Good Bye to the Democratic Underground

[sus453]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by one_voice (a host of the General Discussion forum).

This will be my last post; perhaps, like the post before it (where I said that if Bernie loses the nomination, I would not vote for HRC, but would vote for Jill Stein (I do not live in a swing state, but even if I did I doubt that would make a difference at this point), this post will most likely be deleted by a jury. Some of you will no doubt say, "Good riddance", perhaps no one will see this post, and perhaps some of the Bernie will eventually leave for similar reasons.

I don't blame the DU itself or anyone for my decision to leave, it's due, for the most part, on a fundamental misunderstanding on my part of what the Democratic Underground site stands for. When I first came upon this forum a few years ago, I thought - wow, cool, a left wing site, thinking of Democratic as in "democracy" and Underground as, well "underground". I am old enough to remember SDS and the yippies, and going "underground" had romantic connotations - like the word "resistance". I did not know then that "Democratic" meant only the Democratic Party and its candidates (fifty years ago, would it have been against the rules to not support George Wallace?). I have no idea why the word "underground" was chosen. Perhaps a name change would help this site because I don't see anything "underground" about it. Is this disruptive meta-discussion? This is not a post "complaining about Democratic Underground". I have no complaints. I am simply writing how I see things here, and doing it on my way out.

I believe in progressivism and in democratic socialism. I believe that the wealth of this country (and the world) should be shared in a more equitable fashion. I believe that unless sweeping changes are made in the social system we will irrevocably harm this earth, it's people, flora, and fauna. I see the current leadership of the Democratic Party as part of the problem, not part of the solution.

So, to all the DU members, many of whom I admire, good bye. Maybe there's still time for change in the Democratic Party and in DU, though I for one will look for it elsewhere. Here's a link to a video by TeleSur which highlights the contradictions in the front-runner for the Democratic nomination, and perhaps to much of DU itself:

So there you. Have a nice evening.

- Susan Alcorn

[roguevalley]

62. first three posts prove her point

[northernsouthern]

107. ^^100%^^

Last edited Fri Apr 29, 2016, 11:36 AM - Edit history (1)

It seems to the be HRC policy for "reaching out" to Bernie supporters...






?noredirect

Good luck making america...what was it...oh yeah..."Whole again."

[Hortensis]

156. Goodbye, Susan Alcorn.

Seems to me that if mainstream Democrats and liberals in general did better they still wouldn't be the right match for you and many others gathered here who are farther left.

The contribution of new, positive ideas is always good and valuable, but I agree that that contribution has been swamped by the constant disagreements, and ultimately hostility, that has developed between factions. Coming on to find screens full of anti-Democrat attacks is not fun for us either.

So, I wish you a more satisfying place to chat and trade ideas, one of the forums and groups where other lefties who ultimately can't tolerate mainstream Democrats and liberals have gathered. They're out there. I personally would look for one full of people excited and inspired by their own ideology, though, and avoid like the plague those that exist only to badmouth Democrats. Those are out there too.

[lakeguy]

119. yup, i've been here a long time but haven't started posting again until recently

there is hardly any discussion anymore, it's mostly just a high school mentality of mocking someone who doesn't agree with you. DU lost its 'underground' status a long time ago. i don't even go back and reply to any of the posts i do make so i'll probably be gone for good as well after the GE. but since i don't even have 2000 posts, i was probably a troll anyway. a donating one, at least in the past.

[polly7]

64. 'It's'? She's a woman, not an 'it'. She signed her name. nt.

[Purrfessor]

65. I wouldn't judge a person by their post count. I check into DU...

multiple times a day but don't often post. That has no bearing on my interest in DU. No disrespect to you intended, by the way.

[Texasgal]

12. This poster has been here since 2012.

Relax on the post count.

[hollysmom]

61. just want to say, I was registered here in 2001,

could not get my password reset because I changed e-mail and did not update, long story, not interesting, so I spent the next 10 years just reading here because you don't have to post to get something out of it. Then finally took another name and joined to post. I post on a lot of boards.not everyone posts a lot until they have something to say, so I don't consider post count that important unless the only posts are troll posts. (recently caught one who made 1000 month working on the computer at home.).

agreed, don't pick on people because of post count.

[mahina]

116. I didn't post here for years and years,

Mostly, but that was back in the freaky 00's.

It's not so hairy now.

[HeartoftheMidwest]

150. I have an identical history here to you.

My post count is low, but I've essentially been here since 2001 too.

[noretreatnosurrender]

155. Similar Situation For Me

I couldn't remember my user name so I had to re-register but I've been on DU for a long time.

[CreekDog]

153. they didn't post until 2014

and they posted some nonsense that we're as bad as ISIS.

and that Hillary Clinton feels entitled to be president.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5953716

so pardon me if i'm not feeling the going away party as we're all being lectured about how disappointing we are.

[rhett o rick]

38. How do you guys get a response in within 2 minutes. That's some dedicated hammering on

the refresh button. Sad that that is important to you. Do you really think it gives you an advantage. Esp when your post has to be so short.

