. It will turn the primaries in their direction.

[madfloridian]

108. I doubt it will have an effect at all. It's old news. Now suddenly everyone's mad when it's posted.

It has been posted here, at Daily Kos and other places since I believe 2009.

[Agschmid]

117. If it's old news why post it again?

[madfloridian]

119. Why not? It's about combining govt and religion and power.

It's pertinent to recent power plays going on around the world right now if nothing else.

[Agschmid]

120. Interesting,

[VanillaRhapsody]

94. Didn't anyone alert on this excremental CT yet?

It utter hogwash....

[DemocratSinceBirth]

95. No need to alert...Let a thousand flowers bloom.

I believe this could be the issue that defines the 2016 presidential race.

[VanillaRhapsody]

98. How so?

Flowers don't bloom on bitterness!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

100. So you don't think a week from now Hillary's involvement with The Fellowship will lead the news?

So you don't think a week from now Hillary's former[ involvement with The Fellowship will lead the news?

[madfloridian]

105. Swiftboaters for Bernie??

[VanillaRhapsody]

107. Yep!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

106. I believe the original poster inadvertently fell on an issue that will define the upcoming campaign.

Let's look at the all the big issues:


Marriage equality
Criminal justice reform
Reproductive rights
The threat of ISIS
Iranian nuclear negotiations
The future of the Affordable Care Act
NSA
The Patriot Act

...

All these issues pale in comparison to Hillary Clinton's former membership in a Christian study group.

[madfloridian]

104. All of this is old news. None of it is new.

[VanillaRhapsody]

109. and all of it bullshit...

Let the swiftboating begin!

It only proves that Bernie supporters are desperate!

[madfloridian]

111. Then please start refuting it.

[VanillaRhapsody]

112. I am refuting it right now....

or are you also swiftboating Jimmy Carter?

[AtomicKitten]

148. You can set your watch by VR's flameouts.

[HooptieWagon]

124. Hillary's own words are bullshit?

Yes, I mostly agree. However, I don't think she was bullshitting when she mentioned her admiration to Douglas Coe in her book.

[Agschmid]

115. Yes but not me, went 1-6 leave.

I was sent the results.

[VanillaRhapsody]

116. Well that is because it occurred in the middle of a Saturday night

when the Swiftboaters for Bernie were "packing the courts" so I am not surprised by that result.

[Agschmid]

118. Something like that...

[FlatBaroque]

134. Please identify any one specific aspect of the information which you can show to be inaccurate.

Thanks.

[hootinholler]

96. The folks that bring us the Presidential Prayer Breakfast

Thank you Jeff Sharlet for spending a couple of years on this project.

If you have not read "The Family", be sure you have your security blanket handy. Steven King couldn't put together a scarier book. The follow up book about their C street 'ministry' was an eye opener also.

[kenfrequed]

130. It is a great book.

I think our politicians should flush these C-Street bastards and their prayer breakfast.

[HooptieWagon]

99. In before the hide.

Certainly Hillary's association with The Family is true. In her book is a passage in which she states her admiration and friendship for Coe. That's Hillary's own words. Yet her supporters are falsely claiming this is debunked, and are alerting posts and (coincidently) finding sympathetic juries. There's already been several posts referencing Hillary and The Family hidden. I'm not sure how that happened.
There is certainly plenty to dislike about Hillary besides her association with The Family. But I find it interesting that that is the issue her supporters are desperately trying to shove down the Memory Hole. Maybe where there's smoke, there's fire.

[librechik]

129. Thanks for posting, Mad. Everyone should know about this powerful group

They run us. For "The Lord." The Clinton's and Obama attend their annual prayer breakfast regularly.

[FlatBaroque]

135. Pallin' around with he American Taliban

I suppose it earns some cred with some constituents.

[Octafish]

141. ''Chosen'' explains a lot of the last 34 years.

Some people are above the law. Most are below it. What decides where one lies are money, power, and connections.

Thank you for your traditional outstanding OP and thread, madfloridian.

Regarding the topic, my 2-cents from '06 -- plus many outstanding replies:

Know your BFEE: The Fellowship ‘Preys’ for America

[madfloridian]

143. Secrecy by design..Coe says the more invisible the organization the more powerful it can be.

Goodness that rang a bell. Thinking of the TPP we are not allowed to read and understand. Just trust them.

From The Week:

DC's 'invisible army' for Christ

Secrecy by design

Family members quickly learn that the first rule of the Family is not to talk about it. In 1966, Vereide, who referred to his following as an “invisible army,” decreed that the Family should “submerge the institutional image” of the group—a policy maintained by Coe. As Coe once said in a sermon, “the Family functions invisibly like the Mafia. The more you can make your organization invisible, the more influence it will have.” Family members organize themselves into small “cells” that are, in the group’s own words, “publicly invisible and privately identifiable.” Coe has expressed admiration for the way such leaders as Adolf Hitler, Ho Chi Minh, and Osama bin Laden organized followers into small groups that shared a “covenant.” With a covenant, he says, “two or three people can do anything.” Where those leaders went wrong, he says, was in not making their covenants in Jesus’ name.

