I saw this on the page of a former co-worker...

[TheDebbieDee]

I left active duty Army in July 1991 and spent the next 8 years in the Army Reserves. Military service members do not have any rights - we have no right to free speech, no right to bear arms (unless we're ordered to carry a weapon) and we certainly don't have the right to do what this Marine is doing in the photo!

We are allowed to have opinions about anything and everything but we're supposed to keep these opinions to ourselves!

If a liberal-leaning soldier took a photo making a similar statement about a Republican candidate, you can bet that some outraged conservative would start a witch-hunt to find this soldier and shut him up!

I find this very distressing as it seems that this Marine thinks that it is okay to try to undermine the next Democratic President of the US before he/she can even be elected! Do you think I'm over-reacting?

[bigwillq]

1. Yes, you're over-reacting (nt)

[Egnever]

9. Agreed

Democracy does not mean everyone agrees with you.

[TheDebbieDee]

85. You missed my point which was that members of the military

shouldn't be making political statements, anonymously or not!

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

87. I would counsel him...

...to make all the political statements he wants...

...in a privately purchased garment.

[libdem4life]

117. ....

[FBaggins]

128. Is he weaning a uniform?

It might be civilian camo

[JanMichael]

135. bullshit. the reaction is fine. you are over overreating. nt.

[RiverLover]

2. In all fairness, she is verifiably a war hawk.

I'm terrified of WWIII with her in the WH.

[Chan790]

3. So am I.

I've said it before, "I'm hawkish, she's something else entirely."

I just believe in humanitarian intervention where politics and international relations have failed, Hillary seems to have no cards in her diplomacy deck other than use of military force.

[puffy socks]

32. I'm tired of this lie being posted over and over again.

Clinton scores Gaza cease fire success

By Byron Tau

11/21/12 01:31 PM EST

Updated 11/21/12 04:55 PM EST

The first bus bombing in years struck Tel Aviv just as she arrived for a round of shuttle negotiations that helped produce the deal Wednesday. Clinton, along with White House press secretary Jay Carney, condemned the attack — withering the optimism for stopping the Hamas rocket attacks and the threat of an Israeli ground operation.

Her trip came after days of Obama’s calls with Netanyahu and the Egyptian government — which was negotiating on behalf of Hamas — that had not produced a speedy result. There’s still a long distance between the cease-fire and any kind of lasting peace, but Clinton scored a major victory in a difficult region — one where, despite the list of local Obama priorities, the administration hasn’t seen much progress.

http://www.politico.com/story/2012/11/clinton-announces-gaza-cease-fire-084145




It is Bernie Sanders who is the war hawk as proven by his record.

He supported NATO's bombing of Yugoslavia in 1999.
He voted for funding the one in Afghanistan. He voted for military action in Libya.

He voted in favor of a $1 billion aid package for the coup government Ukraine

He supported Israel's assault on Gaza.

He also voted in favor of S J Res 45 - Authorization for Use of US Armed Forces in Somalia, which authorized President Bill Clinton to use US troops in Somalia.

1997, Bernie voted for HR 2159 - Foreign Operations FY98 Appropriations bill, which included:
$3 billion for Israel, including
$1.8 billion in military assistance and $1.2 billion in economic assistance
$2.12 billion for Egypt, including $1.3 billion in military assistance and $815 million in economic assistance
$770 million for former Soviet Republics
$215 million for international narcotics control and law enforcement.


Bernie voted for HR 4655, the Iraqi Liberation Act of 1998, which expressed the sense of Congress that it should be the aim of the United States to remove Saddam Hussein from power. President George W. Bush later used the Iraqi Liberation Act to provide justification for military action for the 2003 invasion.


In 1999, Bernie voted for HR 2465, which provided $4 billion for military construction,
and he voted for HR 3196, which provided: $2.16 billion for military and economic assistance to Israel
$760 million for military and economic assistance to Egypt
$535 million for Eastern European and the Baltic States, including $150 million for assistance to Kosovo
$300 million for military and economic assistance to Jordan
$285 million for international narcotics control.

He also voted in favor of HR 2800 - Foreign Operations Appropriations, FY 2004 bill, which granted $1.8 billion in military and economic assistance to Egypt and $2.2 billion for Israeli military assistance.

He called closing the torturous gulag at Guantanamo a "complicated issue" and ultimately rejected a proposal to shut it down.