Do you even know what your name means or was it given to you?

[sheshe2]

108. This

Do you even know what your name means or was it given to you?

Stop it!

[bahrbearian]

133. I think you mean :"Cut it out" I'm told that works

[rhett o rick]

143. What? That wasn't a personal attack if you know what Trust Buster means.

I am questioning why someone that appears to revere Wall Street would choose that name.

Teddy Roosevelt was one American who believed a revolution was coming.

He believed Wall Street financiers and powerful trust titans to be acting foolishly. While they were eating off fancy china on mahogany tables in marble dining rooms, the masses were roughing it. There seemed to be no limit to greed. If docking wages would increase profits, it was done. If higher railroad rates put more gold in their coffers, it was done. How much was enough, Roosevelt wondered?

[Katashi_itto]

120. k&R!!! Down with the Vichy Dems

[billhicks76]

57. Don't Be A Disgrace Please

Like in all walks of life we should be open, endearing, welcoming, inclusive and humble. When you act like its a contest of who has the most comments it just looks petty. Not a good look. Some of the people with the mists posts are virulent NSA and military contractor supporters. Quality bs quantity should be considered. Snobbery does none of us any good.

[Katashi_itto]

121. Impossible for them

[pnwmom]

2. When this site was in its early years it was just after Bush's false election and all Democrats

felt like part of the underground.

[leftofcool]

3. Why do people feel the need to announce their departure?

[dlwickham]

11. Either for attention or they want someone to beg him to stay

Either for attention or they want someone to beg him to stay

I say don't let the door hit you on the way out

[Feeling the Bern]

81. Rude.

[jbrooks655]

147. i agree

[Yo_Mama]

176. Because they can't stand the hypocrisy. I'm out too, for basically the same reasons.

Sometime in the last two weeks I faced the question of whether I could vote for Hillary in the general, and after looking up a bunch of stuff, including the State Dept's Inspector General's report, I've decided I can't.

I admire the OP for the honesty, and I will follow her out the door.

[puffy socks]

15. I dunno.

Looking for sympathy?

[johnp3907]

16. Because every day the sun rises just for them.

[zeemike]

22. Why not?

When you leave your home you say goodby to those who you love and care for.
And if and when I leave I will do the same...it is only good manners.
And also they need to know why you are leaving.

But to those who hate you it only seems negative.

[Chicago1980]

30. I haven't heard hate...

I've heard indifference.

[zeemike]

31. And there is little diference between them.

If you are indifferent it means you don't care about people...same as those who hate.

[Chicago1980]

35. Not caring about someones departure isn't hate.

Maybe they haven't given you a reason to care, which is by no means on equal footing as hate.

[Beartracks]

50. But "not caring" is odd when part of a supposed "community" of people.

=======================

[zeemike]

52. Well I care unconditionally.

I know that sounds weird.
But I know it is not the same, just similar.

[Bluenorthwest]

127. Indifference does not comment, it's indifferent to your leaving or staying, a poster who

makes a point of asking 'Why must you say goodbye' is expressing the opposite of indifference, they are expressing concern, interest, attention to the departure rather than apathy toward the departure.

[Lazy Daisy]

89. No, indifference would be not commenting

and just ignoring the post. Hate and smugness is commenting in a negative way.

[Fumesucker]

104. Hate is not the opposite of love, indifference is.. -Elie Wiesel

[iwillalwayswonderwhy]

123. It's not indifference if you take the time to reply

If indifferent, it would just be ignored.

[Travis_0004]

40. With 164 post nobody is going to miss them

People come and go all the time. If somebody has 10k post, make an announcement.

If you have 164 I dont think its necessary.

[zeemike]

45. Well you don't have to post to like people here.

And I have many people here I like and seldom post to them...I still consider them friends.

But many of them have already gone, and soon there will be little here for some of us.

[polly7]

48. Many people have come here to read for years without posting much at all.

DU is still the best place to get news that's been either proven correct or debunked by a lot of great members here who do the research. It doesn't matter if they've made 10 posts, if this was a familiar and comfortable place for them, leaving matters and it's just arrogant bullying to diss them for saying goodbye. You have no idea if they've made friends who they want to let know they're ok and just leaving, or what.

It was also a great OP. As was the video.

[arikara]

178. Some people prefer to read and

others like to talk more. Still others like to shoot off their mouths whether they know what they're talking about or not... a 10k poster could be a big asshole that few would miss.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

63. when you've posted less than 200 posts, it's more like saying bye to your air bnb and less like

saying bye to your home

[zeemike]

70. So it is all about quantity then.

All posters are equal but some are more equal than others...by post count.

I am amazed by how callous people can be...especially those who say they are progressive.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

71. i have empathy for people who have real problems, not for GBCW posts from people

who've been posting for half a minute and who won't support the democrat in the race

this is akin to asking me to empathize with the time kim kardashian reacted poorly to her botox.

[zeemike]

72. Well see that is where we are diferent.

My empathy is unconditional.

And no it is not akin to that at all.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

73. i'm sorry that you have sympathy for bullshit. i really don't have any tolerance

for manipulative bullshit.

