Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

The Blue Flower

(5,420 posts)
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:07 PM May 2016

Bill Moyers: Democrats Can't Unite Until DWS Goes

http://billmoyers.com/story/democrats-cant-unite-unless-wasserman-schultz-goes/#

As we recently wrote, “… She embodies the tactics that have eroded the ability of Democrats to once again be the party of the working class. As Democratic National Committee chair she has opened the floodgates for Big Money, brought lobbyists into the inner circle and oiled all the moving parts of the revolving door that twirls between government service and cushy jobs in the world of corporate influence.”

...
But we digress. It’s the skullduggery going on within the Democratic Party establishment that’s our current concern and as we wrote in March, Rep. Wasserman Schultz “has played games with the party’s voter database, been accused of restricting the number of Democratic candidate debates and scheduling them at odd days and times to favor Hillary Clinton, and recently told CNN’s Jake Tapper that superdelegates — strongly establishment and pro-Clinton — are necessary at the party’s convention so deserving incumbent officials and party leaders don’t have to run for delegate slots ‘against grassroots activists.’ Let that sink in, but hold your nose against the aroma of entitlement.”
....
So, too, has her abolition of the restraints that had been placed on corporate lobbyists and big money — now they can write checks bankrolling what doubtless will be swank and profligate parties during this summer’s Democratic National Convention. At The Intercept, Lee Fang and Zaid Jilani report that a number of the members of the Philadelphia host committee “are actively working to undermine progressive policies achieved by President Barack Obama, including health care reform and net neutrality. Some… are hardly even Democratic Party stalwarts, given that many have donated and raised thousands of dollars for Republican presidential and congressional candidates this cycle.”
This is a slap in the face to progressives calling for a halt to big money and allowing lobbyists to buy our elected officials.
...
Rep. Wasserman Schultz is facing a primary challenge for the first time this year, her opponent a law professor, activist and progressive Sanders supporter named Tim Canova. But the primary’s not until late August, long after the Democratic National Convention. Unless she steps down now or Hillary Clinton has her removed, Philadelphia will be dominated by someone who represents everything that has gone wrong with the Democratic Party and Washington. At the convention’s opening session, Debbie Wasserman Schultz will be bringing the gavel down squarely on progressive hopes of returning the party to its legacy as champion of working people and the dispossessed.

We’ve said it before and we’ll say it again: Time for her to go.