[Loudestlib]

107. No one will believe that Bernie is Hawkish.

Hillary's record proves that she is. n/t

[NewImproved Deal]

132. The bloodthirsty Neo-Cons love the Former First Lady...

Another good reason to not vote for her.

[link:|

[Darb]

23. Super caliber fragalistic horseshit.

Nice going. Nose.

[elleng]

31. No horseshit.

How Hillary Clinton became a hawk.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/24/magazine/how-hillary-clinton-became-a-hawk.html?

[libdem4life]

118. Wow, and it's a real MSM source. There will be crickets because

they can't "kill the messenger"...anything that gets so outragous that the MSM can't not cover it. Unfortunately, some have "just woken up" when it's too late to do much good.

Good find.

[elleng]

121. and many REFUSE to wake up.

That's the part that troubles me most, otherwise thoughtful people just IGNORING!

[libdem4life]

122. Cults are like that. It has religious overtones, too. Leader-centric.

Brainwashing is an old tactic that works very well, given the appropriate circumstances. And here we are...with the appropriate circumstances in place.

[Darb]

125. A bernie calling Hillary supporters cultists.

That's a rich as it fucking gets. Where is your nose?

[libdem4life]

129. So classy. But certainly not unexpected from a true believer.

[Darb]

130. How daft.

Try looking into a mirror. There you will find the cultist.

[libdem4life]

133. How do you know? Do you routinely insult strangers just because they

vote differently? My posts speak for themselves.

Daft? Cultist? Seriously, that's not polite.

[elleng]

137. Seems like s/he DOES that routinely.

LOTS of that going on these days, trying to take us all DOWN together. SICKNESS setting in.

[Darb]

145. More complete obtuseness from a bernie.

The bernies are the death cult when it comes to voting, not the Hillary supporters. I respond when you bernies attack Hillary the exact way a teabagger would. If it seems common, then the teabagger-like attacks must be common.

Deal with it.

Where is your nose?

[Darb]

144. Your posts call Hillary supporters "true believers", etc.

You are being daft. Own it. The only cult here is the cult of bernie, and you are obviously in it.

[elleng]

148. Wrong Wrong Wrong

[Darb]

124. Opinion. Just like an asshole.

Derrrrrr. Where's your nose.

[elleng]

136. Up yours.

[Darb]

146. Bernie lost, deal.

What did you do with your nose after you cut it off?

[elleng]

149. Martin O'Malley lost/stepped down,

Senator Sanders is still running, and doing his best to make something good out of this mess.

[brush]

29. FYI: Trump just said he'd use nukes in Europe

Now that's what I call a war hawk.

Vote blue no matter who.

[RiverLover]

46. Trump is a buffoon, but he wants nukes as a negotiating tactic (?!) & I quote the buffoon,

TRUMP: No, no, but you can’t say — first of all, you don’t want to say, “Take everything off the table…”

MATTHEWS: No, just nuclear.

TRUMP: … because you’d be a bad negotiator if you do that.

MATTHEWS: Just nuclear.

TRUMP: Look, nuclear should be off the table. But would there be a time when it could be used, possibly, possibly?

*****************

MATTHEWS: Can you tell the Middle East we’re not using a nuclear weapon on anybody?

TRUMP: I would never say that. I would never take any of my cards off the table.

MATTHEWS: How about Europe? We won’t use it in Europe?

TRUMP: I — I’m not going to take it off the table.

MATTHEWS: You might use it in Europe?

(LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: No, I don’t think so. But I’m not taking…

MATTHEWS: Well, just say it. “I will never use a nuclear weapon in Europe.”

TRUMP: I am not — I am not taking cards off the table.

Such a dork. We need a sane, decent president. President Sanders.

[brush]

55. I agree, Trump is a dork, and much more, but let's face it, Bernie is not . . .

getting the nomination no matter how much you want that to happen.

We Dems need to work together to make sure Trump gets nowhere near the White House.

That means voting blue no matter who.

Clinston supporters have always said they'd vote for Bernie if he won, Sanders supporters need to come around and do the same.

[Chan790]

138. Yup, I think civilization is well-fucked either way.

Hillary is going to lead us into the quagmire of the fall of empire or Trump is going to start WW III.

