Prayer in schools officially sanctioned in Minnesota

[philosslayer]

While St. Cloud works to support the English-language development of its students, district officials say it has been just as important to make Somali students and their families feel welcome in schools and part of the community, which remains a work in progress.

In the district’s middle and high schools, Muslim students have access to private rooms with prayer rugs for the five daily prayers. Districtwide, school lunch menus provide pork-free options for students, and staff members try to spur the newcomer students’ interest in sports, culture clubs, and other extracurricular activities to develop connections beyond the classroom.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/how-one-minnesota-school-district-handles-a-rising-immigrant-population/

Very interesting article.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. The thread title is misleading.

They are allowing the students room for prayers but the school isn't conducting or organizing them - therefore it's perfectly legal. It seems to me that the schools are doing their best to help these immigrants, which is a good thing. There are a lot of Somalis in Minnesota (I see them in my Minneapolis neighborhood all the time), and I'm in favor of things that help them adjust.

[SusanCalvin]

3. Exactly.

I was getting ready to call FFRF...!

[Logical]

11. I love that you know about FFRF! I have been a member for years! Nt

[SusanCalvin]

13. They do good work, don't they?

In this case, I was happy to find the weren't needed!

[Logical]

18. Love the monthly newsletter! Keeps me sane! :-)

[SusanCalvin]

2. Well my reply is not what I expected it to be from the title.

I got no problem with any of that.

I thought we were going back to the 60s, when I had a choice between attending a prayer meeting in the auditorium or sitting in the principal's office.

[Recursion]

4. My tiny Mississippi town had a prayer room for the two Muslim kids there

And their teachers worked with them on the scheduling (there's apparently a lot of leeway based on your responsibilities during the day). I didn't realize this was controversial...

[Odin2005]

6. If I'm not mistaken the OP has a history of inflamatory comments about Muslims.

[Odin2005]

5. Intentionally misleading and inflammatory thread title.

Yes, how dare Muslim kids are allowed to follow their religious beliefs!

[SheilaT]

7. One of the problems I've long observed in conventional schools,

be they public or private, is the rigidity of the system. Kids are expected to proceed in lockstep with the curriculum and learning.

And while curriculum and learning doesn't have very much to do with prayer, it's part of that lockstep problem. Our public schools are intended to serve all students, and their needs are supposed to be accommodated.

This is why some parents choose to home school. There's this assumption that only right-wing nuts do so, but a lot of home-schoolers are very frustrated by the one size fits all model of regular schools.

While the title of the thread is incredibly misleading, I'm glad to note that what's actually going on protects students' rights.

[etherealtruth]

8. "How one Minnesota school district handles a rising immigrant population"

is what the PBS news hour story is titled.

its a very good piece. Despite the subject title of the post, the piece is very well worth the time.

It is great to see a school helping its students

[whatthehey]

9. This is nothing more than allowing Bible Study groups

Which is perfectly acceptable and widespread. Only theocratic bigots and their quisling enablers among "liberal" believers ever pretend prayer is banned in schools. Students of all faiths have the right to pray all they want and neither Lemon nor Abingdon made the slightest difference. All that is constitutionally problematic is haveng teachers or officials mandate or lead or manage that prayer. My bet is that they do not do this for the Muslim students any more than for the Christian ones. That's all I'd have any issue with.

[philosslayer]

14. During school hours?

[Bluenorthwest]

17. Yeah, students of all religions are free to privately practice or practice with other students

who wish to. Bible groups, prayer circles, meditation, it matters not. The 'prayer in schools' that is not allowed is the sort that is lead by the teacher or the school, which is compulsory. Every school I ever attended had various kids who either did or did not do certain things because of their faith. Always.

The frame you wish to put on this is right wing in nature.

[Odin2005]

24. "quisling enablers" what a dispicable, disgusting claim.

And you militant atheists wonder why people hate you.

[whatthehey]

30. It's a despicable disgusting thing I won't be shamed from calling out by your futile poutrage

Any time you claim special privilege for religion you are enabling Phelps and Falwell and Robertson and all the other haters. If you don't like the company you keep with your co-religionists that's not my problem.

[Odin2005]

36. So you are a bigot, got it.

[whatthehey]

37. So you cannot understand simple English got it

[Nye Bevan]

10. I'm sure that nobody here would object to Christian Prayer Rooms in public schools,

equipped with altars and pews, where Christian students could optionally go to pray if they wanted to, provided that the prayers were not organized by the school or led by teachers.

Would they?

[gelatinous cube]

15. As long as other groups are treated similarly

Rooms and mats for Muslims, an optional club for atheists (if they wanted one), access to the Home Ec. oven/range and some spaghetti for Pastafarians etc. Students should have the freedom to practice their religion peacefully and respectfully.