...
166 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Bill Moyers: Democrats Can't Unite Until DWS Goes (Original Post) The Blue Flower May 2016 OP
This surely would go a long way , I would hope, in mending the fence. Jackie Wilson Said May 2016 #1
And me, Kelvin Mace May 2016 #30
Politics as usual. Just as this election is with two big exceptions, Bernie and Drumpf Jackie Wilson Said May 2016 #32
Totally agree...great post ! libdem4life May 2016 #69
But but what about BoB???? Katashi_itto May 2016 #113
SO what happens when Clinton gives her a job in a Clinton Administration? Ferd Berfel May 2016 #129
If Sanders would except that he has lost: and stop blaming DWS lewebley3 May 2016 #138
If Sanders would except that he has lost: and stop blaming DWS.... AlbertCat May 2016 #145
This is true oldandhappy May 2016 #2
Not true: DWS is not the cause of Sanders losses: Sanders people are bullies lewebley3 May 2016 #139
Sanders people are bullies AlbertCat May 2016 #146
oh? Phlem May 2016 #151
+ 1 Scientific May 2016 #3
^^This^^ zentrum May 2016 #13
And she should take truedelphi May 2016 #4
She should go, but it isn't about DWS dreamnightwind May 2016 #5
Oh FFS Proud Liberal Dem May 2016 #75
Half of Hillary's people don't like DWS either runaway hero May 2016 #80
Sander people won't stop bulliing: they have lost and the want to blame DWS lewebley3 May 2016 #140
No way. runaway hero May 2016 #141
It started in 2008. bvar22 May 2016 #143
Gross runaway hero May 2016 #158
She and Hillary are pals dflprincess May 2016 #164
So you like DWS and think she is good for unity? Silver_Witch May 2016 #84
I don't know a whole lot about DWS to know whether I "like" her or not Proud Liberal Dem May 2016 #166
Wait. Do you think Sanders should run as a third party candidate? Gore1FL May 2016 #86
No different from the throng of Sanders supporters... Orrex May 2016 #137
You think he should run third party too, then? Gore1FL May 2016 #161
No, I don't think that, because that would be stupid. Orrex May 2016 #163
No Proud Liberal Dem May 2016 #165
Thank you, voice of sanity, Bill Moyers! Dont call me Shirley May 2016 #6
She's fucking up a slam-dunk. Iggo May 2016 #7
Well I don't think she was ever a Democrat in spirit. Just someone who could do things and it did no LiberalArkie May 2016 #14
Rec & Kick. MerryBlooms May 2016 #8
That was it for me too! eom LittleGirl May 2016 #103
I appreciate Moyers, but WTF? Hortensis May 2016 #9
Lol! KPN May 2016 #15
Nonsense. 41.5% of your wishful "44%" have no idea Hortensis May 2016 #18
So True! demosincebirth May 2016 #35
Now be honest and admit that all of your percentages are just estimates. A Simple Game May 2016 #54
That 44% is KPN's and I believe it is way overblown, Hortensis May 2016 #92
Wow, so much information, thanks. A Simple Game May 2016 #120
Your statistic is misleading. The average person gets more than 3 minutes of news. Exilednight May 2016 #64
AVERAGE, perhaps, "more than" 3 minutes. But why? Hortensis May 2016 #91
you base this on the assumption that people only get their news from TV. Exilednight May 2016 #118
Now you are just making up crap Hortie KPN May 2016 #159
So when is the right time? Ned Flanders May 2016 #19
NO. Get your head together. Hortensis May 2016 #20
Too late Android3.14 May 2016 #49
I can certainly understand your concern that DWS might have to go now passiveporcupine May 2016 #55
The DNC is helping HUNDREDS of democratic candidates Hortensis May 2016 #108
he has become a Bernie Swooner Skittles May 2016 #59
Where have you been? The Party is split wide open. The Progressives are sick and tired rhett o rick May 2016 #67
Hear, hear! And don't forget Henry Kissinger and Robert (PNAC) Kagan! Peace Patriot May 2016 #88
That's Henry FUCKING Kissinger Paulie May 2016 #135
Devouring our own asses? She allied herself with sheldon adelson to jail medical marijuana patients. Warren DeMontague May 2016 #94
She has failed miserably at electing Dems ybbor May 2016 #105
I can't begin o assess her competence in this weird Hortensis May 2016 #109
She is divisive, dishonest and corrupt as Hell. cali May 2016 #107
Why Is DNC Chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz Co-Sponsoring a Bill to Help Predatory Payday Lenders? AntiBank May 2016 #116
You sound like the NRA after a school shooting, "Now is not Dustlawyer May 2016 #127
We are in the middle of national campaigns for who Hortensis May 2016 #131
We will have to disagree because I feel the same about you. Dustlawyer May 2016 #133
For a moment, ignore the reasons in OP. HooptieWagon May 2016 #10
+1 joeybee12 May 2016 #22
+2 runaway hero May 2016 #81
Moyers is Great. zentrum May 2016 #11
This message was self-deleted by its author Autumn Colors May 2016 #23
Even worse. zentrum May 2016 #33
she said it awhile ago following the early primaries when voters began asking hopemountain May 2016 #82
She said it a few months ago during THIS primary. Seems recent to me. nt stillwaiting May 2016 #124
I think DWS will resign if she believes that's the only way underthematrix May 2016 #12
She'll resign when she sees the handwriting on the wall. Then and only then. KPN May 2016 #16
Call it what you need to call it as long as she does what she needs underthematrix May 2016 #17
Your response confuses me a bit. Maybe I misunderstood. KPN May 2016 #130
cognitive dissonance or willfull ignorance? Ned Flanders May 2016 #26
This big picture. You're talking about underthematrix May 2016 #89
She is not party loyal, she is conservative and corporate loyal. bjobotts May 2016 #45
Party loyal??!! Ha Haaa KelleyKramer May 2016 #61
She's not 'party loyal'. She's DWS-HRC-WJC, Inc. loyal GoneOffShore May 2016 #66
Not really...even if she goes, joeybee12 May 2016 #21
He did have only 25 years in Congress to Hortensis May 2016 #110
can you imagine her as Press Secretary in a Clinton administration? tomm2thumbs May 2016 #24
Debbie was appointed DNC chair by Obama Geronimoe May 2016 #25
So now she hired her? joeybee12 May 2016 #27
She was Hillary 2008 campaign co-chairman Geronimoe May 2016 #36
YES!!! grasswire May 2016 #28
FIRE DWS! Donate to Democratic Underground for Tim Canova FL-23 here Omaha Steve May 2016 #29
She'll go. Probably DWS will most likely be rewarded with a cabinet position by HRC. EndElectoral May 2016 #31
I lost whatever respect I may have had for dws many years ago... mahannah May 2016 #34
Secret kill list? Obama has a secret kill list? You look like an idiot. Why post stupid crap bjobotts May 2016 #47
About that looking like an idiot thing... frylock May 2016 #51
If the real estate swindler is crowned king she may not have to go - may be irrelevant. n/t jtuck004 May 2016 #37
That would be a good start. LS_Editor May 2016 #38
Understatement. nt silvershadow May 2016 #39
The enemy from within. ReRe May 2016 #40
IF she "brings down her gavel on progressive hopes of returning the party to its legacy PatrickforO May 2016 #41
Hillary isn't going to gut the New Deal creeksneakers2 May 2016 #72
What a sad divisive man scscholar May 2016 #42
The party is split between the neoliberal Third Ways and the New Dealers. I don't think PatrickforO May 2016 #43
He's a journalist, not a propagandist for your Party. frylock May 2016 #52
This message was self-deleted by its author TM99 May 2016 #53
I was talking about this article, not history! scscholar May 2016 #56
This message was self-deleted by its author TM99 May 2016 #57
And the long silence continues . . . hatrack May 2016 #157
You have no idea who you're talking about, do you? dflprincess May 2016 #68
Probably not but I heard it pays per post Person 2713 May 2016 #78
Do you have any idea who Bill Moyers is? Fuddnik May 2016 #74
I wasn't talking about then. I'm talking about now! (ntxt) scscholar May 2016 #87
Shooting the messenger much? 99th_Monkey May 2016 #144
Bill Moyers? been speaking truth for a long time .....and that irks some . Nothing new . Person 2713 May 2016 #76
That did it. Welcome to Ignore. Hiraeth May 2016 #77
Bill Moyers? Press secretary to Pres. Lyndon Johnson? JHB May 2016 #85
Are you kidding me? Blue_In_AK May 2016 #90
If debbie wasserman schultz is the party, that means the party supports predatory lending. Warren DeMontague May 2016 #95
Yes. Very. ucrdem May 2016 #98
Bill Moyers Is Wise colsohlibgal May 2016 #44
Debbie is republican-lite Rosa Luxemburg May 2016 #46
I think she should just change parties kevink077 May 2016 #48
We will unite with Bernie - TBF May 2016 #50
Moyers got it right again. Hard for Hillaryites to throw him under the Wall Street bus. imagine2015 May 2016 #58
Wishfull thinking Egnever May 2016 #60
Obama considered replacing her in 2013 antigop May 2016 #62
Recommend for Exposure! KoKo May 2016 #153
and she was confident no one could get her out before her term was over -- 2017. antigop May 2016 #154
It would be a good start, but the Democratic Party has a long road back to being the party of labor Not Sure May 2016 #63
Anyone who thinks that will unite this party has no clue about what is going on. Skwmom May 2016 #65
It sure wouldnt hurt. Warren DeMontague May 2016 #93
Her lack of leadership...the losses...the fawning over HRC...the predatory libdem4life May 2016 #70
11 Governors, 13 Senators, 69 Reps, 913 state seats: there's only one seat left for her to lose! MisterP May 2016 #71
I'm surprised he isn't talking about a more meaningful concession creeksneakers2 May 2016 #73
How about descheduling marijuana entirely at the federal level, instead of a token change from I/II Warren DeMontague May 2016 #96
HRC might split the difference on min wage. From 12 to 10. nt stillwaiting May 2016 #125
After all the cheating, lying, and smugness, we won't unite emsimon33 May 2016 #79
i'm a proud grass roots activist and was hopemountain May 2016 #83
Haven't trusted that one in decades. nt ucrdem May 2016 #97
Today I learned that Bill Moyers is "a sad divisive man" and "that one". pa28 May 2016 #99
And Debbie Wasserman Schultz is a hero. Warren DeMontague May 2016 #101
Yep! Me too. myrna minx May 2016 #115
If ANYBODY had failed as badly at their job DonCoquixote May 2016 #100
Debbie will not be offered up. The Administration is behind her. LuvLoogie May 2016 #102
:) A poet focused on target. Impressive! Hortensis May 2016 #112
Bill Moyers speaks for me. Vote2016 May 2016 #104
This message was self-deleted by its author Turbineguy May 2016 #106
Looks like the DNC is now emulating James O'Keefe, releasing clips edited to make djean111 May 2016 #111
I can't wait to squeeze them into little sheriff meatballs... MrMickeysMom May 2016 #114
Kicked, recommended and I'm sure that if Hillary does become President she will have a cushy job Uncle Joe May 2016 #117
The average voter couldn't care less about DWS treestar May 2016 #119
You don't need to know FlaGranny May 2016 #126
DWS has become a scapegoat treestar May 2016 #142
Agreed. n/t Different Drummer May 2016 #156
K&R! This post deserves hundreds of recommendations. Enthusiast May 2016 #121
Where's Howard Dean when you need him? HelenWheels May 2016 #122
K & R mountain grammy May 2016 #123
A big A** Kick! nt Stellar May 2016 #128
Moyers Campbell Power of myth Protalker May 2016 #132
If resignations make the party battle ready for November, go for it! bucolic_frolic May 2016 #134
she has got to go. yuiyoshida May 2016 #136
Even if she did go it would be a symbolic gesture at best. sibelian May 2016 #147
Right. DWS isn't the problem, she's a RESULT of a deeper problem! ReallyIAmAnOptimist May 2016 #150
DWS needs to go, but that won't make all the wrongs of the past four months right. reformist2 May 2016 #148
Would you have voted for G.W. Bush in 2004 just because he fired Karl Rove? Califonz May 2016 #149
yeah I don't know about this. Phlem May 2016 #152
Losing to Tim Canova won't dis-throne her from DNC Equinox Moon May 2016 #155
She would be covenient sacrifice PATRICK May 2016 #160
Its not about who needs to go quakerboy May 2016 #162

Jackie Wilson Said

(4,176 posts)
1. This surely would go a long way , I would hope, in mending the fence.
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:10 PM
May 2016

Her support of payday lenders did it for me.