Either way, I think we're all going to die. It's like a race between Greg Stillson and Greg Stillson. (Greg Stillson was the antagonist of The Dead Zone by Stephen King. Not so much a villain as much as just a candidate whose future contained the certainty of nuclear war. Okay, he was a bad dude too...a dog-murderer who attempted to use a baby as a human shield to prevent an attempted assassination.)

[sufrommich]

4. If a liberal leaning soldier did the same,there would be

a house committee formed to find and expel liberals from the Marines.

[phylny]

5. Where were the hundreds of signs

asking us not to vote for George W. Bush?

This is crap. He can think what he wants, but I reserve the right to ridicule him.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

6. +1

[jonno99]

34. Yep +1

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

90. Where were the signs?

Here you go....



Wearing uniforms with nametapes, which is highly frowned upon after discharge.

[phylny]

112. Is George W. Bush's name on those signs? I'm looking but don't see it. n/t

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

113. I could not find one, no.

But it was veterans against the Iraq War, which was his war.

Therefore, by extension....

It's the best I can find, but I believe it answers the question in the affirmative.

[phylny]

114. It doesn't answer it for me, because the sign the soldier is holding

specifically names Clinton. I'm looking for the same thing with Bush's name.

And, if you are Army, thanks for serving our country. My husband served for 3.5 years as a Lieutenant.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

115. Here you go.....

And thanks for the kind words.

Explanation for the soldier's Unit Insignia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_Aviation_Brigade,_1st_Cavalry_Division

[kas125]

131. That picture is not from when he was in the Army.

It's a picture of someone I knew and loved - someone who died a little over a year ago because he was shot in the back and paralyzed on his 4th day in Iraq and didn't get the care he needed and deserved, much less the meeting with Bush that he spent years asking for. His family had to fight tooth and nail to get him everything from a working wheelchair to rehab after the VA hospital misdiagnosed pain in his arm which was actually an embolism. They sent him home with yet another prescription for pain meds and he was found comatose the next day. He never fully recovered after that. He was treated abominably. He certainly wasn't in the military when this picture was taken.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

143. I understand.

The care received by veterans is terrible.

It should be considered a national scandal.

Thank you for your post.

[The River]

151. Not True

This Vet gets excellent care from the VA. Most all of
the Vets I talk to love their VA care. That's not a random observation,
I actually do volunteer work with a community based Vet center so I hear both sides.

To say that "The care received by veterans is terrible."
is very misleading. Some Vets may not get what they need
as fast as they think they need it or deserve it but the majority does.

Those who are happy with their care don't often post how good the service is.
It's only the unhappy few who bitch and moan in public and that's what you
see in the right wing media. I bet that many of those who complain the
loudest are "Bad" patients to begin with. They miss appointments and don't call (and some other Vet misses a chance to be seen). They don't take their meds or follow instructions. Sometimes
their condition can't be cured and they're just frustrated out-loud. Sometimes life sucks.

All large organizations have problems due their size and complexity.
The VA is no exception but they do a damned good job compared to
most for-profit hospitals.

You're not helping one bit by repeating the r/w propaganda.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

155. I've heard otherwise....

....but I am happy to hear it is not widespread.

The stories I have heard are from the New York City area and specifically deal with the conditions of the facilities being in such disrepair that it affects treatment and recovery.

Thank you for your input, I certainly have an interest in your post being correct.

[jmowreader]

139. However, he can't do what he's doing

This is the Department of Defense's political regulation. http://www.dod.mil/dodgc/defense_ethics/ethics_regulation/1344-10.html

Advocating for or against partisan political candidates is high on the "don't do this!" list.

BTW...the "Killary" thing leads me to believe he's a Sanders supporter. Trump supporters think the only thing she likes killing is "unborn babies."

[SickOfTheOnePct]

152. Wrong

Military members are certainly permitted to advocate for or against political candidates, but not while representing their service or in an official capacity.

This Marine, though I disagree with him, is doing nothing wrong.

[scscholar]

7. There are double-standards, and...

then there are double-standards.

[Hoyt]

8. Maybe you should not reenlist. By the way, what made you enlist in first place?

I bet it wasn't too promote peace.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

10. I find the above comment reprehensible.

'What made you enlist in first place?'

To defend the very values that enable you to make comments like the one above.

'I bet it wasn't too (sic) promote peace.'

