Zimmerman Medical Report Shows Broken Nose, Lacerations After Trayvon Martin Shooting

[Cave_Johnson]

A medical report compiled by the family physician of accused Trayvon Martin murderer George Zimmerman and obtained exclusively by ABC News found that Zimmerman was diagnosed with a "closed fracture" of his nose, a pair of black eyes, two lacerations to the back of his head and a minor back injury the day after he fatally shot Martin during an alleged altercation.

--snip--

The morning after the shooting, on Feb. 27, Zimmerman sought treatment at the offices of a general physician at a family practice near Sanford, Fla. The doctor notes Zimmerman sought an appointment to get legal clearance to return to work.

The record shows that Zimmerman also suffered bruising in the upper lip and cheek and lower back pain. The two lacerations on the back of his head, one of them nearly an inch long, the other about a quarter-inch long, were first revealed in photos obtained exclusively by ABC News last month.

But the report also shows Zimmerman declined hospitalization the night of the shooting, and then declined the advice of his doctor to make a follow-up appointment with an ear nose and throat doctor.

In addition to his physical injuries, Zimmerman complained of stress and "occasional nausea when thinking about the violence." But he was not diagnosed with a concussion. The doctor noted that it was "imperative" that Zimmerman "be seen with [sic] his psychologist for evaluation."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-medical-report-sheds-light-injuries-trayvon/story?id=16353532#.T7NzN-u3ed4

___________________________________________

Can't decide if this is Zimmerman's personal family doctor or just a family doctor at a clinic based on the first paragraph

[I owe a]

1. hmmm

The doctor noted that it was "imperative" that Zimmerman "be seen with his psychologist for evaluation."

[uponit7771]

2. "...compiled by the family physician..." where's emt report

[vaberella]

47. Thank you. n/t

[ProgressiveProfessor]

81. Still being withheld by the state

[I owe a]

3. Return to work?

The doctor notes Zimmerman sought an appointment to get legal clearance to return to work.

Return to work? Thought he was unemployed? I hope this doe not mean as a captain of neighborhood watch :p

[The Wizard]

4. Fraud

The video of him arriving at the police station belies the report from an examination allegedly on the following day. The doctor opened himself up for cross examination. A good lawyer should be able to rip him a new asshole.

[madokie]

5. This is a family doctor who needs his license jerked

[NYC_SKP]

6. Yup. nt.

[badtoworse]

7. For what reason?

[madokie]

12. For being bought off and lying his ass off

I seen the video at the police station, I read the report where he refused medical treatment. I also read that he wasn't seen for about a month after the murder so How can you question what I said with a straight face

This doctor is a fraud and I'm sure he will be shown to be such as this trial progresses

[customerserviceguy]

15. I'm sure the prosecution

will have someone who is an expert at medical diagnoses from poorly focused video, like you are.

Really, folks, does anyone here think a doctor would put a medical license on the line for this? Unless the cops were extremely incompetant in a case involving a dead person, they had some reasons for not arresting GZ the night of the shooting, or even a few days after. We're about to see their reasoning, and we'll be able to Monday-morning quarterback it as it comes out. Ever since this case became a national issue, I've felt that it was going to turn out to be a disappointment for those who quickly were willing to hang GZ.

[madokie]

17. Daddy

comes to mind as an answer to you

And yes there has many doctors who have lost their license over shit like this. Money talks bullshit walks.

[Bacchus4.0]

33. well then the prosecution will have no problem discrediting the doctor and report then n/t

s

[Bake]

30. Oh, yeah. I'm SURE the cops had a good reason ...

Just like they had a good reason for beating that homeless guy TO DEATH.

Just like they had a good reason to shove a broom handle up Amadou Diallo's rear end.

Just like they had a good reason to taser a grandmother over a traffic stop.

Just like they always have a good reason.

Pathetic. Simply pathetic.

Bake

[Baitball Blogger]

89. I know lawyers who made careers in this County based on their ability to lie.

Their supporters always say the same thing. He's a lawyer. He wouldn't risk his license. Well, you're right there. That's because the Florida Bar is crap and because around here people get bullied to shut them up.

I wouldn't use standard reasoning when it comes to professional licenses around here.

[customerserviceguy]

126. Comparing doctors to lawyers?

I guess you think of them in the same way. I know I don't, and I suspect most people feel that way, too.

There are a lot more lawyer-whores out there who will defend any position or defendent for a fee than there are doctor-whores who will pump up the Elvis Presleys and Michael Jacksons of the world full of drugs for money.

