Before any of us continue cheerleading threads citing RW propaganda crafted to divide, a reminder:

[blm]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by one_voice (a host of the General Discussion forum).

This tactic was first started in the early 70s by infiltrating VVAW - Vietnam Vets Against the War. Why? Because it was determined that they were the most effective messengers. Planted operatives attended meetings and began urging violence to make their points. It worked on some, but, pushed some longtime members away.

I don't believe the math holds up that Nader caused Gore to lose Florida in 2000, but, it is true that GOP operatives targeted the left, yet again, with the goal of splitting the vote to favor Bush.

Here at DU in 2003-4, there were constant over the top attacks being made against the Dem party from some posters posing as Kucinich and Dean supporters who were later revealed to be GOP operatives. seventhson and his pals made DU their playground.

Then (post2012) those operatives were given HUGE BANK ACCOUNTS by the RW machine to guarantee a 2016 WH win:

http://all-len-all.com/the-gops-long-game-to-bait-the-left-into-turning-against-hillary-clinton/

>>>>
When Mitt Romney lost the election, the GOP looked at the potential field of Democratic candidates, and determined that Hillary Clinton was most likely to be the Democratic choice for 2016. Beginning then, a number of conservative groups, including American Crossroads–created by Karl Rove–and America Rising, set to work to develop messaging that would damage her with voters on the left.

The effort to vilify Mrs. Clinton could ultimately cost several hundred million dollars, given the variety and volume of political organizations involved.

Because the Clintons have been in the public eye for so long, and have weathered so many scandals (many of them having proven to be nothing but empty political attacks) American Crossroads knew that they’d have to create and test messaging that would break through to the public. To that end, they gathered focus groups of voters they consider susceptible,

……...
an all-white mix of young men, low-income adults, married mothers and politically moderate women….They showed the voters, who received $100, sandwiches and soft drinks for their time, more than a dozen 30-second ads.
The ads highlighted Mrs. Clinton’s deleting of emails from her private account, tried to tie her to President Obama, portrayed her as distant from middle-class Americans and sought to persuade women that they do not need to support her because of her gender.But many, essentially, struck the same theme, depicting Mrs. Clinton as untrustworthy.
……..

They gathered responses from these paid testers, and with the cumulative information, determined that the words “untrustworthy”, “corporatist” “out of touch with ordinary people” and so forth, should form the basis of their attacks.Using the keywords they discovered had sticking power, they used them in every publication, ever utterance by talking heads, every press release, etc., and they have become wallpaper now. The left has eagerly joined in using them. But perhaps even more insidious, they have created tweets and other online content that appears to originate from the left, and have sent them on to be retweeted and forwarded widely.

For months now, America Rising has sent out a steady stream of posts on social media attacking Mrs. Clinton, some of them specifically designed to be spotted, and shared, by liberals. The posts highlight critiques of her connections to Wall Street and the Clinton Foundation and feature images of Democrats like Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts and Mayor Bill de Blasio of New York, interspersed with cartoon characters and pictures of Kevin Spacey, who plays the villain in “House of Cards.” And as they are read and shared, an anti-Clinton narrative is reinforced.America Rising is not the only conservative group attacking Mrs. Clinton from the left. Another is American Crossroads, the group started by Karl Rove, which has been sending out its own digital content, including one ad using a speech Ms. Warren gave at the New Populism Conference in Washington last May.

In the fast-moving online universe people read, share and pass on information, often without checking the source. Thus, criticism of Hillary created by right-wing superPACs gives the appearance of originating on the left. Certainly, the keywords mentioned above, and the use of Elizabeth Warren–for one example–to discredit Hillary, has been frequently seen here and elsewhere on the left.Sometimes, errors are caught.

The tactic is making for some awkward moments online. The A.F.L.-C.I.O. sent to its more than 60,000 followers an America Rising tweet praising its president, Richard L. Trumka, for a speech that was seen as challenging Mrs. Clinton on economic issues, only to take it down a few hours later, saying it was a mistake.

>>>>>>>

BOTTOM LINE: Check your sources, and police ourselves.

Sanders is a great man, a great candidate, and can win WITHOUT any of us being tools for Rove's GOP operatives and THEIR quest to keep some of the left swallowing and spreading their propaganda.