Jackie Wilson Said

(4,176 posts)
32. Politics as usual. Just as this election is with two big exceptions, Bernie and Drumpf
Fri May 20, 2016, 07:07 PM
May 2016

One is preferred like nobody before because of his independence from the system, the other is as unacceptable as any human being in existence.

 

Katashi_itto

(10,175 posts)
113. But but what about BoB????
Sat May 21, 2016, 07:16 AM
May 2016

How many time have you said they are bringing civilization down?

Or am I thinking the other Jackie?

Ferd Berfel

(3,687 posts)
129. SO what happens when Clinton gives her a job in a Clinton Administration?
Sat May 21, 2016, 09:59 AM
May 2016

BTW Clinton won't get rid of DWS until AFTER she has done all of the dirty work that she can and is no longer useful to the corporatist's.

I just found her obnoxious until the 300% loan shark episode showed her true nature. Now, she is obviously very dangerous to the 99%. Her conduct during the Primary's has confirmed this.


 

AlbertCat

(17,505 posts)
145. If Sanders would except that he has lost: and stop blaming DWS....
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:36 PM
May 2016

..... he'd be as clueless as some Hillary supporters.

Fortunately, he's not that clueless.

 

AlbertCat

(17,505 posts)
146. Sanders people are bullies
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:40 PM
May 2016

And they say Sanders whines. At least he's complaining about the unfairness of the people at the top who's job is supposed to be creating a level playing field, not a few big ol' meanie supporters and supposedly violent incidents that actually didn't happen.

dreamnightwind

(4,775 posts)
5. She should go, but it isn't about DWS
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:23 PM
May 2016

They'll probably replace her with a like-minded corporate suck-up.

As bad as DWS is, and she's really bad, our problems in the party are far worse than that. The DNC itself seems to be little more than a corporate to candidate money-laundering vehicle.

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,355 posts)
75. Oh FFS
Fri May 20, 2016, 11:55 PM
May 2016


Just call the DNC "Satan" and be done with it. WTF is Bernie doing running in the Democratic Party primary? He really ought to be in the Green Party where he can be pure as he wants to be and can lob everything that he wants at both parties.

runaway hero

(835 posts)
141. No way.
Sat May 21, 2016, 02:07 PM
May 2016

This started in 2013 after the house election plans went to the wayside. The reason why Obama has had a red congress for 2 years is because of DWS not campaigning for Congress well at all. This will be an issue after Bernie is gone as well. Come on.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
143. It started in 2008.
Sat May 21, 2016, 02:58 PM
May 2016

Back then, DWS was the Chairperson for the DNC's Red to Blue program.
The purpose of this program headed by DWS was to convert Red States to Blues States,
but DWS REFUSED to endorse Democrats running for vulnerable Republican seats IN HER OWN STATE because that would upset her Republican friends!!!


In 2008 Debbie Wasserman Schultz refused to endorse these 3 Democrats
who had won their Primaries and had a chance to win Republican seats:

Miami-Dade Democratic Party Chair Joe Garcia

Former Hialeah Democratic Mayor Raul Martinez

Democratic businesswoman Annette Taddeo

All three had won their local Democratic Primaries, and were challenging Hard Core Republican incumbents with whom Wasserman-Schultz had become cozy.
Not only did the head of the DCCC Red to Blue Program REFUSE to endorse these Democratic challengers,
but she appeared in person at at least one (possibly more) Campaign/Fundraiser for their Republican opponents.




FL-18, FL-21, FL-25: Wasserman Schultz Wants Dem Challengers to Lose
by: James L.
Sun Mar 09, 2008 at 7:15 PM EDT
<snip>

Sensing a shift in the political climate of the traditionally solid-GOP turf of the Miami area, Democrats have lined up three strong challengers -- Miami-Dade Democratic Party chair Joe Garcia, former Hialeah Mayor Raul Martinez, and businesswoman Annette Taddeo to take on Reps. Mario Diaz-Balart, Lincoln Diaz-Balart and Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, respectively.

While there is an enormous sense of excitement and optimism surrounding these candidacies, some Democratic lawmakers, including Florida Reps. Debbie Wasserman Schultz and Kendrick Meek, are all too eager to kneecap these Democratic challengers right out of the starting gate in the spirit of "comity" and "bipartisan cooperation" with their Republican colleagues:

But as three Miami Democrats look to unseat three of her South Florida Republican colleagues, Wasserman Schultz is staying on the sidelines. So is Rep. Kendrick Meek, a Miami Democrat and loyal ally to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

This time around, Wasserman Schultz and Meek say their relationships with the Republican incumbents, Reps. Lincoln Diaz-Balart and his brother Mario, and Rep. Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, leave them little choice but to sit out the three races.

"At the end of the day, we need a member who isn't going to pull any punches, who isn't going to be hesitant," Wasserman Schultz said.

Now, you'd expect this kind of bullshit from a backbencher like Alcee Hastings, but you wouldn't expect this kind of behavior from the co-chair of the DCCC's Red to Blue program, which is the position that Wasserman Schultz currently holds. Apparently, Debbie did not get Rahm's memo about doing whatever it takes to win:

The national party, enthusiastic about the three Democratic challengers, has not yet selected Red to Blue participants. But Wasserman Schultz has already told the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee that if any of the three make the cut, another Democrat should be assigned to the race.

http://www.swingstateproject.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=1537










The bloggers also are furious with Rep. Kendrick B. Meek (D-Fla.), who similarly refuses to endorse the Democratic challengers to the three Cuban American Republicans.

They are calling for Wasserman Schultz to step down from her leadership role at the DCCC. And they're not letting up, even after one Florida liberal blogger reported that the congresswoman seemed "frustrated" by the blogs and had asked to "please help get them off my back."

This prompted even harsher reaction from perhaps the most influential of the progressive political bloggers, Markos Moulitsas, a.k.a. Kos, founder of Daily Kos, who wrote on his blog Wednesday: "On so many fronts, the Republicans are standing in the way of progress, on Iraq, SCHIP, health care, fiscal responsibility, corruption, civil liberties, and so on. Those three south Florida Republicans are part of that problem. And she's (Wasserman-Schultz) going to be 'frustrated' that people demand she do her job?"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/19/AR2008031903410_3.html


Here are Kos comments on the Wasserman-Schultz betrayal of the Democratic Party:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/03/20/480511/-DCCC-Says-Uproar-Over-DWS-Recusal-Much-Ado-About-Nothing




A lot of time has passed since 2008, but I don't take these kinds of betrayals lightly. Now I find that DWS has been PROMOTED from Chair of the Red to Blue Program
to Chair of the DNC. She must be making the "Centrist" Democratic Leadership VERY HAPPY if they are rewarding THIS kind of Party Treason.

bvar22
Cursed with a memory

"I want to thank Debbie Wasserman-Schultz for being an outstanding chair of our party. (Applause.) She is a great partner."--President Obama


With "partners" like this, we don't need Republicans!



runaway hero

(835 posts)
158. Gross
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:31 PM
May 2016

Hopefully Hillary dumps her when she wraps this up. She is the kind of person that brings scandals to the government.

dflprincess

(28,057 posts)
164. She and Hillary are pals
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:34 PM
May 2016

and there has long been suspicions that DWS was made chair as part of the deal Hillary made with Obama when she dropped out in 2008.

