Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
69 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
That Moment When You Suddenly Realize (Original Post) libodem May 2016 OP
This entire bathroom thing is so absurd. What do they want, a cop outside each bathroom with RKP5637 May 2016 #1
And why did the administration bring it up right during elections? LiberalArkie May 2016 #2
Yep! Excellent question! n/t RKP5637 May 2016 #3
what administration? NC govt is the one who started pushing it Fast Walker 52 May 2016 #6
Why did they start pushing, because some where Washington told them they had to allow LiberalArkie May 2016 #10
The directive to schools and states came AFTER the NC rights-killing legislation. . . nt Bernardo de La Paz May 2016 #14
Why did NC pass the state law if the federal gov did not have a law saying to do it. LiberalArkie May 2016 #15
NC went first unc70 May 2016 #16
The city of Charlotte NC OldArtilleryMan May 2016 #20
If you want to play that game, bathroom bills were discussed by republicans in Arizona in 2013. MillennialDem May 2016 #25
There's some other stuff in the bill that has gotten no attention. alarimer May 2016 #49
Don't post made up stuff as if it were fact when you "weren't keeping app {sic} with the matter". nt Bernardo de La Paz May 2016 #29
I am sorry to have offended you. I just simply asked a question. LiberalArkie May 2016 #30
Okay. It's just that your questions contained assumptions posed as facts. Bernardo de La Paz May 2016 #42
City of Charlotte passed anti-discrimination law saying LGBT could use Triana May 2016 #59
The NC legislature SCantiGOP May 2016 #7
Because North Carolina put it in an omnibus rights killing bill. Ask Gov McCrory . . nt Bernardo de La Paz May 2016 #8
Bingo notemason May 2016 #12
The GOP made it an issue. ohnoyoudidnt May 2016 #9
Because N.C. signed it into law and it's very controversial? Blue_Tires May 2016 #46
Exactly ckimmy57 May 2016 #52
By Jove, I think you've got it! libodem May 2016 #4
And do we all need to carry polmaven May 2016 #43
It's absurd! The individuals dreaming up these laws demonstrate quite a RKP5637 May 2016 #45
The individuals are a very well paid group of "christian" operatives in Orlando Florida. Ford_Prefect May 2016 #47
Thanks for the additional information! RKP5637 May 2016 #48
The fuss is not about men who have become women Boudica the Lyoness May 2016 #54
I wonder, what is the solution? I ask this in all seriousness. n/t RKP5637 May 2016 #55
If a Transgender person look like the sex they want to be Boudica the Lyoness May 2016 #57
I agree with a number of things you've said. I like the idea of a separate unisex rest room as you RKP5637 May 2016 #58
I see what you are saying ProfessorPlum May 2016 #61
there should be a separate unisex rest room. AlbertCat May 2016 #65
somehow, we've all been sorting ourselves out with very little trouble ProfessorPlum May 2016 #60
But that's not the issue, either. Saviolo May 2016 #64
^THIS^ AlbertCat May 2016 #66
Thank you for saying what I was trying to say ProfessorPlum May 2016 #68
Tons of other ancillary issues involved. Saviolo May 2016 #69
Republicans passing a set of intrusive laws with no structure to enforce them. Stryst May 2016 #63
Exactly!!! K&R.. Rhiannon12866 May 2016 #5
What the MSM is not reporting Mr.Bill May 2016 #11
oh no, Mr.Bill !! Hiraeth May 2016 #17
Absolutely passiveporcupine May 2016 #13
Not "illegal shit." MADem May 2016 #18
Absolutely libodem May 2016 #19
+1,000! nt MADem May 2016 #21
Nice caption. However, I like to make sure the blame for 'illegal shit' PatrickforO May 2016 #22
Do you mean the 60 or so people Thespian2 May 2016 #24
They are exactly who I mean. PatrickforO May 2016 #50
So True libodem May 2016 #31
Kicked and recommended! nt Enthusiast May 2016 #23
What is the quote.... CompanyFirstSergeant May 2016 #26
maybe it's a distraction from the latest new war AgerolanAmerican May 2016 #27
YES libodem May 2016 #32
I have been wondering where those people had gone before, maybe they doc03 May 2016 #28
Funny libodem May 2016 #33
Less the media Flatpicker May 2016 #34
What a pile of crap. Name one thing illegal the government is doing. L. Coyote May 2016 #35
+1. The OP basically says the transgender bathroom issue is a conspiracy to distract us uhnope May 2016 #40
And notice, the poster cannot even name one thing. L. Coyote May 2016 #62
Why do nearly every single one of these image memes have to include... ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #36
such as the TPP??? nt hopemountain May 2016 #37
The Public Toilet? PATRICK May 2016 #38
Trans Pacific Parntersip hopemountain May 2016 #39
Vigilantes are already taking action--cand being real creeps eridani May 2016 #41
The woman freaked out when a woman Boudica the Lyoness May 2016 #56
There's a difference? Transgendered people keep very low profiles. eridani May 2016 #67
All because of the Freedom of Religion Act randr May 2016 #44
Actually There is a lot more to HB2 than just the bathroom portion neohippie May 2016 #51
Interesting to know libodem May 2016 #53