[zeemike]

75. People's feelings are not bullshit.

And again, that is how we differ.

You love those who love you and don't tolerate those who don't...a difference in our attitudes.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

85. you mean i dont love random people i dont know on the internet who post right wing lies

and other manipulative BS? yes. you are right on that score.

[zeemike]

96. I don't expect you to understand unconditional love.

It's a philosophical thing.

[Bluenorthwest]

130. There is love and then there is 'the mean' and most of DU is devoted to the mean....

and to the nasty.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

137. Look in the mirror

[La Lioness Priyanka]

138. I understand unconditional sanctimony just fine

[nolawarlock]

83. Bingo!

Yahtzee!

[rhett o rick]

39. Why do people feel the need to get the first response slot. Seems to be very, very

important to your side. Do you get a gold star?

[KPN]

79. Probably similar to the way Hillary folks like to rub it in with the Berners.

[rpannier]

92. TBH

I don't know why for sure
I think, and I could be wrong, it's either a catharsis to alleviate something they're upset about or because they want the attention or a combination
My problem with people announcing their leaving is when they make it sound like we're horribly bad people

[LynneSin]

146. They are looking for us to beg for them to stay

There's the door hope it doesn't meet your ass

This is why I haven't supported any candidates for the primaries after Biden dropped. In in the end I adore Sanders and Clinton way way better than any GOP candidates.

Anyone who has joined DU thinking that this website would support someone other than a Democrat for the Presidential election clearly doesn't know anything about DU. Sanders has always been supported for his races because the DNC/DCCC/DSCC never ran anyone against him. (Minor Democrats may have tossed in their hats but they were unsupported). But the rules have always been clear - This is a site for Democrats.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. Thanks for being here, and good luck!

[brewens]

5. We hardly knew ye! Watch out for that door! n/t

[rhett o rick]

41. Wow, why the ridicule. Don't bother to answer, I know. Sad. nm

[polly7]

6. I admire you for your understanding, empathy

and concern for this planet and all people on it.

[cantbeserious]

7. Thank You For Sharing

eom

[djean111]

8. Really great OP. Thank you. I agree.

I think that, if Hillary is the nominee, her supporters here will feel cheated of something that they were really looking forward to -
before I started using the ignore function, I would read about how much they could not wait for chastened Bernie supporters to come crawling to Hillary.

That's an ugly point of view; not out of character. But I don't think there will be purges and crawling and tears to drink with pleasure - just people quietly leaving. Why stay?

Edited to add - it is so much fun to hit the Full Ignore on the jeering replies!

[Cassiopeia]

26. Yes, some of the replies to this post

are exactly the things that make DU really suck at times. The ignore list will grow tonight.

[Bleacher Creature]

10. Oh good. Another "I'm packing my toys and going home" post.

Unfortunately, there's too much at stake for the rest of us to be as sanctimonious and selfish as others.

[quakerboy]

32. Theres too much at stake

There's too much at stake to throw our weight behind anyone who won't do what is needed for the nation.

[rhett o rick]

43. You have nothing at stake. You've sided with the big banks because you are afraid

to fight for those struggling around us.

[Jack Rabbit]

13. Happy trails, sus

[linuxman]

14. Has anyone ever just left without mailing out invites to the attention party?

[HubertHeaver]

56. You would never know it if they did.

[linuxman]

74. True.

[Quackers]

122. What ever happened to VanillaRhapsody?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=296000

[PufPuf23]

177. When VanillaRhapsody was on time out and prior to account under review,

VanillaRhapsody sent me several mocking and nasty PMs.

I had no other private contact with this poster that had mocked my posts on open forum.

This was how I learned that posters on timeout could PM.

edit to add: Until now I had told no one nor did I make note to admin so have nothing to do with VRs current status.

[Stallion]

17. I LUV a Good Retirement Speech!!!!!

[angstlessk]

18. I may become a former poster as well, but I will not leave, because

there is no other progressive site I found after I was booted back in the early days when I accused DU being a place to vent our dismay and nothing would happen...the heady days of bush* vs Gore

[SoapBox]

19. Keep working out there!

It's a big, wide world outside the DU Bubble...and there is lots of work to do to make change.

Best of luck!

[EndElectoral]

20. Good luck. Perhaps the site might need a new title from DU to DE - Democratic Establishment

[Live and Learn]

27. That seems fitting. nt

[Chicago1980]

33. I see way more posts on this site from so called,

Democratic Socialist Sanders supporters than I see from anyone else.

Calling this place 'establishment' is a bit of a mental stretch.

[Kittycat]

47. Yet we're continuously being told our views are

Extremist. Tea party-like. RW?!?!! That we need to shut up or go away. The Clintonites beg daily for Skinner to bring the axe down and give us the boot, and stifle conversation and dissent even in our own private forum, while directly linking to our protected forum posts to mock and ridicule. Yet here we are 80% of the board and a majority of us have had tenure and were paid members. Go figure for the shit sandwich we're asked to eat daily.