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,355 posts)
166. I don't know a whole lot about DWS to know whether I "like" her or not
Mon May 23, 2016, 08:45 AM
May 2016

but I do feel like she may be getting scapegoated here for Bernie's all-but-certain loss. But I'm not sure what kind of authority Bill Moyers is speaking with in terms of his demands that she be gotten rid of in the midst of a Presidential election cycle. As far as Bernie goes, it just strikes me as sort of weird (at least) to complain about Bernie getting the shaft from the Democratic Party when he was allowed to run for POTUS as a member of the Democratic Party when he could have just as easily been turned away (or discouraged) and, even though he is almost certain not to win, he did make an impressive showing, so the DNC must not have been rigging things too expertly if the DNC was
eager for a quick Hillary "coronation".

Gore1FL

(21,035 posts)
86. Wait. Do you think Sanders should run as a third party candidate?
Sat May 21, 2016, 01:58 AM
May 2016

Is that really the story you want to go with?

Orrex

(63,086 posts)
137. No different from the throng of Sanders supporters...
Sat May 21, 2016, 01:21 PM
May 2016

who've convinced themselves that Clinton is indistinguishable from Trump.

All those who've declared their refusal to vote for the non-Sanders Democratic nominee, as well as all those who've proclaimed their intent to write-in Sanders name in the election, are essentially drafting him into a third party.

So why is it righteous when Sanders' supporters do it but reprehensible when Clinton's supporters point it out?

Gore1FL

(21,035 posts)
161. You think he should run third party too, then?
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:37 PM
May 2016

This brilliant strategy of uniting the party by pruning it is catching on.

Orrex

(63,086 posts)
163. No, I don't think that, because that would be stupid.
Sat May 21, 2016, 07:50 PM
May 2016

Why are you so eager to have someone validate your bizarro third-party fantasy?

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,355 posts)
165. No
Sun May 22, 2016, 04:33 PM
May 2016

I'm glad that he's not. But it's hard to believe that he wants to be part of a party he claims to despise.

Dont call me Shirley

(10,998 posts)
6. Thank you, voice of sanity, Bill Moyers!
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:25 PM
May 2016

Plus she pretty much screwed the party unity thing, possibly permanently.

LiberalArkie

(15,686 posts)
14. Well I don't think she was ever a Democrat in spirit. Just someone who could do things and it did no
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:34 PM
May 2016

matter what party it was. So whoever wins, she probably wins anyway. Even if she lost her seat, she would still benefit from the power.

They don't really care.

MerryBlooms

(11,728 posts)
8. Rec & Kick.
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:25 PM
May 2016

I never gave her much thought, so I was never a huge fan, although I appreciated her loyal support and updates on Gabby Giffords.

She completely lost my respect when she came out in favor of predatory lending.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
9. I appreciate Moyers, but WTF?
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:28 PM
May 2016

This is NOT the time to turn and start devouring our own asses.

There are over 400 members of the DNC, who are elected by various power groups around the nation, including but not limited to the state chairs and vice chairs, and who are expected to represent their interests on the DNC. Demanding they remove DWS is presenting them an easy sacrifice to burn at the stake, but not much else, even if any deserve it, which I question. I don't do witch hunts, and no matter how cozy DWS is with her donors, this bears all the signs of one.

But to a point that should not have to be spelled out: THE DNC IS NOT OUR ENEMY, and turning from our enemies to indulge in internal witch hunts would be a terrible mistake. We NEED the DNC intact and working hard to elect Democrats across the nation to block the huge threat to democracy from the right.

Moyers, with friends like you who needs Republicans, or the Kochs? I know you at least once understood the threat their type poses. Is it senility by any chance? We already have more than enough real enemies attacking in battalions and brigades from all sides, including from the anti-Democratic-Party left.

KPN

(15,587 posts)
15. Lol!
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:39 PM
May 2016

And yet you're okay with alienating 44% of all the people who voted in the Democratic primary so far!

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
18. Nonsense. 41.5% of your wishful "44%" have no idea
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:45 PM
May 2016

who "DWS" is, even written out, and don't give a fuck. A very large block of Americans watches about 3 minutes or less of news a day, and a pathetically large portion of those are Democrats and left-leaning indies.

This is about you and your willingness to sacrifice our nation and our democracy itself to petty factionaism and infighting. Get a grip, KPN. If it's in you.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
54. Now be honest and admit that all of your percentages are just estimates.
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:55 PM
May 2016

So in your estimation how many Hillary supporters are low information voters? My guess is all but the few that profit from the status quo. And those are still wrong they just already know it and don't want to lose their gravy train.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
92. That 44% is KPN's and I believe it is way overblown,
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:34 AM
May 2016

a bogus figure. There is a blizzard of trash polls going on, and too many grab whatever sounds good to them to "prove" a point.

The 3%, very differently, is from Pew research. My "41.5%" neither know or care about "DWS" was pulled out of the air, but I may have understated to try to be fair; it may be more like 43.9%. The reality is that most Americans are so ignorant that by far most adults can't name the three branches of government, explain in brief what they do, and name their own senators. It's appallingly, disastrously real.

Most also cannot explain coherently or at all knowledgeably the differences between conservative-liberal and Republican-Democrat ideologies and histories. They know their own label but cannot explain their own ideology. Conservatism, especially, has degraded for large numbers of people, with the assistance of political manipulators, to being "against the Democrats." That's literally the limit of their understanding. All this has been measured by many studies.

(Many DUers are just as ignorant, knowing what Bernie says he wants to accomplish and nothing about the ideology, history, or achievements of the party he joined for expedience.)

The typical voter blames the CURRENT PRESIDENT, no one else, for all he's unhappy with. That's because it's the one name almost all of them know. Kind of like "DWS," amaf.

And these people "on average," in either party or in none, are going to know or care who "DWS" is, by any name or title, or what her mile-long list of supposedly crimes is? Not hardly.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
120. Wow, so much information, thanks.
Sat May 21, 2016, 08:46 AM
May 2016

But I do believe that 3 minute number is unbelievably far off. Most people get way more than that from their personal network, friends, co-workers, family, etc.

Yes, so much information, most obviously little more than conjecture, and yet you never answered the question I asked.

Exilednight

(9,359 posts)
64. Your statistic is misleading. The average person gets more than 3 minutes of news.
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:37 PM
May 2016

News comes in all forms these days. I try not to WATCH the news, but I do READ and LISTEN to it.

I now have greater access to news with my tablet. I can read a newspaper from any city anywhere I am. I regularly download the BBC podcast, listen to NPR an average of 3 hours a day and subscribe to several magazines.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
91. AVERAGE, perhaps, "more than" 3 minutes. But why?
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:19 AM
May 2016

Go read Pew. They have the percentage I referred to for the block that does not average that much, and measurements for other.

As for the "average" time viewed, cable news junkies, who have it on for hours each day, drag that time number way up for everyone.