[Baitball Blogger]

138. I can only go by my experiences.

And, yes, I've been harmed by a core group of Florida doctors who refused to admit that the primary physician's initial prescription created far more damage to my gastro system than they wanted to admit. Because they refused to make the proper diagnosis I would spend years trying to determine my own diagnosis. We even moved away from the area to find more competent doctors. So, I know for a fact that Florida's regulatory system is so flawed that it accepts casualties among its residents. They spend more time trying to diminish the lives of their victims, than they do challenging the status quo that continues the dysfunctionality.

Our whole world took a turn for the worst the day that Ralph Nadar stopped being a consumer protection specialist in order to sabotage the democratic candidate for president.

BTW, when a person loses that kind of trust in a system, it's lost for a lifetime. That is why I am here today.

[nadinbrzezinski]

91. You forgot the detective recommended arrest that night

And was overruled by the DA.

As to CSS, this ain't tv...my local pd, larger than Sanford, does not have a dedicated unit. Get's worst, it was shoddy police work, not even tape was placed around the scene and we know scene canvassing was mostly not done, and witnesses were coached.

As to the doctor...12+ hours...yup, somebody could break a nose that wasn't.

[badtoworse]

19. Armchair CSI? Why don't you just go down and take over the prosecution since you're such an expert?

I'll wait to see what comes out in the trial. I've had the kinds of injuries he was diagnosed with lots of times growing up and they're not always immediately apparent. If he had black eyes the next day, do you think the doctor is the only witness than can corroborate that?

[madokie]

109. Don't you think the asswipe would have let it be known then if that was true

you seem to forget that we didn't see hide nor hair of this murderer for weeks after the murder. This would have been his best defense if it was true so It is a fucking lie and you are, well I'll stop at that. I'm sure you can figure out the rest

[badtoworse]

111. I'm not surprised that no one saw Zimmerman for weeks.

To be seen in public would not have helped him nor would publicizing his injuries. There will likely be numerous people that can testify about the bruising and swelling on his face. The prosecution will probably stipulate that the injuries were apparent the next day.

In another news report, it seems that the coroner did find that Trayvon had injuries on his knuckles. The reality is that the two probably were fighting.

The problem is that you and many others on DU are convinced that Zimmerman just shot Trayvon in cold blood and don't want to deal with anything that might point to a different scenario. I still have an open mind and want to see what comes out in the trial.

[madokie]

112. Of course you're not surprised

You've been defending him for a while now. Shocked I tell ya', shocked I am.
Oh and the problem is you, not me and the others who have been following this murderer since he murdered a 16 year old kid in cold blood.

[badtoworse]

114. How am I defending him?

Waiting for all the facts to come out before drawing a conclusion is defending him?

[madokie]

115. Thats all I've read from you on this

You're not waiting for shit you are defending the murderer and its pretty damn obvious.

[badtoworse]

117. How about some examples?

[madokie]

118. Read what you've posted so far EOM

[pipoman]

21. What a jump..

holy cow...it intrigues me when people state such assumptive silliness as fact..

[magical thyme]

34. you have zero evidence that the doctor is a fraud

Just like Zimmy will have zero evidence proving that Trayvon inflicted any and/or all those injuries and that some of those injuries couldn't have happened after the murder.

I'm guessing there isn't one set time when bruises surface. I've had deep tissue bruises surface months after a severe injury...and other bruises appear within minutes.

Prove that somebody else didn't give him black eyes and break his nose.

[pipoman]

59. Has anyone seen the contents of the investigating

and first arrival officers reports? Even if a person declines medical attention the officers should have looked him over and reported their findings, further they would include any statements or complaints about pains he made. Until we know if the injuries he sustained happened at the time or after, we are all speculating. I suspect the police did note superficial injuries and this is a reason they believed he was acting defensively. Even if he sustained injury doesn't mean he acted lawfully, but there are a million guesses what happened until we know the whole story/see the evidence.

[magical thyme]

69. there is an emt report from on-site, portions of it were public

It stated "minor injuries" as I recall. Obviously the full report will be available. Portions of the police report have also been published and it does note he was bleeding from his nose and the back of his head.

He declined to go to the hospital at the time.

There are also public statements made by his father about how Trayvon supposedly slammed his head repeatedly into the concrete sidewalk and from his brother about how he was close to spending his life sipping food through a straw.

His injuries do not seem sufficient to support those descriptions, and do leave one wondering why they would make such wild claims. I would not be surprised if an enraged father beat him up after the fact, and then used the results to support the SYG defense.

[madokie]

110. A broken nose is apparent immediately

Blood is everywhere and this murderer is not bloody when they take him to the police station. I call bullshit on this whole premise that you're on about.

