Players suing NFL over head trauma. Are they saying the league knew this was happening?

[Logical]

If the league was hiding proof that the players were getting hear trauma then I understand it.

But if not, then how is the league at fault?

I would assume the players knew the game was dangerous, but were willing to risk if for the large amount of money they made playing the game.

[bigtree]

1. how could they not know?

Of course, there is willful ignorance.

[Lionessa]

5. Curious though how the NFL knowing makes them liable.

The players had to know too. Again, unless the NFL somehow kept them from talking to their doctors or some such thing. Seriously, this isn't a new issue, it is prevalent in other sports as well. Should boxers also be suing the boxing authority (sorry don't know the anagram for boxing sport)?

[bigtree]

12. well, we're really talking about fellows right out of college, in many cases

They say the league either downplayed the dangers or didn't present the recruits with adequate information (that they are presumed to have had) to make their own judgment.

A lot of what these players really want (outside of money) is to affect NFL policy, as well as provide for the rehabilitation of those retired players affected.

[Lionessa]

13. Well I guess I don't have the proper level of sympathy today.

I just don't see how the players can claim ignorance, even if their careers started through believing NFL presentations, sooner or later a doctor would've informed them of the truth, if not, then the doctors are whom they need to sue. I can't see suing the NFL for bad medical advice when they don't claim to be doctors.

[obxhead]

2. There is a difference between them knowing it's dangerous

and being involved in a situation where the opponent is intentionally trying to injure you.

[Lionessa]

3. I agree. Unless the NFL somehow had only their medical professionals

looking at injured players, and those medical professionals were induced or chose to lie in order to get the player back on the field.... The NFL knowing the risk doesn't exclude the players from knowing the risk, nor does it make them liable. I'm curious what they believe the NFL was supposed to do about it, fire people with x number of concussions?

I guess if there was equipment that could've stopped or mitigated injury and the NFL forbade its use or something. Otherwise I don't get it.

[tammywammy]

4. They're saying the NFL hid evidence of concussions leading to permanent damage

"Former Atlanta Falcons running back Jamal Anderson and linebacker Jessie Tuggle, who helped take the "Dirty Birds" to Super Bowl XXXIII, are among 114 professional football players and their wives who sued the National Football League on Thursday as part of expanding national litigation centered around traumatic brain injuries.

The suit, filed in the Northern District of Georgia in Atlanta, is expected to be transferred to U.S. District Court in Philadelphia, where it will become part of multi-district litigation that includes suits filed on behalf of more than 1,500 current and former football players. All claim that for years the NFL concealed evidence linking concussions that players sustained during games to permanent brain damage."
http://www.law.com/jsp/cc/PubArticleCC.jsp?id=1202551833887&114_Football_Players_Wives_Sue_NFL_Over_Head_Injuries

Even as the great, sad Junior Seau killed himself, more and more other old football players are joining in class action to sue the National Football League. They're claiming, generally, that while the NFL understood — for years — how vulnerable its players were to head injuries, the league did not sufficiently warn players about the danger of concussions.

Nor did the teams first do no harm — instead, allowing players to go back into games when they should have been kept out of the action.

The league, of course, is backpedaling furiously to try to show that it now stands foursquare behind safety even, undeniably, as the players get faster and bigger and therefore more liable to concussions all the time. Like it or not, that is the nature of the game we Americans so love.
http://www.npr.org/2012/05/09/152250525/mind-games-football-and-head-injuries

The latest lawsuit, filed by attorney Mike McGlamry in Atlanta's U.S. District Court, states the NFL "repeatedly refuted the connection between concussions and brain injury" and "downplayed and misrepresented the issues, and misled the players concerning the risks associated with concussions."

Similar suits against the NFL have been consolidated for a trial in Philadelphia, but no trial date has been set, the news service said.

The filing in Atlanta cites scientific evidence connecting concussions and Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy, a neurodegenerative disease that results in memory loss, mood swings and symptoms similar to Alzheimer's disease. It points out CTE can only be diagnosed after a patient's death, and 12 cases of CTE have been detected in deceased former players.
Read more: http://www.upi.com/Sports_News/2012/05/03/More-players-sue-NFL-over-concussions/UPI-41961336064266/#ixzz1ulmjSmaj

[Lionessa]

8. The information has been out there. What were the players doing relying on the NFL instead of their

doctors to inform them of this? Makes no sense to me at all.

