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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGuns Don't Deter Crime, Study Finds
This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by DonViejo (a host of the General Discussion forum).
"The one thing that would have at least ameliorated the horrible situation in Charleston would have been that if somebody in that prayer meeting had a conceal carry or there had been either an off-duty policeman or an on-duty policeman, somebody with the legal authority to carry a firearm and could have stopped the shooter," presidential candidate Mike Huckabee said in a Fox News interview on June 19.
A new study, however, throws cold water on the idea that a well-armed populace deters criminals or prevents murders. Instead, higher ownership of guns in a state is linked to more firearm robberies, more firearm assaults and more homicide in general. [5 Milestones in Gun Control History]
"We found no support for the hypothesis that owning more guns leads to a drop or a reduction in violent crime," said study researcher Michael Monuteaux, an epidemiologist and professor of pediatrics at Harvard Medical School. "Instead, we found the opposite."
More guns, more gun crime
Numerous studies have found that gun ownership correlates with gun homicide, and homicide by gun is the most common type of homicide in the United States. In 2013, for example, there were 16,121 total homicides in the United States, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), and 11,208 of those were carried out with a firearm. (Gun suicides outpace gun homicides by far; in 2013, the CDC recorded 21,175 suicides by firearm, about half of all suicides that year. Contrary to popular belief, suicide is typically an impulsive act, psychiatrists say. Ninety percent of people who attempt suicide once will not go on to complete a suicide later, but a suicide attempt using a gun is far more lethal than other methods.)
http://news.yahoo.com/guns-dont-deter-crime-study-finds-180710261.html#
ProfessorGAC
(64,990 posts)Why do you hate the constitution?
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)Like the ban on alcohol?
ProfessorGAC
(64,990 posts)Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)The USA has three types of wannabe-conservatives.
There's the Democrats, who are the wannabe-conservatives that want to take the USA back to the 1990-ies.
There's the GOP, who are the wannabe-conservatives that want to take the USA back to the 1950-ies.
There's the TEA-party, who are the wannabe-conservatives that want to take the country back to the 1850-ies.
But a REAL conservative (like me) would take the country back to the 1750-ies, tear up the constitution, and become British again.
------------------
Too much?
HFRN
(1,469 posts)Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)Figuring out the dynamics at play in social gun culture, according to Kalesan, will be key to sparking social change about the attitudes and practices that inform gun ownership in the first place. She said educating Americans about the health dangers of having a firearm in their homes will change the way people feel about gun ownership, which in turn could drive laws that make guns more difficult to obtain.
"A public health approach, much like the anti-tobacco effort, is necessary, first to facilitate a social change and then political will to form effective policies, Kalesan told HuffPost. "We also need research to understand the public health consequences in different communities and to identify effective social interventions in different populations."
For instance, past research has found a link between the rate of household gun ownership and elevated rates of firearm-suicide, despite the fact that gun owners do not have more mental health problems than non-gun owners, nor are they more prone to suicide than non-gun owners. Other studies have found that gun ownership leads to more violent crime in general, as guns tend fall into the wrong hands when stolen or sold on secondary markets.
In 2013 alone, 33,636 persons were killed using a gun, while 84,258 were shot non-fatally, said Kalesan. "Those who are injured have a difficult journey during recovery, some remaining paraplegic and injured often with PTSD for the rest of their lives.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/07/02/average-gun-owner-america-gun-violence-study_n_7709884.html
Takket
(21,554 posts)erronis
(15,226 posts)Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)olddots
(10,237 posts)but first a word from my sponsor Wayne .
hack89
(39,171 posts)Can you show a significant drop in the number of guns over that period?
https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/1995/95sec5.pdf
https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2012/crime-in-the-u.s.-2012/offenses-known-to-law-enforcement/expanded-homicide/expanded_homicide_data_table_8_murder_victims_by_weapon_2008-2012.xls
Response to hack89 (Reply #6)
LanternWaste This message was self-deleted by its author.
Orrex
(63,199 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)Murder is a complex social phenomena. But I am certain that more guns did not result in America's murder rate being cut in half.
Orrex
(63,199 posts)Incidentally, the overall violent crime rate has fallen over the span that you describe (1993 to 2010), so it follows that the murder rate would decline as well.
hack89
(39,171 posts)so obviously the increase is related to something other than the number of guns in society.
