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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHis backyard ice rink honors a stepdaughter’s memory. Now county inspectors may close it.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/his-backyard-ice-rink-honors-a-stepdaughters-memory-now-county-inspectors-may-close-it/2015/12/31/abb447ac-afdd-11e5-b820-eea4d64be2a1_story.htmlMarc Kohn spent nearly $40,000 and 400 hours building a hockey rink behind his house in rural Poolesville, Md., a winter twist on “Field of Dreams.”
He longed for his childhood days in Boston, skating on neighborhood ponds for hours. And he wanted to honor his stepdaughter Melanie Osborne, a lifelong hockey fan who recently died.
Kohn, 51, called his backyard project Mel’s Rink, hung her name in Christmas lights and invited town residents to play. Since opening two weeks ago, dozens of kids and adults have zipped around the synthetic ice for free.
But this week county inspectors showed up — without their skates. Now Mel’s Rink is in jeopardy.
“It’s a lovely idea, and we understand it’s a labor of love, but it has to be the right place for it,” said Diane Schwartz Jones, with Montgomery County’s department of permitting services.
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yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Everyone is outraged over this, and I mean everyone. I am actually glad to see everyone backing the Dad. I think Maryland will back down on this. Sometimes common sense has to win or I certainly hope so.
RKP5637
(67,112 posts)I once lived in an area where an elderly man had put up a couple of shelves in his one car garage. He stocked the shelves with a few common products someone might want. The locals used to stop by and get a few things. His prices were super low. It was like a tiny friendly garage sale. No cars, really, maybe one an hour. It gave him something to do.
So, the city decided he was a nuisance or something and was operating a business out of his house and were moving to close him down, like he was some huge corporate operation operating illegally.
The sense of community and sharing, kindness and all continues IMO to drain from American life. And common sense is no longer allowed.
Hopefully Maryland will back down.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)Business licenses assure proper insurance, tax compliance, and public safety.
A few blocks away from me there is a mother and daughter who decided to sell burritos out of their garage....should this be allowed too? No inspection, no food safety, no commercial experience....
RKP5637
(67,112 posts)Facility Inspector
(615 posts)home cooked burritos? FUCK YEAH!
pipoman
(16,038 posts)In a microwave, topped with 60 degree lettuce, tomato, and sour cream...yummm...where's the bathroom? Or the hospital....
Facility Inspector
(615 posts)pipoman
(16,038 posts)Food sales to the public.
Guess you haven't seen all the Chipotle hate hereabouts over food borne illness....
Facility Inspector
(615 posts)pipoman
(16,038 posts)Facility Inspector must be a joke eh?
jonno99
(2,620 posts)
avebury
(11,196 posts)pipoman
(16,038 posts)saturnsring
(1,832 posts)you on your way with a bill that you either send to insurance or pay out of pocket. it's just that complicated.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)You go to the hospital, they ask where you were injured, they bill the owner of the premises who passes the bill to their premise liability insurance company. If they don't have premise liability the bill is submitted to the injured's insurance, that insurance subrogates and sues the owner of the property for reimbursement....
saturnsring
(1,832 posts)other than the owner of the child brought in - the hospital doesn't care where you got hurt - they treat your child they bill YOUR insurance. the insurance sends you your portion that you are responsible for and you pay it.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)roscoeroscoe
(1,825 posts)Insurancw, the death of reason in America
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)If there are injuries then someone will be out of pocket, and they will try to recover their loss by suing the operator of tha facility where the injury occurred.
jonno99
(2,620 posts)the premises where you hurt yourself be automatically billed (even their insurance)?
Answer: zero accountability (it's never my fault...)
RobinA
(10,478 posts)They bill insurance. Been there, done that.
broke my elbow skating at a rink. Went to hospital, was X-rayed, told it was broken and to see my orthopedics guy. Went to orthopedics guy who agreed it was broken. ER bills and orthopedic bill sent to insurance. Insurance sent me a letter asking me to sign a paper agreeing to reimburse them if I collected anything in litigation. Insurance then paid bill after pretending to lose the paperwork a couple times. No lawsuit, I slipped on slippery ice.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)to cover a public ice skating rink in his policy.
saturnsring
(1,832 posts)
Kingofalldems
(40,243 posts)I don't know anyone who is, frankly. Who exactly is outraged? Any evidence?
I am sure freepers are outraged.
yellowcanine
(36,773 posts)Sorry but counties have the duty to enforce zoning laws. If you have ever lived anywhere with loose or nonexistent zoning laws you would appreciate the county's position. The dad could have/should have applied for a variance. May have gotten it. May still get it. Doing things the wrong way for good reasons is still doing things the wrong way.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)maybe 10 miles away.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Although I should have been more clear.