Hillary supporters - they are using you, too, to frame Sanders and his supporters as out of touch commies. Stop helping them. I'd come to your page to say this, but, you blocked me long ago for basically asking you to use caution in your frames.

[villager]

1. Rec'ing, because similar tactics were also used in the environmental movement in the 70's & 80's

I saw the 80's-era infiltration unfold, first hand.

In those pre-internet days, I would talk to other lefty-liberal types outside the enviro movement, in particular, to let them know how ruthless the other side's tactics actually were.

Few wanted to believe it.

[blm]

2. Yep - This is why it is up to us long timers here to speak up when we see it and

not deny it when we know better. We have SEEN it out there and in here. This is DU's third primary - we know what they are capable of because we experienced it.

[leveymg]

3. Hillary is her own worst enemy.

She handed the GOP the most effective issues that have undermined public trust in her. Rove and Co. are just opportunists who generally do an incompetent job of exposing her legal and ethical problems.

[blm]

5. That doesn't mean we need to be used as fools and tools, mark.

And half of her 'legal' problems were bogus - you, of all people, should have recognized that the 2 years spent at Rose Law Firm (using cover of Whitewater) were to scrub all files of Jackson Stephens who was a named figure in Kerry's 1992 BCCI report, and a longtime ally of GHWBush who Stephens was helping when he brought BCCI bank to the US in the 70s.

Point being - don't catapult the propaganda crafted by RW operatives or spreading it when you recognize it being used here. That shouldn't be too much to ask of those committed to stop a GOP WH.

You are FAR better than that, Mark, and you don't need it, just as I never did when I opposed her vociferously here for many years. My GOTV work has become a priority now, and THAT is my key focus. Plus, I was blocked from HRC group. ; )

[nashville_brook]

9. the nomination doesn't belong to HRC.

[blm]

16. I didn't say it did. This post is about well-financed operation against the entire party.

Rove decided to train the propaganda machine against the nominee HE anticipated.

[nashville_brook]

24. and you're creating the illusion that any pro-Sanders material is planted by Rove. nice.

[blm]

25. How did you come to that conclusion?

I specifically said RW propaganda and that people need to check their sources first.

Nowhere in there is any suggestion of pro-Sanders material being planted by Rove.

In fact, I clearly state that the tactic is being used to con Clinton supporters, too, to frame Sanders with RW frames.

After all this time, nash, one would expect that you would know by now that one of my biggest issues here since I started was targeting the RW media machine and exposing their operations. You should also know me well for the many years I was the most vociferous critic of Clintons here and I didn't need to rely on RW propaganda to do it. Not ONE time.

Thanks for ignoring my contributions for over a decade, nash, and for misstating my purpose for this thread.

[leveymg]

32. Agree with that 100% That's why progressive Dems need to do their own investigation and analysis.

The central fact of American foreign policy since World War Two is that it proceeds largely by clandestine action, and that cover ups of policy failures and the inevitable corruption of secret government is truly a bi-partisan affair.

Operations blow back, as they sometimes do in spectacular fashion, and that can't always simply be ignored or denied. The last honest and successful efforts to investigate the CIA and black ops was the Church and Pike Committees of the mid-1970s. The Kerry Committee report that followed was partially successful in recording the elaborate criminal operations of BCCI and the interlocking financial and intelligence scandals of the Reagan-Bush era that included Iran-Contra, the S&L ripoff, and illegal Saudi penetration of American banking and investment markets.

Throughout, we have seen the peculiar Washington institution of Congressional committee investigation repeatedly rolled out. It is really an elaborate performance art, complete with onstage pyrotechnics, light shows and smoke generators. It serves mainly to distract by omission from the subjects and figures at the periphery, such as the Stephens of Little Rock, the Baker and Albriton Texas banking families that worked with the bin Mahfooz-bin Laden clan to takeover, collapse and loot the remains of large Texas banks and S&Ls across the south. Those getting the least attention in open session are usually the most important. Congressional committees are smoke and mirrors and white noise generating machines. While under the spotlight of the Whitewater scandal, the Clintons got clean away from the much larger crimes attendant to BCCI and Iran-Contra -- complex, multinational criminal enterprises that operated under cover of covert CIA operations set into motion by Director George H.W. Bush.