To the OP. I've been here since 2004. This used to be a site very open to discussion and ideas. Yes 2008 was a testy time, but even the worst of it did not compare to this. I wish you well, and appreciate your sharing why you feel it went wrong, even if some don't. Maybe it will level out after the election. No idea, I know for me regardless, it will never be the same. Good luck.

[beastie boy]

158. Did you notice that DU became "establishment" as soon it became clear Bernie would lose the race?

[Javaman]

23. I think many will follow. but before you leave...

read this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027786827

[LovingA2andMI]

24. Before You Depart...

There are other places "Underground" like Independent Underground Radio LIVE. It's called that way "Independent" because INDEPENDENT FREE THOUGHT is allowed and welcomed -- supporting the true principles of a Progressive Democracy.

Check it out on Tuesday's and Thursday nights. You might like what you hear on the podcast.

Independent Underground Radio LIVE

[Live and Learn]

25. K&R nt

[LuvLoogie]

28. Can you do that cup thing before you go?

[Thespian2]

29. Some of us understand your position...

so, good luck to you...The Revolution will continue...regardless of who the new president is...If not, America is probably finished as a functioning country...

[redstateblues]

37. Extreme hyperbole

[COLGATE4]

160. Me. Me. It's all about me. Don't you understand???

[4now]

34. LOL Wrong forum

After 164 posts it seems like you would know how to post.
Bye

[redstateblues]

36. Hillary is to blame for every problem in the world. Too bad Susan Sarandon

Didn't do the narration. What a crock. BTW. Bernie is in favor of using drones.

[Scurrilous]

42. @#$% Jill Stein.

[NuclearDem]

55. I second this.

Skinner or EarlG should delete the rancid fart this poster left on their way out.

[sheshe2]

112. Two people got hides here, dayum it!

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

99. Jill "Mr Obama is very articulate" Stein

I wouldn't give that moonbat the time of day.

[pengu]

129. ...

"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy," Biden said. "I mean, that's a storybook, man." - Joe Biden

[truebluegreen]

149. Heh. Well said. nt

[rhett o rick]

44. Think about staying. Put those that have nothing but ridicule on ignore

and post in the Warren Group.

[zalinda]

46. There will be many people joining you.

I may lose interest in politics and leave. I will make my decision after the convention.

Z

[6000eliot]

49. I didn't know that posting right-wing attack memes qualified one as being progressive.

[Loki]

51. Another quitter.

N/t:

[Rass]

53. Stay and fight

Right now, there are paid Hillary trolls originating from her SuperPAC that are online. They are flooding major websites to counter negative statements about her. Only losers need to pay for online propaganda commenters. Don't let them get away with manipulating others.

[beltanefauve]

69. In fact

they're posting on this very thread.

[Chico Man]

144. Yes, I am one of them

We started the good fight back in 2001.

What vision!

[cstanleytech]

106. Some could say that there are also paid Republican trolls flooding the DU trying to cause dissension

between Hillary and Sander supporters but of course that would be tin foil hat talk.

[snooper2]

148. you are pretty good at projection LOL

[HuckleB]

54. Who are you?

[wouldsman]

58. Maybe we will see you over at the other sites,

you know, where the nice people hang out now.
The internet is an awfully big place.

[HuckleB]

68. What other sites.?

[COLGATE4]

162. Free Republic

[gwheezie]

59. I would probably leave also

If I didn't plan on supporting the dem nominee.

[clg311]

66. Sorry to see you go.

But after reading from the comments by the Clinton trolls I don't blame you. Hopefully you will find a truly progressive site.

[Hydra]

77. Ya, quite the classy bunch, aren't they? n/t

[herding cats]

67. This belongs in GDP not GD.

Sure this is total META, but that's subjective to the hosts. However, your last bit makes it 100% GDP, not GD.

I get it, you're leaving and be damned the rules of the site. Problem is, those of us who enjoy the place, and pay to use it, like the rules. That's why we support the site with our hard earned money.

Have some respect for those of us who are following the rules of the site, please?

[bhikkhu]

76. I'm a Sanders supporter, but I've never bought the hatred for Hillary

I know you can find any amount of hyperbole, diatribes and attack ads about how awful she is, but she was a good first lady, a good senator, and she has always been a good supporter of the Democratic party platform. Sound bytes and innuendo are as good as lies, against a long and solid public record - takes more than that to change my mind.

My daughters are also Sanders supporters, and I've been proud of how involved they have gotten in the issues and how politically aware. My older daughter the other day said how she hated Hillary...I asked her what she knew about her, and it amounted to nothing but attack ads. We spent a little while talking (me talking) about how easy it is for media to get you to hate someone, and how human nature leads people who are very similar to polarize into teams and hate each other. Its not necessary, not fact-based, not helpful to what anyone wants to accomplish; hatred only leads in one direction, which is not where you want to go.

[Surya Gayatri]

87. bhikkhu, your wisdom is worthy of the party of liberal values.

Your daughters are fortunate to have you as a mentor.

