Today I was convinced to support intelligence tests to qualify voters

[bluestateguy]

And here is why:

[Politicalboi]

1. We need intelligence tests

For those running for office too, and no civil right should be on any ballot.

[hifiguy]

3. Psychiatric evaluations, too.

I suspect that an objective psychiatrist, evaluating Chimpoleon anonymously, would have clapped him into a laughing academy posthaste. Same goes for Cheeney. Paranoia and megalomania aren't that hard to spot.

[panader0]

2. A couple of years ago I voiced a similar opinion

and got schooled here. In a good way, educated.
I said back then that people have to take a test to drive. They must know the "rules of the road" and take an actual driving test to prove they are capable of driving on our public roads. So why can people vote who don't know jack about the Constitution, or are even capable of answering the questions given to people wanting to become US citizens.
Then I was informed about the racist voting laws of the past, and why voting tests or rules were wrong.
It seems that with all the new voting ID laws, that voter suppresion has not been eradicated yet.
Edit to say, I can't watch videos.

[hifiguy]

4. There's nothing racist about asking people about the basics

of the Bill of Rights or whether they believe in things that are scientifically proven facts, like whether the earth revolves around the sun or vice versa. If you don't learn those basics in junior high, or whatever it is called these days, you should have to learn them before you vote. If you refuse to learn them, sorry - you're too goddam dumb to vote, drive or own firearms.

[cynatnite]

5. I think it's not only racist, I think it's dehumanizing...

There are some people who just don't have the same level of intelligence as most for a variety of reasons. That is no reason to deny them the right to vote for the politician of their choice. To me, this is as slippery of a slope as it gets.

Voting is a right that no one should be able to take away. That is voter suppression plan and simple.

[hifiguy]

8. I won't deny that you have a pretty damned good point

but when I see people who are willing to march their fellow citizens into death camps, I really do have second thoughts.

[cynatnite]

9. Of course, it's enough to make me want to yank my hair out...

I am comforted by the fact that people like this are so few and far between. Their voices will never outnumber the rest of the sane people. Of course, we can never turn our backs on them either.

[XemaSab]

13. That's what the Germans thought

n/t

[Selatius]

17. It only takes a small group of dedicated people to enslave a nation. Ask the people of Chile.

If you can convince a significantly large enough group of people to do something, even if it's only 10% or even 30% of the population, that's more than enough political and physical force to cower the rest of the population, assuming you can get this group of people to go the final step of using force against fellow citizens who disagree.

A good demonstration of this is where the military turns against a democratically elected government and overthrows it, taking over all the organs of state power despite what the majority may think. The United States isn't the only nation to suffer on 9/11. Chile had their own 9/11. It's just that their nightmare began on 9/11/1973 when Augusto Pinochet ripped down their government and installed a military dictatorship friendly to American interests.

[hifiguy]

49. + a googolplex

actively aided and abetted by Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger.

[Logical]

35. Well, then you mostly get the results you are wanting I guess. IDIOTS elected to office! n-t

[cynatnite]

40. No one ever gets the exact results they want...

It's how democracy works. You gotta accept the fact that people you don't like can get elected just like the people you do like. It sucks, but that's life.

[JHB]

38. It's not (inherently) about race, nor intelligence...

...it's about a) the right to vote as an inehrent baseline right and b) on the more practical/cynical side: the certanty that structure and enforcement of such restrictions will be selective. The latter is how it worked historically: tests were rigorously applied to blacks, but whites waived through, helped on the test, grandfathered in, etc., so that "neutral" restrictions were no barrier to white people.

Same thing would happen in all too many places.

[cynatnite]

6. Nope...not ever...

I don't care how dumb as fuck some people are, I am completely against denying people the right to vote for the politician of their choice. It's a throwback to racist intelligent tests and not only that...it's dehumanizing.

No way will I ever support intelligent tests for allowing someone to vote.

[Logical]

36. Well, then no more complaints from you when IDIOTS are elected to office! Celebrate it!!!

[cynatnite]

39. Bullshit...

It's a free country and people can bitch as much as they like about elected officials and the idiots who vote for them.

I'm always suprised when people who claim to be progressive support limiting rights for those they don't agree with.