[magical thyme]

119. then you have no idea what my premise is

Aside from the fact that there is not always heavy bleeding and the police report states that he was bleeding from his nose.

What I am saying is that nothing proves that his father or brother or a friend didn't break his nose AFTER he killed Trayvon and was released from the police station.

The doctor the next day may well have found a broken nose. There was AT LEAST TWELVE HOURS AFTER HE LEFT THE POLICE STATION AND BEFORE HE WENT TO THE DOCTOR WHEN ANYBODY COULD HAVE BROKEN HIS NOSE. HELL, HE COULD HAVE SLAMMED HIS FACE INTO A DOOR AND BROKEN IT WITHOUT ANY HELP.

Get it yet?

The presence or absence of a broken nose the next day makes no difference. Only radiographs taken immediately after the murder, and before he was released, would have supported his claim.

[slackmaster]

129. That's not always the case, madokie. When I broke my nose in 2005 there was almost no external...

...bleeding. There was no obvious deformation of my nose. My doctor ordered a CAT scan to see what was going on.

Two days later I looked like a raccoon.

[madokie]

130. I've not had a broken nose

so I can't speak in the first person. I've broken a nose and my son had his broken twice playing basketball and they all bleed profusely. Mybad that I took it that every time it was. Black eyes I've had and they started showing almost immediately

[slackmaster]

131. There's still time. My method worked quite well.

Have a violent coughing fit while seated in a chair. Lose consciousness briefly, fall forward, and do a face-plant on a terrazzo tile floor.

Works great!

[madokie]

136. Time is running out for me though as I'm 64

Probably not many more years left in my old bod

[MrSlayer]

8. Why? Zimmerman had someone beat him up.

After he left the police station, if that video is accurate. I don't doubt the doctor, I doubt him.

[badtoworse]

10. That might be hard to prove

The only injury that would necessarily show up in the video are the cuts to the back of the head. Swelling and bruising would likely not be apparent until later. Don't know about the broken nose.

[sarge43]

11. A broken nose bleeds ... a lot. As do scalp lacerations.

At any time a quarter of our blood supply is in our head. Cut, crush or bruise veins in the head and that fact becomes evident very quickly.

Where's the EMT report? Was Zimmerman even examined on site? With those alleged injuries there was potential for concussion, internal bleeding, even brain injury. An untreated concussion can be fatal.

As usual this report just raises more questions.

[madokie]

13. The couple times I've had a black eye it was apparent almost immediately.

You are totally wrong on this one but then again bad to worse kinda explains that. Doesn't it?
I accidentally broke a kids nose on the bus once in Junior high school and in ten minutes it was obvious that he had a broken nose and two black eyes. Before he even got off the bus.
fail

[Cave_Johnson]

18. That's you...

For whatever reason, it takes a baseball bat or more to bruise me. When I do bruise it shows up 24-36 hours later...

That's me...

edit: Same for black eyes...

[badtoworse]

20. That has been my experience as well.

[laundry_queen]

38. Same here.

I never bruise. I mean punch to the face, 85 mph fastball on the bare shin, slapshot to the arm no bruise. I swell though. And it hurts like a bruise hurts (the few times I have bruised). No bruising when I had my wisdom teeth out. I *did* bruise at my IV site with one of my c-sections. It was so memorable that I had a bruise, that I remember it clearly, LOL.

My nose doesn't bleed either. Some guys on our senior boys volleyball team spiked right into my nose (I was standing under the net, it was between games in a tourney, i was on the girls team) and no blood. At all. I played a lot of shinny hockey back when no one wore helmets and got a lot of sticks in the nose. No blood. I have 4 kids and ask anyone who has kids how many times they've been head butted in the nose by a jumping toddler. Sinus problems, yes. Blood, no.

SO not defending GZ - I don't care if all this crap is TRUE (and I don't think it is) it still does not give one a reason to kill a 17 year old. Period. But I AM saying, it's possible to never bruise and have a nose that doesn't bleed. I'm a freak of nature that way I suppose.

[obamanut2012]

24. I have had both black eyes and a broken nose

The swelling and bruising begins immediately. IMMEDIATELY.

And, even a casual viewer of boxing or MMA knows I'm not the only one.

[jwirr]

40. I hit my nose on my granddaughters head when I tripped and it was also swelling immediately.

[obamanut2012]

93. Exactly

[mythology]

83. Experts disagree with you

For example, the below from the Mayo Clinic. Perhaps they just haven't watched enough MMA.

