Please stop discussing Dennis Hastert in the context of homosexuality

[DemocratSinceBirth]

It feeds into right wing tropes that molesters are more likely to be homosexual than heterosexual. That is an assertion that is belied by the evidence.

Denny the Molester diddled his underage students. Their gender is of no moment. His behavior is doubly odious as he molested minors who were incapable of informed consent and he violated the sacred trust we give teachers and other school administrators when we put our children in their care.

Thank you and have a nice day.

DemocratSinceBirth

[VanillaRhapsody]

1. I have been wondering about this....

Do we know that this student was younger than 16? Do we know for sure it was pedophilia? I haven't seen anything about the age of the individual. Can you point me to an article? I have just been curious about the details of this

[DemocratSinceBirth]

4. As of now we don't know the age.

I am going to make an educated guess the person was below the age of consent.

And the person was his high school student. High school teachers are prohibited from having sex with students in their charge.


I was looking at right wing boards and many of the reactions were 'Denny is the victim". "this happened a long time ago" and "aren't liberals defenders of gays"...


The last remark chafes. I would defend Denny The Molester's right to have sex with every Republican in the world, male or female, as long as that person is capable of giving meaningful consent and is above the age of majority.

[VanillaRhapsody]

6. I understand that....BUT a Republican like Hastert with that reputation of having a "clean" record

even had consensual sex with a male....

I totally get that his position made it punishable offense at his former school in Yorkville. But a republican with a teenage paramour relationship would be just damning in their minds. not to mention hiding it from his wife and kids.....I think if the person was below the age of consent there wouldn't be a statute of limitations on the offense either would there?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

9. Maybe we need to look at this from a money angle...

Republicans are cheap... If Denny wasn't so cheap he could have just hired an escort to sate his desires. But he thought why pay for the cow when you can get the milk for free and preyed on his students.

The irony is his cheapness cost him millions, his reputation, and possibly his freedom.

[VanillaRhapsody]

11. Oh I get that.....

I am just trying to suss out more about this story.....like why is he not arrested for pedophilia? I wouldn't think that had a statute of limitations...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. Only capital crimes don't have statutes of limitations, I believe.

[VanillaRhapsody]

14. Apparently it is on a state by state basis...

Looks like Illinois doesn't have a statute of limitations on sex abuse...

http://victimsofcrime.org/docs/DNA%20Resource%20Center/sol-for-sexual-assault-check-chart---final---copy.pdf?sfvrsn=2

[AngryAmish]

41. The old statute law had a fixed term

I want to say 2 years. They changed the law about 20 years back.

[MoonRiver]

16. Unless he wanted a child.

Very hard to arrange for that in the U.S. Cambodia, not so much.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. That would be illegal...

If that's how he needed to sate his desires he should have left them unsated.

[MoonRiver]

20. Of course. But he apparently didn't.

And again, this has nothing to do with sexual orientation. It's a crime against children.

[jwirr]

44. The issue regarding "gay sex" should not be on the kind of sex but that he was actively working

against the rights of others to do what he was doing. Hypocrisy. As to pedophilia - that is never okay either.

[Tom Ripley]

46. Your mistake is letting right wing scumbags determine the grounds of debate

"aren't liberals defenders of gays'...
The last remark chafes. I would defend Denny The Molester's right to have sex with every Republican in the world, male or female, as long as that person is capable of giving meaningful consent and is above the age of majority"

Really? Really?

Presumably the homosexual aspect of his chickenhawkery was of concern to Hastert, as it is with many conservatives.

[Chan790]

24. A minor technical point.

If the victim was a HS student, they were presumably 13 or older, a teenager.

As IL law says that it is illegal to commit acts of a sexual nature on persons who are under the age of 18 if they are in a position of authority or trust over the victim. Otherwise, the age of consent in IL is 17.

So that would make the victim 13-18 most likely.