Hiding facts that have been known for a long time?? it has been called punch drunk. I've known about it through the boxing term for those that have been hit in the head so much they are essentially permanently drunk-a-like.

Sounds to me that a bunch of football players are trying to shift their personal responsibility onto the NFL.

[Johonny]

20. The average career is 3.5 years

A player comes out of college, by the time he understands what the pro-game is about he is likely injured, waved, or replace by a cheaper new young guy. In a lot of professions young people tend to have less experience than older players, but you have the 20-40 year guys that can tell you what's what. The young people might not listen to them but they are around. Their are a lot of old retired football players out there and they are not relying on the NFL and have been since the 80s talking about life after football. The NFL is in general filled with young inexperienced men that by the time they understand what is happening to them are ex-players. Prior to the 80s, the NFL while a violent sport was not exactly the huge money making industry it is today. Players in general worked other jobs in the off season and were not as organized as ex-players today. Once again thanks to the money and the union the ex-players are vastly more organized than ever and have been able to re-enforce among themselves they aren't the only ones with these problems. Once the shared plight of these ex-players was understood, that's when they were able to push the injury issue. Young people once again generally think they will live forever, are indestructible, and know everything. It is no surprise this is coming from the older, wiser and finally organized ex-players.

[JonLP24]

23. At-least one example of a crooked doctor

From Publishers Weekly
Huizenga joined the L.A. Raiders in 1983 as the team internist and resigned in 1990, disillusioned at the way pro football, and the Raiders in particular, treated, or failed to treat, players' medical problems. The title was the tag line of his orthopedic colleague, Robert Rosenfeld, who used it with virtually every injured athlete and winked at the use of all sorts of pills by team members. While president of the NFL Physicians' Association, Huizenga campaigned against the use of anabolic steroids, but his proposal to ban them was quietly squelched by the owners in 1992. Here he continues the battle by detailing the case of Lyle Alzado, an ex-Raider who died in 1992 from, among other causes, decades-long use of muscle builders. The author has suggestions for making football less lethal but seems pessimistic about their adoption. A shocker, a sort of Ball Four about the grid game.
Copyright 1994 Reed Business Information, Inc. --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title.
From Library Journal
What young, sports-minded doctor would turn down an opportunity to work for the Los Angeles Raiders? Huizenga certainly couldn't. He was the team internist from 1983 to 1990. While mastering the arcane skills of sports medicine in the raw, Huizenga discovered the prevalence of drug, alcohol, and steroid abuse in the National Football League and the extent to which good medicine takes a back seat to the good of the team. His personal crusade for medical care that emphasizes health led to a clash with a team orthopedist, who dismissed a player's potentially life-threatening physical condition with the comment that became the book's title. Management backed the orthopedist. This doctor's view of the inner workings of the Raider organization and the NFL will entertain readers while providing the average fan with a better understanding of football. Recommended for popular sports collections.
--Terry Madden, Boise State Univ. Lib., Id.
Copyright 1994 Reed Business Information, Inc. --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title.

http://www.amazon.com/Youre-Its-Just-Bruise-Outrageous/dp/0312136277

[Brickbat]

6. Yes, they are saying that.

From the retirees suit:

"The NFL knew as early as the 1920's of the harmful effects on a player's brain of concussions; however, until June of 2010 they concealed these facts from coaches, trainers, players and the public." ... The suit claims the NFL commissioned a study in 1994, titled "NFL Committee on Mild Traumatic Brain Injury" and published a report in 2004, concluding there was "no evidence of worsening injury or chronic cumulative effects" from multiple concussions.

Source: http://www.nbcchicago.com/blogs/grizzly-detail/75-Retired-Players-Sue-NFL-Over-Concussions-125891553.html#ixzz1ulmAIK6W

[Logical]

7. But then WHO knew? One guy? All the executives. Many NFL leaders were players....

also. Did they hide it also?

[JonLP24]

9. The lawsuits are more than that

One is the impact of concussions is better understood these days and your first sentence is one thing the lawsuits will find out. Another point of contention is how the league handled players w/ a concussion or any injury. Usually it was "get back out there". You can't deny that was the culture of the NFL and still is to some extent.

