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Recursion

(56,582 posts)
Sun May 31, 2015, 10:45 AM May 2015

Sanders, unlike anyone else running, voted for the 1994 Violent Crime Control & Law Enforcement Act

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violent_Crime_Control_and_Law_Enforcement_Act

This act banned assault weapons, greatly increased the number of police on the streets and their power, expanded mandatory minimum sentences, and vastly expanded the war on drugs.

Sanders voted for it.

Clinton didn't vote for it, because she was not in Congress. She was First Lady, and she advocated for it, using a quote that is currently a high-rated OP.

O'Malley didn't vote for it, because he was a Baltimore city council member at that point. But later as mayor and governor he enforced it.

That said, one and only one person running for the Democratic nomination today voted for this expansion of police powers and incarceration, and that person was now-Senator Sanders.
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Sanders, unlike anyone else running, voted for the 1994 Violent Crime Control & Law Enforcement Act (Original Post) Recursion May 2015 OP
Kinf of nit-picky, given that you admit Clinton advocated for it, but ok. Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2015 #1
I'm leaning O'Malley Recursion May 2015 #2
My apologies. That makes more sense anyway. Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2015 #21
Recursion has been making this specious argument all day. Wilms May 2015 #11
Here's some more votes and stances he has taken on the issue of criminal justice, peecoolyour May 2015 #3
I like the full picture. nt LWolf May 2015 #4
pathetic. he voted for an assault weapons ban cali May 2015 #5
And Clinton advocated *for the same bill* and is being excoriated for it here Recursion May 2015 #6
Pathetic? LOL. Actually this OP is a response to the 70+ rec OP that is bashing Hillary for DanTex May 2015 #13
This is kind of funny OKNancy May 2015 #7
Isn't this your second post on the SAME subject matter this fine a.m. or does it just SEEM that way? AzDar May 2015 #8
The limit comes later in the primary season, judging by 2008 Recursion May 2015 #9
Situation was difft back then. hollowdweller May 2015 #10
So (D)s are now against banning assault weapons? Motown_Johnny May 2015 #12
Exactly, thank you Recursion May 2015 #14
Odd isn't it. ucrdem May 2015 #19
I'm unaware that anyone has criticized Hillary for her gun control policies. JDPriestly May 2015 #23
Yup. A tale of two DUs. DanTex May 2015 #15
Too bad...most of DU has blinders these days and can't admit joeybee12 May 2015 #16
Bernie also has not been a progression on gun manufacturer and control legislation... Sancho May 2015 #17
More popcorn nadinbrzezinski May 2015 #18
It banned assault weapons. Thank you for pointing out he is the only candidate to vote for that. HooptieWagon May 2015 #20
Desperate attempt to find something wrong with Bernie Sanders. JDPriestly May 2015 #22

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
1. Kinf of nit-picky, given that you admit Clinton advocated for it, but ok.
Sun May 31, 2015, 10:49 AM
May 2015

Congrats, you've found another reason to bolster your choice to vote for Clinton instead of Sanders.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
2. I'm leaning O'Malley
Sun May 31, 2015, 10:52 AM
May 2015

I love how you just make up this idea that I'm a Clinton supporter. Does that make things easier for you, to just imagine what other people think?

 

peecoolyour

(336 posts)
3. Here's some more votes and stances he has taken on the issue of criminal justice,
Sun May 31, 2015, 10:53 AM
May 2015

so we have the full picture:

Voted YES on funding for alternative sentencing instead of more prisons.
Voted NO on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime.
Voted YES on maintaining right of habeas corpus in Death Penalty Appeals.
Voted NO on making federal death penalty appeals harder.
Voted YES on replacing death penalty with life imprisonment.

Rated 78% by CURE, indicating pro-rehabilitation crime votes.
More funding and stricter sentencing for hate crimes.
Require DNA testing for all federal executions.
Reduce recidivism by giving offenders a Second Chance.

http://www.ontheissues.org/Domestic/Bernie_Sanders_Crime.htm

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
5. pathetic. he voted for an assault weapons ban
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:00 AM
May 2015

And lookie lookie who's pushing this crap, why the Cameron's who were screeching that he was responsible for thousands of deaths because he was against gun control.


Here's more on that legislation: it provided funds for prison services, alternative sentencing for juveniles, increased sentences for sexual offenders and increased assistance to victims of sexual assault.
http://ballotpedia.org/Bernie_Sanders_presidential_campaign,_2016?gclid=Cj0KEQjw4qqrBRDE2K_z7Pbvjo8BEiQA39AImQwYM9Hxx-ert__ZI5KhSgjjAbmdYzGN_tWFoB3nGj8aAnNC8P8HAQ

http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Bernie_Sanders_Crime.htm

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
6. And Clinton advocated *for the same bill* and is being excoriated for it here
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:01 AM
May 2015
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6750883

Sorry, fair is fair. I didn't start this, Cali.

Christ, I'm not even a Clinton supporter and this shit is making me stand up for her.

DanTex

(20,709 posts)
13. Pathetic? LOL. Actually this OP is a response to the 70+ rec OP that is bashing Hillary for
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:00 PM
May 2015

supporting the exact same bill that Bernie voted for. If there's a better definition of "hypocrisy" than complaining about this while bashing Hillary for supporting precisely the same thing, I haven't come across it.

OKNancy

(41,832 posts)
7. This is kind of funny
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:02 AM
May 2015

Here is the deal... a lot of things have changed since 1994.
Sanders and Hillary Clinton are both allowed to change their views as society changes.

What's that expression? “A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines."