Sexual assault of a 13-18 year old is ephebophilia (post-pubescent minors) or hebephilia (pubescent minors)...but not pedophilia which is the sexual assault of prepubescent minors. It may seem like splitting hairs but they are often treated very differently legally.

[jwirr]

45. Learn something every day. Thank you.

[Bluenorthwest]

59. Age of consent in Illinois is 17, however people over 17 who are in authority over others can not

have sexual relations with any of those others who are under 18.

[cali]

2. that's been the focus here- that he abused those he was

entrusted to teach and coach- though before the clarification of that fact, some thought this was about Hastert paying hush money to cover up his sexual orientation.

[cherokeeprogressive]

3. Honored to be the rec that sends this to The Greatest Page.

This crap needs to stop. It's NOT OKAY to equate sexual identity and/or orientation with sick behavior... EVER.

[tularetom]

5. Can I still refer to him as a perv?

I don't care whether he molested boys or girls.

[MoonRiver]

17. Same here.

I refuse to give any molester, of either sex, a pass.

[Bradical79]

21. I prefer sex predator or sexual predator as a label

I think that covers the sort of person he is regardless of sexual preference. Don't really care whether he is technically a pedophile or not. Plenty of pervs out there who don't break the law, or target real people from a position of power.

[TheNutcracker]

7. They are pedophiles, and laced throughout all of our institutions....

Start with the Franklin Cover Up

[notadmblnd]

23. I agree, it is one big exclusive club

I also think republicans use sex to entrap and manipulate other politicians. Sex with minors, sex with prostitutes, etc. I believe it's how they maintain that unity thing they have when legislating issues.

[mopinko]

25. ^^this

i believe that too. also think monica was sent.

[TheNutcracker]

27. exactly

I read it that bill would never take the bait for kids. So they sent monica

[Snobblevitch]

60. I don't believe for a second that

Monica was 'sent' by republicans.

[erronis]

26. That's quite cynical ---- but I think it has a bit of truth to it.

Blackmail is one of the easiest ways to control someone else. These legislators (and not solely 'uglicans) are likely to get themselves in compromising positions. Too bad they don't know how to compromise on the floor.

[notadmblnd]

36. I know, it's why I said other politicians.

I think that "The Family" aka "The Fellowship" is a key player regarding the manipulation and blackmail of pols in DC.

[TheNutcracker]

28. that was the whole purpose of franklin cover up! google it.

Better yet google the movie Conspiracy of Silence. Its all there and wha t this is about.

[catrose]

8. YEs. Thank you. n/t

[Demeter]

13. Just stop discussing Hastert, period

Call him evil, and call it a day.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. It's a cudgel to use in our battle with the Republicants.

I still can't believe him and his ilk sat in judgement of Bill Clinton. He might not have been a choirboy but I don't believe he ever diddled kids, especially kids placed in his charge.

[mountain grammy]

15. He was a high school coach in a position of trust..

Innocent till proven guilty unless there's hush money. If it had been a consenting adult, that fact would be known by now. He's a child molester in my eyes.

[brewens]

54. Many of us knew the same thing about Larry Craig for years before his airport bathroom

incident. His first scandal was molesting a Republican page boy that was under age. I think in that case the family was bought off and it went away.

[jeremyfive]

22. It's Relevant, Unfortunately

Hastert did all he could during his years of leadership to block gay rights and thwart the gay agenda, using his powerful position.
Apart from the pedophilia, the same-sex aspect of his predatory past is significant in that light. It reveals hypocrisy at a level that we have seldom seen before! We are just shining a flashlight on the monster.

The rape of any children at all is, of course, the most disturbing aspect.

[George II]

38. I agree - why hide an aspect of his abusive behavior, especially since....

....he was outspoken in opposition to what HE did himself?

He had a same-sex abusive relationship with a child over whom he had authority.

Don't sugar coat it or run from any details of his crime.