In my case, you lose the bet.

[Hoyt]

14. Yeah right. That kid did no such thing, he wasn't drafted and odds are he joined for the gung-ho

Last edited Sat May 7, 2016, 01:01 AM - Edit history (1)

aspects of the military like most kids.

And you carry a gun to go to the store and have said you consider America a war zone. I find that reprehensible too.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

15. 'And you carry a gun.....'

This is not about me, and other posts, other discussions.

If you have not been in the military, you have no right to say what you are saying.

If you have, then thank you for your service and I am sorry you are disillusioned about the military as a career.

[Hoyt]

37. Gun love, military, etc., are often related.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

48. My presence, while grotesque to you, saves lives.

And in my own words.... F--- Off.

How dare you question the motives of someone you don't even know.

The young man in the photo once signed a check, made out to the American people, for the sum of:

' My safety, and my life, if necessary.'

And you question him without knowing him.

[truebluegreen]

57. Quoting Colonel Jessup from A Few Good Men?

There's a role model.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

60. It's a legitimate quote...

...from a Hollywood film.

Of course, they had to turn the highest ranking character in the film into a 'bad guy' at the end, to make the script neat, and to take the 'whole honor thing' down a notch.

My point in using the quote (besides to further debate) is that most people get their information about the military from the movies. Except for all out bloodbath movies (Behind Enemy Lines, and bullshit like that) any subtle storytelling has to turn military characters into flawed individuals who can ultimately do no right.

In Full Metal Jacket, the DI had to be killed, because he was 'sadistic.' In my opinion, he was a fucking riot and I would have loved to have him as my instructor, or as a colleague. In Platoon, the SFC was a deranged killer. In my experience, by the time you become a plat daddy or Top, you are more of a father figure than a combat leader.

In The Hurt Locker, the team leader would have been shit-canned after his first mission for acting that reckless. In Zero Dark Thirty, the film portrayed highly illegal acts, such as re-shooting a person as they lay on the ground. There is absolutely no evidence that this happened.

People need to stop dumping on military personnel out of ignorance, stop treating them like second class citizens politically, and stop questioning their reasons for enlisting.

If your information and military education comes from the movies, you have no right to comment on a Marine's motive for holding up a piece of paper.

[truebluegreen]

68. Don't care if it's from a movie.

Jessup in the movie was a lousy effing role model. And in case you missed it, I didn't make one single statement about "a Marine's motive for holding up a piece of paper." You make a lot of assumptions about where I get my information about the military and what my opinion might be: that doesn't make you any smarter or more justified in my eyes. Deal with it.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

71. I'm not talking to you directly.

If your information and military education comes from the movies, you have no right to comment on a Marine's motive for holding up a piece of paper.

That's me holding up my own goddam piece of paper, not addressing any individual.


I'm addressing the reprehensible attitude in society towards military personnel - when people say how they really feel.

Not the Memorial Day attitude, but the deep dark 'they are expendable' attitude I hear if they do not know a service member is in the room, or if they are anonymous internet contributors. Or if they make movies for Hollywood.

There's a reason that the vast majority of service personnel are sick and tired of being asked 'did you ever kill anyone' when people, especially young people, ask about their service.

Jessup was a fictional movie character whose integrity had to be sacrificed to make the movie sell-able to the Hollywood types.

In my experience, no Colonel would be consulted for the matter of an individual soldier's lack of ability to tow the line. It would have been handled at a much lower echelon, probably no higher than Company NCO level.

Hollywood bullshit that people believe, and form opinions around. And then spout anonymously online.

That was my point, not to start an argument with any individual.

EDIT: see what I mean?

As to guy in photo, he as probably attracted to the training to kill Muslims. Let's be real. When he gets out, odds are he will be little different from George Zman when it comes to gunz.

[Hoyt]

70. I'm fine with police carrying weapons. When off duty, or as cvilian, it's different.

As to guy in photo, he as probably attracted to the training to kill Muslims. Let's be real. When he gets out, odds are he will be little different from George Zman when it comes to gunz.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

74. You need to find a rock....

...any rock...

to call home.

[Hoyt]

79. Well that's better than the usual, "I'll rip your head of and crap down your neck" ypu

hear from the gung-ho for war types.