[Logical]

43. I am surprised that some progressives think some people are not too stupid to vote. n-t

[cynatnite]

48. Would you tell a 30 year person who is a slow learner he can't vote because he's stupid?

What about someone who supports a policy you find offensive such as segregation?

Where do you draw the line?

[ZombieHorde]

58. Should we get rid of the age restriction too?

Five-year-old children can probably operate most voting cards or screens just fine.

[cynatnite]

61. Do you support telling a 30 year old who is a slow learner they are too stupid to vote? n/t

[ZombieHorde]

64. Yes. In the nicest way possible. nt

[cthulu2016]

7. The franchise is given in recognition of one's humanity

Not whether someone will vote right.

If stupid people couldn't vote then why should people of average intelligence be allowed to vote? There are people of above average intelligence, and so on.

[cherokeeprogressive]

10. A fucked up notion no matter how you slice it.

No MATTER how you slice it.

Why don't you go to Mississippi, stand on a corner in Tupelo, and shout that stupid shit out loud?

"Hey! I'm a White Guy! I think y'all should take an intelligence test before y'all can vote!"

FWIW, I didn't even BOTHER to watch your posted video.

[ZombieHorde]

57. Are you saying women of color in Mississippi couldn't pass an intelligence test?

I don't understand your reply.

[cherokeeprogressive]

69. What I'm saying is

I don't think they should be asked to pass an intelligence test before being allowed to vote.

No one should.

[jberryhill]

11. Let me tell you something about unintelligent people

Every person that has ever cheated, swindled, conned, and confused that woman was smarter than her.

In other words, every wrong that's been done to her was done by someone just like you.

And she knows it.

[Mariana]

23. That pastor of hers would be pretty high on the list

of people who have cheated, swindled, conned, and confused that woman. And she doesn't know it, does she?

[jberryhill]

25. No, she doesn't know that

But people who are not intelligent can perfectly well understand the difference between others who accept them and treat them decently, and stuck up snobs who do not.

Guess which ones they choose to believe. It shouldn't be real hard.

If you do not have the mental tools to figure out what is true and what is not, the only thing you have to go on is trust.

There is absolutely no reason to trust people whose chief hobby is making fun of you.

That's why people like this woman believe the things they do, and that is how we oh-so-sophisticated people ratify every word they say.

[sibelian]

28. +1.

Well said.

[Mariana]

34. So why does she hate homosexuals so much?

How many of them have treated her badly for any reason? Why does she want them locked up until they die? Why does she want them eliminated from the population? I'm just having trouble understanding how any of what you say may have happened to her leads to that.

[treestar]

60. The Bible Sez is it wrong

And so do the authorities in her life. That's enough for her.

At first she seemed to be trying to deny the pastor said what he said. When she realized that wasn't working, she kept dodging AC's last question and trying to revert to her talking points.

When she firmly said "homosexuality is wrong" she seemed to think she'd finally hit the nail on the head and started rolling her eyes at AC when he started questioning that too - that some people might be concerned at her pastor's attitude.

She really thought she could set this record straight but then realized it wasn't so easy as she thought it would be.

[dana_b]

12. I miss the "unrec" button right now

I don't care how misinformed, low IQ or wrong I think someone is - everyone should get a vote. No more Jim-Crow-type laws ever!

[RedCappedBandit]

14. No. But this is why civil rights should not be up for vote. nt

[sevento47orpi]

15. From reading the posts in the thread many here would

rather see freedom voted out of existance then stopping it from happening.

[forsaken mortal]

16. Restricting voting rights isn't the solution

A high IQ is no guarantee a person is more enlightened or desires to defend the interests of the oppressed or of society in general. They can be just as predatory, hateful, and selfish as anyone else. It's likely the uber-wealthy financial elites who sank the economy probably have above-average IQs, and I'm not sure restricting voting to just that set would lead to a better society.

[HopeHoops]

18. Q1: Do you watch FOX? - A: Yes = too fucking stupid to breathe. No = continue.

[aquart]

19. Get unconvinced.

[annabanana]

20. "sure, yeah,thank you so much"

Do you think she might have had misgivings by the end of the piece?

