Noam Chomsky: Paris Attacks Are Result of Western Policies in Middle East

[eridani]

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/34046-noam-chomsky-paris-attacks-are-result-of-western-policies-in-middle-east

"If you want to end it, the first question you ask is: why did it take place? What were the immediate causes and what were the deeper roots? And then you try to address those," Professor Chomsky stated in an interview with acTVism Munich, an independent and non-profit global online media network.

Otherwise, the simple bombing strategy will do nothing but increase the likelihood of more terrorist attacks.

Furthermore, Chomsky added that it's probably impossible to defeat Deash by military force; but even if it happened and the West managed to destroy the terrorists, something worse would emerge in its place if the underlying root causes aren't properly addressed.

[killbotfactory]

1. Maybe subjecting entire generations of middle easterners to another decade of war and occupation...

will have better results this time around?

[GummyBearz]

2. Guess we just surrender and let them impose their brand of justice upon us all

since we cant go offensive, or be isolationist. In order to address the wrong doings of past generations, we all must stick our neck out and let them swing the sword. Who wants to go first?

[eridani]

4. Why don't you outline their plan for "imposing justice" on us?

Terrorism is the weapon of the weak. Because they are weak, they can't impose diddly-squat on us. However, it looks like we are getting better and better at terrorizing ourselves.

[GummyBearz]

6. Uhh... I'm not one of them, How could I outline their plans?

The OP began with quotes stating the west is to blame for what is going on, and we can't be militarily offensive. I highly doubt you would suggest we should be isolationist and refuse syrian refugees either. So, the only remaining option is to apologize to ISIS... apologize for our ancestors being jerks, and let them decide what justice should be imposed. This is the logical conclusion I got from your OP. If there is another logical conclusion that I am not seeing, please state directly what conclusion is

[eridani]

7. There are quite a few other options

First and foremost of which is winding down our worldwide military empire. It's really too bad you can't think of other ways of being engaged in the world.

[GummyBearz]

9. Yea, like pulling out of Iraq. We did that, right?

Why did ISIS bomb the russian jet liner? Is Russia a puppet of the west? Or maybe, just maybe, ISIS is fucking psycho and cannot be reasonable. Huh.. they also set a jordanian on fire while he was alive. Does jordan have a history of imperialism in the mid east too?

[daleanime]

16. Do you really think that the world can turn on a dime?

The reckless actions of the last 15 years are going to take us at least that long to try to repair, and we really haven't started yet.

But I'm sure if we continue to kill people it will all work out in the end.

[Yorktown]

17. Do you really think that the Talibans, al Shabaab or Boko Haram were created by the West?

Or do you think there might be something else at work?

And have been at it for longer than "the last 15 years"?

Still ours to repair?

[eridani]

19. Yes. The fundies would have little traction if not for western imperialism n/t

[Yorktown]

23. You're dreaming.

Or you don't know much about Islam.

Your pick.

[eridani]

25. Wondering where all the Islamic terrorists were in 1955?

The issue never came up in the Eisenhower/Stevenson race.

[Yorktown]

37. Just an idea: 30 years of Saudi funding might have helped them sprout?

What do you think?

[eridani]

54. You're right. So why is Saudi Arabia a major ally of ours? n/t

[Yorktown]

56. Because renewables are not here just yet

Imagine Iran controlling the Gulf States.

[hack89]

47. The PLO was too busy attacking Israel. Nt

[Act_of_Reparation]

52. Where was the United States in the 7th century?

When the Kharijites were assassinating caliphs?

I agree with Chomsky in that western foreign policy is an immediate cause of Islamic terrorism, but the roots of the phenomenon grow much deeper. The the internal political and cultural history of the religion are not insignificant considerations, and should have guided our Cold War and modern policies towards the Middle East. But none of our politicians seem to have paid much attention in history class...

[eridani]

55. Looks like everyone in this thread is conflating regular war with terrorism.

Actually, there are good reasons for doing that, come to think of it. In our century, there just isn't such a thing as an Islamic force that has the capability of establishing an empire. If they did, they wouldn't need terrorism, the weapon of the weak.

