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seafan

(9,387 posts)
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 02:29 PM Dec 2015

Past CIA Directors: 'We can neither kill nor surveil our way out of terror.'

EyeOnMiami has this important review today of the Showtime special, "Spymasters: CIA in the crosshairs", based on interviews with living former Directors of the CIA.


.....

There are two conclusions reached by America's top spymasters. They concur on the following points, whether appointed by Republican or Democratic presidents.

The first is that terrorism is impervious to surveillance. In other words, no matter how much money we spend on tracking our enemies (or citizens), we will never root out every terrorist before they inflict their mayhem. This point stands in sharp contrast to headline stories: we have entered a new phase of "the war against terror" demanding new techniques of surveillance.

The second: we can't kill our way out of terrorism. Readers, pay attention: these are definitively not pronouncements by liberals.

Both these points need emphasis since the (GOP) Congress is rife with jingoistic calls for "more boots on the ground" in the Mideast, blaming President Obama for everything from the sun rising to the sun setting.

The documentary appears almost as though the past CIA directors, to a man, believe something strange and difficult is happening within the body politic of the United States. One can sense, in their direct appeals to the camera filming them, a need -- not to expiate, far from it -- but to explain the limits of CIA power.

It is highly unusual for top officials of the CIA to speak candidly for the record. Consider, for example, that CIA Cold War directors would scarcely allow their photos to be taken, much less be quoted in the media. So "Spymasters" signals a sense of utmost urgency for calm, rational reflection of mistakes we made, to chart a path forward.

The most shocking revelation, widely noted, is by George Tenet, an appointee of George W. Bush. Tenet explains how Condoleezza Rice, the Bush Secretary of State, failed to acknowledge and act on CIA warnings of an imminent attack on America during the summer of 2001. He brings new information to the charge.

Up to this time, the 9/11 narrative has been that a briefing paper on Al Qaeda's plan to attack America was sitting on the president's desk in August. Tenet recounts that after his staff briefed him on concrete information gleaned from surveillance of some of the 9/11 terrorists in June 2001, he was so worried that he instantly disrupted Rice's schedule to convene a meeting with her and his senior staff. In her memoir, Rice reports she does not recall the meeting of any special significance because the terrorism threat had been a constant agenda item during this period of time, but Tenet contradicts Rice. He "slammed his fist on her desk" in an emergency meeting. Afterwards? "Nothing."

The second admission -- by Robert Gates, a Bush CIA director held over by President Obama in his first term -- is self-evident to anyone who has paid attention to the tragic costs of war since 9/11. Gates says to the camera, and to the world, in effect: "Imagine how the world would have been different, if we had not gone to war in Iraq under false pretenses."

In the end, what these CIA directors emphasize -- except perhaps George HW Bush -- is that the best we can hope for through the application of CIA involvement in the Mideast is to "buy time and space" for politicians with the will and moral authority to solve problems that cannot be resolved by war. The key message is "we cannot kill our way out of terror".

(Emphasis added)



'.....except perhaps George HW Bush'---- (CIA Director from January 30, 1976 until January 20, 1977)

That says it all.



Moral, political and socioeconomic will has been virtually unseen in our political leaders for many years.


The time is now for widespread change, instituted by those who possess that will.









19 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Past CIA Directors: 'We can neither kill nor surveil our way out of terror.' (Original Post) seafan Dec 2015 OP
K&R LiberalArkie Dec 2015 #1
This Citizen Notes The Wise Insight - Maybe There Are No Moral Leaders - Simply Because cantbeserious Dec 2015 #2
1000% correct. nt hifiguy Dec 2015 #4
Yep, war is a racket. Correction: war is THE racket. nt valerief Dec 2015 #5
+1 tecelote Dec 2015 #7
any ideas how to do that? Fast Walker 52 Dec 2015 #16
there's no profit in morality Fast Walker 52 Dec 2015 #8
Is there profit to be made carla Dec 2015 #12
there are a lot of jobs that are higher on the moral scale, Fast Walker 52 Dec 2015 #15
big K & R... dhill926 Dec 2015 #3
Fuck the CIA.. They put us where we are today.. mountain grammy Dec 2015 #6
Indeed... Fast Walker 52 Dec 2015 #9
Exactly. nt Live and Learn Dec 2015 #10
But but but, trump said we can watch them all. onecaliberal Dec 2015 #11
One family has been there from the beginning, benefiting and so on from secret government. Octafish Dec 2015 #13
The aspens all turn at the same time... carla Dec 2015 #14
Prescott Bush was the CIA's bag man hifiguy Dec 2015 #17
3 or 4 times dpatbrown Dec 2015 #18
Our biggest mistake has been to reject supporting Liberals in the Middle East.... Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2015 #19

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
2. This Citizen Notes The Wise Insight - Maybe There Are No Moral Leaders - Simply Because
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 02:36 PM
Dec 2015

The Oligarchs, Corporations and Banks are wedded to death and destruction as a profit center.

