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Eugene

(61,881 posts)
Thu May 19, 2016, 12:44 PM May 2016

Judge in Freddie Gray-Officer Trial Grills Prosecutors

Source: Associated Press

Judge in Freddie Gray-Officer Trial Grills Prosecutors

By JULIET LINDERMAN, ASSOCIATED PRESS
BALTIMORE — May 19, 2016, 12:16 PM ET

A judge aggressively questioned prosecutors Thursday about why they charged an officer with assault in the arrest of Freddie Gray, and asked whether every officer who makes an arrest without probable cause should be charged with a crime.

Baltimore Circuit Judge Barry Williams grilled prosecutors during their closing arguments in the bench trial of Officer Edward Nero, who was one of three officers who chased Gray when he ran after making eye contact with an officer. Once Gray was in custody, officers found a knife on him, but the judge previously ruled that the knife's legality wouldn't be part of the trial.

Nero faces assault, misconduct in office and reckless endangerment charges. The assault charge carries a maximum penalty of ten years in prison, while the other charges have five-year maximums.

Gray died last year, a week after his neck was broken in a police van. He was handcuffed and shackled in the van, but unrestrained by a seat belt. The department's policy calls for detainees to be belted in.

Prosecutors say Nero unlawfully arrested Gray, and was negligent when he failed to buckle the man in.

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Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/closing-arguments-set-freddie-gray-officer-trial-39226090
9 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Judge in Freddie Gray-Officer Trial Grills Prosecutors (Original Post) Eugene May 2016 OP
Motherfucker Jackie Wilson Said May 2016 #1
Hope he's convicted philosslayer May 2016 #2
What your basis in actual evidence for any alleged corruption by the judge? branford May 2016 #4
What the fuck? beevul May 2016 #3
Yes, you are wrong. branford May 2016 #5
Fair enough, thats why I asked... beevul May 2016 #6
Note that I'm not claiming an assault charge is NEVER appropriate, branford May 2016 #7
I understand. beevul May 2016 #9
The prosecution stipulated TexasMommaWithAHat May 2016 #8
 

branford

(4,462 posts)
4. What your basis in actual evidence for any alleged corruption by the judge?
Thu May 19, 2016, 04:35 PM
May 2016

Did you read the article and do you understand the nature of the judge's questioning and potential effect of the prosecution's very novel position on probable cause, arrest and assault (which the State needed to later "clarify&quot .

We don't convict people based on whether you like them or the police generally. There's a reason why the first Gray case resulted in a hung jury and there's been so much legal wrangling and angry judges, virtually all at the expense of the prosecution.

As an attorney, most of the Gray cases appear to be the result of an apparently incompetent district attorney who gratuitously overcharged even minor actors as a political and publicity spectacle, and is now being brutally reigned in by courts (and at least one jury).

Given the nature and tenor of the judge's questions, I believe it unlikely he'll find the officer guilty on the assault charge, and the resulting lack of prosecution credibility may result in non-guilty verdicts on the lesser charges.

 

beevul

(12,194 posts)
3. What the fuck?
Thu May 19, 2016, 04:30 PM
May 2016
A judge aggressively questioned prosecutors Thursday about why they charged an officer with assault in the arrest of Freddie Gray, and asked whether every officer who makes an arrest without probable cause should be charged with a crime.


Am I wrong in thinking that, YES, every officer who tries to arrest W/O probable cause should be charged with a crime?
 

branford

(4,462 posts)
5. Yes, you are wrong.
Thu May 19, 2016, 04:40 PM
May 2016

The officer believed he had probable cause, and it certainly wasn't clear that he did not. Being wrong and making an arrest is not a criminal offense by itself, and even the state tried to backtrack before the trial ended. If probable cause is later found to be lacking, the remedy is to void the arrest or render evidence inadmissible, not criminally charge a police officer absent other very egregious conduct by that particular officer.

Read the entire article to understand the facts of this particular case and the basis for the court's concern (including reversal of any conviction on appeal).

 

beevul

(12,194 posts)
6. Fair enough, thats why I asked...
Thu May 19, 2016, 05:31 PM
May 2016
The officer believed he had probable cause, and it certainly wasn't clear that he did not. Being wrong and making an arrest is not a criminal offense by itself, and even the state tried to backtrack before the trial ended. If probable cause is later found to be lacking, the remedy is to void the arrest or render evidence inadmissible, not criminally charge a police officer absent other very egregious conduct by that particular officer.


Fair enough, thats why I asked, although that appears to leave a lot of room for "I exercised power over you that I shouldn't have, and you got fucked. Oh well." Those sorts of things don't sit well with me...

Note, I don't assert that this is your attitude. I just think that LE has a bit too much wiggle room for my comfort.
 

branford

(4,462 posts)
7. Note that I'm not claiming an assault charge is NEVER appropriate,
Thu May 19, 2016, 05:56 PM
May 2016

but rather than an arrest without probable cause is not automatically an effective criminal assault, as originally appears to be the novel suggestion of the prosecution and questioned by the judge.

Based on the known and reported facts and the judge's inquiries, it not clear that the prosecution is basing the assault charge on anything more than an apparent close question of probable cause for Gray's arrest. Given the officers report as to the circumstances of the arrest, Gray's prior criminal record, running and possession of the knife, together with the fact that this particular officer didn't actually strike or directly harm gray, the assault charge appears dubious at best.

The misconduct in office and reckless endangerment charges appear far more viable (and are largely based on different facts, i.e., not properly securing Gray in the van), although prosecution overreach may result in outright acquittals or result in strong appeals.

 

beevul

(12,194 posts)
9. I understand.
Fri May 20, 2016, 12:48 AM
May 2016

I just really wish there were serious penalties for LE being wrong where probable cause is concerned.

The kind of penalties that make LE very careful about it.

TexasMommaWithAHat

(3,212 posts)
8. The prosecution stipulated
Thu May 19, 2016, 06:54 PM
May 2016

to the fact that the encounter happened in a high crime area. That "coupled" with the fact that Gray ran when approached by the cop, is enough for probable cause in almost any court in this country.

The fact is that the prosecution seriously overreached on the charges for political reasons, so the people of Baltimore are witnessing a circus instead of actual justice in court.

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