Look, I appreciate our military and police. My late father in-law was retired military and police, over 25+ years in each. Should have heard him talk about the gung-hoers and war. Called them silly fools. He also had no tolerance for police who were big on gunz and such. When he barely had the strength to walk, he ripped some stupid detective walking around with dual shoulder holsters.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

82. Thank you.

Sensible post.

Appreciated.

[DashOneBravo]

141. I believe you could

Find a way to work race in on a gardening forum.

That guy shouldn't make those kind of statements wearing a uniform the tax payers paid for.

In case you have not noticed . The military doesnt just kill Muslims

[Hoyt]

147. That's the focus now, as were Asians mid-1900s.

[libdem4life]

116. Hold on with the gung-ho crap...many, many enlist because there aren't

any decent jobs with benefits or enough to raise a family. That's a well-known fact. And as to the "gung-ho aspects" for shame. And even if so, it's a choice...unlike those without jobs which do not have a choice.

Oh wait, we could have a draft, then we wouldn't have to worry about whether they were gung-ho or not. Duh.

ETA: Also, the opportunity to get a college degree without being indentured to the Corporate Banking System.

[Hoyt]

119. I'll take owing banks to being told what to do, who to kill, who to hate, kissing some

Last edited Sat May 7, 2016, 03:59 PM - Edit history (1)

dumb officer's ass, etc. I get some people don't have much choice, but parents, teachers, etc., should have warned them long before it came to that. Look at the ads for military, they know what excites those kids and it ain't college. Hell, a bunch aren't even high school grads or barely made it. It's sad, actually.

[libdem4life]

120. Poor kids...parents and teachers can't do much about that. I worked in

a Mexican-American community in LA County decades ago, and many were first generation Americans who joined. They were uber-patriotic because of their parent's experience immigrating from horrible situations south of the Border. They had little money so the military was often their sole option, other than being on welfare. Also, back in those years, it wasn't if you spoke English or not, it was if you had an accent...that often kept the job market closed.

They were the best students and parents I had (elementary school) because they still held the values of hard work and were grateful to be Americans. I lived through ... and protested the 60s draft and lost a couple of friends in Nam.

It was the all-voluntary military that produced the events above. I know there is no easy answer or act or position...just that it's multi-layered and doesn't fit into any soundbite.

[ronnie624]

62. Freedom is defended by the constitution, not the military.

History shows that the military is far more likely to be used to oppress people.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

64. The military is used to defend the Constitution.

Try re-winding history and re-playing it without the US Military.

Slavery, Nazism, Communism, Terrorism

Nice bunch of friends you got there.

[ronnie624]

78. Most US military interventions

have been for the purpose of imposing and maintaining a particular economic order that is beneficial to the wealthy class, not freeing slaves. A view of history shows conclusively, that the US military has been used more often for self-serving reasons than idealistic ones.

Here is a timeline:


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_military_operations

It's important to keep in mind for proper perspective, that US activities in the
Philippines, Korea, Indochina and Iraq, featured some the worst acts of brutality in history.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

86. No one would doubt....

...that this nation, any nation, has a checkered history.

Your post could be used in support of the Marine in the OP; speaking up about wanting to avoid all but the most absolutely necessary uses of the military.

[ronnie624]

95. You mentioned terrorism as a rationalization for US militarism,

but an examination of the statistics reveals, that the military response to terrorism has been an over-reaction by many orders of magnitude. The actual threat simply does not merit an all-out global war. The 'war on terror' has increased the threat from terrorism, which is a clear example of how employing the military can cause more harm than good.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

97. I agree very much with your post.

The MIC* has leveraged our collective fear of terrorism to build themselves a multi-gazillion dollar nest egg.

Agreed.

*Military-industrial complex

[Marr]

76. That one can always be counted on to go full Limbaugh. /nt

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

83. I don't listen....

...to Rush Limbaugh.

I listen to NPR.

[Marr]

93. I was referring to the other guy.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

94. Thank you.

[TheDebbieDee]

16. I'm not in, Hoyt. I left active duty in jul 1991...

And I was in the Army Reserves until May 2003.

I joined the Army in Dec 1982. Ray-gun was President, the economy sucked for all those not already wealthy, the job market was tight for those with little experience, loan interest rates were 18 - 22%. I was 21 and I wanted to take the burden of my off my parents...