As should be self-evident, Capitalism is neither moral or wise.

That Capitalism rules Western Democracies should also be self-evident.

Ergo, is there any accident in the observation that no moral leader is willing to stand their ground against Capitalism

 

Fast Walker 52

(7,723 posts)
8. there's no profit in morality
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 04:11 PM
Dec 2015

No material profit anyway.

Is there any way we can make peace and love profitable on a planetary scale?

carla

(553 posts)
12. Is there profit to be made
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 05:19 PM
Dec 2015

from caring? I don't know, but it seems that wealth generated by war is good for a few corporations and dealers, but it is a bust for the rest of us. So is there an economy that is sustainable and serves the needs of people and not the needs of corporations and arms dealers? I imagine we can come up with thousands of careers and businesses that promote human welfare through products and services aimed at making us better happier and more intelligent people. I bet you could come up with ideas in this regard. Peace is what we make it.

 

Fast Walker 52

(7,723 posts)
15. there are a lot of jobs that are higher on the moral scale,
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 05:30 PM
Dec 2015

they just don't happen to pay very well for most people--

Teacher
Artist
Musician
Nurse
Social Worker
Environmentalist
Neighborhood organizer
Peace activist


off the top of my head

mountain grammy

(29,035 posts)
6. Fuck the CIA.. They put us where we are today..
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 03:57 PM
Dec 2015

Yeah, Eisenhower, and his henchmen, the Dulles brothers, ruling the world by deposing popular, elected leaders who would dare challenge the might of American corporate interests around the world.
Now, it's in the interest of the CIA to cover their evil asses. I call bullshit.

The CIA should be shut down.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
13. One family has been there from the beginning, benefiting and so on from secret government.
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 05:23 PM
Dec 2015
Left to right: Henry Luce, Allen Dulles, Clare Boothe Luce, and Billie Cassady aboard the sailing yacht, Niki.



Prescott Bush wrote to Clover Dulles...

I recall in the summer of 1961, after the ill-fated Bay of Pigs affair, you were away and we called Allen to come for supper, and he accepted. That afternoon he called and asked if he could bring a friend, and we said "surely." So he brought John McCone, whom we had known well, but had not thought of as a particular friend of Allen's. But Allen broke the ice promptly, and said, in good spirit, that he wanted us to meet his successor. The announcement came (the) next day. We tried to make a pleasant evening of it, but I was rather sick at heart, and angry too, for it was the Kennedys that brought about the fiasco. And here they were making Allen seem to be the goat, which he wasn't and did not deserve. I have never forgiven them. (Misspellings corrected here.)

SOURCE p. 368 online:

https://books.google.com/books?id=X7OnBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA368&lpg=PA368&dq=john+mccone+%2B+prescott+bush&source=bl&ots=dJAjiC_h6D&sig=fkfjmBYhc8KD3Relu4Vc93mEyCo&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CD0Q6AEwBmoVChMInOeZgovAyAIVBpiACh0JnAxi#v=onepage&q=john%20mccone%20%2B%20prescott%20bush&f=false


Thank you, seafan, for your most important OP. The players -- the beneficiaries of secret government agencies and policies, from drug dealing to dirty banking -- call themselves The Aspens, look like a forest of individual trees above ground, but really are connected by their roots underground. When the former CIA directors, en masse, express their worries, you know damn well they're worried about their threat upon the United States of America -- from We the People to the Constitution itself.
 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
17. Prescott Bush was the CIA's bag man
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 05:37 PM
Dec 2015

in the Senate, as David Talbot explains in "The Devil's Chessboard." The man who made sure no potentially embarrassing questions were ever asked.

 

dpatbrown

(368 posts)
18. 3 or 4 times
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 06:05 PM
Dec 2015

Thanks for the post. What I find to be so interesting, is that I can't remember ANY media source (left or right) that spent one second on Rice's lack of attention. I was reading profusely, from 2000 to 2012, on the Bush administration and other related topics, as many books as I could get my hands on. The reason I say this, is that I read the same things about Rice back in 05, several times. No one was reporting on it. I always felt that the media went very easy on her, she wasn't very bright, and was only there to show her face. She was used.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
19. Our biggest mistake has been to reject supporting Liberals in the Middle East....
Sun Dec 6, 2015, 08:03 PM
Dec 2015

Example: If we had embraced the young people in Tahrir Square in Egypt.

They did NOT toss out Mubarak to install the Muslim Brotherhood. (Despite what Bill Maher thinks)

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