[pnwmom]

94. Thanks, bhikku, I always appreciate posts like yours.

People keep forgetting that when they were both in the Senate they voted together 93% of the time. And of course many young voters wouldn't know that.

I'm sorry to see how polarized everything has gotten. I think we were better off when both parties were much bigger "tents"; with liberals and conservatives on both sides. Remember when many Republicans believed in conserving the environment? Reagan ruined that.

[truebluegreen]

152. I love that Voted-together-93%-of-the-time! thingy,

as if the bills that wend their way through our already-corrupted legislature are representative of the whole range of political thought.

[obamanut2012]

95. great post

[CreekDog]

145. This poster doesn't like that Hillary "has an air about her..."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5953716

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

100. Well said

25 years of constant attacks from the right have begun to taint our well water.

[Samantha]

78. I can't believe no one is discussing the video

I knew a lot of this because I have followed politics for a long time, hours out of the day many days. Thanks for posting it.

I have been here since 2001, and it does get horrendous election time. But there is so much to be gained by the other forums here and the intelligence of some of the people who stay. I have started spending a lot more time in the Bernie Group and out of GD-P. It is a whole different scene over there.

So maybe you will reconsider your alternatives and stick around. DU has a lot of good going for it; you just have to know where to find it, and to use the owners of the site have put in place to help keep your blood pressure under control!

Kind regards,

Sam

[C Moon]

80. Some of the replies here show us why you decided to leave.

It's so unnecessary, and a waste of energy to be mean. I don't understand why members bother posting mean comments, when they can be polite, roll their eyes if they want, and move on to the next post.

[6000eliot]

84. I know, right?

Why can't they just accept smugly being called corrupt fools because of the candidate they support?

[yortsed snacilbuper]

82. Buh bye!

[Feeling the Bern]

86. Based on some of the rather bullying, passive aggressive and nasty responses, you made the right

decision.

Based on the responses you received, Susan, the bullies went from the playground to the keyboard.

I'm sorry to see you go. Maybe when sense comes back here and people stop treating other DUers like crap, you will return.

Keep up the fight!

And for those of you who are bullying this poor woman, have you no shame?

[Feeling the Bern]

114. they eat each other. Or become animal abusers.

[Surya Gayatri]

88. Happy Trails...

[obamanut2012]

93. lolz

Account status: Active
Member since: Fri Nov 16, 2012, 03:20 PM
Number of posts: 164
Number of posts, last 90 days: 135
Favorite forum: General Discussion: Primaries, 63 posts in the last 90 days (47% of total posts)
Favorite group: Bernie Sanders, 3 posts in the last 90 days (2% of total posts)
Last post: Thu Apr 28, 2016, 10:55 PM

[JEB]

97. Looks to me like the wrong folks are leaving. nt

edit typo.

[Leontius]

98. The hide by a jury of post #1 is fucked up.

[PowerToThePeople]

105. I can not see post #1

Must be one of our more personable members.

[xloadiex]

101. Good bye Susan

I agree with your views. Change is coming.

[OldRedneck]

102. Well . . .

[PowerToThePeople]

103. You became a member right when DU started turning heavily right wing

There was a time when it was, more or less, what you were expecting to find.

[Tarheel_Dem]

110. We hardly knew ye!

[Lady_Chat]

111. With Donald Trump talking about Nukes, Sorry, I'm voting for the Democrat

Susan you have a right to your opinion, and the right to leave or stay at this site, but unlike you, I can't in good conscience vote for 3rd party candidates, who don't have a snowball chance in hell, of winning. I want my vote to really count, in order to defeat Trump.

Trump will win the nomination, of that I have no doubt, and the republicans will fall in line and back him. The republicans at FOX are already mending fences between Megyn Kelly and Trump, she'll be doing a prime time special with him. Boehner was out there today bashing Cruz. Trump has already threatened the GOP, with marches and protests if he isn't chosen as the nominee. He will follow through, and they know it.

And here's the thing, I have never seen a candidate engender so much hate on the campaign trail, and get away with it. Trump isn't stupid, far from it, but he is vicious. I would put nothing pass this man. People who have worked for him will tell you the same thing, he believes everything he does is "right", he's very determined, and it is not easy to bring him around once he sets his mind to something. A person like that, doesn't belong in the White House. He's a bully, with a short fuse, who is on an ego trip. He lies like the rug on top of his head. Not having had to work a day in his life, for anyone but his father, he has little to go on, for what it's like for the average voter. Nor does he care. Money has always been there for him. He's an agitator, he brings out the worst in people, the fear and hate. Things we should be ashamed of not proud of. But it's his "truth"


My greatest hope is that Sanders & Clinton will put aside their differences, and work together to defeat him. I hope President Obama gets out there quickly, he's done a lot good, it's time to remind people. I'm a realist, whether or not Sanders or Clinton were the best candidates my party had to offer, either one is better than Trump. I was listening to Trump give a speech few days ago, besides talking about using nukes in Europe, killing the families of terrorists, water boarding, building his wall, and keeping all Muslims out, he mentioned how Sanders isn't being treated "fairly" and that he should run as a 3rd party candidate. Like I said, Trump isn't stupid, he knows a 3rd party will be an automatic win for himself. But he's clever enough to make it look like he cares. The best thing I can do, is to be just as clever and make sure my vote counts.... against him.