It was the only way to see some of the world, earn some type of income and keep a roof over my head! And I did meet some great people in the military, the US military is the most diverse workforce in the world... Or, at least, it was. Maybe conservative types that only watch FOX News is all that remains in the military now...

[Hoyt]

18. I can accept that, not that it matters. But that kid shouldn't be flashing BS like that. My bet

is he joined for the gung-ho, tough guy BS. Probably volunteered for middle east too. Obviously don't know, but I think it's a safe bet.

BTW, my original reply was aimed at the guy in the photo, not you.

[mountain grammy]

35. People enter the military for reasons other than

going off to play real tour of duty. I have a family full of vets who all promote peace and had no desire to fight a war, but some did as ordered. Yes, some who enter the military are gung ho types, but most are just people, wanting to serve their country and proud to do it. Maybe if we all asked what we could do for our country, we'd be in a better place.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

52. Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Most combat vets I know are the most peace loving people you're ever going to meet.

The second most peaceful people are military families and non-combat ex-military.

I worked with recruiters for years, getting urban teens qualified for service.

Any too-gung-ho types were pushed aside. They would fail the psych anyway.

[milestogo]

11. Misogyny runs deep in the Military.

If this Marine can't bring himself to respect a female commander-in-chief he should leave the Military.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

13. She's not the CinC yet.

[milestogo]

20. She or some other woman could be the next President.

And if a Marine can't deal with that they should join the military in some other country that is more consistent with those values,

[davidn3600]

25. How do we know it has anything to do with her being a woman?

If the soldier is a conservative Republican, chances are he's going to hate any Democratic candidate.

[milestogo]

38. Since the odds of the president being a democrat are about 50% -

it seems foolish for a Marine to sign up when they are unwilling to comply with orders 50% of the time.

[davidn3600]

42. His message says nothing about not following orders

Nor does it say anything about Hillary's gender.

For all we know (based on the picture alone), he could be a Bernie supporter who's upset that Hillary may get us into another Iraq (she did vote for it).

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

49. "Hillary may get us into another Iraq"

Service members are liking Bernie

[Hoyt]

72. If they want to avoid war, training to kill, and killing people, don't enlist. Simple.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

73. You need a doctor.

[Hoyt]

75. So does someone promoting gunz and with a user name like you.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

77. Training to kill....

Hmmm....

- Land navigation
- First aid
- Search and rescue
- Traffic control
- Self defense
- Physical fitness
- Radio communications
- Drill and ceremony
- Disaster preparedness
- Public and press relations
- Customs and courtesies
- Military rank
- Military justice

These are the subjects I taught. Real violent, deadly stuff.

[Hoyt]

80. People don't join the military to control traffic, etc.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

81. Oh, wow....

you're right!



NOT

[Hoyt]

88. He's got a gun on his hip, that makes it tolerable. I doubt he'll reenlist to do that the rest of

his life.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

89. No, he'll re-enlist....

...to work his way up the chain of command, and to become First Sergeant someday.

He can have the job I had.

Better yet, we can both go direct traffic.

[Hoyt]

96. He's just happy to be able to walk around with a gun on his hip.

We used to go out to Redstone Arsenal. Right after 9/11, those kids where having a great time harassing retired military and their families. Last time we went, there were about five of those order-taking goofs with rifles swung over their shoulders making us open the hood of the car, and similar crud. I get the necessity, but I came so close to making sudden, wild movements just to watch them crap their pants. Probably would have been shot, but dang, it was tough to resist.

Let's be real. There are a lot of folks in the military who need the structure. Heck, my Vietnam Marine friend -- who hates gunz now too, BTW -- had a judge order one of his kids who couldn't resist drugs to join the Army. Had nothing to do with defending the country, it was simply to stay out of jail.

The real point to all of this, is the supposed Marine in the OP with his stupid little poster/opinions. If he doesn't like, resign and get out -- we'd all be better off. He signed up to have people tell him what to do. If he doesn't like what they tell him, move on.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

99. "had a judge order one of his kids who couldn't resist drugs to join the Army"

I have to go now, but one point - the above quote is known as a fraudulent enlistment.

Results: out on his ass if anyone finds out.

[Hoyt]

104. Standards aren't very high when you need recruits. Heck, the saying during Vietnam was, "if they

look up your rear end and don't see light, you are good to go." And I think they violated that at times.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

105. Not anymore.

[Hoyt]

106. Not according to articles like this.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/war_stories/2008/01/dumb_and_dumber.html

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

109. That was directly in the middle...

......of a very problematic time for the Army.