Signs and symptoms of a broken nose may appear immediately or may take up to three days to develop. Signs and symptoms may include:

Pain or tenderness, especially when touching your nose
Swelling of your nose and surrounding areas
Bleeding from your nose
Bruising around your nose or eyes
Crooked or misshapen nose
Difficulty breathing through your nose
Discharge of mucus from your nose (rhinorrhea)
Feeling that one or both of your nasal passages are blocked

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/broken-nose/ds00992/dsection=symptoms

This doesn't prove or disprove the claim made by Zimmerman, but that's for a court and jury to decide.

[nadinbrzezinski]

88. Hmm in ten years of EMS the least

damaged nose still was pretty swollen within twenty minutes

We had one that did not bleed, was the fourth or fifth break in patient's life. On the other hand the racoon's eyes, the black eyes, and the swelling were obvious by the time we got to the ER. It was a boxing match, we were standing by. Oh that timeline was within half an hour.

Oh and the scalp bleeds.

[badtoworse]

107. Your experience is irrelevant, as is mine which is different.

I played some hockey in school, saw plenty of head injuries and had a few myself. They usually bleed a lot, but not always and sometimes the swelling takes a while.

There will be all kinds of expert testimony and radiology presented as evidence, but I doubt anyone will be able to definitively state that Zimmerman's injuries were not caused by Trayvon. Considering that the coroner's report says that Trayvon had injuries to his knuckles, it seems likely to me that the two of them were in fact fighting.

[nadinbrzezinski]

137. Yup, and I know you or I could not sit in that jury

Which is a good thing.

[Bake]

31. My first question was, hmmm, who did Zippy get to punch him?

A sympathetic neighbor?

Maybe he did it himself with his pistol.

Bake

[ProgressiveProfessor]

87. Fairly preposterous claim to make

I think that the family doctor is not going to hang it out for Zimmerman. What would be his motivations. The Zimmerman family is not the Rockefellers, Duponts, or Kennedys. Not near enough funds to buy witnesses like that.

My expectation is that it will be a tightly documented package that should be close to unassailable.
- Observations
- Imaging and a report by a radiologist (if done)
- Treatment prescribed/recommendations given
- Followup care

All it will do is document the injuries and the severity. I don't think it will really change things in a major way the way a lack of injuries would have.

[sarge43]

9. This was a potential homicide and the cops let him decline immediate medical examination?

In other words, let evidence walk away. Where are the photos of those injuries? He sure didn't look beaten up on that police station surveillance cam.

[Solomon]

14. Hope it comes out who beat him up after the incident.

The police video clearly shows he had no injuries.

He may have made things worse for himself.

[geckosfeet]

16. What did Trayvons fists look like? That much facial bruising

must have caused damage to his hands - if he did it - and that is a big if.

[Solomon]

22. The funeral director said there were no signs of trauma

on Trayvon's hands

[B2G]

45. The autopsy says otherwise

SANFORD, Fla. —
WFTV has confirmed that autopsy results show 17-year-old Trayvon Martin had injuries to his knuckles when he died.


http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/autopsy-results-show-trayvon-martin-had-injuries-h/nN6gs/

[Solomon]

120. To a knuckle. Not knuckles. I got abrasions on my knuckles right now. I swear, I didn't

break Zimmerman's nose. And I stand by what the funeral director said. He may have been wrong, but that's what he said. Knuckle. LOL

[Life Long Dem]

23. The doctor did it

He's covering his ass. He and the grandfather in the CIA are in this to cover this up, even though the grandfather has been dead. And the doctor is a quack. And my eyes are better viewing the ABC video than a doctors eyes.

[magical thyme]

35. you don't need no stinkin' x-ray machine to see that broken nose

You have x-ray vision!

[malaise]

25. Didn't see a sign of this in that video from the police station

Fugg these LIARS

[surrealAmerican]

26. Police brutality?

There's video of what he looked like going into the police station, but what about leaving the police station?

[Fawke Em]

27. Who did he go to seek legal clearance to chase after

an unarmed teenager and shoot him in cold blood?

[catbyte]

28. The injuries shouldn't matter, although I think he'll get off

He lost any right to use stand your ground the minute he took off after that kid.

Diane
Anishinaabe in MI & mom to Leo, Sophie, Taz & Nigel, members of Dogs Against Romney, Cat Division
"We ride inside--HISS!”

[HockeyMom]

29. A broken nose justifies shooting somebody?

Is this new criteria? I hope not.

[Oneka]

42. Can be

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_Great_Bodily_Harm

1. scarring2. permanent disfigurement3. broken bones4. Extended hospital stays (in one case "extended" was meant to mean overnight.

.


A broken nose , can be great bodily harm, and would then be justification for use of defensive force, including lethal force.