Good Luck to you, and all of us, if God Forbid Trump wins.

[The Second Stone]

113. Have a good life!

We are Democrats. If you come here wanting to do something like Tea Bag to our party, we don't want that.

[Skittles]

115. take your ball with you

[Raine]

117. Wishing you all the best. I'm sorry you're leaving, maybe one day you'll come back...

Keep up the good fight!

[muriel_volestrangler]

118. I recommend reading the 'About' page of websites when you join, not three and a half years later

to save disappointment.

Mission Statement

Democratic Underground is an online community where politically liberal people can do their part to effect political and social change by:

Interacting with friendly, like-minded people;
Sharing news and information, free from the corporate media filter;
Participating in lively, thought-provoking discussions;
Helping elect more Democrats to political office at all levels of American government; and
Having fun!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus

Or reading the Terms of Service (which I think are displayed when you join, aren't they?):

Vote for Democrats.
Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground. But that does not mean that DU members are required to always be completely supportive of Democrats. During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them. In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees (EXCEPT in rare cases where a non-Democrat is most likely to defeat the conservative alternative, or where there is no possibility of splitting the liberal vote and inadvertently throwing the election to the conservative alternative). For presidential contests, election season begins when both major-party nominees become clear. For non-presidential contests, election season begins on Labor Day. Everyone here on DU needs to work together to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of American government. If you are bashing, trashing, undermining, or depressing turnout for our candidates during election season, we'll assume you are rooting for the other side.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=termsofservice

[Captain Stern]

124. Good Bye. I wish you well.

I find it humorous that so many posters here have (unintentionally) illustrated your point perfectly. I find it refreshing that many others have not.

[bigwillq]

125. Bye, Felicia

[JHB]

126. What county office is Jill Stein running for?

It has been 20 years since Ralph Nader's 1996 run, and how many people have the Greens been able to elect to federal or state level offices?

Twenty years to build themselves into a force that must be reckoned with at state and national levels, and they have nothing to show for it above the county and municipal levels.

[liberal N proud]

128. I am sure it was a tough choice to make

Deciding to leave after such a long tenure, I know it is difficult and one that no one should have to make. But you made the right choice for you. People have to move on, you can't stay in one place for too long for fear the grass might grow under your feet.

Hope you can find a place to settle someday.



















































































164

[truebluegreen]

154. 2012

[moriah]

131. No offense, but was it necessary to post this in General Discussion...

When your decision is based on the outcome of the primaries?

People come here to escape the pissing matches in GD: Pee.

[robbedvoter]

132. 164 posts? Wow!

Needs more recs!

[deutsey]

134. "Democratic Underground" originated as a reaction to the stolen 2000 election

I think the "underground" was a reference to the feeling that Democrats and lefties had of being driven underground as everyone else (the Supreme Court, the media, the Congress) all sanctioned what had happened.

As such, it was a nice virtual community for those of us who, despite supporting the candidate who won the majority of the vote, felt marginalized. I joined in early spring of 2001 and that's how it felt to me. I grew up in the '80s and felt very isolated during the Reagan Reaction. DU originally was a great antidote for that feeling under Bush.

There were epic flame wars here and infighting among factions (primaries have always been bad, but there was even a "cool kids vs. nerds" spat in the Lounge at one time). But we always seemed to come together in general in mutual support when we needed to.

That's changed over the past few years, in my opinion. That's not a complaint, it's just an observation. Nothing stays the same and our political realities have changed, so DU had changed along with them. It isn't the community I used to know, but there isn't the same need for one now that we had back then.

I don't know that I'll leave here entirely; I come here now for news and information, for the most part. But DU isn't as important to me as it used to be and with Hillary the presumptive nominee, I won't have much of a place here anyway.

Not sure if I'm voting for Hillary or not. At the moment, I don't believe I will. That could change if I feel it's tight as election day approaches, but if that's the case, it will back to voting against the Republican nominee and not for the Democratic one.

[Robbins]

135. and now people cheer as democratic nomination is stolen

the clintons are stealing it just like bush did.and they aren't even trying to hide it.But,then again Clintons are no different than bushes.why else do you think they are so chummy.

Minute Clinton gets delegates she needs i am gone from here.I might come back after she loses.

I will not vote for her.

The primary has proven democratic party isn't progressive.

I better never hear clinton supporters crying on voter fraud or how we are still in war or about police brutality and execution of
young black men.They supported candiate fine with all that.

Many stood still as clintons swiftboated bernie.Clintons again showed no difference than Bush.

I believe in what i always believed but democratic party proved it doesn't.they have been playing progressives for suckers just
like republicans do relgiouas voters.

Clinton acted like she didn't need bernie voters.i am happy to obligage her.

[deutsey]

136. Sadly, I agree with you

It's sad because with the world and our country in such a state of precariousness and crises, the best we can seem to do is come up with two cults of personality facing off, when we need vision, leadership, and real solutions to rally behind.