That last line of hers made me laugh

[jberryhill]

26. She knew that she was only being used as an object of ridicule

She doesn't have the vocabulary to say, "The pastor was engaging in hyperbole." She wouldn't know the word "hyperbole".

She knows full well that she doesn't have the rhetorical tools to state her own position.

[MineralMan]

21. That is one dumbass person.

Uff da! She should still vote. Everyone has the right to vote. But she's stupid as a fence post.

[onethatcares]

22. Stacy, you mind inbred idiot, do you support or condemn

Pastor Wrights use of "God damn the United States for Slavery"?

I think those beedy eyes and creepy mindset would set her to twirling on that one.

[Egalitarian Thug]

24. Stupid people know they're stupid, and being stupid, they react to this knowledge

with the only tool in their toolbox, anger. Now you have an angry, stupid person looking for a target at which to direct their anger, and that's pure gold for any con-man.

[jberryhill]

27. Correct

And we do nothing to address that problem.

Instead, we make fun of them and call them stupid.

[Egalitarian Thug]

30. I've tried and tried for decades and have always failed. Maybe you know how to change their

minds, but I and most others don't. They have BELIEFS, usually instilled from birth, and those BELIEFS trump facts, experience, even their own occasional reasoning, so how do you get past that?

[treestar]

42. Don't try to hard or don't try to convert them in one sitting

Just asking questions and putting things into their minds and staying civil - that would leave them with perhaps something to think about. In time and with several such encounters, they can come to think on their own that they've reached a different conclusion.

[hifiguy]

51. There are people who are simply ineducable.

The stupidity and above all, bigotry and prejudice, simply cannot be changed or eradicated. Misconceptions can be educated out of people. This kind of bigotry and hate is bred in the bone - almost always by the Abrahamic religions.

[sibelian]

29. That's not going to work.

First step - no stupid people
Next step - no uneducated people
Next step - no people "not educated in the way we want".

[DanTex]

31. Wow that was painful to watch.

But, no, there shouldn't be IQ test requirements for voting. For a lot of reasons.

[Egalitarian Thug]

32. Average national IQ has steadily declined since the 70's

I remember a slow-news-day story a few years ago when the average dipped under 100 for the first time.

I blame the metamorphosis of "The American Dream" into the endless pursuit of stuff.

Oh, and TV. TV is a plague.

[Posteritatis]

47. Flynn Effect and the definition of IQ both say otherwise, so said story was wrong. (nt)

[Egalitarian Thug]

50. You say that as if it were the last word and a matter of fact. It's not.

And if you believe that people are, in fact, smarter today, you've substituted your own belief.

[Posteritatis]

52. I'm not saying it, four decades of research are. (nt)

[Happydayz]

33. No, I completely disagree!!

Nope...not ever...

I don't care how dumb as fuck some people are, I am completely against denying people the right to vote for the politician of their choice. It's a throwback to racist intelligent tests and not only that...it's dehumanizing.

No way will I ever support intelligent tests for allowing someone to vote.
___________________________________________________________________________________
Thank you, you hit the nail on the head. Even, the ignorant and uninformed deserve to vote for their candidate of choice, every individual has a right to their ideology even at the voting booth. Forcing the public to be tested before voting is a white nationalist talking point also, which is weird to see on DU.

[Logical]

37. I see your point. Ignore the whiners, why don't understand your point! n-t

[treestar]

41. I actually think maybe she's not dumb

You can see that she realizes that she's been had in the argument, and has some consciousness that she is wrong. She keeps dodging out of the argument. She's smart enough to realize that she does not have a leg to stand on.

[Ikonoklast]

44. Owning a church and filling it with morons is a good business model.

Tell them what they want to hear, no matter how ludicrous, asinine, or ignorant, and they will give you money.

Religion has absolutely nothing to do with it, that is the excuse given to be a tax-exempt enterprise, but it's all about fannies in the seats on Sunday and how much money you can pry out of their wallets.

This woman is a prime example of the type that I would want sitting in my pews, give me a thousand just like her, and I will feed their hate and ignorance right back to them, and charge them for the privilege.

On another note, I see our species dividing along the lines of intelligence even further as the next step in evolution. The smart people will leave this planet and move off-world one day to those intent on reproducing enough stupid descendants until they destroy themselves.

