General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIn My View, The Wealthiest Should Pay At Least 90% of Our Taxes.
According to the New York Times, the "richest 1 percent in the United States now own more wealth than the bottom 90 percent".
Therefore, I believe, they should be paying 90% of taxes.
Agree or Disagree?
If you disagree, what percent should they pay (or you if your one of them, lol)?
Stargazer99
(2,585 posts)They ought to be responsible for the cost of protecting them....no free lunch
Newest Reality
(12,712 posts)of carrying them around on our backs is exorbitant. At least horses get rest and water and meal comprised of more than crumbs.
If they can't pay their way for all the services our covert socialism provides, then they could at least move out of our attic and get their own place.
It seems that, historically, cultures that go to the extreme this wipe themselves out, so we all go together as the wealthy create more scarcity in order to preserve their freedoms and the Serfs end up with no more energy, resources or motivation to continue carrying their water and serving their citadels of lush safety.
If we can't get the golden, fattened parasites off of our collective backs, we all go together, so it seems.
flamin lib
(14,559 posts)Adjusted for inflation that would be $44 mil today. There was a truly graduated progressive tax structure that allowed us to build the best, bar none the best, highway system in the world. It allowed us to completely eliminate one disease from the face of the earth and virtually eliminate measles, mumps, rubella, tuberculosis and polio from the US. It allowed us to export vaccines and doctors instead of guns.
Today the tax structure only taxes "earned income" with only 2 brackets and "unearned income" at one constant 15%.
Not everything about the '50s was great, but the truly progressive income tax worked for everybody and everybody paid a fair share.
former9thward
(32,005 posts)Last edited Thu Aug 27, 2015, 08:10 PM - Edit history (1)
Federal budget in 1951 was 45,000,000,000. In 2015 it was 3,759,000,000,000. 1950s government was 1.2% the size of present federal government. You can't have one without the other.
flamin lib
(14,559 posts)Then come back and we can talk.
former9thward
(32,005 posts)https://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historicals
I used the data from their Table 1.1
flamin lib
(14,559 posts)compare income v expenditures as a % of GDP and get back to ya'. I anticipate a different perspective.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)The top rate of tax on capital gains and qualified dividends is 23.8% (20% plus a 3.8% Obamacare surcharge). Significantly higher than "one constant 15%".
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)Haven't seen you in awhile. I'm right with you
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Been a crazy busy year!
hunter
(38,311 posts)... they should pay most of the bills.
Anyone making a minimum living wage or less probably shouldn't be paying any taxes.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)adjusted for inflationand with the most egregious loopholes closed, and getting corporations to pay the share they paid in those days - 30%+ of federal income takes
The top marginal rate for individuals under the General was 90%. That sounds about right.
former9thward
(32,005 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)The tax burden was apportioned FAIRLY under FDR, Truman, Ike, JFK and LBJ. Even Nixon, Ford and Carter it was far more fair than it is now. You do remember Zombie King Reagan and his voodoo economics, don't you? Let the rich have all they want, to hell with everyone else.
There's no reason MORE revenue could not be collected under FAIR tax policies than is now being realized. In fact I'd bet that fair taxation, strongly enforced, would leave the government rolling in money and a significant rate cut for working people could be had. Combine that with a reduction of military expenditures to sane levels and this country would be prosperous and a far better place.
See Krugman, Piketty, Stiglitz, Galbraith, Chang.
former9thward
(32,005 posts)It did not kick in until $4 million in today's dollars. There were extensive deductions and loopholes. Politically Congress lowered tax rates and closed those loopholes. We will not see the 50s again. In the 50s the U.S. produced 60% of the world's industrial production. When that is happening you can do alot of stuff. We will never see anything close to that in the future.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)former9thward
(32,005 posts)Scores of nations can now do what only we could 50 years ago. We will not stop jobs from going overseas. We need to greatly expand our social safety net to deal with our increasingly stagnant economy. That will not happen with some war on the rich. We need to drastically reduce our military operations to pay for it. That will result in a major recession but that will come to an end eventually.
clarice
(5,504 posts)taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)The 1% own 40% of the wealth in the United States.
But, in the United States, we do not tax wealth directly, so the notion that the %of wealth should equate to the %in taxes is a moot notion.