[Tom Ripley]

47. ^^^THIS^^^

[Arugula Latte]

61. I agree. If these "scandals" bring any good, it is that they shine a light on hypocrisy.

[DawgHouse]

29. I agree but would add that I wish people would not use the word "diddle"

when talking about molestation That word seems to indicate something minor or playful. I don't know maybe it's just me that feels that way, though.

[TheNutcracker]

30. all politicians so surprised yet ordinary citizens not at all. All pols are lying!

[RKP5637]

31. K&R! n/t

[OregonBlue]

32. Agreed. It's that he was molesting CHILDREN. It's not about sex. It's about perversion.

[packman]

33. Double agree - the perversion and the hypocrisy

Could care less if he is or isn't a homosexual, it's the character of the person.

[gwheezie]

34. you said it beautifully

I have not been as eloquent as the op but I've been trying to say the same thing. The only relevance to the sex of the young victims is Hastert went out of his way to add to not support gay issues.

[Thespian2]

35. Hastert

is not, by all accounts, part of the LGBT community...he is a heterosexual molester of a high school student...until more facts are revealed...

[erlewyne]

49. That is the answer I was wanting to give...

he is a heterosexual molester of a high school student...

My wife is/was Catholic. When we first met back in the sixties she
was outraged about this homosexual suing because he could not
land a teaching job. (apparently he admitted to being homosexual
in applying for teaching jobs)

I asked my lady if she ever heard of a homo sexual being charged
for rape or child molestation? We had had several recent events
involving male teachers and their male/female students. My point was
that none of the instigators were admitted homosexuals. As a fact
they were married.

My lady/wife is still is/was Catholic but has not been back to church since
that day. She now defends the LGBT community.

It's a great life today with our children and grandchildren.

[Thespian2]

66. Thanks

Welcome to the Underground...

[HassleCat]

37. Maybe it matters

If the victim is a boy, rather than a girl, is the psychological damage greater? Less? Different? I didn't know Hastert was in trouble.

[MNBrewer]

39. It should rightly be discussed in the context of homophobia

Illustrative of how the most vile homophobes are usually reacting against something within themselves.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

40. What about the victim - does the fact he was molested erase the extortion? nt

[DemocratSinceBirth]

43. That's a good question

A person could say somebody who shakes another person down to the tune of nearly four million dollars for something he or she did to him or her instead of going to the authorities does not have clean hands.

I don't know. I need more information before making that judgement and believe we will get it.


You do know there is a second victim who didn't get paid.

[EEO]

42. Hear, Hear.

[Boomer]

48. I have to disagree with the OP

Hastert has committed multiple betrayals, and his homosexuality is part of that equation. No matter how much I, as a gay person, may hate the right-wing tropes about molesting I'm not going to ignore this aspect of Hastert's history. It may be uncomfortable, but it's very pertinent.

As a teacher, Hastert betrayed any professional ethics and he took advantage of his position of authority if he had sexual relations with at least one student, and possibly more.

If those students were minors (which we can assume is most likely) then he also committed a crime.

And because those were homosexual relations (one relationship presumably lasted for years), Hastert has betrayed the gay community by actively attempting to curtail our civil rights to cover his own activities.

[LovingA2andMI]

53. THIS^^^^

[Joe the Revelator]

58. +10

[Spitfire of ATJ]

50. I crack up hearing about the freeway interchange....

He was investigating the Clintons for Whitewater which was a land deal where they accused the Clintons of using insider knowledge to make a buck (when they actually LOST money on that deal). Meanwhile, Denny was doing the exact same thing making millions off of a land deal using inside information from his time in office.

It just proves Republicans have no shame.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

51. Gotta give the fella credit for planning ahead. He knew he would need hush money./NT

[brewens]

52. I've heard of such Duggary on his part years ago.. You'd think a guy like that

would keep his mouth shut about any moral issues. Fair game but we shouldn't refer to him as homosexual or gay.

[Boomer]

55. That's ludicrous.

If a man has sexual relations with another man, that's homosexual behavior.