[EX500rider]

45. "First and foremost of which is winding down our worldwide military empire."

So that's why they attacked Paris?
I don't think France has any of that.

[Yorktown]

15. Well, that is what ISIS and the Muslim Brotherhood want

[mwrguy]

3. He's right, this is just chickens coming home to roost

Centuries of oppressing the rest of the world is biting the west on the ass.

[GummyBearz]

5. When ISIS destroyed world heritage sites in syria and iraq, was that really sticking it to the west?

Or was it just the dark age mentality of destroying the works of some other civilization (that has been gone for however long) who never did anything to them? I'm sure you will find a CIA link between the ancient city of Palmyra and the west.

Or maybe ISIS really are the worst of human kind, bent on destroying our world heritage if doesn't conform to their religion, and enslaving or killing anyone who opposes them, no matter how much you try to apologize for another generation's sin.

I'm sure selling women into sex slavery by the thousands is another way they are just reacting to the west. It can't be that they are actually some of the most despicable people on the planet, because that title belongs to the French, right?

[eridani]

8. The US attack on Iraq created ISIS

About time to catch up with reality here.

[GummyBearz]

10. Thats why they destroy ancient middle east cities. To get back at the US. Amazing answer

Keep trying

[closeupready]

12. Does it pain you, how wrong your answers are, next to the

vast knowledge of someone with a moniker referencing a well-known candy product?

[closeupready]

11. I know it isn't funny, but your lack of insight here is downright silly.

And frankly, your hardness. You frame good questions in a way that implies you think you're Perry Mason, and you already know the answers to every question you pose, and that those answers are unequivocal.

Well, it has always been the way here on DU, that almost every member of this board is distantly related to the Oracle of Delphi, knowing everything about everything, everywhere, anytime.

[Dorian Gray]

35. It happened with the communists in China

and it's happening now.

People so wrapped up in their ideology they want to destroy all that is a reminder of a different mindset/culture.

[Yorktown]

14. As if the rest of the world never attacked/subjugate the west

You really want the west to be the ultimate eternal bad guy, don't you?

[eridani]

21. The last time anyone attacked the west, they were stopped at the Pyrenees--

--and outside of Vienna.

[Yorktown]

22. Buy a history book

[eridani]

24. Silly person n/t

[Yorktown]

38. What a powerful argument. nt.

[L. Coyote]

13. The result especially of the actions of George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.

And they still need to be held to account. Which Presidential candidate is going to do that?

[LittleBlue]

18. I have a better plan. Send a massive force like we did during the first Gulf War

We defeated Saddam's army in a few days, Isis's army isn't even close to that strong.

Go village to village to conduct trials. Anyone who was part of Isis is executed. Anyone who materially supported Isis is executed. Shoot them in the back of the head and throw their bodies into mass graves. Then pull out and hand the cities back to Assad so he can deal with the rest.

Any future attacks on us will be traced to their source and their country dealt with in the same manner. Any leader who shelters Isis, including Saudis, will be hanged.

That would cripple Isis.

[eridani]

20. Massive force succeeded then only because we didn/t stay there n/t

[BeyondGeography]

26. Finally

Someone has the stone tablets.

[merrily]

27. France bombed Syria in September. Isil attacked France in November.

Probably just a wild coincidence.

Of course, media reported the former as France's bombing Isil in Syria, not as France's bombing Syria, but do the math.

[BlueStateLib]

28. Sheikh-ul-Islam declares an Islamic holy war

On November 14, 1914, in Constantinople, capital of the Ottoman Empire, the religious leader Sheikh-ul-Islam declares an Islamic holy war on behalf of the Ottoman government, urging his Muslim followers to take up arms against Britain, France, Russia, Serbia and Montenegro in World War I.
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/ottoman-empire-declares-a-holy-war

[eridani]

29. And Turkey would never have entered the war without this? n/t

[melman]

30. Really?

Do Western policies make them do this?