RKP5637

(67,086 posts)
1. This entire bathroom thing is so absurd. What do they want, a cop outside each bathroom with
Sun May 15, 2016, 07:00 PM
May 2016

an invasive full body scan. These wackos pushing bathroom laws are such a pack of damn fools.

LiberalArkie

(15,703 posts)
15. Why did NC pass the state law if the federal gov did not have a law saying to do it.
Sun May 15, 2016, 07:39 PM
May 2016

I wasn't keeping app with the matter really.

So you are saying that out of the clear blue sky NC passes a law saying that biological gender is what matters in bathrooms before the federal government even said anything about gender and bathrooms?

unc70

(6,109 posts)
16. NC went first
Sun May 15, 2016, 08:10 PM
May 2016

The Feds responded

This is really a continuation of the RW snit when same-sex marriage was made legal by the Court. Suddenly it went from weddings to bathrooms.

OldArtilleryMan

(7 posts)
20. The city of Charlotte NC
Sun May 15, 2016, 08:42 PM
May 2016

passed a city law permitting transgender people to use the bathroom of the gender they identified with.
The NC legislature then passed a law that prohibited localities from passing such laws.
The governor signed it into law.
It was an effort to throw a crumb to the religious right wing nuts.
Does anyone think they were not already doing this? Moreover, what problems has it caused?

alarimer

(16,245 posts)
49. There's some other stuff in the bill that has gotten no attention.
Mon May 16, 2016, 10:16 AM
May 2016

It's a trojan horse. They took away the right to sue under state law for employment discrimination and also prohibits cities from setting their own minimum wage. What worries me is that they will repeal the bathroom portion but leave the rest intact.

https://www.propublica.org/article/why-north-carolinas-new-anti-lgbt-law-is-a-trojan-horse

https://www.balloon-juice.com/2016/03/24/nc-gop-bathroom-bill-is-a-steaming-load-of-crap/

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,957 posts)
42. Okay. It's just that your questions contained assumptions posed as facts.
Mon May 16, 2016, 06:09 AM
May 2016

You didn't ask "if" the feds started it, but "why" which assumes that they did start it.

Glad it got sorted out in the end.

 

Triana

(22,666 posts)
59. City of Charlotte passed anti-discrimination law saying LGBT could use
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:36 PM
May 2016

whatever facilities they identified with re: gender.

McCrory and rest of NC Taliban disliked this so RUSHED into special session to pass a state law that effectively overturned Charlotte's (and added additional wording that prevented cities and municipalities from paying contract workers more than NC min wage and wording that prevented anyone from suing for discrimination in the workplace or elsewhere). It was gross administrative overreach by NC gov and leg. (though HE accuses Obama Admin of "overreach" it's McCrory & cronies who are actually guilty of it).

Passing of HB2 caused backlash from many schools, businesses, organizations and caused NC to lose millions of dollars in business and possibly millions in fed education funding.

Public schools all over the country thus asked DOJ to clarify rules for them so they can ensure they are following federal law and do not also lose funding.

So, DOJ clarified.

THAT'S why "fed govt" stepped in. They HAD to - were forced to by McCrory and his thugs.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
46. Because N.C. signed it into law and it's very controversial?
Mon May 16, 2016, 09:45 AM
May 2016

And it sets a very ugly precedent for slippery-slope laws further down the road??