I remember in 2003 Denver was playing against San Diego during week 2. Plummer got injured, went to the locker room and came back out. It was said that he suffered a concussion. He finished out the drive in which they scored their third TD in the first half then Buerlein came out there. After the game it was revealed he actually had a tear or something in his shoulder but Shanahan claimed it was a concussion so players wouldn't target his shoulder. That is one obvious case where the player went out there (and when you consider it was claimed to be a concussion and still went out there and not be a problem (now it is) is a sign of how the league handled it when it came up). It was also the same week Shanahan packed the Broncos white jerseys which forced San Diego to wear the dark jerseys in September.

Also a topic is if/how will the league pay for former players with mounting medical bills and lifetime of memory, cognitive, emotional, & behavior problems due to the head injuries?

[Logical]

11. I wonder if players should sign a contract before playing. Like a waiver when I go jet skiing? It...

seems to me like players know the risks are great!

[JonLP24]

14. Oh my

If coaches are telling hurt players to go back out and play you don't see the problem?

Construction is dangerous but if I get hurt performing my duties I fully expect my job to pay for it.

[Logical]

15. Well, the players could say no. Just like if my boss says to come in sick, I can say no. But...

I know they might replace them with another player. No different than my job.

[Brickbat]

16. Construction and mining are good comparisons to make to help people understand what's going on.

Obviously people know that mining and construction are dangerous. It's just like Black Lung.

[tammywammy]

19. Not only coaches, but team doctors.... n/t

[Blue_Tires]

10. not only did the league know, they denied it was even a problem for a long time...

[JackRiddler]

17. No, the league was the only entity in the world not to know

that repeated concussions cause brain damage.

[justiceischeap]

18. And you hear retired athletes talking about

being put into games while having concussions just so the team could win a game.

I know these athletes make a conscious choice to do what they do to themselves but a player can't really tell a coach that he can't/won't play because there would be repercussions.

[CreekDog]

21. the NFL did a study about it and hid the results

[11 Bravo]

22. I am friends with a couple of former Washington Redskins. The players' complaint is ...

that the league was aware of the dangers of concussive injuries, but minimized and in some cases completely hid those risks in the information they gave to the players.

[Politicalboi]

24. I didn't know

Cigarettes were dangerous. LOL! How could they not know. Football can be dangerous, they make a shit load of money for chasing a ball, and now they complain.

[JonLP24]

25. Roofing can be dangerous as well

if I get hurt doing my job, I expect my employer to pay or I would sue.

There has been a few mentions of the money the players made but the organization they're suing made a lot of money as well.

[frylock]

26. just the type of ill informed, compassionless response one can expect around here anymore..

maybe anyone with a hazardous occupation should think twice about what they're doing to make a living. then when your roof needs to be repaired or replaced, you can drag your ass up there and do it.

[Logical]

28. NFL players make millions. They knew the risk. Most pissed away their money. n-t

[frylock]

32. the average career is 3.5 years..

and WTF does pissing away money have to do with on-the-job safety? the issue here is the NFL covering up the results of their study. you getting your ass kicked by jocks, or being selected last in sports shouldn't even come into effect. you either support worker's rights or you don't.

[Elwood P Dowd]

27. Not all the players make "a shit load of money".

The average career is less than 4 years. Many of these players are working for league minimum or spending much of their time making even less on practice squads.

"Chasing a ball"? That's a closer description to soccer than NFL football.

[Zalatix]

30. The players are still workers. I generally side with the workers.

The team owners make a shitload more money than football players. Most players don't make millions.

The median salary is respectable, but still under a million a year.
http://content.usatoday.com/sportsdata/football/nfl/salaries/team

I'm in favor of finding out whether the NFL knows there are safer ways to play football and they're ignoring it.

[cthulu2016]

29. The league knowing would not be required for negligence

I am not defending or criticizing the suit itself. Just saying, in answer to your question, that ignorance is not a blanket defense when negligence is alleged.

"We made our employees drink mystery goop. We didn't know it was poisonous."

One assesses the reasonable care one would take before requiring people to drink mystery goop. Should a reasonable person have know what was in it? What steps would a reasonable person have taken to find out> And so on.

[aikoaiko]

31. I'm waiting for more facts to be made known before judging.

They are saying that the NFL shirked their responsibilities which led to long-term injuries, but like you I am also incredulous.