More and more, it feels like everyone wants to play an intense game of charades while the house is burning down all around us.

[Loki]

140. Stolen?

Because you didn't change your Independent status to vote in a Democratic primary? You want rule changes, then work to change them. Do the hard work at the state and local levels, My state once had a closed primary, now it's open. You want change then work for it, but don't try to do it right before a primary. Not very good planning on your part or the campaigns part, and then you want to whine about it. If you are really an Independent, then work to build a party for your candidates to run in. That would seem the logical path, but don't come to the Democratic primary expecting to have a say in who the party runs, supports, or nominates. It would be like me trying to influence the republicans in their choice for a candidate. Right, I've never voted for one, but I want a say so in it. I'm not an Independent for a very good reason, they very rarely win elections because they never have developed a party. Bernie could have run as an Independent, but he chose not to. Must have been a reason for it. If you know what the rules are going in, and then complain about it, well it reminds me of a line that sums this up very well: "Every piece of this is man's bullshit. They call this war a cloud over the land. But they made the weather and then they stand in the rain and say 'Shit, it's raining!'" You knew it might rain, and you now want to cry about it.

[redwitch]

159. A very large percentage of Americans now consider themselves independent.

Greater than 40% I believe. In my state of New York you had to be registered in a party by October 9th in order to vote in April. Unlike us political junkies lots of people aren't tuned in to these details until much later and so a great many NYers who would have voted could not. I have a young friend in her thirties who went to vote on election day only to find that having changed her voter registration to reflect her new married name also meant that she was dropped from the Democratic rolls.

There are so many ways to suppress the vote in the US. I just find it sad. I have been a Democrat since I registered to vote at 18. I got to vote for Jimmy Carter my first time. I do feel like my party and my country are leaving me behind and it makes me very sad. I really like President Obama, I think he is a very decent man. I just would like my party and my country to push left before it is too late.

[Loki]

161. I wasn't on the voting rolls in Texas several times.

This was during the elections in the late 90's and early 2000's. I was a Democrat in a Republican state. I asked for a provisional ballot and was given one. They had open primaries at that time. Even when I returned to Missouri, they had my husband registered but they didn't have my name even though we both registered at the DMV when we went to have our DL's changed from Texas to Missouri. Even when you do everything you are supposed to, things get lost or misplaced or sometimes intentionally left out. It is up to each and every one of us to know what is going on in our states elections and the campaigns need to make a more concerted effort to empower people with that knowledge. Not knowing is not an excuse in law or in real life. I've worked elections many times and I always worked to let people who could vote, vote. If not, provisional ballots were used. This party isn't leaving me behind, but I know the republican's in my state want less people to vote and they are very happy with that. So go ahead and blame the Democrats, but I will remain and work to make sure that we elect people who are positively involved in the voting process and empower people to facilitate change, not in those who seek to make it a white, male only exercise. You don't like the system, then work in the system to get it changed. Allowing more religiously crazed republicans to be elected because of gerrymandering state districts certainly won't do it. Most of this can only be accomplished on the state level. That's where the work should be and needs to be done. That's what I'm doing, is that what you are doing?

[redwitch]

168. I am a very active Democrat.

Joined my town committee in 2003 and work at the county committee too. Our county committee was instrumental in getting Kirsten Gillibrand elected to Congress. Of course we had a lot of help with that when John Sweeney went off the rails big time.
I have canvassed for candidates, phone banked, donated, coordinated fundraising events and I have always voted. I have carpeted the town with those awful yard signs ( and then gone back at the end and removed them as soon as the election is over). I have always been a staunch Democrat. And I have no idea why my post generated your response. If a Democrat such as I have always been is questioning her membership in the party it is time to worry.

[Loki]

169. See, that's the difference between us.

I don't question her membership in this party. I don't questions Bernie's right to caucus with the Democrats. You choose to believe in a discriminatory practice because you don't believe that she represents every one of your ideas or beliefs. I'm a reality based Democrat and realize that I won't and don't always have everything I want. So I work for it. I don't cast out those who may have just some of the things I want. I'm not a ideological purist. Never have been.

[redwitch]

170. I was referring to me when I said her.

I read your response and it made no sense until I realized you read it wrong. I do not consider myself a purist. I do think money and endless war is ruining us. What discriminatory practice are you referring to, I am seriously confused.
I just changed my avatar because I have a sneaking suspicion that you replied the way you did because of the Bernie avatar.