GBH
Is usually determined on a case by case basis,it will be up to a judge to determine if GZ had received GBH from Trayvon Martin in this case. If a judge finds that Z's injuries constitute GBH, I don't see this prosecution, getting past a SYG hearing.

[spanone]

32. ...and trayvon martin is D E A D.

[RockaFowler]

44. That's it right there

There should be no other explanation.

He killed a young man.

Oh and Trayvon had no bruises on him. I guess he hit Zim with his skittles

[ProgressiveProfessor]

78. Actually he had knuckle injuries, classically indicative that he has hit someone.

Its in the latest released data

[spanone]

128. he also has a bullet hole in him that is classically indicative of being shot dead

[ProgressiveProfessor]

133. It turns out that the knuckle injuries may not have been as extensive as first reported

Data continues to come out in dribbles and drabs...

[WI_DEM]

36. So Zimmerman gets a couple of black eyes when Trayvon 'stands his ground' against this nutty stalker

meanwhile Trayvon is dead.

[spanone]

37. yes, mr zimmerman, it's stressful when you kill someone, isn't it?

[jwirr]

39. Okay - two things - first wouldn't there be exrays that would indicate a break? and once again

since Trayvon was doing nothing wrong didn't he have a right to stand his ground when stalked by a stranger?

[vaberella]

49. Really they take x-rays? Is that the norm?

I figured if he had a broken nose the EMT's wouldn't let him just go home. They would have said he needs to go to the doctor to get that fixed. What he if had factured bone loged some where.

[jwirr]

68. I don't know if they take exrays or not but without one I do not believe them. And I agree if he

had been that injured the police would have demanded he go to the clinic.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

80. The police cannot force anyone to accept treatment

I tend to think that the family doctor is not going to hang it out for Zimmerman and will have a tightly documented package that should be close to unassailable.
- Observations
- Imaging and reports by a radiologist
- Treatment prescribed
- Followup care

All it will do is document the injuries and the severity. I don't think it will really change things in a major way the way a lack of injuries would have.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

79. He can refuse the EMTs as long as he is conscious and coherent

[nadinbrzezinski]

95. And signs an AMA.

I keep waiting for that one to emerge. I'd be shocked if crew did not demand one in the us of a.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

101. Indeed. It is the defining instrument for declining emergency treatment.

[riverwalker]

41. doctor schmoctor

I want to see the report of the paramedics. If they spent only 7 minutes tending to Zimmerman's "wounds" I want to know what they saw at the scene when they assessed him.

[fascisthunter]

43. what a bunch of garbage... he refused medical attention...

...and there was no evidence he suffered any physical abuse. That sick fuck killed an unarmed 17 year-old who he considered shady by his own faulty judgement. He even mitigated the situation by following Trayvon when he had no authority to do so. It's sick and incredible how much phony shit we hear from this kid...

OH to those who claim you don't bruise after a broken nose right away... you are full of shit!

[Cave_Johnson]

46. Sorry you think so...

Pretty easy to call multiple people flat out liars though.

[vaberella]

50. I thought it was a broken nose. That's no joke.

Isn't there immediate signs there is injury? Normally aren't you forced to go to the doctor hospital just in case it could be a more serious injury?

[obamanut2012]

82. I have had a broken nose and black eyes

The former always bleed, and usually swell and bruise pretty quicker. Black eyes? Swelling, bruising and that red, raw flesh look is IMMEDIATE. If you are hit a certain way, under your eye will also "pop," and you'll have a huge gash.

[fascisthunter]

77. pretty easy to murder people too

and defend them. Guess which one is morally reprehensible?

[vaberella]

48. Let's be honest here. Who hasn't asked their family doctor to help them out a few times?

I know, I have. I'm not saying this is not truthful. But let me say that I find it suspect---because I have had experience of getting days off work or delayed college exam I wasn't ready for because of a family doctor.

[B2G]

51. I honestly never have

And your examples are a bit more benign than asking them to alter evidence in a shooting investigation.

[vaberella]

52. Not if the doctor didn't know. It wasn't like the shooting was broadcasted.

The dad didn't know until like a day or two days later. And you're telling me you've never taken a day off work but you needed a doctors note and just asked your local doc to hook you up? Wow, I figured that was a part of life.

[B2G]

55. Nope, I never have.

Probably because I would feel too guilty asking someone to lie for me. But that's just me.

Just curious...is everyone even marginally involved with Zimmerman guilty until proven innocent?