Jesus H. Christ... You can't win for losing... Had Obama said nothing and ignored the issue, the usual suspects would be going apeshit on this site...

libodem

(19,288 posts)
4. By Jove, I think you've got it!
Sun May 15, 2016, 07:11 PM
May 2016

Airport pornascans at every bathroom. It's a reason for some gross pig to get a free look at the genitals of every little kid out there.

polmaven

(9,463 posts)
43. And do we all need to carry
Mon May 16, 2016, 07:52 AM
May 2016

our birth certificates with us wherever we go in case we need to use the bathroom?

RKP5637

(67,086 posts)
45. It's absurd! The individuals dreaming up these laws demonstrate quite a
Mon May 16, 2016, 09:29 AM
May 2016

view of the inner working of their perverted minds.

Ford_Prefect

(7,870 posts)
47. The individuals are a very well paid group of "christian" operatives in Orlando Florida.
Mon May 16, 2016, 10:02 AM
May 2016

They have been engineering legislative attacks in a number of GOP dominated states as part of the Koch plan to disable the bill of rights and federal authority in general. They wrote the laws and coordinated the legislative passage. The FBI should be looking at them for RICO violations. This one outfit is responsible for many of the recent legislative attacks on LGBT people, the recent spate of excessive and inaccurate regulation of abortion service providers and women's health clinics, and the recent focus against access to sex ed. information and birth control for teens.

 

Boudica the Lyoness

(2,899 posts)
54. The fuss is not about men who have become women
Mon May 16, 2016, 11:49 AM
May 2016

using the women's bathroom. What I'm outraged about is that all men will have to be allowed in - because it would sex discrimination if men were expected to use only the men's facilities.

I was assulted as a girl by a strange man and I don't want to provide the entertainment for voyeurs.

This stripping of women/girls of their right to privacy/dignity is a huge step backwards for women's rights.

Don't you dare fucking call me a whacko and a damn fool for not wanting it to be legal for a man to follow me into the bathroom to watch me on the toilet! THERE'S GREAT BIG GAPS AROUND THE DOORS!!!

I'm disgusted Obama for doing this. Will his daughter's college dorm allow the boys that to use the girls showers? Will they get male roommates? If they don't allow that then that will be sex discrimination.

 

Boudica the Lyoness

(2,899 posts)
57. If a Transgender person look like the sex they want to be
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:25 PM
May 2016

no one will be the wiser. For all others there should be a separate unisex rest room. Some places call them family restrooms - it's like for men with small children, people who have to have an helper of the opposite sex go in with them. Great idea.

RKP5637

(67,086 posts)
58. I agree with a number of things you've said. I like the idea of a separate unisex rest room as you
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:30 PM
May 2016

described it.

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
61. I see what you are saying
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:00 PM
May 2016

but imagine how this plays out in real time . . .. say you see someone going into the ladies room that looks like a mannish woman - what are you going to do? That person could be a cisgender woman who just looks mannish, or might be a transgender person who is transitioning but doesn't "pass". In both cases, I still think that person has a right to use the women's bathroom, don't you?


And what about lesbians who look into stalls and scope you and your daughter out? They certainly belong in the women's room, and there aren't special laws about that. The same is true for gay men in men's rooms.


It's just a solution without a problem - criminal activity can happen in restrooms, but we don't need new laws to deal with it.

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
60. somehow, we've all been sorting ourselves out with very little trouble
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:46 PM
May 2016

prior to this without making life even more miserable for our transgender friends.

Saviolo

(3,280 posts)
64. But that's not the issue, either.
Mon May 16, 2016, 04:57 PM
May 2016

Last edited Tue May 17, 2016, 12:10 AM - Edit history (1)

Trans woman (MTF transsexuals to use a slightly outdated term) do not identify as men. They are women. They aren't trying to get into the women's washroom as men, they're trying to get into the woman's washroom as women. They're not trying to get a peek at you, hell, a lot of them are straight women, and attracted to men.

It's the same with trans men. They do not identify as women, they identify as men. They are trying to use the men's room as men, not as women. They also are not trying to peek at guys, they're just using the washroom for who they are.

So, you are afraid that they will now have to allow all men into the women's washroom, but trans women are not men! They view themselves (and request that all others) as women. They're asking to be recognized as women, and thus it would not be changing any "rules" about men not entering the women's restroom.

Also, currently there is nothing stopping men from walking into a women's washroom, other than being recognized as men while they do it, and that's not going to change in any way.