Senator Kerry Committee's report was in may ways a brave and revealing effort. But, what has followed was folly. By the same practiced incompetence as the Whitewater, the Republicans turned State Department and CIA covert operations in Libya and Syria into the Benghazi!!!! witch hunt. Ironically, but not unpredictably, it appeared initially that the primary beneficiary was Hillary Clinton, herself. Had she not set up a private email system that systematically evaded FOIA requests, and email by her and aides sharing classified materials with Sidney Blumenthal been made public by a Romanian hacker, the show might have worked.

The art of cover-up is an old and much practiced unspoken truth glazed over by the Senate Report is that at the center of BCCI was a scheme hatched up by then CIA Director Bush and Saudi GID chief Prince al-Turki to create a slush fund to finance covert operations that Congress and the incoming Carter Administration wouldn't. That agreement in the summer or 1976 was known as the Safari Club, which was a multinational agreement among the heads of intelligence agencies to trade Saudi money for far greater latitude given the Saudis own covert operations. Out of this agreement came BCCI and its funding of the Pakistani nuclear program, as well as global expansion of KSA's own paramilitary capabilities, which became the Mujahaddin and al-Qaeda, and most recently the Islamic State. In the process, it morphed into the multi-billion dollar "al-Yamama" arms for oil slush fund, much of which went to buy politicians. and the Riggs Bank accounts used by then Saudi Ambassador Bandar to bankroll al-Qaeda operatives inside the US who went on to carry out the 9/11 attacks. See, http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/7/355152/-

Saudi petrodollars have continued to finance CIA-sanctioned operations ever since, including in Syria, where these funds ended up bankrolling ISIS. That came out just a few weeks ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/24/world/middleeast/us-relies-heavily-on-saudi-money-to-support-syrian-rebels.html?_r=0

U.S. Relies Heavily on Saudi Money to Support Syrian Rebels
By MARK MAZZETTI and MATT APUZZOJAN. 23, 2016

(. . .)

The support for the Syrian rebels is only the latest chapter in the decadeslong relationship between the spy services of Saudi Arabia and the United States, an alliance that has endured through the Iran-contra scandal, support for the mujahedeen against the Soviets in Afghanistan and proxy fights in Africa. Sometimes, as in Syria, the two countries have worked in concert. In others, Saudi Arabia has simply written checks underwriting American covert activities.

(. . .)

The Kerry Committee report was a fine piece of investigation, one of the best ever produced from inside the legislative branch. But, it needs to be updated and expanded. Many of the same U.S. covert operators and corrupt public officials who were read into Iran-Contra and other BCCI funded activities were given a lifetime pass, and have been protected. These same figures went on to orchestrate the phony WMD and organize the Congressional sign-off of the invasion of Iraq. What we need is an honest approach to the corrupt, covert operations that still involve Saudi money.

And, our investigation and analysis has to be better than the other side's takeaway, which invariably is spun and off-target. They don't care about truth as much as results-oriented outcomes. It is in this way that the US covert operations in Libya and the funneling of arms and fighters to Syria became the farce of "Benghazi." That sort of whitewash follows the Iran-Contra and 9/11 cover-ups. We have to recognize and point out to our readers relevant mitigating as well as incriminating factors behind policy failures. I always approach every source with a degree of skepticism, and try to weigh all sides before coming to my own conclusions.

[blm]

36. I agree with that SO much. What GOP was doing with THEIR version of Benghazi

was absolutely to pin it on State Dept knowing full well that the CIA would remain protected on ALL sides. It always was a covert CIA operation under the direction Gen Petraeus.

[Hekate]

10. No. The Right is her worst enemy. You should ask yourself why this is. nt

[Phlem]

13. Wow. Not getting the point........again.

[Hekate]

14. Oh I get the point all right. I've watched this crap play out against the Clintons since the 1990s.

I watched Newt Gingrich turn the very word "liberal" into a dirty word, reminiscent of how the word "Jew" can be used as a dirty word. "Liberal" did not become an epithet overnight, but Gingrich taught the right wing how to do it and spread the practice throughout the media, and one fine day during the BushCheney administration I realized the work had been completed. I, who used to be proud to call myself a liberal, not defiant, not anything but just describing my end of the political spectrum, realized I no longer wanted to say it because the whole public perception had been changed.