[tabasco]

45. Bwaaaa hahahahaha hahahaha!!!!

That is the funniest comedian I have ever seen!!!

She stayed in character the entire time!!

[Posteritatis]

46. Yay! Jim Crow laws are okay when they're directed at people *we* don't like! (nt)

[ZombieHorde]

54. It is not Jim Crow. We don't let children vote because they lack the intellectual

tools to make an informed decision. Why not apply the same standard equally?

[Posteritatis]

55. Because legal minors are not adults. Christ, this isn't complex. (nt)

[ZombieHorde]

56. Why don't we allow legal minors to vote?

Why do we have that law? What is the perceived benefit?

[treestar]

59. Adult incompetents can vote I suppose too

That's never been covered.

A court can declare an adult incompetent and appoint a guardian. Yet nothing stops that adult's voting rights. Maybe as a practical matter, their guardian won't take them to the polls.

[ZombieHorde]

53. I fully support IQ tests for voting.

I especially support IQ tests for candidates.

[cynatnite]

62. Basically, you're keeping the less educated from the ballot box.

What questions should be on them? How do you tell someone they are too stupid to vote?

Telling a voter that they are too stupid to go in a voting booth is outright voter supression. It's one thing to require it for a candidate...that I think I could get behind.

It's denying someone a basic right that is guaranteed to all citizens I have a problem with. All the intelligence tests in the world is not going to weed out people who are homophobic, racist, or whatever the case may be.

It's bad enough we deny convicted felons who have served their time the right to vote, but to add an intelligence test which is designed to keep people from voting who may not be as smart as you or I is morally offensive.

[ZombieHorde]

63. "What questions should be on them?"

I lack the education required to create the test. I think it should be made by people with degrees in psychology and sociology.

How do you tell someone they are too stupid to vote?

I would suggest doing it my mail.

Telling a voter that they are too stupid to go in a voting booth is outright voter supression.

I agree IQ tests can be considered voter suppression, but I think not allowing children or foreigners to vote is also voter suppression. I think the vast majority of us support some voter suppression, we just disagree on which potential voters should be suppressed.

All the intelligence tests in the world is not going to weed out people who are homophobic, racist, or whatever the case may be.

It's bad enough we deny convicted felons who have served their time the right to vote, but to add an intelligence test which is designed to keep people from voting who may not be as smart as you or I is morally offensive.

I agree some bigots will be able to pass an IQ test. I also agree being a convicted felon should not disqualify a person from voting.

I disagree with the morality claim. Morality is a tool to accomplish a goal. If our goal is only to allow everyone to vote, then restrictions on IQ tests, citizenship, age, and criminal records are indeed immoral, but I really doubt that is very many people's goal for government. If our goal is peace, prosperity for the masses, and a well-educated populace, then voting restrictions make sense.

[cynatnite]

65. If you want a better educated electorate start with the schools and not the voters...

Last edited Sun May 27, 2012, 05:24 PM - Edit history (1)

Foreigners are not allowed to vote for the simple fact that they are not citizens. Children aren't because they're not considered mature enough (although, I think I could win an election changing the school week to Monday, Tues, and Wednesday). They're just not equipped to vote, to drink alcohol, serve in the military, own weapons, etc. The age could be pushed to 17 and possibly even 16 since in some cases 17 year olds have been allowed to join the military and marriage is acceptable at that age in some states.

You're not taking in account someone's education and physical or mental limitations which could have a direct impact on their ability to enter a voting booth.

An intelligence test is no different than these voter I.D. laws. It's no different than how they tried to keep blacks in the south from voting. It's voter oppression. Period.

There will never be a justification for it.

[ZombieHorde]

66. The vast majority of us want some voter oppression.

We just disagree with which groups should be oppressed.

You want foreigners and children to be oppressed, some want felons to be oppressed, I want those of low-cognitive ability to be oppressed, and probably foreigners too.

So you are justifying voter oppression with your post.

[cynatnite]

67. So you support repealing the 14th and 26th amendments? n/t

[ZombieHorde]

68. Repealing the 14th amendment would be scary. I would just make a new amendment

that addressed section 2 of the 14th amendment. That is what the 26th amendment does.