 

AlbertCat

(17,505 posts)
66. ^THIS^
Mon May 16, 2016, 05:43 PM
May 2016

Trans is not a drag act, y'know....

This seems to be what people don't get. It's not a guy in women's clothes.

It's akin to that "homosexuality is not a choice" debunked crap the religious like to tout.

Like the sign I saw in Raleigh said:

It wasn't about water fountains then and it isn't about bathrooms now.

This happened because Charlotte did something it wasn't supposed to do in our Conservative Nirvana of NC. An example must be made!

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
68. Thank you for saying what I was trying to say
Tue May 17, 2016, 12:11 PM
May 2016

in a much better way. This is exactly the correct point.

Saviolo

(3,280 posts)
69. Tons of other ancillary issues involved.
Tue May 17, 2016, 01:40 PM
May 2016

Like, who gets to decide who "passes?"

Additionally, restricting people from using the washroom of the sex they identify with has its own pitfalls. A trans woman is going to present as a woman. If the assertion is that they were born as men, so they must use the men's room, you have an entirely new problem. Are women going to be okay with trans men entering the women's washroom because they were born as women? They present as men! They dress as men, look like men, and identify as men. Guaranteed women don't want them in the ladies' room.

Stryst

(714 posts)
63. Republicans passing a set of intrusive laws with no structure to enforce them.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:20 PM
May 2016

"Limited intrusion small government" for ya.

Mr.Bill

(24,238 posts)
11. What the MSM is not reporting
Sun May 15, 2016, 07:27 PM
May 2016

is that in California, we have basically had this law, at least regarding our schools since 2013 and there have been no problems.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
18. Not "illegal shit."
Sun May 15, 2016, 08:24 PM
May 2016

It's NO SHIT.

The CONGRESS hasn't been doing shit for all these years. And the obstructionist Republicans are the ones who are the PARTY OF "NO."

libodem

(19,288 posts)
19. Absolutely
Sun May 15, 2016, 08:28 PM
May 2016

Totally earning that 9% approval rating. Republicans want the people to hate the government. Worst possible representatives, evah.

PatrickforO

(14,559 posts)
22. Nice caption. However, I like to make sure the blame for 'illegal shit'
Sun May 15, 2016, 09:06 PM
May 2016

is placed squarely where it belongs:

- The oligarchs
- Wall Street
- The Military Industrial Complex
- Other big corporations

I say this because they are the ones who OWN our government. Sure, the worms we go through the sham of electing to national office are doing illegal shit. But it is illegal shit that benefits billionaires.

Thespian2

(2,741 posts)
24. Do you mean the 60 or so people
Sun May 15, 2016, 09:50 PM
May 2016

who own America, and, of course, both political parties?

Ask Jill Stein who runs America...

 

CompanyFirstSergeant

(1,558 posts)
26. What is the quote....
Sun May 15, 2016, 09:58 PM
May 2016

...about robust debate over a few bullshit topics?

Hell, I'm from Brooklyn, so that is the fucking quote.

Ya gotta pee, ya gotta pee.

Just go pee.

 

AgerolanAmerican

(1,000 posts)
27. maybe it's a distraction from the latest new war
Sun May 15, 2016, 10:00 PM
May 2016

did you hear that we now have ground troops in Yemen?

You'd think that would be a little more interesting from a "duty to inform the public" point of view than the bathroom thing.

libodem

(19,288 posts)
33. Funny
Sun May 15, 2016, 11:11 PM
May 2016

No one could tell. Nobody noticed. It's a made up thing to legislate, like women's bodies, because they can't govern.

Flatpicker

(894 posts)
34. Less the media
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:48 AM
May 2016

than the local governments themselves.

I don't think this was even an issue until someone decided it should be illegal.
Would have thought that this would have come up 15 years ago when Family Bathrooms and Baby Changing stations started popping up. Those were unisex also.

L. Coyote

(51,129 posts)
35. What a pile of crap. Name one thing illegal the government is doing.
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:10 AM
May 2016

Seriously, so we can get right on it. And when did Fox News become cover-up agents for Obama. The whole premise that the media exosts to lay down cover for a criminal government is laughable and a conspiracy theory at best.

 

uhnope

(6,419 posts)
40. +1. The OP basically says the transgender bathroom issue is a conspiracy to distract us
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:51 AM
May 2016

from thing *THEY* don't want us to know.