Unfortunately, cable junkies' own average information level does not rise with time invested. Of course, that is in part because most cable stations are mostly "discussion," not news. BUT, those viewers imagine they are far, far better informed than they are. According to one study, Fox viewers tested out more ignorant about what was happening and why than those who watched no news at all. Unfortunately, by all studies CNN and MSNBC junkies do better but are still appallingly ignorant. Public TV has the only decently informed viewers.

Btw, watched network news in the past few years? Commercials--short news segment--commercials--short news segment--commercials--happy 6-year-old artist story--commercials. The network news shows have degraded into strictly commercial viewership delivery vehicles to sell to their clients. The more and happier viewers, the higher the profits.

Most Americans are far too ignorant to make sensible choices.


Exilednight

(9,359 posts)
118. you base this on the assumption that people only get their news from TV.
Sat May 21, 2016, 08:35 AM
May 2016

Although people don't buy newspapers from the store, they still read newspapers online. People still listen to the radio on their commute back and forth from work.

KPN

(15,587 posts)
159. Now you are just making up crap Hortie
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:33 PM
May 2016

With Dems like you, who needs Republicans. This has nothing to do with me personally. It is simply about what is right and good. It's really pretty simple. While I get a grip, why don't you go ahead and get a pair of glasses.

 

Ned Flanders

(233 posts)
19. So when is the right time?
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:49 PM
May 2016

Don't you think, maybe, there's a serious problem if you feel compelled to hide your candidate's (and her lackeys') faults?

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
55. I can certainly understand your concern that DWS might have to go now
Fri May 20, 2016, 09:14 PM
May 2016

Considering that in spite of the fact she is supposed to be neutral in the candidates races, and has made it obvious she is helping Hillary and Holding Back Sanders any way she can. Of course this would be a bad time for her to go (for you, a Hillary supporter). Yes, I can see it from your perspective.

But for the rest of us...what did you call us?...Anti-Democratic-Party Left?...well, we would like to see someone in her place that will actually be neutral and not favor any one candidate. Because even though you think we are anti-democratic, we'd like to see a fair and impartial democratic process used from now on. Which is something we will not be getting from Debbie.

It was time to start devouring our own asses (hey, your term, not mine) from the day Debbie starting fighting for her old pal Hillary to win.

The DNC will get along just fine without her...hell, it might even do a lot better, if there weren't so many sneaky party shenanigans going on. Maybe some of that money that is supposed to go down ticket instead of to Hillary, might actually go down ticket and help us turn congress blue again.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
108. The DNC is helping HUNDREDS of democratic candidates
Sat May 21, 2016, 06:12 AM
May 2016

get elected. They're all VERY, VERY busy people right now.

How on earth can you think you're competent to say what the DNC should do when you have no idea what it does or how it functions? It is NOT their job to be impartial. Their job is to elect as many Democrats as possible.

"Democrats are bad" and "I know what I know" is the level that right wing radio listeners stopped at.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
67. Where have you been? The Party is split wide open. The Progressives are sick and tired
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:46 PM
May 2016

of the Corporate Wing bullying them. It's time to stand up to the Oligarchy bullies that have coopted our Party.

The corporate Wing and their candidate Hillary Richam Clinton are loved by the Koch Bros, Goldman-Sachs, Wall Street, Monsanto, Walmart, Chevron Oil, etc. Oh yeah and her fans.

We are fighting for the life of the middle and working classes and the poor while Clinton fans support CORPORATE PROFITS UBER ALLES.

Peace Patriot

(24,010 posts)
88. Hear, hear! And don't forget Henry Kissinger and Robert (PNAC) Kagan!
Sat May 21, 2016, 02:31 AM
May 2016

Your list:

The corporate Wing and their candidate Hillary Richam Clinton are loved by the Koch Bros, Goldman-Sachs, Wall Street, Monsanto, Walmart, Chevron Oil, etc. Oh yeah and her fans.


One of her fans is Henry Kissinger, with whom she vacations and who is her mentor and advisor. Henry Fucking Kissinger!

Having used the f-word on that mass murdering SOB Kissinger, I don't have a strong enough word for Clinton's OTHER advisor, Robert (fill in the blank) Kagan, architect of the "The Project For A New American Century" (PNAC)--Cheney-Rumsfeld's blueprint for military occupation of the ME and its oil, and world domination.

And I will mention one more entity who loves Hillary Clinton: the woman-hating sheiks of Araby. Tens of millions of dollars into Hillary's slush fund, the Clinton Foundation (in exchange for weapons deals for these fuckwads approved by SoS Clinton).

Okay, one more: The fascist fuckwads of Honduras, who had Berta Caceres, winner of the Goldman Environmental Prize, murdered in her bed. They love Hillary and Hillary loves them! Funded them with our tax dollars, personally put them in power using the State Dept. as the 'electing' entity. Lots of other women being raped and murdered in Honduras as well. Women tend to be the leaders of the environmental and democracy movements in Honduras. They had a democracy. Clinton assisted its overthrow. Now they are all being bumped off, or systematically raped to put them in their place. Kind of thing Kissinger is infamous for.

I doubt she has anyone who loves her in Libya--but some serious rotters in this country love her for what she did there. The Neo-Cons, who intend to ride her back into the White House.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
94. Devouring our own asses? She allied herself with sheldon adelson to jail medical marijuana patients.
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:40 AM
May 2016

Seems to me she's perfectly fine with teaming up with a trump-boosting republican for important causes like sticking granny in supermax because she was caught with a pot brownie.

ybbor

(1,552 posts)
105. She has failed miserably at electing Dems
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:47 AM
May 2016

We have lost the house and senate under her watch, and so many state government seats and governorships. If electing Dems is the primary role of the DNC, we need another vehicle to make that happen. This version of the DNC is more like a satellite office of the RNC. Not to mention her work in support of local republican candidates in FLA.

DWS has shown herself to be pathetic at anything except rigging this thing as if she were still HRC's campaign chair.

She's got to go, or a shitload of us will be.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
109. I can't begin o assess her competence in this weird
Sat May 21, 2016, 06:39 AM
May 2016

election year. But in 2016 we have to defeat the Republican Party in as many offices as we can.

WHO do you think is behind this attempt to distract us from that and refocus us on attacking ourselves? The right-wing disinformation industry has been very busy all along. Theirs are full-time jobs.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
107. She is divisive, dishonest and corrupt as Hell.
Sat May 21, 2016, 06:05 AM
May 2016

And I think your comment about Moyers reflects you perfectly.

Dustlawyer

(10,493 posts)
127. You sound like the NRA after a school shooting, "Now is not
Sat May 21, 2016, 09:57 AM
May 2016

the time..." it is the time while what is going on is still fresh in everyone's minds. We will never correct problems without addressing them!

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
131. We are in the middle of national campaigns for who
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:04 AM
May 2016

controls this country, federally and at the state and local levels.

I believe that you are behaving like a mindless automatic weapon that's been loaded and aimed by people intent on defeating the Democrats specifically so they can continue the transfer of America's wealth and power to a ruling class. Get a grip on yourself. Is it really your intent to destroy our power to control our nation, and with it our own destinies?