[vaberella]

84. He is innocent of what exactly? The problem is the boy was unarmed and killed.

He's not innocent of killing an unarmed kid. That is evident. Your post does not disprove this. If you claim he killed the kid in self defense. Then you are stating that Stand Your Ground rules, not only apply here but are justified and the kid then deserved to die. Ultimately, Zimmerman felt this hence the reason he did what he did. And if he did do it in self defense and he was justified in the killing, then why did he instigate the confrontation? There is no denying he did considering the boy was closer to his home than Zimmerman was to his car. Secondly why would a kid go back and attack Zimmerman as he claimed, when the boy was on the phone with his girlfriend at the time and the phone records prove that. If the confrontation was instigated...who do you think started it?

From my perspective it is the person with the weapon because he had no need to even follow the boy. He had no reason to even leave his car. He called the police. If there is one entrance into the complex then Zimmerman was located in close distance to that entrance or could have stayed near the entrance until the police showed up.

I need to figure out. What he is innocent for exactly? That you're telling me he's innocent until proven guilty. Is he innocent of Second Degree murder? Then you have a claim of innocent until proven guilty, and from what I can see...no one on this thread is denying that he might be innocent of that charge. But is he guilty of killing if not murder...by his own admission he already claimed that guilt.

[marmar]

53. 'A medical report compiled by the family physician' ...........

........... sounds akin to an ethics report compiled by Richard Nixon's personal attorney.


Some of the posts in this thread are very illuminating.

[Ikonoklast]

104. One million candlepower's worth.

You're supposed to act fooled.

Same names, with a couple of new ones.

[Solomon]

122. Yep. Two words jumped right out at me. "Family physician" and "compiled".

Well, actually thats three words. The word "compiled" smacks of building a case. What's all the "compiling" about?

[librechik]

54. ABCnews has been uncritically airing these unbelievable uncreditable stories from the beginning

what skin do they have in this game?

[B2G]

56. ABC News is reporting on court testimony

Oh the horror.

[marmar]

58. Reporting on it lazily and uncritically.

In other words, acting as a dictation service rather than checking out the veracity of claims. Joseph Pulitzer's nightmare.

[B2G]

61. Uncritically? What are they supposed to say in their report?

"A medical report entered into evidence stated that he had black eyes and a broken nose, but frankly we think the doctor is lying and should lose his license to practice?"

[Solomon]

123. What the hell are you talking about, "entering into evidence". Court testimony? The damn

trial hasn't even started yet and here you are elevating this bullshit to "entered evidence". Do you know anything about criminal trials at all? You can't just "enter evidence" willy nilly. It's subject to cross-examination and a ruling by the court before it becomes admissible as evidence. If ABC is indeed reporting it that way, then they are deceiving the public.

[Blue_Tires]

66. in addition to that, they also aired that "edited, enhanced" parking lot video

that maybe/kinda/sorta showed injuries to the back of Zimmerman's head if you looked really hard; and ran with it like it was honest-to-god fact

in the good old days of journalism, this used to be called "making shit up", so ABC's record on their reporting of this case is less than stellar

[NoGOPZone]

57. That's something I've also noticed

I suspect someone connected to Zimmerman has a contact at ABC and is forwarding info favorable to the defense to that network but no one else. Funny how the supposed liberal bias goes out the window when an exclusive story is involved.

[B2G]

60. Does that tinfoil make you sweaty?

Everything they are reporting is part of the court record. Maybe his minions have connections there as well!

[NoGOPZone]

62. Did you bother reading the article?

"obtained exclusively by ABC News ". What's your theory now, they're the only news outlet reviewing the court record?

[B2G]

63. The documents were released by the court yesterday

It's a matter of public record. That ABC might have gotten them first means nothing. Every media outlet out there is trying to scoop the others. ABC won this time.

[NoGOPZone]

64. In other words, you're saying ABC lied when the said

'obtained exclusively'. Yet the other posters in this thread who say thay can't be trusted are wrong.

[B2G]

67. And just maybe Matt Gutman is a better journalist

than his Florida counterparts. That's what journalist do...establish contacts, follow leads and scoop their peers.

It's been happening forever.

[NoGOPZone]

75. and maybe one of those contacts

happens to be someone close to Zimmerman, as I suggested in my OP

[Little Star]

65. So????

[Cave_Johnson]

70. So....

Some people obviously found it interesting. What part of that was unclear?

[FarLeftFist]

71. The part that says you ca't fight back against someone wielding a gun.

Maybe Trayvon fought back after a gun was brandished.

[Little Star]

72. I know you are new around here but there will occasionally be duplicates,

there always have. People do not do it on purpose it just sometimes happens. It is not a contest. I'm sorry I didn't see your post before I posted mine, I did try to look and see if there was already one up though.

I must admit, and I've seen others say this before, it is rude to confront someone over things like you did. And I did take offense,.