In other contexts, the OP would be considered transphobic

L. Coyote

(51,129 posts)
62. And notice, the poster cannot even name one thing.
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:44 PM
May 2016

Or, it is just a hit-and-run with no intent except to distract us by saying we are being distracted!

 

ChisolmTrailDem

(9,463 posts)
36. Why do nearly every single one of these image memes have to include...
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:51 AM
May 2016

...a word like "shit" or "fucking"?

I can't post that shit to my fucking facebook wall. My auntie is on my facebook, for gawd sake!

PATRICK

(12,228 posts)
38. The Public Toilet?
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:46 AM
May 2016

They would rather have us focus on the absurd, the shame and disgrace of ludicrous national priorities than ANY of the life and death priorities that are important to all of humanity.

eridani

(51,907 posts)
41. Vigilantes are already taking action--cand being real creeps
Mon May 16, 2016, 04:59 AM
May 2016
One woman had a strange, eye-opening encounter in a Target bathroom.

http://www.upworthy.com/one-woman-had-a-strange-eye-opening-encounter-in-a-target-bathroom?c=upw1

She walked past the three open stalls and stood directly in front of my door. Then she leaned over and placed her eye firmly up against the gap between the door and the frame and stared in at me.

I am not making this up. And let me tell you, it was awkward. Bizarre even. This wasn't a case of someone hoping all those occupied stalls aren't really occupied. Mine was the only stall that was occupied. She deliberately stopped and stared in at me. My startled eyes met hers, and she moved away into one of the larger stalls.

I got out of my stall as quickly as I could, and as I stood washing my hands, her voice called out.

"Sorry about that," she said. "But, you know, Target lets men and homosexuals use just any bathroom. I was making sure you were a woman."

I walked out, utterly gobsmacked, and it wasn't until I caught up with my daughter and told her the whole ridiculous story that I realized the complete and utter irony of it. This woman deliberately made me feel horribly uncomfortable just because she was uncomfortable with the extremely vague possibility of someone being different from expected behind a closed and locked stall door.

My daughter raised a brow and asked, "Did you tell her that your teenage daughter has a girlfriend?"

"She probably would have blinded me with hand sanitizer or something," I joked.
 

Boudica the Lyoness

(2,899 posts)
56. The woman freaked out when a woman
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:20 PM
May 2016

stared at her while she was on the toilet. Imagine what she'll feel like when men are staring at her.

This is my point; when we are perched on the toilet we can be watched by any Tom, Dick and Harry. I never thought it would be a Democratic administration who would allow women and girls to be violated.

I plan to take my husband in to guard the door every time I use a public restroom. I won't be the only one either.



eridani

(51,907 posts)
67. There's a difference? Transgendered people keep very low profiles.
Tue May 17, 2016, 02:58 AM
May 2016

It is idiotic to suggest that they are going to put their eyeballs to toilet stall cracks. I sure the fuck don't want FTMs in womene's bathrooms. I don't want to be sharing the same bathroom with a man with a full beard, even if he still has a vagina.

randr

(12,409 posts)
44. All because of the Freedom of Religion Act
Mon May 16, 2016, 09:13 AM
May 2016

that Bill Clinton signed to appease his right wing partners.
The fundies are using this to claim they have "right"s that are being infringed upon due to the nature of their personal religious hatred of other peoples.
A litmus test should be used to determine the veracity of their "religious" beliefs. Do they follow the "Golden Rule" or not?

neohippie

(1,142 posts)
51. Actually There is a lot more to HB2 than just the bathroom portion
Mon May 16, 2016, 11:21 AM
May 2016

Here is a link to 18 questions and answers about the impact of this law

http://www.ncjustice.org/?q=18-questions-18-answers-real-facts-behind-house-bill-2


It affects the rights of persons as far as any type of workplace discrimination lawsuits by taking away one's right to take grievances to state courts.

It affects the the possibility for local governments to make their own minimum wage laws in our state.

It affects the ability of any local government in the state to enact family leave policies that may differ from those set by the state

and so on... There's a lot more going on here than just who potties where, also the law was written so that each portion of it has to be removed individually so even if the bathroom portion of the bill get's overturned, the portions of the law that affect employment and workplace discrimination still stand so there is a lot more going on here than simple distraction

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»That Moment When You Sudd...