Dustlawyer

(10,493 posts)
133. We will have to disagree because I feel the same about you.
Sat May 21, 2016, 11:39 AM
May 2016

Hillary is OWNED by Big Business. The DNC is OWNED by Big Business. They keep threatening us with the evil Republican Bogeyman to keep us voting for the more reasonable, by bought off Democrat every election. This will always be our choice unless more of us wake up and fight to change this.

 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
10. For a moment, ignore the reasons in OP.
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:31 PM
May 2016

DWS simply has a dismal track record of incompetence. That alone is enough reason to fire her. She can scream , stamp her feet, play the J-card (as was rumored she would do)... But it all comes down to the simple fact she's done an inept job. She rose through the party ranks because she could raise money and represented a gerrymandered district where she never had a serious challange...so she could buy her way up the chain, instead of demonstrating ability.

zentrum

(9,865 posts)
11. Moyers is Great.
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:33 PM
May 2016

What she said about doing whatever she can to squash grass root candidates who challenge the club, is so entitled, so not understanding what her real job is—that it's like insider trading on Wall Street.

The party is not a fiefdom for one's personal cronies.

I'm surprised other Democrats don't speak out against this statement of hers.

But—in a day or two, she'll say she misspoke.

Response to zentrum (Reply #11)

zentrum

(9,865 posts)
33. Even worse.
Fri May 20, 2016, 07:11 PM
May 2016

I guess she said it before she was under such scrutiny? Because it doesn't get much more tone deaf than this.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
82. she said it awhile ago following the early primaries when voters began asking
Sat May 21, 2016, 01:32 AM
May 2016

why the party has super delegates and what is their function and how did hillary end up with so many so early in her campaign before bernie even announced he was running.

underthematrix

(5,811 posts)
12. I think DWS will resign if she believes that's the only way
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:33 PM
May 2016

to win everything we need to win. She is party loyal. I expect her to do what she needs to do.

KPN

(15,587 posts)
16. She'll resign when she sees the handwriting on the wall. Then and only then.
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:41 PM
May 2016

And maybe it will come before the convention. It would help to smooth a road to unity.

underthematrix

(5,811 posts)
17. Call it what you need to call it as long as she does what she needs
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:44 PM
May 2016

to do. I'm getting tired of everyone being in their feels. This shit ain't no joke.

KPN

(15,587 posts)
130. Your response confuses me a bit. Maybe I misunderstood.
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:00 AM
May 2016

Just so I'm clear, are you saying DWS should resign because she's corrupt and dishonest, i.e., rigged they primary for her good buddy Hillary, or that she should resign just for the sake of Party unity?

I assumed the latter by your response which I also interporeted to mean you have no problem with how the primary has been "managed"?

 

Ned Flanders

(233 posts)
26. cognitive dissonance or willfull ignorance?
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:54 PM
May 2016

"She is party loyal."

Big LOL. You mean like when she supported Republican candidates in Florida over their Democratic challengers? Or when she blocked a DNC resolution in support of Obama's deal with Iran?

GoneOffShore

(17,309 posts)
66. She's not 'party loyal'. She's DWS-HRC-WJC, Inc. loyal
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:43 PM
May 2016

What she needs to do is resign and take her triangulating friends with her.

 

joeybee12

(56,177 posts)
21. Not really...even if she goes,
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:50 PM
May 2016

Bernie will find some paranoid excuse as to why he's losing. He needs to go.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
110. He did have only 25 years in Congress to
Sat May 21, 2016, 06:50 AM
May 2016

make friends and rack up superdelegate support. "DWS has to go!!!!!"

Joeybee, his supporters are obviously currently on a roll. Now, if "DWS" were to resign, he might designate another witch to sic them on. I'm guessing another female would probably work well. The Nevada SDP witch is probably too obscure. Warren? She refused to endorse, so they owe her some big-time hate, and if she got in his way somehow? She'd be a great choice.

tomm2thumbs

(13,297 posts)
24. can you imagine her as Press Secretary in a Clinton administration?
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:52 PM
May 2016

(I'm sorry, were you eating...? my bad)

 

Geronimoe

(1,539 posts)
25. Debbie was appointed DNC chair by Obama
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:53 PM
May 2016

Pure speculation that perhaps this appointment was a deal to get Hillary's support as Debbie was co-chair of Hillary's 2008 campaign.

Interesting the bottom feeders Hillary hires to help her.

mahannah

(893 posts)
34. I lost whatever respect I may have had for dws many years ago...
Fri May 20, 2016, 07:13 PM
May 2016

when she said this to a reporter about the Obama "kill list"

frylock

(34,825 posts)
51. About that looking like an idiot thing...
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:46 PM
May 2016
Secret ‘Kill List’ Proves a Test of Obama’s Principles and Will

WASHINGTON — This was the enemy, served up in the latest chart from the intelligence agencies: 15 Qaeda suspects in Yemen with Western ties. The mug shots and brief biographies resembled a high school yearbook layout. Several were Americans. Two were teenagers, including a girl who looked even younger than her 17 years.

President Obama, overseeing the regular Tuesday counterterrorism meeting of two dozen security officials in the White House Situation Room, took a moment to study the faces. It was Jan. 19, 2010, the end of a first year in office punctuated by terrorist plots and culminating in a brush with catastrophe over Detroit on Christmas Day, a reminder that a successful attack could derail his presidency. Yet he faced adversaries without uniforms, often indistinguishable from the civilians around them.

“How old are these people?” he asked, according to two officials present. “If they are starting to use children,” he said of Al Qaeda, “we are moving into a whole different phase.”

It was not a theoretical question: Mr. Obama has placed himself at the helm of a top secret “nominations” process to designate terrorists for kill or capture, of which the capture part has become largely theoretical. He had vowed to align the fight against Al Qaeda with American values; the chart, introducing people whose deaths he might soon be asked to order, underscored just what a moral and legal conundrum this could be.

<more>

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/29/world/obamas-leadership-in-war-on-al-qaeda.html?_r=0

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
40. The enemy from within.
Fri May 20, 2016, 07:40 PM
May 2016

... Looking back, DW-S replaced Howard Dean. Now, as of today, can we not say without any reservation that DW-S, compared to Howard Dean, has been a total failure? Debbie seems to have become the Democratic Party's version of KKKarl Rove, slap in the middle of the effing Democratic Party! WTF? Looking back to WJC's administration the attack dog KKKarl Rove character was Rahm Emanuel. For HRC, DW-S has become the KKKarl Rove character.

The DNC may as well make peace with the Original Democrats, because we aren't going away. And the next leader of the DNC should be a real Democrat

PatrickforO

(14,516 posts)
41. IF she "brings down her gavel on progressive hopes of returning the party to its legacy
Fri May 20, 2016, 07:54 PM
May 2016

as a champion of working people and the dispossessed," the shit will hit the fan and Clinton will face the very real prospect of losing.

Because as a Sanders supporter I've HAD IT with Third Way big money bullshit. I demand a return to policies that will actually improve my life, the lives of my family members and the lives of the American working class (yes, ALL ethnicities and races).

These people are now flapping their evil jaws about 'getting entitlements under control' and are signalling they are willing to cave in and cut or even gut Social Security. Well bullshit. We're NOT gonna do that. (on edit got rid of the 'f' bomb)

And I want BETTER healthcare, and that involves RENEGOTIATING the GATS treaty to allow for a healthcare-specific 'service monopoly.' And I am dead set against Congress ratifying the TPP because its provisions seriously compromise what little democracy we have left.