[Mariana]

16. Christian students have always been allowed to pray in school

as long as they aren't disruptive about it, and as long as the other students aren't pressured into joining them. I hung out in the school library a lot during high school, and some of the students would come into the library during break periods and pray silently in the carrels, or read their Bibles. They didn't disturb anyone and no one bothered them. Is that much different than what's going on here?

Did the Christians in this school district ever ask permission to pray in unused rooms during break periods? If they asked and were turned down, while the Muslims were accommodated, there would be a valid complaint. If they never asked, then what's the problem?

[WillowTree]

28. Not "always".

In some places, kids have been told that they can't bring their bibles to school, even if they keep them in their lockers and only read them when they're not in class.

And let's not forget the kid who was chastised by a teacher for blithely saying "God bless you" when a friend sneezed in class.

Lots of people on DU have lots of problems with any display of Christianity in any public place, especially in schools.

[whatthehey]

32. a) most of that is nonsense glurge from wannabe-oppressed Xians

b) the few that are legit are quickly corrected after checking with legal

c) The rest are organized poutrage-seeking which really arose from attempts at equal access. It's amazing how often schools allow bible giveaways for decades, then shut down all religious text distribution just to stop atheists or minority faiths from having equal access, then still sell the story as if it's Christians being oppressed by the overall ban.

[Mariana]

35. And without fail, those who told the kids

they can't bring Bibles to school were set straight because they were wrong. Please show me one case of such being upheld in court. And cases of a teacher telling the kid not to read his Bible during class when he's supposed to be listening to the lecture don't count.

At any rate, I was talking about prayer. No kid has ever been prohibited from praying in school. They can pray silently all they want at any time. They can get together with other kids on a voluntary basis outside of class time and pray together. They don't get to take over the class and force others to listen to them and they don't get to have the teacher try to make everyone else pray with them. I don't know why any Christian would want to make a big show of praying out loud in front of other people anyway, since Christ very clearly told his followers not to do that. But regardless of their reason, they don't get to disrupt school with it.

[whatthehey]

31. The vast majority of US HS alrewdy have Bible study groups.

What else is being provided for Muslims?

And before the usual baseless accusations fly, I find both faiths exactly equal in gullible, silly superstitious nonsense and have not the slightest fear of criticizing either. Same goes for Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Shinto et al.

[Logical]

12. As long as they would be ok with an atheist club I see no problem with this. Nt

[cleanhippie]

19. ACTUAL HEADLINE: "How one Minnesota school district handles a rising immigrant population"

What's the matter? Not comfortable with other religions getting the same treatment as yours?

Please, do tell us how Jesus was banned from public schools, how prayer has been banned, and how Christianity is under attack. Because that's what you're really trying to say, aren't you?

[rockfordfile]

20. I don't like this. Keep religion out of public schools

[SusanCalvin]

22. Nuance needed here.

Keep religion forced by the schools out of public schools.

Keep individual religion out completely? Planning on keeping all the kids home?

[Odin2005]

23. That violates Muslims' freedom to practice their relgion.

Muslims are supposed to pray several times a day, a public school not allowing them to do that goes against their 1st Amendment rights.

[brooklynite]

26. Who is stopping them from praying?

Where in the Koran does it say that prayer must be in a private room?

[Bradical79]

34. It's better giving them a designated room

Otherwise, everyone is just getting in each other's way, and you can keep track of students easier when you know where they will be.

[Nevernose]

21. I'm usually the "safe space" for the NOI kids

So many other students and teachers don't understand their religion that they have no place to go, and I'm on my prep at noon.

Every school needs a place like that. It takes five minutes and harms no one.

[Bigmack]

25. As a 30 year High School teacher...

....and confirmed secular humanist... I see nothing wrong with this stuff. As long as the school doesn't sponsor or lead anything. I think the Supremes would go along with it, too.

KIDS ONLY...

A small "meeting room" set aside for religious or other (AA or Alanon for example) meetings.

Have a sign-up sheet, and have the room monitored by a security camera for liability purposes.

0700-0715...Baptist preschool prayer group.
0730-0745... Muslim prayer group
0800-0815... Alateen meeting
0830-0845... Wiccan meeting
etc...

[brooklynite]

27. If you support this, do you support the provision of a chapel for the Christian kids?

I can imagine that a lot of parents would think that was an appropriate use of school resources.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

29. Not an actual chapel if that would require building a separate edifice,

but I'd have no problem with the school providing a room that students could use for Bible study or any such thing as long as the students directed and managed it, and that spaces were also made available for other student-directed religious (or atheist) studies or practices if requested.

[whatthehey]

33. Why the false equivalence? Are Muslim kids getting a mosque built?

Again schools both can and do already provide rooms for genuinely student-led bible study and prayer circles with no issues. The whole damn point is that it's either all religions or none.

[yortsed snacilbuper]

38. You've got to start brain washing them early!