And about excusing adultery? Not really, but members only judged by higher power.

Does the Family excuse adultery and other sins?

Not exactly, but it considers the powerful to be accountable only to God and their peers, not to their constituents or the Constitution. Coe speaks often of the biblical King David, who slept with another man’s wife, then ordered the cuckolded husband into battle, effectively sentencing him to death. Yet despite his personal failings, David was one of God’s chosen, and his reign was a blessing to the Israelites. When Gov. Sanford invoked King David to explain why he wouldn’t resign over his adulterous relationship with an Argentine woman, “you could almost hear Doug’s voice,” says Sharlet, who considers the Family’s disregard for conventional morality “potentially very dangerous,” because it “leads you away from accountability to the public.”

[MisterP]

145. there's an -ism for that: "perfectionism" where one CAN be purged of all sin

though Wesley's point was to NOT do the sin again
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_perfection

[BlancheSplanchnik]

147. unspeakable evil

Needs to get spoken about.

[madfloridian]

149. Family stored their archived records in the Billy Graham center Wheaton College. 600 boxes

http://www.sott.net/article/189722-Inside-The-Family-Jeff-Sharlet-Speaks-About-His-Unique-Look-at-American-Evangelicals

Interviewer: I'm surprised that I haven't heard of this group before. You think it be the kind of thing that would be publicized at some point.

Sharlet: They have been publicized at points. And there's this weird non-response on the part of the rest of the press back in the 1990s. Originally this group goes back to 1935. They weren't the self-described "invisible" group until 1966. Between 1935 and 1966 they were sort of coasting on a culture of elites in which beliefs didn't get challenged. You didn't report on these private matters of elites. In 1966 they decide to "submerge" - that's the word they use - "We're going to 'submerge' our public profile." In1974 Playboy has a long investigative piece that shows money moving around in fishy ways. Nothing happens. Dan Rather challenges Nixon's press secretary about why Chuck Colson, the Nixon dirty-trickster who'd been given the boot, was still showing up at the White House? Press secretary says, "He's there for prayer meetings." But then no follow-up. So this goes on every so many years. And in the '90s a Florida paper noted that Taiwan was forking over big chunks of change in order to get good seats at the National Prayer Practice because they understood this was a backdoor into American power. In 2002, The Los Angeles Times did a year-long investigation. Should have been a huge follow-up. Nothing.

So the weird thing is why haven't you heard about it? It's partly this media that is disposed to understand fundamentalism only when it's a sweaty Southern guy in a two-piece suit, pounding the pulpit, and along come these very sophisticated, very polished internationalist guys and they just don't register, even though they're more enduring and more powerful.

Interviewer: Tell me about the logistics of your time there.

Sharlet: I went for a visit and then I went another time for an interview, and then I moved in for a little bit under a month. I moved into this house where younger guys were being groomed for leadership. And you live in this house that's one amongst this cluster of about 20 houses all owned by family members and the centerpiece of which is this big mansion called "The Cedars," overlooking the Potomac River, where they host foreign heads of state and various important visitors.

Mostly, the idea is that you're building a network. You're building a behind-the-scenes brotherhood that you can call upon if you move ahead in the world of business or government or whatever you end up doing. When I left, I discovered that they dumped 600 boxes of papers in the Billy Graham center archive in Wheaton, Illinois. So I moved there, got myself an apartment with no furniture and just spent every day going through this archive, Xeroxing as much as I could to get as much out of there because I knew they were eventually going to restrict the archive. I suspected they would and indeed they did.

[PufPuf23]

151. The "Family" is a dangerous group. k&r

[Pooka Fey]

155. What is in the water these days that is creating all these cult leaders?

[madfloridian]

158. Good question.

There seems to be a lot of it lately.

[shaayecanaan]

156. the great thing about obama

is that he rose up the ranks too quickly to fall in with a lot of this shit.

[pa28]

160. K&R

[BeanMusical]

162. Hillary, ‘The Family,’ and Uganda’s Anti-Gay Christian Mafia

The evangelical organization that describes itself as a Christian mafia has been the hidden hand behind Uganda’s anti-gay bill, along with Rick Warren, the gay-bashing pastor who presided at Obama’s first inauguration.

The President of Uganda has just signed into law extreme anti-gay legislation. In addition to imprisoning anyone who counsels or reaches out to the gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgender community in Uganda, the law establishes a crime of “aggravated homosexuality” which include acts where one person is infected with HIV, “serial offenders,” and sex with minors. “Aggravated homosexuality” is punished with life in prison. A previous version of the law, amended after worldwide protests, proscribed the death penalty.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/25/obama-the-family-and-uganda-s-anti-gay-christian-mafia.html

So what's Hillary's position on LGBT rights?

[madfloridian]

167. That just sickens me.

[BeanMusical]

168. Yes, it's sickening...

But some people don't see what the big deal is. I just saw that on Facebook on a liberal friend's post. Supposed liberals attacking this same article! You're a good person BTW and I've been enjoying your posts for a while.