I was an adult during the Nixon years, as well. Do I need to go into detail?

The point is -- I KNOW who the enemy is. I can smell them coming. I see how their propaganda gets picked up, used by the media, splashed into other sources, until it even seeps into DU.

So I say again: Hillary's worst enemy is the Right Wing in this country, and you have to ask yourself just why that would be.

[ohheckyeah]

28. Couldn't help yourself, could you?

Had to get a slam in there.

[randr]

4. Republican's and their opperatives are dangerous to all life on our planet

Anyone who would post lies and/or demeaning information intended to pit one of our candidates against the other is suspect.
We will get through the primary process without damaging our inevitable choice if we treat each other the way Democrats have always been proud of; Respectfully.

[appalachiablue]

6. K & R. Very Important Issues: Infiltrate, Divide, Conquer Strategies. Good Post.

[radical noodle]

7. You're right

The GOP has been lying about the Clintons for decades. She is still one of the most admired women in the world. They've never attacked Bernie because up to this point, they've not seen a need for it. If he should get the nomination, he will be attacked unmercifully and younger Sanders supporters who don't see this now will soon become intimately acquainted with how this works.

I never attack Bernie. Although I might disagree with some of his plans and policies, I don't dredge up lies about him from questionable sources. I have, on Facebook, debunked some posts I've seen about him that were outright lies.

The GOP is desperate to win. They watch everywhere and will parrot every negative thing anyone says about either of them, depending on who gets the nomination. That may be okay with some people at DU, but it is not okay with me.

[Hekate]

15. Thank you for....getting the point.

[blm]

19. If we are fortunate enough for a Sanders WH, they'd do the exact same to Jane on that one issue

involving funds, that they did to hound HRC on Whitewater. They find even the slightest opening and they DRILL - DRILL - DRILL and turn it into a huge scandal - so huge it will NEED millions of dollars in investigations. They say.

It is EXACTLY how they operate towards ANY Dem administration.

[radical noodle]

22. No doubt about it

They will also bash her for her looks, her hair, her weight, her clothing... not because they deserve criticism but just because it sends a negative image and that's what they love. There will be YouTube videos supposedly exposing lies, puppy eating and kitten stomping. They twist words, they take things out of context and they will go back decades to pick out some minor thing that they can make into something akin to a serial killer.

They will scrutinize every detail of his life, her life, their children's lives. Careers will be torn apart. Good works will be made into evil acts. We would all want to cry from the unfairness but it will do no good. They are relentless and never hesitate or back down because they want no good spoken about any Democrat.

We know all this because of the things done to the Clintons and the Obamas. The GOP is nothing more than a hate group that deserves to be thrown out with the trash.

[blm]

23. SPLC has recently labeled THIS current crop of Republicans as a Hate Group.

No stretch t figure out why.

I'm just pissed that they find DU a great place to implement their tactics.

The old DU would have done everything it could to stop these fascists and their use of this tactic in their tracks.

[rusty fender]

8. This is why we must recognize that

Republicans are the enemy, not fellow Dems. Our focus should be on defeating the Repukes at every stage.

[Andy823]

11. Excellent post

I could not agree more. Every election since I came here back in 2007 has been this way, with people posting that obviously aren't here to promote electing Democrats, but are only posting things designed to divide the boards and cause problems. It seems to get worse with every new election, and this time it's far worse than ever before. I have never seen so many posters threatening to NOT voter for the other candidate in the GE if their candidate loses. I have not seen so much hate for one person as I have for Hillary.

I agree with you Bernie can do just fine without so called supporters going ballistic with hate posts towards anyone who disagrees with them. I also agree the GOP trolls work both sides of the fence here trying to keep the board divided. If a person constantly promotes not voting for the nominee, voting for third party candidates, or writing in the name of the person who does not win the nomination, we should think very hard about what their agenda here really is.

[VulgarPoet]

12. Then I think I'd be remiss if I didn't ask for proof that she isn't what they call her.

Because from all the research I've done on Hillary, having supported her this time around until a friend of mine clued me into Sanders after giving me a wealth of information on her voting record, I'm honestly disgusted with myself for even considering supporting her. So please, if she's not a liar, a chameleon, a warmonger, or a corporate bailout supporting tool, please direct me to where I can find this information.