NV Whino
(20,886 posts)Lack of some kind of permit seems to be the problem. A commercial enterprise in a residential area? Building permit? 
Seems to me the county should be pitching in to help. This guy has created a nice gathering place to bring kids and families together, get them away from the tube and their smart phones, and keep them off the streets and out of trouble.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)It could be a permit situation. I think the county could send him the paperwork and price for the permit and be done. The permit is a couple hundred dollars and the rink costs 40K. He might not even have known he needed a permit. I know that is too bad for him but the county is there to help not hinder. Well at least that was original intent.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)It is notice to begin an inspection of the construction. For instance a permit for a house begins with a site inspection to be sure the proposed site is far enough from public right of way, isn't over a nuclear waste site, or some other issue not immediately visible. Then the footing is dug which triggers another inspection to be sure the footing is properly constructed and in the right place....after this inspection the footings can be poured. Next is any plumbing under the poured floor inspected before the floor can be poured....etc, etc, etc....these things cannot be done retroactively...he spent $40k...we don't know that it wouldn't have cost $80k to build correctly in compliance....
Kingofalldems
(40,243 posts)
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)
pipoman
(16,038 posts)But I have no idea who would undertake a $40k, 400 hour construction project without in investigating the permit, inspection and licensing requirements.
The permitting and inspection laws are there so someone doesn't waste their time and money building something that ends up too dangerous for public use.
What if a neighborhood kid is killed or seriously injured because of some aspect of his design? Will his homeowners insurance pay? Probably not.
Maybe the community should put their money where their feelings are and help him bring the place into compliance or build one in an area properly zoned and designed?
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)I am sure this story will have a lot of moving parts. I just wished the county would be a bit more helpful in at least explaining what is wrong. He clearly probably has the money for a permit. I think it is the way the county has gone about it.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)For things like this. The licensure assures public safety is in place and thet the operators are properly insured...
Love the idea but, yea.
lpbk2713
(43,270 posts)Oh yeah.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)to keep us safe from backyard skating rinks.
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)You be fulminating about people trying to duck out from under regulation and ask why building inspectors weren't on top of it. We have meddling bureaucrats to implement rules that were typically put in place in response to a pattern of problematic activity, such as an ongoing disregard for safety.
Next time you're in a second hand bookstore see if you can find an old casebook on tort law and read some of it. The details of various avoidable historical accidents will make your hair curl.
I have a story I like to tell some people about how there are government rules on the design of drain covers for swimming pools, and sure enough most listeners chuckle and agree that it's absurd that we need laws dictating the shape and style of plastic drain covers, a task better left to engineers and pool operators to sort out among themselves. Then I tell them about the what happens where those rules are not in place - children can get pulled onto the drain by the powerful water suction and drown or have their intestines pulled out. Which is exactly why some jurisdictions have adjusted pool safety standards...
Kingofalldems
(40,243 posts)tabasco
(22,974 posts)I really see no great danger to the community from a goddamn plastic skating rink. LOL. As soon as the nanny state gets out of our lives, the better. I grew up skating on frozen farm ponds and managed to survive.
[font size=6]OH THE HUMANITY!!![/font]
FYI - thanks for the recommendation. I had multiple torts classes in law school, so I've read all those terrible horror stories. Never read one about a plastic skating rink. Nevertheless, there's a great deal of negligence law I don't agree with.
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)If you went to law school then you understand the concept of negligent liability perfectly well and you are just posturing. Whether you disagree with a large chunk of negligence law is beside the point, since you're not the one seeking to be made whole - and if you are ever a plaintiff in a negligence case, I'm sure you'll excuse the lack of intellectual consistency with the well-worn entitlement excuse.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Have a nice day!
Downwinder
(12,869 posts)and a swimming pool?
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)pipoman
(16,038 posts)
leftyladyfrommo
(19,981 posts)That's what we had here. An anonymous person left little fairy houses in the woods for children to find.
The powers that be tore it all down. Not allowed.
She built a very special one in memory of a little girl who died. I think it was allowed to stay?
What's wrong with people?
I know that as a child I would have been over the moon if I had discovered something like that. They were little tiny fairy houses with doors and furniture and really neat little miniature stuff inside. Now who the hell was that hurting?
jonno99
(2,620 posts)saturnsring
(1,832 posts)jonno99
(2,620 posts)You can just unilaterally waive liability and be in the clear. People are not that competent at assessing risk in the first place, and in particular they lack the knowledge to assess whether the operators of an attraction are always competent and diligent or whether they are sometimes negligent. Because things like structures and commercial attractions are generally permitted, the public assumes a certain standard of safety is being adhered to, and if that turns out not to be the case they might well sue the county (or other responsible party) for failing to inspect a facility that turned out to be dangerous or inadequate.