[img] [/img]


How about this?

http://www.nytimes.com/video/world/middleeast/100000003226608/isis-slave-market-day.html

[eridani]

31. Was that going on in 1955? If not, why not? n/t

[Throd]

39. Yes.

[eridani]

42. Must have been why Stevenson and Eisenhower argued so much about stopping hijackings

Don't remember any of that myself.

[killbotfactory]

50. Over a decade of occupation, bombings, drones, etc...

kids growing up having their future destroyed because of our illegal war.

we taught them everything they know about the value of life.

[joshcryer]

32. The first step is to prosecute the war criminals.

Until then there is no credibility with the US and middle east policy.

Bush belongs in the Hague.

[eridani]

33. Agree 100%, Unfortunately, I don't think even Sanders would do that n/t

[joshcryer]

34. I think Sanders would do an investigation.

Even that would at least be a start.

Set up a special prosecutor to investigate the Bush administrations justification for war in the middle east.

Join the International Criminal Court while you're at it.

[RedCappedBandit]

36. Well he's right

We can't carry on acting like our oppressive imperialist agenda across the globe has no ramifications

[JEB]

40. There has got to be a better plan

than just keep pouring bombs money and death into the ME.

[maxsolomon]

41. There are 2 questions: Why? and How?

How? is the immediate, practical question that stops other plots. How did they smuggle the weapons into Central Paris? Where did they acquire them?

Why? is a long-term question. Frankly, the Goose is cooked regarding Arab Sunnis. There's not a lot we can do to change hearts and minds among that populace at this point. We had a chance in the wake of 9/11, but it was squandered. We didn't do all of the damage, but we sure did fuck up in Iraq.

My solution is twofold:
1. Quarantine. Short-term. Isolate and cordon off the Caliphate. You go into ISIL-territory, you don't get to come out and return to your home in W. Europe. You just surrendered your Citizenship.

2. The Love Bomb. Long-term. After 9/11, we should have begun a campaign of largesse in other parts of the Muslim world where we would have been accepted - Africa, Asia. Sponsor infrastructure projects: women's health, clean water, sewers, power grids. Make sure they get built.

[grossproffit]

43. What utter bullshit. Islamism is to blame, period.

Islamism is a political ideology that wants to to implement Islamic Sharia in all walks of life.

One mustn't confuse secular Muslims with Islamists.

[youtube]

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[killbotfactory]

51. hardcore militants tend to pop up to fill power vacuums

we should stop creating them.

[Blue_Tires]

44. Shorter Chomsky:

"Because their national government droned somebody somewhere, all those dead Parisians should have been expecting a justified counter-attack!"

[philosslayer]

46. Great article

Very thought provoking.

[cemaphonic]

48. I think it's too simplistic to reduce the cause to foreign policy alone

If aggressive foreign policy in the Middle East was the root cause of terrorism in the West, you would expect to find that the US would be the lightning rod instead of France or the UK (and increasingly in Belgium, the Netherlands and Sweden as well). I think the domestic situation has a lot more effect on the frequency and severity of Western terrorist attacks than anything else. All of those countries have sizable Muslim minorities that are largely ghettoized, and cut off from full economic and cultural participation, and despite a trend over the last decade toward multiculturalism, they are all countries with a long history as ethnic nation-states, so people outside of the cultural majority have a very hard time feeling accepted.

The US, while not without problems of this sort as well, has been a lot more accommodating to Muslim immigrants (especially in the urban areas where they tend to settle), and we have a cultural history of periodic waves of immigrants that integrate into the cultural mainstream (while changing it in the process) over a couple of generations. As a result, despite our foreign policy, Muslims in America are far less susceptible to the sort of radicalism that has been brewing in European cities and towns over the last few decades.

[smirkymonkey]

53. *This*

Thread winner!

[marmar]

49. Right, as always. He speaks difficult truths ..........

...... things that some can't handle. Apparently even here on DU.