Two KY clerks violate the constitution

[Dwayne Hicks]

Fire them, then sue them into poverty then throw them in prison!

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/kentucky-clerks-no-marriage-for-you

[TeddyR]

1. So it seems to me that the clerks fall into two separate categories

The first includes those who refuse to issue marriage licenses to any couple. If -- like in Alabama -- the state statute says that clerks "may" issue marriage licenses then I'm not sure there is a problem with refusing to issue licenses to anyone. The clerks aren't breaking the law and aren't discriminating against one group.

The second category includes those who refuse to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples only. That group of clerks is on shakier ground. Their argument is that they are protected by the First Amendment from being forced to violate their religious beliefs. However, since they are public servants, I'm not sure that argument will carry the day, although I don't believe it has been resolved yet.

In any event, I do not think anyone should be thrown into prison for refusing to issue a marriage license. Fired, but not imprisoned.

[uppityperson]

14. Wrong about religious beliefs in job, and regarding "may"

Allison Martin, spokeswoman for Kentucky Attorney General Jack Conway, directed TPM to Conway's earlier statement:

"The United States Supreme Court issued the final word on this issue on Friday. The ruling does not tell a minister or congregation what they must do, but it does make clear that the government cannot pick and choose when it comes to issuing marriage licenses and the benefits they confer. Any clerk that refuses to issue marriage licenses is opening himself or herself to potential legal liability and sanctions. Any couple or person denied a license may seek remedy in federal court, but should consult with a private attorney about their particular situation.”

"may issue" does not mean "may not", it means it gives the person the ability to do so. It does not mean "may or may not". Rather like me in my nursing job "may" give medicines or do treatment does not mean I get to pick and chose which to give or do.

[CBGLuthier]

2. Wow. So much fucking hate

I am talking about you not them BTW. Sheesh it will all be over in a few weeks. They will either comply, lose their jobs, quit their jobs, or the courts will step in.

People need to quit showing their blood lust.

We won.

[hobbit709]

3. I don't have much use for people who knowingly and willfully violate their oath of office.

Either comply with the law you swore to uphold, or STFU and resign.

[davidpdx]

5. I agree, but the OP was a little overboard with sue them into poverty

Their beliefs are wrong, but we shouldn't be wishing someone to be sued into poverty. Yes, they should lose their jobs if they refuse to carryout their duties. The sad fact is it probably won't happen right away.

[Dwayne Hicks]

15. No

They deserve the so called "hate". And I will be glad to let them have it. Its what they deserve.

[CBGLuthier]

16. You know, that is exactly what they say.

Eye for an eye leaves the world blind.

[yardwork]

4. The hypocrisy annoys me.

Jesus specifically said that divorce is wrong. He said that anybody who marries a divorced person commits adultery.

So, have these clerks been denying licenses to previously married couples? If not, why not?

[davidpdx]

6. I agree with you and in terms of the hypocrisy of those who are religious

and that bothers me when it comes to other issues as well. It is one of the reasons why I consider myself agnostic.

[yardwork]

7. I chose another path.

I left the church and worship God according to my beliefs.

[davidpdx]

10. That's certainly an option I'd think about

I don't think I'm hard core agnostic, maybe it's that I really disagree with teachings at some churches.

I went to a very liberal church when I was an undergraduate in college and kind of shopped around for the right place. If you happen to ever get to Portland Oregon it's worth stopping by just to see the beautiful architecture both inside and outside. it is located at SW 11th and Park downtown.

[yardwork]

11. I will do that! Thank you.

[NaturalHigh]

8. "Fire them, then sue them into poverty then throw them in prison!"

That's the sort of ridiculous talk I would expect from the other side. Yes they should lose their jobs if they won't comply, but wishing poverty and prison for them? That's just mean-spirited and wrong.

[yardwork]

12. I agree. No need for revenge.

I do think that they should resign if they can't do their jobs, though.

I don't get to pick and choose my work responsibilities based on personal beliefs.

[davidpdx]

13. +1

I highly doubt they'll lose their jobs right away. If anything, those who are fired will be the ones who are going to sue the local or state governments for enforcing the law.

[lame54]

9. I'm good with the firing...

and be done with it