You all hear me???

It isn't enough any more to 'suck less' than the Republican opponent because you think I will be compelled to vote for the empty suit DINO Third Way neoliberal deregulate-privatize-gut the New Deal-keep the forever war going candidates because they are SLIGHTLY less odious than their Republican opponents. Not any more.

Sorry. I've had enough. For once I INSIST that we start running this country to benefit its people instead of the MIC and Wall Street.

So....fuck the Third Way.

creeksneakers2

(7,468 posts)
72. Hillary isn't going to gut the New Deal
Fri May 20, 2016, 11:32 PM
May 2016

That's just crazy.

There isn't a slight difference. There's a drastic difference.

PatrickforO

(14,516 posts)
43. The party is split between the neoliberal Third Ways and the New Dealers. I don't think
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:16 PM
May 2016

Moyers had anything to do with creating that situation because its been brewing since the Reagans slithered into the White House in that fell winter of 1981.

Response to scscholar (Reply #42)

Response to scscholar (Reply #56)

Fuddnik

(8,846 posts)
74. Do you have any idea who Bill Moyers is?
Fri May 20, 2016, 11:54 PM
May 2016

His Democratic roots go back to the Kennedy and Johnson Administrations.

You won't find a better man, anywhere!

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
144. Shooting the messenger much?
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:17 PM
May 2016

when the messenger is a widely respected source of news and opinion,
you might want to actually try listening to what they have to say.

JHB

(37,133 posts)
85. Bill Moyers? Press secretary to Pres. Lyndon Johnson?
Sat May 21, 2016, 01:41 AM
May 2016

Journalist for decades who practices (rare these days) actual journalism?

Try again, and do some better research.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
95. If debbie wasserman schultz is the party, that means the party supports predatory lending.
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:44 AM
May 2016

It means "the party" is so in favor of sticking sick people in prison for smoking medical marijuana, it is willing to ally itself with sheldon adelson to make sure the law isnt fixed.

DWS sure as shit is not "the party"

colsohlibgal

(5,275 posts)
44. Bill Moyers Is Wise
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:21 PM
May 2016

Not sad at all, the man has been around and seen it all.

Hillary people for whatever reason have blinders on and tunnel vision....at least a good deal of them. The Iraq vote? All good she says, she goofed, she was wrong. No harm no foul...really?

All those millions from Wall Street....not to worry.

The rich and well off are gaining on the backs of the less fortunate.

Moyers talks those truths, you will not hear of them on The MSM.


Rosa Luxemburg

(28,627 posts)
46. Debbie is republican-lite
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:25 PM
May 2016

it would seem that the Democratic Party lost a lot of races during her term. Obama should have removed her.

kevink077

(365 posts)
48. I think she should just change parties
Fri May 20, 2016, 08:29 PM
May 2016

Or quit congress all together and go work for the payday loan companies.

 

Egnever

(21,506 posts)
60. Wishfull thinking
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:11 PM
May 2016

I am not a fan of Debbie but I would be willing to bet 80% or better of registered Dems would stare at you blankly if you asked who she was.

antigop

(12,778 posts)
62. Obama considered replacing her in 2013
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:30 PM
May 2016
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/02/senate-bid-could-be-solution-for-wasserman-schultz-115373

Throughout her time as chair, Wasserman Schultz has turned off colleagues, other top Democrats and current and former staff for a management style that strikes many as self-centered — even for a politician — and often at the expense of the DNC or individual candidates or campaigns. Many top Democrats, including some she counts as supporters and friends, privately complain about her trying to use the DNC as a vehicle for her own personal promotion, and letting her own ambition get in the way of larger goals.

Wasserman Schultz has a different sense of herself. According to people who spoke with her, when she sensed Obama was considering replacing her as chair in 2013, she began to line up supporters to suggest the move was both anti-woman and anti-Semitic. Under fire last fall for her leadership, she took Obama’s decision not to remove her then as evidence of renewed strength and said she was confident no one could get her out of the DNC before her term is over at the beginning of 2017, according to sources who’ve spoken with her. She’s also been known to joke around the office about how having a vacation home in New Hampshire might one day be helpful in a presidential run.


antigop

(12,778 posts)
154. and she was confident no one could get her out before her term was over -- 2017.
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:13 PM
May 2016

Explains a lot, doesn't it?

Not Sure

(735 posts)
63. It would be a good start, but the Democratic Party has a long road back to being the party of labor
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:35 PM
May 2016

The occasional bone isn't enough, we need some meat and fast before we completely waste away.

 

libdem4life

(13,877 posts)
70. Her lack of leadership...the losses...the fawning over HRC...the predatory
Fri May 20, 2016, 11:24 PM
May 2016

lenders (just the other half of the Goldman Sachs group)...on and on. IDC if no one knows who she is. She has failed miserably. And if it happened tomorrow, it wouldn't be a big to do. Just some housecleaning. The party has left her Republican Lite.

There's never a bad time to get rid of a bad leader. Go Tim Canova.

Thank you, Bill Moyers.

creeksneakers2

(7,468 posts)
73. I'm surprised he isn't talking about a more meaningful concession
Fri May 20, 2016, 11:36 PM
May 2016

Something like splitting the difference on minimum wage to $13.50. Something that would make a big difference.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
96. How about descheduling marijuana entirely at the federal level, instead of a token change from I/II
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:49 AM
May 2016

That would make a huge difference, because anything short of that leaves the conflict between federal and state law in place.

emsimon33

(3,128 posts)
79. After all the cheating, lying, and smugness, we won't unite
Sat May 21, 2016, 12:48 AM
May 2016

DWS seems determined to lose 2016 as she did 2014. I am beginning to suspect that she is in the pay of the RNC.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
83. i'm a proud grass roots activist and was
Sat May 21, 2016, 01:34 AM
May 2016

shocked to hear dws's disenfranchising statement following the early primaries when many of us were learning there was such a thing as "super delegates".

it was a huge slap in the face and made me question what had become of the democratic party. not the party of my dad and grandparents.

pa28

(6,145 posts)
99. Today I learned that Bill Moyers is "a sad divisive man" and "that one".
Sat May 21, 2016, 04:01 AM
May 2016

I guess if it's time to choose sides I'll gladly take Bill Moyer's.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
101. And Debbie Wasserman Schultz is a hero.
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:18 AM
May 2016

Maybe because she knows prison is the only place for these sorts of dangerous drug criminals!

myrna minx

(22,772 posts)
115. Yep! Me too.
Sat May 21, 2016, 07:53 AM
May 2016
Yet DWS, the woman who supports payday loansharks, is the moral compass of the party.

DonCoquixote

(13,615 posts)
100. If ANYBODY had failed as badly at their job
Sat May 21, 2016, 04:32 AM
May 2016

as Debbie, she would have been FIRED. Look at how many Van Jones's got the ax because Fox news decided to say bad things, but Debbie, no.

And before people talk about party loyalty, do keep in mind you are supporting someone who has supported GOP in her home state, and is therefore a reason why Florida, a state that should be democratic, is in play.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/9/16/1421914/-Debbie-Wasserman-Schultz-The-Manchurian-Chair
http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a37542/dnc-chairperson/
http://observer.com/2015/09/debbie-wasserman-schultz-must-go/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/debbie-wasserman-schultz-paylenders-cfpb_us_56d4ce38e4b03260bf77e8fc

This is not about her gender or religion, though she has played both cards til; the edges wore off, thanks to protecting friends that prey on women and that keep Bibi supported as he seeks that final war that will either make him emperor or finish his country (hint: the latter is likely to happen.)