Peace, LS

[Kingofalldems]

73. Yeah, it sure is interesting.

I have certainly taken one.

[reflection]

74. Where's Bill Frist when we need him?

He should be able to look at that grainy ABC News video, as well as Trayvon's gravesite, and immediately ascertain the condition of each of them the night of the conflict. He's remarkably omniscient that way.

[JVS]

76. I demand we consult Miss Cleo!

[nadinbrzezinski]

85. 12+ hours after the incident

It could be legit...I mean 12 + hours is long enough for somebody to break a nose.

As to the black eyes...yup, normal with a broken nose.

The court should order an x-ray. They will be able to tell if that was a recent break, or even if there is one.

And if the X-ray is clean...that's a problem.

Hmmm I hope EMT crew obtained an AMA.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

90. Given the defensive practice of medicine, its a good bet that imaging was done

That would also provide a radiologists report as well. I also assume the EMTs did the paperwork.

There is more to come on this as both sides try this issue in the media.

[Baitball Blogger]

86. What is the name of the physician?

[ProgressiveProfessor]

94. Should be on the released data.

I have a hard time seeing a family doc hanging himself out on this one. No reason to and the Zimmermans are not wealthy enough to buy someone.

I really do not think the trial will hinge on this.

[Baitball Blogger]

96. Don't underestimate the level of unprofessional courtesies that occur in this county.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

100. Still need a basis for that to occur.

Its not like the Zimmermans are a long term Florida family or as wealthy as the Duponts. Anything the doc does will be rigorously analyzed. This is not decisive material regardless.

[Baitball Blogger]

103. It wouldn't surprise me if the person he's trying to cover is Norm Wolfinger.

The question is, why did Norm Wolfinger make the decisions he made? That's where it gets tricky.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

105. Without something probative to support your conspiracy theories

all this does is muddy the water.

Take the doc's report, analyze it to see if it conforms to standards of care AND other available data. Only if it does not in an indefensible manner should we head done the conspiracy route.

Occam's Razor anyone?

[Baitball Blogger]

106. It's not like there isn't a city in this county which has given up millions

to hush up the very fact that conspiracies do exist.

I'm just sayin, I wouldn't rule anything out.

[Zax2me]

97. Even if true, the physician is going to catch HELL

for reporting it on record.
If I were him I'd take a couple weeks off.

[Cave_Johnson]

98. From who?

Are we at the point where a doctor should fear reprisal for doing his job?

[ProgressiveProfessor]

102. Concur

If the doc did a professional and appropriate job there should be no repercussions.

Some professional poutrage pushers might consider coming after him, but then nothing could stop those who have no shame.

[magical thyme]

99. and Zimmerman was a prescription drug user

According to the report, prior to the shooting Zimmerman had been prescribed Adderall and Temazepam, medications that can cause side effects such as agitation and mood swings, but in fewer than 10 percent of patients.


http://www.drugs.com/temazepam.html
Temazepam is used to treat insomnia symptoms, such as trouble falling or staying asleep.
Temazepam may also be used for other purposes not listed in this medication guide.

http://www.drugs.com/adderall.html
Adderall is a central nervous system stimulant. It affects chemicals in the brain and nerves that contribute to hyperactivity and impulse control. Adderall is used to treat narcolepsy and attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD).

Both are potentially addictive. And neither should be taken with alcohol. But of course they didn't bother to do an alcohol test on the killer, did they?

[DonCoquixote]

108. OK, let's grant all of it

Let's even grant that Tray was a modern day Mike Tyson, despite his size. Let's give him a Black Belt, a UFC championship, and four tours in Iraq.

As the folks in the Boxer Rebellion learned, the best martial arts in the whole world do not mean JACK when someone has a pistol on you. White Belt in Gun beats Black Belt every time.

It is a FACT that, despite the CLEAR RULES of neighborhood watch, that Zimmerman had the gun, and brought it to the scene.
It is a FACT that the Police dispatcher told him NOT to follow, to let the Police take care of the situation.
It is a FACT that Zimmerman had the rap sheet for beating his girlfirend and assaulting cops.
It is a FACT that he had called the cops dozens of times, all on young black males.

And even Nancy Grace heard the comments about "fuc__ing C--Ns" that he felt free to make KNOWING DISPATCHERS TAPE YOUR CALLS.

Now, before people laugh, tell me, if someone had followed you, cornered you, and threatened you with a GUN, that you would not use any hand to hand combat skills to defend yourself? It is up to ZIMMERMAN, who brought the gun into this, to prove his life was in danger, a burden of proof that should be heavier considerign he likes to HIT COPS and WOMEN.