I get what you are trying to point out here. It's kind of hypocritical for some people to pull out old votes, views or stances from 20,30 or even 40 years ago and write: neener neener, your candidate is xxxx

 

AzDar

(14,023 posts)
8. Isn't this your second post on the SAME subject matter this fine a.m. or does it just SEEM that way?
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:03 AM
May 2015

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
9. The limit comes later in the primary season, judging by 2008
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:06 AM
May 2015

I was just appalled by the Kafka-esque nature of an OP lambasting Clinton for supporting a bill that Sanders actually voted for.

 

hollowdweller

(4,229 posts)
10. Situation was difft back then.
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:35 AM
May 2015

Crime rate was higher. We'd just been going thru the crack epidemic.

Republicans were painting democrats as soft on crime, buzzwords about criminals "Getting off on a Technicality". Police with their "hands tied behind their back" "Liberal Judges" letting criminals off. Right before Clinton, Bush had kicked Dukakis ass using Willie Horton ads about a criminal set free to create crime again and highlighting Dukakis being a member of the ACLU which is code word for being soft on crime.

Dems responded by getting tougher on crime. We can argue the reasons but the crime rate has drastically fallen, but more police and stricter enforcement is at least part of it.

However just like the cutting of taxes and regulations, that helped with inflation and the economy, back then situations change. You just can't keep doing the same thing over and over when your problems are different and expect no negative results.

It's the republicans who are wedded to ideology and unable to be flexible in legislation when conditions require difft actions, not democrats.
 

Motown_Johnny

(22,308 posts)
12. So (D)s are now against banning assault weapons?
Sun May 31, 2015, 11:56 AM
May 2015

I guess I missed that memo.

Also missed out on the fact that we are against the Violence Against Women Act and the Driver's Privacy Protection Act.

Silly me. I will try to pay closer attention.



For the sarcasm impaired >>------->



This is a crazy argument. There were bad things in that bill, there were good things in that bill. With 20 years of hindsight it is easy to attack that vote. I think both Hillary and Bernie supporters should just let this one go. There are plenty of real arguments to be had, we don't need to resort to this.


Recursion

(56,582 posts)
14. Exactly, thank you
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:03 PM
May 2015

It's crazy to charge either Clinton or Sanders for supporting it. But somehow this defense only comes out for Sanders.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
23. I'm unaware that anyone has criticized Hillary for her gun control policies.
Sun May 31, 2015, 04:24 PM
May 2015

Do you have links to posts criticizing her on that account? I don't think it is from the Sanders side. Please provide links.

DanTex

(20,709 posts)
15. Yup. A tale of two DUs.
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:04 PM
May 2015

OP: Hillary supported the 1994 Crime Bill
DU: Rec! She's Horrible! Mass incarceration is all her fault!

OP: Bernie supported the 1994 Crime Bill
DU: Unrec! How dare you! Times were different back then! It's not a simple issue!

 

joeybee12

(56,177 posts)
16. Too bad...most of DU has blinders these days and can't admit
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:04 PM
May 2015

There are some things Bernie did wrong...he's the latest DU God, not a human, just like Liz until it finally hit home that she wasn't running...it's pretty amusing seeing the responses from Bernie's true believers...I'm just glad Bernie has a thicker skin than his supporters do.

Sancho

(9,060 posts)
17. Bernie also has not been a progression on gun manufacturer and control legislation...
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:14 PM
May 2015
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2015/05/bernie_sanders_on_guns_vermont_independent_voted_against_gun_control_for.html

But before liberal Democrats flock to Sanders, they should remember that the Vermont senator stands firmly to Clinton’s right on one issue of overwhelming importance to the Democratic base: gun control. During his time in Congress, Sanders opposed several moderate gun control bills. He also supported the most odious NRA–backed law in recent memory—one that may block Sandy Hook families from winning a lawsuit against the manufacturer of the gun used to massacre their children.

But his voting record paints the picture of a legislator who is both skeptical of gun control and invested in the interests of gun owners—and manufacturers. In 1993, then-Rep. Sanders voted against the Brady Act, which mandated federal background checks for gun purchasers and restricted felons’ access to firearms. As a senator, Sanders supported bills to allow firearms in checked bags on Amtrak trains and block funding to any foreign aid organization that registered or taxed Americans’ guns. Sanders is dubious that gun control could help prevent gun violence, telling one interviewer after Sandy Hook that “if you passed the strongest gun control legislation tomorrow, I don’t think it will have a profound effect on the tragedies we have seen.”
------------------
Unlike the 1994 Act, this is one bill that is difficult to understand after Sandy Hook.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
18. More popcorn
Sun May 31, 2015, 12:19 PM
May 2015


Quietly munches on it. Entertaining.

(And instead of looking at one vote, people should be looking at the whole policy that has led to mass incarceration and where these people are. And I mean every clown running, I don't care what letter is behind their name.)

Now pass more of this

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
22. Desperate attempt to find something wrong with Bernie Sanders.
Sun May 31, 2015, 04:21 PM
May 2015

And it is a big fail.

Bernie Sanders opposes the for-profit prison system.

In 1994, we needed more money in law enforcement. Today, we need fewer people in prison.

And what we need least of all are for-profit prisons.

I'm with Bernie on this one.

And getting rid of AK-47s? Who needs them? You don't use them to hung. They couldn't do much to defend against a drone. They are basically dangerous playthings. I don't want them in my neighborhood. I don't want them next door to my grandchildren. They serve no purpose outside of a military context. Maybe some police forces need them in case of an invasion. That's about it.

I'm with Bernie on this one.

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