LuvLoogie

(6,855 posts)
102. Debbie will not be offered up. The Administration is behind her.
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:22 AM
May 2016

It's time to deliver a coup de grace upon the GOP. Draw your swords not to the backs of your vanguard, but to the foe before them. You complain that you are fed gruel, while the enemy would serve you your innards with your blood to wash them down.

Go blue or go home.

Response to The Blue Flower (Original post)

 

djean111

(14,255 posts)
111. Looks like the DNC is now emulating James O'Keefe, releasing clips edited to make
Sat May 21, 2016, 07:00 AM
May 2016

Sanders' supporters look violent.

As far as I am concerned, Debbie DINO represents today's Democratic party absolutely fucking perfectly, and for me, and others of my friends and family, there will no be any unity. The damage is done.

DWS has not done anything that was not approved by Hillary. She and Brock are the ugly face of the New Democrats.

Uncle Joe

(58,112 posts)
117. Kicked, recommended and I'm sure that if Hillary does become President she will have a cushy job
Sat May 21, 2016, 08:27 AM
May 2016

waiting for Schultz n the White House for services rendered perhaps Secretary of Controversy.

Thanks for the thread, The Blue Flower.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
119. The average voter couldn't care less about DWS
Sat May 21, 2016, 08:36 AM
May 2016

Probably don't know who she is.

Bernie lost because he could not get more voters. Blaming DWS is childish.

HelenWheels

(2,284 posts)
122. Where's Howard Dean when you need him?
Sat May 21, 2016, 09:18 AM
May 2016

Howard was the best Dem Chair ever and played a big part in President Obama's election. The President was very wrong to pass over Howard for a Cabinet post. He never gave Howard his due for how he helped with the election. Howard would have made a great head of Health and Human Services and he even asked to be selected for this post. Obama was wrong to neglect him and I think it may have been a little jealousy on the President's part.

mountain grammy

(26,573 posts)
123. K & R
Sat May 21, 2016, 09:20 AM
May 2016

mainly because, as a liberal Democrat, this is exactly how I feel.

Philadelphia will be dominated by someone who represents everything that has gone wrong with the Democratic Party and Washington. At the convention’s opening session, Debbie Wasserman Schultz will be bringing the gavel down squarely on progressive hopes of returning the party to its legacy as champion of working people and the dispossessed.

Protalker

(418 posts)
132. Moyers Campbell Power of myth
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:26 AM
May 2016

This series is one of the great joys of my life. Money should be out of politics. Overturn money is speech. To do that we need to win. Adelson gave Trump 100 million. The rest of the billionaires have yet to weigh in. Right now today it takes big money to fight big money.

bucolic_frolic

(42,681 posts)
134. If resignations make the party battle ready for November, go for it!
Sat May 21, 2016, 11:41 AM
May 2016

Cleanse and fight for Freedom from Trump!

sibelian

(7,804 posts)
147. Even if she did go it would be a symbolic gesture at best.
Sat May 21, 2016, 03:42 PM
May 2016

One cannot alter the nature of an organisation by removing figures at the top of it's ladders.
150. Right. DWS isn't the problem, she's a RESULT of a deeper problem!
Sat May 21, 2016, 04:16 PM
May 2016

Even though I agree DWS is a complete disaster, and MUST go,
in my view it's JOKE to blame her for the troubles of the Democratic Party.

The real problem is that much, or most, of the hierarchy suffers from a metastasized cancer of greed. Most, or all, of them probably started their careers with the people's problems at the forefront of their minds, but overtime they were absorbed into the dark side.

This was the natural result of Bill Clinton's 'New Democrats' alignment with big money.

That's my view.

 

Califonz

(465 posts)
149. Would you have voted for G.W. Bush in 2004 just because he fired Karl Rove?
Sat May 21, 2016, 04:12 PM
May 2016

Or voted for you-know-who because he fired Goebbels?

Phlem

(6,323 posts)
152. yeah I don't know about this.
Sat May 21, 2016, 04:24 PM
May 2016

DWS can only do so much by herself. She needs enablers to make her affective.

Getting rid of the symptom does not get rid of the cause.

Equinox Moon

(6,344 posts)
155. Losing to Tim Canova won't dis-throne her from DNC
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:21 PM
May 2016

Although very important that Tim Canova wins that congressional seat from her, the DNC chair is a separate position.

She needs to be removed from BOTH.

PATRICK

(12,227 posts)
160. She would be covenient sacrifice
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:34 PM
May 2016

Even if she stayed and won re-election she would be "moving on up" to some wonderful reward. Dumping her would be at least a cunning symbol of appeasing the Sanders crowd. It would be a start and patently ludicrous if it ended there since how does Moyers possibly think asll those fake establishment delegates and all their swank sell-out parties are going to work out party unity- at all?

it would be a start and it would still seem to likely fail but will anyone be shocked it if the careerists and Mammonite Dems do anything except double down on arrogance? When you can't change and when the reckoning of decades is about to hit you denial is the order of the day. It is soothing, semi-heroic, fortified by undeniable power. And they are trapped in that elite Alamo really without any ammo whatsoever. Just a billion bucks and a white flag.

So far no one has crossed that line drawn in the sand.

Will the two parties disappear? No careerists have less of a path and certainly less of a spine to transition to any third party.

They have been weirdly jumping ship D to R, R to D with no seeming change of heart or policy. The people have been more professionally confused than at any other time of history for all our education and media smorgasbords. So this will be a repressed climate for inexorable change, strangely parallel for the suicidal species madness of the climate change "debate".

Both parties are anti-democratic, anti-people, anti sense in opposing a huge disconnect with at least half their own electorate base. The GOP deserves death by at least irrelevance and direct opposition to the needs, to the very survival of nation and citizen. And dumb as bricks to give some excuse to their service of Smaug the Mighty. The current politics dictates that the Democrats follow their lead down this non road.

Neither party can die, but America and its citizens sure can. And do. And will. And whatever illusions or delusions money can buy neither party or both together can representthe American people nor do they dare connect. One method is to back a demagogue, classic far right loon disconnected from this reality in many many ways, none good. The other is mask decline by a nostalgia Evita Perrone style comeback. Herself, not just the legend! But with none of the charisma to connect to anything but a sullen trip down anachronistic capitalist lane, a dead everything.

The party will want history to disappear, and unity to appear like some magic entitlement greater than any they promise for social security or medicare or schools or peace or..... How did the people who received the very meaning of their careers from the better traditions pre-Reagan ever descend to this and with such lickspittle cowardice and indifference?
We seem committed to misery and little else. No need to list the horrors. Just hunker down or flee

To talk of just dumping DWS (driiving while sh#t-faced?) is being overly polite or sarcastic.

quakerboy

(13,901 posts)
162. Its not about who needs to go
Sat May 21, 2016, 06:43 PM
May 2016

But about who needs to come. If you dump a bunch of underwhelming performers and replace them with new underwhelming performers, thats kinda useless.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Bill Moyers: Democrats Ca...