[blm]

17. They used bogus issues to develop the caricature being sold. Whitewater, travel office, Benghazi.

All ginned up in the PUBLIC EYE to create a PUBLIC CARICATURE.

Criticize her for real issues, not bogus ones - that shouldn't be too much ask. I targeted Clinton here vociferously for years, and I didn't use one RW propaganda source EVER. EVER!

If you can't do that, then people here at DU would be remiss to not ask you why you rely on RW propaganda to push your view of HRC?

[librechik]

18. you can't "prove" a negative.

and do your own research.

BTW, Hillary has 30 years or so of negative attacks on her mostly lies or twisted "facts"

Nobody cared to attack Bernie, because he was the only guy in his party, the I senator.

Bernie was in Congress for decades. Why didn't any of his ideas get adopted during those long years?

Because The Right won't allow it, and they cheat. Bernie is no weakling, and I love his agenda, but if he becomes President, it is still unlikely any of his agenda will be adopted by the Right. There will be as much opposition to him then as Obama or Hillary have gotten over the years.

The notion of a political revolution is a daydream. Vote for whoever you want, it won't make a damn bit of difference to the invisible unelected armies that actually rule us. That's the problem we have, not the problem of who to vote for.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/10/18/vote-all-you-want-the-secret-government-won-change/jVSkXrENQlu8vNcBfMn9sL/story.html

[Andy823]

20. If the right wing is spreading the information

YOU need to do some research of your own. Have you ever posted all the positives of having Bernie in the WH instead of simply attacking Hillary? Just curious.

[yardwork]

21. Thanks for posting this information.

[Octafish]

26. Michael Moore talked about this in ''Where to Invade Next''

It seems when the government of Slovenia moved to charge college tuition for foreign students, a small group of Slovenian national students rebelled. Student protests eventually caused the fall of the government and the election of a new parliament that reversed the decision. The student protesters' reasoning was that if they started to charge foreigners tuition, it would eventually lead to the Slovenian citizens getting charged for tuition. The group that led to the downfall of a government numbered around 40.

Ripples, blm.

[blm]

27. I knew you would get exactly what's happening. We've seen it firsthand here, uh, HOW many times?

I hope more of us long timers will continue to step up and acknowledge this tactic for what it is and what goal is expected from employing it here and other Dem sites.


Thanks, Octafish - I think you're officially my longest ongoing compatriot/love here! ; )

[Kingofalldems]

29. I see the right wing Judicial Watch suit praised to the heavens here.

The lowest of tactics, there are RW infiltrators on DU.

[blm]

30. and Moonie News, and investors.com, and, and, and……...

The old DU crowd would have nipped the use of these sources in the bud.

Where's MWO when you need them?

[Kingofalldems]

31. Right.

Extremely disturbing.

[ohheckyeah]

33. I've witnessed it for longer than I care to admit.

I've calledit it out on occasion to be piled on.

[blm]

34. There's definitely been an uptick in its use in the past month.

Hoping to use the heat of primaries as their cover and their reason. And they truly have infiltrated both camps in order to achieve their goals. Go to any of the sources being used and the articles include attacks on Sanders in order to frame him and his supporters as crazed leftists.

Most of us here should know better than to let them get away with their agenda here.

[ohheckyeah]

35. I agree with all of your points.

[nadinbrzezinski]

37. I do not need to read judicial watch

Talk about RW, to know that HRC is an extremely flawed candidate. Nor do I need to read any loonie times to know she will have a hell of a time in a change election when voters are truly pissed at the establishment.

You keep up with the fantasy that this is coming from the RW. Hell, I hear it in the streets. I guess everybody is reading RW sources

Hey it is your party. Nominate whoever you chose. But don't cry when she loses to Trump Best of luck with the national mood

[one_voice]

38. Locking..

Doesn't meet SoP for GD. Better suited for GDP. Please re-post there.

Statement of Purpose

Discuss politics, issues, and current events. Posts about Israel/Palestine, religion, guns, showbiz, or sports are restricted in this forum. Posts about the Democratic primaries, conspiracy theories and disruptive meta-discussion are forbidden