Recruiting centers became more like carnival tents....'Step right up....'

They paid for that mistake with gang activity and drugs in the ranks.

[Hoyt]

110. At least you admit it.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

111. I remember it.

I also remember going up against my colleagues who still believed in group punishment, lumping the knuckleheads with the (majority) well meaning ones that really wanted to be there.

My popularity among the senior NCO corps was not always that rosy.

[Katashi_itto]

54. Bwhahaha!!! Where dies the marine talk about gender?

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

56. Nowhere

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

12. I support the Marine entirely.

While I would not want him using government property to transmit the image, if he did it on his own computer he has every right.

He is not showing his name tapes, no rank, no identifiable information (such as a unit guidon) behind him.

I would be proud to be his NCO, regardless of what he is saying on the paper.

[Kingofalldems]

44. His picture is identifiable information .

Guess you missed that one.

Not fooled.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

51. No, it's not.

Not legally.

He's not doing anything illegal for us to want to know who he is.

Therefore we don't need to know who he is.

Therefore his face does not matter.

See my post below.

[jwirr]

17. +1

[Viva_La_Revolution]

19. most of the guys in my son's platoon are voting for Bernie, not one admits wanting Hillary as CIC

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

21. Roger that.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

24. "Roger that" reminds me of someone; but I cannot remember who used to say it

[Kingofalldems]

45. Someone that was a DU member?

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

50. In the military,

It's more common than 'good morning.'

[Skittles]

22. sexist garbage

I bet he thinks Dubya and Trump are just SWELL

[davidn3600]

26. Should the military not be allowed to vote either?

Seems you don't want them to have political opinions.

Sorry, but Hillary Clinton isn't President of the United States right now.

[TheDebbieDee]

36. I didn't say anything about them not having political opinions...

I stated that when I was in the military, we were encouraged to keep our opinions to ourselves, especially those of a political nature...

And the whole point of my post is that this jack-wagon is trying to undermine the next President (maybe he's got a sign with Bernie's name on it as well...) and that were he posting this type of material about a republican Presidential candidate, conservatives would beoutraged and trying to find out who he is!

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

53. Things have changed.

Things have really changed.

[Kingofalldems]

59. So if she wins ---the marine should be removed from

the service or court martialed.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

63. Cout Martial? Are we being serious here?

I certainly hope not.

[Kingofalldems]

65. As regards to 'we', I have no proof what you are doing

but I have a good idea. I am seriously taking it to it's logical conclusion.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

66. Court martial a kid for holding up a sign?

Are those the kind of people we are currently nominating for office?

[Kingofalldems]

67. Nope.

Logical conclusion.

[tenderfoot]

27. PLEASE!!! Vote for Republicans that consistently vote for wars and cuts to veteran benefits.

There, I fixed the sign for him.

[phylny]

43. Perfect response. n/t

[DawgHouse]

69. Exactly right +100

[Rebkeh]

28. K and R nt

[leftofcool]

30. He's a Trump supporter.

[liberalhistorian]

33. I'm not crazy about Hillary at all,

and I will have to hold my nose to vote for her should she become the nominee (but I will, indeed, vote for her, no question), and I also agree that she has a very hawkish record that I would not be happy about were I in the military. HOWEVER....just what does this gentleman think that Drumpf would do? Does he think Drumpf would be any better? Does he not realize that Drumpf would be even worse militarily and cause even greater danger to the military?

[Aristus]

40. Shit. Could be a Berniebot.

Their hatred of Hillary Clinton makes the right-wing noise machine sound like the annoyed grunt of a pissy 12 year-old.

[Ex Lurker]

41. Enlisted personnel have a lot more leeway in this than officers

It's one of the few ways the enlisted ranks have it better than the officer corps. An officer's chain of command would take a very dim view of this. An enlisted Soldier or Marine would at most get counseled by the 1st SGT to tone it down a little bit, and maybe not even that.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

47. Agreed

His favor:

- Own personal phone camera

- Own personal laptop or internet device

- No identifiable nametapes, rank, unit insignia, barracks information in background

- Service members regularly use facebook and other websites I'm too old to know about

- Someone above said his face was identifiable - ummmm, yeah, but he owns his face.