If that behavior happens in a context of prison, then you can persuasively argue that the man may be fundamentally heterosexual and simply used homosexual sex as a substitute because there were no other options.

But Hastert had options and still chose to have sex with another male. If that doesn't make him a homosexual, then I'm really scratching my head to understand what exactly would meet your criteria. It's bullshit to try and distance ourselves from him, no matter how toxic he may be. No matter how much I may loathe him, Hastert is a homosexual

I agree that I wouldn't call him "gay" because that is a term I connect with homosexuals who accept. to at least some degree, their true nature. Being gay is more than just engaging in homosexual sex. I'm gay because I participate in the LGBT community as an out lesbian.

[Tom Ripley]

62. +1000

[still_one]

56. I suspect the reason they bring up the gay nature of his assault is because Hastert is an extreme

homophobe, and it is to point out the hypocrisy

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

57. Hastert's homosexuality was the focus of Barney Frank's comments this past week

Wouldn't it be appropriate to discuss Hastert's gay sex in terms of his hypocrisy? That was the sum and substance of Barney Frank's comments on MSNBC this past week.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/05/30/1389022/-Barney-Frank-calls-out-Dennis-Hastert-GOP-hypocrisy-with-a-perfect-statement#

..."There is a hypocrisy issue," Barney Frank said. "Dennis Hastert was a member of the House who voted for the Defense of Marriage act. He subsequently as Speaker twice put before the House of Representatives the constitutional amendment that would have cancelled retroactively all the same sex marriages that had taken place legally. ... The rank hypocrisy of this man using his power to persecute other people for doing what he was doing. Secondly, and it is relevant to note that in terms of the hypocrisy area, you mentioned Gingrich had to quit. It turns out Gingrich was at the time having an affair with the woman he is now married who was an employee of the House Agriculture Committee. And then Livingston who was supposed to replace him had to quit because he was having an affair not just with a woman but with a lobbyist who was lobbying him. So then in an effort to get somebody [who was clean], they get Hastert. The point is that all this was happening while they were impeaching Bill Clinton for having oral sex. So I think that it now looks like if you take Bill Clinton, Newt Gingrich, Dennis Hastert, and Robert Livingston the the Republican Speakers or would be speakers, Clinton is a choir boy." ...

[totodeinhere]

68. He is a pedophile, not a homosexual.

Pedophilia is a distinct sexual orientation marked by persistent, sometimes exclusive, attraction to prepubescent children.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/09/19/903178/-Gays-are-pedophiles-No-Here-s-the-proof

Men who molest boys are more likely to be pedophiles than homosexuals. Homosexuals have adult relationships, not with children.

[Boomer]

70. Please read your own definition!

There is NO evidence so far that Hastert is a pedophile. He was a high-school teacher, and last time I checked there aren't any prepubescent students going to high school.

Hastert may have had sexual relations with a minor, but "minor" covers a range of kids up to the age of 17-years-old. That's illegal because teens are still under the age of consent, but it's not the same as being a pedophile.

[libdem4life]

63. Best line on the thread.."Clinton is a choir boy"! She was over 18 and it was consensual, apparently

Still, that sure sets a low bar.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

64. "Choir Boy" is not all that high a standard

It means you can maybe sing a little.

There is no automatic moral high ground there. The bar is low.

From the bozo in the second row, pretending to sing.

[Behind the Aegis]

65. ....

That is what you are primarily doing. Hopefully your message will get through to some, but I don't hold out much hope. When it comes to sexuality, especially homosexuality, people really don't have a clue. If a gay guy has sex with a woman, no one calls him "straight", but a straight guy has sex with a male, and they are automatically gay. It simply doesn't work that way. But it is a complex topic and most can't be bothered to learn about it, much less try and understand the complexities involved.

Fingers crossed. Maybe a few will learn something.

[Kyblue1]

67. Is anyone asking where the former teacher was able to amass a fortune?

[SusanCalvin]

69. Right you are, and thank you for stating it. nt