But of course, that is NOT what this is about. This is about the GOP trying to tease all the scum with the hope that any white person can put a black male in his place, the revival of what used to be called the 'sundown" law, where Blacks out in the street after dark would be killed.

[Cave_Johnson]

113. You take several logical leaps...

... and it seems like you are fitting facts to a personal theory.

[Solomon]

124. Nope. He's dead on. Didn't you see the news in the paper this morning? Minority babies

now officially outnumber white babies. At bottom, this is what this crap is all about. We're back in reconstruction days when the KKK rose up to terrorize the majority black population down south, only now it's happening all over the country. It's not the KKK anymore. It's Stand Your Ground laws and the license to kill black males at the slightest provocation. That post is dead on.

[DonCoquixote]

127. Logical leaps

Is that what you call documented facts?

[belcffub]

132. thats a great theory

Now, before people laugh, tell me, if someone had followed you, cornered you, and threatened you with a GUN, that you would not use any hand to hand combat skills to defend yourself?

Now prove that zimmerman threatened him with a gun instead of pulling the gun out after he was attacked and on the ground... which I'm not saying is what happened... but if he is innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt that is what you must do... if you can't then he walks

It is up to ZIMMERMAN, who brought the gun into this, to prove his life was in danger, a burden of proof that should be heavier considerign he likes to HIT COPS and WOMEN.

thats not how our system works... do you want to have a criminal justice system that works under a guilty unless proven innocent beyond a reasonable doubt assumption...

"better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer"

[DonCoquixote]

134. OK, now to dissect your ideas

Innocent until proven guilty, eh? It seems obvious Zimmerman made a judgement of Martin;s guilt, which his talk of "fu--- oons" "they always get away."

you said:
"thats not how our system works... do you want to have a criminal justice system that works under a guilty unless proven innocent beyond a reasonable doubt assumption..."

Funny thing is, when you have a rap sheet that includes violence, it does affect reasonable doubt, because it is reasonable to assume that someone that was violent will be violent again. And while we are at it, let's see how many of the people he called about were not black males?

you said:
"Now prove that zimmerman threatened him with a gun instead of pulling the gun out after he was attacked and on the ground."
Oddly enough, I do not have to, Mr. Zimmerman is the one who needs to prove why he felt his lif is in danger, especially as he is the one that initated the pursuit. SYG mans just that, you stand the ground where youa re, not get out of your car, against the orders of the police dispatch, and stalk someone (which the phone records indictate he did, martin complained on his cell phone that he was being followed, and used the terms "I am not going to run, but walk fast."


.". which I'm not saying is what happened... "

But you sure want to plant that seed knowing that white people are trained to fear Black Males.

[belcffub]

135. zimmerman martin or any private citizen do not have the same requirement as our criminal just system

innocent until proven guilty is only in a court of law...

I am pretty sure that zimmerman profiled martin... had a history of it...

you said:
"Now prove that zimmerman threatened him with a gun instead of pulling the gun out after he was attacked and on the ground."
Oddly enough, I do not have to, Mr. Zimmerman is the one who needs to prove why he felt his lif is in danger, especially as he is the one that initated the pursuit. SYG mans just that, you stand the ground where youa re, not get out of your car, against the orders of the police dispatch, and stalk someone (which the phone records indictate he did, martin complained on his cell phone that he was being followed, and used the terms "I am not going to run, but walk fast."

the prosecution will need to prove this... if they can't he will walk... Zimmerman has injuries consistent with what he was saying from the beginning...

and your making up your own interruption of SYG... dispatch said they do not need him to follow. They never ordered him to do anything. he got out of his car (a totally stupid thing) and confronted martin... no one knows what was said.. could have asked him for skittles for all we know... then a fight started... again we have no idea who started it... your guess is as good as mine...

.". which I'm not saying is what happened... "

But you sure want to plant that seed knowing that white people are trained to fear Black Males.

no I'm giving you reasonable doubt... which is what's required for zimmerman to get off...

[LynneSin]

116. If this is true - doesn't Travyon Martin have the right to defend himself?

Or should he have just stood there so Zimmerman had an easy target?

[obamanut2012]

121. Yes, but some would rather you never bring that up

I honestly believe quite a few people, and even some on here, don't think he did.

What would you do if some creepy guy was following you in the rain and dark? Yeah, so would I, and so would everyone else trying to deflect blame onto Trayvon.

[Rex]

125. So I can believe his own personal physician after the crime

was commited OR I can believe what my eyes saw on the police cc system, right after the murder.

WOW...and the FBI is looking at charging Zimm with a hate crime! GO FBI!!!