[Loki]

172. Sorry if I confused you.

So many people on this board are ready, willing and do blame everything wrong with voting on Hillary or the Democrats, but fail to take any responsibility for their own failure to even take an interest in the elections and how they are run in their states. That is what Democracy is all about and being politically ignorant is not an excuse for me anymore. I took your comment out of context, and I'm sorry for that. I didn't realize you were talking about yourself. I'm not an independent, because there are absolutely no republicans that I could honestly and with good conscience every vote for. When there have been candidates who are Green or Independent and I felt they were good, I've voted for them. But in this state, Missouri, we have two political parties of any consequence and I vote for the Democrat. We have a state legislature that wastes our tax money on trying to defund PP and the ACA, and name a state football team, and place a bust of Rush Limbaugh in the State chambers, while letting all the rest of the state go to hell in a hand basket. This is what a republican controlled legislature looks like. I want to change that and get back to actually getting things done before we pass a point where we won't have the resources to do it. People want change, but I've found that when it comes to doing the hard work and having to pay for it, they quit wanting it and settle for the guy that bleats "no new taxes." I guess I'm just old school. To me, Independent means that you would vote Republican if the person had good ideas. I'm realistic enough to know that Republicans will never vote against the party, ever, so being Independent is not a viable option with the current people in power. Back in the days before the Tea Party and the rise of Ronald Reagan, we had Republican's that you could actually consider voting for. Not anymore.

[redwitch]

174. I'm in NY, from NJ originally.

And the list of politicians, (including a whole lot of Democrats) convicted of corruption, sexual harassment etc. is quite long. Power and money corrupt.

I am still a Democrat but I am hanging by a thread.

[Tarc]

141. This is just absurd. Your man was out-voted by 3 million, and out-gained on delegates by 300

It's time to just suck it up and admit defeat.

[beastie boy]

163. Let me guess...

If anyone brings up the fact that you have no compelling evidence to claim the election was "stolen", you are leaving DU, right?

[COLGATE4]

165. I don't think she wants you to obligage her. nt

[arikara]

179. Those were the good old days for sure

It was the place to get all the news first, Keph was on top of everything in LBN. People actually discussed all kinds of issues instead of just ganging up and attacking each other. We were skeptical and used our brains. People researched, shared the info and kept adding to it. It was great back then.

I'm settling in to JPR but this habit is still hard to break after 15 years however if she wins the nomination I will be leaving too.

[FSogol]

139. TeleSur is Venezuela's Propaganda Outlet, very similar to Iran's PressTV, and Russia's RT.

From wiki: After 2007 however, some began to believe that teleSUR appeared to be a propaganda tool for Hugo Chávez and his Bolivarian Revolution, with the network being described as "a mouthpiece for Chávez". According to Aram Aharonian, the founder of teleSUR, Chávez "took the reins" of teleSUR and used "propaganda as rolling news", with Aharonian being removed from teleSUR in December 2008 by former Venezuelan Minister of Popular Power for Communication and Information Andres Izarra.

It should never be used as a source on DU and so especially not be used to bash any Democratic party candidate.

Ciao,

[COLGATE4]

166. Absolutely. This 'site' is every bit as dishonest as the crap

from World Nut Daily or Rim Job's sad excuse for a website. It should be prohibited from being posted on DU.

[CreekDog]

142. the real reason you've opposed Hillary

But . . . the problem with Mrs. Clinton, aside from the fact that she's been the consummate neo-liberal in foreign relations and a strong supporter of Wall Street, is that there's this air about her that she's entitled to be nominated because it's her turn

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5953716

don't lecture us, just go. it's okay to disagree with us, it's ok to not like this place.

it's not ok to be high minded about it, when you've come her to peddle a sexist trope.

[Paladin]

173. Well said. (nt)

[yellowcanine]

151. "This will be my last post." That is where I stopped reading.

If you want to leave, just leave. Really not interested in the reasons.

[Democat]

157. Move this to the Primaries forum where it belongs

Are the admins really going to allow every single anti-Clinton poster make their own "Democrats suck" thread in the General forum?

Move the thread and make it clear that these type of posts are only allowed in the Primaries forum.

[LannyDeVaney]

164. Goodbye!

[dbackjon]

167. So you didn't get your way so you're taking your ball and going home

Instead of trying to change the party from the bottom up which needs to be done


Then in another four or eight years you'll be back trying to have some other independent person when the democratic nomination and they complaining about how the party is stacked against you even though you've been working against it for the last 4 to 8 years

Yeah that sounds like a real intelligent adult way to effect change

[Aristus]

171. If a Republican gets into the Oval Office, you may want to think about coming back.

You've only been here a few years. I've been here since 2001. And it didn't take too long for the "both parties are exactly the same" types to dislike the feel of egg on their faces. Stubbornly holding out for Ralph Nader gave us 8 years of the Shrub. And God knows, I don't want to go through that again. DU was a life-line for me in difficult times. If, in good times for the Democratic Party, we fragment and bicker, at least let's come together to prevent a return to the bad times.

[Vogon_Glory]

175. I'm old enough to remember the Dixiecrats, too

I'm old enough to remember the Dixiecrats, too, and how they picked up their marbles and left.

The Democratic Party is an agglomeration of interests and is far more liberal as a whole than it was in 1968.

Bye-bye!

[one_voice]

180. Locking..

Doesn't meet SoP for GD. Better suited for GDP.

Star Member Skinner (61,525 posts)
1. If it mentions one of the primary candidates then it still belongs in GDP.

You are welcome to post about the general election in GD without reference to the primary candidates