Also, while it seems everyone in the vicintiy is OK with his ice rink, this isn't always the case. Often such things are deemed an attractive nuisance because the popularity leads to commercial traffic that interferes with neighbors' enjoyment of their own property.
Think what a boon it would be to corporations if all they had to do was put up 'enter at your own risk' signs outside any commercial premises and escape any sort of liability for what transpired by saying 'they knew the risks.'
tularetom
(23,664 posts)Fear of losing their jobs forces code enforcement people and other local government employees to more or less be dicks in carrying out their duties and the codes themselves are structured so as to discourage common sense and judgment.
We are a litigious society and the fear of lawsuits determines our action in many areas. Nowhere is this fear more prevalent than in local government.
yellowcanine
(36,773 posts)constructs something which blocks their view or whatever.
Voice for Peace
(13,141 posts)Period.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)and skate a few laps. With the cameras rolling. 
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)By Paul Wagner
POSTED: DEC 31 2015 06:19PM EST
... Kohn began constructing the rink in his backyard using synthetic materials for ice on top of gravel and pallets ...
"I got a call from the director of permitting yesterday saying that this had become too public and that the area this house is in, the agricultural reserve, doesn't support any type of play area unless it’s related to horses or equestrian events,” Kohn told us.
And that is just part of the problem. Diane Schwartz-Jones, the director of Permitting Services for Montgomery County, said she wants to make sure the place is safe, and without the proper permits, Kohn was hit with a notice of violation ...
http://www.fox5dc.com/news/local-news/67262875-story
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)BY KEVIN LEWIS, JEANNETTE REYES, ABC7 THURSDAY, DECEMBER 31ST 2015
POOLESVILLE, Md. (WJLA) - ... "We are very sympathetic to Mr. Kohn's situation and believe that the rink is a labor of love for his daughter, Melanie. The rink is being promoted for public use, rather than personal use, which raises concerns about public safety, community impacts and compatibility with the agricultural reserve," wrote Diane Schwartz Jones, Director of the Montgomery County Department of Permitting Services ...
http://wjla.com/news/local/popular-backyard-ice-rink-in-jeopardy-of-being-shut-down
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)By Derrick Ward
... Since real ice wouldn’t last in our weather, "It's a half-inch thick ultra-high-density polyethylene plastic," Kohn said ... Technically, the county hasn't shut the rink down, and it's unknown whether that will actually happen.
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Hockey-Rink-Tribute-to-Stepdaughter-on-Thin-Ice-363962911.html
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)I'm not sure why you keep posting different versions off the same story over and over.
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)#38 indicates there's a zoning issue related to the agricultural reserve
#39 reports local officials are sympathetic to Kohn
#40 provides some information on the construction, as well as the fact that the "rink" has not been closed
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)After all, you have shown above that the salient information can be summed up in just 3 lines of text.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)The DANGER is real !!1!!
struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)In 1980, the Montgomery County Council made one of the most significant land-use decisions in county history by creating what we call the Agricultural Reserve. Heralded as one of the best examples of land conservation policies in the country, the Agricultural Reserve encompasses 93,000 acres – almost a third of the county’s land resources – along the county’s northern, western, and eastern borders.
The Agricultural Reserve and its accompanying Master Plan and zoning elements were designed to protect farmland and agriculture. Along with a sustained commitment to agriculture through the county's Agricultural Services Division, the combination of tools helps retain more than 500 farms that contribute millions of dollars to Montgomery County's annual economy. This is a notable achievement in an area so close to the nation's capital, where development pressure remains perpetual and intense ...
Although primarily a working agricultural landscape, the Agricultural Reserve offers county residents a plethora of activities. Check out the Reserve's many opportunities -- pick-your-own fruit farms, a winery, bike routes and pastoral scenic vistas -- in a resource guide and map, produced in collaboration with the Montgomery Countryside Alliance. Beyond that, the Reserve represents a historic landscape as well as a resource that protects our public water supply and provides access to green open spaces ...
http://www.montgomeryplanning.org/community/ag_reserve.shtm
kwassa
(23,340 posts)struggle4progress
(126,024 posts)Cabin John Ice Rink in Rockville
http://www.montgomeryparks.org/enterprise/ice/cabin_john/
Wheaton Ice Arena
http://www.montgomeryparks.org/enterprise/ice/wheaton/
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Montgomery County has outstanding services, great parks and swimming complexes.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)
Omaha Steve
(109,060 posts)
OS