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv11.pdf
Orrex
(63,199 posts)That an increase in guns doesn't cause a drop in crime rate?
hack89
(39,171 posts)it is a two sided coin. Either guns matter (good and bad) or they don't. The OP specifically says "More guns, more gun crime". I don't think that the past 20 years bear that out.
Orrex
(63,199 posts)Of course, if guns don't lead to a reduction in crime, why is this used as a major selling point for guns?
Also, this leaves us with the question of why our murder-by-gun rate so greatly exceeds every other developed nation on the planet, if guns actually have no bearing on violent crime.
hack89
(39,171 posts)if you look at a city like Chicago or Boston, for example, you will see that gun violence is concentrated in a few neighborhoods. The vast majority of Americans live in areas with murder rates on par with all the other developed nations.
High crime rates are associated with poverty, unemployment, poor education, drugs and criminal gangs. Most developed nations have social safety nets and rational drug laws that don't leave them with concentrated pockets of desperate, violent people. The demographics of violent crime are well known - lets focus on those who are actually committing the violence.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)after controlling. More guns, more homicide.
hack89
(39,171 posts)over the pass 20 years, resulting in a corresponding increase in murder? Is that the argument?
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Studies, schmudies. Unless if validates my bias, it's flawed/inaccurate/questionable-- and I have my own biased and flawed interpretations of other studies to prove it...
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)This same thread got locked yesterday. Guns, y'know.
Matrosov
(1,098 posts)Only emotions do.
"Oh, so you want people to be defenseless?"
"Oh, so you want women to be raped?"
"Oh, so you want us to be thrown into reeducation camps?"
flamin lib
(14,559 posts)All data that doesn't support NRA talking points is biased, poorly researched, improperly interpreted and presented solely to take all our guns away.
Didn't ya know that?
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)with a skeptical eye.
Fearless
(18,421 posts)The solution to gun violence isn't more guns?
Shocker!
iscooterliberally
(2,860 posts)The first time I fired a weapon I was 5 years old. I wanted to search for crawdads in the creek, but dad insisted that I shoot. We were in the woods outside of Macon, GA sometime around 1967. He handed me the gun and helped me aim it and I fired the gun. I was instantly blind and deaf. I had no eye or ear protection. The gun that I shot was a 9mm Luger. If you're familiar with that weapon you can guess what happened to me. I remember when we got home, and mom got her first look at me, she started screaming at my dad. I had a lump the size of a bottle cap right in the center of my forehead, and a pounding skull ache. My dad was a chronic alcoholic who had served in the national guard. He was also a gun enthusiast. Two years later, we had moved up near Atlanta, and my dad bought a snub nosed .38 revolver for 'home protection'. My younger brother was all excited about that. He did not have the benefit of my experience, but that was about to change. My brother was 5, and my dad was passed out on the couch. I was not even remotely interested in the new gun. I had a comic book that I was reading and my brother disappeared down the hallway. Out of the corner of my eye, I saw my brother come back and sit down on the coffee table across the room from me. I noticed that he was holding the gun and about to squeeze the trigger. I went to say no, but it was too late. I saw the round come out of the barrel and lodge in the drywall about a foot away from my right knee. My brother screamed and dropped the gun and ran down the hallway. My father jumped up off of the couch and looked around. He saw the gun on the floor and me still sitting in the chair. At first he thought I had been shot, but I said no, and showed him where the round had gone into the wall. My dad punished my brother severely for that, but it was obviously my dad's fault. I have other gun related horror stories, but I'll stop here. If you think you need a gun for home protection, you should probably move, or get a dog. At least with a dog, you will know the trouble is coming before it makes it in the door. A gun won't do you any good unless you are on patrol with your weapon at the ready. I would rather not be on patrol, or live in a world where I have to worry about who I'm going to have to shoot at. I would rather have a closet full of guitars any day.
Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)Gun advocates are courageous freedom fighters!
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Snark ain't discussion.
Time to lock this one too.
iscooterliberally
(2,860 posts)DonViejo
(60,536 posts)A consensus of Forum Hosts agree, this OP does not meet the requirements of the SOP for the posting of gun threads. Forum Hosts encourage you to post this OP in one of the gun groups.
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