- She's NOT the Commander in Chief. She's a political candidate

- Not doing anything 'in person' to influence the campaign or results of the election (not allowed to use the uniform for political purposes)


Not his favor:

- USMC MARPAT (camo style) is unique to the Marine Corps, so what is showing of the uniform is at minimal branch specific

- If he was on duty, he was getting paid to do his job, not write signs

- If he was off duty, he should have taken a shower and thrown his cammies in the laundry, and taken the photo in a T-shirt

- And always my favorite:

"I really don't need this petty shit in my office right fucking now. Staff Sergeant, you go make sure this does not happen again with any of your people. If they want to get political, tell them to do it in civvies.

You roger me on that?"

[CBGLuthier]

58. How do you know this man is not a liberal?

I am very liberal and I think the same thing he does.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

61. He's a Marine....

He has to be a right wing nut job

(VERY SERIOUS SARCASM OF COURSE)

Of course he could be of any political leaning, or none at all.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

84. you mean the military is misogynistic overall?

http://www.alternet.org/story/85099/misogyny_rampant_in_the_armed_forces%3A_1_in_3_military_women_experience_sexual_abuse

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/hs-student-asks-secdef-about-history-pervasive-misogyny-military

but let's all pretend this is because hillary is a hawk, because Cruz or Trump are such fucking doves.

guy's an asshole. just because he wears a uniform doesn't make him less of an asshole.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

91. "guy's an asshole."

Well get over it, because you swore an oath to defend him and people like him, no matter your political views.

Even if it gets you killed someday.

Oh, wait, I got it backwards.

Never mind.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

92. For those of you who are so anti war

What was the last time that the military actually saved my freedoms?

The military is used for national building and random humanitarian missions. No one is attacking us and so no one is saving me.

I am not pro cop or pro military just because they don a uniform. There's a lot of crap in both those organizations and the crap needs to be called out

[Hoyt]

108. WWII, and we took that too far nuking innocent Japanese. Every war since was just killing Asians or

Muslims for no good reason. Can accept some strikes after 9/11 and some other limited actions, but bombing and occupying wasn't necessary anywhere.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

98. "KIllery" Clinton! If the coward is afraid to fight he should get out of the military

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

100. Coward????

He does not want to fight an unnecessary war.

Very brave, in my opinion.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

102. Have you enlisted?

The validity of your post hinges on an answer to that question.

[47of74]

101. How do we know this guy is a member of the military?

And not just some rando holding up a sign?

I wouldn't put anything past the GOP at this point.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

103. The lighting.

That's barracks lighting. I know that anywhere.

[Shandris]

123. Why, no, of course not, why would you think that? ...

You just want to feel a little less powerless by destroying someone else's life. We understand. Everyone does it nowadays, it's so easy and you even get points for virtue signalling before you do it, just like you did.

People who like to control others have a mental illness. Since that's the vast bulk of society these days, all one can do is point it out and hope that maybe somewhere deep inside there lies enough humanity to realize the truth of it.

[TheDebbieDee]

153. WTH are you talking about?

Active duty military members are supposed to keep their opinions to themselves - at least, that's the way things were when I was in the military. You could get into big trouble for showing up at a military event in uniform, much less posting pictures of yourself holding signs deriding political candidates....

If this person were holding up a sign that dumped on a republican candidate, there would be a conservative-led witch-hunt to find out who this soldier/marine was!

And how would I be destroying his life if he willingly took the picture and distributed it on the internet? You sound stupid...

[HassleCat]

126. He might be in trouble.

He's in uniform and purports to speak on behalf of his fellow marines. Not too smart.

[cantbeserious]

127. Once A War Hawk - Always A War Hawk

eom

[Laura PourMeADrink]

134. Have tons of respect for him, but sorry, anyone who says "Killary" instead

of a proper name can't be taken seriously

[DashOneBravo]

140. In the past you

Were not allowed to make political statements in uniform.

Hopefully they will go bacK.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

142. I agree...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7813384

[GOLGO 13]

150. Yes, your over-reacting.

Your not "distressed". Your just upset that he's getting away with it.

[libodem]

154. Not with Rush Limbaugh

On Armed Forces Radio. That's how they learn that type of "respect" for their commander in chief.

Hmmmm, a proper court marshal is too good for him.