The top 1% share of income is about 20% and share of income tax is about 45%. Seems pretty fair to me.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Since the poor have more income than wealth. Income tax unfairly burdens the poor, it seems to me.
TexasMommaWithAHat
(3,212 posts)Wealth includes things you own
You have a $300,000 house and it's taxed at a rate of 10%. That's $30,000 every year. Pretty soon, you won't own that house.
No, income should be taxed, but ALL income should be taxed at progressive rates. The problem now is too much income isn't taxed because of loopholes in the tax law or because the income is hidden offshore.
Lurker Deluxe
(1,036 posts)Taxing wealth is crazy.
So I bust my ass, live below my means, save so I can retire .... you take some percentage of that.
Someone else spends every dime they ever make and never owns anything ... he pays no wealth tax.
Uhhh, no.
Income tax on low wages should be eliminated, I would push that threshold to 15k before any income tax kicks in.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Lurker Deluxe
(1,036 posts)Wealth.
Corporate wealth? If not, everyone will just be a corporation.
If so, corporations just pass along costs to consumers. Tax what wealth? Over a billion? That will hit any large corporation, hell some drilling rigs cost 750 million ... each. You will simply pay that cost at the pump. Football team? Pay it at the ticket window.
There is very little that you can tax when it comes to wealth that will not just be directly passed on to the consumer, so you may as well just do a VAT and get on with it.
Instead of taxing to pay for wars, how about we just stop fighting wars.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)... I said the same thing, the rich should pay 90% of taxes if they have 90% of the income.
The Republican said all kinds of stuff about how bad my suggestion was. It would kill the economy, etc.
I smiled and said, do you think we should have a flat tax?
He said "Yes".
I said, OK, lets assume all income in the US amounts to one million dollars.
And that the wealthiest earn 900,000 and the rest earn 100,000, that's 90% for the wealthiest and 10% for everyone else, just like the reports say the current ratio is.
He said "OK, yes, I see that".
I said OK, now apply a 10% flat tax to those amounts. So the wealthy together would pay 90,000 and everyone else 10,000.
Guess what percentage of the overall taxes it means the wealthy pay?
He got this funny look at his face and he said, "OK Steve, you got me."
Munificence
(493 posts)not pay taxes on "wealth" and that is where he could have torn you apart for being ignorant to that fact.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)the bottom 63% of tax filers paid 6.2% of all income taxes.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/03/24/high-income-americans-pay-most-income-taxes-but-enough-to-be-fair/
We don't tax wealth in America. Nor do we want to start.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)investment income is taxed at a lower rate than salary.
taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)while making sure their dividends and capital gains are taxed at a fraction of the rate the working man/woman's wages are taxed at. i hear you.
taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)Nowhere near 90%. Also, they pay 45% of income tax. Double your ratio. Seems pretty fair.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)Note that the top 1% by wealth are not necessarily the top 1% by income, either.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)Every year I would pay a tax on my savings, house and retirement accounts? Because that is where my wealth is.
RadiationTherapy
(5,818 posts)then there is no percentage you would likely feel comfortable with.
hack89
(39,171 posts)I just question the wisdom of a policy that steers people towards spending instead of saving.
RadiationTherapy
(5,818 posts)Either way, thank you for your willingness to pay taxes and congratulations on having assets enough to qualify.
hack89
(39,171 posts)is that going to be the front lines of this particular battle - those who have any assets vs those who have none? We have wandered far from making the 1% pay their fair share don't you think?
RadiationTherapy
(5,818 posts)I admit to wishing I earned and owned enough to complain about taxes or worry about their increase. As it is, I continue to work hard and do the best I can for my family. Good luck to all.
hack89
(39,171 posts)lpbk2713
(42,757 posts)And this scam should stop right now. WE are paying their freight.
1939
(1,683 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)And can have a lot of unintended consequences.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)(This is 2011's where they make that more explicit. 2012's report should be out in a couple of months. I have no idea why it takes CBO this long.)
ileus
(15,396 posts)Then they'd be poor, and Uncle Sam would buy another 23 jet fighters and a black SUV, and we'd be back to paying our regular tax rates.
questionseverything
(9,654 posts)estate taxes are a whole different story
there is no fairer way to tax than the "death tax"
the heirs have already enjoyed a lifetime of privilege, plus there is already a 10 million buck exemption and the dead don't miss the money